Greetings All...
I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
flea markets?
Thanks for your help.
William Lohr
> You can buy new made in USA from prairie tool company at
> www.prairietool.com. Their low end grinder is $36. You can get what's
> called a railroad grinder for $120. They also have hand turned water wheel
> grinders with 10 x 1 1/2 inch wheels for $124. I think they've been
> building these things the same way since 1920 or so. I've heard this is the
> brand used at the college of the Redwoods school.
We distributed Prairie Tool products for nearly twenty years. They
stopped delivering and replying to phone calls and faxes about a year or
so ago. If you get through - have them call me please.
Robert Larson
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:49:49 GMT, "Bob" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>He's a big proponent of using hand cranked because you cannot burn a blade
>using one.
Good result, but there's more than one way to achieve it. A slow, wet
wheel won't burn either.
>As to the quality, I also disagree with you. Its one of those "it depends"
>things.
I've never seen one of these that had a wheel I'd regard as usable for
anything more than crude sharpening. If that's all you need, then go
for it - but you'll be spending time with the 1000 grit waterstone (or
local equivalent) afterwards, and you might as well start with that.
I don't have one of these things, but there are two up at my Dad's.
One is old and worn, the other is older (WW2) but was brand new and
boxed until we opened it. Neither has a wheel that's much good.
>A modern motorized water grinder is great - if you want to spend $300.
I'm no fan of the Tormek, because I think it's a ridiculous price and
the wheels aren't very good. I've got a Record (rebadged Scan) that's
about $75 and there are any number of $150 twin-wheel machines with
fast and slow ends.
--
Inbreeding - nature's way of always giving you enough fingers to count your cousins
Many thanks to all who replied so quickly...
I have not been to the prairie site yet, but am about to. I will keep
my eye on ebay as well. It was indeed Krenov's comments that planted
the first seed for this idea, and then when I saw one in action, I
thought I would look further. I am finally at a point where getting
my own rig is a possibility.
To the person who asked, "Where in Asheville?" I was out at the
Biltmore Estates work sites. They had a blacksmith and woodworker
both in action near the stables.
To the person who asked if I was related to other the Lohr's, I do not
know. There are many Lohr's even around my area of Maryland, but I do
not think I am related to any of them.
Again, thank you! This is such a great group!
William
[email protected] (William) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
Bought one off eBay for $10 plus shipping.
http://www.lehmans.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=3961&itemType=PRODUCT&RS=1&keyword=sharpen
"William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
"Bob" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Watch ebay closely. They are all over the place. Search for "hand
> grinder". But you play poker. Average selling price is about $10.
> Ask the seller if it runs smooth and if it will take 6" wheel. Some of
> the oldies only take a 4" wheel.
>
> I've seen them go as low as $4. Shipping will run $8 to $13. I just
> bought a Railroad grinder on ebay for $22 and shipping was $20. It
> weighs about 25 lbs and is an impressive machine. These don't show up
> very often.
>
> You can buy new made in USA from prairie tool company at
> www.prairietool.com. Their low end grinder is $36. You can get
> what's called a railroad grinder for $120. They also have hand turned
> water wheel grinders with 10 x 1 1/2 inch wheels for $124. I think
> they've been building these things the same way since 1920 or so.
> I've heard this is the brand used at the college of the Redwoods
> school.
Great link, thanks!! Tormek at 1/4th or less of the price.
"Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've never seen one of these that had a wheel I'd regard as usable for
> anything more than crude sharpening. If that's all you need, then go
> for it - but you'll be spending time with the 1000 grit waterstone (or
> local equivalent) afterwards, and you might as well start with that.
You must use a different approach to sharpening than I do. I use a grinder
to put a hollow ground, square shape to the edge, not for actual sharpening.
I always use the stones to do the actual bevel, which begins with a
1000-1200 grit waterstone. Tonight I completely reground a plane edge using
the hand grinder. After that, it took about 6-7 minutes with the water
stones.
> I don't have one of these things, but there are two up at my Dad's.
> One is old and worn, the other is older (WW2) but was brand new and
> boxed until we opened it. Neither has a wheel that's much good.
Agreed, many of the old grinders did not handle a decent size wheel either.
A wheel is pretty cheap to change out.
> the wheels aren't very good. I've got a Record (rebadged Scan) that's
> about $75 and there are any number of $150 twin-wheel machines with
> fast and slow ends.
When you say fast/slow ends, do you mean 3450/1750? When/where did you get
the Record for $75? I haven't seen anything like that in current markets.
Bob
> The 23-700 seems to be a well-kept secret. I never hear about it, but it
> certainly looks like a good value proposition. Its sort of a contraption,
> with one small motor driving two wheels are radically different speeds. Do
> you have any experience with it?
> Bob
>
>
Nope, no experience. I just knew about it and had seen a price. But I rather prefer
the 23-710, flat laying disc, and it's blade holder looks substantial. I'd rather not
go with a hollow grind like the 23-700 and the Tormek will give. Pretty cool
gearing layout too!
Alex
"AAvK" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:9Z_ed.43682$bk1.9969@fed1read05...
>
> > A modern motorized water grinder is great - if you want to spend $300.
> >
> >
> There is the Delta 23-700 with a fat 5" grinder wheel and a 10" upright
wet wheel for around $170
> or less. They also make the 23-710 with a fat 5" grinder wheel and an 8"
flat lying wet wheel for ...
> I don't know how much.
The 23-700 seems to be a well-kept secret. I never hear about it, but it
certainly looks like a good value proposition. Its sort of a contraption,
with one small motor driving two wheels are radically different speeds. Do
you have any experience with it?
Bob
Gotta disagree with you Andy. Krenov would also strongly disagree with you.
He's a big proponent of using hand cranked because you cannot burn a blade
using one. He devotes a few pages in his book to it and he grinds all his
chisels and plane irons on one.
As to the quality, I also disagree with you. Its one of those "it depends"
things. I bought one from ebay (Chiness clone?) that was junk and returned
it to the seller. I just bought another one that is as fine a machine as
you'll find anywhere. Its called Railroad grinder and sports a 7 1/2" wheel
running on a one inch arbor. I got it for $22 on ebay.
A modern motorized water grinder is great - if you want to spend $300.
Bob
"Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 24 Oct 2004 15:57:38 -0700, [email protected] (William) wrote:
>
> >Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> >flea markets?
>
> Do yourself a favour; get a modern motorised and water-cooled slow
> wheel. These old hand-cranked wheels just aren't much good for any
> woodworking tool with a better edge on it than an axe. The stones are
> coarse, the bearings aren't very smooth and hand-cranking it with one
> hand isn't the best way to control the edge.
>
> If you can find a 2' diameter treadle wheel in a water trough, then
> you might be onto a winner. The 9" dry wheels though - best avoided,
> IMHO.
>
> --
> Smert' spamionam
Yes. That's the one. Thanks, I new somebody had that link.
"Bob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Watch ebay closely. They are all over the place. Search for "hand
grinder".
> But you play poker. Average selling price is about $10. Ask the seller
if
> it runs smooth and if it will take 6" wheel. Some of the oldies only take
a
> 4" wheel.
>
> I've seen them go as low as $4. Shipping will run $8 to $13. I just
bought
> a Railroad grinder on ebay for $22 and shipping was $20. It weighs about
25
> lbs and is an impressive machine. These don't show up very often.
>
> You can buy new made in USA from prairie tool company at
> www.prairietool.com. Their low end grinder is $36. You can get what's
> called a railroad grinder for $120. They also have hand turned water wheel
> grinders with 10 x 1 1/2 inch wheels for $124. I think they've been
> building these things the same way since 1920 or so. I've heard this is
the
> brand used at the college of the Redwoods school.
>
> If you get one of these and want to put a nice Norton white aluminum oxide
> wheel on it, you may have to buy a shaft adaptor bushing. Many of the
hand
> grinders have a 3/8" arbor (smaller than average). The one I bought has a
> 1" arbor (bigger than average).
>
> Bob
>
>
> "William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Greetings All...
> >
> > I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> > there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> > they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> > However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
> >
> > Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> > flea markets?
> >
> > Thanks for your help.
> >
> > William Lohr
>
>
Looks like you are getting no help. High quality hand crank grinders are
still made. Someone posted a link to a place selling them some time ago.
Unfortunately, I didn't save it. Maybe someone who did will come forward.
"William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
[email protected] (William) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
Lehmans has one
http://www.lehmans.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=3961&itemType=PRODUCT&RS=1&keyword=sharpening
On 24 Oct 2004 15:57:38 -0700, [email protected] (William) wrote:
>Greetings All...
>
>I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
>there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
>they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
>However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
>Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
>flea markets?
>
>Thanks for your help.
>
>William Lohr
ebay.
are you a Lohr of the Lennox Lohr clan?
Bridger
Ever notice that the arbor has a nut on it? That is so you can change the
wheel. I suppose you throw grinders out when the wheel gets worn.
"Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:49:49 GMT, "Bob" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >He's a big proponent of using hand cranked because you cannot burn a
blade
> >using one.
>
> Good result, but there's more than one way to achieve it. A slow, wet
> wheel won't burn either.
>
> >As to the quality, I also disagree with you. Its one of those "it
depends"
> >things.
>
> I've never seen one of these that had a wheel I'd regard as usable for
> anything more than crude sharpening. If that's all you need, then go
> for it - but you'll be spending time with the 1000 grit waterstone (or
> local equivalent) afterwards, and you might as well start with that.
>
> I don't have one of these things, but there are two up at my Dad's.
> One is old and worn, the other is older (WW2) but was brand new and
> boxed until we opened it. Neither has a wheel that's much good.
>
> >A modern motorized water grinder is great - if you want to spend $300.
>
> I'm no fan of the Tormek, because I think it's a ridiculous price and
> the wheels aren't very good. I've got a Record (rebadged Scan) that's
> about $75 and there are any number of $150 twin-wheel machines with
> fast and slow ends.
> --
> Inbreeding - nature's way of always giving you enough fingers to count
your cousins
"Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 05:14:14 GMT, "Bob" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >You must use a different approach to sharpening than I do. I use a
grinder
> >to put a hollow ground, square shape to the edge, not for actual
sharpening.
>
> So how often do you need to do that ? I might well do it once to
> resurrect an eBay special, but I don't need to do it for daily
> sharpening.
Oh no, not daily! Hopefully only once or twice a year or when I slide my
plane across a brad (ouch!). How often do you use the water grinder?
> >A wheel is pretty cheap to change out.
>
> But what to ? Choice is pretty limited.
> These are 9" grinders and
> I've got good 9" synthetic waterstones that need water, but haven't
> seen anything useful as a dry stone. There's probably something out
> there, but not in the "cheap and easily found" category -- if I have
> to pay specialist prices, or rig up a water trough, then I've lost the
> price benefit of the hand grinder.
I'm not sure I understand. It appears you have ruled out dry grinding
altogether, so yes that does limit the choice. I certainly don't propose
trying to convert a hand grinder to a water grinder. For dry grinding,
Norton Abrasives has a full range of choices in sizes and grits. Cost is
about $20-$25.
> This sort of thing:
> http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=21264&recno=6
> http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=21739&recno=4
Ah... That's virtually identical to Delta model 73-700 which someone
mentioned. I don't think they are well publicized in the US. I never see
them in any of the stores. Odd.
>
> > When/where did you get the Record for $75?
>
> It was a bit more than $75 - £50, whatever that turns into these days.
> They make a couple of models, this is the small single wheel machine,
> not the one with the little honing roller. It hollow grounds like
> crazy as the wheel is so small, but then I'm only using it for initial
> shaping and I can take the hollow out by hand later on.
I don't think its available in the USA, at least not readily.
Bob
Watch ebay closely. They are all over the place. Search for "hand grinder".
But you play poker. Average selling price is about $10. Ask the seller if
it runs smooth and if it will take 6" wheel. Some of the oldies only take a
4" wheel.
I've seen them go as low as $4. Shipping will run $8 to $13. I just bought
a Railroad grinder on ebay for $22 and shipping was $20. It weighs about 25
lbs and is an impressive machine. These don't show up very often.
You can buy new made in USA from prairie tool company at
www.prairietool.com. Their low end grinder is $36. You can get what's
called a railroad grinder for $120. They also have hand turned water wheel
grinders with 10 x 1 1/2 inch wheels for $124. I think they've been
building these things the same way since 1920 or so. I've heard this is the
brand used at the college of the Redwoods school.
If you get one of these and want to put a nice Norton white aluminum oxide
wheel on it, you may have to buy a shaft adaptor bushing. Many of the hand
grinders have a 3/8" arbor (smaller than average). The one I bought has a
1" arbor (bigger than average).
Bob
"William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 10:58:18 GMT, "Bob" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>Hopefully only once or twice a year or when I slide my
>plane across a brad (ouch!).
I don't grind nail-strikes out of my plane irons. The bench planes
don't meet nails, the toolbag planes and the coarse scrub don't care.
>How often do you use the water grinder?
Whenever I buy a new bagful of old tools - every couple of weeks.
--
Smert' spamionam
Might I ask what woodworkers shop in Asheville you are referring to? I live
near Asheville.
David Merrill
"William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 05:14:14 GMT, "Bob" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>You must use a different approach to sharpening than I do. I use a grinder
>to put a hollow ground, square shape to the edge, not for actual sharpening.
So how often do you need to do that ? I might well do it once to
resurrect an eBay special, but I don't need to do it for daily
sharpening.
>A wheel is pretty cheap to change out.
But what to ? Choice is pretty limited. These are 9" grinders and
I've got good 9" synthetic waterstones that need water, but haven't
seen anything useful as a dry stone. There's probably something out
there, but not in the "cheap and easily found" category -- if I have
to pay specialist prices, or rig up a water trough, then I've lost the
price benefit of the hand grinder.
>When you say fast/slow ends, do you mean 3450/1750?
This sort of thing:
http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=21264&recno=6
http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=21739&recno=4
They're a small 3000 rpm dry wheel at one end, about 150 on the large
wet wheel;
The 1500 machines are generally the Creusen "red" models, aimed at
woodturners. If you're doing a lot of HSS tools, these can be pretty
good.
> When/where did you get the Record for $75?
It was a bit more than $75 - £50, whatever that turns into these days.
They make a couple of models, this is the small single wheel machine,
not the one with the little honing roller. It hollow grounds like
crazy as the wheel is so small, but then I'm only using it for initial
shaping and I can take the hollow out by hand later on.
--
Smert' spamionam
On 24 Oct 2004 15:57:38 -0700, [email protected] (William) wrote:
>Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
>flea markets?
Do yourself a favour; get a modern motorised and water-cooled slow
wheel. These old hand-cranked wheels just aren't much good for any
woodworking tool with a better edge on it than an axe. The stones are
coarse, the bearings aren't very smooth and hand-cranking it with one
hand isn't the best way to control the edge.
If you can find a 2' diameter treadle wheel in a water trough, then
you might be onto a winner. The 9" dry wheels though - best avoided,
IMHO.
--
Smert' spamionam
Prarie looks like a neat place.
Here's a simple one, seems expensive compared to Prarie.
Wilson
http://www.lehmans.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=3961&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=677&iSubCat=836&iProductID=3961
"William" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings All...
>
> I was in Asheville, NC, this past week. In the woodworkers shop,
> there was a hand-cranked sharpening wheel. The fella using it said
> they were common to this day... another person standing by agreed.
> However, I am unable to locate one on the web.
>
> Do any of you know where I might get one other than digging through
> flea markets?
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> William Lohr