I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats of
satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on this
project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply, and
it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to look
splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
Thanks for the info. I'm having some trouble with the terminology. Can you
define sanding sealer, and varnish? Are these the same as a polyurethane?
(which is all I have ever used before)
"tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:39:36 -0600, Sutula wrote:
>
> > I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
> > maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats
of
> > satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on
this
> > project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply,
and
> > it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
> >
> > Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to
look
> > splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
>
> I work in a production shop where we build quite a lot out of birch ply
> and hard maple... the way we finish everything is to mix stain with
> sanding sealer, spray, sand smooth with scotchbrite pads or 400grit on an
> orbital sander (depending on the thickness of the coat and the size of the
> unit), then mix stain with varnish (or straight varnish, depending on the
> depth required), and respray. The stuff I personally build, I usually
> dont use any stain at all, I like the clear white color of the birch and
> maple, but I also like the look of 3:1 sealer:fruitwood stain, and
> straight varnish. But I'm a light color man, myself :)
http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/
Sanding sealer and varnish are not the same product as polyurethane. Sanding
sealer has a filler in it and it is applied to wood, it dries quickly, and
sands to a smooth finish. Varnish is applied over it.
Polyurethane dries to a harder surface than varnish. Explore the link I
included above. I think you will learn from it.
"Jack Black" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thanks for the info. I'm having some trouble with the terminology. Can
you
> define sanding sealer, and varnish? Are these the same as a polyurethane?
> (which is all I have ever used before)
>
> "tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:39:36 -0600, Sutula wrote:
Sutula wrote:
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to look
> splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
I just finished a project where I coated some Baltic Birch ply with
three coats of Tried & True Danish Oil (true boiled linseed oil), then
four coats of Liberon dewaxed Garnet shellac (1.5lb cut) and finally
waxed with natural Briwax. It looks great, nice color and no blotchiness
except where my shellac padding technique was flawed :-(
Pictures are on abpw (Purpleheart/Baltic Birch blanket boxes) or at
http://members.cox.net/kpfleming/wood
I have used Baltic Birch plywood extensively and like it. It holds it shape
and finishes with no problems.
Jerry
"Sutula" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
> maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats of
> satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on this
> project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply,
and
> it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
>
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to
look
> splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
>
>
"Sutula" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply, and
> it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
>
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to
look
> splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
Birch plywood is a good match to hard maple. I just used Tired and True
Varnish oil on a tray and it turned out well; a little more sheen that
Danish oil. It was natural though, no stain or tints.
Ed
First question here is, are you staining because you think you have too or
is there a specific reason for it? IE you have to match existing decor and
the budget couldn't quite swing cherry,
If it is the first, staining is NOT a required step in finishing. My first
rule of staining is 'don't unless you have to".
If you are staining of your own free will, I like Barry Burke's first rule.
--
Mike G.
[email protected]
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"Sutula" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
> maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats of
> satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on this
> project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply,
and
> it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
>
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to
look
> splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
>
>
Hello Jack
Sanding sealer is a compound that contains metallic soaps (sterates) that
keep sand paper from clogging. These can also cause adhesion problems with
finishes. They aren't something you want to use.
What should have been recommended is a pore/wood filler. These are used on
open pored woods such as oak and walnut to fill the open pores to a point
were they are level to the surrounding wood surface. Not using one on an
open pored wood when finishing with a surface finish (shellac, lacquer, or,
varnish) will give the finish cratered surface. Pore fillers can be
commercial fillers, the finish you are using applied and sanded back till
the pores are filled, or shellac applied and sanded back till the pores are
filled.
Yes. polyurethane is a varnish. A varnish is a mixture of a thinner (usually
mineral spirits), a carrier (tung oil or some other kind of reconstituted
vegetable oil) and resins (used to be things like rosin and amber, now
mostly man made).
Three basic type of varnishes you will find at you neighborhood supply store
will be Spar/marine varnish, varnish, and polyurethane (also in a spar
poly).
Spar varnish is a long oil varnish (a higher ration of oil to resins)
formulated to be more flexible then standard varnish to accommodate the more
radical movment of wood exposed to the whims of the weather. Just plain
varnish has a smaller oil to resin ratio and is more brittle then spar
varnish. Polyurethane is the same recipe as just plain varnish but the
resins used are more chemical and scratch resistant (which is why people who
rub out finishes tend to avoid it) resins then that found in just plain
varnish.
Application of all three is exactly the same process. If you have to rub out
a varnish finish just plain varnish is the one to choose since it's cured
properties lend itself better to the process.
--
Mike G.
[email protected]
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"Jack Black" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thanks for the info. I'm having some trouble with the terminology. Can
you
> define sanding sealer, and varnish? Are these the same as a polyurethane?
> (which is all I have ever used before)
>
> "tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:39:36 -0600, Sutula wrote:
> >
> > > I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood
and
> > > maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats
> of
> > > satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on
> this
> > > project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap
ply,
> and
> > > it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
> > >
> > > Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency
to
> look
> > > splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
> >
> > I work in a production shop where we build quite a lot out of birch ply
> > and hard maple... the way we finish everything is to mix stain with
> > sanding sealer, spray, sand smooth with scotchbrite pads or 400grit on
an
> > orbital sander (depending on the thickness of the coat and the size of
the
> > unit), then mix stain with varnish (or straight varnish, depending on
the
> > depth required), and respray. The stuff I personally build, I usually
> > dont use any stain at all, I like the clear white color of the birch and
> > maple, but I also like the look of 3:1 sealer:fruitwood stain, and
> > straight varnish. But I'm a light color man, myself :)
>
>
On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:39:36 -0600, "Sutula" <[email protected]> wrote:
>I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
>maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats of
>satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on this
>project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply, and
>it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
My rule #1 of staining is "ignore the name of the color on the can if
it's the name of a wood". <G> There are so many shades of cherry
that using it as a name of a color is near meaningless.
Some stain manufacturers actually use colors like "Van Dyke Brown",
rather than "Special Walnut", and they're a lot more meaningful.
Choose by color on samples vs. what _you_ want the "Cherry" to look
like.
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to look
>splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
If you're staining, wash coating the wood with thinned, dewaxed
shellac will reduce blotching. Zinnser Seal Coat is available in
premixed cans. You can thin it 50/50 with denatured alcohol. You'll
need to use a darker stain, as less will be absorbed into the wood.
Gel stains can also reduce blotching. Don't sand past about 120 grit
when staining. Fight the urge to sand it until it's ultra smooth.
You'll burnish the wood pores and seal out the stain.
I don't know how the wash coat will work under Watco, I don't normally
use the stuff. Someone else may know, or you can try it on scrap.
The few times I've used Watco, I've sanded to 220 or 280, applied the
Watco, kept it wet, and then wiped it down every so often for the next
day or two. Additional coats were applied with 400 and 600 grit
sandpaper, wet sanding with the Watco.
Have fun, play with that scrap! Write each step on the back of the
test board, so you can duplicate success and troubleshoot failure.
Barry
On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:39:36 -0600, Sutula wrote:
> I have just completed a blanket chest constructed with birch plywood and
> maple trim. Up until now, I've finished all my projects using 3 coats of
> satin polyurethane, but I'd like try something a little different on this
> project. I tried using cherry Watco Danish Oil on a piece of scrap ply, and
> it turned out looking like red oak more than cherry. Is this normal?
>
> Also, I haven't used Baltic ply before, which I hear has a tendency to look
> splotchy after finishing. Any tips would be great.
I work in a production shop where we build quite a lot out of birch ply
and hard maple... the way we finish everything is to mix stain with
sanding sealer, spray, sand smooth with scotchbrite pads or 400grit on an
orbital sander (depending on the thickness of the coat and the size of the
unit), then mix stain with varnish (or straight varnish, depending on the
depth required), and respray. The stuff I personally build, I usually
dont use any stain at all, I like the clear white color of the birch and
maple, but I also like the look of 3:1 sealer:fruitwood stain, and
straight varnish. But I'm a light color man, myself :)