My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
"professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and no
fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby houses.
This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
very careful with those finishing rags.
Russ
On Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:31:45 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
>> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
>> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
>> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
>> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
>> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
>> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
>> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and
>> no fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby
>> houses.
>>
>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>
>> Russ
>
>
>Just last week someone in this area had an explosion caused by a gasoline
>soaked rag in their washing machine. Apparently fumes built up, the dryer
>was turned on and Boom. No injuries, but no doubt some extra laundry ...
OMG! Who in hell was dumb enough to put a gassy article of clothing
into a machine? No injuries? Darwin is disappointed, no doubt.
--
The United States of America is the greatest, the
noblest and, in its original founding principles,
the only moral country in the history of the world.
-- Ayn Rand
On Apr 12, 5:50=A0pm, "Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote:
> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used b=
y
> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and =
no
> fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby house=
s.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
> very careful with those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
My "wake up" with spontaneous combustion occurred back in the late
'60's. My Father had me refinishing a desk at his office with linseed
oil. I was just tossing my rags into a paper bag, and then I went out
to eat lunch. When I got back, the bag was already smoking. Nothing
happened beyond that, but it didn't take long, and I never forgot it.
Marty
> Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
> oil starts to oxidize? =A0I've never understood how putting the
> ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
>
> -- Andy Barss
The problem with oily rags is rapid evaporation of the solvents can
cause heat build up. You won't get this problem if the rag is layed
flat because there is no where for the heat to gather. Another way to
dissipate the heat is to have water evaporating along with the oil. As
the oily solvents evaporate the water is also evaporated and the water
vapor carries away much of the heat, disallowing the dangerous build-
up. The oily solvents make the water evaporate faster and the water
makes the oily solvents evaporate slower. All working together to
solve the problem.
Just my educated guess but is based on knowledge of the use of drying
agents and how they work, especially in terms of interaction with
ambient water.
On Wed, 13 Apr 2011 20:18:59 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:31:45 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond
>>>> to
>>>> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
>>>> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the
>>>> fire
>>>> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used
>>>> by
>>>> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
>>>> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
>>>> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
>>>> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and
>>>> no fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby
>>>> houses.
>>>>
>>>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
>>>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>>>
>>>> Russ
>>>
>>>
>>>Just last week someone in this area had an explosion caused by a gasoline
>>>soaked rag in their washing machine. Apparently fumes built up, the dryer
>>>was turned on and Boom. No injuries, but no doubt some extra laundry ...
>>
>> OMG! Who in hell was dumb enough to put a gassy article of clothing
>> into a machine? No injuries? Darwin is disappointed, no doubt.
>>
>
>Who? An Oregonian? Probably not a native. Natives are too busy sharpening
>saws or welding.
Huh? There's very little of that going on here. The farkin' tree
huggers got laws passed to make cutting one damnear illegal, the
Spotted Owl Union has the Feds in their pocket, etc.
--
The United States of America is the greatest, the
noblest and, in its original founding principles,
the only moral country in the history of the world.
-- Ayn Rand
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article
> <e9264361-2895-4118-81ef-a4d661df8f02@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com>, RonB
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
>>oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
>>
>>Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
>>is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
>>bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
>>garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
>>to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
>>there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
>>back yard patio slap in a covered can.
>
> Better practice IMHO is to spread them out flat and allow them to dry --
> especially if you have a nice non-combustible garage floor to spread them
> out
> on. I've found it to be quite adequate to wring mine out, then drape them
> completely unfolded over a sawhorse. Spreading them out is really the key:
> allow access to free air, and the heat produced by oxidative drying is
> dissipated harmlessly. Problems occur when the heat cannot dissipate
> freely.
If it is sunny and dry out, I let them dry outside on concrete. If it is
rainy or wet, I put them in a can and burn them up. Obviously not a
solution if you have a lot of oily rags. But the occasional mini bonfire in
my backyard is not noticed. It is hard to catch on fire if they are al
burnt up!
"Russ Stanton" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I keep an
old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into that
until I'm ready to dispose of them. If I have just one or two I lay them
out to dry thoroughly on the driveway before they go in the garbage.
Thanks Russ. This one is real easy to forget. More than once I've
grabbed a rag that had been left sitting only to feel the warmth.
Lucky I've never had a fire. When I am thinking I hang them to dry.
On Apr 12, 3:50=A0pm, "Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote:
> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used b=
y
> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and =
no
> fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby house=
s.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
> very careful with those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article
> <e9264361-2895-4118-81ef-a4d661df8f02@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com>, RonB
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
>>oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
>>
>>Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
>>is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
>>bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
>>garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
>>to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
>>there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
>>back yard patio slap in a covered can.
>
> Better practice IMHO is to spread them out flat and allow them to dry --
> especially if you have a nice non-combustible garage floor to spread them
> out
> on. I've found it to be quite adequate to wring mine out, then drape them
> completely unfolded over a sawhorse. Spreading them out is really the key:
> allow access to free air, and the heat produced by oxidative drying is
> dissipated harmlessly. Problems occur when the heat cannot dissipate
> freely.
Exactly, precicely, and all that . I toss the rag in question off by itself
in an open spot on the concrete garage floor for a few days and then toss it
when I take the trash out to the street.
"RonB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:e9264361-2895-4118-81ef-a4d661df8f02@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
> rt and the fire did not spread to other nearby houses.
>>
>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>
>> Russ
>
> Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
> oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
>
> Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
> is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
> bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
> garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
> to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
> there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
> back yard patio slap in a covered can.
I just throw mine out the back door into the lawn. Can't do any harm there
and, this being Seattle, it is likely raining.
On 4/13/2011 9:13 PM, DGDevin wrote:
> When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I keep
> an old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into
> that until I'm ready to dispose of them. If I have just one or two I lay
> them out to dry thoroughly on the driveway before they go in the garbage.
What he said. One of those 5gal BORG buckets, with a lid, half full of
water is what I use, and thoroughly submerge the rags with a stick each
time I add to it. Eventually the whole thing gets drained and tossed
immediately.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)
On Apr 12, 6:50=A0pm, "Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote:
> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used b=
y
> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and =
no
> fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby house=
s.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
> very careful with those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
It is also an old trick to speed up demolition of a building. AKA
Gypsy Lightning.
On May 2, 5:00=A0am, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Andrew Barss" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > : "Russ Stanton" =A0wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> > : When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I kee=
p
> > an
> > : old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into t=
hat
> > : until I'm ready to dispose of them.
>
> > Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
> > oil starts to oxidize? =A0I've never understood how putting the
> > ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
>
> > -- Andy Barss
>
> If you put a lid on the can, it won't dry out for months, even years if w=
ell
> sealed. =A0Being in a can, the rags would not burn very much anyway as th=
e
> oxygen would be gone in seconds.
>
> Even a metal can with no water can work.
Bu that still doesn't answer Andrew's concern, which I share. what
happens when you take the oily rags out of the water can and dry them
out? or when you open your no-water can and let fresh oxygen get at
the rags? or if the can gets crushed? The can can only be a temporary
solution.
Or do you allow them to start fires in your waste disposal site? I can
see keeping them for kindling, but I do generate enough wooden
kindling to last me throughout a Yukon winter, so I don't need oily
rags in my fireplace or wood stove.
Luigi
Who spreads out his oily rags to cure/dry and then throws them out,
just like Doug Miller says.
rt and the fire did not spread to other nearby houses.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
> very careful with those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
back yard patio slap in a covered can.
RonB
"Andrew Barss" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> : "Russ Stanton" wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> : When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I keep
> an
> : old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into that
> : until I'm ready to dispose of them.
>
> Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
> oil starts to oxidize? I've never understood how putting the
> ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
>
> -- Andy Barss
If you put a lid on the can, it won't dry out for months, even years if well
sealed. Being in a can, the rags would not burn very much anyway as the
oxygen would be gone in seconds.
Even a metal can with no water can work.
"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond to
> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the fire
> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and
> no fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby
> houses.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
> very careful with those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
Just last week someone in this area had an explosion caused by a gasoline
soaked rag in their washing machine. Apparently fumes built up, the dryer
was turned on and Boom. No injuries, but no doubt some extra laundry ...
--
Ever wonder why doctors, dentists and lawyers have to Practice so much? Ever
wonder why you let them Practice on You?
"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
> My wife and I are first responders and one of
> our duties is to respond to house fires to
> monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration
> etc. We responded to a house fire recently and
> just learned the cause of the fire today. It
> started outside the home in a pile of rags that
> had been used by "professionals?" to apply a
> linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house,
> caught fire and the fire went up the cedar
> siding, thru the soffit and into the attic ,
> where it spread taking out about 40% of the
> house. The house was not occupied and no fire
> fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread
> to other nearby houses.
>
> This is not urban legend but straight up true
> story, Moral to this is be very careful with
> those finishing rags.
>
> Russ
Pay attention to your dryer vents too. phil
On 4/13/2011 1:40 PM, RonB wrote:
> rt and the fire did not spread to other nearby houses.
>>
>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>
>> Russ
>
> Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
> oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
>
> Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
> is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
> bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
> garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
> to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
> there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
> back yard patio slap in a covered can.
>
> RonB
Remember there are other woodworking thing that can spontaneously
combust. We nearly lost our garage when we moved in and it was full of
cardboard boxes. We had had the upstairs hardwood floors sanded and
refinished. When they came back to do the final coat, they placed the
sandings in a trash can. Unfortunately in a fit of neatness and not
knowing about the sandings, it ended back in the garage next to the
boxes. We realized something was wrong when smoke started coming into
the family room which is off the garage. Fortunately we caught it
before it caught the boxes, and I was able to get the trash can out of
the garage.
In article <e9264361-2895-4118-81ef-a4d661df8f02@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com>, RonB <[email protected]> wrote:
>Certainly not urban legend and the fairly harmless smelling Linseed
>oil is as volatile as many of the finishing materials we use.
>
>Several years ago I was finishing a project with wipe on poly, which
>is an/oil poly blend. My practice was to put the rag in a zip-lock
>bag, push the air out, seal it, and throw it in the center of the
>garage floor until I got to a point of cleaning up. One day I forgot
>to pick it up and came back out that evening and noticed it was still
>there. The bag was VERY warm to touch. After that, they went to the
>back yard patio slap in a covered can.
Better practice IMHO is to spread them out flat and allow them to dry --
especially if you have a nice non-combustible garage floor to spread them out
on. I've found it to be quite adequate to wring mine out, then drape them
completely unfolded over a sawhorse. Spreading them out is really the key:
allow access to free air, and the heat produced by oxidative drying is
dissipated harmlessly. Problems occur when the heat cannot dissipate freely.
"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:31:45 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond
>>> to
>>> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
>>> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the
>>> fire
>>> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used
>>> by
>>> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
>>> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
>>> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
>>> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied and
>>> no fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby
>>> houses.
>>>
>>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is be
>>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>>
>>> Russ
>>
>>
>>Just last week someone in this area had an explosion caused by a gasoline
>>soaked rag in their washing machine. Apparently fumes built up, the dryer
>>was turned on and Boom. No injuries, but no doubt some extra laundry ...
>
> OMG! Who in hell was dumb enough to put a gassy article of clothing
> into a machine? No injuries? Darwin is disappointed, no doubt.
>
Who? An Oregonian? Probably not a native. Natives are too busy sharpening
saws or welding.
"DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> "Russ Stanton" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
>
>> It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
>> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
>> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
>> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
>
> When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I keep an
> old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into that
> until I'm ready to dispose of them. If I have just one or two I lay them
> out to dry thoroughly on the driveway before they go in the garbage.
Not spontaneous, but good nonetheless. I worked in the ER in the USAF
hospital where I was stationed. In the ER office we maintained a glass
covered board listing the names all the call people for the day written in
grease pencil and the night staff (me in this case) was responsible for
updating it. We also had a meeting between night and day shift to give
report and transfer responsibility.
One morning I cleaned the board as usual with some 4x4 gauze sponges soaked
in ether, penciled in the names for the day and tossed the gauze in the
waste basket. At 8am I'm seated at the desk, the charge nurse (a major) is
standing by the door, couple more corpsmen in the hall, and the charge
sergeant is stand to my left by the waste basket. I hadn't gone through more
than a couple minutes of report when the sarge decides to light a cigarette
(an acceptable thing in those days even in a hospital). He lights a match
and Drops It In The Waste Basket! Enormous gout of flame shoots up his arm
and then he sticks a leg in the basket to stomp out the flame!
Fortunately he just lost all the hair on his arm and singed his pant leg.
We stopped using ether as a solvent. Whole hospital stopped using ether as a
solvent.
"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2011 20:18:59 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> On Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:31:45 -0700, "Lobby Dosser"
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Russ Stanton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>> My wife and I are first responders and one of our duties is to respond
>>>>> to
>>>>> house fires to monitor the fire fighters for B.P. dehydration etc. We
>>>>> responded to a house fire recently and just learned the cause of the
>>>>> fire
>>>>> today. It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been
>>>>> used
>>>>> by
>>>>> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the
>>>>> redone
>>>>> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the
>>>>> fire
>>>>> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where
>>>>> it
>>>>> spread taking out about 40% of the house. The house was not occupied
>>>>> and
>>>>> no fire fighters were hurt and the fire did not spread to other nearby
>>>>> houses.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is not urban legend but straight up true story, Moral to this is
>>>>> be
>>>>> very careful with those finishing rags.
>>>>>
>>>>> Russ
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Just last week someone in this area had an explosion caused by a
>>>>gasoline
>>>>soaked rag in their washing machine. Apparently fumes built up, the
>>>>dryer
>>>>was turned on and Boom. No injuries, but no doubt some extra laundry ...
>>>
>>> OMG! Who in hell was dumb enough to put a gassy article of clothing
>>> into a machine? No injuries? Darwin is disappointed, no doubt.
>>>
>>
>>Who? An Oregonian? Probably not a native. Natives are too busy sharpening
>>saws or welding.
>
> Huh? There's very little of that going on here. The farkin' tree
> huggers got laws passed to make cutting one damnear illegal, the
> Spotted Owl Union has the Feds in their pocket, etc.
>
Ahhh, that was Californians. Native Oregonians sharpen saws and weld as a
matter of pride.
--
"I'm the man who broke the bank at Monte Carlo ..."
Larry Jaques wrote:
>
> Huh? There's very little of that going on here. The farkin' tree
> huggers got laws passed to make cutting one damnear illegal, the
> Spotted Owl Union has the Feds in their pocket, etc.
Plenty of logging going on here in Lane County. Pretty much all of the old
growth is gone at this point, so it's all reprod anymore.
I was out driving around this afternoon in the hills above Panther Creek and
saw several clearcuts, each about a square mile or so in size. Probably at
least the second time it has been harvested from those areas, and they still
replant it for the next time.
It's a strange feeling to drive through a big chunk like that, the
desolation is noticeable. Take a drive out in the coast range if you want
to see some big logging operations, it's pretty much just a big tree farm at
this point.
Jon
DGDevin <[email protected]> wrote:
: "Russ Stanton" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
:> It started outside the home in a pile of rags that had been used by
:> "professionals?" to apply a linseed oil finish to cabinets in the redone
:> kitchen. The rags were piled next to the house, caught fire and the fire
:> went up the cedar siding, thru the soffit and into the attic , where it
: When I know I'm going to be producing a bunch of rags like that I keep an
: old paint can full of water outside the garage and the rags go into that
: until I'm ready to dispose of them.
Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
oil starts to oxidize? I've never understood how putting the
ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
-- Andy Barss
In article <28fba141-a1ee-43da-aad2-91ac9dcd44cf@s41g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
SonomaProducts.com <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
>> oil starts to oxidize? I've never understood how putting the
>> ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
>>
>> -- Andy Barss
>
>The problem with oily rags is rapid evaporation of the solvents can
>cause heat build up. You won't get this problem if the rag is layed
>flat because there is no where for the heat to gather. Another way to
>dissipate the heat is to have water evaporating along with the oil. As
>the oily solvents evaporate the water is also evaporated and the water
>vapor carries away much of the heat, disallowing the dangerous build-
>up. The oily solvents make the water evaporate faster and the water
>makes the oily solvents evaporate slower. All working together to
>solve the problem.
>
>Just my educated guess but is based on knowledge of the use of drying
>agents and how they work, especially in terms of interaction with
>ambient water.
Evaporation causes cooling, not heating. The reason the oily rags combust
is because the oxidation reaction of drying oils like BLO and tung oil
creates heat. Keeping the rags flat allows the heat to radiate away before
the rags can reach combustion temperature. Note that rags doused with a
non-drying oil, like engine oil or cooking oil, will not self-combust.
--
There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid answers.
Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org
On Wed, 4 May 2011 08:54:50 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>> Won't the problem reoccur when the rags dry out (of water), and the
>> oil starts to oxidize? I've never understood how putting the
>> ouly rags in water is supposed to halt the problem.
>>
>> -- Andy Barss
>
>The problem with oily rags is rapid evaporation of the solvents can
>cause heat build up. You won't get this problem if the rag is layed
>flat because there is no where for the heat to gather. Another way to
>dissipate the heat is to have water evaporating along with the oil. As
>the oily solvents evaporate the water is also evaporated and the water
>vapor carries away much of the heat, disallowing the dangerous build-
>up. The oily solvents make the water evaporate faster and the water
>makes the oily solvents evaporate slower. All working together to
>solve the problem.
>
>Just my educated guess but is based on knowledge of the use of drying
>agents and how they work, especially in terms of interaction with
>ambient water.
Evaporation removes heat since it takes heat to turn a liquid into a
gas. Andy's right that it is the oxidation of the oils that cause the
heat.
Water prevents the rags from igniting as it limits the amount of
oxygen available for oxidation of the oils.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA