I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
Dry sand.
International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallon.
It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) but
it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and meant
for spraying.
I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
(the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
hours).
All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
:)
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
On Apr 17, 11:27 am, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Two...
> 1. seal the wood
> 2. to provide a very smooth, defect free surface for paint.
For paint, these are my two favorites:
http://www.zinsser.com/product_detail.asp?ProductID=10
I use this even under the high performance finishes. Actually, just
about under all my painted finishes. Goes on easy, sanding time is
short, and you can build up coats with it. I use it on kitchen
refinishes and have never had a problem. It lays out great and sands
cleanly.
The other would be the 10th one down here.
http://www.sherwin-williams.com/pro/sherwin_williams_paint/sherwin_williams_paints/primers/interior/
this might work better:
http://tinyurl.com/y7tlza9
It is the SW "Easy Sand". Good stuff if the wood isn't beat up and
not too dirty.
For really rough wood, I like to prime it with the one above the Easy
Sand, called the Pro Build. That stuff isn't like anything else on
the market, and why they don't market the daylights out of it I don't
know.
You can't spray it; it has to be rolled or brushed. It has so much
silica in it, it will fill oak tubules with just a couple of coats.
It dries fast, covers everything, sticks well..... I would think they
would look at it as a premier product.
It is NOT good for smooth surfaces though like birch, poplar, maple,
etc. It leaves the surface too rough and requires too much sanding to
get back to smooth.
As always, just my 0.02.
Robert
On Apr 17, 12:53=A0pm, Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:47:12 -0400, John Grossbohlin wrote:
> > If you are using a pigmented paint over it (or an oil based finish such
> > as polyurethane, boiled linseed oil, Tung oil, etc.) I'd suggest using
> > Plaster of Paris to fill the grain first, then prime and top coat. It's
> > cheap, fills open grain well, dries fast, sands easily (and disappears
> > with an oil finish). =A0Plaster of Paris was commonly used as a filler =
in
> > furniture factories in the past.
>
> Interesting. =A0I'd heard of using pumice with shellac although I haven't
> yet tried it. =A0Do you mix the plaster as you would for a normal use?
Some French polish techniques start by oiling the wood and
then sprinkling on a light dusting of pumice. The pumice abrades
the wood under the pad, thus creating a wood filler. I've found it
faster just to lay on a few heavy coats of shellac, then wet sand
with naptha and finish with a pad, no pumice, no oil, which has
to be spirited off. Open grained or curly woods look deeper when
you don't muddy them with an opaque paste.
"dadiOH" wrote:
> Two...
> 1. seal the wood
> 2. to provide a very smooth, defect free surface for paint.
------------------------------------------------
Couple of coats of 1/2 lb shellac followed by a coat of 2 lb
shellac.(Allow 24 hrs between coats).
Wait two weeks, then sand smooth with 220 grit, wipe with a tack rag
and paint.
A lot less cost than shooting epoxy high build primer at $100/gal.
Lew
On Apr 18, 8:02=A0am, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Father Haskell wrote:
> > On Apr 16, 3:08 pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to
> >> sand. Dry sand.
>
> >> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed
> >> to fill the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was
> >> $100+ per gallon. It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours
> >> (lots of xylol IIRC) but it is way too pricey. Auto body primer
> >> works but is lacquer based and meant for spraying.
>
> >> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it
> >> is water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than
> >> 24 hours (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in
> >> maybe 2-4 hours).
>
> >> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation
> >> counts
>
> > I've used shellac under lacquer with great results. =A0Straight
> > from the can, 3 lb cut, slop it on, wait a couple of hours, then
> > sand level. =A0This was on white oak, and the lacquer finished
> > dead flat, like a pane of glass.
>
> > One of the guitar making sites I read recommended drywall
> > mud (joint compound) under paint. =A0Also good under a clear
> > finish if you tint it with water based stain to match the wood
> > color.
>
> I use that (mud) sometimes, works well for smoothing and sanding but not =
for
> sealing. =A0Of course, the first topcoat seals it but the more topcoats I=
have
> to put on the more opportunities I have for messing up =A0:)
>
> --
>
> dadiOH
> ____________________________
>
> dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
> ...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
> LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
> Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
For sealing, nothing beats shellac.
On Apr 16, 1:08=A0pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand=
.
What is the reason for priming?
Are you putting a clear coat over it, or just paint?
Robert
On Apr 16, 2:08=A0pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand=
.
> Dry sand.
>
> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fil=
l
> the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallo=
n.
> It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) b=
ut
> it is way too pricey. =A0Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and =
meant
> for spraying.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hour=
s
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
>
> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
> :)
>
> --
>
> dadiOH
> ____________________________
>
> dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
> ...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
> LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
> Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico
Benjamin Moores Enamel Underbody [ oil] I would use it 1-2 coat and
sand with maybe 220-320, finish with Satin Impervo thinned with
Penetrol to the point it was just almost to thin and the finish looks
sprayed on, use Tack cloth and real good China brush. There might be
other sandable primers but this stuff sands fast as thats its purpose.
I have doors I can see myself in like a mirror that look great after
25 years. Only P&L Effecto and Moore Impervo line flow out perfectly,
and I tried everything sold here. The Penetrol makes it work, but
universal tints ruin the flowing out somewhat so factory powder pre
tinted is best, like White.
On 4/16/10 3:08 PM, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
> Dry sand.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
Have you tried shellac?
Robert Haar wrote:
> On 4/16/10 3:08 PM, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to
>> sand. Dry sand.
>>
>
>> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it
>> is water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than
>> 24 hours (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in
>> maybe 2-4 hours).
>
> Have you tried shellac?
That would sand well but I need it to fill as well. Maybe Zinsser's shellac
base primer? never used ot, don't know.
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
"dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
>Dry sand.
>
> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
> the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per
> gallon. It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol
> IIRC) but it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer
> based and meant for spraying.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
>
> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
If you are using a pigmented paint over it (or an oil based finish such as
polyurethane, boiled linseed oil, Tung oil, etc.) I'd suggest using Plaster
of Paris to fill the grain first, then prime and top coat. It's cheap, fills
open grain well, dries fast, sands easily (and disappears with an oil
finish). Plaster of Paris was commonly used as a filler in furniture
factories in the past. I've found it works great with white oak, red oak and
other open grained woods under an oil finish. I've also used it to smooth
out construction grade BC plywood before painting where the finish was sort
of important... a rare situation but it worked fine.
John
PS, It's also better than glue and sawdust for fixing gaps in dovetailing
when an oil finish is planned...
"dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
>Dry sand.
>
> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
> the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per
> gallon. It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol
> IIRC) but it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer
> based and meant for spraying.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
>
> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
> :)
>
> --
>
> dadiOH
> ____________________________
>
> dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
> ...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
> LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
> Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
>
>
I use sanding sealer. Mineral sprits type, not lacquer type. Some times 2
coats and sanding between coats.>ww
[email protected] wrote:
> On Apr 16, 1:08 pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to
>> sand.
>
> What is the reason for priming?
Two...
1. seal the wood
2. to provide a very smooth, defect free surface for paint.
> Are you putting a clear coat over it, or just paint?
>
> Robert
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
On Apr 16, 3:08=A0pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand=
.
> Dry sand.
>
> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fil=
l
> the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallo=
n.
> It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) b=
ut
> it is way too pricey. =A0Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and =
meant
> for spraying.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hour=
s
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
>
> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
I've used shellac under lacquer with great results. Straight
from the can, 3 lb cut, slop it on, wait a couple of hours, then
sand level. This was on white oak, and the lacquer finished
dead flat, like a pane of glass.
One of the guitar making sites I read recommended drywall
mud (joint compound) under paint. Also good under a clear
finish if you tint it with water based stain to match the wood
color.
[email protected] wrote:
> On Apr 17, 11:27 am, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Two...
>> 1. seal the wood
>> 2. to provide a very smooth, defect free surface for paint.
>
> For paint, these are my two favorites:
>
> http://www.zinsser.com/product_detail.asp?ProductID=10
>
> I use this even under the high performance finishes. Actually, just
> about under all my painted finishes. Goes on easy, sanding time is
> short, and you can build up coats with it. I use it on kitchen
> refinishes and have never had a problem. It lays out great and sands
> cleanly.
>
> The other would be the 10th one down here.
>
> http://www.sherwin-williams.com/pro/sherwin_williams_paint/sherwin_williams_paints/primers/interior/
> It is the SW "Easy Sand". Good stuff if the wood isn't beat up and
> not too dirty.
Bingo. The product data for it sounds much like the International I used to
use. I suspect the shellac base Zinsser would serve too. Or plain shellac
+ pumice (or whiting).
Many thanks to you and all others forthe input.
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
On 4/16/10 3:08 PM, dadiOH wrote:
> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
> Dry sand.
>
> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
> the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallon.
> It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) but
> it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and meant
> for spraying.
>
> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
> water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
> (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
> hours).
>
> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
> :)
>
What kind of cherry are you priming?
;-)
--
Froz...
The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:47:12 -0400, John Grossbohlin wrote:
> If you are using a pigmented paint over it (or an oil based finish such
> as polyurethane, boiled linseed oil, Tung oil, etc.) I'd suggest using
> Plaster of Paris to fill the grain first, then prime and top coat. It's
> cheap, fills open grain well, dries fast, sands easily (and disappears
> with an oil finish). Plaster of Paris was commonly used as a filler in
> furniture factories in the past.
Interesting. I'd heard of using pumice with shellac although I haven't
yet tried it. Do you mix the plaster as you would for a normal use?
--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw
On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 15:08:51 -0400, the infamous "dadiOH"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
>Dry sand.
>
>International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
>the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallon.
>It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) but
>it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and meant
>for spraying.
Oh my Crom! Priming mahogany? Thats a mortal sin, innit?
>I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
>water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
>(the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
>hours).
What are you doing?
>All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
>:)
I recommend Waterlox Original Sealer Finish, and nothing else. Medium
sheen is my fave, and I still steelwool/wax it later. It's an oil
based, quick-drying finish. Rubbed, it's dry in half an hour, say I.
Brushed, it's sandable-dry in 8 hours, says Waterlox. 26.3% solids.
(Satin 28.1% solids) http://fwd4.me/84E
I haven't tried their TB3809 Marine Sealer (for use with their TB3940
Marine Finish), but it has 26% solids.
http://www.waterlox.com/Portals/Documents/product_specs.pdf
---
A book burrows into your life in a very profound way
because the experience of reading is not passive.
--Erica Jong
"Larry Blanchard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 18:47:12 -0400, John Grossbohlin wrote:
>
>> If you are using a pigmented paint over it (or an oil based finish such
>> as polyurethane, boiled linseed oil, Tung oil, etc.) I'd suggest using
>> Plaster of Paris to fill the grain first, then prime and top coat. It's
>> cheap, fills open grain well, dries fast, sands easily (and disappears
>> with an oil finish). Plaster of Paris was commonly used as a filler in
>> furniture factories in the past.
>
> Interesting. I'd heard of using pumice with shellac although I haven't
> yet tried it. Do you mix the plaster as you would for a normal use?
Yup... mix it as usual or a bit looser. Spread it with a taping knife or
plastic bondo spaltula and push it into the surface to insure a good fill...
It dries fast and then you can sand it off.
Pumice does work with shellac. My last piece, that I had at Woodworkers
Showcase, was a shellaced knitting chest made from white oak and walnut. The
grain was filled with pumice.
John
On Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:27:22 -0400, the infamous "dadiOH"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>[email protected] wrote:
>> On Apr 16, 1:08 pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to
>>> sand.
>>
>> What is the reason for priming?
>
>Two...
> 1. seal the wood
> 2. to provide a very smooth, defect free surface for paint.
If it's a small amount you need to fill, the blue (well, it was blue
back in the late '80s) 3M sandable putty works really, really well.
http://fwd4.me/8dT They appear to have a whole lot more to offer
nowadays, including flowables.
---
A book burrows into your life in a very profound way
because the experience of reading is not passive.
--Erica Jong
Father Haskell wrote:
> On Apr 16, 3:08 pm, "dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to
>> sand. Dry sand.
>>
>> International makes/used to make one that was originally developed
>> to fill the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was
>> $100+ per gallon. It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours
>> (lots of xylol IIRC) but it is way too pricey. Auto body primer
>> works but is lacquer based and meant for spraying.
>>
>> I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it
>> is water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than
>> 24 hours (the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in
>> maybe 2-4 hours).
>>
>> All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation
>> counts
>
> I've used shellac under lacquer with great results. Straight
> from the can, 3 lb cut, slop it on, wait a couple of hours, then
> sand level. This was on white oak, and the lacquer finished
> dead flat, like a pane of glass.
>
> One of the guitar making sites I read recommended drywall
> mud (joint compound) under paint. Also good under a clear
> finish if you tint it with water based stain to match the wood
> color.
I use that (mud) sometimes, works well for smoothing and sanding but not for
sealing. Of course, the first topcoat seals it but the more topcoats I have
to put on the more opportunities I have for messing up :)
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 15:08:51 -0400, "dadiOH" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>I need a primer that sticks well (wood) and is exceptionally easy to sand.
>Dry sand.
>
>International makes/used to make one that was originally developed to fill
>the grain on Phillipine mahogany but last I looked it was $100+ per gallon.
>It was wonderful, dried ready to sand in 2-4 hours (lots of xylol IIRC) but
>it is way too pricey. Auto body primer works but is lacquer based and meant
>for spraying.
>
>I need something that can be brushed and/or rolled, don't care if it is
>water or oil base as long as it can be dry sanded in no more than 24 hours
>(the International dried in an hour or so, easily sanded in maybe 2-4
>hours).
>
>All suggestions welcome, actual experience with the recommendation counts
>:)
Sherwin Williams has a very good primer formulated specfically for
bare wood. It dries slowly (you will need to wait one day), oil
based, very good quality.