I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
the third will last if I buy it....
My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
Any experience out there?
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
> an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
Not only is it obsolete (because Zinsco lost their UL designation), it is
downright dangerous.
I finally replaced mine after I got tired of such minor things as sparks
inside the box and breakers
giving up the ghost after a year or so.
Eventually, it will be far cheaper to replace that stuff with safer
equipment right now while your
house is still standing.
Jim
<[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
> an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
> I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
> I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
> the third will last if I buy it....
>
> My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
> I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
> maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
> this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
>
> Any experience out there?
Depends upon your budget and knowledge/comfort factor adding a new panel. It
is a rather simple procedure, but not something your would want to tackle
with limited experience.
The alternative seem to be to use a non GFCI breaker, and a new GFCI
receptacle as the first in the run.
Certainly an effective, and much cheaper alternative.
Just my tuppence ...
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 2/20/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)
[email protected] wrote:
<snip>
> My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
> I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
> maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
> this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
>
> Any experience out there?
As someone who spent many years in the trenches
designing/applying/selling electrical distribution equipment let me
offer the following:
My employer considered the equipment you describe as something coming
from the bottom feeder sector of the competition and refused to
compete against them if they were specified on a job.
BTW, didn't lose a lot of jobs to them if a first line electrical
contractor was involved.
If you want to try to maintain 20+ year old equipment as described
above, you probably deserve whatever happens.
IMHO, a load center and some plug in c'bkrs are just not that
expensive, especially when you factor in the risk factors.
At a minimum, you get an up to date installation in compliance with
current code.
Lew
Real simple math
New service = much less than house burning down
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
> an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
> I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
> I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
> the third will last if I buy it....
>
> My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
> I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
> maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
> this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
>
> Any experience out there?
>
In article <[email protected]>
[email protected] writes:
>
>My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
>I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
>maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
>this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
About 20 years ago, I was renting a house with a fuse box. One of
the circuits was flaky. I forget exactly what was up, probably
that it was blowing the fuse frequently. I called the landlord who
set up a call with an electrician.
So the next day, I get an interesting call from my wife. The
electrician showed up, opened up the fuse box, and found that it
was on fire. We had a new breaker box by the time I got home.
If the funds are there, I'd certainly rather replace the box,
especially if the circuit parts you need are no longer made.
--
Drew Lawson | And to those who lack the courage
[email protected] | And say it's dangerous to try
| Well they just don't know
| That love eternal will not be denied
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
> an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
[snip]
> Any experience out there?
Hi Brian,
Licensed electrician with 30 years experience speaking here. Donning my
electrician's rubber gloves and official Usenet flame suit I offer the
following for your consideration.
We have hundreds, probably thousands of these Zinsco/Sylvania panels in
Greater St. Louis area, with relatively few significant problems. I do not
know of a single incident where an electrical fire was directly attributed
to a problem with this panel. My knowledge of "electrical" fires over the
past 30 years has revealed that the vast majority of "electrical" fires are
in actuality, STUPIDITY fires. Installing 30amp breakers and fuses on 15
amp wire, connecting aluminum wire to copper-only devices, and -(the # 1
reason for residential "electrical" fires)- improper use of extension cords
are three big-time causes of STUPIDITY fires. Probably the most serious
issue is with the 125 amp split buss panels is at the point where the
subfeed conductors are connected to the secondary buss. There have been a
significant number of problems at that point. The panel's reputation is far
worse than my experiences have shown the actual failure rate to be.
There are folks who will bad mouth these panels for various reasons, and I
agree with some of the complaints. This panel and the breakers were not of
the highest quality, but certainly comparable to several other manufacturers
of the era. The real issue today is that the manufacturer (Sylvania) dumped
the panel (for their Challenger brand) and we are now on the third or fourth
after-market manufacturer who has the "rights" to manufacturer breakers to
fit this panel. Obviously with the declining user base, availability is
down and prices are up! To my knowledge, there never has been an
aftermarket version of the GFI breakers.
I definitely would not spend money on replacing a GFI breaker of that era,
especially with a used one. You can replace the "bad" GFI breaker with a
single-pole breaker of the same amperage rating as the GFI. Then either
find the first receptacle on that circuit and install a GFI receptacle in
that space, or make a new first receptacle by installing the new GFI
receptacle at the main panel and connect the load from the original GFI
breaker to the load side of the new GFI receptacle.
If all this sounds too complex for your comfort level, you may email me off
list and I'll be glad to try to help you.
Gary Kasten
gwkasten@google'semail.com
(It shouldn't be too hard to figure out that google'semail.com is gmail.com)
There is a good reason why; Zinsco and most of the names that followed
are no longer known for circuit protection. I've seen entire circuits
burn up with the breaker never tripping.
Mike M
On 14 May 2007 18:16:39 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>
>I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
>an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
>I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
>I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
>the third will last if I buy it....
>
>My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
>I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
>maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
>this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
>
>Any experience out there?
On 14 May 2007 18:16:39 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>
>I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
>an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
>I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
>I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
>the third will last if I buy it....
>
>My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
>I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
>maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
>this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
>
>Any experience out there?
My experience with GFCI breakers of that era was not positive.
My previous house (1970 vintage) had the carport enclosed in 1980 and
an outlet added to the outside of that space in 1980. The outside
outlet was fed from a GFCI breaker - which tripped every time there
was a thunderstorm in the area. The breaker failed (permanent trip) a
few years later and I replaced it with another GFCI breaker - which
also tripped with every passing thunderstorm.
Wiring was to the then-current NEC and was passed by the city
inspector. I later replaced the GFCI breaker with a standard breaker
and the outlet with a GFCI outlet - and no more problems.
John
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've had a GFIC breaker fail (a ground fault doesn't trip it). It's
> an old GTE/Sylvania (AKA Zinsco?) that apparnetly is obsolete.
>
> I've chased it down to a few electrical surplus dealers here in town.
> I located 3 parts, two of witch tested bad. makes me wonder how long
> the third will last if I buy it....
>
> My question is, should I buy a 20+ year old breaker to replace the one
> I have, or replace the whole panel with something that can be
> maintained (Square D etc)? One of the dealers I spoke with mentioned
> this old style being suceptable to causing fires.
>
I have a 24 year old Sylvania and breakers for it are at Home Depot. Maybe
we don't have the same thing.
In any event, I would try to avoid GFCI breakers and use a GFCI outlet
instead.