Kreg pocket screw jig

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 03:55:37 -0400, "Upscale" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>"C & E" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits
>come
>> with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The setting
>is
>> just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that you
>> get the extra bite.
>
>I've got a question on that. I bought the K3 master kit but haven't used it
>yet. On something like Oak or other hard woods, how far do you go through
>the first piece of wood into the second, e.g.. stile into rail? Saw a video
>once where the instructor drilled very shallowly through into the rail. It
>looked like just enough for the screw to line up and start biting into the
>rail. Does that sound right?

Not at all in my case. The screws are self drilling with relief. The
alignment is taken care of with the clamps. I've never pre drilled
the second piece.

Frank

"GarageWoodworks" <.@.> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>

>
> OK. I have also never used these self tapping screws. I usually predrill
> everything. Is there 'any' risk of splitting oak with self tappeing
> screws with no predrilling on the opposite mating piece?
>
>
>>
>
>

I use the Kreg screws for other uses and have screwed them in as close as
1/8" from the end/edge of a oak board with no splitting problem,.....
normally.

IF the grain near the end/edge is a bit strange or has a knot I have seen
some splitting but again, only if screwing near the edge.

C & E wrote:

> <snip?
>
>> OK. I have also never used these self tapping screws. I usually
>> predrill
>> everything. Is there 'any' risk of splitting oak with self tappeing
>> screws with no predrilling on the opposite mating piece?
>>
>
> I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits
> come
> with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The setting
> is just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that
> you
> get the extra bite. I've not had a cabinet face split, a screw exit the
> otherside nor have I had one separate using glue and screws. Ditto on the
> choice of fine threads for hardwoods and coarse threads for softwoods.
> Later,
> Chuck

Ditto what he said. Only time I've ever had any splits is if the screw
gets over-tightened on narrow stock.


--
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Actually, I drill all my rails first (both ends), without a stile in
sight.

I'm confused about which piece you're suggesting to put the pocket hole.
Isn't there a stronger joint where a pocket hole would be put in any end
grain piece butting up against a side grain? A screw tip would bite better
into side grain than pocket hole in side grain with screw biting into end
grain.

I believe you're just considering only simple cabinet doors (two rails, two
stiles) when you're talking about which piece has the pocket hole, and in
that regard I'd agree with you. But, what if you had a larger door with two
rails and three stiles? Then I'd be tempted to place the pocket holes in the
middle stile and screw it into the rail for the stronger joint.

I've had in my mind larger unit face frames like my entertainment centre
where there's a greater number of rails and stiles with some stiles butting
up against the middle of the rail. Then I believe it might be a little
different where you place the pocket hole. Am I explaining properly?

"GarageWoodworks" <.@.> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Is there a min stock thickness that can be used for these? I'm thinking
> of buying one of the cheap ones (Kreg rocket jig), but my stock is only
> 3/4" for this project. Because the screw goes in at an angle I would
> think that the limitation is the stock thickness?? (too thin and the
> screw would come out the front??)
>
> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=5793
>
> --
> www.garagewoodworks.com
>
>

On the standard non adjustable jigs the screw exits the end/edge at the
center of a 3/4" think piece of wood.
Taking into mind that the screw is approximately 3/32 wide. If you wood is
1/2" thick you would be coming very close to having the screw exit on the
face vs. the edge of the board.

With that said however the screw would have to go into thicker material so
that the screw would not exit the face of the piece being joined.

The more adjustable jigs allow for you to keep the screw centered as it
exits the surface of the drilled board.

"C & E" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits
come
> with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The setting
is
> just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that you
> get the extra bite.

I've got a question on that. I bought the K3 master kit but haven't used it
yet. On something like Oak or other hard woods, how far do you go through
the first piece of wood into the second, e.g.. stile into rail? Saw a video
once where the instructor drilled very shallowly through into the rail. It
looked like just enough for the screw to line up and start biting into the
rail. Does that sound right?

> On the standard non adjustable jigs the screw exits the end/edge at the
> center of a 3/4" think piece of wood.
> Taking into mind that the screw is approximately 3/32 wide. If you wood
> is 1/2" thick you would be coming very close to having the screw exit on
> the face vs. the edge of the board.
>
> With that said however the screw would have to go into thicker material so
> that the screw would not exit the face of the piece being joined.
>
> The more adjustable jigs allow for you to keep the screw centered as it
> exits the surface of the drilled board.

OK. I have also never used these self tapping screws. I usually predrill
everything. Is there 'any' risk of splitting oak with self tappeing screws
with no predrilling on the opposite mating piece?


>

<snip?

> OK. I have also never used these self tapping screws. I usually predrill
> everything. Is there 'any' risk of splitting oak with self tappeing
> screws with no predrilling on the opposite mating piece?
>

I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits come
with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The setting is
just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that you
get the extra bite. I've not had a cabinet face split, a screw exit the
otherside nor have I had one separate using glue and screws. Ditto on the
choice of fine threads for hardwoods and coarse threads for softwoods.
Later,
Chuck

> Not at all in my case. The screws are self drilling with relief. The
> alignment is taken care of with the clamps. I've never pre drilled
> the second piece.
>

Ditto.

IME w/ maple, the jig only predrills the upper piece and that is perfectly
adequate. Kreg sells a special vice-grip type clamp with a big pad on one
jaw and a small pad on the other. It is included with some of their
packages.

Orient it with the big jaw on the show side of your face frame, and that
face will always come out flush, even if the stock isn't the exact same
thickness.

Regards,

Steve


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 03:55:37 -0400, "Upscale" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"C & E" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits
>>come
>>> with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The
>>> setting
>>is
>>> just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that
>>> you
>>> get the extra bite.
>>
>>I've got a question on that. I bought the K3 master kit but haven't used
>>it
>>yet. On something like Oak or other hard woods, how far do you go through
>>the first piece of wood into the second, e.g.. stile into rail? Saw a
>>video
>>once where the instructor drilled very shallowly through into the rail. It
>>looked like just enough for the screw to line up and start biting into the
>>rail. Does that sound right?
>
> Not at all in my case. The screws are self drilling with relief. The
> alignment is taken care of with the clamps. I've never pre drilled
> the second piece.
>
> Frank

Same as Frank. I've always used the exact setup called for in Kreg's
directions - they tell you exactly how to set up the stop collar for various
size woods and the type of joint, and what size/type screws to use. Never
had a problem in any type or size wood, to date, and have never even
considered additional drilling steps.

Jim In FL

> So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without
> a
> rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
> time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?

Absolutely correct. When screwing the fastener, the threads will grab a bit
in the upper piece before you get any traction on the lower piece. I the
will cause "jacking", the tendency for the the pieces to push apart. This is
why it is necessary to clamp your pieces while driving the screws.

-Steve


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

(Not speaking for Frank, of course). You're right - in those cases I put
the pockets in the style. I never have gone into end grain with the screw.
I'm betting Frank was just referring to the outside part of the frame.

Jim In Fl.

"Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> Well, yes, however, when making face frames it is normally the rails
>> that you drill the pocket holes in so that the end grain of the rails
>> are hidden by the stile.
>
> A question about that. Wouldn't a screw hold better going from a pocket
> hole
> in an end grain into side grain? Of course, it would depend on which stile
> and rail you were working with. Rails are sandwiched between stiles on
> either end, but the reverse is true in the middle of a face frame where
> the
> stiles are sandwiched between rails.
>
>

"Upscale" wrote in message

> So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without
a
> rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
> time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?

Actually, I drill all my rails first (both ends), without a stile in sight.
:)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/8/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sat, 8 Sep 2007 10:27:16 -0400, "GarageWoodworks" <.@.> wrote:

>Is there a min stock thickness that can be used for these? I'm thinking of
>buying one of the cheap ones (Kreg rocket jig), but my stock is only 3/4"
>for this project. Because the screw goes in at an angle I would think that
>the limitation is the stock thickness?? (too thin and the screw would come
>out the front??)
>
>http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=5793


I'm putting together a face frame that has 3/4" thk. stock but has
flutes on the front face that are 1/8" deep making the effective
thickness 5/8". Last night I took some sample pieces and put them
together using the 1-1/4" screws with the step drill collar set at the
normal position for that screw and stock thickness. I then removed
the screws and cut the board across the screw hole to see where it
actually ended up relative to the front face. Bottom line is it has
plenty of stock left, at least 1/8"

You can control the position by adjusting the stop collar at the
expense of penetration depth.

Frank

> Is there a min stock thickness that can be used for these? I'm thinking
> of buying one of the cheap ones (Kreg rocket jig), but my stock is only
> 3/4" for this project. Because the screw goes in at an angle I would
> think that the limitation is the stock thickness?? (too thin and the
> screw would come out the front??)
>
> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=5793
>
> --
> www.garagewoodworks.com

I can't say about the mnimum thickness as I haven't tried, but I've used
mine in stock as thin as 5/8" with the head buried and 1/2" with part of the
screw head sticking up past the surface by a 1/16" or so.

Mike

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
> under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling into
> the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw
will
> have less to thread into.

So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without a
rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 11:00:37 -0400, "Upscale" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
>> under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling into
>> the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw
>will
>> have less to thread into.
>
>So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without a
>rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
>time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?
>


Well, yes, however, when making face frames it is normally the rails
that you drill the pocket holes in so that the end grain of the rails
are hidden by the stile. But you can do them all at once. I usually
set stops to cut everything first, lay it all out to make sure it
fits, then go back and do the pocket holes all at once.


Frank

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> Drill the pocket holes in the ends of rails that go between two stiles,
and
> in the ends of intermediate stiles that go between two rails.
>
> The end result of this is apparently what you are trying to describe
above.
> :)

Yeah, I've been accused of being long winded sometimes. :)

"Patriarch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
> <snip>
>> I use the Kreg screws for other uses and have screwed them in as close
>> as 1/8" from the end/edge of a oak board with no splitting
>> problem,..... normally.
>>
>
> Some of my pocket screws are Kreg sold. Most came from McFeeley's. I've
> found that I need to crank down the torque to a lower, milder setting with
> some of those, or they sink too deeply.
>
> Or maybe it's the poor quality ply.
>
> Patriarch

With a rare exception, I prefer the Kreg's over the McFeeleys. I don't know
why, I think mostly that the Kreg's have a better appearance. It has
however been several years since I used the McFeeleys pocket hole screws.

"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 10:06:42 -0500, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>
> You've done this with a Kreg K3 master kit?
>
>
> Frank


I would think it impossible except if you were using the small portable
pocket rocket, or what ever Kreg calls it.

"Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "C & E" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> I don't know about the unit that you are looking at but the larger kits
> come
>> with a tapered drill which depth you set with a stop collar. The setting
> is
>> just slightly more shallow than the length of the chosen screw so that
>> you
>> get the extra bite.
>
> I've got a question on that. I bought the K3 master kit but haven't used
> it
> yet. On something like Oak or other hard woods, how far do you go through
> the first piece of wood into the second, e.g.. stile into rail? Saw a
> video
> once where the instructor drilled very shallowly through into the rail. It
> looked like just enough for the screw to line up and start biting into the
> rail. Does that sound right?
>
>

No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling into
the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw will
have less to thread into.

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
>>
>
> Absolutely, I have never used a rail or mating piece during the drilling.
> In fact, how would you do that as the full sized jig does not allow any
> piece except the one you are drilling.
>.



Korection, Never used a stile or mating piece when drilling a rail.

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

<snip>
> I use the Kreg screws for other uses and have screwed them in as close
> as 1/8" from the end/edge of a oak board with no splitting
> problem,..... normally.
>

Some of my pocket screws are Kreg sold. Most came from McFeeley's. I've
found that I need to crank down the torque to a lower, milder setting with
some of those, or they sink too deeply.

Or maybe it's the poor quality ply.

Patriarch

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> "Patriarch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> news:[email protected]:
>>
>> <snip>
>>> I use the Kreg screws for other uses and have screwed them in as
>>> close as 1/8" from the end/edge of a oak board with no splitting
>>> problem,..... normally.
>>>
>>
>> Some of my pocket screws are Kreg sold. Most came from McFeeley's.
>> I've found that I need to crank down the torque to a lower, milder
>> setting with some of those, or they sink too deeply.
>>
>> Or maybe it's the poor quality ply.
>>
>> Patriarch
>
> With a rare exception, I prefer the Kreg's over the McFeeleys. I
> don't know why, I think mostly that the Kreg's have a better
> appearance. It has however been several years since I used the
> McFeeleys pocket hole screws.
>

It has been several years since I BOUGHT McFeeley's screws. The initial
order was of 'sufficient size'. ;-)

Kreg's at Rockler were pretty expensive, and not consistently available.

Patriarch

"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Additionally, if your K3 master did not come with a 90 degree clamp
> (3/8" dia rod on one end, flat plate on the other) you should get
> one. very helpful.

If you're talking about item 'B' in the picture, I bought on at the same
time I purchase my K3 kit.
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=49892&cat=,46275
And yeah, it does look like a helpful clamp.

"dpb" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> there's a small advantage in having the hole penetrate the joined piece
> _slightly_ as a guide -- it eliminates (or at least minimizes) the
> desire of the piece to "walk" when there's a hole for the screw to bite
> into initially...

Sounds reasonable.

"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Well, yes, however, when making face frames it is normally the rails
> that you drill the pocket holes in so that the end grain of the rails
> are hidden by the stile.

A question about that. Wouldn't a screw hold better going from a pocket hole
in an end grain into side grain? Of course, it would depend on which stile
and rail you were working with. Rails are sandwiched between stiles on
either end, but the reverse is true in the middle of a face frame where the
stiles are sandwiched between rails.

"Upscale" wrote in message
>
> "Swingman" wrote in message
> >
> > Drill the pocket holes in the ends of rails that go between two stiles,
> > and in the ends of intermediate stiles that go between two rails.
> >
> > The end result of this is apparently what you are trying to describe
>> above.
> > :)
>
> Yeah, I've been accused of being long winded sometimes. :)

Here's a picture worth a lot of wind:

http://www.e-woodshop.net/images/FFPocketHoles.JPG

:)

(Arrows are the ends where the pocket holes are drilled, and the direction
of the arrows is the direction the screw goes)

FWIW, this is pretty standard procedure as far as I know. I've literally
done hundreds of face frames, and do them all this way.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 8/8/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Upscale wrote:
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
>> under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling into
>> the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw
> will
>> have less to thread into.
>
> So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without a
> rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
> time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?

In theory, yes. In what little pocket joinery I've done, I think
there's a small advantage in having the hole penetrate the joined piece
_slightly_ as a guide -- it eliminates (or at least minimizes) the
desire of the piece to "walk" when there's a hole for the screw to bite
into initially...

$0.02, ymmv, etc., ...

--

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 10:06:42 -0500, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:

>Upscale wrote:
>> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
>>> under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling into
>>> the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw
>> will
>>> have less to thread into.
>>
>> So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without a
>> rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
>> time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?
>
>In theory, yes. In what little pocket joinery I've done, I think
>there's a small advantage in having the hole penetrate the joined piece
>_slightly_ as a guide -- it eliminates (or at least minimizes) the
>desire of the piece to "walk" when there's a hole for the screw to bite
>into initially...
>
>$0.02, ymmv, etc., ...


You've done this with a Kreg K3 master kit?


Frank

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 21:30:20 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 10:06:42 -0500, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>
>> You've done this with a Kreg K3 master kit?
>>
>>
>> Frank
>
>
>I would think it impossible except if you were using the small portable
>pocket rocket, or what ever Kreg calls it.
>
I would think you would be exactly right. Even if you could rig the
portable and set the stop collar improperly to get penetration, the
minor diameter of the step drill is a clearance diameter, larger than
the screw. so all you would accomplish is putting a clearance hole in
the second piece, reducing the amount of thread bite, and thinning out
the material below the counterbore. None of those are good things.

Frank

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:02:45 -0400, "Upscale" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>"Frank Boettcher" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> Well, yes, however, when making face frames it is normally the rails
>> that you drill the pocket holes in so that the end grain of the rails
>> are hidden by the stile.
>
>A question about that. Wouldn't a screw hold better going from a pocket hole
>in an end grain into side grain?

Yes.

>Of course, it would depend on which stile
>and rail you were working with. Rails are sandwiched between stiles on
>either end,

And any full rails in the middle for drawers, doors, etc.


> but the reverse is true in the middle of a face frame where the
>stiles are sandwiched between rails.
>
If you are talking about intermediate vertical dividers for drawers or
a door partition, yes always put the pocket holes in the piece where
the screw will exit the end grain into the side of the other piece.

Additionally, if your K3 master did not come with a 90 degree clamp
(3/8" dia rod on one end, flat plate on the other) you should get
one. very helpful.

Try it out, you'll like it I suspect.

Frank

GarageWoodworks wrote:
> Is there a min stock thickness that can be used for these? I'm thinking of
> buying one of the cheap ones (Kreg rocket jig), but my stock is only 3/4"
> for this project. Because the screw goes in at an angle I would think that
> the limitation is the stock thickness?? (too thin and the screw would come
> out the front??)
>
> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=5793
>

See the "Rocket" user manual at:

http://www.kregtool.com/education_center/manuals/rocket_kreg_jig.pdf

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]

"Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> No, in fact it is recommended to use a dime or nickel as a depth spacer
>> under the drill bit in the jig to correctly set the collar. Drilling
>> into
>> the second piece simply weakens the strength of the joint as the screw
> will
>> have less to thread into.
>
> So realistically, you could drill all your stiles at the same time without
> a
> rail in sight then come alone with a rail, clamp the stiles to it one at a
> time and drive in your screws. Does *that* sound right?
>
>

Absolutely, I have never used a rail or mating piece during the drilling.
In fact, how would you do that as the full sized jig does not allow any
piece except the one you are drilling.

"GarageWoodworks" <.@.> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Is there a min stock thickness that can be used for these? I'm thinking
> of buying one of the cheap ones (Kreg rocket jig), but my stock is only
> 3/4" for this project. Because the screw goes in at an angle I would
> think that the limitation is the stock thickness?? (too thin and the
> screw would come out the front??)
>
> http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=5793
>
> --
> www.garagewoodworks.com
>
>
The minimum stock thickness is 1/2 inch. The jig positions the stock so
that the screw enters the work at the middle of the thickness. You use a
different screw length for each thickness of stock.
Jim

Rockler's multi-pack of Kreg Screws is comparable to Home Depots, who also
sales individual sizes in quantities of 1000 for $18 to about $24. However,
Lowes sales 100 packs for less than $4. Please don't flame my butt for
mentioning those kinda stores.

Mike
Watch for the bounce.
If ya didn't see it, ya didn't feel it.
If ya see it, it didn't go off.
Old Air Force Munitions Saying
"Patriarch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>>
>> "Patriarch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in
>>> news:[email protected]:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>> I use the Kreg screws for other uses and have screwed them in as
>>>> close as 1/8" from the end/edge of a oak board with no splitting
>>>> problem,..... normally.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Some of my pocket screws are Kreg sold. Most came from McFeeley's.
>>> I've found that I need to crank down the torque to a lower, milder
>>> setting with some of those, or they sink too deeply.
>>>
>>> Or maybe it's the poor quality ply.
>>>
>>> Patriarch
>>
>> With a rare exception, I prefer the Kreg's over the McFeeleys. I
>> don't know why, I think mostly that the Kreg's have a better
>> appearance. It has however been several years since I used the
>> McFeeleys pocket hole screws.
>>
>
> It has been several years since I BOUGHT McFeeley's screws. The initial
> order was of 'sufficient size'. ;-)
>
> Kreg's at Rockler were pretty expensive, and not consistently available.
>
> Patriarch

"GarageWoodworks" <.@.> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>> On the standard non adjustable jigs the screw exits the end/edge at the
>> center of a 3/4" think piece of wood.
>> Taking into mind that the screw is approximately 3/32 wide. If you wood
>> is 1/2" thick you would be coming very close to having the screw exit on
>> the face vs. the edge of the board.
>>
>> With that said however the screw would have to go into thicker material
>> so that the screw would not exit the face of the piece being joined.
>>
>> The more adjustable jigs allow for you to keep the screw centered as it
>> exits the surface of the drilled board.
>
> OK. I have also never used these self tapping screws. I usually predrill
> everything. Is there 'any' risk of splitting oak with self tappeing
> screws with no predrilling on the opposite mating piece?
>
>
>>
>
>
I have driven lots of Kreg screws into oak, and I have never had a problem.
You use fine threaded screws for all hardwood.
Jim

"Upscale" wrote in message

> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > Actually, I drill all my rails first (both ends), without a stile in
> sight.
>
> I'm confused about which piece you're suggesting to put the pocket hole.
> Isn't there a stronger joint where a pocket hole would be put in any end
> grain piece butting up against a side grain? A screw tip would bite better
> into side grain than pocket hole in side grain with screw biting into end
> grain.

Drill the pocket holes in the ends of rails that go between two stiles, and
in the ends of intermediate stiles that go between two rails.

The end result of this is apparently what you are trying to describe above.
:)

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Last update: 8/8/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)