Rust prevention on surfaces... in today's environments

On 6/2/2017 7:19 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/2/2017 6:11 PM, Leon wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
>> surface is it easy to straighten?
>>
>
> Nevermind, my TS top is 30" x 44" The cover would be too small.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I bet you used to buy the XL condoms too.

On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 7:06:11 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
> On 6/2/2017 12:14 PM, Steve wrote:
> > Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.
> >
> > Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
> >
> > No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.
> >
> > I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Steve
> >
>
> A hint for using TopCote. For the first application spray a thorough
> layer. I typically spray the surface with horizontal strokes, let it
> haze over and wipe the film off. The I do the same with vertical strokes.
> From that point use it as needed, I touch up if the surface feels
> grabby or if I drip sweat on the table. ;~)

Great timing, Leon, thanks. I just got my Top Cote via Amazon (no air freight allowed, probably for aerosols.) Thank you.

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 11:39:36 AM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>

On Fri, 02 Jun 2017 17:55:02 -0400, [email protected] wrote:

>On 02 Jun 2017 19:07:33 GMT, Puckdropper
><puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>
>>Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
>>news:[email protected]:
>>
>>> On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>>>
>>> Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table--
>>> another great idea, thanks, all.
>>>
>>> I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice
>>> in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply
>>> makes sense-- thanks again.
>>>
>>
>>A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your
>>saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,
>>won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help.
>>Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
>>the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.
>
>Any horizontal space is going to attract "stuff". ;-)
>
>I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>
><https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>
>The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>particularly careful to keep these clean.
That's where using a "sled" helps - the fence slot gets filed with
wood too. Use paste wax on the bottom of the "sled"

Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.

Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'

No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.

I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!

Thanks,
Steve

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 18:19:53 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

>On 6/2/2017 6:11 PM, Leon wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
>> surface is it easy to straighten?
>>
>
>Nevermind, my TS top is 30" x 44" The cover would be too small.

I'm surprised they don't have a cover for SawStop but apparently they
don't. Time to get rid of that piece of junk. Send it to me and I'll
take care of it. ;-)

Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>
> Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table--
> another great idea, thanks, all.
>
> I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice
> in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply
> makes sense-- thanks again.
>

A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your
saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,
won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help.
Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.

Puckdropper
--
http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking
A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst!

On 6/2/2017 12:14 PM, Steve wrote:
> Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.
>
> Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
>
> No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.
>
> I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!
>
>

I previously read about a product called "Penetrol" which is a paint
additive you can find at the Big Orange Box for about $10 or less a
quart. Comes in a can like Mineral Spirits.

I had some minor rusting on a saw top that got away from me when it was
stored in an unheated portion of the garage and after I cleaned it up
with the usual means, I applied a liberal coat of Penetrol, let it dry,
and buffed it off. Smooth, slick surface and no further worries.

The other products work well too but this seems more cost effective.
I've put it on ALL my cast iron, the majority of which resides in a
heated and air-conditioned shop.

Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> Puckdropper: Completely agreed. This is exactly why I didn't drop a
> tarp onto the table to begin with-- it didn't make sense that it would
> prevent moisture-- when condensation forms on metal, it does so
> (generally) whether or not there's a light covering over it. But the
> plywood... something solid, and of greater weight right over and
> against the table surface, this makes sense. My slots may suffer a
> bit, but the surface should do well... um,. I think!
>
> Where do you drop pucks, by the way? I gotta get back on the ice. Old
> Man, B-, C+ Beer League, more than likely.

I'm in Central Illinois. I no longer drop pucks but spend a lot of time
chasing them.

Hockey's just too much fun to not play. Sounds like you're at a level
where things just start to get fun. The passes are a lot better, guys
recognize they're offsides within milliseconds, and everyone remembers
when they used to suck so the games aren't too serious.

Puckdropper
--
http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking
A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst!

On 6/15/2017 8:33 PM, Steve wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 7, 2017 at 8:46:16 PM UTC-4, Phil Kangas wrote:
>> "Unquestionably Confused"
>>> wrote in message
>>> I previously read about a product called "Penetrol" which
>>> is a paint additive you can find at the Big Orange Box for
>>> about $10 or less a quart. Comes in a can like Mineral
>>> Spirits.
>>>
>>> I had some minor rusting on a saw top that got away from
>>> me when it was stored in an unheated portion of the garage
>>> and after I cleaned it up with the usual means, I applied
>>> a liberal coat of Penetrol, let it dry, and buffed it off.
>>> Smooth, slick surface and no further worries.
>>>
>>> The other products work well too but this seems more cost
>>> effective. I've put it on ALL my cast iron, the majority
>>> of which resides in a heated and air-conditioned shop.
>>>
>>
>> Penetrol works good on a snowplow blade too! ;>)
>
> Penetrol? As in, the Alkyd paint conditioner Penetrol?? This is interesting to me-- kindly let me know.

Yep, Steve, Penetrol. Find it a Lowe's, Big Orange, etc. I figured if
nothing else I could probably use it someday for a painting project.
Still sitting in the shop for it's "unintended" purpose.

On 6/16/2017 2:10 PM, Steve wrote:
> On Thursday, June 15, 2017 at 10:29:13 PM UTC-4, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
>
>>
>> Yep, Steve, Penetrol. Find it a Lowe's, Big Orange, etc. I figured if
>> nothing else I could probably use it someday for a painting project.
>> Still sitting in the shop for it's "unintended" purpose.
>
> Wow. Had no idea. All those times I used it to get that mirror-smooth finish out of old interior oils...get the brush strokes to settle down a little faster. I'm going to have to look into this some more. If not for this, there will always be something else! Thanks for the hint.
>

Start here:

<http://www.floodaustralia.net/products/anti_corrosion/penetrol-anti_rust.php>

And then Google: "penetrol as rust preventative on tools" or something
similar and settle in for a good read.

On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 3:07:39 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> Steve=20
> >=20
>=20
> A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your=
=20
> saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,=20
> won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help. =20
> Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo=
=20
> the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.
>=20
> Puckdropper
> --=20
> http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking
> A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst!

Puckdropper: Completely agreed. This is exactly why I didn't drop a tarp =
onto the table to begin with-- it didn't make sense that it would prevent m=
oisture-- when condensation forms on metal, it does so (generally) whether =
or not there's a light covering over it. But the plywood... something s=
olid, and of greater weight right over and against the table surface, this =
makes sense. My slots may suffer a bit, but the surface should do well... =
um,. I think! =20

Where do you drop pucks, by the way? I gotta get back on the ice. Old Man,=
B-, C+ Beer League, more than likely.

>
> Any horizontal space is going to attract "stuff". ;-)
>
> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>
> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>
> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
> particularly careful to keep these clean.


Thanks, Not-- this is interesting too. Magnets, as opposed to simple 'tarp' also make sense. I'll check it out.
--Yup, I'm already wary of the slots.

like Keith I leave my table saw sled in place in an unheated well ventilated shop. A little minwax paste wax underneath the sled keeps my saw rust free. has worked for years.

On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real
>> rust-preventative on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent
>> climate-controlled basement. Bought a new house a couple of years
>> ago and upgraded the shop, but it's in an uninsulated, unheated
>> garage. Also upgraded the table saw from a Craftsman contractor saw
>> to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except the surface. I
>> knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked for me in
>> the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for
>> me.
>>
>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will
>> eventually be insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term
>> surface fix.
>>
>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for
>> now, let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>>
>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous
>> comments on this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive
>> thread since about 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more
>> like a smattering of comments embedded in a bunch of other threads.
>> VOC Laws have changed drastically in many states since then, affecting
>> hundreds of thousands of products in the chemicals and coatings
>> industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy Massachusetts, which
>> has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also located on the NH
>> line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire products
>> even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>>
>> So my questions are this:
>>
>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield
>> and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with
>> these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>>
>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over
>> the past decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending
>> on the regs in your location.)
>>
>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that
>> are as effective or better than these two today?
>>
>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>> Steve
>>
>
> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately
> had rust the next morning on brand new equipment.
>
> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We
> get a wind from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost
> always 90% in the mornings.
>
> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been
> for the past 36 years.
>
> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax
> and or Bodshied.
>
> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe
> off the film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>
> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it
> belonged to Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and
> have not found anything that works better.

Let me add that if you are getting condensation, formally caused by
sudden temperature changes you may want to consider a cover that sits
directly on top of the surface. Typically these covers are flat and can
be cut to fit the table precisely.

On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop, but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>
> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>
> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now, let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>
> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass, and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>
> So my questions are this:
>
> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>
> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in your location.)
>
> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as effective or better than these two today?
>
> Thanks for your assistance, all
> Steve
>

Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately
had rust the next morning on brand new equipment.

I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We
get a wind from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost
always 90% in the mornings.

My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been
for the past 36 years.

The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax
and or Bodshied.

Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe
off the film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.

For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it
belonged to Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and
have not found anything that works better.

On 6/2/2017 9:58 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 6/2/17 7:38 AM, Jack wrote:
>> On 6/1/2017 10:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>> I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
>>
>>> Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that works
>>> is Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.
>>>
>> Exactly, why fool with success. Bostik TopCote works great and is
>> designed for exactly this purpose. Lasts a long time, easy to apply
>> and slick as all get out.
>>
>> Spend a couple of bucks and be done with it.
>>
>
> That's what I tell people every time the subject of removing rust from
> table saw top comes up. I say, "Just use Boeshield RustFree and be done
> with it."
>
> But there are always people who want to put more work into it. There
> are always those who say you need WD-40 and steel wool and to scrub and
> reapply, etc, ad nauseam.
> Maybe, they get more satisfaction out of the scrubbing and elbow grease,
> but I'd rather use the saw, not clean it.
>
>


I think we are talking about "rust prevention" not rust removal.

I think you might be the first advising how to remove. ;~)

On 6/1/2017 1:36 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
> And just to clarify my previous clarification Bostik has changed
> their branding ;-D
>
> https://www.woodcraft.com/blog_entries/bostik-changes-cote-product-branding
>
> "Bostik’s TopCote product with the brown and white
> label will change to the name GlideCote with a
> blue label."
>
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ODZM7SG/
>

LOL

https://www.amazon.com/Empire-Manufacturing-Inc/b/ref=w_bl_hsx_s_hi_web_8418259011?ie=UTF8&node=8418259011&field-lbr_brands_browse-bin=Empire+Manufacturing+Inc

And to take this another step, Empire the originator of TopCote still
makes great products.
The original TopCote was made to make the TS top slippery and did an
excellent job. But the big benefit was that tops, with this product
applied, quit rusting too.
The Bostitch version is not as good as the original but I it works well
enough for me.

On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative
>> on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled
>> basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop,
>> but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from
>> a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except
>> the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked
>> for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>>
>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be
>> insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>>
>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now,
>> let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>>
>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on
>> this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about
>> 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments
>> embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in
>> many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the
>> chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy
>> Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also
>> located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire
>> products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>>
>> So my questions are this:
>>
>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or
>> TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in
>> cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>>
>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past
>> decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in
>> your location.)
>>
>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as
>> effective or better than these two today?
>>
>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>> Steve
>>
>
> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately had rust
> the next morning on brand new equipment.
>
> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We get a wind
> from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost always 90% in the
> mornings.
>
> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been for the
> past 36 years.
>
> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax and or
> Bodshied.
>
> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe off the
> film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>
> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it belonged to
> Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and have not found
> anything that works better.
>
>
>
I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?

gray_wolf <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

> I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
>
I wouldn't do that, at least not without checking first to make sure it doesn't contain silicone --
some of which will inevitably be transferred to the wood, where it will interfere with just about
any finish you try to apply.

On 6/2/2017 6:11 PM, Leon wrote:
>
>>>
>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>
>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>
>>>
>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>
>>
>
> Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
> surface is it easy to straighten?
>

Nevermind, my TS top is 30" x 44" The cover would be too small.

On 6/2/2017 8:38 AM, Jack wrote:

>
>> Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that works is
>> Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.
>>
> Exactly, why fool with success. Bostik TopCote works great and is
> designed for exactly this purpose. Lasts a long time, easy to apply and
> slick as all get out.
>
> Spend a couple of bucks and be done with it.
>

Think of life on the planet also. How many Carnauba have to die just so
you can keep your tools clean? The best wax comes from baby carnauba
that have been clubbed to death to have the wax extracted. It is very
cruel and should be stopped.

Go ahead and use it but don't cry later when PETA confiscates your
tablesaw and leaves you with a pile of carnauba dung in its place. .

On 6/2/2017 6:30 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 18:19:53 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:
>
>> On 6/2/2017 6:11 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
>>> surface is it easy to straighten?
>>>
>>
>> Nevermind, my TS top is 30" x 44" The cover would be too small.
>
> I'm surprised they don't have a cover for SawStop but apparently they
> don't. Time to get rid of that piece of junk. Send it to me and I'll
> take care of it. ;-)
>


Where should I send it? LOL

On 6/1/2017 11:39 AM, Steve wrote:

>
> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?

They work for me. I'm probably 75 miles south of you so similar
climate. I see no reason to change.

On Thursday, June 15, 2017 at 10:29:13 PM UTC-4, Unquestionably Confused wr=
ote:

>=20
> Yep, Steve, Penetrol. Find it a Lowe's, Big Orange, etc. I figured if=
=20
> nothing else I could probably use it someday for a painting project.=20
> Still sitting in the shop for it's "unintended" purpose.

Wow. Had no idea. All those times I used it to get that mirror-smooth fin=
ish out of old interior oils...get the brush strokes to settle down a littl=
e faster. I'm going to have to look into this some more. If not for t=
his, there will always be something else! Thanks for the hint.=20

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 12:27:25 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

>On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real
>>> rust-preventative on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent
>>> climate-controlled basement. Bought a new house a couple of years
>>> ago and upgraded the shop, but it's in an uninsulated, unheated
>>> garage. Also upgraded the table saw from a Craftsman contractor saw
>>> to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except the surface. I
>>> knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked for me in
>>> the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
>>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for
>>> me.
>>>
>>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will
>>> eventually be insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term
>>> surface fix.
>>>
>>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for
>>> now, let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>>>
>>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous
>>> comments on this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive
>>> thread since about 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more
>>> like a smattering of comments embedded in a bunch of other threads.
>>> VOC Laws have changed drastically in many states since then, affecting
>>> hundreds of thousands of products in the chemicals and coatings
>>> industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy Massachusetts, which
>>> has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also located on the NH
>>> line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire products
>>> even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
>>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>>>
>>> So my questions are this:
>>>
>>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield
>>> and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with
>>> these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>>>
>>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over
>>> the past decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending
>>> on the regs in your location.)
>>>
>>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that
>>> are as effective or better than these two today?
>>>
>>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>>> Steve
>>>
>>
>> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately
>> had rust the next morning on brand new equipment.
>>
>> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We
>> get a wind from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost
>> always 90% in the mornings.
>>
>> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been
>> for the past 36 years.
>>
>> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax
>> and or Bodshied.
>>
>> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe
>> off the film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>>
>> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it
>> belonged to Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and
>> have not found anything that works better.
>
>Let me add that if you are getting condensation, formally caused by
>sudden temperature changes you may want to consider a cover that sits
>directly on top of the surface. Typically these covers are flat and can
>be cut to fit the table precisely.

My "cover" is my extension table for my unisaur. It does keep dew from
settling.

On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:

Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table-- another great idea, thanks, all.

I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply makes sense-- thanks again.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 12:24:27 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

>On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop, but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>>
>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>>
>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now, let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>>
>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass, and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>>
>> So my questions are this:
>>
>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>>
>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in your location.)
>>
>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as effective or better than these two today?
>>
>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>> Steve
>>
>
>Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately
>had rust the next morning on brand new equipment.
>
>I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We
>get a wind from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost
>always 90% in the mornings.
>
>My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been
>for the past 36 years.
>
>The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax
>and or Bodshied.
>
>Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe
>off the film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>
>For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it
>belonged to Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and
>have not found anything that works better.
>
I had my tools in my garage when I lived in Alabama. Boeshield worked
but as you note it's pretty sticky stuff. I didn't like it. I still
use it but a lot less, now that my tools are in my basement (only
moved about 70mi, so the weather is similar). I also found that a
magnetic cover for the saw helped.

On Wednesday, June 7, 2017 at 8:46:16 PM UTC-4, Phil Kangas wrote:
> "Unquestionably Confused"
> > wrote in message
> > I previously read about a product called "Penetrol" which
> > is a paint additive you can find at the Big Orange Box for
> > about $10 or less a quart. Comes in a can like Mineral
> > Spirits.
> >
> > I had some minor rusting on a saw top that got away from
> > me when it was stored in an unheated portion of the garage
> > and after I cleaned it up with the usual means, I applied
> > a liberal coat of Penetrol, let it dry, and buffed it off.
> > Smooth, slick surface and no further worries.
> >
> > The other products work well too but this seems more cost
> > effective. I've put it on ALL my cast iron, the majority
> > of which resides in a heated and air-conditioned shop.
> >
>
> Penetrol works good on a snowplow blade too! ;>)

Penetrol? As in, the Alkyd paint conditioner Penetrol?? This is interesting to me-- kindly let me know.

(hint: Avoid the sister product "Floetrol" at all costs, unless you're spraying!!)

>>
>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>
>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>
>>
>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>
>

Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
surface is it easy to straighten?

On 6/2/2017 4:55 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On 02 Jun 2017 19:07:33 GMT, Puckdropper
> <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
>> news:[email protected]:
>>
>>> On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>>>
>>> Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table--
>>> another great idea, thanks, all.
>>>
>>> I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice
>>> in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply
>>> makes sense-- thanks again.
>>>
>>
>> A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your
>> saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,
>> won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help.
>> Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
>> the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.
>
> Any horizontal space is going to attract "stuff". ;-)
>
> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>
> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>
> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>

My experience is that sheet goods warp, the magnetic cover looks promising.

On 6/2/2017 12:14 PM, Steve wrote:
> Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.
>
> Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
>
> No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.
>
> I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
>

A hint for using TopCote. For the first application spray a thorough
layer. I typically spray the surface with horizontal strokes, let it
haze over and wipe the film off. The I do the same with vertical strokes.
From that point use it as needed, I touch up if the surface feels
grabby or if I drip sweat on the table. ;~)

And just to clarify my previous clarification Bostik has changed
their branding ;-D

https://www.woodcraft.com/blog_entries/bostik-changes-cote-product-branding

"Bostik’s TopCote product with the brown and white
label will change to the name GlideCote with a
blue label."

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ODZM7SG/

On Saturday, June 3, 2017 at 10:06:37 AM UTC-4, Jack wrote:
> On 6/2/2017 1:14 PM, Steve wrote:
> > Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the =
TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me =
out of both options.
> >
> > Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there f=
or people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
> >
> > No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too=
.
> >
> > I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a =
while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranub=
a efforts. The seal's on his own, though!
>=20
> Make sure you get all the rust off first, using whatever you want. When=
=20
> I bought my (used) tools 40+ years ago I used navel jelly, as the rust=20
> was considerable on the tops. Then I used lacquer thinner to remove any=
=20
> remaining residue of the rust remover, and got the tops super clean.
> Then spray on the Topcoat, let it dry, and put on a second coat.
>=20
> After that only one coat is needed to freshen it up. How long it lasts=
=20
> would depend on how much use the tops get, but when I used my tools=20
> daily, I would re-coat about every 6 months or so. Never got any rust=20
> after that and re-coating would take about 5 minutes for all 7 of my=20
> cast iron tops, so it is essentially a labor free task.
>=20
> I also use it on the screws of bench vices, pipe clamps, bar clamps=20
> C-clamps etc as it keeps them clean, rust free, slick and free spinning.
>=20
> --=20
> Jack
> Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
> http://jbstein.com

Thanks Jack-- I have a pretty good rust killer that I tested first on an ol=
d Black Iron pipe railing at my house that had to be a minimum of 50 years =
old, and likely older. It's a water base, believe it or not, but it worked=
like a charm. I intend to dilute it a little for the precise and machined=
surface of the saw, but yes, this is good advice that someone shouldn't lo=
ok past.

On 2017-06-02, Ed Pawlowski <[email protected]> wrote:

> Think of life on the planet also. How many Carnauba have to die just so
> you can keep your tools clean? The best wax comes from baby carnauba
> that have been clubbed to death to have the wax extracted. It is very
> cruel and should be stopped.

One absurdity deserves another:

A baby harp seal walks into a bar. "Whatya have", the bartender
dutifully grumbles. "Anything but Canadian Club!", answers the seal.

nb

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 10:34:34 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
> >> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
> >>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative
> >>> on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled
> >>> basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop,
> >>> but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from
> >>> a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except
> >>> the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked
> >>> for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
> >>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
> >>>
> >>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be
> >>> insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
> >>>
> >>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now,
> >>> let's focus on the question at hand, please.
> >>>
> >>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on
> >>> this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about
> >>> 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments
> >>> embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in
> >>> many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the
> >>> chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy
> >>> Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also
> >>> located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire
> >>> products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
> >>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
> >>>
> >>> So my questions are this:
> >>>
> >>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or
> >>> TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in
> >>> cold/heavy-moisture environments?
> >>>
> >>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past
> >>> decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in
> >>> your location.)
> >>>
> >>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as
> >>> effective or better than these two today?
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for your assistance, all
> >>> Steve
> >>>
> >>
> >> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately had rust
> >> the next morning on brand new equipment.
> >>
> >> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We get a wind
> >> from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost always 90% in the
> >> mornings.
> >>
> >> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been for the
> >> past 36 years.
> >>
> >> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax and or
> >> Bodshied.
> >>
> >> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe off the
> >> film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
> >>
> >> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it belonged to
> >> Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and have not found
> >> anything that works better.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?

> Why fool with success? Paste wax works.

Maybe because the OP has clearly stated that "Paste isn't cutting it now."

> Another product that works is
> Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]>
wrote:

>On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative
>>> on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled
>>> basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop,
>>> but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from
>>> a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except
>>> the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked
>>> for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
>>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>>>
>>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be
>>> insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>>>
>>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now,
>>> let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>>>
>>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on
>>> this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about
>>> 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments
>>> embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in
>>> many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the
>>> chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy
>>> Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also
>>> located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire
>>> products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
>>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>>>
>>> So my questions are this:
>>>
>>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or
>>> TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in
>>> cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>>>
>>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past
>>> decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in
>>> your location.)
>>>
>>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as
>>> effective or better than these two today?
>>>
>>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>>> Steve
>>>
>>
>> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately had rust
>> the next morning on brand new equipment.
>>
>> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We get a wind
>> from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost always 90% in the
>> mornings.
>>
>> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been for the
>> past 36 years.
>>
>> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax and or
>> Bodshied.
>>
>> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe off the
>> film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>>
>> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it belonged to
>> Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and have not found
>> anything that works better.
>>
>>
>>
>I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that works is
Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.

On 02 Jun 2017 19:07:33 GMT, Puckdropper
<puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:

>Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
>news:[email protected]:
>
>> On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>>
>> Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table--
>> another great idea, thanks, all.
>>
>> I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice
>> in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply
>> makes sense-- thanks again.
>>
>
>A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your
>saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,
>won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help.
>Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
>the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.

Any horizontal space is going to attract "stuff". ;-)

I use one of these. It's been flawless.

<https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>

The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
particularly careful to keep these clean.

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 03:54:24 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 10:34:34 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 6/1/2017 12:24 PM, Leon wrote:
>> >> On 6/1/2017 10:39 AM, Steve wrote:
>> >>> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative
>> >>> on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled
>> >>> basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop,
>> >>> but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from
>> >>> a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except
>> >>> the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked
>> >>> for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also
>> >>> affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>> >>>
>> >>> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be
>> >>> insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>> >>>
>> >>> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now,
>> >>> let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>> >>>
>> >>> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on
>> >>> this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about
>> >>> 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments
>> >>> embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in
>> >>> many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the
>> >>> chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy
>> >>> Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also
>> >>> located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire
>> >>> products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass,
>> >>> and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>> >>>
>> >>> So my questions are this:
>> >>>
>> >>> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or
>> >>> TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in
>> >>> cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>> >>>
>> >>> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past
>> >>> decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in
>> >>> your location.)
>> >>>
>> >>> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as
>> >>> effective or better than these two today?
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks for your assistance, all
>> >>> Steve
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> Wax nor Boeshield ever worked for me at all. With both I immediately had rust
>> >> the next morning on brand new equipment.
>> >>
>> >> I live in Houston so I am about 45 miles from the Gulf of Mexico. We get a wind
>> >> from the gulf a majority of the time. And humidity is almost always 90% in the
>> >> mornings.
>> >>
>> >> My shop in in an uninsulated and unairconditioned garage and has been for the
>> >> past 36 years.
>> >>
>> >> The only time I really had a rust issue was when I attempted to use wax and or
>> >> Bodshied.
>> >>
>> >> Boeshield works if you heavily coat the surface. BUT you have to wipe off the
>> >> film before doing any cutting. End of the day reapply.
>> >>
>> >> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch. At one time it belonged to
>> >> Empire. Anyway I apply this product 3~4 times a year and have not found
>> >> anything that works better.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
>
>> Why fool with success? Paste wax works.
>
>Maybe because the OP has clearly stated that "Paste isn't cutting it now."
>
>> Another product that works is
>> Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.
A GOOD paste wax, properly applied SHOULD do it

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 20:47:56 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <[email protected]> wrote:

>On 6/2/2017 7:19 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/2/2017 6:11 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
>>> surface is it easy to straighten?
>>>
>>
>> Nevermind, my TS top is 30" x 44" The cover would be too small.
>
>Yeah, yeah, yeah. I bet you used to buy the XL condoms too.

Used to? You mean before he was married? ;-)

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 18:11:56 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

>
>>>
>>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>>
>>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>>
>>>
>>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>>
>>
>
>Is it difficult to align, if it starts crooked and does not cover the
>surface is it easy to straighten?

No, you don't straighten it out once it's on. It's not hard to get
straight, though. I cut an 1/8" slot from the front of the blade to
the rear to clear the blade and splitter/blade cover. I just unroll
in into two halves and slide the slot over the blade and under the
guard, then unroll it both directions. It's a lot easier than it
sounds.

On 6/1/2017 11:39 AM, Steve wrote:
> Seeking your counsel, folks. I never had a need for a real rust-preventative on my tools, as my shop was in a reasonably- decent climate-controlled basement. Bought a new house a couple of years ago and upgraded the shop, but it's in an uninsulated, unheated garage. Also upgraded the table saw from a Craftsman contractor saw to the Grizzly hybrid model, and I love it-- except the surface. I knew this would be a thing, but paste wax had always worked for me in the past. Paste isn't cutting it now. My band saw table is also affected; no dice on the wax there either which had always worked for me.
>
> Before you fire off with the usual, please... (1) yes, I will eventually be insulating, heating, etc. but I still need a short term surface fix.
>
> 2) Other materials for my table surface ARE being considered, but for now, let's focus on the question at hand, please.
>
> 3) Yes I have looked and I am aware of the bazillions of previous comments on this, but believe it or not there's not a comprehensive thread since about 2012 or so, according to my search. There's more like a smattering of comments embedded in a bunch of other threads. VOC Laws have changed drastically in many states since then, affecting hundreds of thousands of products in the chemicals and coatings industries. I'm in consumer-protection-happy Massachusetts, which has some new regs over the past decade. But I'm also located on the NH line and believe it or not, recent changes hit New Hampshire products even harder. (As only an example, I can still get real TSP in Mass, and I have a better chance of getting decent Alkyds in Mass.)
>
> So my questions are this:
>
> --Are you guys, generally, still using and/or recommending Boeshield and/or TopCote for this purpose today? What's your experience with these products in cold/heavy-moisture environments?
>
> -- Have you noticed any decline in the products' effectiveness over the past decade or so? (Keep in mind, this reply may vary, depending on the regs in your location.)
>
> -- are there any new products that anyone's been introduced to that are as effective or better than these two today?
>
> Thanks for your assistance, all
> Steve
>
I am going to repeat the same old thing. I have had my table saw in an
unheated garage in central Indiana, and now for the last 6 years in the
lower Piedmont region of North Carolina. I have been able to take care
of the rust problem by periodically applying a coat of good car wax.

I also do one thing more. I have a piece of plywood the cut to the size
of the table on the saw. Any time I am not using the saw, the plywood
is on the table. This plywood lays flat against the surface and keeps
the moist air from coming in contact with the metal. No moisture on the
metal, and the metal does not rust.

I have had the saw for about 30 years, and while I can not see my face
in the surface there is no rust on the table.

The piece of plywood also prevents someone coming in, seeing a flat
surface. and plopping some thing on the saw that will corroded or stain
the surfaces.



--
2017: The year we lean to play the great game of Euchre

On 6/1/2017 10:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]>
> wrote:

>> I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?

> Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that works is
> Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.
>
Exactly, why fool with success. Bostik TopCote works great and is
designed for exactly this purpose. Lasts a long time, easy to apply and
slick as all get out.

Spend a couple of bucks and be done with it.

--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
http://jbstein.com

On 6/2/17 7:38 AM, Jack wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 10:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>
>>> I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
>
>> Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that works
>> is Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu wax.
>>
> Exactly, why fool with success. Bostik TopCote works great and is
> designed for exactly this purpose. Lasts a long time, easy to apply
> and slick as all get out.
>
> Spend a couple of bucks and be done with it.
>

That's what I tell people every time the subject of removing rust from
table saw top comes up. I say, "Just use Boeshield RustFree and be done
with it."

But there are always people who want to put more work into it. There
are always those who say you need WD-40 and steel wool and to scrub and
reapply, etc, ad nauseam.
Maybe, they get more satisfaction out of the scrubbing and elbow grease,
but I'd rather use the saw, not clean it.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 6/2/17 11:15 AM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/2/2017 9:58 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 6/2/17 7:38 AM, Jack wrote:
>>> On 6/1/2017 10:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 17:19:33 -0500, gray_wolf
>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I wonder if a vinyl floor wax would work?
>>>
>>>> Why fool with success? Paste wax works. Another product that
>>>> works is Collinite #845 Insulator wax. It is a high carnabu
>>>> wax.
>>>>
>>> Exactly, why fool with success. Bostik TopCote works great and
>>> is designed for exactly this purpose. Lasts a long time, easy to
>>> apply and slick as all get out.
>>>
>>> Spend a couple of bucks and be done with it.
>>>
>>
>> That's what I tell people every time the subject of removing rust
>> from table saw top comes up. I say, "Just use Boeshield RustFree
>> and be done with it."
>>
>> But there are always people who want to put more work into it.
>> There are always those who say you need WD-40 and steel wool and to
>> scrub and reapply, etc, ad nauseam. Maybe, they get more
>> satisfaction out of the scrubbing and elbow grease, but I'd rather
>> use the saw, not clean it.
>>
>>
>
>
> I think we are talking about "rust prevention" not rust removal.
>
> I think you might be the first advising how to remove. ;~)

I know that. I was using it as another example of how many people would
rather do much harder work than to use a simpler process/product to
achieve the same/better results with much less effort.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 6/2/2017 5:55 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>> uff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
>> the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.
I have used the plywood on the table of the saw technique for many years
and never had a problem with the tracks rusting.

Yes it attracts stuff, but im my small work shop the stuff usually gets
put away. I can use the plywood covered table saw as an extra bench to
put glued frames while they dry; a working bench for my portable router
table, a bench when I need a big space for sanding something that will
not fit any where else; etc.

--
2017: The year we lean to play the great game of Euchre

On 6/2/2017 1:14 PM, Steve wrote:
> Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.
>
> Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
>
> No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.
>
> I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!

Make sure you get all the rust off first, using whatever you want. When
I bought my (used) tools 40+ years ago I used navel jelly, as the rust
was considerable on the tops. Then I used lacquer thinner to remove any
remaining residue of the rust remover, and got the tops super clean.
Then spray on the Topcoat, let it dry, and put on a second coat.

After that only one coat is needed to freshen it up. How long it lasts
would depend on how much use the tops get, but when I used my tools
daily, I would re-coat about every 6 months or so. Never got any rust
after that and re-coating would take about 5 minutes for all 7 of my
cast iron tops, so it is essentially a labor free task.

I also use it on the screws of bench vices, pipe clamps, bar clamps
C-clamps etc as it keeps them clean, rust free, slick and free spinning.

--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
http://jbstein.com

"Unquestionably Confused"
> wrote in message
> I previously read about a product called "Penetrol" which
> is a paint additive you can find at the Big Orange Box for
> about $10 or less a quart. Comes in a can like Mineral
> Spirits.
>
> I had some minor rusting on a saw top that got away from
> me when it was stored in an unheated portion of the garage
> and after I cleaned it up with the usual means, I applied
> a liberal coat of Penetrol, let it dry, and buffed it off.
> Smooth, slick surface and no further worries.
>
> The other products work well too but this seems more cost
> effective. I've put it on ALL my cast iron, the majority
> of which resides in a heated and air-conditioned shop.
>

Penetrol works good on a snowplow blade too! ;>)

Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

> For 30+ years I have been using TopKote, Bostitch.

Just to clarify, it's TopCote: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0000223UD

not TopKote: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000WK0XF0

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 18:08:08 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

>On 6/2/2017 4:55 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>> On 02 Jun 2017 19:07:33 GMT, Puckdropper
>> <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>>> Steve <[email protected]> wrote in
>>> news:[email protected]:
>>>
>>>> On Friday, June 2, 2017 at 1:14:42 PM UTC-4, Steve wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Oh-- and I'll definitely cut a piece of ply to fit over my table--
>>>> another great idea, thanks, all.
>>>>
>>>> I had considered a cover or tarp, but didn't think that would suffice
>>>> in this environment-- the moisture's simply everywhere. The ply
>>>> makes sense-- thanks again.
>>>>
>>>
>>> A tarp can actually trap moisture, so it will be worse than leaving your
>>> saw uncovered. The plywood, being in intimate contact with the top,
>>> won't have any air space in which to trap moisture and might help.
>>> Personally, I'd give the fancy stuff (topcote or similar) a try and forgo
>>> the top. IMO, a plywood top would encourage setting stuff on the saw.
>>
>> Any horizontal space is going to attract "stuff". ;-)
>>
>> I use one of these. It's been flawless.
>>
>> <https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/magnetic_table_saw_cover.html>
>>
>> The issue with any cover, plywood included, is that it does nothing to
>> protect the miter slots (BTW, the plywood should be thin enough that
>> it sits on the top like a noodle). Any prep tends to get worn off in
>> these areas, too, making the miter gauge sticky. One has to be
>> particularly careful to keep these clean.
>>
>
>My experience is that sheet goods warp,

I was thinking about something like 3/16" hardboard.


> the magnetic cover looks promising.

Worked for me.

On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 10:14:40 -0700 (PDT), Steve <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Great info, folks. thank you very much. I think I'm going to give the TopCote a try-- the non-transferring and slicker nature does appeal to me out of both options.
>
>Wax aside, I'm a little surprised there are no new products out there for people, but as a number of you mentioned, 'why mess with a good thing?'
>
>No issues with VOC changes for anyone, either-- that's a good thing too.
>
>I'll repost in a few months or so to let you know how it went, after a while. If I can find a coupon, I'll donate the savings to the baby caranuba efforts. The seal's on his own, though!

If you've used any of these products before, be sure you *clean* the
top thoroughly before putting anything new on the top. Use the
appropriate "cleaner" for what was used. ...and lots of it.