Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. Back then, more so
non-Fords than Fords, they built a wood frame and nailed the sheet metal
to it. With Chevy, I guess what ever the best deals they got in bulk
product, they used. Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason
I would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade
ply and gluing up what I need? The main idea here is cost savings.
Complete wood kits are available but cost $2000-3000. Any other
suggestions??
Here is what I'm starting with: http://www.bunchobikes.com/my1929chevy.htm
Here are some shots of someone else's project with a wood kit installed:
http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929h.jpg
http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929i.jpg
http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929j.jpg
If you want a nice Ford flathead V8 for that project, give me a shout. I've
got a couple five engines and trannys under a thin layer of sawdust in my
shop.
"Mark and Kim Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. Back then, more so
> non-Fords than Fords, they built a wood frame and nailed the sheet metal
> to it. With Chevy, I guess what ever the best deals they got in bulk
> product, they used. Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason I
> would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade ply
> and gluing up what I need? The main idea here is cost savings. Complete
> wood kits are available but cost $2000-3000. Any other suggestions??
>
> Here is what I'm starting with:
> http://www.bunchobikes.com/my1929chevy.htm
>
> Here are some shots of someone else's project with a wood kit installed:
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929h.jpg
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929i.jpg
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929j.jpg
Thu, Nov 10, 2005, 3:11am [email protected]
(Mark=A0and=A0Kim=A0Smith) doth sayeth:
Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. <snip> Any other
suggestions?? <snip>
You've got a truck, not a car; and wood was pretty standard for any
vehicle back then. Unless your're going for a complete restoration, I'd
say steel tubing, not wood.
http://www.users.bigpond.com/glenn_percy/body_assembly.htm I've seen it
done, it ain't rocket sicience.
JOAT
If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
- Red Green
On 10 Nov 2005 03:11:06 EST, Mark and Kim Smith <[email protected]>
wrote:
>Got myself an old car. [...] Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason
>I would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade
>ply and gluing up what I need?
Aren't these always ash ? Every one (mainly MGs) that I've worked on
has been. There are a lot of curves in there and I'd hate to try making
the shapes from plywood. That said, the originals did use a lot of
plywood for the flat invisible parts, such as door skins or under a
rear-mounted petrol tank.
Besides which, good ash is cheaper than mediocre plywood.
On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 16:24:30 -0500, LP <[email protected]> wrote:
>The hardest part was developing patterns for the parts,
It's generally agreed that with the kits you're paying half for the
timber and half for the pattern. Most people who find themselves needing
a woodwork kit don't have enough of the original surviving to use it as
a pattern. The best kits are measured up off a good survivor, not a
rotten reconstruction.
if you do have a car in need of such a restoration, it's vital to make
working drawings of the body and especially of the mortice and tenon
joints _before_ you dismantle the shell, or even before you lift it off
the chassis (which is usually all that's holding it together). If you
can get the "frame" dimensions then you can build a square-edged body
skeleton and then shape the curves to suit. If you take the wooden
parts apart then you might be able to copy the curves of individual
pieces, but you'll never be able to reconstruct the overall shape or the
joinery between the pieces.
Mike Marlow wrote:
> <snip>
>
>You could use plywood for most of this stuff. You'd want a really good
>adhesive because in order to use ply, you'd have nail into the ply layers
>and that's not a good idea. I'm not so sure that you'd save a lot of money
>over hardwood though. The components you show in the pictures are not all
>that complex and could well be produced out of ash. It might pay to look
>around for rough cut hardwood prices in your area. If you don't have the
>tools to work the wood (and we're not talking fine cabinetry here...), you
>could find a friend or acquaintance with a band saw which would satisfy 80%
>of the woodworking requirement. You'd certainly come in at a fraction of
>that $2000-$3000 price you're being quoted for a kit.
>
>
>
I originally thought of doing the frame in steel. I wonder how the
price of ash compares to steel? Yeah, completely slipped my mind when
thinking of making the structural members of ply, having to drive nails
in them to hold the panels. The tools aren't a problem, I have what I
need to shape the frame pieces.
Andy Dingley wrote:
>On 10 Nov 2005 03:11:06 EST, Mark and Kim Smith <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>Got myself an old car. [...] Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason
>>I would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade
>>ply and gluing up what I need?
>>
>>
>
>Aren't these always ash ? Every one (mainly MGs) that I've worked on
>has been. There are a lot of curves in there and I'd hate to try making
>the shapes from plywood. That said, the originals did use a lot of
>plywood for the flat invisible parts, such as door skins or under a
>rear-mounted petrol tank.
>
>Besides which, good ash is cheaper than mediocre plywood.
>
>
>
Were talking Chevies here. They bought what they could get! I'll look
into the pricing of ash locally. I was just thrown off by the price tag
I was quoted.
J T wrote:
>Thu, Nov 10, 2005, 3:11am [email protected]
>(Mark and Kim Smith) doth sayeth:
>Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. <snip> Any other
>suggestions?? <snip>
>
> You've got a truck, not a car; and wood was pretty standard for any
>vehicle back then. Unless your're going for a complete restoration, I'd
>say steel tubing, not wood.
>http://www.users.bigpond.com/glenn_percy/body_assembly.htm I've seen it
>done, it ain't rocket sicience.
>
>
>
>JOAT
>If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
>- Red Green
>
>
>
Easy JOAT! No need to get picky, I know what I have! If I have enough
scrap, I just might do it in steel. Or sell it for a different model (
something from 1947-1954.)
Fri, Nov 11, 2005, 1:05pm [email protected]
(Mark=A0and=A0Kim=A0Smith) did speaketh:
Easy JOAT! No need to get picky, I know what I have! If I have enough
scrap, I just might do it in steel. Or sell it for a different model (
something from 1947-1954.)
No picky. Car car. Truck truck. No same. Sell? Where at?
Cheap?
You should be able to get used steel tubing quite inexpensively. I
would prefer it - I'd never restore "anything" to 100% original, I'd
want to use it, not look at it - not hard to put in, stronger than wood,
won't rot. You could possibly trade it, and get a better deal then
selling. Maybe.
JOAT
If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
- Red Green
J T wrote:
>Fri, Nov 11, 2005, 1:05pm [email protected]
>(Mark and Kim Smith) did speaketh:
>Easy JOAT! No need to get picky, I know what I have! If I have enough
>scrap, I just might do it in steel. Or sell it for a different model (
>something from 1947-1954.)
>
> No picky. Car car. Truck truck. No same. Sell? Where at?
>Cheap?
>
> You should be able to get used steel tubing quite inexpensively. I
>would prefer it - I'd never restore "anything" to 100% original, I'd
>want to use it, not look at it - not hard to put in, stronger than wood,
>won't rot. You could possibly trade it, and get a better deal then
>selling. Maybe.
>
>
>
>JOAT
>If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
>- Red Green
>
>
>
Hey JT,
I'm in So Cal. I would probably let it go for a couple grand. If I
had the latest pics, it would show the front and rear springs cleaned up
and installed, the front axle installed and I'm currently working on the
Camaro 10 bolt in the rear. Ok, well some of the pics do show some of
that stuff. Time to dig out the sand blaster, clean the cowl and prime
it. Everything is getting a two part epoxy. I'm also just about to set
up the V8 mounts and 700R4 mount. I still have the original honeycomb
radiator and a lightbar is in the mail. If you really are interested, I
can get more pics posted. Trucks are great, but with a wife and two
kids, I need something with more seats! Not sure how much freight would
be. I would probably crate most of it up and strap it to a pallet.
You're still using pallets, aren't you? I'll try to find some with
decent grain and minimal knots. ( The icing on the cake!)
Sat, Nov 12, 2005, 10:10pm [email protected]
(Mark=A0and=A0Kim=A0Smith) doth propose:
=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0I'm in So Cal. I would probably let it go for a couple
grand. <snip> Trucks are great, but with a wife and two kids, I need
something with more seats! <snip> You're still using pallets, aren't
you? <snip>
Too rich for me. Anyway, when I get the space, and can loosen up
some spare change, got my eye on a complete five window GMC/Chevvy
peekop, I think it'll go pretty low. There's a guy around here with
probably an acre of old cars and truck, most of 'em look to be '30s,
some '40s, a few later. Most seem pretty complete. Bad part is getting
him to sell. Ah well. But you can send me some popular wood pallets.
Free wood is "always" popular wood.
JOAT
If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
- Red Green
J T wrote:
>Sat, Nov 12, 2005, 10:10pm [email protected]
>(Mark and Kim Smith) doth propose:
> I'm in So Cal. I would probably let it go for a couple
>grand. <snip> Trucks are great, but with a wife and two kids, I need
>something with more seats! <snip> You're still using pallets, aren't
>you? <snip>
>
> Too rich for me. Anyway, when I get the space, and can loosen up
>some spare change, got my eye on a complete five window GMC/Chevvy
>peekop, I think it'll go pretty low. There's a guy around here with
>probably an acre of old cars and truck, most of 'em look to be '30s,
>some '40s, a few later. Most seem pretty complete. Bad part is getting
>him to sell. Ah well. But you can send me some popular wood pallets.
>Free wood is "always" popular wood.
>
>
>
>JOAT
>If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
>- Red Green
>
>
>
Hang out at www.stovebolt.com, at the forums. Occasionally, a freebie
will come along. By the way, see any Suburbans in that field??
Mon, Nov 14, 2005, 3:21pm [email protected] doth asketh:
Hang out at www.stovebolt.com, at the forums. Occasionally, a freebie
will come along. By the way, see any Suburbans in that field??
Not sure, but seem to recall a '40s-'50s Suburban. Might be a bit
pricey for shipping tho, I'm in NC. Local used car lot does have a
probably '39-'40 era Pontiac (I think) sedan tho, nice, but totally
painted red, bumpers and all. No idea what engine, price, or anything
else about it. I can get the tel # if you're interested. E-mail if you
are.
JOAT
If it ain't broke, don't lend it.
- Red Green
I've got no Ford to put one in!!
Andy wrote:
>If you want a nice Ford flathead V8 for that project, give me a shout. I've
>got a couple five engines and trannys under a thin layer of sawdust in my
>shop.
>
>
>"Mark and Kim Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>
>
>>Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. Back then, more so
>>non-Fords than Fords, they built a wood frame and nailed the sheet metal
>>to it. With Chevy, I guess what ever the best deals they got in bulk
>>product, they used. Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason I
>>would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade ply
>>and gluing up what I need? The main idea here is cost savings. Complete
>>wood kits are available but cost $2000-3000. Any other suggestions??
>>
>>Here is what I'm starting with:
>>http://www.bunchobikes.com/my1929chevy.htm
>>
>>Here are some shots of someone else's project with a wood kit installed:
>>http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929h.jpg
>>http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929i.jpg
>>http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929j.jpg
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
"Mark and Kim Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. Back then, more so
> non-Fords than Fords, they built a wood frame and nailed the sheet metal
> to it. With Chevy, I guess what ever the best deals they got in bulk
> product, they used. Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason
> I would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade
> ply and gluing up what I need? The main idea here is cost savings.
> Complete wood kits are available but cost $2000-3000. Any other
> suggestions??
>
> Here is what I'm starting with:
http://www.bunchobikes.com/my1929chevy.htm
>
> Here are some shots of someone else's project with a wood kit installed:
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929h.jpg
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929i.jpg
> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929j.jpg
You could use plywood for most of this stuff. You'd want a really good
adhesive because in order to use ply, you'd have nail into the ply layers
and that's not a good idea. I'm not so sure that you'd save a lot of money
over hardwood though. The components you show in the pictures are not all
that complex and could well be produced out of ash. It might pay to look
around for rough cut hardwood prices in your area. If you don't have the
tools to work the wood (and we're not talking fine cabinetry here...), you
could find a friend or acquaintance with a band saw which would satisfy 80%
of the woodworking requirement. You'd certainly come in at a fraction of
that $2000-$3000 price you're being quoted for a kit.
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 09:08:09 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Mark and Kim Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> Got myself an old car. A 1929 Chevy 1.5 ton pickup. Back then, more so
>> non-Fords than Fords, they built a wood frame and nailed the sheet metal
>> to it. With Chevy, I guess what ever the best deals they got in bulk
>> product, they used. Oak, ash, etc. My question is, is there any reason
>> I would have to go with a hardwood? Any thoughts on using marine grade
>> ply and gluing up what I need? The main idea here is cost savings.
>> Complete wood kits are available but cost $2000-3000. Any other
>> suggestions??
>>
>> Here is what I'm starting with:
>http://www.bunchobikes.com/my1929chevy.htm
>>
>> Here are some shots of someone else's project with a wood kit installed:
>> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929h.jpg
>> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929i.jpg
>> http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/projects/binder/binder_stephen_1929j.jpg
>
>You could use plywood for most of this stuff. You'd want a really good
>adhesive because in order to use ply, you'd have nail into the ply layers
>and that's not a good idea. I'm not so sure that you'd save a lot of money
>over hardwood though. The components you show in the pictures are not all
>that complex and could well be produced out of ash. It might pay to look
>around for rough cut hardwood prices in your area. If you don't have the
>tools to work the wood (and we're not talking fine cabinetry here...), you
>could find a friend or acquaintance with a band saw which would satisfy 80%
>of the woodworking requirement. You'd certainly come in at a fraction of
>that $2000-$3000 price you're being quoted for a kit.
A few years ago my brother was restoring an old Chevy ('37?) that had
a lot of wood in it. Bro is great with sheet metal but totally inept
in a woodshop so he asked me if I would replace the wood framing
around the windows and doors.
The car had sat in an open field for years and most of the wood was
either gone or rotted very badly. I was able to identify it tho, as
Ash, and used that for replacement parts.
The hardest part was developing patterns for the parts, as those
suckers seemed to curve in five directions at once. But with some 1/4
ply and a lot of cut n' fit I was able to do it.
The actual parts started out as 8/4 Ash, laminated where required.
With a bandsaw and a spindle sander I was able to turn out pieces that
fit pretty well. And yes, a couple of them had to be made twice :)
Overall it came out well, I enjoyed the challenge and Bro was happy to
have something to nail his tin to.
Unfortunately I didnt get to see the finished product as Bro moved off
to hurricane country and took his vehicle with him. One of these days
I'll have to overcome my fear of death and visit, just to see how my
handiwork turned out.
Total cost? I dont remember exactly but it was less than $200 for the
lumber and I donated my labor.