There has been some talk of hearing protection and such. But sometimes the
effects are overlooked.
I have been working at a reno this week and a crew of 2 hardwood floor
installers showed up to install parkay flooring ( glue down ).
They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection. One
even was wearing a ring all day.
One of the installers was in his early 30 and both had the radio playing LOUD.
But to them it wasn't loud at all. And you had to speak loudly to have a
converstion with them.
Wear your protective gear and take safety precautions seriously.
: "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
: leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
: -- George M. Wrong.
:
: Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
: gov to be replaced with ca
: www.reliable-quality.com
Doug Miller wrote:
>> My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could
>> not get the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some
>> semblance of roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an
>> easy thing to do
>> when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer
>> wear a ring in the shop!
>
> IMO, not wearing a ring is the wrong lesson to take out of this
> experience. The right lessons to take out of it would be to take
> steps to prevent kickback, and ensure that all of your body parts are
> well out of the way should one occur.
Incredible. Doubtless you also believe
- Woodturners who dropped a gouge that stuck in their foot because they
were wearing sandles shouldn't wear boots, they should just be more careful
to avoid lathe catches.
- Woodworkers who trip on electric cords on the floor should just walk
more carefully, not take actions to remove the hazard. (I have 3 extension
cords running along the ceiling of my shop because I got tired of the
tripping hazard -- do you think I should take them down & just be "more
careful"?)
People have posted here, "Something bad happened while I was working with my
hands. The injury was *worse* because of a circle of metal on my finger.
I'm not wearing rings in the shop anymore." Seems reasonable to me. It's a
personally-proven technique of reducing the chance of injury.
-- Mark
Sat, Jan 10, 2004, 9:05pm [email protected]
(Angelo=A0Castellano=A0posting) claims:
There has been some talk of hearing protection and such. But sometimes
the effects are overlooked. <snip>
Uh, no, I think that's why the talk about hearing protection.
JOAT
Don't e-mail me while I'm breathing.
Life just ain't life without good music. - JOAT
Web Page Update 10 Jan 2004.
Some tunes I like.
http://community-2.webtv.net/Jakofalltrades/SOMETUNESILIKE/
In article <[email protected]>, "Mark Jerde" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Doug Miller wrote:
>
>>> My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could
>>> not get the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some
>>> semblance of roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an
>>> easy thing to do
>>> when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer
>>> wear a ring in the shop!
>>
>> IMO, not wearing a ring is the wrong lesson to take out of this
>> experience. The right lessons to take out of it would be to take
>> steps to prevent kickback, and ensure that all of your body parts are
>> well out of the way should one occur.
>
>Incredible. Doubtless you also believe
>
> - Woodturners who dropped a gouge that stuck in their foot because they
>were wearing sandles shouldn't wear boots, they should just be more careful
>to avoid lathe catches.
Nope. I believe that anybody who wears sandals in a woodshop isn't too bright.
There are just too many things that can land on your toes. Wearing shoes is
just one of those things that falls into the category of "reasonable
precautions", along with using a splitter and push sticks on a TS, and keeping
your various body parts out of the line of fire.
>
> - Woodworkers who trip on electric cords on the floor should just walk
>more carefully, not take actions to remove the hazard. (I have 3 extension
>cords running along the ceiling of my shop because I got tired of the
>tripping hazard -- do you think I should take them down & just be "more
>careful"?)
You really should pay a bit more attention to posts before you respond to
them. I never advocated leaving obvious safety hazards in place, and for you
to conclude that I would, is quite a stretch of the imagination.
>People have posted here, "Something bad happened while I was working with my
>hands. The injury was *worse* because of a circle of metal on my finger.
>I'm not wearing rings in the shop anymore." Seems reasonable to me. It's a
>personally-proven technique of reducing the chance of injury.
>
Keeping your hands away from things that can hurt them is also a proven
technique, and IMO a better one, of reducing the chance of injury.
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
Second that. In my case it was a young man shinning down a Lightning Mk6
ladder dirung a scramble start (Cold War days, guys) who slipped, caught his
ring in a step tread and managed to peel most of his ring finger like taking
a condom off.
The other big nono about wearing rings was the skinny dipstick whose ring
didn't fit and managed to drop it in the starboard equipment compartment of
the same aircraft type. We spent most of that night stripping the bloody
thing to find it before the aircraft could fly again.
I accept that it's slightly different when you're wearing a ring in your own
woodworking shop, but as far as I'm concerned, it's just another thing in
the way, so I don't wear one. I don't wear a wristwatch either.
YMMV
Frank
"Groggy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I agree with Andy on this. For mechanical binding and (potentially)
> electrical reasons, I'd recommend against wearing rings around machinery
or
> anywhere it is likely to catch and cause damage.
>
> I have personally seen a finger torn off by catching on a latch in an
> aircraft (C130) doorway when the individual jumped to the ground - not
> pretty. Whilst not directly relevant to the shop, mechanical binding has
> shown (to me) that the weakest point is the finger, not the ring.
>
> Some production shops have these as rules. In some countries they are
> legislation. In all instances they are for a reason.
>
> If you read this Doug, "no rings" is the wrong lesson to learn from the
> given instance, but that does not mean the policy is a bad one in
> conjunction with the other safeguards you mentioned.
>
> regards,
>
> Greg
>
> "Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 20:31:38 GMT, [email protected] (Doug Miller)
> > wrote:
> >
> > >Ahh, I see. Still IMO "no rings" is the wrong lesson to learn from
this.
> >
> > I have no idea what "the right question" is.
> >
> > But the right answer is don't wear rings in a workshop.
> > --
> > Do whales have krillfiles ?
>
>
Doug Miller wrote:
>>> <serious>
>>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so
>>> close to a
>>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you
>>> have your
>>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>>
>> This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule,
>> about
>> wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an
>> operator try to
>> slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring
>> was caught
>> and tore the ring off.
>
> The problem wasn't the ring...
Fine, exercise your right to ignore lessons of others. I don't wear my ring
while doing any kind of manual labor. I've had rings catch on stuff.
Something on the ranch went wrong and even through leather gloves my finger
was bleeding 360 degrees.
My dad doesn't wear his when doing manual labor either. When he was a young
he jumped out of a hayrack. The ring caught on a nail. If the hayrack had
been a couple inches taller he would have lost the finger.
I put these all in the same category: "Use your TS guard." "Use push
sticks." "Take off your rings in the shop."
-- Mark
Greetings and Salutations...
While it is great advice to keep one's hands
out of any situation where a ring might get grabbed,
it is not always possible. Accidents happen. So...
my rule is "no jewelry in the shop".
But then...I got out of the habit of wearing
rings some years ago when I was more heavily involved
in working on electronics and cars. It is just not
a happy thing to stick one's hand into a piece of
equipment and have a ring short something out.
At best, it dings the equipment...at worst, it
tries to weld the ring to the frame...which is NOT
a pleasant experience.
Regards
Dave Mundt
On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:47:24 +0100, Juergen Hannappel
<[email protected]> wrote:
>That's the second time i hear that titanium wedding rings are extra
>expensive. Why?
FASHION!
Titanium is cheaper than gold. In fact, you can get a 3 POUND bicycle
frame, made of 100% Ti, for less than many people pay for a 2 oz.
ring.
Barry
And just try to get that titanium off if it's ever crushed onto your finger.
The doctors and EMTs don't like trying to cut them off at all. Tom
>On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:47:24 +0100,
Juergen Hannappel
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>That's the second time i hear that titanium wedding rings are extra
>>expensive. Why?
>
Someday, it'll all be over....
OK, it's not too bad. $149 for it and I must say it's very nice.
It's very light on my finger, I don't worry about it bending and its
quite comfortable.
SWMBO got all the diamonds and gold, I'm happy with Titanium.
[email protected] (Tom) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >Titanium is cheaper than gold. In fact, you can get a 3 POUND bicycle
> >frame, made of 100% Ti, for less than many people pay for a 2 oz.
> >ring.
>
> Actually, the titanium in bicycles is alloyed with vanadium and aluminum. Tom
> Someday, it'll all be over....
On 14 Jan 2004 23:27:04 GMT, [email protected] (Tom) wrote:
>Actually, the titanium in bicycles is alloyed with vanadium and aluminum.
Not all of them. There have been quite a few CP frames about
(although mine is 6/4).
My wedding ring was Ti. Piece of scrap that one of my friends rolled
up and filed to shape for me. Never did work out how to put a decent
black finish on it though.
--
Do whales have krillfiles ?
On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:51:05 GMT, Tim Carver <[email protected]>
wrote:
>On the other hand (couldn't resist :-)) I can imagine cases where
>wearing a ring in the shop would be dangerous. My brother was a
>welder and maintenance supervisor at International Harvester. Nobody
>wore rings in his department. This may be a myth, but they were told
>that there had been an instance of a guy falling off of a steel
>I-beam, catching his ring on the edge as he tried to grab the beam to
>save himself, and having the skin completely ripped off of his ring
>finger as his entire body weight hung from the ring caught on the
>beam. Nobody was quite sure if this was true, but they all chose
>to not wear rings, because it seemed like something that could
>actually happen to even a reasonably careful person. This is very
>unlike the ring-around-the-tablesaw question, which requires several
>concurrent stupid decisions in order for an accident to occur.
Essentially that same thing happened to a friend of mine in college.
He was climbing in (or maybe out) of a second-floor dorm room window,
when he slipped and grabbed at the window ledge. He caught his wedding
ring on the aluminum track of the sliding window and pretty much
skinned his finger to the bone. It was a very ugly mess and I'm not
sure he ever regained full use of that finger.
Frankly, the danger of a ring around power equipment is probably
pretty slight, if you are close enough to catch it all you might be
doing is increasing the severity of the injury. Sort of like wearing
gloves when using the TS. I do on rough lumber, but never on smooth
stuff. You just need to understand the risks and take steps to
minimize them.
Tim Douglass
http://www.DouglassClan.com
(Slightly OT)
I had my wedding band on a total of 1 day on our honeymoon when I went
surfing and a wave made it slip right off into the water. (And please,
let's not go into whether surfing is foolhardy or not again on this
group!) I dove under and barely managed to grab it for a second
before it slipped out of my hand, lost forever. The 2nd band my wife
bought lasted about another week before it came off when surfing
again. Were these rings trying to tell me something? In any case,
while she forgave both incidents and bought a 3rd ring, I have to this
day to wear it in the water, the shop, or anywhere else! This,
however, she does not like!
Cheers!
Duke
[email protected] (Nancy A. Kroes) wrote in message news:<Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie>...
> >>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
> >>> [snip]
> >>> >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection.
> >>> >One even was wearing a ring all day.
> >>>
> >>> <serious>
> >>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
> >>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
> >>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
> >>
> >>
> >> As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
> >>take the chance?
> >
> > *What* chance? That's my point: your fingers should never be so close to any
> > moving part that a ring makes a difference. If I could get a ring caught on
> > something moving, my finger is *already* in danger because it's too close.
> >
>
> I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
> including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
> My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not get
> the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
> roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
> when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer wear
> a ring in the shop!
> That's the second time i hear that titanium wedding rings are extra
> expensive. Why? The material cannot be the reason, you get it (at 90%
> purity) for 37 CHF per Kg....
Because people will pay for them? Might be a business for you to get
into. I know I paid more than the price of gold for my wife's engagement
ring...
--
gabriel
On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:37:36 GMT, "Mark Jerde"
<[email protected]> wrote:
><g> Sorry, my practical experience is different. The extension cords on
>the ceiling reduce a tripping hazard that existed when I ran them on the
>floor Ideally, of course, I'd have outlets wherever needed. But the panel
>and subpanel are maxed out. When I rewire the house I have to get a bigger
>cable from the power company.
Mark -
You're making my point very well :-) We all do things that might not
be textbook-perfect from time to time. You've just given an example
of where you've done something that improves your safety situation,
even though you are doing something which is still technically a
no-no. Even though it improves your situation and is perfectly safe
in this case, there are a whole raft of passages in the NEC that make
what you are doing not quite kosher. But again, I'm not saying
there's anything really wrong with your cords on the ceiling, they are
certainly safer there than on the floor - but dedicated outlets would
be neater and safer.
Personally, I think that if you're close enough to a tablesaw blade
that the ring matters, you'll soon have no fingers left, ring or no
ring. And I'm sorry, but the kickback scenario where the ring got
smashed just seems extremely unlikely - if you set yourself up for
that kind of kickback, you could just as easily be killed by a board
through the throat or something.
On the other hand (couldn't resist :-)) I can imagine cases where
wearing a ring in the shop would be dangerous. My brother was a
welder and maintenance supervisor at International Harvester. Nobody
wore rings in his department. This may be a myth, but they were told
that there had been an instance of a guy falling off of a steel
I-beam, catching his ring on the edge as he tried to grab the beam to
save himself, and having the skin completely ripped off of his ring
finger as his entire body weight hung from the ring caught on the
beam. Nobody was quite sure if this was true, but they all chose
to not wear rings, because it seemed like something that could
actually happen to even a reasonably careful person. This is very
unlike the ring-around-the-tablesaw question, which requires several
concurrent stupid decisions in order for an accident to occur.
Tim Carver
[email protected]
I've had my wedding band on for so long, I couldn't even get it off if I had
to. I always wondered why my finger is black and blue!
--
"Cartoons don't have any deep meaning.
They're just stupid drawings that give you a cheap laugh."
Homer Simpson
Jerry© The Phoneman®
"Lawrence Wasserman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have seen 2 accidents involving rings. One involved a drill press; I
> don't know exactly what the guy did, but the ring was cracked (making
> a 'C' shape instead of an 'O') and the two ends thus created had
> punctured the wearer's fingers. One of the older and calmer guys
> in the shop grabbed 2 pairs of pliers and pulled the ring open
> to remove it from the finger.
>
> The other time, an automotive mechanic accidentally let his wedding
> band complete a 12 volt circuit. That was around 15 years ago and he
> still has a circular scar around his ring finger.
>
>
> --
>
> Larry Wasserman Baltimore, Maryland
> [email protected]
>
[email protected] (Geoff) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> I had a scary moment with my wedding ring on the back deck a few weeks
> ago. I was working with MDF and I knew I was wearing the expensive,
> titanium wedding ring when I started. Then 6 hours later, I wasn't
Be very careful wearing those titanium rings. My (then) fiancee
and I were thinking of them until we spoke to a paramedic. If you're
ever injured in the hand or finger, you may lose the finger. They
can't cut them off you--too hard for their metal shears. If your
finger starts to swell it'll cut off the circulation and then that's
it.
On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 20:31:38 GMT, [email protected] (Doug Miller)
wrote:
>Ahh, I see. Still IMO "no rings" is the wrong lesson to learn from this.
I have no idea what "the right question" is.
But the right answer is don't wear rings in a workshop.
--
Do whales have krillfiles ?
--={Flyer}=-- <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:35:59 GMT, "Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Why did you not just snip or cut one section of the ring and widen it to get
> >it off? I can't remember why it happened, but I remember crushing my ring
> >one day. Used a pair of tin snips to cut the thin part, spread it and had it
> >off easily. It was fairly cheap (e.g. $15) to have it repaired at the
> >jewellers.
>
> Gotta tell you all about our Shipping supervisor's encounter with ring
> removal:
Here's another one: never wear rings if you work around high current
DC supplies. Apparently some of the early IBM mainframes had
multi-hundred amp 5V supplies where the terminals were closely spaced
which lead non-zero numbers of tech's with ring fingers that were
blown off when the ring closed the circuit. In this case no ring was
left to be removed. There are still some systems used in various
particle and nuclear physics experiments that have a similar feature
300A @ 5V supplies with the terminals spaced about 1cm apart -- scary.
It's easier to take the ring off for WW before the accident than
after. That act, however, does not recuse one from being careful.
hex
-30-
Mark Jerde wrote:
> Doug Miller wrote:
>
>>
>>The problem wasn't the ring...
>
>
> Fine, exercise your right to ignore lessons of others.
No, he's making excuses so when his finger gets ripped off he can call
it an accident.
We've been married 12 years. I don't wear a ring and if I wear a watch
it has a rubber band.
I told wife before we were married I wouldn't wear a ring, I was around
too many things at home and work and it would be a hazard. She got me a
small band for the ceremony. I would wear it on occasion. Found myself
wearing it one day at work, figured all I was going was pulling wrenches
so I left it on. When I got home I went to take it off and couldn't,
found it was ovaled. Took it off and haven't seen it in years. We
figured I lost it.
Got another ring, this time a 'comfort fit'. It's a big fat band and
irritating as hell. I know exactly where this one is (inside the safe).
I wear it only at weddings and job interviews.
--
Mark
N.E. Ohio
Never argue with a fool, a bystander can't tell you apart. (S. Clemens,
A.K.A. Mark Twain)
When in doubt hit the throttle. It may not help but it sure ends the
suspense. (Gaz, r.moto)
guess he should have work a better fitting ring(I still cant see how it
would catch, unless he tried really hard and jammed the thin edge of the
ring in the teeth that you use to tighten which i have skinned a knuckle
nicely on trying to slow down)
in article [email protected], Angelo Castellano
posting at [email protected] wrote on 1/11/04 7:07 AM:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> "Doug Miller" wrote in message
>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
>> [snip]
>>> They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection.
>>> One even was wearing a ring all day.
>>
>> <serious>
>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>
> This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule, about
> wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an operator try to
> slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was caught
> and tore the ring off. The operator didn't even know he lost a finger until
> it
> was seen on the floor. As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
> take the chance?
>
> As for SWMBO, explain.
>
> : "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
> : leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
> : -- George M. Wrong.
> :
> : Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
> : gov to be replaced with ca
> : www.reliable-quality.com
>
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>
put your ring on a toe while your in the shop, your wearing, its hard to
lose, and unless your wearing sandals by the time its a problem your foot is
hurting anyways
in article ValMb.72526$Fg.20772@lakeread01, CP at [email protected] wrote on
1/11/04 3:46 PM:
> Every commercial endeavor that falls under the control of OSHA has similar
> safety requirements to protect people's hands and other parts of the body.
> It amazes me that the guys who fall outside the realm of OSHA often don't
> take any safety precautions at all. I think they're crazy. Because of OSHA
> the company I work for has various workgroups of 50 to 200 people who have
> worked for years with no recordable OSHA injuries. Not permitting finger
> rings is part of the protection scheme.
>
> Chris
>
> "Angelo Castellano posting" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> "Doug Miller" wrote in message
>>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
>>> [snip]
>>>> They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing
> protection.
>>>> One even was wearing a ring all day.
>>>
>>> <serious>
>>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close
> to a
>>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have
> your
>>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>>
>> This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule, about
>> wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an operator try
> to
>> slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was
> caught
>> and tore the ring off. The operator didn't even know he lost a finger
> until it
>> was seen on the floor. As for a table saw, you are probably right. But
> why
>> take the chance?
>>
>> As for SWMBO, explain.
>>
>> : "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
>> : leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
>> : -- George M. Wrong.
>> :
>> : Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
>> : gov to be replaced with ca
>> : www.reliable-quality.com
>>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use <http://www.pgp.com>
>>
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>> EL54zj+fTCGD1GLhoQNH+01j
>> =kzEu
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>
>
>
In article <[email protected]>, "Angelo Castellano posting" <[email protected]> wrote:
[snip]
>They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection. One
>even was wearing a ring all day.
<serious>
What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
</serious>
<tongue-in-cheek>
What else am I gonna do with my wedding ring, anway? Put it on a chain around
my neck? I don't think so.
Put it in my pocket? And lose it? Then try to explain that to SWMBO? That's an
even _greater_ hazard than putting it around my neck. :-)
Leave it on the dresser? Then try to explain to SWMBO's _parents_ why I'm not
wearing my ring anymore? Or her brother? Yeah, right.
I'll take my chances with the machinery, thank you very much.
</tongue-in-cheek>
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 09:30:11 -0800, Tim Douglass
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>Essentially that same thing happened to a friend of mine in college.
>He was climbing in (or maybe out) of a second-floor dorm room window,
>when he slipped and grabbed at the window ledge. He caught his wedding
>ring on the aluminum track of the sliding window and pretty much
>skinned his finger to the bone. It was a very ugly mess and I'm not
>sure he ever regained full use of that finger.
>
You have a friend who was a married man, injured while climbing thru a
dorm room window while he was in college?
Sorry about his finger, but I'm certain that it would be pertinent to
the safety discussion for us to know a little more about how this came
about :-)
Tim Carver
[email protected]
In article <b1fdAgSJWeUO@winnie>, [email protected] (Nancy A. Kroes) wrote:
>In article <_fVMb.28428$P%[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Doug Miller) writes:
>> In article <Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie>, [email protected] (Nancy A. Kroes) wrote:
>>
>>>I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
>>>including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
[snip]
>> Subject to your correction, I'm guessing that this occurred on a table saw,
>> with no splitter, and no push sticks in use either.
>
>No, it was in my early days of woodworking. I was ripping on a radial arm saw.
>Not even sure how it wound up smashing my fingers, it happened too fast. I have
>since replaced that RAS with a table saw and a compound mitre saw. And I always
>use push sticks. Still no ring though...
Ahh, I see. Still IMO "no rings" is the wrong lesson to learn from this.
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> --={Flyer}=-- wrote:
>
> > reaches
> > for his Dremel with one of those abrasive wheels mounted on it.
>
> Gack!
>
> I had to cut Dad's ring off because it was causing him pain. I used an
> Xacto razor saw to get most of it, then cut through with tin snips. Worked
> fine.
>
> Tell your boss to try my way next time. :)
>
The suggested method direct from Red Cross First Aid training:
Get a spool of floss- pass about 12" under the ring from finger tip
towards wrist. Begin wrapping the finger with floss- make it tight
enough to compress the skin- spiral up the finger under the ring- tight
close-together coils of floss. Keep going up until you've wrapped to the
center of the 2 joints. DO NOT OVERLAP THE WRAPPINGS. When this is done,
grasp the 12" end hanging from the bottom of the ring and slowly begin
unwrapping by using the ring as a lever- the bottom edge of the floss
should always be touching the ring bottom. The ring will slowly spiral
off the finger.
Works every time (yes, I have used this method more than once) except if
the ring is crushed.
/vic
Then again, if I ever find the SOB that stole my dad's rings, fingers
are only the first thing I'll be clipping off.
I have seen 2 accidents involving rings. One involved a drill press; I
don't know exactly what the guy did, but the ring was cracked (making
a 'C' shape instead of an 'O') and the two ends thus created had
punctured the wearer's fingers. One of the older and calmer guys
in the shop grabbed 2 pairs of pliers and pulled the ring open
to remove it from the finger.
The other time, an automotive mechanic accidentally let his wedding
band complete a 12 volt circuit. That was around 15 years ago and he
still has a circular scar around his ring finger.
--
Larry Wasserman Baltimore, Maryland
[email protected]
One of the first lessons drilled into my head when I started work (early
70's) by our instructor was about safety (and so it should be). No rings,
no loose clothes, no long hair. These came before safety glasses and safety
shoes................
Rings are inherently dangerous - it's all to easy to catch a ring when you
least expect it. I've heard all the arguments that your finger shouldn't be
near the blades / drills etc., but the consequences of a minor mishap are
too high - rings can rip a finger off.
Don't get me started about those videos of long hair in a drill press -
makes you want to run out and get one of those geeky hair nets.
Play safe - don't argue it shouldn't happen - no accident should happen, ne
careful - no rings, no loose clothes, not loose long hair and use eye
protection.
Ian.
"Nancy A. Kroes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie...
>
> >>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
> >>> [snip]
> >>> >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing
protection.
> >>> >One even was wearing a ring all day.
> >>>
> >>> <serious>
> >>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so
close to a
> >>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you
have your
> >>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
> >>
> >>
> >> As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
> >>take the chance?
> >
> > *What* chance? That's my point: your fingers should never be so close to
any
> > moving part that a ring makes a difference. If I could get a ring caught
on
> > something moving, my finger is *already* in danger because it's too
close.
> >
>
> I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
> including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
> My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not
get
> the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
> roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
> when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer wear
> a ring in the shop!
Why did you not just snip or cut one section of the ring and widen it to get
it off? I can't remember why it happened, but I remember crushing my ring
one day. Used a pair of tin snips to cut the thin part, spread it and had it
off easily. It was fairly cheap (e.g. $15) to have it repaired at the
jewellers.
"Nancy A. Kroes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie...
> I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
> including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
> My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not
get
> the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
> roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
Tim Carver wrote:
> I'll bet you that the fire marshal would give you a lecture about
> those extension cords on your ceiling that sounds an awful lot like
> the way you are lecturing everybody about wearing a ring around a saw.
> Is it a big deal? No, but wearing a ring around a saw isn't that big
> a deal, either. There are situations in the shop where a ring could
> be dangerous, just as your cords could be dangerous if they are
> overloaded. But neither the ring nor the cords wiil lead to disaster
> if some care and common sense are exercised.
<g> Sorry, my practical experience is different. The extension cords on
the ceiling reduce a tripping hazard that existed when I ran them on the
floor Ideally, of course, I'd have outlets wherever needed. But the panel
and subpanel are maxed out. When I rewire the house I have to get a bigger
cable from the power company.
> your cords could be dangerous if they are
> overloaded.
Power in this house is a bummer. I have the extension cords (heavy, rated
gage) to avoid problems. The utility room with its washer is on a separate
15A circuit. I unplug the washer and plug my TS into that circuit. I can't
run the TS and shop vac on the gara^H^H^H^Hshop circuits and do any heavy
cutting or the 15A breaker trips. Sometimes I "steal" power from one wall
of the kitchen, which is also on its own circuit.
> wearing a ring around a saw isn't that big
> a deal, either. There are situations in the shop where a ring could
> be dangerous
IMO the ring is an ever-present hazard, like wearing floppy clothing in the
shop. 25+/- years ago my ring finger was dripping blood from an accident
that (IIRC) could not have been forseen or prevented. The rest of my hand
was sore but not bleeding. Chalk the accident up to random quantum
fluxations. <g>
Perhaps I'm more "attached" to my fingers than others. I'm a piano player
and 75+ WPM typist. I'd rather lose a leg (I think) than a finger.
-- Mark
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Hash: SHA1
"Doug Miller" <wrote in message
> In article Angelo Castellano wrote:
> >As for SWMBO, explain.
> >
> SWMBO = She Who Must Be Obeyed, i.e. wife.
Clarification here.
I didn't mean to ask to explain what SWMBO means. I meant to explain the
situation about shop safety. My ring is too big and haven't worn it in years.
I'll resize it someday.
: "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
: leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
: -- George M. Wrong.
:
: Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
: gov to be replaced with ca
: www.reliable-quality.com
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Every commercial endeavor that falls under the control of OSHA has similar
safety requirements to protect people's hands and other parts of the body.
It amazes me that the guys who fall outside the realm of OSHA often don't
take any safety precautions at all. I think they're crazy. Because of OSHA
the company I work for has various workgroups of 50 to 200 people who have
worked for years with no recordable OSHA injuries. Not permitting finger
rings is part of the protection scheme.
Chris
"Angelo Castellano posting" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> "Doug Miller" wrote in message
> > In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
> > [snip]
> > >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing
protection.
> > >One even was wearing a ring all day.
> >
> > <serious>
> > What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close
to a
> > moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have
your
> > hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>
> This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule, about
> wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an operator try
to
> slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was
caught
> and tore the ring off. The operator didn't even know he lost a finger
until it
> was seen on the floor. As for a table saw, you are probably right. But
why
> take the chance?
>
> As for SWMBO, explain.
>
> : "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
> : leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
> : -- George M. Wrong.
> :
> : Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
> : gov to be replaced with ca
> : www.reliable-quality.com
>
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>
>>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
>>> [snip]
>>> >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection.
>>> >One even was wearing a ring all day.
>>>
>>> <serious>
>>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
>>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
>>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>>
>>
>> As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
>>take the chance?
>
> *What* chance? That's my point: your fingers should never be so close to any
> moving part that a ring makes a difference. If I could get a ring caught on
> something moving, my finger is *already* in danger because it's too close.
>
I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not get
the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer wear
a ring in the shop!
In article <[email protected]>, "Angelo Castellano posting" <[email protected]> wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>"Doug Miller" wrote in message
>> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
>> [snip]
>> >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection.
>> >One even was wearing a ring all day.
>>
>> <serious>
>> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
>> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
>> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
>
>This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule, about
>wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an operator try to
>slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was caught
>and tore the ring off.
The problem wasn't the ring...
>The operator didn't even know he lost a finger until it was seen on the
>floor.
.. the problem was that the machine was being operated by an idiot. Your shop
teacher learned -- and taught -- the wrong lesson from this incident. Instead
of "Don't operate machinery while wearing a ring" the proper lesson is "Don't
operate machinery if you're stupid."
> As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
>take the chance?
*What* chance? That's my point: your fingers should never be so close to any
moving part that a ring makes a difference. If I could get a ring caught on
something moving, my finger is *already* in danger because it's too close.
>
>As for SWMBO, explain.
>
SWMBO = She Who Must Be Obeyed, i.e. wife.
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
In article <Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie>, [email protected] (Nancy A. Kroes) wrote:
>I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
>including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
What was your hand doing in the way of a kickback, in the line of fire so to
speak?
>My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not get
>the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
>roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
>when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer wear
>a ring in the shop!
IMO, not wearing a ring is the wrong lesson to take out of this experience.
The right lessons to take out of it would be to take steps to prevent
kickback, and ensure that all of your body parts are well out of the way
should one occur.
Subject to your correction, I'm guessing that this occurred on a table saw,
with no splitter, and no push sticks in use either.
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
An ER doc had a photo on his site a few years ago of a left hand that
got hit by a slab of wood that ended up with fusing of the joints of a
couple of the fingers, one wearing a ring. It is taped to the front
of my saw near the switch.
> What was your hand doing in the way of a kickback, in the line of fire so to
> speak?
>
On 16 Jan 2004 18:20:10 -0800, [email protected] (hex)
wrote:
>Here's another one: never wear rings if you work around high current
>DC supplies.
I used to work in telephone exchanges. Power was supplied at 50V,
through huge copper bus bars, made from 1" thick copper, either 6" or
12"high. They weren't insulated and they were only an inch or so
apart.
--
Do whales have krillfiles ?
In article <_fVMb.28428$P%[email protected]>, [email protected] (Doug Miller) writes:
> In article <Y09Z9tkYeU4+@winnie>, [email protected] (Nancy A. Kroes) wrote:
>
>>I had a kickback in the shop while wearing a ring. It smashed my fingers,
>>including the ring, which it smashed flat on my finger.
>
> What was your hand doing in the way of a kickback, in the line of fire so to
> speak?
>
>>My finger immediately started swelling and turned black and I could not get
>>the ring off. I had to try to hit it with a hammer to some semblance of
>>roundness and then use soap to get it off. Wasn't an easy thing to do
>>when it felt like my whole hand was smashed. Believe me, I no longer wear
>>a ring in the shop!
>
> IMO, not wearing a ring is the wrong lesson to take out of this experience.
> The right lessons to take out of it would be to take steps to prevent
> kickback, and ensure that all of your body parts are well out of the way
> should one occur.
>
> Subject to your correction, I'm guessing that this occurred on a table saw,
> with no splitter, and no push sticks in use either.
>
> --
> Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
>
No, it was in my early days of woodworking. I was ripping on a radial arm saw.
Not even sure how it wound up smashing my fingers, it happened too fast. I have
since replaced that RAS with a table saw and a compound mitre saw. And I always
use push sticks. Still no ring though...
I had a scary moment with my wedding ring on the back deck a few weeks
ago. I was working with MDF and I knew I was wearing the expensive,
titanium wedding ring when I started. Then 6 hours later, I wasn't
married anymore! I don't have shop yet and so I work on the back
deck. I swept every dustpile carefully, I crawled underneath the deck
in the mud, and an hour later it was lost. I am still a newlywed and
my wife was none too pleased. The MDF dust acted like talc and off
slipped the ring.
The great thing is I found it 2 days later when I went out at night
with a good flashlight and searched the herb garden next to the end of
the deck. There it shone, ready to wear.
I don't do that anymore, needless to say.
Geoff Collins
"Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Why did you not just snip or cut one section of the ring and widen it to get
> it off? I can't remember why it happened, but I remember crushing my ring
> one day. Used a pair of tin snips to cut the thin part, spread it and had it
> off easily. It was fairly cheap (e.g. $15) to have it repaired at the
> jewellers.
>
> ... I've heard all the arguments that your finger shouldn't be
> near the blades / drills etc., but the consequences of a minor mishap are
> too high - rings can rip a finger off.
Exactly.
Actually, the ring can create a problem even without any power-tool or
electricity involved. I know a person who is missing a finger. He was
lifting a heavy object from the ground to his shoulder behind a
mini-van that has its rear door raised open. Unfortunately, his ring
got caught with the door hinger, and he ripped his finger off. That
didn't involve any power tool or any welding equipment. The only
things involved was the force that he applied to himself and a tiny
metal object that was sticking out.
No, I don't wear a ring when I work in my workshop or when I move
anything.
Jay Chan
Hearing is not only lost to loud noise exposure, but to illness.
That's were a part of mine went.
Sitting in front of some Marshall stacks at concerts in younger days
didn't help.
As for the power tools, yikes! The planer, router, vac, TS, jointer,
well the list can go on......
Today, it's hearing protect or no tool use. No concerts anymore since
the people I'd go to see are either dead or no longer perform. Not to
mention I'm not interested in music that loud. And illness, well,
that's strictly chance.
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 21:05:56 -0500, "Angelo Castellano
posting" <[email protected]> wrote:
>There has been some talk of hearing protection and such. But sometimes the
>effects are overlooked.
>
>I have been working at a reno this week and a crew of 2 hardwood floor
>installers showed up to install parkay flooring ( glue down ).
>
>They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection. One
>even was wearing a ring all day.
>
>One of the installers was in his early 30 and both had the radio playing LOUD.
>But to them it wasn't loud at all. And you had to speak loudly to have a
>converstion with them.
>
>Wear your protective gear and take safety precautions seriously.
>
>: "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
>: leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
>: -- George M. Wrong.
>:
>: Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
>: gov to be replaced with ca
>: www.reliable-quality.com
On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 17:38:06 GMT, "Mark Jerde"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> - Woodworkers who trip on electric cords on the floor should just walk
>more carefully, not take actions to remove the hazard. (I have 3 extension
>cords running along the ceiling of my shop because I got tired of the
>tripping hazard -- do you think I should take them down & just be "more
>careful"?)
>
Note that tacking extension cords along your ceiling is a big safety
no-no according to the electrical codes. Now is it really a problem?
Well, it's probably safer than having them on the floor, but
the right thing to do is to have permanent wiring sufficient that you
don't need extension cords.
I'll bet you that the fire marshal would give you a lecture about
those extension cords on your ceiling that sounds an awful lot like
the way you are lecturing everybody about wearing a ring around a saw.
Is it a big deal? No, but wearing a ring around a saw isn't that big
a deal, either. There are situations in the shop where a ring could
be dangerous, just as your cords could be dangerous if they are
overloaded. But neither the ring nor the cords wiil lead to disaster
if some care and common sense are exercised.
Tim Carver
[email protected]
On 14 Jan 2004 23:35:11 -0800, [email protected] (Dave G)
wrote:
>They can't cut them off you--too hard for their metal shears.
Complete rubbish. Ti is just another metal, not kryptonite.
Doug Miller wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, "Mark Jerde" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Keeping your hands away from things that can hurt them is also a proven
> technique, and IMO a better one, of reducing the chance of injury.
And what will you do when you find yourself in a situation where you'd LIKE
NOTHING MORE than to keep your hands away from harm's way, but an unfortunate
circumstance and a powerful machine have different ideas? Haven't you read the
stories about limbs getting dragged into hungry machines because something got
hooked onto a ring or a watch or a piece of loose clothing? Wearing jewelry
around any kind of machinery is just dumb, no matter how "careful" you are.
Picture having a stout splinter of wood catch under your ring while feeding a
board into the planer. A contrived example perhaps, but you never know what
kind of shit is going to happen. Better safe than sorry.
--
To reply, change the chemical designation to its common name.
I still have the nick in my wedding ring that almost lost me a finger. Got
it while surfing (actually, while "trying" to surf) wthout a leash on the
board. Had a wipeout, grabbed for the board, and a fin caught my ring. Since
theboard & I were going in opposite directions with a few tons of seawater
pushing, it was quite painful.
"Tim Carver" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:37:36 GMT, "Mark Jerde"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> ><g> Sorry, my practical experience is different. The extension cords on
> >the ceiling reduce a tripping hazard that existed when I ran them on the
> >floor Ideally, of course, I'd have outlets wherever needed. But the
panel
> >and subpanel are maxed out. When I rewire the house I have to get a
bigger
> >cable from the power company.
>
> Mark -
>
> You're making my point very well :-) We all do things that might not
> be textbook-perfect from time to time. You've just given an example
> of where you've done something that improves your safety situation,
> even though you are doing something which is still technically a
> no-no. Even though it improves your situation and is perfectly safe
> in this case, there are a whole raft of passages in the NEC that make
> what you are doing not quite kosher. But again, I'm not saying
> there's anything really wrong with your cords on the ceiling, they are
> certainly safer there than on the floor - but dedicated outlets would
> be neater and safer.
>
> Personally, I think that if you're close enough to a tablesaw blade
> that the ring matters, you'll soon have no fingers left, ring or no
> ring. And I'm sorry, but the kickback scenario where the ring got
> smashed just seems extremely unlikely - if you set yourself up for
> that kind of kickback, you could just as easily be killed by a board
> through the throat or something.
>
> On the other hand (couldn't resist :-)) I can imagine cases where
> wearing a ring in the shop would be dangerous. My brother was a
> welder and maintenance supervisor at International Harvester. Nobody
> wore rings in his department. This may be a myth, but they were told
> that there had been an instance of a guy falling off of a steel
> I-beam, catching his ring on the edge as he tried to grab the beam to
> save himself, and having the skin completely ripped off of his ring
> finger as his entire body weight hung from the ring caught on the
> beam. Nobody was quite sure if this was true, but they all chose
> to not wear rings, because it seemed like something that could
> actually happen to even a reasonably careful person. This is very
> unlike the ring-around-the-tablesaw question, which requires several
> concurrent stupid decisions in order for an accident to occur.
>
>
>
> Tim Carver
> [email protected]
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 14:50:09 GMT, [email protected] (Doug Miller)
wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>, "Angelo Castellano posting" <[email protected]> wrote:
>[snip]
>>They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection. One
>>even was wearing a ring all day.
>
><serious>
>What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
>moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
>hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
></serious>
>
><tongue-in-cheek>
>What else am I gonna do with my wedding ring, anway? Put it on a chain around
>my neck? I don't think so.
>
>Put it in my pocket? And lose it? Then try to explain that to SWMBO? That's an
>even _greater_ hazard than putting it around my neck. :-)
>
>Leave it on the dresser? Then try to explain to SWMBO's _parents_ why I'm not
>wearing my ring anymore? Or her brother? Yeah, right.
>
>I'll take my chances with the machinery, thank you very much.
></tongue-in-cheek>
I heard about wearing rings and hazards. Some shops just don't allow
them. I'm 49 and had my hearing tested. I was surprised to hear my
hearing is as good as a 20-year-old. I do wear earmuffs in the shop
(some of the time) and when mowing the lawn. It would be nice if my
eyes were as good as my ears. I use a jeweler's loupe to remove
splinters.
Tim Carver wrote:
> Note that tacking extension cords along your ceiling is a big safety
> no-no according to the electrical codes. Now is it really a problem?
> Well, it's probably safer than having them on the floor, but
> the right thing to do is to have permanent wiring sufficient that you
> don't need extension cords.
Like others have written, the power cord that came with my Grizzly
contractor saw is barely long enough to touch the floor. Likewise, my two
electric drills have laughably short cords. Only the Sears shop vac, the DW
router and PC router have long enough cords to be reasonably expected to
plug into a wall socket and not require the use of an extension cord.
-- Mark
Mark Jerde writes:
>Tim Carver wrote:
>
>> Note that tacking extension cords along your ceiling is a big safety
>> no-no according to the electrical codes. Now is it really a problem?
>> Well, it's probably safer than having them on the floor, but
>> the right thing to do is to have permanent wiring sufficient that you
>> don't need extension cords.
>
>Like others have written, the power cord that came with my Grizzly
>contractor saw is barely long enough to touch the floor. Likewise, my two
>electric drills have laughably short cords. Only the Sears shop vac, the DW
>router and PC router have long enough cords to be reasonably expected to
>plug into a wall socket and not require the use of an extension cord.
My table saw placement would require floor outlets or overhead outlets. I do
not like floor outlets for anything in a woodshop and I don't like overhead
outlets because they create another problem with materials catching on the
hanging cables. Ergo, a 12' extension cord to my Unisaw works. I use extension
cords on the floor from time to time, but try to remember toremove and recoil
them as needed. I've got a total of more than 40 outlets in my shop, but there
always seems to be a tool placed where some kind of extra cord length is
needed. That's often because the manufacturer builds the tool to a bean
counter's list and cuts 2-3 feet off the cord to save 15 cents or so.
Charlie Self
"Take care of the luxuries and the necessities will take care of themselves."
Dorothy Parker
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Angelo Castellano posting wrote:
> slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was
> caught
> and tore the ring off. The operator didn't even know he lost a finger
That's why I don't try to stop moving machinery with my left hand. :)
Being aware of the ring and actively working to protect it from harm is IMHO
sufficient to avoid catching it on anything. I don't want to get it
scraped up. It belonged to my great grandfather.
Good argument for taking it off, granted, but I always lose track of it when
I do. It and a watch are the only jewlry I ever need.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
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"Doug Miller" wrote in message
> In article <, "Angelo Castellano wrote:
> [snip]
> >They worked with a small table saw ( no guard ) and no hearing protection.
> >One even was wearing a ring all day.
>
> <serious>
> What's the big deal about wearing a ring? If you get your hand so close to a
> moving part that you're in danger of snagging your ring on it, you have your
> hand too damn close to it anyway, ring or not.
This goes back to my high school days with a warning, and shop rule, about
wearing jewellery in the shop. Seems my teacher had seen an operator try to
slow down a drill press or milling machine with his hand. The ring was caught
and tore the ring off. The operator didn't even know he lost a finger until it
was seen on the floor. As for a table saw, you are probably right. But why
take the chance?
As for SWMBO, explain.
: "The only person sure of himself is the man who wishes to
: leave things as they are, and he dreams of an impossibility"
: -- George M. Wrong.
:
: Angelo Castellano emails - statsone@sympatico dot gov
: gov to be replaced with ca
: www.reliable-quality.com
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On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 18:52:57 GMT, Tim Carver <[email protected]>
wrote:
>On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 09:30:11 -0800, Tim Douglass
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>>Essentially that same thing happened to a friend of mine in college.
>>He was climbing in (or maybe out) of a second-floor dorm room window,
>>when he slipped and grabbed at the window ledge. He caught his wedding
>>ring on the aluminum track of the sliding window and pretty much
>>skinned his finger to the bone. It was a very ugly mess and I'm not
>>sure he ever regained full use of that finger.
>>
>
>You have a friend who was a married man, injured while climbing thru a
>dorm room window while he was in college?
>
>Sorry about his finger, but I'm certain that it would be pertinent to
>the safety discussion for us to know a little more about how this came
>about :-)
We attended college in Spokane, WA. His wife attended college in
Denver, CO (IIRC). Guys lived on the ground floor, girls on the second
floor. Beyond all that I really don't have any idea what was going
on... ;-)
Tim Douglass
http://www.DouglassClan.com
Silvan,
That is why my glasses (to see) have polycarbonate lenses just in
case. My son (rug rat) also has polycarbonate lenses in his glasses.
Adds very little to the cost of the glasses, but worth it.
Andy
On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 02:27:26 -0500, Silvan
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Along with my lathe, I got one of those $11 full face shield thingies. I
>LOVE it. Why have I been wearing safey glasses all these years? Safety
>glasses SUCK.
>
>Sure, stuff could still get under this too, but it's a lot less likely.
"As good as a 20-year-old" really doesn't mean anything. When I was 20
I already had tinnitus.
What gets me are those kids cruising with 300+ amps pushing out bass
in the confines of a shut up car. You know the ones -- the ones you
can hear over your running table saw when they drive by. Can you
imagine their hearing when they start griping about their kids' bad
habits??
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 20:10:43 GMT, Phisherman <[email protected]> wrote:
>I heard about wearing rings and hazards. Some shops just don't allow
>them. I'm 49 and had my hearing tested. I was surprised to hear my
>hearing is as good as a 20-year-old. I do wear earmuffs in the shop
>(some of the time) and when mowing the lawn. It would be nice if my
>eyes were as good as my ears. I use a jeweler's loupe to remove
>splinters.
Jim K writes:
>"As good as a 20-year-old" really doesn't mean anything. When I was 20
>I already had tinnitus.
Mine started the year before I was 20.
>What gets me are those kids cruising with 300+ amps pushing out bass
>in the confines of a shut up car. You know the ones -- the ones you
>can hear over your running table saw when they drive by. Can you
>imagine their hearing when they start griping about their kids' bad
>habits??
I don't get upset out of consideration for the little turds who drive those
things. But my youngest did tell me some time ago that a lot of them drive with
ear plugs in.
Makes sense to them, I guess. I've got a small subwoofer on this computer that
I hardly ever use. It is louder downstairs, thgouh the floor, than it is here,
3' away. Not an essential ingredient. I'd probably never use it if I hadn't
paid extra for it for some reason I no longer recall.
Charlie Self
If God had wanted me to touch my toes he would have put them higher on my body.
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Charlie Self wrote:
> Jim K writes:
>
>
>>"As good as a 20-year-old" really doesn't mean anything. When I was 20
>>I already had tinnitus.
>
>
> Mine started the year before I was 20.
I've had tinnitus so long I don't remember not having it.
Probably my late teens or early twenties. It's just gotten
much worse lately.
Does the sound of your own voice make your ears ring?
Sometimes mine does.
Bought a set of Leight muffs last week. 31 dB noise
reduction. Though I have a box of plugs here I find it
inconvenient when I may run a machine once or twice an hour.
Plugs in, plugs out, plugs in ..... irritates the hell out
of my ears.
Plus the muff keeps my ears nice and warm when it gets below
freezing.
--
Mark
N.E. Ohio
Never argue with a fool, a bystander can't tell you apart.
(S. Clemens, A.K.A. Mark Twain)
When in doubt hit the throttle. It may not help but it sure
ends the suspense. (Gaz, r.moto)
> That's why I don't try to stop moving machinery with my left hand. :)
>
> Being aware of the ring and actively working to protect it from harm is
IMHO
> sufficient to avoid catching it on anything. I don't want to get it
> scraped up. It belonged to my great grandfather.
>
> Good argument for taking it off, granted, but I always lose track of it
when
> I do. It and a watch are the only jewlry I ever need.
Same here (well, except that the ring doesn't have that much sentimental
value). I always take my ring off, pop it onto my watch band, re-do the
watch band, and put the pair of them on top of the microwave in the kitchen
(right on the path to the gara^H^H^H^Hshop). Same thing I do in the shower,
at night, and any other time I don't want to wear them (excepting that they
might be on the headboard or sink, instead). Keeping a pattern -- and
attaching the ring to something else! -- prevents it's loss.
--randy
Angelo Castellano posting wrote:
> situation about shop safety. My ring is too big and haven't worn it in
> years. I'll resize it someday.
Wow. Wish I had problems like that. I had mine resized, resized, then had
to get a new one. Because it kept getting too small. I didn't realize
gold would shrink like that, but that *must* be why it kept getting tighter
and tighter.
My college ring is very tight, and my high school ring is the tighest of
them all.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
Doug Miller wrote:
> You really should pay a bit more attention to posts before you
> respond to
> them. I never advocated leaving obvious safety hazards in place, and
> for you
> to conclude that I would, is quite a stretch of the imagination.
Not trying to pick a fight, or insult, or engage in a long subthread. <g>
IME wearing a ring in the shop *is* a safety hazard. If you don't agree,
fine. I hope you never have to wish you had not had it on. It's really
un-fun getting a ring off when the skin is no longer continuous under it.
-- Mark
On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:35:59 GMT, "Upscale" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Why did you not just snip or cut one section of the ring and widen it to get
>it off? I can't remember why it happened, but I remember crushing my ring
>one day. Used a pair of tin snips to cut the thin part, spread it and had it
>off easily. It was fairly cheap (e.g. $15) to have it repaired at the
>jewellers.
Gotta tell you all about our Shipping supervisor's encounter with ring
removal:
The fellow said he was replacing his wedding ring, which was too small, after
being mounted on his finger for 22 years. Couldn't twist, pry, soap or grease
it off, so he decided to cut it away.
He jams a pencil underneath the ring to stand it off his finger....and reaches
for his Dremel with one of those abrasive wheels mounted on it.
Me: "What about the heat....?"
Him: "Wait. I'm getting to that."
So he proceeds to slice through the ring, and given gold's excellent
conduction of heat, breaks through at the same instant the heat really begins to
burn his finger. This generates a reaction in which he places his hand in his
mouth to assist in cooling. Of course, saliva and moist skin are relatively
poor heat conductors, and the poor fellow burns the tip of his tongue and lower
lip. Made some interesting marks on his face, I can assure you, however, there
was more. As the ring was cut, internal stresses in the metal caused the band
to contrict tightly around his finger, still in the "very GD hot" stage. He
suffered 2nd degree burns on the root of his ring finger, which looked pretty
ugly a week afterwards.
This is one of those things that tickle your funny bone before moving on to
the sympathy zone.
My boss once said "You can find sympathy in the dictionary between
sh*t and syphillis."
Tom Flyer
--={Flyer}=-- wrote:
> reaches
> for his Dremel with one of those abrasive wheels mounted on it.
Gack!
I had to cut Dad's ring off because it was causing him pain. I used an
Xacto razor saw to get most of it, then cut through with tin snips. Worked
fine.
Tell your boss to try my way next time. :)
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
Tim Carver wrote:
>
> On the other hand (couldn't resist :-)) I can imagine cases where
> wearing a ring in the shop would be dangerous. My brother was a
> welder and maintenance supervisor at International Harvester. Nobody
> wore rings in his department. This may be a myth, but they were told
> that there had been an instance of a guy falling off of a steel
> I-beam, catching his ring on the edge as he tried to grab the beam to
> save himself, and having the skin completely ripped off of his ring
> finger as his entire body weight hung from the ring caught on the
> beam. Nobody was quite sure if this was true, but they all chose
> to not wear rings, because it seemed like something that could
> actually happen to even a reasonably careful person. This is very
> unlike the ring-around-the-tablesaw question, which requires several
> concurrent stupid decisions in order for an accident to occur.
>
I'm a mechanic.
I went to Vocational school, I've worked on Uncle Sugars
Nuclear Missiles, and earned my A&P. The machinery I've
worked on is used on earth, sea, sky and outer space.
Compared to some equipment I've worked on, the nastiest
machine in your home shop is pretty pussy.
Woodworking is a past time for me but the safety rules still
hold: No adornment of any type while working. No rings,
chains or watches.
From my point of view it's funny as hell to read dumbasses
justifications for wearing jewelry around machinery. Bottom
line is, if you wear a ring in the shop your a Pollyanna.
Everyone has brain farts.
It's been three days since my right eye's been right. Seems
I got a piece of metal stuck in it from grinding. I was
installing outlets in the ceiling for my shop lights. I
needed to move one but I had ring shanked it to the truss
and the easiest way to get it off was with my die grinder.
I put on the safety glasses and ear muffs. I ground off the
heads making sure the sparks didn't go near anything
valuable, especially myself.
Later, while washing up in the shower, I get this pain in my
right eye. I figured it was soap. The next day it was a bit
scratchy but I couldn't see anything in the eye. WTF???
It was a bit of dark gray grinding bur in my cornea. Somehow
this ball got lodged in my eye *after* I was done using the
grinder. I think it got washed there in the shower.
(hospital story omitted)
Went to the opthamologist. Real freaky listening to a needle
twang while their picking at your eyeball.
I submit this story to illustrate how one can follow safety
procedures and still get bit.
So go ahead, wear your rings, work safely and if you get bit
tell us why it shouldn't have happened.
--
Mark
N.E. Ohio
Never argue with a fool, a bystander can't tell you apart.
(S. Clemens, A.K.A. Mark Twain)
When in doubt hit the throttle. It may not help but it sure
ends the suspense. (Gaz, r.moto)
Mark wrote:
> I submit this story to illustrate how one can follow safety
> procedures and still get bit.
Safety glasses still let stuff get in your eyes, in my experience. I caught
a rock in the eye while weed eating. Went right up at just the right angle
to slip under the glasses and wing me in the eye. Scratched my cornea.
There was nothing inappropriate about the glasses I was wearing, and the
opthamologist didn't bless me out for poor safety practices. It's just
that they don't really work that well. Goggles are much better at keeping
stuff out, but they fog so bad you might as well just put on blinders, and
stuff can still make it through the little holes.
Along with my lathe, I got one of those $11 full face shield thingies. I
LOVE it. Why have I been wearing safey glasses all these years? Safety
glasses SUCK.
Sure, stuff could still get under this too, but it's a lot less likely.
I've got two so far. One for me, one for one of the kids. I want to pick
up two more, so I can have one dedicated for weed eating, and one for the
other rug rat. They're awesome, and quite reasonably priced IMHO.
I was convinced of this the first time a piece came apart and bounced
harmlessly off of the piece of clear plastic in front of my mouth full of
expensive-to-replace teeth. :)
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
[email protected] (hex) writes:
[...]
> left to be removed. There are still some systems used in various
> particle and nuclear physics experiments that have a similar feature
> 300A @ 5V supplies with the terminals spaced about 1cm apart -- scary.
but not *so* easy to touch, and at least here at CERN you are supposed
to add a wrning sign "Danger, extra low voltage". But if you consider
the dangers of an ordinary power cable: If you touch a loose end with
your bare finger you will get a small burn (maybe) and jerk it away,
but the ring might cause the short-circuit current to flow, which can
easily reach a few thousand amps before the breaker kicks in.
>
> It's easier to take the ring off for WW before the accident than
> after. That act, however, does not recuse one from being careful.
Much better not to wear any rings or oher jewelry at all, since danger
lurks everywhere and bites often when least expected, and the jewelry
never helps you: If you are beautiful by yourself it only distracts,
if not it only makes you attractive to thieves...
--
Dr. Juergen Hannappel http://lisa2.physik.uni-bonn.de/~hannappe
mailto:[email protected] Phone: +49 228 73 2447 FAX ... 7869
Physikalisches Institut der Uni Bonn Nussallee 12, D-53115 Bonn, Germany
CERN: Phone: +412276 76461 Fax: ..77930 Bat. 892-R-A13 CH-1211 Geneve 23
[email protected] (Geoff) writes:
> I had a scary moment with my wedding ring on the back deck a few weeks
> ago. I was working with MDF and I knew I was wearing the expensive,
> titanium wedding ring when I started. Then 6 hours later, I wasn't
That's the second time i hear that titanium wedding rings are extra
expensive. Why? The material cannot be the reason, you get it (at 90%
purity) for 37 CHF per Kg....
--
Dr. Juergen Hannappel http://lisa2.physik.uni-bonn.de/~hannappe
mailto:[email protected] Phone: +49 228 73 2447 FAX ... 7869
Physikalisches Institut der Uni Bonn Nussallee 12, D-53115 Bonn, Germany
CERN: Phone: +412276 76461 Fax: ..77930 Bat. 892-R-A13 CH-1211 Geneve 23
P.S.
> Perhaps I'm more "attached" to my fingers than others. I'm a piano
> player and 75+ WPM typist. I'd rather lose a leg (I think) than a
> finger.
The overwhelming majority of my income the past 20 years has come from my
ability to type computer programs and documentation. I really want/need to
keep all 10 fingers!
-- Mark