.. just got a *lot* more expensive.
The taps:
https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
The announcement:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
The Testing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
I hope they sell a million sets.
On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:43:15 -0500, Jack <[email protected]> wrote:
>On 2/14/2017 10:32 PM, woodchucker wrote:
>> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>>>
>>> The taps:
>>> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>>>
>>> The announcement:
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>>>
>>> The Testing:
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>>>
>>> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>>>
>>> I hope they sell a million sets.
>>>
>> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
>> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely claimed
>> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
>> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
>> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
>> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
>> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
>
>Me neither. It was relatively recently in my woodworking "career" that
>I discovered how strong wood could hold up with regular machine screw
>threads. I had read about it, but didn't fully believe it until I tried
>it. I think they often work better than threaded inserts they sell at
>the borgs.
How can that be? Threaded inserts are, well, threaded into the wood,
after all.
Electric Comet <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 02:04:34 +0000 Spalted Walt <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>
> but only if you buy them
>
> i have watched some of the woodwhisper videos and i get a good laugh at
> all his gadgets and gizmos
>
> seems he has a tool for every single task
>
> lean toward the paul sellers style but i bet those folks that like buying
> stuff more than making it like the woodwhisper
And YOU.
On Wednesday, February 15, 2017 at 7:31:07 PM UTC-5, Electric Comet wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 00:16:40 +0000 (UTC)
> Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > I made wooden vise screws (1.5" diameter) and nuts for a workbench
> > 15-20 years ago. It was cheaper than buying a metal vise. I've
> > since replaced the front vise with a metal one, but the 2 end vises
> > (lined up with the dogholes) are still in use and working fine.
>
> good example
>
> have seen some real nice vices with wooden threads
the threads used in wood vices are typically a much coarser thread, similar to ACME...If I understand correctly the tapping that is being discussed is national coarse thread, ie 1/2-13, 1/4-20, etc, but please correct me if I am wrong...
On Thursday, February 16, 2017 at 4:20:54 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 15, 2017 at 7:31:07 PM UTC-5, Electric Comet wrote:
> > On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 00:16:40 +0000 (UTC)
> > Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > I made wooden vise screws (1.5" diameter) and nuts for a workbench
> > > 15-20 years ago. It was cheaper than buying a metal vise. I've
> > > since replaced the front vise with a metal one, but the 2 end vises
> > > (lined up with the dogholes) are still in use and working fine.
> >
> > good example
> >
> > have seen some real nice vices with wooden threads
>
> the threads used in wood vices are typically a much coarser thread, similar to ACME...If I understand correctly the tapping that is being discussed is national coarse thread, ie 1/2-13, 1/4-20, etc, but please correct me if I am wrong...
and of course, coffee had not kicked in, or I would have corrected the spelling to "vises"
On 2/17/2017 11:28 AM, Jack wrote:
> On 2/16/2017 12:31 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:43:15 -0500, Jack <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2/14/2017 10:32 PM, woodchucker wrote:
>>>> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>>>>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>>>>>
>>>>> The taps:
>>>>> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>>>>>
>>>>> The announcement:
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>>>>>
>>>>> The Testing:
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>> I hope they sell a million sets.
>>>>>
>>>> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
>>>> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely
>>>> claimed
>>>> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
>>>> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
>>>> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
>>>> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
>>>> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
>>>
>>> Me neither. It was relatively recently in my woodworking "career" that
>>> I discovered how strong wood could hold up with regular machine screw
>>> threads. I had read about it, but didn't fully believe it until I tried
>>> it. I think they often work better than threaded inserts they sell at
>>> the borgs.
>>
>> How can that be? Threaded inserts are, well, threaded into the wood,
>> after all.
>>
> (Posted at end of numerous lines of extraneous text to conform to
> ignorance level of previous poster[s])
>
> Threaded inserts are generally very short, with a few course threads,
> making them unstable and weak, while a tapped hole is the length of the
> screw and very stable. It's also easy to tap a hole in wood, just using
> a small tail-less drill and the tap.
Actually, some threaded inserts may be very short and have only a few
coarse threads.
Threaded inserts with coarse threads are generally intended to be used
in soft woods and plywood. A bolt and or screw does not thread well
into soft woods or plywood and last with repeated assembly and disassembles.
I buy these things 20~50 at a time in lengths up to 1.25" long and they
receive, in my case, 5/16" bolts. And FWIW I have never had one fail.
I used 8 inserts and 8, 5/16"bolts to hold a commercial airplane display
together. This display is used all around the world and is disassembled
and reassembled for each convention that it is used at. I have been
told that this display had been taken apart and reassembled about once a
month for the past 4 years.
Naturally if you use the wrong part for a particular application it is
likely to fail. By the same token if I had simply threaded the display
with a tap and not use a threaded insert and bolted it together it would
not have held up with 50 plus cycles.
On 2/15/2017 4:41 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>> The Testing:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>
> I thought that test was interesting, and clever, but it may not tell you
> all you need to know.
>
> After I saw one of the Woodsperer's videos about tapping wood, I decided
> to give it a try. I had a set of Sixties-era taps that were my Dad's.
>
> If I remember correctly, I did my own test, tapping a 1/4"x20 thread in
> some oak and then hitting the bolt with a hammer, and even a hand
> sledge. It was remarkable how strong it was. Armed with that
> information, I used some tapped holes in a jig I made. Now the jig was
> poplar, but it was fully an inch thick, and wouldn't be required to hold
> with extreme force.
>
> I found though that after I had tightened and loosened the jig a bunch
> of times, the bolt felt looser in the threads. I think I could have
> stripped them if I tightened the bolt to my usual "tighter than
> necessary" degree.
>
> I think I'll still make use of some wood threads from time to time, but
> if the application is going to require frequent loosening and
> tightening, I'll use another method.
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
It depends on the wood. I use soft wax when tapping wood. it helps avoid
tearing the fibers, and seems to cut them better.
But yes, metal against wood will eventually wear down.
Crappy metal threads more so then smooth threads, so the quality of the
screw makes a difference.
I have been doing threads for years w/ no problems. I find it easier
than inserts which I find to lift a dimple around the insert too many
times. Even when pushing down hard in a drill press to keep the insert
in straight and manually tapping it by hand in the drill press (belt
off). I still use inserts too, so no hard rules.
--
Jeff
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>
> The taps:
> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>
> The announcement:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>
> The Testing:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>
> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>
> I hope they sell a million sets.
>
Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely claimed
he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
quality long reach metal taps for much less.
So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
--
Jeff
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
On Tue, 14 Feb 2017 22:32:21 -0500, woodchucker <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
> > .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
> >
> > The taps:
> > https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
> >
> > The announcement:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
> >
> > The Testing:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
> >
> > http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
> >
> > I hope they sell a million sets.
> >
>
> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely claimed
> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
Not to me either, I've found my 20 yr old set of these to be quite
adequate for my occasional needs:
http://www.harborfreight.com/60-piece-sae-metric-tap-and-die-set-35407.html
I want to say acme. Wood tap/die units for brush instruments - shop
brooms - are tapered.
Metal threads are typically to fine for wood. Some of the x8 or x4 are
not far off.
Inserts fit into hard wood in a specific threaded hole.
Martin
On 2/16/2017 3:20 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 15, 2017 at 7:31:07 PM UTC-5, Electric Comet wrote:
>> On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 00:16:40 +0000 (UTC)
>> Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> I made wooden vise screws (1.5" diameter) and nuts for a workbench
>>> 15-20 years ago. It was cheaper than buying a metal vise. I've
>>> since replaced the front vise with a metal one, but the 2 end vises
>>> (lined up with the dogholes) are still in use and working fine.
>>
>> good example
>>
>> have seen some real nice vices with wooden threads
>
> the threads used in wood vices are typically a much coarser thread, similar to ACME...If I understand correctly the tapping that is being discussed is national coarse thread, ie 1/2-13, 1/4-20, etc, but please correct me if I am wrong...
>
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 02:04:34 +0000 Spalted Walt <[email protected]>
wrote:
> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
but only if you buy them
i have watched some of the woodwhisper videos and i get a good laugh at
all his gadgets and gizmos
seems he has a tool for every single task
lean toward the paul sellers style but i bet those folks that like buying
stuff more than making it like the woodwhisper
On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
> The Testing:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
I thought that test was interesting, and clever, but it may not tell you
all you need to know.
After I saw one of the Woodsperer's videos about tapping wood, I decided
to give it a try. I had a set of Sixties-era taps that were my Dad's.
If I remember correctly, I did my own test, tapping a 1/4"x20 thread in
some oak and then hitting the bolt with a hammer, and even a hand
sledge. It was remarkable how strong it was. Armed with that
information, I used some tapped holes in a jig I made. Now the jig was
poplar, but it was fully an inch thick, and wouldn't be required to hold
with extreme force.
I found though that after I had tightened and loosened the jig a bunch
of times, the bolt felt looser in the threads. I think I could have
stripped them if I tightened the bolt to my usual "tighter than
necessary" degree.
I think I'll still make use of some wood threads from time to time, but
if the application is going to require frequent loosening and
tightening, I'll use another method.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 16:41:51 -0500
Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:
> I think I'll still make use of some wood threads from time to time,
> but if the application is going to require frequent loosening and
> tightening, I'll use another method.
that is the other thing
not sure i have seen threads in wood very often except in whimsical
forms or artistic forms
croquet mallets come to mind but that is not a good solution
and prefer a tapered shaft and glue
for kid toys it seems fine
On Wed, 15 Feb 2017 14:05:15 -0800, Electric Comet wrote:
> not sure i have seen threads in wood very often except in whimsical
> forms or artistic forms
I made wooden vise screws (1.5" diameter) and nuts for a workbench 15-20
years ago. It was cheaper than buying a metal vise. I've since replaced
the front vise with a metal one, but the 2 end vises (lined up with the
dogholes) are still in use and working fine.
--
What if a much of a which of a wind gives the truth to summer's lie?
On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 00:16:40 +0000 (UTC)
Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> wrote:
> I made wooden vise screws (1.5" diameter) and nuts for a workbench
> 15-20 years ago. It was cheaper than buying a metal vise. I've
> since replaced the front vise with a metal one, but the 2 end vises
> (lined up with the dogholes) are still in use and working fine.
good example
have seen some real nice vices with wooden threads
"Greg Guarino" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>> The Testing:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>
> I thought that test was interesting, and clever, but it may not tell you
> all you need to know.
>
> After I saw one of the Woodsperer's videos about tapping wood, I decided
> to give it a try. I had a set of Sixties-era taps that were my Dad's.
>
> If I remember correctly, I did my own test, tapping a 1/4"x20 thread in
> some oak and then hitting the bolt with a hammer, and even a hand sledge.
> It was remarkable how strong it was. Armed with that information, I used
> some tapped holes in a jig I made. Now the jig was poplar, but it was
> fully an inch thick, and wouldn't be required to hold with extreme force.
>
> I found though that after I had tightened and loosened the jig a bunch of
> times, the bolt felt looser in the threads. I think I could have stripped
> them if I tightened the bolt to my usual "tighter than necessary" degree.
>
> I think I'll still make use of some wood threads from time to time, but if
> the application is going to require frequent loosening and tightening,
> I'll use another method.
They can be greatly hardened/strengthened by applying super glue to the
threads then re-tapping.
On 2/14/2017 10:32 PM, woodchucker wrote:
> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>>
>> The taps:
>> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>>
>> The announcement:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>>
>> The Testing:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>>
>> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>>
>> I hope they sell a million sets.
>>
> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely claimed
> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
Me neither. It was relatively recently in my woodworking "career" that
I discovered how strong wood could hold up with regular machine screw
threads. I had read about it, but didn't fully believe it until I tried
it. I think they often work better than threaded inserts they sell at
the borgs.
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com
On 2/15/2017 9:03 AM, Spalted Walt wrote:
> Not to me either, I've found my 20 yr old set of these to be quite
> adequate for my occasional needs:
>
> http://www.harborfreight.com/60-piece-sae-metric-tap-and-die-set-35407.html
My set is considerably older, but just as cheap. I have a few that I
picked up from who knows where that are much higher quality, but the
cheap stuff works OK for re-working threads and taping wood.
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com
On 2/16/2017 12:31 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:43:15 -0500, Jack <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On 2/14/2017 10:32 PM, woodchucker wrote:
>>> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>>>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>>>>
>>>> The taps:
>>>> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>>>>
>>>> The announcement:
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>>>>
>>>> The Testing:
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>>>>
>>>> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>>>>
>>>> I hope they sell a million sets.
>>>>
>>> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
>>> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely claimed
>>> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square for
>>> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are nice
>>> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
>>> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
>>> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
>>
>> Me neither. It was relatively recently in my woodworking "career" that
>> I discovered how strong wood could hold up with regular machine screw
>> threads. I had read about it, but didn't fully believe it until I tried
>> it. I think they often work better than threaded inserts they sell at
>> the borgs.
>
> How can that be? Threaded inserts are, well, threaded into the wood,
> after all.
>
(Posted at end of numerous lines of extraneous text to conform to
ignorance level of previous poster[s])
Threaded inserts are generally very short, with a few course threads,
making them unstable and weak, while a tapped hole is the length of the
screw and very stable. It's also easy to tap a hole in wood, just using
a small tail-less drill and the tap.
And before you go all Krwnotreal on me, I said "I think" they "often"
work better, not that no one should ever use a threaded insert...
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com
On 2/17/2017 12:57 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 2/17/2017 11:28 AM, Jack wrote:
>> On 2/16/2017 12:31 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:43:15 -0500, Jack <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2/14/2017 10:32 PM, woodchucker wrote:
>>>>> On 2/14/2017 9:04 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:
>>>>>> .. just got a *lot* more expensive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The taps:
>>>>>> https://thewoodwhispererguild.com/product-category/tools/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The announcement:
>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC6p5SSUSW4
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Testing:
>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA-CmUvIsjg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.pdfbooksworld.com/image/cache/catalog/68-390x550.jpg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I hope they sell a million sets.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Go ahead and buy them, I'll continue to use regular metal taps, which
>>>>> work quite well. I never spin a shank, like he (I'll bet falsely
>>>>> claimed
>>>>> he did) . The hex shank is a negative. I would rather have a square
>>>>> for
>>>>> use in regular tap wrench if I decided to hand tap. The shanks are
>>>>> nice
>>>>> and long. and it looks like a quality tap. But I can buy the highest
>>>>> quality long reach metal taps for much less.
>>>>> So I'm sure they'll sell, just not to me.
>>>>
>>>> Me neither. It was relatively recently in my woodworking "career" that
>>>> I discovered how strong wood could hold up with regular machine screw
>>>> threads. I had read about it, but didn't fully believe it until I
>>>> tried
>>>> it. I think they often work better than threaded inserts they sell at
>>>> the borgs.
>>>
>>> How can that be? Threaded inserts are, well, threaded into the wood,
>>> after all.
>>>
>> (Posted at end of numerous lines of extraneous text to conform to
>> ignorance level of previous poster[s])
>>
>> Threaded inserts are generally very short, with a few course threads,
>> making them unstable and weak, while a tapped hole is the length of the
>> screw and very stable. It's also easy to tap a hole in wood, just using
>> a small tail-less drill and the tap.
>
> Actually, some threaded inserts may be very short and have only a few
> coarse threads.
> Threaded inserts with coarse threads are generally intended to be used
> in soft woods and plywood. A bolt and or screw does not thread well
> into soft woods or plywood and last with repeated assembly and
> disassembles.
> I buy these things 20~50 at a time in lengths up to 1.25" long and they
> receive, in my case, 5/16" bolts. And FWIW I have never had one fail.
> I used 8 inserts and 8, 5/16"bolts to hold a commercial airplane display
> together. This display is used all around the world and is disassembled
> and reassembled for each convention that it is used at. I have been
> told that this display had been taken apart and reassembled about once a
> month for the past 4 years.
>
> Naturally if you use the wrong part for a particular application it is
> likely to fail. By the same token if I had simply threaded the display
> with a tap and not use a threaded insert and bolted it together it would
> not have held up with 50 plus cycles.
>
>
>
>
Naturally.
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com