Pawn Shop Tool Score: Router & ROS

On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 9:02:46 AM UTC-4, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 8/21/2017 10:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>
>
>
> >>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
> >>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Nothing says that only used items
> >>> can be pawned.
> >>
> >> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
> >> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
> >> factory or original retailer, everything is used.
> >
> > Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
> > the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
> > the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
> > been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?
> >
> >> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
> >> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.
> >
> > There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
> > used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
> > third party is used. Read on...
> >
> >> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
> >> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.
>
> Previously titled = used
>
> >
>
> >
> > How about this: Let's say I buy a miter saw from Home Depot and sell it
> > to you, unopened, for half price. Would you tell your buddies that you bought
> > a used miter saw for half the price of a new one or would you tell them that
> > some idiot sold you a brand new miter saw for half price?
> >
>
> Substitute "pre-owned"
>
> Reality is, if it is brand new in a pawn shop it falls into two
> categories.

Thank you making my point. There are indeed brand new items in pawn shops,
contrary to what russell claims.

> New, as in the dealer bought it through regular channels, perhaps as a
> clearance item. The other is stolen. No one is going to Home Depot and
> buying a $100 tool and taking it to a pawn shop to borrow $35 on it.

While those 2 reasons probably cover many of the new items found in a pawn
shop, there are other ways for a brand new item to end up there.

If you've ever bought a "new" item on eBay or Craigslist, you know that there
are indeed people that buy an item, never use it and then choose to get
rid of it. I bought a brand new power washer and a brand new bike rack on
Craigslist. Regular folks, an old guy and a young couple. I seriously doubt
the items were stolen. These folks could have chosen to take the items to a
pawn shop and sold them - not borrowed on them, but sold them for the cash,
quick and easy.

An item could also have been a gift that they had no need for. Once again,
take the item to a pawn shop and sell it. Quick and easy and the seller
is ahead by the cash they received because they never laid out any money
for the item.

On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 1:31:05 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:29:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> >
> > > On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > > > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> > > > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> > > > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> > > > router by hand.
> > > >
> > > > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> > > > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> > > > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> > > > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> > > > pawn shop.
> > > >
> > > > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> > > > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> > > > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
> > > >
> > > > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> > > >
> > > > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> > > > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> > > > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> > > >
> > > > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> > > > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
> >
> > > You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
> > >
> >
> > Not true. (The "used" part)
> >
> > From Wikipedia:
> >
> > "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
> > offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
> > collateral."
> >
> > While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
> > brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
>
>
>
> Nothing says that only used items
> > can be pawned.
>
> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
> factory or original retailer, everything is used.

Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?

> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.

There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
third party is used. Read on...

> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.

Apples and oranges. First off, new cars are indeed driven of the lot and
still sold as new. It's called a test drive. That doesn't typically happen
with a tool. If you test drive a generator or miter saw, the best it'll be
from then on is factory refurbished. But aside from that, in the case of a
car that was sold and then driven by the buyer, there is no argument that it
immediately becomes a used car. It was *used* by someone. On the other hand,
the Honda generators at the pawn shop were never driven. They were never
started. They were never even taken out of the box. In other words, they were never *used*. Heck, from that perspective, they are newer than the new car
that has 100 miles worth of test drives on it.

How about this: Let's say I buy a miter saw from Home Depot and sell it
to you, unopened, for half price. Would you tell your buddies that you bought
a used miter saw for half the price of a new one or would you tell them that
some idiot sold you a brand new miter saw for half price?

On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 7:30:19 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
=20
> >We used to put our SS# on our tools. Imagine that now...
>=20
> How about your company's tax ID number?

I know that must be tongue in cheek...

Giving away your tax ID number to anyone and everyone give any hacker, malw=
are user, lurker, etc., a great place to start to access your company busin=
ess and its financial accounts.

I know that the group here have only been employees of the highest moral va=
lues with unquestionable integrity... but...

What if you had an employee or subcontractor that you wrote a check to? He=
then has your bank, your account number, the routing number, etc. Truthfu=
lly, you give away your ID# when you issue a W2 or 1099. But after going t=
o a couple of business online security classes, they have found that direct=
employees are not as likely to be the culprit of identity theft as someone=
you don't know. So drinking beer with the guys one night, someone notices=
your Federal Tax ID# on a drill, and says... "hey... is that Robert's comp=
any tax ID?"

Let your mind wander. There is a reason you see as little personal/private=
information available anywhere, only as needed. Giving up my tax ID# is n=
o different than you putting your SS# on your stuff. A company is an entit=
y; it has credit, pays taxes, has liabilities and can enter into transactio=
ns.

Like you, even though your SS# is easily found and known by your employers,=
banks, governmental benefit institutions, anyone that pays you interest an=
d on and on... you still don't feel good about putting it on your car as a =
bumper sticker for everyone to see, right?

I don't tools scattered across a job with that information on them, or stol=
en to get it.

Oh yeah... the green? It was this color, and I covered the tools with it:

http://wallpapercave.com/wp/ZYOoTF8.jpg

Robert

On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:27:31 PM UTC-4, G Ross wrote:
> DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> > router by hand.
> >
> > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> > pawn shop.
> >
> > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
> >
> > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> >
> > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> >
> > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
> >
> Nice looking router! Looks better than mine!
>
> --
> GW Ross

Thanks! Interesting thing is that it came with this 5/16" Straight Dovetail
Router Bit with 8mm Shank. There was a guide bushing installed and 8mm reducer
in the 1/2" collet.

https://www.woodcraft.com/products/woodriver-leigh-140-8-5-16-straight-dovetail-router-bit-8mm-sh

Somebody was doing something special with it, but they didn't do it for
very long. ;-)
There was a guide bushing and 8mm reducer in the 1/2" collet.

On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 15:00:31 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
wrote:

>On 8/21/2017 9:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 1:31:05 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:29:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>>>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>>>>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>>>>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>>>>>> router by hand.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>>>>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>>>>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>>>>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>>>>>> pawn shop.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>>>>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>>>>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>>>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>>>>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>>>>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>>>>
>>>>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Not true. (The "used" part)
>>>>
>>>> From Wikipedia:
>>>>
>>>> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
>>>> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
>>>> collateral."
>>>>
>>>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
>>>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Nothing says that only used items
>>>> can be pawned.
>>>
>>> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
>>> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
>>> factory or original retailer, everything is used.
>>
>> Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
>> the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
>> the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
>> been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?
>>
>>> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
>>> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.
>>
>> There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
>> used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
>> third party is used. Read on...
>>
>>> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
>>> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.
>>
>> Apples and oranges. First off, new cars are indeed driven of the lot and
>> still sold as new. It's called a test drive. That doesn't typically happen
>> with a tool. If you test drive a generator or miter saw, the best it'll be
>> from then on is factory refurbished. But aside from that, in the case of a
>> car that was sold and then driven by the buyer, there is no argument that it
>> immediately becomes a used car. It was *used* by someone. On the other hand,
>> the Honda generators at the pawn shop were never driven. They were never
>> started. They were never even taken out of the box. In other words, they were never *used*. Heck, from that perspective, they are newer than the new car
>> that has 100 miles worth of test drives on it.
>
>Technically a vehicle is not considered used until it is titled with
>someone's name is on it other than the manufacturer/dealer.
>Even long ago the new demo vehicles that I drove up until 6 months or
>6,000 miles were considered new since the title was never issued with a
>buyers name on it. Warranties were extended the amount of time/miles
>that the vehicle was driven up to 6/6K.

I believe it's the same in most states. However, where I've lived,
vehicles used in a "rental" fleet, even if the rental rate is zero
(loaner), are required to be registered as a rental vehicle.

On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 21:27:26 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:10:36 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:17:02 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:32:22 AM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
>> >
>> >> Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first
>> >> place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
>> >> One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instruments.
>> >> You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the place
>> >> to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do
>> >> something about enforcing laws about it.
>> >
>> >Here in Texas, pawn shops are carefully controlled and licensed. But, that only keeps the most obvious fencing of stolen goods activity at bay.
>> >
>> >Having had enough tools stolen to equip the Corp of Engineers, I don't even go look for my tools when they are stolen. If they are pawned, they can be pawned for 10 days, 14 days, 30 days, or indefinitely. So say the pawned items sit in the back of the pawn shop out of sight for a couple of weeks (or more). Are you going to hit every pawn shop in town looking your tools every day looking for your tools after an undetermined/unknown amount of time passes?
>>
>> How about spraying all your tools hot pink? No one would steal them
>> and if they did, no one would buy them from a pawn shop. Sorta the
>> Joe Arpaio theft defense.
>>
>
>Tried "Mary Kay" pink, hot pink, gremlin green, and an awful color of purple. Doesn't slow anyone down. Your tools look like shit, I hated using them and they were stolen just the same. Tons of tools out there safety orange and hot pink. The problem is that no matter how annoying the color is, most can be wiped off at with some mineral spirits. Or they take a tiny bit less at the pawn shop. Worse, no matter how unusual the color, it doesn't prove ownership.

I was thinking of something a bit more permanent but then again,
modern tools sorta look like they were designed by Joe Arpaio. Lime
green? Really?

>We used to put our SS# on our tools. Imagine that now...

How about your company's tax ID number?

>Then we put our phone numbers on them, and people ground them off (aluminum housing, less than 5 minutes, plastic a couple with sandpaper) so no one marks against theft anymore.
>
>We spray some of our tools and mark some of them if we are working on sites with others just so we can keep them separate, but it has little to do with theft protection.
>
><<< I >>> would like to have some kind of device that would cripple or maim the thief. I cannot tell you how completely delighted I was when the police found me after canvassing our neighborhood to find the owners of stolen property. When talking to the police, the way they "caught" the thieves was by chasing them down (two on a motorcycle with a couple of pillow cases full of stuff) and in the heat of the chase they had a wreck that hospitalized them both, and nearly killed one.
>
>I think the police was a little disturbed when I told him "too bad you guys didn't run over them". But, that time I got my 1/2 sheet sander back. Funny, when I told my fellow contractors about the motorcycle wreck and the near death of one of them, they all expressed their disappointment (and the bad luck) at the lack of a fatality as well.
>
>Robert

On 8/21/2017 6:11 AM, G Ross wrote:
> DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:27:31 PM UTC-4, G Ross wrote:
>>> DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>> > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and
>>> built
>>> > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look
>>> on-line for a
>>> > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to
>>> use the
>>> > router by hand.
>>> >
>>> > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot,
>>> etc. They
>>> > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I
>>> decided
>>> > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to
>>> come with
>>> > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to
>>> be a
>>> > pawn shop.
>>> >
>>> > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the
>>> router and
>>> > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is
>>> in better
>>> > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>> >
>>> > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>> >
>>> > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>> > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing
>>> sketchy.
>>> > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>> >
>>> > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with
>>> the ROS.
>>> > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>>> >
>>> Nice looking router!  Looks better than mine!
>>>
>>> --
>>> GW Ross
>>
>> Thanks!  Interesting thing is that it came with this 5/16" Straight
>> Dovetail
>> Router Bit with 8mm Shank. There was a guide bushing installed and 8mm
>> reducer
>> in the 1/2" collet.
>>
>> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/woodriver-leigh-140-8-5-16-straight-dovetail-router-bit-8mm-sh
>>
>>
>> Somebody was doing something special with it, but they didn't do it for
>> very long. ;-)
>> There was a guide bushing and 8mm reducer in the 1/2" collet.
>>
> It's early in the morning, but I'm having trouble wrapping my mind
> around a straight dovetail. Sorta like a 180 degree angle.
>

Leigh Jigs used an 8mm shank straight bit for cutting through dove tails
on their jig.

On 8/20/2017 8:07 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:27:31 PM UTC-4, G Ross wrote:
>> DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>>> router by hand.
>>>
>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>>> pawn shop.
>>>
>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>>
>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>>
>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>>
>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>>>
>> Nice looking router! Looks better than mine!
>>
>> --
>> GW Ross
>
> Thanks! Interesting thing is that it came with this 5/16" Straight Dovetail
> Router Bit with 8mm Shank. There was a guide bushing installed and 8mm reducer
> in the 1/2" collet.
>
> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/woodriver-leigh-140-8-5-16-straight-dovetail-router-bit-8mm-sh
>
> Somebody was doing something special with it, but they didn't do it for
> very long. ;-)
> There was a guide bushing and 8mm reducer in the 1/2" collet.
>

He probably had a Leigh DT jig for sale too. That 8mm bit was a common
size for cutting through dove tails in the Leigh, IIRC.

On 8/20/2017 10:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>
>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>>> router by hand.
>>>
>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>>> pawn shop.
>>>
>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>>
>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>>
>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>>
>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>
>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>>
>
> Not true. (The "used" part)
>
> From Wikipedia:
>
> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
> collateral."
>
> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop. Nothing says that only used items
> can be pawned.
>

Yeah! Stolen new items can be pawned too. :!) Typically presents that
were unneeded.

On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 4:00:46 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
> On 8/21/2017 9:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 1:31:05 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> >> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:29:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> >>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> >>>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> >>>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> >>>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> >>>>> router by hand.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> >>>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> >>>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> >>>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> >>>>> pawn shop.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> >>>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> >>>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> >>>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> >>>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> >>>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
> >>>
> >>>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Not true. (The "used" part)
> >>>
> >>> From Wikipedia:
> >>>
> >>> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
> >>> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
> >>> collateral."
> >>>
> >>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
> >>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Nothing says that only used items
> >>> can be pawned.
> >>
> >> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
> >> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
> >> factory or original retailer, everything is used.
> >
> > Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
> > the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
> > the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
> > been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?
> >
> >> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
> >> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.
> >
> > There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
> > used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
> > third party is used. Read on...
> >
> >> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
> >> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.
> >
> > Apples and oranges. First off, new cars are indeed driven of the lot and
> > still sold as new. It's called a test drive. That doesn't typically happen
> > with a tool. If you test drive a generator or miter saw, the best it'll be
> > from then on is factory refurbished. But aside from that, in the case of a
> > car that was sold and then driven by the buyer, there is no argument that it
> > immediately becomes a used car. It was *used* by someone. On the other hand,
> > the Honda generators at the pawn shop were never driven. They were never
> > started. They were never even taken out of the box. In other words, they were never *used*. Heck, from that perspective, they are newer than the new car
> > that has 100 miles worth of test drives on it.
>
> Technically a vehicle is not considered used until it is titled with
> someone's name is on it other than the manufacturer/dealer.
> Even long ago the new demo vehicles that I drove up until 6 months or
> 6,000 miles were considered new since the title was never issued with a
> buyers name on it. Warranties were extended the amount of time/miles
> that the vehicle was driven up to 6/6K.
>

I agree. It's russel that said: "Just like the instant a car drives off
the dealer's lot, its USED."

You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!



On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> router by hand.
>
> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> pawn shop.
>
> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>
> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>
> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>
> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)

On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:

> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> > router by hand.
> >
> > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> > pawn shop.
> >
> > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
> >
> > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> >
> > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> >
> > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)

> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>

Not true. (The "used" part)

From Wikipedia:

"A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
collateral."

While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop. Nothing says that only used items
can be pawned.

On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:10:36 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:17:02 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>=20
> >On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:32:22 AM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
> >=20
> >> Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first=
=20
> >> place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
> >> One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instrument=
s.
> >> You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the pla=
ce=20
> >> to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do=20
> >> something about enforcing laws about it.
> >
> >Here in Texas, pawn shops are carefully controlled and licensed. But, t=
hat only keeps the most obvious fencing of stolen goods activity at bay.
> >
> >Having had enough tools stolen to equip the Corp of Engineers, I don't e=
ven go look for my tools when they are stolen. If they are pawned, they ca=
n be pawned for 10 days, 14 days, 30 days, or indefinitely. So say the pawn=
ed items sit in the back of the pawn shop out of sight for a couple of week=
s (or more). Are you going to hit every pawn shop in town looking your too=
ls every day looking for your tools after an undetermined/unknown amount of=
time passes?
>=20
> How about spraying all your tools hot pink? No one would steal them
> and if they did, no one would buy them from a pawn shop. Sorta the
> Joe Arpaio theft defense.
>=20

Tried "Mary Kay" pink, hot pink, gremlin green, and an awful color of purpl=
e. Doesn't slow anyone down. Your tools look like shit, I hated using the=
m and they were stolen just the same. Tons of tools out there safety orang=
e and hot pink. The problem is that no matter how annoying the color is, m=
ost can be wiped off at with some mineral spirits. Or they take a tiny bit=
less at the pawn shop. Worse, no matter how unusual the color, it doesn't=
prove ownership.

We used to put our SS# on our tools. Imagine that now...

Then we put our phone numbers on them, and people ground them off (aluminum=
housing, less than 5 minutes, plastic a couple with sandpaper) so no one m=
arks against theft anymore.

We spray some of our tools and mark some of them if we are working on sites=
with others just so we can keep them separate, but it has little to do wit=
h theft protection.

<<< I >>> would like to have some kind of device that would cripple or maim=
the thief. I cannot tell you how completely delighted I was when the poli=
ce found me after canvassing our neighborhood to find the owners of stolen =
property. When talking to the police, the way they "caught" the thieves wa=
s by chasing them down (two on a motorcycle with a couple of pillow cases f=
ull of stuff) and in the heat of the chase they had a wreck that hospitaliz=
ed them both, and nearly killed one.

I think the police was a little disturbed when I told him "too bad you guys=
didn't run over them". But, that time I got my 1/2 sheet sander back. Fu=
nny, when I told my fellow contractors about the motorcycle wreck and the n=
ear death of one of them, they all expressed their disappointment (and the =
bad luck) at the lack of a fatality as well.

Robert

On Sun, 20 Aug 2017 15:34:53 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>router by hand.
>
>The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>pawn shop.

Nice find! I've had a PC691 (prefer the 'D' handle) for decades.
Great router.
>
>I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.

I've never found anything in a pawn shop that was worth having. Most
of what I've seen is beat up junk and they're asking nearly what a new
one costs (sometimes more). You did good.
>
>http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>
>I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>
>(I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)

On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:32:22 AM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
=20
> Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first=20
> place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
> One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instruments.
> You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the place=
=20
> to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do=20
> something about enforcing laws about it.

Here in Texas, pawn shops are carefully controlled and licensed. But, that=
only keeps the most obvious fencing of stolen goods activity at bay.

Having had enough tools stolen to equip the Corp of Engineers, I don't even=
go look for my tools when they are stolen. If they are pawned, they can b=
e pawned for 10 days, 14 days, 30 days, or indefinitely. So say the pawned =
items sit in the back of the pawn shop out of sight for a couple of weeks (=
or more). Are you going to hit every pawn shop in town looking your tools =
every day looking for your tools after an undetermined/unknown amount of ti=
me passes?

Can't do it, no one has that much time. Even if you find your stuff, which=
I did one time by accident, it is a chore to get it back. You have to pro=
ve it was yours, prove it was stolen, and then get the police involved. If=
it gets that far and the police determine an item was stolen then the pawn=
broker simply gives it back to you. He gets a mark on his record, and isn'=
t in the State's radar unless he has several incidents a year.

To complicate that, they broke up a ring of thieves that were working out o=
f Houston (a 3 1/2 hour drive from here) that were literally raiding constr=
uction sites and trailers during the day, then driving their stolen merchan=
dise straight to San Antonio to pawn. Since the local cops don't share the=
information unless requested, the stolen goods simply fly under the radar =
and are easily pawned, especially if they are pawned the same day.

When I had a buddy that worked at a pawn shop, he told me that they figure =
about half to 75% of the stuff they have at any given time was probably sto=
len.

Robert

On 8/21/2017 11:27 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:10:36 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:17:02 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:32:22 AM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
>>>
>>>> Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first
>>>> place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
>>>> One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instruments.
>>>> You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the place
>>>> to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do
>>>> something about enforcing laws about it.
>>>
>>> Here in Texas, pawn shops are carefully controlled and licensed. But, that only keeps the most obvious fencing of stolen goods activity at bay.
>>>
>>> Having had enough tools stolen to equip the Corp of Engineers, I don't even go look for my tools when they are stolen. If they are pawned, they can be pawned for 10 days, 14 days, 30 days, or indefinitely. So say the pawned items sit in the back of the pawn shop out of sight for a couple of weeks (or more). Are you going to hit every pawn shop in town looking your tools every day looking for your tools after an undetermined/unknown amount of time passes?
>>
>> How about spraying all your tools hot pink? No one would steal them
>> and if they did, no one would buy them from a pawn shop. Sorta the
>> Joe Arpaio theft defense.
>>
>
> Tried "Mary Kay" pink, hot pink, gremlin green, and an awful color of purple. Doesn't slow anyone down. Your tools look like shit, I hated using them and they were stolen just the same. Tons of tools out there safety orange and hot pink. The problem is that no matter how annoying the color is, most can be wiped off at with some mineral spirits. Or they take a tiny bit less at the pawn shop. Worse, no matter how unusual the color, it doesn't prove ownership.
>
> We used to put our SS# on our tools. Imagine that now...
>
> Then we put our phone numbers on them, and people ground them off (aluminum housing, less than 5 minutes, plastic a couple with sandpaper) so no one marks against theft anymore.
>
> We spray some of our tools and mark some of them if we are working on sites with others just so we can keep them separate, but it has little to do with theft protection.
>
> <<< I >>> would like to have some kind of device that would cripple or maim the thief. I cannot tell you how completely delighted I was when the police found me after canvassing our neighborhood to find the owners of stolen property. When talking to the police, the way they "caught" the thieves was by chasing them down (two on a motorcycle with a couple of pillow cases full of stuff) and in the heat of the chase they had a wreck that hospitalized them both, and nearly killed one.
>
> I think the police was a little disturbed when I told him "too bad you guys didn't run over them". But, that time I got my 1/2 sheet sander back. Funny, when I told my fellow contractors about the motorcycle wreck and the near death of one of them, they all expressed their disappointment (and the bad luck) at the lack of a fatality as well.
>
> Robert
>

A well hidden GPS device hidden inside the tool, similar to the where is
my iPhone app, might be helpful.

On 8/21/2017 9:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 1:31:05 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:29:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>>>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>>>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>>>>> router by hand.
>>>>>
>>>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>>>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>>>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>>>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>>>>> pawn shop.
>>>>>
>>>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>>>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>>>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>>>>
>>>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>>>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>>>>
>>>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>>>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>>>
>>>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not true. (The "used" part)
>>>
>>> From Wikipedia:
>>>
>>> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
>>> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
>>> collateral."
>>>
>>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
>>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
>>
>>
>>
>> Nothing says that only used items
>>> can be pawned.
>>
>> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
>> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
>> factory or original retailer, everything is used.
>
> Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
> the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
> the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
> been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?
>
>> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
>> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.
>
> There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
> used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
> third party is used. Read on...
>
>> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
>> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.
>
> Apples and oranges. First off, new cars are indeed driven of the lot and
> still sold as new. It's called a test drive. That doesn't typically happen
> with a tool. If you test drive a generator or miter saw, the best it'll be
> from then on is factory refurbished. But aside from that, in the case of a
> car that was sold and then driven by the buyer, there is no argument that it
> immediately becomes a used car. It was *used* by someone. On the other hand,
> the Honda generators at the pawn shop were never driven. They were never
> started. They were never even taken out of the box. In other words, they were never *used*. Heck, from that perspective, they are newer than the new car
> that has 100 miles worth of test drives on it.

Technically a vehicle is not considered used until it is titled with
someone's name is on it other than the manufacturer/dealer.
Even long ago the new demo vehicles that I drove up until 6 months or
6,000 miles were considered new since the title was never issued with a
buyers name on it. Warranties were extended the amount of time/miles
that the vehicle was driven up to 6/6K.



>
> How about this: Let's say I buy a miter saw from Home Depot and sell it
> to you, unopened, for half price. Would you tell your buddies that you bought
> a used miter saw for half the price of a new one or would you tell them that
> some idiot sold you a brand new miter saw for half price?
>

On 8/21/2017 10:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:



>>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
>>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.
>>
>>
>>
>> Nothing says that only used items
>>> can be pawned.
>>
>> But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS
>> the person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original
>> factory or original retailer, everything is used.
>
> Really? So you would consider the Honda generators in the sealed boxes with
> the intact plastic strapping as "used"? What about the Dewalt miter saws in
> the sealed boxes, still encased in the shrink-wrap plastic? If it's never
> been out of the box, how can it be considered used? Used by who?
>
>> If your router is not bought directly from Porter Cable, or one of its
>> authorized retailers (Home Depot, etc.), it is used.
>
> There is no doubt in my mind that the router I bought at the pawn shop is
> used. However, that doesn't mean that *every* router that I buy from a
> third party is used. Read on...
>
>> Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's lot, its USED. The
>> dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and say it is brand new.

Previously titled = used

>

>
> How about this: Let's say I buy a miter saw from Home Depot and sell it
> to you, unopened, for half price. Would you tell your buddies that you bought
> a used miter saw for half the price of a new one or would you tell them that
> some idiot sold you a brand new miter saw for half price?
>

Substitute "pre-owned"

Reality is, if it is brand new in a pawn shop it falls into two
categories. New, as in the dealer bought it through regular channels,
perhaps as a clearance item. The other is stolen. No one is going to
Home Depot and buying a $100 tool and taking it to a pawn shop to borrow
$35 on it.

On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 4:24:49 PM UTC-5, Bob La Londe wrote:
=20
> ***********************
>=20
> Sounds like you did good. My luck at pawn shops is usually everything I=
=20
> want is priced higher than new retail and they expect me to be thankful i=
f=20
> they lower the price to new retail for me.

That's the way it is here, too. They are selling the used tools they have =
for much more than the price in the stores. I was a more than surprised at=
that since I could easily go to Home Depot's site online while I was in th=
e store and find the regular price of tools, etc. The clerk I talked to sa=
id they expect to take off about 10-20%, and most people think they are get=
ting a deal.

The other side of the equation that he pointed out is that Home Depot won't=
finance, and they will.

Strangely, one of the last things I bought from a pawn shop is similar to D=
D's story. I found an older saw that I really wanted on EBAY and bid it up=
once I found it was located here in my hometown. The ebay ad said no ship=
ping if picked up. I thought was an individual as he answered my questions=
right away, but nope. It was the EBAY department of one of our local pawn=
chains. When I picked up the saw, it still had the tag on it that was mar=
ked at $50 more (for the store sale) than I paid for it.

A lot of smoke and mirrors, these days.

Robert

On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 9:24:16 PM UTC-4, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 8/20/17 5:34 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> > router by hand.
> >
> > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> > pawn shop.
> >
> > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
> >
> > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> >
> > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> >
> > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
> >
>
> You thoroughly suck.


Yes...yes I do. ;-)

On 8/20/2017 11:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

>
>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>>
>
> Not true. (The "used" part)
>
> From Wikipedia:
>
> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
> collateral."
>
> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were some
> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop. Nothing says that only used items
> can be pawned.
>

Right. Some stuff is shoplifted and never opened when pawned. Must be
a lot of defective chargers too, many of the drills don't have them.

On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:29:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 10:59:06 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wro=
te:
> =20
> > On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 5:34:58 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and bu=
ilt
> > > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line =
for a
> > > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to us=
e the=20
> > > router by hand.
> > >=20
> > > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc.=
They
> > > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I dec=
ided=20
> > > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come=
with=20
> > > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be=
a=20
> > > pawn shop.=20
> > >=20
> > > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router=
and
> > > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in =
better=20
> > > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.=20
> > >=20
> > > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
> > >=20
> > > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> > > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketc=
hy.
> > > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
> > >=20
> > > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the=
ROS.=20
> > > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>=20
> > You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
> >
>=20
> Not true. (The "used" part)
>=20
> From Wikipedia:
>=20
> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that=
=20
> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
> collateral."
>=20
> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were so=
me
> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop.=20



Nothing says that only used items=20
> can be pawned.

But your definition says "personal property used as collateral". UNLESS th=
e person (personal) is the source manufacturer or they are the original fac=
tory or original retailer, everything is used. If your router is not bough=
t directly from Porter Cable, or one of its authorized retailers (Home Depo=
t, etc.), it is used. Just like the instant a car drives off the dealer's =
lot, its USED. The dealer that sold it cannot buy it back the next day and=
say it is brand new.

On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 08:18:38 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
wrote:

>On 8/20/2017 8:07 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:27:31 PM UTC-4, G Ross wrote:
>>> DerbyDad03 wrote:
>>>> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>>>> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>>>> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>>>> router by hand.
>>>>
>>>> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>>>> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>>>> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>>>> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>>>> pawn shop.
>>>>
>>>> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>>>> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>>>> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>>>>
>>>> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>>>>
>>>> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>>>> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>>>> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>>>>
>>>> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>>>> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>>>>
>>> Nice looking router! Looks better than mine!
>>>
>>> --
>>> GW Ross
>>
>> Thanks! Interesting thing is that it came with this 5/16" Straight Dovetail
>> Router Bit with 8mm Shank. There was a guide bushing installed and 8mm reducer
>> in the 1/2" collet.
>>
>> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/woodriver-leigh-140-8-5-16-straight-dovetail-router-bit-8mm-sh
>>
>> Somebody was doing something special with it, but they didn't do it for
>> very long. ;-)
>> There was a guide bushing and 8mm reducer in the 1/2" collet.
>>
>
>He probably had a Leigh DT jig for sale too. That 8mm bit was a common
>size for cutting through dove tails in the Leigh, IIRC.

8mm is a common shank for Festool routers, too. Maybe his other
router was a Festool. ;-)

On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 21:27:26 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

><<< I >>> would like to have some kind of device that would cripple or maim=
> the thief.

Or a rfid chip tune to the tool, but then they make it a ring and
rings and a contruction workers is a bad idea. Then the laywers get
ahold of it and we have lousy infomercial of the TV.

DerbyDad03 wrote:
> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> router by hand.
>
> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> pawn shop.
>
> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>
> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>
> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>
> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>
Nice looking router! Looks better than mine!

--
GW Ross

On 8/20/17 5:34 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
> a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
> spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
> router by hand.
>
> The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
> go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
> to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
> a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
> pawn shop.
>
> I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
> a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
> shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>
> http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>
> I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
> takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
> I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>
> (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
> If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>

You thoroughly suck.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com

DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:27:31 PM UTC-4, G Ross wrote:
>> DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> > I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
>> > a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
>> > spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
>> > router by hand.
>> >
>> > The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
>> > go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
>> > to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
>> > a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
>> > pawn shop.
>> >
>> > I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
>> > a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
>> > shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.
>> >
>> > http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1
>> >
>> > I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
>> > takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
>> > I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.
>> >
>> > (I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
>> > If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)
>> >
>> Nice looking router! Looks better than mine!
>>
>> --
>> GW Ross
>
> Thanks! Interesting thing is that it came with this 5/16" Straight Dovetail
> Router Bit with 8mm Shank. There was a guide bushing installed and 8mm reducer
> in the 1/2" collet.
>
> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/woodriver-leigh-140-8-5-16-straight-dovetail-router-bit-8mm-sh
>
> Somebody was doing something special with it, but they didn't do it for
> very long. ;-)
> There was a guide bushing and 8mm reducer in the 1/2" collet.
>
It's early in the morning, but I'm having trouble wrapping my mind
around a straight dovetail. Sorta like a 180 degree angle.

--
GW Ross

On 8/21/17 7:43 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 8/20/2017 11:29 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>
>>
>>> You said Pawn Shop. That means used. Those look brand spanking new!
>>>
>>
>> Not true. (The "used" part)
>>
>> From Wikipedia:
>>
>> "A pawnbroker is an individual or business (pawnshop or pawn shop) that
>> offers secured loans to people, with items of personal property used as
>> collateral."
>>
>> While neither of the tools I bought were in fact brand new, there were
>> some
>> brand new, unopened items in the pawn shop. Nothing says that only
>> used items
>> can be pawned.
>>
>
> Right. Some stuff is shoplifted and never opened when pawned. Must be
> a lot of defective chargers too, many of the drills don't have them.


Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first
place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instruments.
You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the place
to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do
something about enforcing laws about it.



--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

I bought a Woodpecker router table insert for my PC 690 router and built
a router table extension for my table saw. I decided to look on-line for a
spare base so I wouldn't have to take the base off of the table to use the
router by hand.

The bases are readily available on eBay, tool sites, Home Depot, etc. They
go for anywhere from $70-$80 once you include shipping and tax. I decided
to try my local Craiglist and found a base that just happened to come with
a PC690LR router for $60. I called the number and it turned out to be a
pawn shop.

I went to the store, and after a little negotiation, I got the router and
a Dewalt D26453 Variable Speed ROS for $80, no tax. The router is in better
shape than mine and the sander looks barely used.

http://i.imgur.com/CN8IcZL.jpg?1

I could've spent a lot more money at that pawn shop. The tool section
takes up about 1/3 of the store. Nice neighborhood too, nothing sketchy.
I'll definitely be going back to shop some more.

(I'm going to try an adapt an old miter saw dust bag for use with the ROS.
If it doesn't work, eBay has them for $14.)

***********************

Sounds like you did good. My luck at pawn shops is usually everything I
want is priced higher than new retail and they expect me to be thankful if
they lower the price to new retail for me.

The other issue is they might buy stuff and have you pay the sales taxes.
simple as that can be dangerous.

Martin

On 8/22/2017 11:59 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 7:30:19 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>
>>> We used to put our SS# on our tools. Imagine that now...
>>
>> How about your company's tax ID number?
>
> I know that must be tongue in cheek...
>
> Giving away your tax ID number to anyone and everyone give any hacker, malware user, lurker, etc., a great place to start to access your company business and its financial accounts.
>
> I know that the group here have only been employees of the highest moral values with unquestionable integrity... but...
>
> What if you had an employee or subcontractor that you wrote a check to? He then has your bank, your account number, the routing number, etc. Truthfully, you give away your ID# when you issue a W2 or 1099. But after going to a couple of business online security classes, they have found that direct employees are not as likely to be the culprit of identity theft as someone you don't know. So drinking beer with the guys one night, someone notices your Federal Tax ID# on a drill, and says... "hey... is that Robert's company tax ID?"
>
> Let your mind wander. There is a reason you see as little personal/private information available anywhere, only as needed. Giving up my tax ID# is no different than you putting your SS# on your stuff. A company is an entity; it has credit, pays taxes, has liabilities and can enter into transactions.
>
> Like you, even though your SS# is easily found and known by your employers, banks, governmental benefit institutions, anyone that pays you interest and on and on... you still don't feel good about putting it on your car as a bumper sticker for everyone to see, right?
>
> I don't tools scattered across a job with that information on them, or stolen to get it.
>
> Oh yeah... the green? It was this color, and I covered the tools with it:
>
> http://wallpapercave.com/wp/ZYOoTF8.jpg
>
> Robert
>

On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:17:02 -0700 (PDT), "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 10:32:22 AM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
>
>> Around here, whenever a musician has any instruments stolen, the first
>> place you look is the local pawn shops and used music stores.
>> One particular music shop is notorious for taking in stolen instruments.
>> You would think for as many times the cops have been called to the place
>> to release someone's gear, they'd actually penalize the store or do
>> something about enforcing laws about it.
>
>Here in Texas, pawn shops are carefully controlled and licensed. But, that only keeps the most obvious fencing of stolen goods activity at bay.
>
>Having had enough tools stolen to equip the Corp of Engineers, I don't even go look for my tools when they are stolen. If they are pawned, they can be pawned for 10 days, 14 days, 30 days, or indefinitely. So say the pawned items sit in the back of the pawn shop out of sight for a couple of weeks (or more). Are you going to hit every pawn shop in town looking your tools every day looking for your tools after an undetermined/unknown amount of time passes?

How about spraying all your tools hot pink? No one would steal them
and if they did, no one would buy them from a pawn shop. Sorta the
Joe Arpaio theft defense.

>Can't do it, no one has that much time. Even if you find your stuff, which I did one time by accident, it is a chore to get it back. You have to prove it was yours, prove it was stolen, and then get the police involved. If it gets that far and the police determine an item was stolen then the pawnbroker simply gives it back to you. He gets a mark on his record, and isn't in the State's radar unless he has several incidents a year.
>
>To complicate that, they broke up a ring of thieves that were working out of Houston (a 3 1/2 hour drive from here) that were literally raiding construction sites and trailers during the day, then driving their stolen merchandise straight to San Antonio to pawn. Since the local cops don't share the information unless requested, the stolen goods simply fly under the radar and are easily pawned, especially if they are pawned the same day.
>
>When I had a buddy that worked at a pawn shop, he told me that they figure about half to 75% of the stuff they have at any given time was probably stolen.
>
>Robert