On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 10:48:05 -0400, Gerald Ross <[email protected]>
wrote the following:
>Evodawg wrote:
>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>> thought some might want to know.
>>
>> Rich
>I have a 12v Makita which was a gift. It is light, strong and looks
>like a sneaker. Only problem, the chuck will not tighten enough to
>keep drill bits from slipping. Hope the more expensive ones have a
>better chuck.
The best solution is either to install a keyed chuck or use hex bits
(or hex bit adapters.)
I have one of these for my impactor http://fwd4.me/Ry3 and some of
these http://fwd4.me/Rzf ($17) for my little Ryobi drill driver. I got
tired of buying new sets when I broke the 1/8" or 1/16" hex-mounted
bits like these http://fwd4.me/Rze.
With the Snappy'dapters, I can mount forstner, bradpoints, or twist
billdrits. The extra hex/hex nut slides over the 1/4" to make
tightening the bit into the collet that much easier and considerably
firmer.
--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin
On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 06:28:50 -0700, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote
the following:
>Evodawg wrote:
>
>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>> thought some might want to know.
>
>Opps forgot the URL
>http://alturl.com/j7gj
Yeah, if you need a hammer drill, that looks like a nice one. Most
people don't drill holes all day long so the smaller 1.5Ah batteries
would probably be OK.
When I do decks and such, I need an impactor. I just started another
deck job last Friday, so I ordered the following kit, replacing my
Bosch 14.4v Impactor with the Makita 451 kit. http://fwd4.me/Pce
It has the LXT 3Ah lithium batteries. $269 at Amazon, $30 to $200
cheaper than anywhere else, and they throw in free shipping.
--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin
notbob <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
*snip*
>
> Another thing I notice at the lumber store. At the counter is a whole
> bowl full of those hex-drive phillips bits, like it's a given they
> won't last long and you best stock up. Wear and tear on the couple
> bits I have would seem to support this. My Korean hammer driven
> impact driver bits are as good and true as the day I bought them, 35
> yrs ago! Anyone making bits that good for the construction industry
> or is cheap Chinese metal all that's available?
>
> nb
>
I've been using the DeWalt Phillips bits with good success. I have to
switch to a new bit once a month or so, doing hobbiest level work with
lots of Phillips screws. They fit the drywall screws I use for pineywood
perfectly.
For some reason, the double ended bits included with many screwdriver
tools seems to be better than the insert bits. Even the B&D and Skil
screwdrivers include a good double ended bit.
Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.
On Jun 7, 2:55=A0pm, Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
> notbob <[email protected]> wrote innews:[email protected]=
d:
>
> *snip*
>
>
>
> > Another thing I notice at the lumber store. =A0At the counter is a whol=
e
> > bowl full of those hex-drive phillips bits, like it's a given they
> > won't last long and you best stock up. =A0Wear and tear on the couple
> > bits I have would seem to support this. =A0My Korean hammer driven
> > impact driver bits are as good and true as the day I bought them, 35
> > yrs ago! =A0Anyone making bits that good for the construction industry
> > or is cheap Chinese metal all that's available?
>
> > nb
>
> I've been using the DeWalt Phillips bits with good success. =A0I have to
> switch to a new bit once a month or so, doing hobbiest level work with
> lots of Phillips screws. =A0They fit the drywall screws I use for pineywo=
od
> perfectly.
>
> For some reason, the double ended bits included with many screwdriver
> tools seems to be better than the insert bits. =A0Even the B&D and Skil
> screwdrivers include a good double ended bit.
There is a large variation in the quality of driver bits. I've found
that the DeWALT "impact ready" are by far the best bits available,
followed by Bosch.
On 06 Jun 2010 18:50:53 GMT, Elrond Hubbard <[email protected]> wrote
the following:
>Larry Jaques <[email protected]> wrote in
>news:[email protected]:
>
>
>> When I do decks and such, I need an impactor. I just started another
>> deck job last Friday, so I ordered the following kit, replacing my
>> Bosch 14.4v Impactor with the Makita 451 kit. http://fwd4.me/Pce
>> It has the LXT 3Ah lithium batteries. $269 at Amazon, $30 to $200
>> cheaper than anywhere else, and they throw in free shipping.
>
>I've owned this unit for several years, and it has held up well through a
>lot of hard daily use. My only small gripe is that there is no storage on
>the unit for other driver bits, like DeWalt usually has on their drills and
>drivers, but it's a minor oversight.
Glad to hear yet another good review, Scott. My Ryobi has a pair of
bubbles on it for flat and vertical drilling, plus places on top for
two bits. The Bosch has a single hole in the bottom rear of the main
housing for a single extra bit. I use it to swap out phillips/square
bits. I guess I can figure out how to attach something to the Makita
if needed. I hate having to take off gloves and dig in my jeans
pockets for a bit.
>When I first bought it, one of the crew dubbed it "The Stupid Drill" 'cause
>he thought it was useless; it was loud, it had a silly LED light on it, and
>it couldn't be used as a drill without an adaptor chuck. After using it
>for a while, including finishing up a drywall job in an attic during a
>power outage (remember that LED?), it's now the first tool he wants to
>borrow... unless he actually needs to drill a hole.
<g>
--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin
"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 07:14:49 -0500, "Leon" <[email protected]>
> wrote the following:
>
>>
>>"notbob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> On 2010-06-06, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Evodawg wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I
>>>>> have
>>>>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>>>>> thought some might want to know.
>>>>
>>>> Opps forgot the URL
>>>> http://alturl.com/j7gj
>>>
>>> How do these hammer/drills work?
>>>
>>> IOW, is it a linear hammering force into, say, a phillips screw head
>>> to prevent stripping of the cross slots or a rotary hammering force to
>>> further drive the twisting torque for hex head lag bolts driven
>>> into wood? Or, is it both? I have a great DeWalt 13V drill/driver,
>>> but now see how it is lacking when driving phillips head deck screws.
>>>
>>> nb
>>
>>Typically impact drivers work like any other impact driver.
>
> I'll have to strongly disagree with that, Leon.
>
> I haven't physically had the mechanisms apart, but I understand that
> hammer drills have an axial hammer (like tapping the back of the bit)
> while impactors have a rotary hammer effect (hammering down the end of
> the breaker bar, a torsional hammer.)
>
> That's a major difference both in concept and result. An impactor
> won't drill concrete and a hammer drill won't work nearly as well as
> an impactor for installing or removing long, tough screws.
I misread and did not catch the fact that he was asking about a hammer drill
vs. an impact driver. Agreed a hammer drill exerts force in a totally
different dirrection than an impact driver.
On 2010-06-06, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
> Evodawg wrote:
>
>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>> thought some might want to know.
>
> Opps forgot the URL
> http://alturl.com/j7gj
How do these hammer/drills work?
IOW, is it a linear hammering force into, say, a phillips screw head
to prevent stripping of the cross slots or a rotary hammering force to
further drive the twisting torque for hex head lag bolts driven
into wood? Or, is it both? I have a great DeWalt 13V drill/driver,
but now see how it is lacking when driving phillips head deck screws.
nb
On 2010-06-07, Leon <[email protected]> wrote:
> I misread and did not catch the fact that he was asking about a hammer drill
> vs. an impact driver. Agreed a hammer drill exerts force in a totally
> different dirrection than an impact driver.
I probably misstated my question. Let me greatly simplify my query:
I will probably be doing more rebuilding and further improvments to my
deck. I see the use of hex head lag bolts already used for the frame,
which is quite sound, and I've used 8" phil-hd deck screws to rebuild
the steps. While assembling the steps I discovered my 13V DeWalt
drill/driver was less than thrilling for driving phil-hd screws and
needed pre-drilling of deck screw holes. So, a couple pertinent
questions for the future:
1. Which is the best type of driver for phil-hd deck screws and do all types
of drivers require pre-drilling the deck screw holes? Howzabout for
removing old phil-hd deck screws, many rusty and close to breaking?
2. Would I be better off in the future paying extra for allen hd deck
screws?
3. Which driver for the lag bolts?
Thank you.
nb
"notbob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2010-06-06, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Evodawg wrote:
>>
>>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I
>>> have
>>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>>> thought some might want to know.
>>
>> Opps forgot the URL
>> http://alturl.com/j7gj
>
> How do these hammer/drills work?
>
> IOW, is it a linear hammering force into, say, a phillips screw head
> to prevent stripping of the cross slots or a rotary hammering force to
> further drive the twisting torque for hex head lag bolts driven
> into wood? Or, is it both? I have a great DeWalt 13V drill/driver,
> but now see how it is lacking when driving phillips head deck screws.
>
> nb
Typically impact drivers work like any other impact driver. Does not answer
your question... Because the impact is for a split second repeatedly over
and over a Philips head screw comes out easier because the torque is not
constant and the bit does not normally climb out of the screw head like it
will with a drill driver.
With my impact driver I was able to remove kitchen cabinets that a customer
had previousely used wood putty to hide the Philips head screws. My regular
drill driver cammed out. My impact was able to remove the screws with
minimal engagement.
The confusion is down to this :
impact driver is rotational not in/out.
Hammer drill is rotational in drill mode. It is hammer in/out in hammer mode.
It can do both in some models.
I have one of each - my 1/2" SDS+ Hammer drill has an electronic brake/stop.
Martin
Martin H. Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
"Our Republic and the Press will Rise or Fall Together": Joseph Pulitzer
TSRA: Endowed; NRA LOH & Patron Member, Golden Eagle, Patriot's Medal.
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Charter Founder
IHMSA and NRA Metallic Silhouette maker & member. http://lufkinced.com/
On 6/7/2010 11:24 AM, notbob wrote:
> On 2010-06-07, J. Clarke<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> The drill under discussion is a hammer drill, not an impact driver. The
>> hammer on a hammer drill is of no utility in driving fasteners, it's
>> used to drill masonry, and it's a linear hammering action, not rotary.
>> The drill turns the bit while the hammer pounds on it.
>
> Yet, it's that hammer pounding action that keeps a phillips-head bit
> from "camming out", as one poster so accurately described it. In
> motorcycle mechanics, an impact driver is one that gets torqued
> phillips head screws out without stripping the phil slots. It's
> designed to turn whenever bashed on the back end with a 2lb hammer,
> the hammer action making sure there is HUGE inward driving force to
> prevent camming out. I want that inward linear force driving the bit
> INTO the phil slots when I'm driving deck screws! That Popular
> Mechanics review of the Makita hammer driver I posted even talked
> about driving deck screws, but also mentioned changing the bits and
> drills so often his hand was raw. You gotta pre-drill for deck screws
> even with a hammer driver!?
>
>
> Another thing I notice at the lumber store. At the counter is a whole
> bowl full of those hex-drive phillips bits, like it's a given they
> won't last long and you best stock up. Wear and tear on the couple
> bits I have would seem to support this. My Korean hammer driven
> impact driver bits are as good and true as the day I bought them, 35
> yrs ago! Anyone making bits that good for the construction industry
> or is cheap Chinese metal all that's available?
>
> nb
Gerald Ross wrote:
> Evodawg wrote:
>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>> thought some might want to know.
>>
>> Rich
> I have a 12v Makita which was a gift. It is light, strong and looks
> like a sneaker. Only problem, the chuck will not tighten enough to
> keep drill bits from slipping. Hope the more expensive ones have a
> better chuck.
>
Oops. My Makita is flawless. It is the Hitachi that slips.
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA
Laugh, and the world ignores you.
Crying doesn't help either.
Evodawg wrote:
> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
> thought some might want to know.
>
> Rich
I have a 12v Makita which was a gift. It is light, strong and looks
like a sneaker. Only problem, the chuck will not tighten enough to
keep drill bits from slipping. Hope the more expensive ones have a
better chuck.
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA
Laugh, and the world ignores you.
Crying doesn't help either.
On 2010-06-08, Martin H. Eastburn <[email protected]> wrote:
> impact driver is rotational not in/out.
> Hammer drill is rotational in drill mode. It is hammer in/out in hammer mode.
> It can do both in some models.
Which brands/models would that be? Thnx.
nb
On 2010-06-07, J. Clarke <[email protected]> wrote:
> The drill under discussion is a hammer drill, not an impact driver. The
> hammer on a hammer drill is of no utility in driving fasteners, it's
> used to drill masonry, and it's a linear hammering action, not rotary.
> The drill turns the bit while the hammer pounds on it.
Yet, it's that hammer pounding action that keeps a phillips-head bit
from "camming out", as one poster so accurately described it. In
motorcycle mechanics, an impact driver is one that gets torqued
phillips head screws out without stripping the phil slots. It's
designed to turn whenever bashed on the back end with a 2lb hammer,
the hammer action making sure there is HUGE inward driving force to
prevent camming out. I want that inward linear force driving the bit
INTO the phil slots when I'm driving deck screws! That Popular
Mechanics review of the Makita hammer driver I posted even talked
about driving deck screws, but also mentioned changing the bits and
drills so often his hand was raw. You gotta pre-drill for deck screws
even with a hammer driver!?
Another thing I notice at the lumber store. At the counter is a whole
bowl full of those hex-drive phillips bits, like it's a given they
won't last long and you best stock up. Wear and tear on the couple
bits I have would seem to support this. My Korean hammer driven
impact driver bits are as good and true as the day I bought them, 35
yrs ago! Anyone making bits that good for the construction industry
or is cheap Chinese metal all that's available?
nb
Larry Jaques <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> When I do decks and such, I need an impactor. I just started another
> deck job last Friday, so I ordered the following kit, replacing my
> Bosch 14.4v Impactor with the Makita 451 kit. http://fwd4.me/Pce
> It has the LXT 3Ah lithium batteries. $269 at Amazon, $30 to $200
> cheaper than anywhere else, and they throw in free shipping.
I've owned this unit for several years, and it has held up well through a
lot of hard daily use. My only small gripe is that there is no storage on
the unit for other driver bits, like DeWalt usually has on their drills and
drivers, but it's a minor oversight.
When I first bought it, one of the crew dubbed it "The Stupid Drill" 'cause
he thought it was useless; it was loud, it had a silly LED light on it, and
it couldn't be used as a drill without an adaptor chuck. After using it
for a while, including finishing up a drywall job in an attic during a
power outage (remember that LED?), it's now the first tool he wants to
borrow... unless he actually needs to drill a hole.
Scott
On Jun 6, 8:26=A0am, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I hav=
e
> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
> thought some might want to know.
>
> Rich
> --
> You can lead them to LINUX
> but you can't make them THINK !
> Mandriva 2010 =A0using KDE 4.3
> Website: =A0www.rentmyhusband.biz
I have owned the 14.4v Makita, driver for about five years. I put up
about 270 feet of cedar fence and a new deck; not to mention day to
day use and it performs like a trooper. It isn't quite as stylish as
this one but a good machine. The 14.4 version will drive a screw all
the way through a cedar board if you aren't careful; but with a little
finesse it is easier to control than my regular cordless Makita
drill.
RonB
Evodawg wrote:
> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I have
> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
> thought some might want to know.
Opps forgot the URL
http://alturl.com/j7gj
--
You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK !
Mandriva 2010 using KDE 4.3
Website: www.rentmyhusband.biz
"Evodawg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Evodawg wrote:
>
>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I
>> have
>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>> thought some might want to know.
>
> Opps forgot the URL
> http://alturl.com/j7gj
>
> --
> You can lead them to LINUX
> but you can't make them THINK !
> Mandriva 2010 using KDE 4.3
> Website: www.rentmyhusband.biz
Sold Out!!
On 6/7/2010 8:14 AM, Leon wrote:
> "notbob"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2010-06-06, Evodawg<[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Evodawg wrote:
>>>
>>>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I
>>>> have
>>>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>>>> thought some might want to know.
>>>
>>> Opps forgot the URL
>>> http://alturl.com/j7gj
>>
>> How do these hammer/drills work?
>>
>> IOW, is it a linear hammering force into, say, a phillips screw head
>> to prevent stripping of the cross slots or a rotary hammering force to
>> further drive the twisting torque for hex head lag bolts driven
>> into wood? Or, is it both? I have a great DeWalt 13V drill/driver,
>> but now see how it is lacking when driving phillips head deck screws.
>>
>> nb
>
> Typically impact drivers work like any other impact driver. Does not answer
> your question... Because the impact is for a split second repeatedly over
> and over a Philips head screw comes out easier because the torque is not
> constant and the bit does not normally climb out of the screw head like it
> will with a drill driver.
> With my impact driver I was able to remove kitchen cabinets that a customer
> had previousely used wood putty to hide the Philips head screws. My regular
> drill driver cammed out. My impact was able to remove the screws with
> minimal engagement.
The drill under discussion is a hammer drill, not an impact driver. The
hammer on a hammer drill is of no utility in driving fasteners, it's
used to drill masonry, and it's a linear hammering action, not rotary.
The drill turns the bit while the hammer pounds on it.
On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 07:14:49 -0500, "Leon" <[email protected]>
wrote the following:
>
>"notbob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On 2010-06-06, Evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Evodawg wrote:
>>>
>>>> This is the best price I've seen on this drill ever. 24 hours only. I
>>>> have
>>>> one and love it. Light but strong. I'm not affiliated with Amazon just
>>>> thought some might want to know.
>>>
>>> Opps forgot the URL
>>> http://alturl.com/j7gj
>>
>> How do these hammer/drills work?
>>
>> IOW, is it a linear hammering force into, say, a phillips screw head
>> to prevent stripping of the cross slots or a rotary hammering force to
>> further drive the twisting torque for hex head lag bolts driven
>> into wood? Or, is it both? I have a great DeWalt 13V drill/driver,
>> but now see how it is lacking when driving phillips head deck screws.
>>
>> nb
>
>Typically impact drivers work like any other impact driver.
I'll have to strongly disagree with that, Leon.
I haven't physically had the mechanisms apart, but I understand that
hammer drills have an axial hammer (like tapping the back of the bit)
while impactors have a rotary hammer effect (hammering down the end of
the breaker bar, a torsional hammer.)
That's a major difference both in concept and result. An impactor
won't drill concrete and a hammer drill won't work nearly as well as
an impactor for installing or removing long, tough screws.
--
Never tell people how to do things. Tell them what
to do and they will surprise you with their ingenuity.
-- George S. Patton
On 2010-06-06, Larry Jaques <[email protected]> wrote:
> When I do decks and such, I need an impactor. I just started another
> deck job last Friday, so I ordered the following kit, replacing my
> Bosch 14.4v Impactor with the Makita 451 kit. http://fwd4.me/Pce
> It has the LXT 3Ah lithium batteries. $269 at Amazon, $30 to $200
> cheaper than anywhere else, and they throw in free shipping.
OK, I see. Hammer vs impact, impact obviously being rotary impact
like an air impact wrench. Got it. BTW, here's a mini comparison
from popular mechanics on the Makita hammer drill:
http://tinyurl.com/24x7oyu
Still a great deal for the price.
nb