My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
and on the post like these.
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
what I have now.
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
hardware to use? Thanks
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:58:50 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Guess who" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:40:28 -0800, "TeamCasa" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>
>>
>> Will you after few years? I found that screwing into the end-grain
>> was eventually a problem.
>
>I used an inner piece of wood with the grain running perpendicular to the
>bed rail so that the bed rail side of the fastener was mounted with the
>grain also.
>
Thanks. I noticed that great idea in another post as well; one of
those, "Why didn't I think of that?". I've used a similar idea in the
past myself, but never thought of it. I'll be tackling a bed in the
near future, and appreciate all of the good ideas presented here. My
inclination now is possibly a combination of ideas. That might
require just a very little more effort in assembly. I'll see what I
come up with, and if it's good enough will bring back here for
scrutiny. It might be a while though since I'm temporarily forced to
avoid dust for a month or two.
I don't like the hardware you've used either. I would go with the bed
bolts you've shown. They are very solid and can be tightened as
needed. One per joint is all that is needed. If you haven't already,
you will need to have a shallow M&T joint made in order to prevent the
rail from twisting. I'm using the same bed bolts on a current project
I'm starting.
<<<(8/4 rails, right?)>>>
8/4 rails? WOW! I thought my 5/4 rails were substantial even if they
are red oak. I like the bed bolts idea as most have recommended.
However, now that the head and foot boards are all assembled, drilling
accurate holes is problematic. The surface mounts recommended by Jeff
also present a problem locating the rails the correct distance apart to
allow matress clearance without a lot of access space. Leaning toward
the bed bolts but think I'll make my own since I have access to brass
stock. Seem simple enough. Just need to ponder how to go about
drilling accurate holes for a while.
In article <[email protected]>, Guess who
<[email protected]> wrote:
> I found that screwing into the end-grain was eventually a problem.
That's why a really sturdy bed is so important. ;-)
Kevin
In article <[email protected]>,
Mike in Arkansas <[email protected]> wrote:
> Great, thanks for the input Mike, Leon, Joe C, Mike n, Toolguy and Joe
> W. Good ideas, info and new sources. I hadn't consided the necessity
> of a mortis/tenon to prevent twisting. Couple of dowels should do it.
Aren't you in the Arkadelphia area?
If you ever get through Texarkana, you should stop at Oak Creek Amish
Furniture, just off of Hwy 67 South, a couple of miles SW of Texarkana.
The bed hardware their suppliers use is the sturdiest stuff I've ever
seen. Very heavy duty! I took note of the name shown on the hardware,
but Google didn't produce any hits.
http://www.oakcreekamishfurniture.com/index.html
I know that "Amish" describes the people who make it and the level of
craftsmanship, but I still get a chuckle out of the Amish entertainment
centers. ;-)
Kevin
In article <[email protected]>,
Mike in Arkansas <[email protected]> wrote:
> <Aren't you in the Arkadelphia area?>
>
> Happily, no. Went to college there in the 60's and haven't been back
> since. I'm a little bit less than slightly more than halfway between
> here and there in the west central area.
Ah. I'm from nowhere nearly that exciting. ;-)
I grew up in Hatfield, in Polk County.
Kevin
This month's Fine Woodworking has a very comprehensive article on bed
hardware. You might take a look.
Joe in Denver
my woodworking website:
http://www.the-wildings.com/shop/
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
These work well.
http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=3269
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
On 17 Jan 2005 07:24:42 -0800, the inscrutable "Mike in Arkansas"
<[email protected]> spake:
>http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
>My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
>or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
>hardware to use? Thanks
They're sold in sets of 4, so they're probably designed for individual
use, one to a corner. I'd make a T&G for them if it were my bed. It
would relieve the stress. (Disclaimer: I haven't used them, but
they're also used to hold workbenches together, so they should be
strong enough. A Mission bed should be white oak, so the wood is
strong enough. (8/4 rails, right?)
--
EAT SOYLENT McD!
----------------------
http://diversify.com People-free Websites
I like them as well - see the last bed I made, they worked great.
http://www.teamcasa.org/workshop/beddetails.htm
Dave
> These work well.
> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=3269
>
>
>
> "Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
>> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
>> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
>> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
>> and on the post like these.
>> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
>> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
>> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
>> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
>> what I have now.
>> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
>> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
>> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
>> hardware to use? Thanks
>>
>
>
> Will you after few years? I found that screwing into the end-grain
> was eventually a problem.
True - to an extent. I found that if the joint between the headboard and
sideboard is sufficient size (mass) and large screws (I used #12 x 3") and
the fit is very tight, you will have no problems.
I used this same setup on a similar style bed many years ago and it is still
solid today.
If the sideboards are thin (< 1" or narrow < 6") then a bedbolt would be
preferred.
Dave
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap
=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap
=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
I have used bed bolts for 20 years with as yet no problems whatsoever . In
my opinion the longer the bolts are the better as the tendancy to shear out
along the grain is lessened [although I have never experienced that
problem].....
I get my reproduction hardware from horton brasses ,cromwell conn . I find
this quality first class and their service fast and friendly .i enclose a
link for your convenience
....http://www.horton-brasses.com/products/bedhardware. .....mjh
I used a completely hidden system that is rock solid on the craftsman bed
that I made. Plans are in Jeff Miller's book 'Beds'. Basically, you cut a
shallow mortise into the outside of each leg (where your bolt hole cover
would normally go) and drop in a square nut. The nut should be flush with
the outside of the bed leg. Extend that hole for the bolt througth the leg
and into the bed rail. The bolt then drops into a long shallow mortise on
the inside of each rail, then pushes into the hole extending to the outside
of the leg (to picture this, think of loading a bolt-action rifle). The nut
on the outside of the leg is covered by the 'wings'. Be sure that when you
attach the rails, the thread from the bolt doesn't extend past the nut, or
it will snap the wing right off.
Clear as mud?
Joe C.
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
I was worried about that as well, but I quickly found a lot of information
explaining how to drill for large hardwood dowels across the grain, in line
with the needed screws. This is what I did and it was a piece of cake. No
end grain issue anymore and nothing has come loose and the bed doesn't
squeak at all. I made the bed out of hard maple and it weighs a lot, but my
wife moves the bedroom furniture around about every 2 weeks, so if the bed
was going to come loose I think it would've happened by now. AT any rate,
the end grain issue is really not an issue at all, IMO.
Mike
"Guess who" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 15:47:26 GMT, "Mike in Mystic"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I used the following type of fasteners:
>>http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product_details.cfm?&offerings_id=10&objectgrou
>>p_id=7&catid=6&filter=bed
>>
>>These aren't really difficult to install, and you don't see anything. I
>>recessed the female portion just a TAD (I'm talking MAYBE 1/32") deeper
>>than
>>flush, which resulted in the two pieces going together very tightly. The
>>bed doesn't move after 3 years now. Anyway, this is just another option.
>
> I hate those with a passion. The one part has to fasten into
> end-grain. They DO come loose, and the bed squeaks [keep it clean
> boys and girls] after a time. The only solution then is to re-screw
> it hlonger fatter [might have to drill out the metal] screws ...still
> end-grain with ensuing problems.
>
> I'd go for the bolts unless there's something better is suggested
> ...haven't read all the other replies yet.
>
Mike, I used some hardware from Rockler for my son's first bed - a twin
sized. The whole thing is solid as a rock and these were perfect. Surface
mount so no M&T work. Plus they break down very easily and have the option
of locking in with one screw (you'll see what I mean when you look at the
link).
Good luck!
http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product_details.cfm?&offerings_id=5783
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
> http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:40:28 -0800, "TeamCasa" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>I like them as well - see the last bed I made, they worked great.
>
>http://www.teamcasa.org/workshop/beddetails.htm
>
>Dave
>> These work well.
>> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=3269
Will you after few years? I found that screwing into the end-grain
was eventually a problem.
The bed bolts in your second link would work very well and are actually
pretty close to what were historically used (at least from what I've read
and seen before). The decorative covers that hide the bolts aren't really
bad and you can find a lot of options if you don't like those from LV. The
other benefit is that you can easily take the bed apart.
I used the following type of fasteners:
http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product_details.cfm?&offerings_id=10&objectgrou
p_id=7&catid=6&filter=bed
These aren't really difficult to install, and you don't see anything. I
recessed the female portion just a TAD (I'm talking MAYBE 1/32") deeper than
flush, which resulted in the two pieces going together very tightly. The
bed doesn't move after 3 years now. Anyway, this is just another option.
Mike
"Mike in Arkansas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My Craftsman Style bed (Wood Magazine plans) is finally finished and
> assembled. Pretty disappointed in the rail mounting hardware I got the
> plans specified. They consist of two heavy gauge interlocking sheet
> metal parts about 5 inches long that mount on the inside of the rail
> and on the post like these.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40444&cat=3,40842,41269&ap
=1
> The tabs bend pretty easily and allow movement of the rail in relation
> to the post. Anyone have experience with 'bed bolts'? Requires
> drilling into the rails and posts but seems they would be stronger than
> what I have now.
>
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40445&cat=3,40842,41269&ap
=1.
> My rails are 6 1/2 inches tall. Would one per rail end be sufficient
> or would two (one near each edge)be better? Any other suggestions for
> hardware to use? Thanks
>
This never made it out on the 18th, so here goes anyway.
On 17 Jan 2005 19:58:23 -0800, the inscrutable "Mike in Arkansas"
<[email protected]> spake:
><<<(8/4 rails, right?)>>>
>
>
>8/4 rails? WOW! I thought my 5/4 rails were substantial even if they
>are red oak.
Wuss! <g>
>I like the bed bolts idea as most have recommended.
>However, now that the head and foot boards are all assembled, drilling
>accurate holes is problematic. The surface mounts recommended by Jeff
>also present a problem locating the rails the correct distance apart to
>allow matress clearance without a lot of access space. Leaning toward
>the bed bolts but think I'll make my own since I have access to brass
>stock. Seem simple enough. Just need to ponder how to go about
>drilling accurate holes for a while.
Drill the holes in the rails and use dowel centers to mark the bed
posts. Screw a slat to the rails if you want a solid measuring device.
That's if you haven't followed a plan and don't know that the actual
center of the post should be on the mark. ;)
Do think about M&T for these rail-to-post joints. It would probably
keep the squeaking down to a minimum, too. Wax before assembly.
-
Yea, though I walk through the valley of Minwax, I shall stain no Cherry.
http://diversify.com
On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 21:55:27 -0800, Larry Jaques
<novalidaddress@di\/ersify.com> wrote:
>Do think about M&T for these rail-to-post joints. It would probably
>keep the squeaking down to a minimum, too. Wax before assembly.
I hadn't ever thought of waxing the M&T on a bed to minimize
squeaking. Thanks for a great tip.
Tim Douglass
http://www.DouglassClan.com
On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 15:47:26 GMT, "Mike in Mystic"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>I used the following type of fasteners:
>http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product_details.cfm?&offerings_id=10&objectgrou
>p_id=7&catid=6&filter=bed
>
>These aren't really difficult to install, and you don't see anything. I
>recessed the female portion just a TAD (I'm talking MAYBE 1/32") deeper than
>flush, which resulted in the two pieces going together very tightly. The
>bed doesn't move after 3 years now. Anyway, this is just another option.
I hate those with a passion. The one part has to fasten into
end-grain. They DO come loose, and the bed squeaks [keep it clean
boys and girls] after a time. The only solution then is to re-screw
it hlonger fatter [might have to drill out the metal] screws ...still
end-grain with ensuing problems.
I'd go for the bolts unless there's something better is suggested
...haven't read all the other replies yet.
"Guess who" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:40:28 -0800, "TeamCasa" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> Will you after few years? I found that screwing into the end-grain
> was eventually a problem.
I used an inner piece of wood with the grain running perpendicular to the
bed rail so that the bed rail side of the fastener was mounted with the
grain also.