Purpose of Relief Cut on Back of Baseboard Molding

On Nov 25, 11:01=A0pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>
>
> > You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> > if it wasn't backed out. =A0*Light* bead, lay down with a
> > wet finger, goes fast.
>
> Caulking is a HACK job. =A0I don't know of a decent build house that has =
caulk
> in the trim.

Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.

Robatoy wrote:

>On the topic of caulk, less is more. I use a piece of formica from a
>sample chain, the ones with sharp corners, to level the top of the
>caulk with the edge of the baseboard....never do I leave a radius.
--------------------------
AKA: Caulk scraper.

BTW, do you practice scary sharp on your Formica sample to keep the
corners square?

Lew

On 11/27/2010 4:05 PM, Morgans wrote:
>
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote>>
>>
>> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
>> to cut the mitres!
>
> I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.

You're kidding, right?

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 17:05:23 -0500, "Morgans"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote>>
>>
>> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
>> to cut the mitres!
>
> I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.

He used to until the new tools came out. Look back a few years and
you'll see our friend, Tom Silva (or was it Nahm's young pup who left
the show?), coping things with a power coper of some sort. I forgot
what it was called, but it was neat and fast. It might have been this
one http://www.easycoper.com/ but it hs been too long since I saw that
episode.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Nmnn4DPrUc It wasn't this one.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

On Nov 27, 11:32=A0am, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 11/27/2010 10:04 AM, Swingman wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 11/27/2010 9:07 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> >> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote
>
> >>> Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>
> >>>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Djqjef8_ZW2E&feature=3Dplayer_embedded
>
> >>> 6:52
>
> >>> ... go figure, eh?
>
> >> My step-father would be laughing himself silly watching that. He'd mak=
e
> >> a perfect fit and never used caulk.
>
> > Of course he didn't, the painter who followed him up did.
>
> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>
> http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/genera...
>
> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>
> --www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/15/2010
> KarlC@ (the obvious)

I use a Bosch digital protractor and divide by2. The gauges on my
mitre saws are calibrated as best as I know, and the consistent
results seem to bear that out....BUT, that Festool tool, dammit, seems
a whole lot easier and idiot proof and my division skills get all head-
achy when it comes to degrees, minutes, and seconds. I still think we
should metricate(?) angular measurements..like a full circle is 1000
degrees. <G>

On Nov 25, 8:33=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. =A0What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?

Yes, and yes. Backing out makes sure the edges
of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.

You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
wet finger, goes fast.

>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.
>
> --
>
> =A0 -MIKE-
>
> =A0 "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> =A0 =A0 =A0--Elvin Jones =A0(1927-2004)
> =A0 --
> =A0http://mikedrums.com
> =A0 [email protected]
> =A0 ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 11/27/2010 10:04 AM, Swingman wrote:
> On 11/27/2010 9:07 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote
>>>
>>> Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjef8_ZW2E&feature=player_embedded
>>>
>>> 6:52
>>>
>>> ... go figure, eh?
>>
>> My step-father would be laughing himself silly watching that. He'd make
>> a perfect fit and never used caulk.
>
> Of course he didn't, the painter who followed him up did.

LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:

http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/general-accessories/miterfast-angle-transfer-device-494370.html

Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote>>
>
> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
> to cut the mitres!

I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.
--
Jim in NC

"Josepi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both
> sides???


Some mouldings are primed/painted at the mill, and therefore sealed. Less
likely to warp/cup. If unpainted and left out in the elements and or
different climates the board with a fresh exposed side can warp/cup. Mill
both sides and things tend to even out.





>
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides,
> unless
> preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
> one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
> I always do this when planing boards.
>
>
>
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
>> purpose?
>>
>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
>> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>>
>> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
>> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.
>
>
>
>

On 11/27/2010 11:55 AM, Robatoy wrote:
> On Nov 27, 11:32 am, Swingman<[email protected]> wrote:

>> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>>
>> http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/genera...
>>
>> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>>
>> --www.e-woodshop.net
>> Last update: 4/15/2010
>> KarlC@ (the obvious)
>
> I use a Bosch digital protractor and divide by2. The gauges on my
> mitre saws are calibrated as best as I know, and the consistent
> results seem to bear that out....BUT, that Festool tool, dammit, seems
> a whole lot easier and idiot proof and my division skills get all head-
> achy when it comes to degrees, minutes, and seconds. I still think we
> should metricate(?) angular measurements..like a full circle is 1000
> degrees.<G>

As an old redleg Artilleryman, that would be 6400 mils ...

Dealing with Festool stuff lately I'm getting fairly conversant with
metric again, but I do have an inches to metric converter app on my
DroidX just in case.

Leon and I both now have Festool's Parallel Guide Sets for precision
breaking down of full sheets of plywood and they're all metric. So much
easier to have 20 or 30 sheets delivered and just cut on top of the
stack with a 4 x 8 piece of foam:

http://picasaweb.google.com/karlcaillouet/DurretteKitchenShopPictures?authkey=Gv1sRgCIaJgYOqgKvOVw#5542196561727881746

Getting too damn old and stiff to do otherwise ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>
>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
>> caulk
>> in the trim.
>
> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.

Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.

Josepi wrote:
> Damn NNTP doesn't send the checkback code and it reposts.
>
> My apologies to any irritated.
>
> "Josepi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both
> sides???
>
>
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides,
> unless preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is
> only milled on one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup.
> Solution, mill both sides. I always do this when planing boards.
>
>
>
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is
>> its purpose?
>>
>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the
>> wall? Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>>
>> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
>> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.

Change the "Copies" parameter from "2" to "1" ?

"Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>
> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
> wet finger, goes fast.


Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has caulk
in the trim.

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:d36775ba-ae5d-4c68-b79c-a6db4a7df106@v19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 25, 11:01 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>
>
> > You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> > if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
> > wet finger, goes fast.
>
> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
> caulk
> in the trim.

If the trim guy uses caulk, it's a hack, if the painter uses it, it's
part of the finish.

I am 100% with C-less that the black shadow line looks way worse than
a skilfully applied fill in that gap.
The bitch I have with caulking, is that too many schlock trim
carpenters use it as a regular part of their installation procedure.
But to leave the black gaps is the worse of two evils, IMHO.... and I
have never been in a house where a little dab here and there didn't
make it look better.


I dont think I have ever seen a perfect trim board, the wall can be
perfectly straight and the trim board will need the caulk anyway.

On 11/25/2010 8:07 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 11/25/10 7:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
>> On Nov 25, 8:33 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
>>> purpose?
>>>
>>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the
>>> wall?
>>> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>>
>> Yes, and yes. Backing out makes sure the edges
>> of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.
>>
>> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
>> wet finger, goes fast.
>>
>
> Thanks.
>
> I really hate caulking trim. To me, nothing says, "No one involved took
> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.
>
>

I was kind of wondering about that. I've never caulked any trim on.

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

Damn NNTP doesn't send the checkback code and it reposts.

My apologies to any irritated.

"Josepi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both sides???


"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides, unless
preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
I always do this when planing boards.



"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.

On 11/27/2010 8:16 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>

> In the real world, both the walls and ceiling would be wavy and nearly
> the whole length of every wall would require caulk to make it look
> nice, both at the base and crown.

Apparently there are no hard to please clients in google/wikipedia,
where the temperature is a constant 72, the sky is always cloudless, and
all baskets go swoosh ... ;)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 11/29/2010 7:35 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 11/29/10 7:22 PM, Swingman wrote:
>> On 11/29/2010 11:47 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
>>> On 11/27/10 10:32 AM, Swingman wrote:
>>>>
>>>> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/general-accessories/miterfast-angle-transfer-device-494370.html>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>>>>
>>>
>>> If anyone is interested, this one has a more modest price..
>>>
>>> http://www.affinitytool.com/boraanglemaster.html
>>
>> Thanks ...
>>
>
> Sure thing!
> You can send me some of that green weasel stew you were cookin up after
> Thanksgiving. :-p

Not sure about the color, but it was the same color as leftover turkey,
chicken, sausage and okra GUMBO, if that helps ... ;)

<last of the pot is heating up for supper as we speak>

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:d36775ba-ae5d-4c68-b79c-a6db4a7df106@v19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 25, 11:01 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Ship
make it look better.

On the topic of caulk, less is more. I use a piece of formica from a
sample chain, the ones with sharp corners, to level the top of the
caulk with the edge of the baseboard....never do I leave a radius.
Also, the caulking gun tip is cut square at the smallest possible
opening and 'pushed' as it dispenses, as opposed to 'pulled'. I get
compliments all the time about how little I use and how bloody awesome
I am at caulking...<G>
Of course, I use the Festool of caulking guns, none better than these:
http://preview.tinyurl.com/23lhbev
Having done a lot of countertops in the last 25+ years, you get to do
a lot of caulking.

I have had a number of caulk guns over they years, expensive exotic ones.
My favorite ones are the CHEAP Home Depot Orange ones. Those guns have an
automatic pressure relief so that when you stop squeezing the handle the
caulk stops coming out. No more laying the gun down for a sec and returning
to find a pile of goo under the tip.

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote
>
> Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjef8_ZW2E&feature=player_embedded
>
> 6:52
>
> ... go figure, eh?

My step-father would be laughing himself silly watching that. He'd make a
perfect fit and never used caulk. Remember when paneling was big in the
1960's? People used corner strips. If he did the job, he'd charge extra
for each corner that did not use a corner trim. He'd miter the two pieces
(using a circular saw) of paneling and make a perfect corner.

Most of the work he did was in high end houses. When he became too sick to
work any more, one homeowner sent a car every day to pick him up, drove him
to the house so he could supervise and train two finish carpenters putting
in trim such a special custom milled baseboard. You can bet they use no
caulk.

On Nov 25, 9:07=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> Thanks.
>
> I really hate caulking trim. =A0To me, nothing says, "No one involved too=
k
> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.
>


In a perfect world walls are flat, baseboard is straight... in a
perfect world.
That is why I use 3M hotmelt and silicon to attach baseboard. A good
push and it follows the wall (mostly) and no nail holes to fill.
Then, as small a bead as possible because I think a filled gap looks
better than a gap unfilled. <G>
Make sure the fill gets painted the same colour as the wall.

On Nov 27, 6:42=A0pm, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 11/27/2010 4:05 PM, Morgans wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote>>
>
> >> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
> >> to cut the mitres!
>
> > I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.
>
> You're kidding, right?

One of our timberframers worked on a Tom Silva job and said he was the
most organized, classiest, all-out best contractor he'd ever been
involved with.
JP

On Nov 27, 8:35=A0am, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 11/26/2010 10:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>
> >>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
> >>> caulk
> >>> in the trim.
>
> >> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
> >> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.
>
> > Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.
>
> Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Djqjef8_ZW2E&feature=3Dplayer_embedded
>
> 6:52
>
> ... go figure, eh?
>

Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
to cut the mitres!

On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 05:52:52 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Nov 25, 11:01 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>
>>
>>
>> > You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>> > if it wasn't backed out.  *Light* bead, lay down with a
>> > wet finger, goes fast.
>>
>> Caulking is a HACK job.  I don't know of a decent build house that has caulk
>> in the trim.
>
>If the trim guy uses caulk, it's a hack, if the painter uses it, it's
>part of the finish.
>
>I am 100% with C-less that the black shadow line looks way worse than
>a skilfully applied fill in that gap.

FINALLY, something we agree on. ;)


>The bitch I have with caulking, is that too many schlock trim
>carpenters use it as a regular part of their installation procedure.
>But to leave the black gaps is the worse of two evils, IMHO.... and I
>have never been in a house where a little dab here and there didn't
>make it look better.

Ayup.


>On the topic of caulk, less is more. I use a piece of formica from a
>sample chain, the ones with sharp corners, to level the top of the
>caulk with the edge of the baseboard....never do I leave a radius.

Hmm, I'll have to try that. I think it'd look better than even a small
radius.


>Also, the caulking gun tip is cut square at the smallest possible
>opening and 'pushed' as it dispenses, as opposed to 'pulled'. I get
>compliments all the time about how little I use and how bloody awesome
>I am at caulking...<G>

Ayup, push whenever possible for pre-finished beads and much less
overflow/bypass.


>Of course, I use the Festool of caulking guns, none better than these:
>http://preview.tinyurl.com/23lhbev

I like these: http://fwd4.me/pqk Damned good guns. Open, for the style
of caulk we use in the USA.


>Having done a lot of countertops in the last 25+ years, you get to do
>a lot of caulking.

I've gotten a lot more practice as a handyman than I did before. And I
have new tools for finishing it.

http://fwd4.me/pqg These are PERFECT for tub-to-tile junctions.

http://fwd4.me/pqh These are better for the cabinet-to wall joints.

And a damp rag to swipe the walls afterward creates the perfection
we're all after.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

On Nov 25, 9:07=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 11/25/10 7:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
>
> > On Nov 25, 8:33 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> =A0wrote:
> >> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. =A0What is i=
ts
> >> purpose?
>
> >> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> >> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wa=
ll?
> >> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> > Yes, and yes. =A0Backing out makes sure the edges
> > of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.
>
> > You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> > if it wasn't backed out. =A0*Light* bead, lay down with a
> > wet finger, goes fast.
>
> Thanks.
>
> I really hate caulking trim. =A0To me, nothing says, "No one involved too=
k
> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.

A neat caulking job SHOWS pride in your work. Cut the very
tip of the nozzle, just enough to lay a pencil-lead wide bead,
run the caulk fast, then hit with a wet finger. You don't notice
the caulk, you notice that the trim and wall look like one piece.

You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both sides???


"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides, unless
preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
I always do this when planing boards.



"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.

On Nov 25, 11:01=A0pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>
>
> > You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> > if it wasn't backed out. =A0*Light* bead, lay down with a
> > wet finger, goes fast.
>
> Caulking is a HACK job. =A0I don't know of a decent build house that has =
caulk
> in the trim.

If the trim guy uses caulk, it's a hack, if the painter uses it, it's
part of the finish.

I am 100% with C-less that the black shadow line looks way worse than
a skilfully applied fill in that gap.
The bitch I have with caulking, is that too many schlock trim
carpenters use it as a regular part of their installation procedure.
But to leave the black gaps is the worse of two evils, IMHO.... and I
have never been in a house where a little dab here and there didn't
make it look better.

On the topic of caulk, less is more. I use a piece of formica from a
sample chain, the ones with sharp corners, to level the top of the
caulk with the edge of the baseboard....never do I leave a radius.
Also, the caulking gun tip is cut square at the smallest possible
opening and 'pushed' as it dispenses, as opposed to 'pulled'. I get
compliments all the time about how little I use and how bloody awesome
I am at caulking...<G>
Of course, I use the Festool of caulking guns, none better than these:
http://preview.tinyurl.com/23lhbev
Having done a lot of countertops in the last 25+ years, you get to do
a lot of caulking.

On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 21:54:21 -0600, Steve Barker
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On 11/25/2010 8:07 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 11/25/10 7:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
>>> On Nov 25, 8:33 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
>>>> purpose?
>>>>
>>>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>>>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the
>>>> wall?
>>>> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>>>
>>> Yes, and yes. Backing out makes sure the edges
>>> of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.
>>>
>>> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>>> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
>>> wet finger, goes fast.
>>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> I really hate caulking trim. To me, nothing says, "No one involved took
>> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.

Yeah, caulked 1/2" gaps just don't scream "craftsperson", do they?


>I was kind of wondering about that. I've never caulked any trim on.

I hate the black line between trim/cabinetry/walls and invariably
caulk it even it it's nicely even and tight.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, fo to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both sides???


"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides, unless
preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
I always do this when planing boards.



"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.

On Nov 26, 5:34=A0pm, Larry Jaques <[email protected]>
wrote:

> On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 05:52:52 -0800 (PST), Robatoy

>
> >Of course, I use the Festool of caulking guns, none better than these:
> >http://preview.tinyurl.com/23lhbev
>
> I like these:http://fwd4.me/pqkDamned good guns. Open, for the style
> of caulk we use in the USA.

We are finally allowed toobs of caulk <G> The IMF and World Bank said
so.
I prefer a T-bar over a hook (very minor point, really)
The key with the gun you're showing is that they're die-cast handles
and the barrel rotates. Features I like about the Cox. I'm sure I'd be
happy with that one too.
>
> >Having done a lot of countertops in the last 25+ years, you get to do
> >a lot of caulking.
>
> I've gotten a lot more practice as a handyman than I did before. And I
> have new tools for finishing it.
>
> http://fwd4.me/pqg=A0These are PERFECT for tub-to-tile junctions.

Never seen those before, but look as handy as a pocket-on-a-shirt.

>
> http://fwd4.me/pqh=A0These are better for the cabinet-to wall joints.

Those I have used. Not a fan, but they did get me out of trouble
before.
>
> And a damp rag to swipe the walls afterward creates the perfection
> we're all after.
>

Sounds like we should have a caulk-off. <G>

On Nov 27, 1:34=A0pm, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 11/27/2010 11:55 AM, Robatoy wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 27, 11:32 am, Swingman<[email protected]> =A0wrote:
> >> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>
> >>http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/genera..=
.
>
> >> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>
> >> --www.e-woodshop.net
> >> Last update: 4/15/2010
> >> KarlC@ (the obvious)
>
> > I use a Bosch digital protractor and divide by2. The gauges on my
> > mitre saws are calibrated as best as I know, and the consistent
> > results seem to bear that out....BUT, that Festool tool, dammit, seems
> > a whole lot easier and idiot proof and my division skills get all head-
> > achy when it comes to degrees, minutes, and seconds. I still think we
> > should metricate(?) angular measurements..like a full circle is 1000
> > degrees.<G>
>
> As an old redleg Artilleryman, that would be 6400 mils ...
>
> Dealing with Festool stuff lately I'm getting fairly conversant with
> metric again, but I do have an inches to metric converter app on my
> DroidX just in case.
>
> Leon and I both now have Festool's Parallel Guide Sets for precision
> breaking down of full sheets of plywood and they're all metric. So much
> easier to have 20 or 30 sheets delivered and just cut on top of the
> stack with a 4 x 8 piece of foam:
>
> http://picasaweb.google.com/karlcaillouet/DurretteKitchenShopPictures...
>
> Getting too damn old and stiff to do otherwise ...
>
> --www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/15/2010
> KarlC@ (the obvious)

Slick as snot, wot?

Damn NNTP doesn't send the checkback code and it reposts.

My apologies to any irritated.

"Josepi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
You started about painting both sides and switched to, milling both sides???


"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides, unless
preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
I always do this when planing boards.



"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.

On 11/27/2010 9:07 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote
>>
>> Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjef8_ZW2E&feature=player_embedded
>>
>> 6:52
>>
>> ... go figure, eh?
>
> My step-father would be laughing himself silly watching that. He'd make
> a perfect fit and never used caulk.

Of course he didn't, the painter who followed him up did.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 11/25/10 7:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
> On Nov 25, 8:33 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
>> purpose?
>>
>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
>> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> Yes, and yes. Backing out makes sure the edges
> of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.
>
> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
> wet finger, goes fast.
>

Thanks.

I really hate caulking trim. To me, nothing says, "No one involved took
any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 11/25/10 9:45 PM, Robatoy wrote:
> On Nov 25, 9:07 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> I really hate caulking trim. To me, nothing says, "No one involved took
>> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.
>>
>
>
> In a perfect world walls are flat, baseboard is straight... in a
> perfect world.
> That is why I use 3M hotmelt and silicon to attach baseboard. A good
> push and it follows the wall (mostly) and no nail holes to fill.
> Then, as small a bead as possible because I think a filled gap looks
> better than a gap unfilled.<G>
> Make sure the fill gets painted the same colour as the wall.

Used to be, in an average world, walls were straight. There were
straight in my previous house, because I built it. The drywall sub even
asked me to straighten out some bent studs.... in the closet, no less.
How's that for wanting a quality finish. Who would do that? 90 percent
of contractors would just sheet right over it a bend the drywall.
There's no excuse for some of the curving I see in new homes around
here. Correction... there are lots of excuses... none of them valid, imo.

Most baseboard bends enough to follow the wall. Unfortunately curving
baseboard is more apparent than curving drywall. Filling the troughs
makes the baseboard look straight, but still shows the imperfection on top.

I had to do that with some crown on a house that had waves on both axes.
Big dips down and waves in and out, seemingly between each stud. It
would've looked horrible to follow those waves with the crown. I used
hotmelt, too. It's great for securing corners and I'm in favor of fewer
nail holes, as well.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

I don't know of any quality installation that does not. If I had
a painter that didn't, I'd be getting a different painter.

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DanG
Keep the whole world singing . . .


"Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>
>> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
>> wet finger, goes fast.
>
>
> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house
> that has caulk in the trim.
>
>

Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>
>> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
>> wet finger, goes fast.
>
>
> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
> caulk in the trim.
I don't know of any homes built that doesnt get caulk on painted trim. It
give it the finishing touches. If the trim is white I always caulk after the
walls have been painted. Been trimming for a long time and caulking has
always been part of the finished job. No walls are straight and plum and
there is nothing worse then trim running down a wood floor looking like a
Railroad Track in the Rockies.
--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"

Man. 2010.1 Spring
KDE4.4
2.6.33.5-desktop-2mnb

On 11/26/10 4:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
> On Nov 25, 9:07 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>> On 11/25/10 7:54 PM, Father Haskell wrote:
>>
>>> On Nov 25, 8:33 pm, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
>>>> purpose?
>>
>>>> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
>>>> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
>>>> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>>
>>> Yes, and yes. Backing out makes sure the edges
>>> of the trim contact the wall, even if the wood cups.
>>
>>> You'll still have to caulk it in, but not so heavily as
>>> if it wasn't backed out. *Light* bead, lay down with a
>>> wet finger, goes fast.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> I really hate caulking trim. To me, nothing says, "No one involved took
>> any pride in their work," like caulking the seems between wall and trim.
>
> A neat caulking job SHOWS pride in your work. Cut the very
> tip of the nozzle, just enough to lay a pencil-lead wide bead,
> run the caulk fast, then hit with a wet finger. You don't notice
> the caulk, you notice that the trim and wall look like one piece.


I know how to caulk. I have no problem with a "neat" caulking job.

If you read my posts in context you'll understand I'm essentially
referring to caulking to hide shitty work done by lazy workers.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

In article <[email protected]>,
Ed Pawlowski <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>>
>>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
>>> caulk
>>> in the trim.
>>
>> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
>> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.
>
>Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.
>

Usually baseboard is applied over drywall. Drywall is hung on studs. Studs
are put up by framing carpenters. I don't think it's necessary to comment
on the accuracy standards of a framing carpenter.





--
When the game is over, the pawn and the king are returned to the same box.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org

On 11/27/10 10:32 AM, Swingman wrote:
>
> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>
> <http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/general-accessories/miterfast-angle-transfer-device-494370.html>
>
>
> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>

If anyone is interested, this one has a more modest price..

http://www.affinitytool.com/boraanglemaster.html


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 11/29/10 7:22 PM, Swingman wrote:
> On 11/29/2010 11:47 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 11/27/10 10:32 AM, Swingman wrote:
>>>
>>> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>>>
>>> <http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/general-accessories/miterfast-angle-transfer-device-494370.html>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>>>
>>
>> If anyone is interested, this one has a more modest price..
>>
>> http://www.affinitytool.com/boraanglemaster.html
>
> Thanks ...
>

Sure thing!
You can send me some of that green weasel stew you were cookin up after
Thanksgiving. :-p


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

"Morgans" <[email protected]> writes:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote>>
>>
>> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
>> to cut the mitres!
>
> I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.
I think I heard him say on another show that since that material is
synthetic it doesn't expand/contract as much plus he can glue the
corners so they don't separate...

On 11/29/2010 11:47 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 11/27/10 10:32 AM, Swingman wrote:
>>
>> LOL ... but I really do like that Miterfast Angle Transfer Device:
>>
>> <http://www.festoolusa.com/products/sliding-compound-miter-saws/general-accessories/miterfast-angle-transfer-device-494370.html>
>>
>>
>>
>> Be worth having just on general principles ... ;)
>>
>
> If anyone is interested, this one has a more modest price..
>
> http://www.affinitytool.com/boraanglemaster.html

Thanks ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 13:04:17 +0000 (UTC),
[email protected] (Larry W) wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
>Ed Pawlowski <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>"Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>>>
>>>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
>>>> caulk
>>>> in the trim.
>>>
>>> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
>>> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.
>>
>>Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.
>>
>
>Usually baseboard is applied over drywall. Drywall is hung on studs. Studs
>are put up by framing carpenters. I don't think it's necessary to comment
>on the accuracy standards of a framing carpenter.

Combine that with the wavy new cardboard baseboard and you have a
nightmare which begs for caulking to give it some semblance of order.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Baseboard moldings always have a cutout on the back side. What is its
> purpose?
>
> Is it there to relieve cupping stresses?
> Or maybe to just allow for flat placement over imperfections in the wall?
> Anyone know the actually reason for this?
>
> I'm not asking for guesses or speculation.
> I'm sure someone out there actually knows this info.


Keep this in mind also. Seldom is a baseboard painted on both sides, unless
preprimed. What happens to a piece of thin lumber that is only milled on
one complete side? Normally it will warp/cup. Solution, mill both sides.
I always do this when planing boards.

On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 15:25:36 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Nov 26, 5:34 pm, Larry Jaques <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 05:52:52 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
>
>>
>> >Of course, I use the Festool of caulking guns, none better than these:
>> >http://preview.tinyurl.com/23lhbev
>>
>> I like these:http://fwd4.me/pqkDamned good guns. Open, for the style
>> of caulk we use in the USA.
>
>We are finally allowed toobs of caulk <G> The IMF and World Bank said
>so.

Alrighty, then.


>I prefer a T-bar over a hook (very minor point, really)
>The key with the gun you're showing is that they're die-cast handles
>and the barrel rotates. Features I like about the Cox. I'm sure I'd be
>happy with that one too.

Yeah, the cast-handled jobbers are much more powerful and you can be
more deft in your application if you've a mind to.


>> >Having done a lot of countertops in the last 25+ years, you get to do
>> >a lot of caulking.
>>
>> I've gotten a lot more practice as a handyman than I did before. And I
>> have new tools for finishing it.
>>
>> http://fwd4.me/pqg These are PERFECT for tub-to-tile junctions.
>
>Never seen those before, but look as handy as a pocket-on-a-shirt.

Teeny slit in the corner makes for a poifect bead.


>> http://fwd4.me/pqh These are better for the cabinet-to wall joints.
>
>Those I have used. Not a fan, but they did get me out of trouble
>before.

I especially like them for getting deep into corners.


>> And a damp rag to swipe the walls afterward creates the perfection
>> we're all after.
>>
>
>Sounds like we should have a caulk-off. <G>

I believe that's illegal in the USA. But carry on, if you like.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 07:35:41 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:

>On 11/26/2010 10:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>>>
>>>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
>>>> caulk
>>>> in the trim.
>>>
>>> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
>>> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.
>>
>> Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.
>
>Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjef8_ZW2E&feature=player_embedded

Ooh, _tasty_ lookin' lady! What was the video about, anyway?


>6:52
>
>... go figure, eh?

And that remodel was probably installed by truly skilled craftsmen who
are getting paid for results, not lowest bid contractors. Has TOH ever
done a remodel for less than a cool million? <g>

In the real world, both the walls and ceiling would be wavy and nearly
the whole length of every wall would require caulk to make it look
nice, both at the base and crown.

--
Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening
of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences.
It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is
happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with
awareness. -- Louis L'Amour

On 11/26/2010 10:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> "Father Haskell" <[email protected]> wrote
>>>
>>> Caulking is a HACK job. I don't know of a decent build house that has
>>> caulk
>>> in the trim.
>>
>> Standard practice. That little inside radius does your trim painter
>> a BIG favor, makes it easier for him to cut in without masking tape.
>
> Standard practice for a hack, yes, not a skilled finish carpenter.

Yeah, a real hack job by a real hack:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjef8_ZW2E&feature=player_embedded

6:52

... go figure, eh?

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 11/28/2010 7:12 PM, blueman wrote:
> "Morgans"<[email protected]> writes:
>> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote>>
>>>
>>> Well, shit... of course he needed to use caulk. He was using a Kapex
>>> to cut the mitres!
>>
>> I wanna know why he did not cope the corners.
> I think I heard him say on another show that since that material is
> synthetic it doesn't expand/contract as much plus he can glue the
> corners so they don't separate...

Bingo ... the foam crown material is much more dimensionally stable than
its wood counterpart so effectively doesn't need to be coped as it
doesn't open up with seasonal changes in RH.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)