Mission style coffee table - What would Gustav Stickley do??

<[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> I've used aniline dyes before and they tend to fade over time. It's
> probably not an issue unless the table has objects on it most of the
> time. If it does then the area where the objects are will stay darker
> over time. When you remove the objects you'll end up with an
> inconsistent color. (ex: humidor on top of the table)
>
> I'd really like to fume the table using industrial ammonia. I know
> it's nasty stuff but I'd like to give it a try.
>
It's not *that* nasty. I use 25% ammonia in my basement, with the windows
open. With gloves, a respirator, and safety glasses. The real nasty stuff
is anhydrous ammonia.

> Don't laugh but I'm thinking of using my pickup truck bed with canopy
> top as the fuming chamber once the table is done. Then I'll use
> linseed oil and probably a satin oil for the top for added protection.
>
> P.S. No, I don't plan to drive the truck while the fuming process is
> taking place!!
>
> Am I crazy or will this work?? Has anyone fumed white oak before?? Any
> tip or techniques?? I did read the Fine Woodworking article from isssue
> 126.

A simple bag made of 3 mil plastic and some duct tape will suffice.

On Nov 26, 1:06 pm, henny <[email protected]> wrote:
> I'm starting to design plans to build a mission style coffee table out
> of qtr sawn white oak with flake.

>
> I see two different styles:
>
> Square spindles:http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/NoFrame/items_direct/003266nf.html?s...
>
> Slat spindles:http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/noframe/items/008644nf.html
>

This is more 'true' Stickley:
http://tinyurl.com/y5gdod
The smaller, square spindles. But, they also do the slats. The older
the examples you find, the more you'll see square spindles. I think
they look better. BUT... that's just me.
What do YOU like?

Good luck with the finish. I'm sure somebody here will be able to help
you.
I don't do oak anymore, cuz I no longer have to. Stickley looks soooo
much better in cherry..oops..an opinion slipped out. sorry...

r

On Nov 26, 8:20 pm, "Lowell Holmes" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > snip
>
> > Good luck with the finish. I'm sure somebody here will be able to help
> > you.
> > I don't do oak anymore, cuz I no longer have to. Stickley looks soooo
> > much better in cherry..oops..an opinion slipped out. sorry...
>
> > rWith a little Greene and Greene thrown in.
>
> :-)

Speaking of which:
After these, follow the bouncing ball... and find your way around all
of the projects Greene & Greene ever built/designed.

http://tinyurl.com/y3xy9q
http://tinyurl.com/y4685g
http://tinyurl.com/szp2v
http://tinyurl.com/d6jcy

btw.. they all zoom in real close. Thousands of pictures here. Just do
the basic search and you'll find everything. A real database.

r

I've used aniline dyes before and they tend to fade over time. It's
probably not an issue unless the table has objects on it most of the
time. If it does then the area where the objects are will stay darker
over time. When you remove the objects you'll end up with an
inconsistent color. (ex: humidor on top of the table)

I'd really like to fume the table using industrial ammonia. I know
it's nasty stuff but I'd like to give it a try.

Don't laugh but I'm thinking of using my pickup truck bed with canopy
top as the fuming chamber once the table is done. Then I'll use
linseed oil and probably a satin oil for the top for added protection.

P.S. No, I don't plan to drive the truck while the fuming process is
taking place!!

Am I crazy or will this work?? Has anyone fumed white oak before?? Any
tip or techniques?? I did read the Fine Woodworking article from isssue
126.


Mark Howell wrote:
> I tell ya, I've been wrestling with qs white oak finishing for a good 3 years now.
> Tried just about everything, dyes, stains, glazes, topcoats, etc. For starters, I don't
> trust pictures for correct color because the lighting will affect it. Take a look at the
> kitchen I'm building for swmbo, I have pics here with 3 different sources of light,
> and the panel looks different in each one (panel1, panel2, dishwasher2):
> http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/skidmark316/kitchen/
>
> By the way, I have made a small qs oak coffe table a couple of years ago:
> http://mysite.verizon.net/vze6zvlk/id10.html
>
> Anyway, for your project, try this:
>
> dye with lee valley fumed light oak aniline dye
> seal with garnet shellac
> stain with 1/3 asphaltum, 1/3 boiled linseed oil, 1/3 mineral spirits
> seal with garnet shellac
> topcoat of whatever, but it must be flat! Any sheen on the topcoat
> makes the oak look too 3-D and "busy". Just look at my coffee table
> which has too much sheen. The flakes are too crazy.
>
> HTH
>
> "henny" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> > I'm starting to design plans to build a mission style coffee table out
> > of qtr sawn white oak with flake.
> >
> > I'd like to capture as many design elements from the classic mission
> > style era as possible. One of them is the characteristic spindles in
> > the ends.
> >
> > I see two different styles:
> >
> > Square spindles:
> > http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/NoFrame/items_direct/003266nf.html?source=otw-yahooshopping
> >
> > Slat spindles:
> > http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/noframe/items/008644nf.html
> >
> > Is one more representative of true Stickley design? Are there any
> > Stickly guidelines for slat width vs. spacing or just I just go with
> > whatever my preferance is?
> >
> > I'd also like to get that classical mission style color that contrasts
> > the "tiger" oak. Any suggestions on a stain (water, oil, or dye) that
> > works particularly well for creating a mission style finish. I
> > probably won't be able to fume it in ammonia.
> >
> > Here's a representative sample of the end finish I'd like to achive:
> >
> > http://www.hilestudio.com/prodpage/occtable/hs4472.html
> >
> > Any links pertaining to designing mission and building mission style
> > style furniture would be very helpful.
> >
> > TIA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

Here's a link to an article with tons of useful info on Mission
finishes...
http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/htdocs/mission_oak.htm

Thanks for all the replies.

I really like the thought of using household ammonia vs. trying to
track down the 25% stuff.

Can I assume that the 5% stuff will simply take 5X the time to fume.
If so that's no big deal. The Fine Woodworking article showing fuming
results for 0-36 hrs using the 25% stuff. I have no problem letting my
project fume for a week or more if it'll work.

TIA. This group is still one of the highlights of Usenet.



Stephen M wrote:
> > Don't laugh but I'm thinking of using my pickup truck bed with canopy
> > top as the fuming chamber once the table is done. Then I'll use
> > linseed oil and probably a satin oil for the top for added protection.
>
> that's kind of big, but it may work OK
>
> > P.S. No, I don't plan to drive the truck while the fuming process is
> > taking place!!
> >
> > Am I crazy or will this work?? Has anyone fumed white oak before?? Any
> > tip or techniques?? I did read the Fine Woodworking article from isssue
> > 126.
> >
>
> I have successfully fumed with hosehold ammonia... the article's assertion
> that you need the industrial stuff is simply wrong.
>
> I can only assume that the author was just repeating an accepted "fact".
>
> Is industrial faster/better/different? maybe, but household ammonia does
> does work.
>
> DAGS... we've touched on this topic here before.
>
> Steve

I use analine dye, Behlens Solar-lux. Mix "Golden Oak," "Hickory," and
"Van Dyke Brown" dyes until you get the color you want, keeping in mind that
you can darken it with multiple coats of dye (testing on cut-offs planed or
sanded same as actual pieces) and then apply with a rag, recoating until the
color is what I want. Finish with multiple coats of shellac (you can add
dye to the shellac to make the color slightly different). You can also
check out the mission-style ottoman David Marks did on diytv.com. He uses
powdered analine dye.
"henny" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I'm starting to design plans to build a mission style coffee table out
> of qtr sawn white oak with flake.
>
> I'd like to capture as many design elements from the classic mission
> style era as possible. One of them is the characteristic spindles in
> the ends.
>
> I see two different styles:
>
> Square spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/NoFrame/items_direct/003266nf.html?source=otw-yahooshopping
>
> Slat spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/noframe/items/008644nf.html
>
> Is one more representative of true Stickley design? Are there any
> Stickly guidelines for slat width vs. spacing or just I just go with
> whatever my preferance is?
>
> I'd also like to get that classical mission style color that contrasts
> the "tiger" oak. Any suggestions on a stain (water, oil, or dye) that
> works particularly well for creating a mission style finish. I
> probably won't be able to fume it in ammonia.
>
> Here's a representative sample of the end finish I'd like to achive:
>
> http://www.hilestudio.com/prodpage/occtable/hs4472.html
>
> Any links pertaining to designing mission and building mission style
> style furniture would be very helpful.
>
> TIA
>
>
>
>
>

"henny" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I'm starting to design plans to build a mission style coffee table out
> of qtr sawn white oak with flake.
>
> I'd like to capture as many design elements from the classic mission
> style era as possible. One of them is the characteristic spindles in
> the ends.
>
> I see two different styles:
>
> Square spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/NoFrame/items_direct/003266nf.html?source=otw-yahooshopping
>
> Slat spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/noframe/items/008644nf.html
>
> Is one more representative of true Stickley design? Are there any
> Stickly guidelines for slat width vs. spacing or just I just go with
> whatever my preferance is?
>
> I'd also like to get that classical mission style color that contrasts
> the "tiger" oak. Any suggestions on a stain (water, oil, or dye) that
> works particularly well for creating a mission style finish. I
> probably won't be able to fume it in ammonia.
>
> Here's a representative sample of the end finish I'd like to achive:
>
> http://www.hilestudio.com/prodpage/occtable/hs4472.html
>
> Any links pertaining to designing mission and building mission style
> style furniture would be very helpful.

How about looking at the real thing?
http://www.stickley.com/gallery/results.cfm?c=36&cat1=88&view=all

> Don't laugh but I'm thinking of using my pickup truck bed with canopy
> top as the fuming chamber once the table is done. Then I'll use
> linseed oil and probably a satin oil for the top for added protection.

that's kind of big, but it may work OK

> P.S. No, I don't plan to drive the truck while the fuming process is
> taking place!!
>
> Am I crazy or will this work?? Has anyone fumed white oak before?? Any
> tip or techniques?? I did read the Fine Woodworking article from isssue
> 126.
>

I have successfully fumed with hosehold ammonia... the article's assertion
that you need the industrial stuff is simply wrong.

I can only assume that the author was just repeating an accepted "fact".

Is industrial faster/better/different? maybe, but household ammonia does
does work.

DAGS... we've touched on this topic here before.

Steve

I did a staircase of treads and 59 spindles. I left the parts in the tent
for 2..maybe 3 days. The tent was barely bigger than the stock (2 batches)
... about a cubic yard.

My experience was that most of the color change appeared in the first 8
hours and then it tapered off from there. My casual experiments showed that
more time resulted in deeper penetration. Compared to stain the (color
change) penetration was impressive... about 1/8". That is, you would have to
try really hard to sand through the color.

One thing NOT to do: put the tent outside with an unpitched "roof".
Condensation formed on the top of the tend and dripped onto a few pieces. It
caused a bit of ugly staining.

Good luck with that

-Steve





<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thanks for all the replies.
>
> I really like the thought of using household ammonia vs. trying to
> track down the 25% stuff.
>
> Can I assume that the 5% stuff will simply take 5X the time to fume.
> If so that's no big deal. The Fine Woodworking article showing fuming
> results for 0-36 hrs using the 25% stuff. I have no problem letting my
> project fume for a week or more if it'll work.
>
> TIA. This group is still one of the highlights of Usenet.
>
>
>
> Stephen M wrote:
>> > Don't laugh but I'm thinking of using my pickup truck bed with canopy
>> > top as the fuming chamber once the table is done. Then I'll use
>> > linseed oil and probably a satin oil for the top for added protection.
>>
>> that's kind of big, but it may work OK
>>
>> > P.S. No, I don't plan to drive the truck while the fuming process is
>> > taking place!!
>> >
>> > Am I crazy or will this work?? Has anyone fumed white oak before?? Any
>> > tip or techniques?? I did read the Fine Woodworking article from isssue
>> > 126.
>> >
>>
>> I have successfully fumed with hosehold ammonia... the article's
>> assertion
>> that you need the industrial stuff is simply wrong.
>>
>> I can only assume that the author was just repeating an accepted "fact".
>>
>> Is industrial faster/better/different? maybe, but household ammonia does
>> does work.
>>
>> DAGS... we've touched on this topic here before.
>>
>> Steve
>

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> snip

>
> Good luck with the finish. I'm sure somebody here will be able to help
> you.
> I don't do oak anymore, cuz I no longer have to. Stickley looks soooo
> much better in cherry..oops..an opinion slipped out. sorry...
>
> r
>


With a little Greene and Greene thrown in.

:-)

I tell ya, I've been wrestling with qs white oak finishing for a good 3 years now.
Tried just about everything, dyes, stains, glazes, topcoats, etc. For starters, I don't
trust pictures for correct color because the lighting will affect it. Take a look at the
kitchen I'm building for swmbo, I have pics here with 3 different sources of light,
and the panel looks different in each one (panel1, panel2, dishwasher2):
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/skidmark316/kitchen/

By the way, I have made a small qs oak coffe table a couple of years ago:
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze6zvlk/id10.html

Anyway, for your project, try this:

dye with lee valley fumed light oak aniline dye
seal with garnet shellac
stain with 1/3 asphaltum, 1/3 boiled linseed oil, 1/3 mineral spirits
seal with garnet shellac
topcoat of whatever, but it must be flat! Any sheen on the topcoat
makes the oak look too 3-D and "busy". Just look at my coffee table
which has too much sheen. The flakes are too crazy.

HTH

"henny" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> I'm starting to design plans to build a mission style coffee table out
> of qtr sawn white oak with flake.
>
> I'd like to capture as many design elements from the classic mission
> style era as possible. One of them is the characteristic spindles in
> the ends.
>
> I see two different styles:
>
> Square spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/NoFrame/items_direct/003266nf.html?source=otw-yahooshopping
>
> Slat spindles:
> http://www.furnitureontheweb.com/noframe/items/008644nf.html
>
> Is one more representative of true Stickley design? Are there any
> Stickly guidelines for slat width vs. spacing or just I just go with
> whatever my preferance is?
>
> I'd also like to get that classical mission style color that contrasts
> the "tiger" oak. Any suggestions on a stain (water, oil, or dye) that
> works particularly well for creating a mission style finish. I
> probably won't be able to fume it in ammonia.
>
> Here's a representative sample of the end finish I'd like to achive:
>
> http://www.hilestudio.com/prodpage/occtable/hs4472.html
>
> Any links pertaining to designing mission and building mission style
> style furniture would be very helpful.
>
> TIA
>
>
>
>
>