My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
currently being turned into McMansion land So...
Went to a local hardwood distributor yesterday to pick up a few board
feet of Walnut and Soft Maple. After picking out a 4/4 (13/16") 4" x
10' stick of S2S walnut and two 7' lengths of 4/4 4.5" and 6.25" S2S
soft maple, I wandered up to the checkout and was greeting by a madman
with a calculator who placed a charge of over $60 on my debit card.
WOW!
After looking over the invoice, I discovered that - in addition to the
$6.33/bd ft charge for the walnut and the $4.58/bd ft charge for the
soft maple, they have surcharges of 7% for Kiln Shrinkage and 11% for
Edge Ripping - even though the boards are rough edged. This is in
addition to the rounding-up of the board feet to nice, even increments
of one.
Is this now a universal practice? Or is this the result of living in
a wretched, overcrowded city full of corporate leeches. Heck, I might
as well go back to cabinet plywood, oak and poplar from the Borg. :-\
At these prices, it makes that Cherry tree I cut down last year and
ripped into very nice 12/4 slabs worth about $2000.
(They get $11.66/bd ft for 12/4 Cherry - edged with sapwood and pith.
A 3/4" x 4' x 8' sheet of plain sliced, veneer core cherry plywood
sells for $128.00.)
A kitchen wall cabinet with real wood frames must be worth about $400
each just in materials these days...
Another affirmation that I am in the wrong business - it's deep into
the woods with a Woodmizer for me...
What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
Greg G.
On 11/30/2005 6:25 PM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
> Greg G. said:
>
>
>>My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
>>the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
>>currently being turned into McMansion land So...
>
> <snip>
>
>>What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>
>
> Thanks Guys, for the feedback.
>
> Well, since there were so many responses to my question, I'm gonna
> respond to them all right here.
>
> I'm near Atlanta, GA. SE US. Although development has been rabid for
> the last 30 years, the last five years have brought absolutely
> horrific changes into my area - and not _one_ for the better. Most of
> the indigenous population has fled - running, not walking.
>
> Used to get poplar for ~$1.72, Cherry for ~$3.65 and clear Walnut for
> ~$4.60. No surcharges - us dumb rednecks wouldn't stand for that for
> a second. We'd have that guy lynched and on a rail to NYC. <g>
> Kiln Shrinkage - get fracking serious.
>
> Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
> to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
> you'll get a bill for $250. And you don't have to dial one, either.
> I can make a call to south Florida far cheaper...
>
> Anyway, all the local mills have moved away, and the closest are now
> in Augusta, Alabama and Tennessee. Subsequently, the prices have
> apparently risen to whatever the market will bear - plus a bit more.
>
> Which makes me even hotter when I see these damned carpetbagger home
> builders come in and clear-cut the trees, scrape the topsoil away, bag
> it all up and sell it back to the same idiots who bought their poorly
> constructed homes. Just because they are _used_ to paying $400,000
> for a 3BR house up North, these idiots have forced the prices here way
> beyond reason. Needless to say, the poor dumbasses who sold the
> property to the developers for pennies on the dollar are now appalled
> at how poorly they negotiated their own deals. They probably could
> have made more from selling the timber.
>
> The distributor in question is not a Rockler or Woodcraft, but a
> larger, multi-state hardwood dealer who sells to commercial interests.
> And yet, I see similar prices AT Rockler - sometimes even less...
>
> And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
> live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
> of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>
> As for the shop that sells walnut for $11 and soft maple for $13.30,
> I'm with Dave on this on. Cripes, let me know what state you're in so
> I can black it out on my map - I _sure_ don't want to move there!
>
> Canada is looking pretty good right now... As is western PA.
>
> I DO know that the next time I see a tree laying in the woods, fallen
> from a storm, I'm going to cut that *ucker up and haul it home!
> After I cut down all the trees in our yard, of course. <g>
>
> FWIW,
>
> Greg G.
Greg,
What area of Atlanta? I'm about 40 mile ENE towards Athens and I
haven't seen those prices anywhere near here.
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
Greg G. wrote:
> What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
About $6/bf for decent 12/4 cherry, and about $5.50 for 4/4 cherry.
Last time I bought walnut I think it was around $6 also. This is in
Phoenix, AZ. The lumber places I use are much more friendly about
measuring, too.
But where are you, Greg? So I know not to move there :-)
PQ
I've seen $10 bf for Cherry here in San Diego.
I started building some outdoor furniture out of all heart clear
redwood. A simple little bench is costing $350 in raw redwood lumber
alone.
I really believe we are being ripped on retail pricing. One could go
to a mass merchant and by a redwood bench with the same amount of
redwood for $99. It means that volume manufacturers are paying WAY
less than we that are buying retail.
Greg G. wrote:
> My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
> the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
> currently being turned into McMansion land So...
>
> Went to a local hardwood distributor yesterday to pick up a few board
> feet of Walnut and Soft Maple. After picking out a 4/4 (13/16") 4" x
> 10' stick of S2S walnut and two 7' lengths of 4/4 4.5" and 6.25" S2S
> soft maple, I wandered up to the checkout and was greeting by a madman
> with a calculator who placed a charge of over $60 on my debit card.
>
> WOW!
>
> After looking over the invoice, I discovered that - in addition to the
> $6.33/bd ft charge for the walnut and the $4.58/bd ft charge for the
> soft maple, they have surcharges of 7% for Kiln Shrinkage and 11% for
> Edge Ripping - even though the boards are rough edged. This is in
> addition to the rounding-up of the board feet to nice, even increments
> of one.
>
> Is this now a universal practice? Or is this the result of living in
> a wretched, overcrowded city full of corporate leeches. Heck, I might
> as well go back to cabinet plywood, oak and poplar from the Borg. :-\
>
> At these prices, it makes that Cherry tree I cut down last year and
> ripped into very nice 12/4 slabs worth about $2000.
> (They get $11.66/bd ft for 12/4 Cherry - edged with sapwood and pith.
> A 3/4" x 4' x 8' sheet of plain sliced, veneer core cherry plywood
> sells for $128.00.)
>
> A kitchen wall cabinet with real wood frames must be worth about $400
> each just in materials these days...
>
> Another affirmation that I am in the wrong business - it's deep into
> the woods with a Woodmizer for me...
>
> What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>
>
> Greg G.
Greg, I can't say what most people pay just what I'd charge if you
were a walk-in customer at my business. $11 on the walnut and $13.30 on
the soft maple. Jana
I'm guessing that part of the equasion is knowing where to look. For
example, here in Phoenix you can definitely find $8-$10/bf cherry - at
the usual suspects like Rockler, Woodcraft. And there are also
specialty shops like Woodwoker's Source that have an outstanding
selection but high-ish prices (when they're not having a sale,
anyways). But if you look you can also find less expensive places like
Spellmans, which is more of a contractor warehouse but will sell to the
general public, and Timber which is a medium-sized family owned shop in
Mesa. Both of those places have nice hardwoods that are favorably
priced compared to the others - and often the difference is 60%-100%
between them and the big guys, for the same species and cut.
Not knowing what the situation is in other markets, I'm sure it's
easier to find high prices than good ones - but maybe there are local
woodworking clubs or other resources that can point you towards better
deals?
PQ
I'm just getting into woodworking, but as it happens, I called a place
in Memphis today to inquire about wood prices. I'm not sure about some
of the terms you guys are using to describe the wood size (or
quality?), but I can get 13/16" cherry in random widths with one
straight side in lengths of 10-12 feet for $3/bd ft. They have birch
for something like $2.65/bd ft.
They also had other hardwoods, but I didn't inquire about the prices.
How does that compare to the discussion?
[email protected] wrote:
> I'm just getting into woodworking, but as it happens, I called a place
> in Memphis today to inquire about wood prices. I'm not sure about some
> of the terms you guys are using to describe the wood size (or
> quality?), but I can get 13/16" cherry in random widths with one
> straight side in lengths of 10-12 feet for $3/bd ft. They have birch
> for something like $2.65/bd ft.
>
> They also had other hardwoods, but I didn't inquire about the prices.
> How does that compare to the discussion?
What you got was fairly common in the SE, at least as far as pricing
goes, maybe a bit on the low side. Compared to what the others are
paying, you're in fat city. There are a lot of great features about
this area (though Memphis is a ways from here), and the sizable
hardwood forests are one major feature for woodworkers. That is also
one of the reasons much furniture making is centered around northern NC
and into South central VA.
Unfortunately, wood is neither as cheap nor as accessible around here
as it was just five years ago, but it still far cheaper than places
like Mesa where a lot of transport, and a couple extra levels of
handling, are needed.
This sounds like retail pricing to me, although it ain't bad for
retail. I'm not too familiar with Walnut pricing but Soft Maple is
often on sale for less than $3 a foot in S2S around here in CA and I
pay less than $4 for hard maple. 4/4 Cherry fluxuates from $5-$7 in
S2S. I alwasy get charged for the straight edging but it's just bundled
into the bf price at like 10 or 15 cents a foot, can't recall exactly.
They always round up the bf but around here shrinkage is left as a
personal issue.
So is this local harwood distrubuter a retail establishment or do they
server the cabinet trade? I'd try to find out who the cabinet makers
are buying from and get your stock from them. You can't always select
your stock but if they have a Will Call you can typically buy pretty
small quantities and avoid any deliver charge. All the guys around here
have no minimum and will sell to anyone at good prices.
Most places calculate and charge for fractional BF. First ripoff
Edge ripping 11%. never heard of that either. Ripoff #2
An if there's significant sapwood, cracked ends or otherwise unuseable
parts, they subtract some BF
Kiln shrinkage. Never heard of "shrinkage", not that kind anyway...
ripoff #3
Anyway the base $/BF seem OK, but all those "extras"
Mitch
Mitch, I agree with #1 and #2. As for #3....you may know it as net
tally vs gross tally if you're used to buying larger lots. I don't
charge it (well, I adjust it into my bd ft price because it's less
confusing to the customer) but every other retail lumber company does
it that way. Most wholesale companies charge you for the footage and
deduct the percentage off the scale. Jana
I understand where you are coming from Greg. Seems like every time I
turn around the lumber industry has found a way to squeak a bit more
out of us. Plywood dimensions keep getting thinner and thinner ( I
recently bought some 1/2" shop grade that was barely above 3/8). And my
local hardwood supplier charges a "straight Lining" charge of 10% on
all domestic lumber they carry. Claiming its S3S lumber. Can't figure
out why they just don't add it into the marked price. It artifically
makes the price on the rack look cheaper...marketing tactic I guess.
Even then I have to joint it every time and usually end up removing
more than 1/8" to get it true.
I just got some 5/4 mahogany (s2s) and it was less than an inch thick.
And the veneer on hardwood plywood is so thin these days that I reject
a sheet even if it's got a "shipping" mark on it. I know if I try and
clean it up by sanding the black mark off I risk burning right through
it. And have you bought dimensional construction lumber lately? I see
why more and more housing is using steel studs. Wood studs are
expensive and crappy. Remember the reason a 2x4 stud is 3 1/2 by 1 1/2
is because the mill cut off the bad parts. Now days it would be a tooth
pick.
Mark
Andrew Barss wrote:
> Greg G. <[email protected]> wrote:
> : Greg G. said:
>
> : Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
> : to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
> : you'll get a bill for $250.
>
>
> That's roughly $4.50 per minute. I can call central Mongolia for
> less than that! You need to switch phone carriers.
>
> I'm in southern AZ, and can call anywhere in the US or Canada for
> under 5 cents a minute.
We have a Verizon set up for $59 a month that allows unlimited calling
within the U.S. and Canada. No time limits, not set times, zip, nada,
zilch. It sounds a bit high at first, but even at nickel a word, you
can run up some major charges when your wife calls her parents or
siblinigs and yaks for a couple, three hours, three or four times a
week (among the joys of aging parents is keeping track of their well
being from several hundred miles away).
Charlie Self wrote:
> We have a Verizon set up for $59 a month that allows unlimited calling
> within the U.S. and Canada. No time limits, not set times, zip, nada,
> zilch.
I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't
already get high-speed internet from them too.
It's amazing how long-distance prices are dropping.
Chris
George wrote:
> "Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote
>>I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't already
>>get high-speed internet from them too.
> How do they work the taxes? US folks have taxes to provide "essential
> service" to the poor, excise, connection taxes and 9-1-1 assessments. Do
> these internet-based outfits charge them, or do they fall under the "can't
> tax the internet" legislation?
I think I may not have been clear--this is regular landline from the
local telco, not VOIP.
Chris
George said:
>
>"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> Greg G. said:
>>
>> And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
>> live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
>> of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>>
>
>NOBODY clear-cuts a hardwood forest with the expectation that it will be one
>in the future. Clear-cutting is for softwood. where it makes sense because
>the seedlings don't tolerate shading well.
No one ever claimed they wanted it to grow back. They strip it for
the hardwoods, and either leave it fallow, or build McMansions on it.
When they build here now, EVERY tree is removed. After all, don't
want those pesky song birds waking you up in the morning. And those
evil trees take up space that could be used for pavement or another
stinking, worthless house.
Like this:
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-2.jpg
The areas left with trees are where the locals wouldn't sell - yet.
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-5.jpg
There are over 20 houses in this one picture alone. This mess is
tucked in a slim alley between two older neighborhoods - that's why
there are still trees visible.
When developers originally moved into Atlanta, they built nice homes,
left the majority of the trees, and the houses actually had yards for
the kids.
But Ryland Homes and other such maggot's interpretation of
homebuilding is to strip everything - and I mean EVERYTHING.
The top soil, the trees, the rocks. All that is left is red clay.
Everything else is trucked off and sold.
When you buy a bag of potting soil at Home Depot, you don't get a well
mixed formula of perlite, vermiculite, peat moss and composted soil.
You get a bag of Georgia Forest Topsoil - even says so on the back of
the bags in very small print. It doesn't even matter what brand you
buy: Miracle Grow (crap), private brands (crap), Jungle (better),
Bayer (same crap) or Schultz (used to be a good mix, but now it's
produced locally and is crap as well.)
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-7.jpg
They just got started on this one...
They attempt to alter the rolling terrain to fit their crappy slab
homes, and then everyone surrounding this mess is left to deal with
the rainwater erosion problems they have created. It's horrible...
And these damned northern industrial city transplants just eat up...
They have turned a forested jewel into a cesspool of foul pollution.
Unmanaged growth and development, crooked local government officials
hungry for money and kickbacks, and locals who sell-off to get the
hell away from what this is turning into. It's not a pretty site...
Even been to Compton, CA? Welcome home!
Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
It's like someone raping your child - over and over - and you're
powerless to stop them.
FWIW,
Greg G.
tyvek said:
>On Mon, 05 Dec 2005 03:28:12 -0500, Greg G. wrote:
>>As for the southern girls comment - Here, let me bend you over my
>>hitchin' post while my kinfolks make you squeal like a pig... <g>
>
>Isn't it "kinfolk"? Oh wait, I get it. I still say that's the best
>movie Burt what's-his-name ever did. Perhaps even better than the
>Bandit series?
Kinfolks is acceptable... for a colloquialism.
But never was a Burt fan, thanks.
>>As for Tyvec the Conqueror - although I can appreciate your warped
>>sense of humor, you probably haven't managed to conquer your
>>embarrassing habit of whacking off in the public restroom after seeing
>>a spinner at the mall, much less dominate the earth.
>>
>Well, I am a little wrapped up in myself- agghhhhh!!
>p.s. Is it true the girls are maturing earlier and exhibiting a
>general tendency towards smaller breast size?
I really wouldn't know. I prefer more seasoned women. Besides,
they put old guys like me in jail for hanging around the schoolyard.
>>As for the rest of it - you're pretty close to being factual there,
>>except that China is the workcamp, the US is the new realm of the
>>blind and downtrodden.
>
>Yep, the only people who have anything are the fortune 500 gang, gov
>employees and,.. um, military contractors. For the rest of us it's
>crumbs,.. crumbs from the rich mans table.
I hear ya.
I was in the same situation until I shot some video of a prominent
Texas politician in a .. um.. compromising position at a park near the
Corpus Christy Navel Air Station.
Now it's Iranian Beluga Caviar and Dom - all the way.
>That's all I know, see you in church.
You spend WAY too much time swapping configuration properties in
Agent. But what I'd really like to know is which one of you smart-ass
wreckers this _really_ is... Tyvek the Conqueror has never made a
post to Usenet before yesterday, and I have a sneaking suspicion that
you are actually... hmm... 220grit. :-p
Greg G.
On 12/1/2005 12:48 AM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
> Odinn said:
>
>
>>>Greg G. said:
>>>
>>>
>>>>My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
>>>>the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
>>>>currently being turned into McMansion land So...
>>>
>>><snip>
>>>
>>>>What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>>>
>>Greg,
>> What area of Atlanta? I'm about 40 mile ENE towards Athens and I
>>haven't seen those prices anywhere near here.
>
>
> I'm on the west side, 12 miles out from Buckhead.
> Know of a good place?
>
>
> Greg G.
Georgia Hardwoods in Buford
Atlanta Wood Products - South Cobb Dr and River Rd
Peachstate Lumber in Kennesaw
Suwanee Lumber Co. in Suwanee
You might want to check out http://www.woodworkersguildofga.com and look
at the forum. Occassionally someone is selling lumber.
If you don't mind air dried rough lumber, check out
http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-bobtailcritter
He's located north of Buford.
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
Charles Spitzer said:
>welcome to southern kalifornia. that's what it looks like, la to san diego,
>wall to wall.
I know - don't remind me. <g> We fly out there several times a year.
Little did I realize the first time I went to LA, back in the early
eighties, that it would follow me home just a few years later...
The in-laws live in Santa Barbara and sisters live in LA and in the
Sierras, NE of San Francisco. One writes hiking books about the
waterfalls and trails of California. One raises hybrid Orchids. One
raises kids. I've been up and down the entire state - albeit mostly
along the coast. Nice weather, but way too many people in an
artificially sustained environment. To many scam artists and price
fixing monopolies as well. Looked at your water or power bill lately?
<g> Rolling blackouts, my ass - more like engineered scare tactics
vying for price increases. I'm just fearful that we're heading in the
same direction...
JMHO,
Greg G.
>"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> They have turned a forested jewel into a cesspool of foul pollution.
>> Unmanaged growth and development, crooked local government officials
>> hungry for money and kickbacks, and locals who sell-off to get the
>> hell away from what this is turning into. It's not a pretty site...
>> Even been to Compton, CA? Welcome home!
>>
>> Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
>> It's like someone raping your child - over and over - and you're
>> powerless to stop them.
>>
>> FWIW,
>>
>> Greg G.
>
Greg G.
On 30 Nov 2005 13:27:07 -0800, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> $6.33/bd ft charge for the walnut and the $4.58/bd ft charge for the
>> soft maple, they have surcharges of 7% for Kiln Shrinkage and 11% for
>> Edge Ripping - even though the boards are rough edged. This is in
>> addition to the rounding-up of the board feet to nice, even increments
>> of one.
> Greg, I can't say what most people pay just what I'd charge if you
> were a walk-in customer at my business. $11 on the walnut and $13.30 on
> the soft maple. Jana
Holy crap. You're not serious?
"Dave Hinz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 30 Nov 2005 13:27:07 -0800, [email protected]
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> $6.33/bd ft charge for the walnut and the $4.58/bd ft charge for the
>>> soft maple, they have surcharges of 7% for Kiln Shrinkage and 11% for
>>> Edge Ripping - even though the boards are rough edged. This is in
>>> addition to the rounding-up of the board feet to nice, even increments
>>> of one.
>
>> Greg, I can't say what most people pay just what I'd charge if you
>> were a walk-in customer at my business. $11 on the walnut and $13.30 on
>> the soft maple. Jana
>
> Holy crap. You're not serious?
Certainly, but she figured the BF, and gave a total.
"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greg G. said:
>
> And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
> live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
> of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>
NOBODY clear-cuts a hardwood forest with the expectation that it will be one
in the future. Clear-cutting is for softwood. where it makes sense because
the seedlings don't tolerate shading well.
I really doubt that it's much different down there either from a sivaculture
or tax standpoint
"Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Charlie Self wrote:
>
>> We have a Verizon set up for $59 a month that allows unlimited calling
>> within the U.S. and Canada. No time limits, not set times, zip, nada,
>> zilch.
>
> I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't already
> get high-speed internet from them too.
>
> It's amazing how long-distance prices are dropping.
>
Yep, when it was one talk per copper pair there was more demand than supply.
Economics 101.
How do they work the taxes? US folks have taxes to provide "essential
service" to the poor, excise, connection taxes and 9-1-1 assessments. Do
these internet-based outfits charge them, or do they fall under the "can't
tax the internet" legislation?
"Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> George wrote:
>> "Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>>>I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't
>>>already get high-speed internet from them too.
>
>> How do they work the taxes? US folks have taxes to provide "essential
>> service" to the poor, excise, connection taxes and 9-1-1 assessments. Do
>> these internet-based outfits charge them, or do they fall under the
>> "can't tax the internet" legislation?
>
> I think I may not have been clear--this is regular landline from the local
> telco, not VOIP.
Ah, "bundle" of wireline services with DSL rather than using the bandwidth
on the DSL.
Lots of folks here have gone away from landline altogether. Cellular or
internet calling through cable is cheaper.
"Bob G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
I still remember my first check
> from the US Army... $18.46 cents...NET ...and 16 bucks of that was
> traveling pay from Ft Bragg to Walter Reed... That check I really
> should have not cashed ..I should have had it framed and hung it on my
> wall...
>
Remember the jump when I sewed on E-3. I was then making $ 22 per
fortnightly payday. Felt so good about it that I went out and got
married....
> My first job in High School was at a burger joint... we sold them fro
> 15 cents each..or 7 for a dollar... My 1951 V8 Hot Rod drank gas that
> cost me 19 cents a gallon... and ran on "May Pop" brand tires ..like
> one just may pop... at any time...I think I averaged 2-3 flat tires a
> week...
>
Stockboy at 0.50 / hour, but you could get a gallon for between 11 and 17
cents, _and_ a set of glasses for a fill up. The MGA cost me 1500 at three
years old.
> Now back to the original posters comments... I have no idea if I can
> afford to continue buying wood... Before I retired I stock piled a
> lifetime supply of Walnut, Cherry and Poplar...(what A laugh...I must
> have died a few years ago because it only took about 5 years before I
> had to float a loan to buy a small supply to make my Daughters dinning
> room set...(Table & Hutch,...no darn chairs...) ..
>
My daughter married a guy whose family had a few forties of timber, so when
we made the cabinets for his NASCAR memorabilia, he supplied his own black
ash. Same for all the replacement oak moldings - red oak from the "camp."
The bed will be in cherry, but I'll have to supply anything over 4/4,
because that's all they have in the barn.
Since I mostly turn firewood, my flat stock should hold out a few more
years.
"Odinn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>
> I switched to VoIP (Sunrocket) over my high speed cable. $200 a year
> (that's like $16.67 a month), unlimited calling US and Canada. There is
> the issue of having no phone if the internet is out, but I have a cell
> phone for those few times when that happens.
Are you sure there is unlimited calling? I got a solicitation through the
mail and there was a 100 minute limit for long distance.
Andrew Barss said:
>Greg G. <[email protected]> wrote:
>: Greg G. said:
>
>: Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
>: to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
>: you'll get a bill for $250.
>
>
>That's roughly $4.50 per minute. I can call central Mongolia for
>less than that! You need to switch phone carriers.
>
>I'm in southern AZ, and can call anywhere in the US or Canada for
>under 5 cents a minute.
Oh, believe me - I don't live in New Jersey - the Garden State.
I spent a year there in 2000. The greenish-blue well water and vast
multitudes of scam-artists, and deer ticks had me racing back to the
Southern Appalachians. <g>
As for the phones - I believe one company held a monopoly on the land
lines there... We're talking calls _within_ the state, out of state
was different - the Feds get involved...
Greg G.
>On my 21st birthday, I called home (Westchester County, in New York) from
>Kaneohe Bay, Hawaii. Cost of a 20 minute call was about $115. A long damned
>time ago, and at that time I was making, if memory serves, about $124 a
>month, net. Lance corporal, USMC. Big boost the next year, going to E4 and
>over 3. Up to $170 a month.
>
Charlie you are younger then me.... I still remember my first check
from the US Army... $18.46 cents...NET ...and 16 bucks of that was
traveling pay from Ft Bragg to Walter Reed... That check I really
should have not cashed ..I should have had it framed and hung it on my
wall...
Prices are relative,,, My home cost less then $25,000 when I
purchased it in 1965 ...When my dad died a few years ago I discovered
he paid either $1160 or $1610 for my entire 1st year in college when I
was going thru his things... even laughed at his comment that I better
cut my beer consumption because he was going broke "supporting" me...
My first job in High School was at a burger joint... we sold them fro
15 cents each..or 7 for a dollar... My 1951 V8 Hot Rod drank gas that
cost me 19 cents a gallon... and ran on "May Pop" brand tires ..like
one just may pop... at any time...I think I averaged 2-3 flat tires a
week...
Now back to the original posters comments... I have no idea if I can
afford to continue buying wood... Before I retired I stock piled a
lifetime supply of Walnut, Cherry and Poplar...(what A laugh...I must
have died a few years ago because it only took about 5 years before I
had to float a loan to buy a small supply to make my Daughters dinning
room set...(Table & Hutch,...no darn chairs...) ..
Fricken scary ...what EVERYTHING costs now...
My "Real Estate" Taxes per year today .. are greater then what I paid
in 1965 for my mortgage (P&I and taxes)... My first "new" car was a
1965 Corvette 396 BB purchased in 1966 for $4,700 ..today just the
knock off wheels for that car are worth that much...
Honestly as much as I bitch about what I have to pay for lumber I
really feel sorry for my grandchildren and what they have to pay for a
little, but nice, townhouse with a 200 sq foot back yard.....even the
dog can not get any exercise in that small yard...
Ok..
Off my soap box...
The one check I will not have to write will be to the Funeral Home...
what a good though that is... Maybe I should run out and buy some pine
for a "box" today.... who knows what the wife will have to pay per Bf
of that crap in a few years...
Bob G...
mike hide said:
>Here is my local supplier ,Suwannee lumber ,in Suwanee Ga . they are a
>pleasure to deal with and their prices seem fair to me .Here is the web
>site, see what you think in particular with regards to their selection
>
>www.suwaneelumber.com.
I knew of them but haven't actually tried them, due to the distance.
But their prices look better - and I saw no surcharges. It's a pretty
good ride from here, however, I'd have to stock up to pay for the
trip. Now if I can get SWMBO to give up that useless dining room for
wood storage...
Thanks,
Greg G.
"Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Charlie Self wrote:
>
>> We have a Verizon set up for $59 a month that allows unlimited calling
>> within the U.S. and Canada. No time limits, not set times, zip, nada,
>> zilch.
>
> I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't already
> get high-speed internet from them too.
>
> It's amazing how long-distance prices are dropping.
>
> Chris
On my 21st birthday, I called home (Westchester County, in New York) from
Kaneohe Bay, Hawaii. Cost of a 20 minute call was about $115. A long damned
time ago, and at that time I was making, if memory serves, about $124 a
month, net. Lance corporal, USMC. Big boost the next year, going to E4 and
over 3. Up to $170 a month.
Redwood is that much now??? Geez, I salvaged a bunch of 50 year old 4x8x8
redwood beams out of a home remodel last winter. Probably 350 or so bdft.
Sounds like they are worth about $5000 now! Walnut, oak, cherry, maple,
hickory etc, shorts are $2.00 bdft here, 8' legnts run about $4 bdft. My
local lumber mill is a small hole in the wall, the
owner/operator/sawyer/salesman is great to deal with, and has many hardwoods
in stock for very reasonable prices. Plus, he can tell me where the tree
was that he cut into that lumber, which is usually in my county. You gotta
bring your mucking boots though, this place ain't no retail store! --dave
"Jerry" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've seen $10 bf for Cherry here in San Diego.
>
> I started building some outdoor furniture out of all heart clear
> redwood. A simple little bench is costing $350 in raw redwood lumber
> alone.
>
> I really believe we are being ripped on retail pricing. One could go
> to a mass merchant and by a redwood bench with the same amount of
> redwood for $99. It means that volume manufacturers are paying WAY
> less than we that are buying retail.
>
Greg G. wrote:
> My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
> the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
> currently being turned into McMansion land So...
>=20
> Went to a local hardwood distributor yesterday to pick up a few board
> feet of Walnut and Soft Maple. After picking out a 4/4 (13/16") 4" x
> 10' stick of S2S walnut and two 7' lengths of 4/4 4.5" and 6.25" S2S
> soft maple, I wandered up to the checkout and was greeting by a madman
> with a calculator who placed a charge of over $60 on my debit card.
>=20
> WOW!
>=20
> After looking over the invoice, I discovered that - in addition to the
> $6.33/bd ft charge for the walnut and the $4.58/bd ft charge for the
> soft maple, they have surcharges of 7% for Kiln Shrinkage and 11% for
> Edge Ripping - even though the boards are rough edged. This is in
> addition to the rounding-up of the board feet to nice, even increments
> of one.
>=20
> Is this now a universal practice? Or is this the result of living in
> a wretched, overcrowded city full of corporate leeches. Heck, I might
> as well go back to cabinet plywood, oak and poplar from the Borg. :-\
>=20
> At these prices, it makes that Cherry tree I cut down last year and
> ripped into very nice 12/4 slabs worth about $2000.
> (They get $11.66/bd ft for 12/4 Cherry - edged with sapwood and pith.
> A 3/4" x 4' x 8' sheet of plain sliced, veneer core cherry plywood
> sells for $128.00.)
>=20
> A kitchen wall cabinet with real wood frames must be worth about $400
> each just in materials these days...
>=20
> Another affirmation that I am in the wrong business - it's deep into
> the woods with a Woodmizer for me...
>=20
> What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>=20
>=20
> Greg G.
Greg:
Your assessment is one with which I concur. What the market will bear.
Check out:
http://centurymill.com/domestic.html
Multiply by .85 to get USD from Kanuckistani Pesos.
--=20
Will R.
Jewel Boxes and Wood Art
http://woodwork.pmccl.com
The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those=20
who have not got it.=94 George Bernard Shaw
On 12/1/2005 1:42 PM mike hide mumbled something about the following:
> Here is my local supplier ,Suwannee lumber ,in Suwanee Ga . they are a
> pleasure to deal with and their prices seem fair to me .Here is the web
> site, see what you think in particular with regards to their selection
>
> www.suwaneelumber.com.
>
>
I need to head up there soon and pick up a couple sheets of 1/4" birch
ply for some kitchen cabinet finishing (store bought cabinets that I
just need to finish up the ends).
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
On 12/1/2005 5:30 PM mike hide mumbled something about the following:
> "Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>mike hide said:
>>
>>
>>>Here is my local supplier ,Suwannee lumber ,in Suwanee Ga . they are a
>>>pleasure to deal with and their prices seem fair to me .Here is the web
>>>site, see what you think in particular with regards to their selection
>>>
>>>www.suwaneelumber.com.
>>
>>I knew of them but haven't actually tried them, due to the distance.
>>But their prices look better - and I saw no surcharges. It's a pretty
>>good ride from here, however, I'd have to stock up to pay for the
>>trip. Now if I can get SWMBO to give up that useless dining room for
>>wood storage...
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>
>>Greg
>
>
> Yes a long ride for me also, I live in Atlanta guess abot 20 miles round
> trip .One other thing they have a shed with a good quantity of odds of all
> kinds for knock down prices. So if you need the odd piece of oak etc it is a
> good deal .last time I was up there I found some nice pieces of Hickory
> [which I thought was oak ].....mjh
>
>
Closer for you than for me. 60 mile round trip (I used to work just a
couple miles from them on Satellite), but then again, the closest Lowe's
to me is almost 40 miles round trip.
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
"Fly-by-Night CC" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Bob G. <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Fricken scary ...what EVERYTHING costs now...
>
> Here's a website calculator I get a kick out of plugging numbers into:
> <http://www.minneapolisfed.org/Research/data/us/calc/>
> It's a Fed Resv Bank calculator for what the dollar amount in some year
> would equal in another year.
>
> That $4700 Corvette would be just shy of $30,000 today. But then
> consider how much more by way of amenities and safety the C-5 or C-6 has
> over that '65.
>
> Some things are pretty much as they should be with respect to inflation.
> Other things like houses and cars don't translate as easily since
> there're other factors that contribute to today's prices above the cost
> of building a similar one today.
> --
Yes. Average size of post WWII house: under 1000 SF. Average size of Iraq
era house, about 2800 SF. Just one thing. Of course, those Levittown houses,
starting out just over 900 SF, IMS, are now larger and selling for something
more like $350,000 than their original under 5K prices.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
> Hi Dave, Yes, I'm serious. Jana
>
Where are you located? Right now in CT I can get 4/4 walnut for $6 to $7
USD and none of the charges the OP described. Includes planing to thickness
too.
On 12/1/2005 9:50 AM Leon mumbled something about the following:
> "Odinn" <[email protected]> wrote in message=20
> news:[email protected]...
>=20
>>>
>>I switched to VoIP (Sunrocket) over my high speed cable. $200 a year=20
>>(that's like $16.67 a month), unlimited calling US and Canada. There i=
s=20
>>the issue of having no phone if the internet is out, but I have a cell =
>>phone for those few times when that happens.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Are you sure there is unlimited calling? I got a solicitation through =
the=20
> mail and there was a 100 minute limit for long distance.=20
>=20
>=20
For SunRocket, yes, it is unlimited calling
From their website.
SunRocket 's All-Inclusive Annual Edition gives you a year's worth of=20
Internet home phone service for only $199. Cancel anytime and receive a=20
refund for unused months.
* Unlimited calling =E2=80=93 U.S., Canada and Puerto Rico
* Free international minutes ($3.00 credit every month)
* Free extra phone number - Local or AnyWhere Number=E2=84=A0
* Enhanced Emergency 911 Service
* Over 12 enhanced calling features, including Caller ID, 3-way=20
Calling, Enhanced Voicemail, and much more=E2=80=A6
* Two free Directory Assistance calls each month
* No charge to activate
* No hidden fees - Taxes included in the Bottom-Line Price=E2=84=A0
* No cancellation fees
* 31 day money back guarantee
--=20
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
On 12/1/2005 10:05 AM Duke of Burl mumbled something about the following:
> Do they have the 911 thing worked out yet?
>
If you're thinking of switching, I'll send you a reference.
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
On 12/1/2005 10:05 AM Duke of Burl mumbled something about the following:
> Do they have the 911 thing worked out yet?
>
Yes they do. You have to fill out a form giving your location for it to
work (since you can have a phone number from anywhere in the US, not
just your local calling area).
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
>
> What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>
>
> Greg G.
Here in central NC, I'm usually able to pick up walnut 4/4 S2S for about $5
per BF and soft maple for $4.
-G
On 12/1/2005 3:55 PM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
> George said:
>
>
>>"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>Greg G. said:
>>>
>>>And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
>>>live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
>>>of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>>>
>>
>>NOBODY clear-cuts a hardwood forest with the expectation that it will be one
>>in the future. Clear-cutting is for softwood. where it makes sense because
>>the seedlings don't tolerate shading well.
>
>
> No one ever claimed they wanted it to grow back. They strip it for
> the hardwoods, and either leave it fallow, or build McMansions on it.
> When they build here now, EVERY tree is removed. After all, don't
> want those pesky song birds waking you up in the morning. And those
> evil trees take up space that could be used for pavement or another
> stinking, worthless house.
>
> Like this:
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-2.jpg
> The areas left with trees are where the locals wouldn't sell - yet.
>
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-5.jpg
> There are over 20 houses in this one picture alone. This mess is
> tucked in a slim alley between two older neighborhoods - that's why
> there are still trees visible.
>
> When developers originally moved into Atlanta, they built nice homes,
> left the majority of the trees, and the houses actually had yards for
> the kids.
>
> But Ryland Homes and other such maggot's interpretation of
> homebuilding is to strip everything - and I mean EVERYTHING.
> The top soil, the trees, the rocks. All that is left is red clay.
> Everything else is trucked off and sold.
>
> When you buy a bag of potting soil at Home Depot, you don't get a well
> mixed formula of perlite, vermiculite, peat moss and composted soil.
> You get a bag of Georgia Forest Topsoil - even says so on the back of
> the bags in very small print. It doesn't even matter what brand you
> buy: Miracle Grow (crap), private brands (crap), Jungle (better),
> Bayer (same crap) or Schultz (used to be a good mix, but now it's
> produced locally and is crap as well.)
>
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-7.jpg
> They just got started on this one...
>
> They attempt to alter the rolling terrain to fit their crappy slab
> homes, and then everyone surrounding this mess is left to deal with
> the rainwater erosion problems they have created. It's horrible...
> And these damned northern industrial city transplants just eat up...
>
> They have turned a forested jewel into a cesspool of foul pollution.
> Unmanaged growth and development, crooked local government officials
> hungry for money and kickbacks, and locals who sell-off to get the
> hell away from what this is turning into. It's not a pretty site...
> Even been to Compton, CA? Welcome home!
>
> Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
> It's like someone raping your child - over and over - and you're
> powerless to stop them.
>
> FWIW,
>
> Greg G.
Greg,
You need to move out of metro. I live 40 miles from 285, my closest
neighbor is 150 ft away through the woods and I can't see his house, and
if I was to drive to his house, it's damn near a 1/4 mile drive (the
neighbor on the other side would be almost a mile drive door to door).
--
Odinn - thinking it's almost time to move to the country.
> Canada is looking pretty good right now... As is western PA.
>
Actually I'm in western PA where I recently found a rather small father/son
run sawmill, just north of Pittsburgh.
On my last trip up I picked up about 35-40 bf for about $80.
It was a mixed lot of 4/4 & 7/4 cherry, 4/4 WOak, 4/4 sycamore
and a 3x3x72 piece of soft maple
All rough
Add $10 for gas and still less than $3/ bf
FWIW, even the local Rocklers' sells S3S ROak for $3.50 - $4.00
Ron
[email protected] said:
>Greg, My quote was a total, not by the bd ft. Jana
Oops! Sorry about that. Totally different situation.
Tell me where you live so I CAN move there.
I just figured you were in Cental/Southern CA.
Greg G.
Greg G. said:
>My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
>the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
>currently being turned into McMansion land So...
<snip>
>What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
Thanks Guys, for the feedback.
Well, since there were so many responses to my question, I'm gonna
respond to them all right here.
I'm near Atlanta, GA. SE US. Although development has been rabid for
the last 30 years, the last five years have brought absolutely
horrific changes into my area - and not _one_ for the better. Most of
the indigenous population has fled - running, not walking.
Used to get poplar for ~$1.72, Cherry for ~$3.65 and clear Walnut for
~$4.60. No surcharges - us dumb rednecks wouldn't stand for that for
a second. We'd have that guy lynched and on a rail to NYC. <g>
Kiln Shrinkage - get fracking serious.
Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
you'll get a bill for $250. And you don't have to dial one, either.
I can make a call to south Florida far cheaper...
Anyway, all the local mills have moved away, and the closest are now
in Augusta, Alabama and Tennessee. Subsequently, the prices have
apparently risen to whatever the market will bear - plus a bit more.
Which makes me even hotter when I see these damned carpetbagger home
builders come in and clear-cut the trees, scrape the topsoil away, bag
it all up and sell it back to the same idiots who bought their poorly
constructed homes. Just because they are _used_ to paying $400,000
for a 3BR house up North, these idiots have forced the prices here way
beyond reason. Needless to say, the poor dumbasses who sold the
property to the developers for pennies on the dollar are now appalled
at how poorly they negotiated their own deals. They probably could
have made more from selling the timber.
The distributor in question is not a Rockler or Woodcraft, but a
larger, multi-state hardwood dealer who sells to commercial interests.
And yet, I see similar prices AT Rockler - sometimes even less...
And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
As for the shop that sells walnut for $11 and soft maple for $13.30,
I'm with Dave on this on. Cripes, let me know what state you're in so
I can black it out on my map - I _sure_ don't want to move there!
Canada is looking pretty good right now... As is western PA.
I DO know that the next time I see a tree laying in the woods, fallen
from a storm, I'm going to cut that *ucker up and haul it home!
After I cut down all the trees in our yard, of course. <g>
FWIW,
Greg G.
Greg G. <[email protected]> wrote:
: Greg G. said:
: Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
: to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
: you'll get a bill for $250.
That's roughly $4.50 per minute. I can call central Mongolia for
less than that! You need to switch phone carriers.
I'm in southern AZ, and can call anywhere in the US or Canada for
under 5 cents a minute.
-- Andy Barss
welcome to southern kalifornia. that's what it looks like, la to san diego,
wall to wall.
"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> George said:
>
>>
>>"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> Greg G. said:
>>>
>>> And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
>>> live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
>>> of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>>>
>>
>>NOBODY clear-cuts a hardwood forest with the expectation that it will be
>>one
>>in the future. Clear-cutting is for softwood. where it makes sense
>>because
>>the seedlings don't tolerate shading well.
>
> No one ever claimed they wanted it to grow back. They strip it for
> the hardwoods, and either leave it fallow, or build McMansions on it.
> When they build here now, EVERY tree is removed. After all, don't
> want those pesky song birds waking you up in the morning. And those
> evil trees take up space that could be used for pavement or another
> stinking, worthless house.
>
> Like this:
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-2.jpg
> The areas left with trees are where the locals wouldn't sell - yet.
>
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-5.jpg
> There are over 20 houses in this one picture alone. This mess is
> tucked in a slim alley between two older neighborhoods - that's why
> there are still trees visible.
>
> When developers originally moved into Atlanta, they built nice homes,
> left the majority of the trees, and the houses actually had yards for
> the kids.
>
> But Ryland Homes and other such maggot's interpretation of
> homebuilding is to strip everything - and I mean EVERYTHING.
> The top soil, the trees, the rocks. All that is left is red clay.
> Everything else is trucked off and sold.
>
> When you buy a bag of potting soil at Home Depot, you don't get a well
> mixed formula of perlite, vermiculite, peat moss and composted soil.
> You get a bag of Georgia Forest Topsoil - even says so on the back of
> the bags in very small print. It doesn't even matter what brand you
> buy: Miracle Grow (crap), private brands (crap), Jungle (better),
> Bayer (same crap) or Schultz (used to be a good mix, but now it's
> produced locally and is crap as well.)
>
> http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/AerialAtlanta-7.jpg
> They just got started on this one...
>
> They attempt to alter the rolling terrain to fit their crappy slab
> homes, and then everyone surrounding this mess is left to deal with
> the rainwater erosion problems they have created. It's horrible...
> And these damned northern industrial city transplants just eat up...
>
> They have turned a forested jewel into a cesspool of foul pollution.
> Unmanaged growth and development, crooked local government officials
> hungry for money and kickbacks, and locals who sell-off to get the
> hell away from what this is turning into. It's not a pretty site...
> Even been to Compton, CA? Welcome home!
>
> Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
> It's like someone raping your child - over and over - and you're
> powerless to stop them.
>
> FWIW,
>
> Greg G.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Are you sure there is unlimited calling? I got a solicitation through the
> mail and there was a 100 minute limit for long distance.
Woops I am wrong. Unlimited calling it is.
Mark said:
>I understand where you are coming from Greg. Seems like every time I
>turn around the lumber industry has found a way to squeak a bit more
>out of us. Plywood dimensions keep getting thinner and thinner ( I
>recently bought some 1/2" shop grade that was barely above 3/8). And my
>local hardwood supplier charges a "straight Lining" charge of 10% on
>all domestic lumber they carry. Claiming its S3S lumber. Can't figure
>out why they just don't add it into the marked price. It artifically
>makes the price on the rack look cheaper...marketing tactic I guess.
>Even then I have to joint it every time and usually end up removing
>more than 1/8" to get it true.
>I just got some 5/4 mahogany (s2s) and it was less than an inch thick.
>And the veneer on hardwood plywood is so thin these days that I reject
>a sheet even if it's got a "shipping" mark on it. I know if I try and
>clean it up by sanding the black mark off I risk burning right through
>it. And have you bought dimensional construction lumber lately? I see
>why more and more housing is using steel studs. Wood studs are
>expensive and crappy. Remember the reason a 2x4 stud is 3 1/2 by 1 1/2
>is because the mill cut off the bad parts. Now days it would be a tooth
>pick.
>Mark
Yeah, the sad thing is, I looked at every piece of 'cabinet' plywood
in the place, there was a lot of it, and every sheet of 3/4" was 5
rough plys and the veneer was paper thin. Best looking stuff in there
was some Baltic birch in odd sizes. I think it was 15 ply - Imported.
I'm going to have to find a better shop - preferably down a long dirt
road in the middle of nowhere - owned by a guy who has been there 40
years, and who built and maintains his own equipment.
I actually went there looking for totally rough lumber.
Honest to God 4/4 stuff. You end up having to surface it anyway, and
their equipment alignment generally leaves much to be desired.
A board edged at 87 degrees is wasted wood - not to mention that wave
in the middle. And I _will_ take a dial caliper with me next time...
My first home was constructed of 2x4s that actually measured
1 5/8" x 3 5/8" - imagine that...
Greg G.
tyvek the conquerer said:
>You southern girls really can get worked up can't you?
>The party is fucking over!!
>I am Tyvec the Conquerer!!
>I rule the minds of your idiot children with my commercials. I prepare
>your moron teenagers to be cannon fodder with my violent films. I rule
>what's left of your minds with CNN and my fake voting machine.
>North America is a workcamp. You will die as slaves and then we will
>begin the 1000 year reign of our Master Race of Corporate Investors!
>Resistance is Futile! You will be assimilated. Give me your TOPSOIL!
>Now button up your bib overalls, countryboy.
>Bwaaaahahahaha,....ha!!
As for the southern girls comment - Here, let me bend you over my
hitchin' post while my kinfolks make you squeal like a pig... <g>
As for Tyvec the Conqueror - although I can appreciate your warped
sense of humor, you probably haven't managed to conquer your
embarrassing habit of whacking off in the public restroom after seeing
a spinner at the mall, much less dominate the earth.
As for the bib overalls, Dude - I grew up in the Big City and have
never owned a pair. I spend my winters at the beaches of Florida and
California, and my leisure hours replacing defective semiconductors in
military electronic equipment on contract. I write x86 assembly code
in my sleep, and fly a Lear Jet above the clouds while your sorry butt
is humping burgers down at the corner BK.
As for the rest of it - you're pretty close to being factual there,
except that China is the workcamp, the US is the new realm of the
blind and downtrodden.
I'll give you a 7.5 on the troll meter. And I'm keeping the topsoil.
LMAO!
Greg G.
On 30 Nov 2005 12:59:33 -0800, [email protected] wrote:
>Greg G. wrote:
>
>> What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>
>About $6/bf for decent 12/4 cherry, and about $5.50 for 4/4 cherry.
>Last time I bought walnut I think it was around $6 also. This is in
>Phoenix, AZ. The lumber places I use are much more friendly about
>measuring, too.
>
>But where are you, Greg? So I know not to move there :-)
>
>PQ
I started building a bandsaw mill because of the lumber prices, I
can't afford to make anything if I buy it at the store.
Plus, I have access to at least 200 acres of woods (as long as I
don't try to log it all) and I have some tree service friends that
call me when they get something I might want.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greg, My quote was a total, not by the bd ft. Jana
>
So 3.3bf of walnut is $11? Well, that's completely different.
"Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> George wrote:
>> "Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>>>I can get that in Saskatchewan for $25CAD a month, $30 if I didn't
>>>already get high-speed internet from them too.
>
>> How do they work the taxes? US folks have taxes to provide "essential
>> service" to the poor, excise, connection taxes and 9-1-1 assessments. Do
>> these internet-based outfits charge them, or do they fall under the
>> "can't tax the internet" legislation?
>
> I think I may not have been clear--this is regular landline from the local
> telco, not VOIP.
Mine, too. Verizon is the local long distance carrier. Supposedly working on
DSL. When we returned some 18 months ago, they told my wife it would be six
months. Now, they don't respond that clearly.
"Fly-by-Night CC" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> That $4700 Corvette would be just shy of $30,000 today. But then
> consider how much more by way of amenities and safety the C-5 or C-6 has
> over that '65.
Few years ago I was in a mall and they had a display of vintage Corvettes.
One had the original price list that was about $4200. I thought to myself,
"why didn't I have one back then as they were fairly cheap?" Then I did
some simple math and realized back they it was about a year's wages..
In article <[email protected]>,
Bob G. <[email protected]> wrote:
> Fricken scary ...what EVERYTHING costs now...
Here's a website calculator I get a kick out of plugging numbers into:
<http://www.minneapolisfed.org/Research/data/us/calc/>
It's a Fed Resv Bank calculator for what the dollar amount in some year
would equal in another year.
That $4700 Corvette would be just shy of $30,000 today. But then
consider how much more by way of amenities and safety the C-5 or C-6 has
over that '65.
Some things are pretty much as they should be with respect to inflation.
Other things like houses and cars don't translate as easily since
there're other factors that contribute to today's prices above the cost
of building a similar one today.
--
Owen Lowe
The Fly-by-Night Copper Company
__________
"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
Corporate States of America and to the
Republicans for which it stands, one nation,
under debt, easily divisible, with liberty
and justice for oil."
- Wiley Miller, Non Sequitur, 1/24/05
In article <[email protected]>,
"Edwin Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Few years ago I was in a mall and they had a display of vintage Corvettes.
> One had the original price list that was about $4200. I thought to myself,
> "why didn't I have one back then as they were fairly cheap?" Then I did
> some simple math and realized back they it was about a year's wages..
Right. They were for those with disposable income then as they are
today. Many of these cars were the second car in a family. Quite common
today to have at least two cars (two are practically expected!) but in
'65 not so much - evidence of spare cash for those who did have the
Corvettes and Jags.
Also consider how many toys and additional expenses we have today that
we "just couldn't live without" compared to 40 years ago: the
aforementioned 2 cars in the family; cable TV; cell phones; computers;
internet access; and expensive convenience foods (above and beyond the
Swanson TV dinners) just to name a few.
Take a look at our shop tools compared with what our fathers had! My dad
was a chemical engineer and made a middle class living but I remember
him asking for a Stanley #7 for Christmas in the very early '70s to work
on the woodwork for the house he was building us. Today most of us would
go out and buy our own as the need arises. He had a used 4" jointer, a
used radical alarm saw, a router and a belt sander. Everything else was
done by hand or he sought out a local mill to do bulk surfacing. He
would be amazed at the upper-end shop tools I have out there.
In other words, yes things cost more than they did in the good old days
but perhaps it's in part an indicator of how much extra cash (whether
in-hand or available through borrowing) is floating around - i.e. charge
what the market will bear. This is especially evident with the housing
"bubble".
--
Owen Lowe
The Fly-by-Night Copper Company
__________
"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
Corporate States of America and to the
Republicans for which it stands, one nation,
under debt, easily divisible, with liberty
and justice for oil."
- Wiley Miller, Non Sequitur, 1/24/05
On 12/1/2005 5:40 AM Charlie Self mumbled something about the following:
> Andrew Barss wrote:
>
>>Greg G. <[email protected]> wrote:
>>: Greg G. said:
>>
>>: Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
>>: to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
>>: you'll get a bill for $250.
>>
>>
>>That's roughly $4.50 per minute. I can call central Mongolia for
>>less than that! You need to switch phone carriers.
>>
>>I'm in southern AZ, and can call anywhere in the US or Canada for
>>under 5 cents a minute.
>
>
> We have a Verizon set up for $59 a month that allows unlimited calling
> within the U.S. and Canada. No time limits, not set times, zip, nada,
> zilch. It sounds a bit high at first, but even at nickel a word, you
> can run up some major charges when your wife calls her parents or
> siblinigs and yaks for a couple, three hours, three or four times a
> week (among the joys of aging parents is keeping track of their well
> being from several hundred miles away).
>
I switched to VoIP (Sunrocket) over my high speed cable. $200 a year
(that's like $16.67 a month), unlimited calling US and Canada. There is
the issue of having no phone if the internet is out, but I have a cell
phone for those few times when that happens.
--
Odinn
RCOS #7 SENS BS ???
"The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never
worshiped anything but himself." -- Sir Richard Francis Burton
Reeky's unofficial homepage ... http://www.reeky.org
'03 FLHTI ........... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/ElectraGlide
'97 VN1500D ......... http://www.sloanclan.org/gallery/VulcanClassic
Atlanta Biker Net ... http://www.atlantabiker.net
Vulcan Riders Assoc . http://www.vulcanriders.org
rot13 [email protected] to reply
You southern girls really can get worked up can't you?
The party is fucking over!!
I am Tyvec the Conquerer!!
I rule the minds of your idiot children with my commercials. I prepare
your moron teenagers to be cannon fodder with my violent films. I rule
what's left of your minds with CNN and my fake voting machine.
North America is a workcamp. You will die as slaves and then we will
begin the 1000 year reign of our Master Race of Corporate Investors!
Resistance is Futile! You will be assimilated. Give me your TOPSOIL!
Now button up your bib overalls, countryboy.
Bwaaaahahahaha,....ha!!
On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 18:25:58 -0500, Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote:
>Greg G. said:
>
>>My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
>>the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
>>currently being turned into McMansion land So...
><snip>
>>What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>
>Thanks Guys, for the feedback.
>
>Well, since there were so many responses to my question, I'm gonna
>respond to them all right here.
>
>I'm near Atlanta, GA. SE US. Although development has been rabid for
>the last 30 years, the last five years have brought absolutely
>horrific changes into my area - and not _one_ for the better. Most of
>the indigenous population has fled - running, not walking.
>
>Used to get poplar for ~$1.72, Cherry for ~$3.65 and clear Walnut for
>~$4.60. No surcharges - us dumb rednecks wouldn't stand for that for
>a second. We'd have that guy lynched and on a rail to NYC. <g>
>Kiln Shrinkage - get fracking serious.
>
>Reminds me of freaking New Jersey, where if you call from Mullica Hill
>to Cherry Hill (less than 15 miles and in-state) for 55 minutes,
>you'll get a bill for $250. And you don't have to dial one, either.
>I can make a call to south Florida far cheaper...
>
>Anyway, all the local mills have moved away, and the closest are now
>in Augusta, Alabama and Tennessee. Subsequently, the prices have
>apparently risen to whatever the market will bear - plus a bit more.
>
>Which makes me even hotter when I see these damned carpetbagger home
>builders come in and clear-cut the trees, scrape the topsoil away, bag
>it all up and sell it back to the same idiots who bought their poorly
>constructed homes. Just because they are _used_ to paying $400,000
>for a 3BR house up North, these idiots have forced the prices here way
>beyond reason. Needless to say, the poor dumbasses who sold the
>property to the developers for pennies on the dollar are now appalled
>at how poorly they negotiated their own deals. They probably could
>have made more from selling the timber.
>
>The distributor in question is not a Rockler or Woodcraft, but a
>larger, multi-state hardwood dealer who sells to commercial interests.
>And yet, I see similar prices AT Rockler - sometimes even less...
>
>And while wood is definitely far cheaper here than in Clownifornia, I
>live in the middle of a freaking hardwood forest - thousands of acres
>of it - at least where the clear-cutters haven't gotten to yet....
>
>As for the shop that sells walnut for $11 and soft maple for $13.30,
>I'm with Dave on this on. Cripes, let me know what state you're in so
>I can black it out on my map - I _sure_ don't want to move there!
>
>Canada is looking pretty good right now... As is western PA.
>
>I DO know that the next time I see a tree laying in the woods, fallen
>from a storm, I'm going to cut that *ucker up and haul it home!
>After I cut down all the trees in our yard, of course. <g>
>
>FWIW,
>
>Greg G.
"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> mike hide said:
>
>>Here is my local supplier ,Suwannee lumber ,in Suwanee Ga . they are a
>>pleasure to deal with and their prices seem fair to me .Here is the web
>>site, see what you think in particular with regards to their selection
>>
>>www.suwaneelumber.com.
>
> I knew of them but haven't actually tried them, due to the distance.
> But their prices look better - and I saw no surcharges. It's a pretty
> good ride from here, however, I'd have to stock up to pay for the
> trip. Now if I can get SWMBO to give up that useless dining room for
> wood storage...
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Greg
Yes a long ride for me also, I live in Atlanta guess abot 20 miles round
trip .One other thing they have a shed with a good quantity of odds of all
kinds for knock down prices. So if you need the odd piece of oak etc it is a
good deal .last time I was up there I found some nice pieces of Hickory
[which I thought was oak ].....mjh
On 12/2/2005 12:49 AM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
> Odinn said:
>
>
>>On 12/1/2005 3:55 PM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
>
>
>>>Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
>>
>>Greg,
>> You need to move out of metro. I live 40 miles from 285, my closest
>>neighbor is 150 ft away through the woods and I can't see his house, and
>>if I was to drive to his house, it's damn near a 1/4 mile drive (the
>>neighbor on the other side would be almost a mile drive door to door).
>
>
> What town are you nearest to?
3.5 miles from a little town called Bethlehem (pop 320).
> I don't disagree - but I also need to have to have certain vital
> services - like High Speed Internet - for income. We do programming
> and system support work from home. I doubt I'll be making enough at
> woodworking to cover our expenses. <g>
I have high speed internet via cable. I'm in the computer industry as
well (Sr. Unix Architect used to be a Software Engineer - don't you just
love the names they use to glorify programmer and sysadmin positions)
and require it (I had satellite for a while, which barely managed).
>
> I actually drove to Cartersville for 2 years, subcontracting a job
> there, 50 miles out of Atlanta, and no sooner than I got there, the
> developers began clearing out the farmlands...
>
> Of course, the proximity of the Interstate doesn't help in that
> regard... We even looked around northern Alabama, outside of
> Huntsville as a possible solution.
>
> Same with Florida. Moved there in '90, and moved to 4 different
> cities before I gave up and moved back here.
>
> It like a plague, and I'm the carrier. :-\ I'm getting to the
> point that when I see Caterpillar yellow, I drop into a
> pseudo-epileptic fit. I've lived in cities, and don't like it.
>
> No single species should have such exclusive and overwhelming
> dominance over any area. It just ain't healthy, I tell ya...
>
> And before I forget, thanks for the link to the Bobtail Critter
> Sawmill. This is about what I'm looking for...
Okay, don't move out here, it's already getting too crowded. We had a
traffic jam on my road yesterday (I was behind 2 cars doing 43 in a 45
mph zone) and I don't need it worse.
--
Odinn - seriously thinking of moving to the country before it gets too
crowded.
Odinn said:
>On 12/1/2005 3:55 PM Greg G. mumbled something about the following:
>> Sorry about the rant, but I have to live here...
>
>Greg,
> You need to move out of metro. I live 40 miles from 285, my closest
>neighbor is 150 ft away through the woods and I can't see his house, and
>if I was to drive to his house, it's damn near a 1/4 mile drive (the
>neighbor on the other side would be almost a mile drive door to door).
What town are you nearest to?
I don't disagree - but I also need to have to have certain vital
services - like High Speed Internet - for income. We do programming
and system support work from home. I doubt I'll be making enough at
woodworking to cover our expenses. <g>
I actually drove to Cartersville for 2 years, subcontracting a job
there, 50 miles out of Atlanta, and no sooner than I got there, the
developers began clearing out the farmlands...
Of course, the proximity of the Interstate doesn't help in that
regard... We even looked around northern Alabama, outside of
Huntsville as a possible solution.
Same with Florida. Moved there in '90, and moved to 4 different
cities before I gave up and moved back here.
It like a plague, and I'm the carrier. :-\ I'm getting to the
point that when I see Caterpillar yellow, I drop into a
pseudo-epileptic fit. I've lived in cities, and don't like it.
No single species should have such exclusive and overwhelming
dominance over any area. It just ain't healthy, I tell ya...
And before I forget, thanks for the link to the Bobtail Critter
Sawmill. This is about what I'm looking for...
Greg G.
On Mon, 05 Dec 2005 03:28:12 -0500, Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote:
>tyvek the conquerer said:
>
>>You southern girls really can get worked up can't you?
>>The party is fucking over!!
>>I am Tyvec the Conquerer!!
>>I rule the minds of your idiot children with my commercials. I prepare
>>your moron teenagers to be cannon fodder with my violent films. I rule
>>what's left of your minds with CNN and my fake voting machine.
>>North America is a workcamp. You will die as slaves and then we will
>>begin the 1000 year reign of our Master Race of Corporate Investors!
>>Resistance is Futile! You will be assimilated. Give me your TOPSOIL!
>>Now button up your bib overalls, countryboy.
>>Bwaaaahahahaha,....ha!!
>
>As for the southern girls comment - Here, let me bend you over my
>hitchin' post while my kinfolks make you squeal like a pig... <g>
Isn't it "kinfolk"? Oh wait, I get it. I still say that's the best
movie Burt what's-his-name ever did. Perhaps even better than the
Bandit series?
>
>As for Tyvec the Conqueror - although I can appreciate your warped
>sense of humor, you probably haven't managed to conquer your
>embarrassing habit of whacking off in the public restroom after seeing
>a spinner at the mall, much less dominate the earth.
>
Well, I am a little wrapped up in myself- agghhhhh!!
p.s. Is it true the girls are maturing earlier and exhibiting a
general tendency towards smaller breast size?
>As for the bib overalls, Dude - I grew up in the Big City and have
>never owned a pair. I spend my winters at the beaches of Florida and
>California, and my leisure hours replacing defective semiconductors in
>military electronic equipment on contract. I write x86 assembly code
>in my sleep, and fly a Lear Jet above the clouds while your sorry butt
>is humping burgers down at the corner BK.
Yeah, I hear ya, we used to have a Lear but just weren't satisfied
with it- traded it in on a Citation- came with a blond girl,.. Paris
something- oh, it's all such a blur. Besides, I could only smuggle
160 bf of black market Teak in it- we really saved a lot of money that
way.
I flunked assembler. Give the address who's next byte is the operand
next on the stack,..?
I can't believe you replace semiconductors. I thought they just
replaced the whole tank or helicopter or satellite or whatever.
And how could you ever know I work at BK? I used to work at McMansions
but they sent me home after I burnt that lady's twat shut. God that
was awful. She was nice. (although I wouldn't describe her as a
spinner).
>As for the rest of it - you're pretty close to being factual there,
>except that China is the workcamp, the US is the new realm of the
>blind and downtrodden.
Yep, the only people who have anything are the fortune 500 gang, gov
employees and,.. um, military contractors. For the rest of us it's
crumbs,.. crumbs from the rich mans table.
In WA state. For what it's worth: Planned both sides and straight
lined one edge.
Philippine Mahogany - 4/4 $4.43 bf
African " - 4/4 $6 bf
Honduras " - 4/4 $8 bf
Purple Heart - 4/4 $6.50
Okume 1088 3mil ply $32 sheet
African ribbon ply $100 sheet
Double these prices for a lumber store (they usually don't have this
stuff anyway). That's all I know, see you in church.
>I'll give you a 7.5 on the troll meter. And I'm keeping the topsoil.
>
>LMAO!
>
>
>Greg G.
Odinn said:
>> Greg G. said:
>>
>>>My supply of self-harvested wood doesn't include walnut or maple, and
>>>the small sawmill I used to frequent has been abandoned and is
>>>currently being turned into McMansion land So...
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>What do _you_ pay locally for these examples of domestic hardwoods?
>>
>Greg,
> What area of Atlanta? I'm about 40 mile ENE towards Athens and I
>haven't seen those prices anywhere near here.
I'm on the west side, 12 miles out from Buckhead.
Know of a good place?
Greg G.
"Bob G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>>On my 21st birthday, I called home (Westchester County, in New York) from
>>Kaneohe Bay, Hawaii. Cost of a 20 minute call was about $115. A long
>>damned
>>time ago, and at that time I was making, if memory serves, about $124 a
>>month, net. Lance corporal, USMC. Big boost the next year, going to E4 and
>>over 3. Up to $170 a month.
>>
> Charlie you are younger then me.... I still remember my first check
> from the US Army... $18.46 cents...NET ...and 16 bucks of that was
> traveling pay from Ft Bragg to Walter Reed... That check I really
> should have not cashed ..I should have had it framed and hung it on my
> wall...
Hell, I had to be younger than somebody! That was in 1959, for anyone who
cares.
>
> Prices are relative,,, My home cost less then $25,000 when I
> purchased it in 1965 ...When my dad died a few years ago I discovered
> he paid either $1160 or $1610 for my entire 1st year in college when I
> was going thru his things... even laughed at his comment that I better
> cut my beer consumption because he was going broke "supporting" me...
My first semester's tuition at Albany State (now the great and pretentious
University at Albany)
was 200 bucks, IIRC. and $400 for a semester in the dorms, with meals. One
semester and I went out, against the rules, and got my own apartment. It was
that or
kill a college kid.
>
> My first job in High School was at a burger joint... we sold them fro
> 15 cents each..or 7 for a dollar... My 1951 V8 Hot Rod drank gas that
> cost me 19 cents a gallon... and ran on "May Pop" brand tires ..like
> one just may pop... at any time...I think I averaged 2-3 flat tires a
> week...
>
> Now back to the original posters comments... I have no idea if I can
> afford to continue buying wood... Before I retired I stock piled a
> lifetime supply of Walnut, Cherry and Poplar...(what A laugh...I must
> have died a few years ago because it only took about 5 years before I
> had to float a loan to buy a small supply to make my Daughters dinning
> room set...(Table & Hutch,...no darn chairs...) ..
>
> Fricken scary ...what EVERYTHING costs now...
>
> My "Real Estate" Taxes per year today .. are greater then what I paid
> in 1965 for my mortgage (P&I and taxes)... My first "new" car was a
> 1965 Corvette 396 BB purchased in 1966 for $4,700 ..today just the
> knock off wheels for that car are worth that much...
My niece, her husband and daughter came down from LI a few weeks ago, and we
talked of
cabbages, kings, RE taxes and things. First, they are paying approximately
three times the
assessed value of my home for a similar sized place (though nicer) on Long
Island. They are also
paying approximately 16 times what I am paying in RE and school taxes. Their
tax bill is on the
order of $167 per MONTH more than I pay for a year. I was born and raised in
Westchester County, so
high RE taxes come as no surprise, but that's asinine.
>
> Honestly as much as I bitch about what I have to pay for lumber I
> really feel sorry for my grandchildren and what they have to pay for a
> little, but nice, townhouse with a 200 sq foot back yard.....even the
> dog can not get any exercise in that small yard...
>
> Ok..
> Off my soap box...
Our grandchildren, with minor exceptions, will scrape by. Our great
grandchildren will not. We--and this is
all inclusive--have gobbled their resources and their money. It has nothing
to do with SS, but with our allowing
idiot politicians over the past 65 years to piss away money at a rate that
would scare anyone with half a brain. We
make jokes about cost overruns and pork, and nothing EVER gets done about
it. The national debt mounts, and
we slither along--and that's how the kids will probably view us. As a bunch
of thieving snakes.
My soapbox.
>
> The one check I will not have to write will be to the Funeral Home...
> what a good though that is... Maybe I should run out and buy some pine
> for a "box" today.... who knows what the wife will have to pay per Bf
> of that crap in a few years...
>
Yeah, well...if they waste a box on me, I'll come back and haunt 'em.