Hey folks. I am preparing to cut four pieces of glass for a display case I
am building. the tops of the pieces will have a slight arc ( 1" over a 10"
run) . I have never cut an arc in glass before, and have limited experience
with straight cuts as well.
I have googled, and found an article where the writer is talking about
turning the glass over so the score is on the underside, placing it on a
piece of cardboard, and applying pressure to the score from the back.
Will this get me the desired results?
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:14:35 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"
<[email protected]> vaguely proposed a theory
......and in reply I say!:
remove ns from my header address to reply via email
As an interested standby reader of this thread, who is trying to
learn, I would politely ask that you stop attacking Leon. He expressed
an opinion and you denigrated it ("Nonsense"). He continues to
politely talk it over and you start getting sarky.
>> > nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces
>> would
>sorry, i've only been doing art glass work for 20 years, so i'll bow to the
>greater knowledge of someone who as a few stained glass projects under their
>belt.
*****************************************************
It's not the milk and honey we hate. It's having it
rammed down our throats.
On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 00:24:30 GMT, Old Nick <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> As an interested standby reader of this thread, who is trying to
> learn, I would politely ask that you stop attacking Leon. He expressed
> an opinion and you denigrated it ("Nonsense"). He continues to
> politely talk it over and you start getting sarky.
It would seem to me that 20 years experience _does_ trump "a few
projects".
On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 03:05:22 GMT, Edwin Pawlowski <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> "Dave Hinz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> It would seem to me that 20 years experience _does_ trump "a few
>> projects".
>
> It should, but there are always exceptions. I know of people that have been
> hacks for years and still make a living in their trade.
Ah, the "He doesn't have 12 years of experience, he's got one year
of experience 12 times" type, yup, I've run into those too.
Charles Spitzer wrote:
> nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces would
> cause flares, and i would assume that the OP doesn't have the diamond tools
> to fix that.
>
> this can be cut in one go. you can get some scrap window glass for FREE at
> window places. they toss out lots.
>
> use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top surface
> on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant. run the cutter over the line,
> staying on one side of the sharpie line or the other, but be consistent. use
> a firm, but not a heavy head. you want to hear a zing, not a crumbling of
> the top surface of glass. it doesn't take much with window or even double
> strength glass.
>
> run the cutter to the edges of the glass.
>
> there's two ways to break it. 1: place the cut side down on a piece of rug.
> press downwards at the end of the cut with the end of a rounded wooden
> dowel. it should start to run the crack, and will follow the break. 2: with
> cut side up, hold between your thumb and first finger knuckle of each hand.
> pull down and away with each hand.
>
> there are glass tools that make this a lot easier. you could also just take
> the glass (marked) to a stained glass place. it'll take about 30 seconds to
> do this.
As someone who make stained glass panels I agree with the advise above. I would
also suggest getting a good glass cutter that automatically oils the cutting
wheel while the cut is being made. When cutting the glass don't draw the cutter
towards you. Use a push cut moving away from you body.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
(Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)
Leon wrote:
> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
> surface
> > on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
>
> Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
> lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the cutters
> into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of my
> glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the axel and
> wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the life
> of the axel.
The oil serves two purposes.
From the Warner Crivellaro web site (
http://www.warner-criv.com/techtips/tools.aspx ):
Lubricant - Glass cutting lubricant or oil is generally a half and half mixture
of
kerosene and a light oil. This cutting lubricant serves to
clean off
little slivers of glass that cling to the wheel of your glass
cutter and
interfere with the wheel spinning freely. It also helps
prevent the
score line from sealing itself which can prevent you from
breaking
the glass even though the score line is still visible.
Commercially
prepared lubricants are available.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
(Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 22:35:45 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>As a bit more of an indicator, if that arc that is 10" ling with a 1" rise
>were extended into a circle, the radius would be 13".
the radius is 13" whether you extend it at all or not....
> The edge of that
>circle would hardly be close to practically straight IMHO.
>
it looks plenty straight enough to cut in one shot to me....
awesome. thanks for the advice.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> As far as breaking the glass, I prefer to keep the keeper piece on thin
cork
> or an old spread out bath towel. With the scored line up and near the
edge
> of the table quickly press down on the unsupported waste part of the
glass.
> Remember to make relief cuts as the glass will want to break straight and
> this arc cut should be made in about 4 cuts.
>
>
"Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
surface
> on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the cutters
into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of my
glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the axel and
wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the life
of the axel.
If you are wanting to end up with a half moon shaped of glass, the inside
round cut will be tough. You want to remove as much of the glass before
scoring the arc with your glass cutter. Score the line as usual along the
arc and make a few relief cuts out perpendicular from that arc. Then gently
star breaking away. Generally I use grozing plyers to naw away up to the
arc.
If you are wanting to end up with an outside radius cut, similar to a ball,
score the arc with the glass cutter and let some of the scores go straight
so that you can break away several pieces as you go around the arc.
PRACTICE FIRST. This took me several tries to learn especially with the 1/2
moon cut.
"js" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hey folks. I am preparing to cut four pieces of glass for a display case I
> am building. the tops of the pieces will have a slight arc ( 1" over a 10"
> run) . I have never cut an arc in glass before, and have limited
experience
> with straight cuts as well.
> I have googled, and found an article where the writer is talking about
> turning the glass over so the score is on the underside, placing it on a
> piece of cardboard, and applying pressure to the score from the back.
>
> Will this get me the desired results?
>
>
"Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >
>
> nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces
would
> cause flares, and i would assume that the OP doesn't have the diamond
tools
> to fix that.
It certainly will break easier with the relief lines added in. Better to
not take the chance. I have done several stained glass projects and this is
the correct way. Further if the edges are going to show, you can sand the
edges to smooth them up, however I usually do use my wet diamond glass
grinder.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 22:35:45 GMT, "Leon"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >As a bit more of an indicator, if that arc that is 10" ling with a 1"
rise
> >were extended into a circle, the radius would be 13".
>
> the radius is 13" whether you extend it at all or not....
LOL.. That too.
> > The edge of that
> >circle would hardly be close to practically straight IMHO.
>
> it looks plenty straight enough to cut in one shot to me....
It does not sound like much curve until you realize that the rise is 1" half
way though the arc and not a total of 1" at the end of the 10" run. So the
1" rise happens at 5" into the run assuming the arc will form a circle. The
waste side of the glass will more than likely break somewhere. When working
with the more expensive stained glass you tend to want the scraps to break
such that you can get more pieces from them also. Making the relief cuts
where you want helps insure that the scrap will be useful also.
"Nova" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Well, hummm,, My instructor 20+ years ago mentioned that the oil was for
the wheel axel. We never really saw much oil on the glass at all. As for
the score line, he told us to break the glass ASAP after scoring.
"Dave Hinz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> It would seem to me that 20 years experience _does_ trump "a few
> projects".
>
It should, but there are always exceptions. I know of people that have been
hacks for years and still make a living in their trade.
As far as breaking the glass, I prefer to keep the keeper piece on thin cork
or an old spread out bath towel. With the scored line up and near the edge
of the table quickly press down on the unsupported waste part of the glass.
Remember to make relief cuts as the glass will want to break straight and
this arc cut should be made in about 4 cuts.
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:14:35 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>you want a hard thing to practice on? try cutting a 2" circular diameter
>hole out of the middle of a 14" diameter circle of white stained glass.
>
I think I'd drill that.
but then I'm a weenie....
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> As far as breaking the glass, I prefer to keep the keeper piece on thin
cork
> or an old spread out bath towel. With the scored line up and near the
edge
> of the table quickly press down on the unsupported waste part of the
glass.
> Remember to make relief cuts as the glass will want to break straight and
> this arc cut should be made in about 4 cuts.
>
nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces would
cause flares, and i would assume that the OP doesn't have the diamond tools
to fix that.
this can be cut in one go. you can get some scrap window glass for FREE at
window places. they toss out lots.
use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top surface
on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant. run the cutter over the line,
staying on one side of the sharpie line or the other, but be consistent. use
a firm, but not a heavy head. you want to hear a zing, not a crumbling of
the top surface of glass. it doesn't take much with window or even double
strength glass.
run the cutter to the edges of the glass.
there's two ways to break it. 1: place the cut side down on a piece of rug.
press downwards at the end of the cut with the end of a rounded wooden
dowel. it should start to run the crack, and will follow the break. 2: with
cut side up, hold between your thumb and first finger knuckle of each hand.
pull down and away with each hand.
there are glass tools that make this a lot easier. you could also just take
the glass (marked) to a stained glass place. it'll take about 30 seconds to
do this.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > >
> >
> > nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces
> would
> > cause flares, and i would assume that the OP doesn't have the diamond
> tools
> > to fix that.
>
>
> It certainly will break easier with the relief lines added in. Better to
> not take the chance. I have done several stained glass projects and this
is
> the correct way. Further if the edges are going to show, you can sand the
> edges to smooth them up, however I usually do use my wet diamond glass
> grinder.
>
sorry, i've only been doing art glass work for 20 years, so i'll bow to the
greater knowledge of someone who as a few stained glass projects under their
belt.
a 10" piece of a 26" diameter circle is practically straight. yes, it may
break easier, but it will be vastly harder for the OP to clean up the edge
afterwards.
btw: you want to get the fewest, and largest, scrap pieces. the OP probably
doesn't care what happens to the scrap, since they'll probably be discarding
it anyway. doing relief cuts on this is piece is silly and wasteful. for all
practical purposes, it's a straight shot. furthermore, since it's an outside
cut, if it runs, it will run off as a relief would anyway, thus producing
your relief cut. single window glass is very soft, and this type of break is
simple to do.
you want a hard thing to practice on? try cutting a 2" circular diameter
hole out of the middle of a 14" diameter circle of white stained glass.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
> surface
> > on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
>
> Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
> lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the cutters
> into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of my
> glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the axel
and
> wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the
life
> of the axel.
>
well, a: you don't have or know of all cutters. there are some that designed
to cut dry. for instance there are some carbide wheels, and diamond tipped
hand cutters, that are like this.
b: second, it's not only for lubricant, but to help with the selfhealing
properties of the glass skin. i've been cutting stained glass for years with
a dry cutter. when i cut 3/4" glass, it's far easier to paint on kerosene
with a paint brush. cutting 3/4" glass won't break correctly without putting
something on the glass surface first.
"Old Nick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:14:35 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"
> <[email protected]> vaguely proposed a theory
> ......and in reply I say!:
>
> remove ns from my header address to reply via email
>
> As an interested standby reader of this thread, who is trying to
> learn, I would politely ask that you stop attacking Leon. He expressed
> an opinion and you denigrated it ("Nonsense"). He continues to
> politely talk it over and you start getting sarky.
the advice that leon has given is wrong. it will cause the OP to have a
piece of glass that a: will need fixing using expensive diamond tools and
specialized glass working tools, that for sure they don't have, and b:
possibly be dangerous by having shards of glass sticking out of their
original piece that they will not be able to remove without using such
tools.
the method i gave is the correct one, and will result in the easiest and
safest resulting piece of glass for the OP.
for leon, his way is quite sufficient for someone who has the tools to fix
the problems associated with his method. it is neither the easiest, nor
quickest, in my professional opinion. his method would be correct, if for
example, it was a 10" rise in 10" width, which, while not impossible to cut
directly, is somewhat harder than the original request.
> >> > nonsense. 1" in 10" is practically straight. cutting it off in pieces
> >> would
>
> >sorry, i've only been doing art glass work for 20 years, so i'll bow to
the
> >greater knowledge of someone who as a few stained glass projects under
their
> >belt.
>
> *****************************************************
> It's not the milk and honey we hate. It's having it
> rammed down our throats.
[email protected] wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:18:16 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>> >
>>> > use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
>>> surface
>>> > on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
>>>
>>> Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
>>> lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the
>>> cutters
>>> into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of
>>> my glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the
>>> axel
>>and
>>> wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the
>>life
>>> of the axel.
>>>
>>
>>well, a: you don't have or know of all cutters. there are some that
>>designed to cut dry. for instance there are some carbide wheels, and
>>diamond tipped hand cutters, that are like this.
>>
>>b: second, it's not only for lubricant, but to help with the selfhealing
>>properties of the glass skin. i've been cutting stained glass for years
>>with a dry cutter. when i cut 3/4" glass, it's far easier to paint on
>>kerosene with a paint brush. cutting 3/4" glass won't break correctly
>>without putting something on the glass surface first.
>>
> Charles, Leon is completely out to lunch but you won't win this argument
> in this group.
> The only thing rec.woodworking excels in these days is mediocre advice
> from amateurs, like Leon.
While I agree with your viewpoint to some extent, there's another issue.
Generally speaking commenting on the abilities of others is
counterproductive because it carries the discussion into the domain of
personalities rather than technical issues. Dismissing another's comment
as "nonsense", even if it _is_ nonsense, is more likely to incite a flame
war than a productive discussion. Better to explain, politely, _why_ it is
nonsense.
I'll get back under my bridge now.
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
> surface
> > on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
>
> Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
> lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the cutters
> into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of my
> glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the axel and
> wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the life
> of the axel.
Listen to Leon !!! I agree with what he says. I have 20 plus years in
stained glass (hobby only ) from lamps to windows etc. and oil
lubricant is for the cutter wheel. Inside curves are very difficult to
cut. Depending on the glass sometimes you have success sometimes you
have a oh ! sh--!!!! I would cut the glass oval in several steps
(small curvatures). The trick to cutting is even steady pressure of
the cutter on the glass and seperate the pieces in slow rocking motion
, this enforces the score line and seperation at the line. I would
also get a diamong stone to smooth the edges of glass.
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:18:16 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Charles Spitzer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>> >
>> > use a sharpie on the back side to mark your cut line. paint the top
>> surface
>> > on the curve with kerosene for a lubricant.
>>
>> Umm, one more thing here, you are partially right to advise using a
>> lubricant but,,,It is not for the glass. It is common to dip the cutters
>> into a lubricant to lubricate the AXEL that the wheel spins on. All of my
>> glass cutters have built in lubricant dispensers that lubricate the axel
>and
>> wheel when the cutter is depressed down on the glass. This extends the
>life
>> of the axel.
>>
>
>well, a: you don't have or know of all cutters. there are some that designed
>to cut dry. for instance there are some carbide wheels, and diamond tipped
>hand cutters, that are like this.
>
>b: second, it's not only for lubricant, but to help with the selfhealing
>properties of the glass skin. i've been cutting stained glass for years with
>a dry cutter. when i cut 3/4" glass, it's far easier to paint on kerosene
>with a paint brush. cutting 3/4" glass won't break correctly without putting
>something on the glass surface first.
>
Charles, Leon is completely out to lunch but you won't win this argument in this
group.
The only thing rec.woodworking excels in these days is mediocre advice from
amateurs, like Leon.
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 23:48:57 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 22:35:45 GMT, "Leon"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >As a bit more of an indicator, if that arc that is 10" ling with a 1"
>rise
>> >were extended into a circle, the radius would be 13".
>>
>> the radius is 13" whether you extend it at all or not....
>
>LOL.. That too.
>
>
>> > The edge of that
>> >circle would hardly be close to practically straight IMHO.
>>
>> it looks plenty straight enough to cut in one shot to me....
>
>It does not sound like much curve until you realize that the rise is 1" half
>way though the arc and not a total of 1" at the end of the 10" run. So the
>1" rise happens at 5" into the run assuming the arc will form a circle. The
>waste side of the glass will more than likely break somewhere. When working
>with the more expensive stained glass
did I miss something here? I think the OP was talking about plain
window glass. of course, with anything else it'll be harder.
> you tend to want the scraps to break
>such that you can get more pieces from them also. Making the relief cuts
>where you want helps insure that the scrap will be useful also.
>