If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
Thanks,
Dan
In article <[email protected]>, Leon
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Technically you should use a jointer to straighten and or flatten a rough
> cut board, be it an electric one or human powered one. That said, I got
> real close with reasonable straight rough cut lumber using my TS to
> straighten and a thickness planer.
Depending on the length of the rough stock and the size of your saur...
I posted a link to jointing jig for my crap saw (good for up to about
30" length) a while back but the pix are off the site and damned if I
can find them now. Essentially, it's a sled with some hold-down clamps
to secure the board.
Hi Dan,
Next to my TS & MS, I think my 6 inch Delta jointer is one of the best
woodworking investments I have ever made. If you ever want to shave off
a 32nd or 64th, there is nothing to compare - especially for those of
us who have not developed our neander skills yet.
Lou
In article <[email protected]>, Daniel Grieves
<[email protected]> wrote:
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
> rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
> about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
> guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
> joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
>
[email protected] wrote:
> On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 14:17:18 -0800, "Daniel Grieves"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
>>rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
>>about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
>>guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
>>joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Dan
>>
>
>
>
> hand planing is slow but sure.
>
> and takes up very little room.
But it DOES take practice. You up to practicing on your scraps? Planing
surface flat and jointing edges for glue up can be frustrating at first.
But you can derive satisfaction from using hand tools. Me - I prefer
power tools for speed, hand tools as a supplement.
Philski
I am in the same situation, and here's what I do:
I use a 13" delta planer, and a PC router in a table with a 2 1/2"
freud straight bit. I take the rough stock and run it through the
planer on both sides until parallelism is obtained. Then I take the
best edge I have on the board and joint that using the router setup
mentioned above. (See Pat Warners site on doing the edge jointing if
you aren't sure). I then take the opposite edge and rip that along a
fence on either the table or bandsaw.
Works great with one rare exception. If I have a stick that is warped
along it's length and it's pretty long, then all the planer will do is
replicate the warp, where a jointer would flatten it. I've had it
happen once, but it really didn't matter if the board was slightly
warped since the rest of the structure would flatten it once it was
screwed in anyway. I don't feed my family doing this, and it beats
spending a ton of money and space on a 12" jointer to match my planer
width
Someone else mentioned using a table saw and sled to get one straight edge and
it works well. I recently did the same thing with some rough boards. Just
screw your rough lumber down to a straight board (at the very ends so the holes
can be cut off) so the straight board will run against the saw fence. The
rough board edge should overhang the straight board on the blade side. Run it
through and you have one straight edge. My boards were a little cupped but by
putting the concave side down so it goes through the planer on the outside
edges, it's possible to get a flat surface on the convex side. Then its just a
simple matter of flipping the board. Might not be perfect but works pretty
well. Twisted or warped is another matter.
On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 14:17:18 -0800, "Daniel Grieves"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
>rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
>about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
>guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
>joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
>Thanks,
>Dan
>
hand planing is slow but sure.
and takes up very little room.
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 23:34:25 GMT, "toller" <[email protected]> wrote:
I always thought I'm the only one doing what you did, that's why I'm selling my
1 yr old 8" YC jointer. I could plane red oak and hard maple both sides almost
parallel with my 15" planer and finally finished it with my TS on both edges.
>It depends on how rough your wood is, and how flat the wood has to be. I
>use mainly S2S, but even the occasional rough stock I buy (mainly at
>auctions) is flat enough to go to the planer without being face planed.
>Likewise, it can be a little wasteful, but you can get an edge good enough
>for glue with a little care an on good table saw.
>I had neither the space or the budget for a real jointer, so I bought a
>tabletop. It was a useless POS. Eventhough I really don't have the room
>for it, I recently bought a used jointer. It was a worthwhile investment,
>though not strictly necessary.
>
On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 07:36:28 -0500, "George" <george@least> wrote:
>Question. If he's got no room or money for a jointer, how's he going to
>swing the boards or afford a surface planer? Not to mention the room to
>hang the jigs and sleds out of the way.
>
>For that matter, where's he going to find the room for the
>bench/vise/hold-downs and the three planes required to work rough lumber?
>
>Why screw around trying to make do when you can get, for instance, the open
>stand 6" JET for $350, and make a low stand that allows it to be rolled
>under the wings of your tablesaw out of the way when you need room for a
>planer?
=============================
My thoughts exactly.... !
My small 24x24 detached shop building offered plenty of room 40 years
ago when I started in the hobby.... more then I ever thought I would
need (sound familiar ?)
Today I have a hard time finding a place to sit my coffee cup down.
But putting tools on rollers and "storing" them under TS wings and
under workbenches or under the lathe stand is sometimes REQUIRED...
Bob Griffiths
[email protected] wrote:
> hand planing is slow but sure.
>
> and takes up very little room.
Hah. My workbench takes up at least as much room as the average high end
big iron home power jointer, though maybe less than some really big
industrial jobs.
Planes are small, but they lead quickly to workbenches, vises, more planes,
dogs, sharpening supplies, more planes, hold-downs, more planes, and then
you add some more planes. A power jointer is probably cheaper in the long
run. :)
(Actually, in my case, I finally wound up buying a little baby jointer to do
some of the grunt work. A hard day of wielding my planes leaves my wrists
hurting something awful, so splitting the work between a machine and planes
to put a pretty surface on afterwards really seems to be a best of both
worlds proposition. I can get by with a cheaper, crappier, more
poorly-adjusted jointer, and I get the same kind of final results I was
getting doing everything by hand.)
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/
patriarch wrote:
> month. I've been setting up a 'remote shop' at my father's place, with
> some of the things I need to 'do a few things' up there. And he's got
> some of my timber in his basement space.
I have some of my least used machinery in the den, which amuses my wife to
no end.
> Is there a 12 step program?
1. Clear a site
2. Think up a plan
3. Purchase materials
4. Pour a foundation
5. Erect a structure
6. Roof it
7. Insulate it
8. HVAC it
9. Wire it
10. Drywall it
11. Fill it up with machinery
12. Repeat when full
When you run out of room, try getting a survey of your property, and bribe
the surveyor to whoopsie and err on the side of drawing the line so you can
put your new shop where your neighbor's silly rose garden used to be.
Run lots of big noisy iron out there, and when the neighbor gets furious
with the whole situation and moves out, let your grass grow 12' tall and
park a bunch of rusted out Camaros and Trans Ams in your front yard on
blocks. Walk around in your underwear and scratch your ass and fart a lot
whenever the house next door is being shown. Eventually the Realtor will
just give you the thing to get rid of it. Then you can rip out the walls
and build more shop inside.
Repeat until you have acquired the entire neighborhood in this fashion.
Eventually you will have one of everything, and plenty of room to put it
all. It gets expensive bribing all those surveyors and local government
officials though.
Oh, and don't forget to cut your grass and get rid of the cars when
finished.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/
> Daniel Grieves wrote
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
> square face joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
That's a viable alternative, DAGS on shooting board.
Dave in Fairfax
--
Dave Leader
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.Patinatools.org/
Question. If he's got no room or money for a jointer, how's he going to
swing the boards or afford a surface planer? Not to mention the room to
hang the jigs and sleds out of the way.
For that matter, where's he going to find the room for the
bench/vise/hold-downs and the three planes required to work rough lumber?
Why screw around trying to make do when you can get, for instance, the open
stand 6" JET for $350, and make a low stand that allows it to be rolled
under the wings of your tablesaw out of the way when you need room for a
planer?
"JMWEBER987" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Someone else mentioned using a table saw and sled to get one straight edge
and
> it works well. I recently did the same thing with some rough boards.
Just
> screw your rough lumber down to a straight board (at the very ends so the
holes
> can be cut off) so the straight board will run against the saw fence. The
> rough board edge should overhang the straight board on the blade side.
Run it
> through and you have one straight edge. My boards were a little cupped but
by
> putting the concave side down so it goes through the planer on the outside
> edges, it's possible to get a flat surface on the convex side. Then its
just a
> simple matter of flipping the board. Might not be perfect but works
pretty
> well. Twisted or warped is another matter.
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
> rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
> about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
> guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
> joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
Dan, if what your looking for is a way to straighten an edge on rough
stock, use your table saw with a straight edge.Leave stock 1/8"
oversize, then take this amount off with next pass. This will give you
an acceptable edge.
I won't go into numerous other ways. hand planing,router etc.I suggest
if you do not already have a jointer plane or at least a jack plane,
look for either a used one or buy new.Your portable plane should be
able to plane square if the fence is 90 degrees to the table. The
table is too short to use to straighten an edge.Look for a handplane
at least 18" long with a decent iron.
mike
It depends on how rough your wood is, and how flat the wood has to be. I
use mainly S2S, but even the occasional rough stock I buy (mainly at
auctions) is flat enough to go to the planer without being face planed.
Likewise, it can be a little wasteful, but you can get an edge good enough
for glue with a little care an on good table saw.
I had neither the space or the budget for a real jointer, so I bought a
tabletop. It was a useless POS. Eventhough I really don't have the room
for it, I recently bought a used jointer. It was a worthwhile investment,
though not strictly necessary.
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
> square face joint?
You are right about the planer not making wood square. OTOH, depending on
where you get your wood, you can get by without a jointer. I have so far,
but it is on my list of "needs".
The places I buy my wood will at a minimum give me an edge and a flat bottom
so I can finish it omn my planter and table saw. Some will joint and plane
to whatever thickness I specify. It is included in the price.
If you are using air dried wood from Grampa's barn, buy the jointer.
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
> square face joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
I don't know where you live but about 30 minutes from my house is a lumber
yard with a great milling operation. It is a not as convenient as having my
own jointer but I try to plan my projects so I can bring all my wood there
to have it jointed and cut to size at one time. Costs me $18 for up to 40
minutes of work. This is another option to consider depending on where you
live.
Dick Snyder
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
using
> rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
articles
> about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
> guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
> joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
I own a table saw, planer, and good jointer (powermatic 54a). I also own a
Stanley No 8 Jointer plane. If I had to save space, the jointer would be
the first to go. If I had to save money, we would have to discuss it.
Be sure you understand the true cost of doing work by hand. A hand plane is
no good without a respectable work surface to hold your wood and plane it
effectively. A decent used long hand plane is going to cost you $80-$100
(ebay). It will cost another $25-$40 to get set up to sharpen it properly.
A cheap workbench will cost $200. Perhaps you've got the last two covered
already.
A long heavy hand plane is a pretty amazing tool and satisfying to use. It
figures out what's flat without being told. You just aim it.
Bob Davis
Houston, Texas
Bob G. <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 07:36:28 -0500, "George" <george@least> wrote:
>
>>Question. If he's got no room or money for a jointer, how's he going
>>to swing the boards or afford a surface planer? Not to mention the
>>room to hang the jigs and sleds out of the way.
>>
>>For that matter, where's he going to find the room for the
>>bench/vise/hold-downs and the three planes required to work rough
>>lumber?
>>
>>Why screw around trying to make do when you can get, for instance, the
>>open stand 6" JET for $350, and make a low stand that allows it to be
>>rolled under the wings of your tablesaw out of the way when you need
>>room for a planer?
>
> =============================
> My thoughts exactly.... !
>
> My small 24x24 detached shop building offered plenty of room 40 years
> ago when I started in the hobby.... more then I ever thought I would
> need (sound familiar ?)
>
> Today I have a hard time finding a place to sit my coffee cup down.
>
> But putting tools on rollers and "storing" them under TS wings and
> under workbenches or under the lathe stand is sometimes REQUIRED...
>
> Bob Griffiths
>
So, Bob, I ask this in all seriousness: What will you do when the next
large tool follows you home? I have very much the same problem, and my
wife has laid claim on the bedroom the youngest said he was vacating this
month. I've been setting up a 'remote shop' at my father's place, with
some of the things I need to 'do a few things' up there. And he's got some
of my timber in his basement space.
Is there a 12 step program?
Patriarch
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
> square face joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
Technically you should use a jointer to straighten and or flatten a rough
cut board, be it an electric one or human powered one. That said, I got
real close with reasonable straight rough cut lumber using my TS to
straighten and a thickness planer.
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
> square face joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
Rough lumber was used long before power tools were around. Faces can be
flattened by using planes and edges can be straightened and squared by using
a large jointing plane. That being said, I still use the jointer/planer
method.
Frank
No way around it. No woodworking was ever done before the jointer was
invented.
"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
using
> rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
articles
> about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
> guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
> joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
>
In the beginning, I started with a Ryobi AP-10, a 10" planer. For a
short while, I was putting rough stock through it, but that stock was
pretty straight to begin with. I then got a 6" jointer, but some
pieces, like bed rails were still too wide, so I also put them through
the planer w/o benefit of a jointer. The moral is that whether or not
you must use a jointer depends. It depends on your stock, your
projects, how much you want to work them by hand, etc., etc.
On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 14:17:18 -0800, "Daniel Grieves"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from using
>rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those articles
>about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer but I'm
>guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a square face
>joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>
>Thanks,
>Dan
>
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 23:32:25 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Daniel Grieves" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> If I don't have room/money for a jointer, am I forever forbidden from
>> using rough lumber, or is there a way to work around it? I've read those
>> articles about building a router-table fence to work as an edge jointer
>> but I'm guessing that my portable power planer wouldn't guarantee me a
>> square face joint? Do I buy a big hand plane instead?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Dan
>
>Technically you should use a jointer to straighten and or flatten a rough
>cut board, be it an electric one or human powered one. That said, I got
>real close with reasonable straight rough cut lumber using my TS to
>straighten and a thickness planer.
>
I've tacked a piece of straight-cut thin ply, or masonite to a board,
expecting to lose a little. That is the guide to cut the other edge
on the TS, then turn an cut off the wasted piece [removing the guide
first.] If more fussy, then clamp a straightedge and rout a shim of
the edge. Thickness-plane the width.
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:00:02 -0500, Silvan
<[email protected]> wrote:
>[email protected] wrote:
>
>> hand planing is slow but sure.
>>
>> and takes up very little room.
>
>Hah. My workbench takes up at least as much room as the average high end
>big iron home power jointer, though maybe less than some really big
>industrial jobs.
yabbut... you need that bench for assembly anyhow.
>
>Planes are small, but they lead quickly to workbenches, vises, more planes,
>dogs, sharpening supplies, more planes, hold-downs, more planes, and then
>you add some more planes. A power jointer is probably cheaper in the long
>run. :)
shhh.....
>
>(Actually, in my case, I finally wound up buying a little baby jointer to do
>some of the grunt work. A hard day of wielding my planes leaves my wrists
>hurting something awful, so splitting the work between a machine and planes
>to put a pretty surface on afterwards really seems to be a best of both
>worlds proposition. I can get by with a cheaper, crappier, more
>poorly-adjusted jointer, and I get the same kind of final results I was
>getting doing everything by hand.)