Greetings!
I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
substrate?
Thanks for your input,
D'ohBoy
[email protected] wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
Depends on the use of the cabinets but I doubt pocket screws would
work. They would probably just pull right through as you tightened
them. Have you looked here:
http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/5040-CSP-A/5-x-40mm-Connecting-Screw-Starter-Kit
I've worked quite a large number of projects in melamine board. I do
not recommend your technique of coarse threaded screws even with
shaving off the plastic to bare the substrate. If you want to use
threaded fasteners, Confirmat screws should be used. This is IMHO.
Joe G
[email protected] wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>
> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
> substrate?
>
> Thanks for your input,
>
> D'ohBoy
sounds sketchy to me, but the only way to tell if it'll work for your
application is to mock up the joint with some scrap and test it to
destruction. I predict it'll be very easy to destroy.
I generally try to use a screw that goes all of the way through for
locations where I can put the head in a non-visible place, and a
biscuit where I have to show the face.
use melamine glue, not gorilla glue. it's a lot stronger for your
application, and a lot cheaper.
This post is a slightly off topic but it might interest a few in the
group.
Melamine board developed by necessity in Germany right after WWll
ended. Germany was in ruins as a consequence of the allied bombing
raids. There was very little wood available to begin reconstruction.
There was however a great deal of destroyed wooden material at hand and
a process was developed to grind the available wood into chips suitable
for rolling into sheet goods using formaldehyde glue as a binder.
Plastic sheets were adhered to the outside surfaces to provide a finish
as the substrate was not conducive to traditional finishing
techniques. The German hardware industry developed the 32 mm system
with catalogs full of specialized screws, hinges, drawer slides,
connectors et al to work with the particular properties of the new
board. Therefore the confirmat screw.
Joe G
On Jan 23, 2:04 pm, [email protected] wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>
> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
> substrate?
>
> Thanks for your input,
>
> D'ohBoy
In answer to Pat,
This part of the melamine story might be apocryphal but I pass it along
anyway. You can research it and make up your own minds. The reason the
Germans chose 32mm was that it was the centerline to centerline
distance of the only pair of matching gears they had. These gears
formed the basis of the gang drill which permited multiple system holes
to be drilled simoltaneously.
Joe G
On Jan 24, 3:21 pm, Pat Barber <[email protected]> wrote:
> Very interesting and I often wondered where the 32mm started
> and why.
>
> I just thought the germans wanteed to be different
> or they had found some deep dark reason for all that hole spacing.
>
>
>
> GROVER wrote:
> > This post is a slightly off topic but it might interest a few in the
> > group.
> > Melamine board developed by necessity in Germany right after WWll
> > ended. Germany was in ruins as a consequence of the allied bombing
> > raids.- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -
What does your pterodactyl eat?
On Jan 24, 10:32 pm, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Yeah, and I have a pterodactyl as a pet.
>
> "GROVER" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > In answer to Pat,
> > This part of the melamine story might be apocryphal but I pass it along
> > anyway. You can research it and make up your own minds. The reason the
> > Germans chose 32mm was that it was the centerline to centerline
> > distance of the only pair of matching gears they had. These gears
> > formed the basis of the gang drill which permited multiple system holes
> > to be drilled simoltaneously.
> > Joe G- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -
On Jan 23, 2:04 pm, [email protected] wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>
> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
> substrate?
>
> Thanks for your input,
>
> D'ohBoy
When I build cabinets, I don't use glue and use 2 or 2.5 inch particle
board screws. All holes must be predrilled and awy from the edge.
Havent had a problem so far.
Jim
On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:29:48 GMT, Pat Barber
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Confirmat's require a pretty pricey drill bit and if
>your screwing skills are not excellent, you can screw up
>the holes.
I doubt there's a man among us who would admit to having less than
excellent screwing skills...
Around here a lot of people use 2" particle board screws and no glue when
building kitchen cabinets. Some use pan heads others don't. You have to
predrilled and the holes are about 4" apart. JG
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>
> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
> substrate?
>
> Thanks for your input,
>
> D'ohBoy
>
Very interesting and I often wondered where the 32mm started
and why.
I just thought the germans wanteed to be different
or they had found some deep dark reason for all that hole spacing.
GROVER wrote:
> This post is a slightly off topic but it might interest a few in the
> group.
> Melamine board developed by necessity in Germany right after WWll
> ended. Germany was in ruins as a consequence of the allied bombing
> raids.
Yeah, and I have a pterodactyl as a pet.
"GROVER" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In answer to Pat,
> This part of the melamine story might be apocryphal but I pass it along
> anyway. You can research it and make up your own minds. The reason the
> Germans chose 32mm was that it was the centerline to centerline
> distance of the only pair of matching gears they had. These gears
> formed the basis of the gang drill which permited multiple system holes
> to be drilled simoltaneously.
> Joe G
Found it... http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/0820-FSL/
They are 2" not 2.5"....
Pat Barber wrote:
> Call the boys at Mcfeely's and ask them. They sell a
> screw that is suitable for melamine... A pocket hole
> screw will work, but is a weak joint in melamine.
>
> THe screws I used were 2.5" long and will hold a butt
> joint nice and tight.
>
> Watch melamine close to the ends. You MUST pre-drill
> to prevent splitting.
>
> I can't remember the name of that screw.
>
> Confirmats are the best but these work pretty well.
>
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>> Greetings!
>>
>> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
>> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
>> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>>
>> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
>> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
>> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
>> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
>> substrate?
>>
>> Thanks for your input,
>>
>> D'ohBoy
>>
Call the boys at Mcfeely's and ask them. They sell a
screw that is suitable for melamine... A pocket hole
screw will work, but is a weak joint in melamine.
THe screws I used were 2.5" long and will hold a butt
joint nice and tight.
Watch melamine close to the ends. You MUST pre-drill
to prevent splitting.
I can't remember the name of that screw.
Confirmats are the best but these work pretty well.
[email protected] wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> I am building some cabinets out of melamine and would rather not invest
> in a Confirmat step bit and screws if I don't have to. Would coarse
> thread pocket screws be an adequate substitute?
>
> I would use these with Gorilla glue. Additionally, would I be better
> off routing the coating off the melamine so it is wood fiber glued to
> wood fiber or does it not matter, i.e., would the glue bond the ripped
> edge of the melamine just as well to the slick surface as the
> substrate?
>
> Thanks for your input,
>
> D'ohBoy
>
In article <[email protected]>,
Pat Barber <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Why not just use McFeely's Confirmat style screws?
> >
> > <http://www.mcfeelys.com/tech/confirmat.asp>
> >
> This was pretty old article but I recall the original
> guy "not" wanting to use confirmats due to cost.
Which is why I suggested the McFeely's Confirmat style. Rockler sells
Confirmat screws 8 for $2.09. McFeely's copies are $7.53 for a 100,
which doesn't seem prohibitive to me, especially if the Confirmat style
screw is as much better for particle board as claimed.
>
> Confirmat's require a pretty pricey drill bit and if
> your screwing skills are not excellent, you can screw up
> the holes.
>
I was surprised at the price of the drill bit, but Rockler, who sells
the genuine Confirmat simply says that they need a 7/32" pilot hole.
Still, it seems better to use the proper tool for the job and learn the
skills needed to use it than to compromise on something that won't hold
up.
--
Hank Gillette
To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are
to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and
servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. -- T. R. Roosevelt
In article
<[email protected]>,
Pat Barber <[email protected]> wrote:
> Found it... http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/0820-FSL/
>
> They are 2" not 2.5"....
>
> Pat Barber wrote:
>
> > Call the boys at Mcfeely's and ask them. They sell a
> > screw that is suitable for melamine... A pocket hole
> > screw will work, but is a weak joint in melamine.
> >
> > THe screws I used were 2.5" long and will hold a butt
> > joint nice and tight.
> >
> > Watch melamine close to the ends. You MUST pre-drill
> > to prevent splitting.
> >
> > I can't remember the name of that screw.
> >
> > Confirmats are the best but these work pretty well.
Why not just use McFeely's Confirmat style screws?
<http://www.mcfeelys.com/tech/confirmat.asp>
--
Hank Gillette
To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are
to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and
servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. -- T. R. Roosevelt
This was pretty old article but I recall the original
guy "not" wanting to use confirmats due to cost.
Confirmat's require a pretty pricey drill bit and if
your screwing skills are not excellent, you can screw up
the holes.
Using the more traditional screws would be
easier for a novice to use in my opinion.
All you need is coutersink bit and a screw driver.
Hank Gillette wrote:
> Why not just use McFeely's Confirmat style screws?
>
> <http://www.mcfeelys.com/tech/confirmat.asp>
>