I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
any sagging shelves.
The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
ole books. ;!)
I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
extremely rigid.
Comments welcome!
Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
"detailed pictures"
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
Click older at the top for the series.
On 6/29/2012 1:33 PM, Leon wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
> extremely rigid.
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
Gorgeous as usual, Bubba! And time to celebrate with an:
https://picasaweb.google.com/111355467778981859077/EWoodShopJustStuff#5685385450154360146
--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 12:40:05 -0700, Doug Winterburn
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On 06/29/2012 12:16 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>>> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>>>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>>>> any sagging shelves.
>>>>
>>>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>>>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>>>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>>>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>>>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>>>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>>>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>>>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>>>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>>>> ole books. ;!)
>>>>
>>>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>>>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>>>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>>>> extremely rigid.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Comments welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>>>> "detailed pictures"
>>>>
>>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Click older at the top for the series.
>>>
>>> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
>>> loaded that will be lost.
>>> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
>>> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>>>
>>
>> Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)
>
>Pronounced Ick-e-a
"Icky, eh?"
--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln
In article <[email protected]>, Leon
<lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
Beautiful! You even make red oak look great!
On 06/29/2012 12:16 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>>> any sagging shelves.
>>>
>>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>>> ole books. ;!)
>>>
>>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>>> extremely rigid.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Comments welcome!
>>>
>>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>>> "detailed pictures"
>>>
>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>>
>>>
>>> Click older at the top for the series.
>>
>> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
>> loaded that will be lost.
>> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
>> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>>
>
> Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)
Pronounced Ick-e-a
--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill
"Leon" <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have any
> sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope I
> measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments. There
> are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each for the
> front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6 adjustable
> feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each foot is good
> for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least 1800#'s. Over
> all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain patter for the back
> panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>
First off, very nice looking bookshelves. Those books will have a first
class home! Mary will be proud to show off her books and the bookcases.
Some comments, questions, etc.
With the adjustable feet, each cabinet can support 1800 lbs. Are you sure
this is enough? I think each cabinet should support at least 3,000 lbs.
LOL I just had to kid you a little on that one.
Are the shelves doubled? What are the shelves made of?
Also, are the shelves notched in the back?
That extra set of adjustable center supports, front and back, on the end
cabinets is totally slick. I have seen it done on the back, but not on the
front as well. That will definitely increase the working load on each shelf
and prevent sagging. Good idea, good design, good execution.. I am sure
that some folks will think it is overbuilt, but I have always been accused
of overbuilding things. Those extra supports not only support the shelves,
but increase the strength and rigidity of the cabinets as well. It not only
looks good, it works good. Beauty AND function. It doesn't get any better
than that.
I remember some book shelves I built for my sister. The comment she made
(and everyone else who knew her made as well) was that the book cases were
"really solid". Implying anything else she ever had wasn't. Those things
are just as solid now as the day I built them, over 20 years ago. Quality
furniture is not rickety and fragile. It is durable, strong and looks good.
You obviously build quality furniture.
One other comment. I saw those pictures on top of your table saw. How do
you cut any wood with those pictures on the top of your saw? Has your wife
been decorating your shop? <g,d&r>
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I
> hope I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for
> adjustments. There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each
> side and 1 each for the front and back center stiles. Each end
> cabinet is setting on 6 adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms
> of the cabinets and each foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet
> should be good for at least 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was
> lucky to get a great grain patter for the back panels, too bad they
> will be hidden behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and
> back face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13
> cabinets that I have built this way since October last year. These
> things are extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
> "detailed pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbo
> x/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
Beautiful grain on the back of those cases. Since most books are
shorter than the shelf distance, you'll still be able to see some of it
after the case is loaded up.
The center shelf pins make perfect sense. Good idea. I'll probably
copy it if I do adjustable shelves.
Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.
Leon, a couple more questions.
When you do your double face frame construction, are all the face frames
held together with just glue? And when you attach the face frames to the
body, do you just glue them as well? Are there any mechanical fasteners
involved? Dominos?
How did you drill the holes for the shelf hangers? A commercial jig, or?
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 13:33:19 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
wrote:
>I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>any sagging shelves.
>
>The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>ole books. ;!)
>
>I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>extremely rigid.
>
>
>
>Comments welcome!
>
>Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>"detailed pictures"
>
>http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
>Click older at the top for the series.
Beautiful bookcase. Too bad those backpanels aren't door panels. A
shame to hide them behind books.
Mike M
> Beautiful grain on the back of those cases. Since most books are
> shorter than the shelf distance, you'll still be able to see some of it
> after the case is loaded up.
>
> The center shelf pins make perfect sense. Good idea. I'll probably
> copy it if I do adjustable shelves.
>
> Puckdropper
Thank you!
I have seven adjustable shelves plus the bottom shelf on each outer
cabinet and the customers current saggy book cases are pretty much
adjusted so that there are no gaps. ;~( Either way show or no show it
looks goo now. LOL
Yeah the center supports work very well although they totally totally
eleminat the need to go to the "sagulator site" to determine how much
your shelves are going to sag. ;~)
On Friday, June 29, 2012 2:33:19 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
> ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
> extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
> "detailed pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
very nice! i hadn't seen the "front and back face frame" technique before.
On 6/29/2012 2:44 PM, Han wrote:
> Leon<lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I
>> hope I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for
>> adjustments. There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each
>> side and 1 each for the front and back center stiles. Each end
>> cabinet is setting on 6 adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms
>> of the cabinets and each foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet
>> should be good for at least 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was
>> lucky to get a great grain patter for the back panels, too bad they
>> will be hidden behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and
>> back face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13
>> cabinets that I have built this way since October last year. These
>> things are extremely rigid.
>>
>>
>>
>> Comments welcome!
>>
>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>> "detailed pictures"
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbo
>> x/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
> Gorgeous, Leon!
>
Thank you Han!
On 6/29/2012 2:19 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Friday, June 29, 2012 2:33:19 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>> ole books. ;!)
>>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>>
>>
>>
>> Comments welcome!
>>
>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>> "detailed pictures"
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
> very nice! i hadn't seen the "front and back face frame" technique before.
Thank you!
I first use it here on this link about 6~9 months ago
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/6485169533/in/set-72157622991960362
And again here about 3 months ago.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7096659383/in/set-72157622991960362/
On 6/29/2012 4:22 PM, Mike M wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 13:33:19 -0500, Leon<lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
> wrote:
>
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>> ole books. ;!)
>>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>>
>>
>>
>> Comments welcome!
>>
>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>> "detailed pictures"
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
> Beautiful bookcase.
Thank you!
Too bad those backpanels aren't door panels. A
> shame to hide them behind books.
>
That was what I was thinking. LOL
> Mike M
>
On 6/29/2012 4:12 PM, Swingman wrote:
> On 6/29/2012 1:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
> Gorgeous as usual, Bubba! And time to celebrate with an:
>
> https://picasaweb.google.com/111355467778981859077/EWoodShopJustStuff#5685385450154360146
>
>
Thank you! and I agree with the celebration. Ummmmmmmm.
On 6/29/2012 4:02 PM, tiredofspam wrote:
> I like the way you trapped the middle case in on top. Nice.
Thank you , I used a similar method on our pantry with the center stack
of 22 drawers.
>
> What is going in the middle of the the cases below that middle case?
>
Mu customer has a 48" wide red oak students desk.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/6485171225/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> On 6/29/2012 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>> ole books. ;!)
>>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>>
>>
>>
>> Comments welcome!
>>
>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>> "detailed pictures"
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I
> hope I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for
> adjustments. There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each
> side and 1 each for the front and back center stiles. Each end
> cabinet is setting on 6 adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms
> of the cabinets and each foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet
> should be good for at least 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was
> lucky to get a great grain patter for the back panels, too bad they
> will be hidden behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and
> back face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13
> cabinets that I have built this way since October last year. These
> things are extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
> "detailed pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbo
> x/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
Gorgeous, Leon!
--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid
I like the way you trapped the middle case in on top. Nice.
What is going in the middle of the the cases below that middle case?
On 6/29/2012 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
> ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
> extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
> "detailed pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 16:12:44 -0500, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
>On 6/29/2012 1:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
>Gorgeous as usual, Bubba! And time to celebrate with an:
>
>https://picasaweb.google.com/111355467778981859077/EWoodShopJustStuff#5685385450154360146
Looks yummy, Swingy!
--
If you're trying to take a roomful of people by
surprise, it's a lot easier to hit your targets
if you don't yell going through the door.
-- Lois McMaster Bujold
On 6/29/2012 8:58 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 16:40:26 -0500, Leon<lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>> Beautiful grain on the back of those cases. Since most books are
>>> shorter than the shelf distance, you'll still be able to see some of it
>>> after the case is loaded up.
>>>
>>> The center shelf pins make perfect sense. Good idea. I'll probably
>>> copy it if I do adjustable shelves.
>>>
>>> Puckdropper
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> I have seven adjustable shelves plus the bottom shelf on each outer
>
> _Nice_ amount of book shelving, dude.
>
>
>> cabinet and the customers current saggy book cases are pretty much
>> adjusted so that there are no gaps. ;~( Either way show or no show it
>> looks goo now. LOL
>>
>> Yeah the center supports work very well although they totally totally
>> eleminat the need to go to the "sagulator site" to determine how much
>> your shelves are going to sag. ;~)
>
> Yeah, I prefer the wider shelving (with pretty good access behind the
> center post) over dual narrow shelves. I think I'll use the L shaped,
> pinned shelf supports next time, too. They're much easier to work with
> than the flatted pins.
>
And the L shaped pins can not come out unless you remove the shelf first.
On 6/29/2012 7:21 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/29/2012 2:52 PM, Bill wrote:
>>> Z3Driver wrote:
>>>> Only one word: gorgeous.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, non-simply beautiful.
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>
>>
>> Thank you Bill!
>>
>> And may I remind you that I used Old Masters Gel varnish? ;~)
>
> I haven't followed the whole thread so I'm unaware of any inside jokes....
> so are you saying this *is* in fact the Old Masters stuff.
>
> This is the stuff you say dries pretty fact?
>
>
Yes that is the stuff. Actually most all of the gel varnishes dry
pretty quickly but the Old Masters is head and shoulders above General
Finishes Gel Varnish.
On 6/29/2012 10:14 PM, Steve Turner wrote:
>
>
> Looks very nice Leon!
Thank you
>
> It seems like a lot of the work you do is in Oak; is that a personal
> choice or is that reflective of what your customers ask for?
>
Lots of oak, and mostly because it the least expensive of the hard, hard
woods in this area.
On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
> any sagging shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
> ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
> extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
> "detailed pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
loaded that will be lost.
My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
--
Froz...
The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>>> any sagging shelves.
>>>
>>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>>> ole books. ;!)
>>>
>>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>>> extremely rigid.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Comments welcome!
>>>
>>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>>> "detailed pictures"
>>>
>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>>
>>>
>>> Click older at the top for the series.
>>
>> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
>> loaded that will be lost.
>> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
>> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>>
>
> Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)
No Ikea stores in Texas? Cheap Swedish knock down build it yourself
stuff, but it is in the basement.
--
Froz...
The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
On 6/29/12 3:41 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/29/2012 2:32 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>> On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
>>> On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>>>> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>>>>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>>>>> any sagging shelves.
>>>>>
>>>>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>>>>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>>>>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>>>>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1
>>>>> each
>>>>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>>>>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and
>>>>> each
>>>>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at
>>>>> least
>>>>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>>>>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a
>>>>> bunch'a
>>>>> ole books. ;!)
>>>>>
>>>>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and
>>>>> back
>>>>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13
>>>>> cabinets
>>>>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>>>>> extremely rigid.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Comments welcome!
>>>>>
>>>>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>>>>> "detailed pictures"
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Click older at the top for the series.
>>>>
>>>> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
>>>> loaded that will be lost.
>>>> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
>>>> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)
>>
>> No Ikea stores in Texas? Cheap Swedish knock down build it yourself
>> stuff, but it is in the basement.
>>
>
> Yeah we have one, I visited once about 10 years ago and again recently
> only because I forgot that you have to go through a maze to get out.
My wife likes their candles and some of the other stuff sold near the
exits, we we break in through an open check-out line and go for what she
wants instead of taking the scenic tour. :-)
--
Froz...
The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 6/29/2012 2:52 PM, Bill wrote:
>> Z3Driver wrote:
>>> Only one word: gorgeous.
>>>
>>
>> Yes, non-simply beautiful.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>
> Thank you Bill!
>
> And may I remind you that I used Old Masters Gel varnish? ;~)
I haven't followed the whole thread so I'm unaware of any inside jokes....
so are you saying this *is* in fact the Old Masters stuff.
This is the stuff you say dries pretty fact?
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
-MIKE- wrote:
> On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/29/2012 2:52 PM, Bill wrote:
>>> Z3Driver wrote:
>>>> Only one word: gorgeous.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, non-simply beautiful.
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>
>>
>> Thank you Bill!
>>
>> And may I remind you that I used Old Masters Gel varnish? ;~)
>
> I haven't followed the whole thread so I'm unaware of any inside jokes....
> so are you saying this *is* in fact the Old Masters stuff.
>
> This is the stuff you say dries pretty fast?
I'm 99% sure that the answer to that is yes.
Bill
>
>
On 6/29/2012 1:33 PM, Leon wrote:
> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted simple
> red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have any sagging
> shelves.
>
> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The cases are
> 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope I measured
> correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments. There are 6 shelf
> hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each for the front and back
> center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6 adjustable feet , adjusted
> through the bottoms of the cabinets and each foot is good for 300#'s each so
> each cabinet should be good for at least 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I
> was lucky to get a great grain patter for the back panels, too bad they will be
> hidden behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>
> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back face
> frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets that I have
> built this way since October last year. These things are extremely rigid.
>
>
>
> Comments welcome!
>
> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of "detailed
> pictures"
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>
> Click older at the top for the series.
Looks very nice Leon!
It seems like a lot of the work you do is in Oak; is that a personal choice or
is that reflective of what your customers ask for?
--
Any given amount of traffic flow, no matter how
sparse, will expand to fill all available lanes.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:
>
> Yes that is the stuff. Actually most all of the gel varnishes dry
> pretty quickly but the Old Masters is head and shoulders above General
> Finishes Gel Varnish.
>
Hey Leon -
I use General Finishes "Gel Topcoat"
(http://www.generalfinishes.com/retail-products/oil-base-top-coats)
and am happy with the results. Is the GF Gel Varnish you refer to above
in fact the Gel Topcoat, or a different product?
Besides drying speed, any other reason you prefer the Old Masters
product?
Thanks.
On 6/29/2012 4:24 PM, Dave Balderstone wrote:
> In article<[email protected]>, Leon
> <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:
>
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>
> Beautiful! You even make red oak look great!
Thank you Dave!
Funny you should mention the red oak looking good. I built with that
stuff for 30 years and only recently started using white oak because of
IMHO nicer color and what seems to me a bit sturdier wood/less
splintery. It has been 18 months since I have really built anything
with red oak and looking at theses book cases I have to agree that this
red oak seems to have a very nice color. Maybe it is the Old Masters
gel varnish. ;~)
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 15:43:37 -0400, "Lee Michaels"
<leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast dot net> wrote:
>One other comment. I saw those pictures on top of your table saw. How do
>you cut any wood with those pictures on the top of your saw? Has your wife
>been decorating your shop? <g,d&r>
Those are oddly shaped, very colorful pushsticks, huh?
--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 16:40:26 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
wrote:
>
>> Beautiful grain on the back of those cases. Since most books are
>> shorter than the shelf distance, you'll still be able to see some of it
>> after the case is loaded up.
>>
>> The center shelf pins make perfect sense. Good idea. I'll probably
>> copy it if I do adjustable shelves.
>>
>> Puckdropper
>
>Thank you!
>
>I have seven adjustable shelves plus the bottom shelf on each outer
_Nice_ amount of book shelving, dude.
>cabinet and the customers current saggy book cases are pretty much
>adjusted so that there are no gaps. ;~( Either way show or no show it
>looks goo now. LOL
>
>Yeah the center supports work very well although they totally totally
>eleminat the need to go to the "sagulator site" to determine how much
>your shelves are going to sag. ;~)
Yeah, I prefer the wider shelving (with pretty good access behind the
center post) over dual narrow shelves. I think I'll use the L shaped,
pinned shelf supports next time, too. They're much easier to work with
than the flatted pins.
--
If you're trying to take a roomful of people by
surprise, it's a lot easier to hit your targets
if you don't yell going through the door.
-- Lois McMaster Bujold
On 6/29/2012 2:32 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
> On 6/29/12 3:16 PM, Leon wrote:
>> On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
>>> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>>>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>>>> any sagging shelves.
>>>>
>>>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>>>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>>>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>>>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1
>>>> each
>>>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>>>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>>>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at
>>>> least
>>>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>>>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a
>>>> bunch'a
>>>> ole books. ;!)
>>>>
>>>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>>>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>>>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>>>> extremely rigid.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Comments welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>>>> "detailed pictures"
>>>>
>>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Click older at the top for the series.
>>>
>>> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
>>> loaded that will be lost.
>>> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
>>> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>>>
>>
>> Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)
>
> No Ikea stores in Texas? Cheap Swedish knock down build it yourself
> stuff, but it is in the basement.
>
Yeah we have one, I visited once about 10 years ago and again recently
only because I forgot that you have to go through a maze to get out.
On 7/2/2012 4:17 PM, J. Random Lurker wrote:
> Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:
>>
>> Yes that is the stuff. Actually most all of the gel varnishes dry
>> pretty quickly but the Old Masters is head and shoulders above General
>> Finishes Gel Varnish.
>>
>
> Hey Leon -
>
> I use General Finishes "Gel Topcoat"
> (http://www.generalfinishes.com/retail-products/oil-base-top-coats)
> and am happy with the results. Is the GF Gel Varnish you refer to above
> in fact the Gel Topcoat, or a different product?
>
> Besides drying speed, any other reason you prefer the Old Masters
> product?
>
>
> Thanks.
>
If you like the General Finishes Gel Varnish you wold most likely "love"
any other brand.
I have used Barteys, Lawrence McFadden, General Finishes, Old Masters,
and Verithane gel varnishes.
I absolutely hated General Finishes "Gel" varnish and I tried it a
couple of times. I do like and have been using their other products for
a very long time.
What I don't like about the GF Gel is that it has a
consistency/thickness of apple sauce, not really a gel.
All of the other brands that I have used are more like pudding and or
Vaseline and I feel they go on more consistently and cover better. They
will not run or drip like theGF Gel that I have used.
On 6/29/2012 2:43 PM, Lee Michaels wrote:
>
>
> "Leon" <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1
>> each for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting
>> on 6 adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets
>> and each foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good
>> for at least 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a
>> great grain patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden
>> behind a bunch'a ole books. ;!)
>>
>
> First off, very nice looking bookshelves. Those books will have a first
> class home! Mary will be proud to show off her books and the bookcases.
>
> Some comments, questions, etc.
>
> With the adjustable feet, each cabinet can support 1800 lbs. Are you
> sure this is enough? I think each cabinet should support at least 3,000
> lbs. LOL I just had to kid you a little on that one.
I think that will be enough, maybe. I try to build for the person that
might inherit the furniture and use it to maybe store their gold bars or
lead fishing weights. LOL
> Are the shelves doubled? What are the shelves made of?
Single thickness, 3/4" red oak veneer plywood with a 3/4" x 3/4" piece
of solid red oak on the front edges. That piece is attached to the
plywood shelves with a spline joint.
>
> Also, are the shelves notched in the back?
No.
>
> That extra set of adjustable center supports, front and back, on the end
> cabinets is totally slick. I have seen it done on the back, but not on
> the front as well.
The center hanging section is done that way too. It is little more
effort to put the supports in the front center stile also. Kind of a no
brainer. This really reduces the need to add extra support to the
shelves them selves to prevent sag. I did this on my previous 3 book
cases and the pantry that I built for our new home.
That will definitely increase the working load on
> each shelf and prevent sagging.
Exactly!
Good idea, good design, good execution..
Thank you! Thank you Sketchup! That program has really helped me
design better furniture.
> I am sure that some folks will think it is overbuilt, but I have always
> been accused of overbuilding things. Those extra supports not only
> support the shelves, but increase the strength and rigidity of the
> cabinets as well. It not only looks good, it works good. Beauty AND
> function. It doesn't get any better than that.
I try to overbuild, I don't want a problem at a later date. I am sure
the center stiles add something but the front and back face frames that
have dados to accept the bottom, top, and sides of the cases really adds
rigidity. FWIW I moved the cases with out the shelves and backs by
picking them up by the center front stile.
During the dry fits of the prior 10 cases that I built this way I had
the unit laying on its back glued up face frame and the top, bottom, and
sides fitted into the back face frame dados and the top glued up face
frame fitted on top of all of that. I could lift one corner and the
case would pivot from the opposite back corner. No sag any where.
>
> I remember some book shelves I built for my sister. The comment she made
> (and everyone else who knew her made as well) was that the book cases
> were "really solid". Implying anything else she ever had wasn't. Those
> things are just as solid now as the day I built them, over 20 years ago.
> Quality furniture is not rickety and fragile. It is durable, strong and
> looks good. You obviously build quality furniture.
I often say that quality built furniture always looks good and never
goes out of style. I am sure you and your sister would agree about the
piece you built for her.
Basically well built continues to look well built. Cheaply built
looks less than desirable after a few years.
>
> One other comment. I saw those pictures on top of your table saw. How do
> you cut any wood with those pictures on the top of your saw? Has your
> wife been decorating your shop? <g,d&r>
It is hard keeping the dust out. ;~) My grand mother painted thos, and
about 10 others that I have had, in the mid 60's. I finally inherited
the rest that you saw. I have reframed all of her paintings with like
frames and they all hang in our den.
Thanks again for the kind comments!
On 6/29/2012 4:43 PM, Lee Michaels wrote:
>
>
> Leon, a couple more questions.
>
> When you do your double face frame construction, are all the face frames
> held together with just glue? And when you attach the face frames to the
> body, do you just glue them as well? Are there any mechanical fasteners
> involved? Dominos?
The front face frames are held together with floating tenon Dominos and
glue, all butt in appearance joints so to speak.
The back face frames use lap joints 1/3 x 2/3 to form a 1/4" deep rabbet
all the way around the opening to receive the back panels. and then all
of those joints are reinforced with floating Domino tenons. This
provides a very clean looking back side and allows me to screw in the
back panels.
3 pictures are worth a thousand words.
The back face frame joint,
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7088837069/in/photostream
That joint separated
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7088836699/in/photostream/
The detail of that joint with the Domino showing.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7088836297/in/photostream/
>
> How did you drill the holes for the shelf hangers? A commercial jig, or?
For 15+ years I have been using the Rockler shelf pin jig and it has
seen tens of thousands of holes. But it is getting long in the tooth
and showing signs that it could fail, the plastic is cracking around the
guide holes. So I replaced it with this one, smaller than the Rockler
but it gets into tighter spots. I have had this jig about 4 months and
have drilled about 1,300 holes with it so far.
http://www.kregtool.com/Shelf-Pin-Jig-Prodview.html
On 6/29/2012 2:07 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
> On 6/29/12 2:33 PM, Leon wrote:
>> I started this project near the end of last month. My customer wanted
>> simple red oak book cases that would hold loads of books and hot have
>> any sagging shelves.
>>
>> The finish is Old Masters Gel Varnish, my new varnish of choice. The
>> cases are 120" wide and have to fit a wall that is 10'-2" wide. I hope
>> I measured correctly! Lots of shelves with 690 holes for adjustments.
>> There are 6 shelf hanger hooks for each shelf, 2 on each side and 1 each
>> for the front and back center stiles. Each end cabinet is setting on 6
>> adjustable feet , adjusted through the bottoms of the cabinets and each
>> foot is good for 300#'s each so each cabinet should be good for at least
>> 1800#'s. Over all height is 80". I was lucky to get a great grain
>> patter for the back panels, too bad they will be hidden behind a bunch'a
>> ole books. ;!)
>>
>> I again used my preferred method of choice construction, front and back
>> face frames with 12 dado joints on each cabinet. This makes 13 cabinets
>> that I have built this way since October last year. These things are
>> extremely rigid.
>>
>>
>>
>> Comments welcome!
>>
>> Nailshooter! you would be proud, follow the link to a series of
>> "detailed pictures"
>>
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/7467999852/in/photostream/lightbox/
>>
>> Click older at the top for the series.
>
> Those are beautiful, love the grain on the backs, but yeah, once it is
> loaded that will be lost.
> My wife has a butt load of books and wanted some shelving in the
> basement for them, I went to Ikea. :-)
>
Thank you! Ikea huh? ;~)