Couple of questions about planes:
I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
slickness?
When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
point?
Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.
I agree with others. The finer sanding of the sole will make it smoother p=
laning. I often use 2000 and finer to polish metal, my planes' soles inclu=
ded.
Cross grain planing was done on my shaving horse project, after splitting t=
he log into appropriate boards. Not only perpendicular to the grain, but d=
iagonal to it at times. That kind of rough planing cuts down greatly on th=
e along-the-grain planing, later. That cross planing gouges out greater sh=
avings, than does the finer smoothening of along-the-grain planing.
Not only will cross planing knock down the high spots faster, but if you wa=
nt to reduce the overall thickness of a board, say by 1/8", cross planing i=
s the fastest way to accomplish the task, to nearly your mark, before fine =
planing along the grain to your mark, when hand planing only.
Sonny
"Puckdropper" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
"Mike Marlow" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> Puckdropper wrote:
>
>> Couple of questions about planes:
>>
>> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the
>> sole. After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only
>> last for about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary
>> sharp process) to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally
>> keep that smooth slickness?
>>
>
> Sure will. The wax is probably hiding a "rough" surface on the sole
> of your plane. Try 1500 - that may be plenty smooth enough. If not,
> go finer.
>
I shall acquire some sheets of fine paper and report back. The sole
looked pretty flat when checked with my straight edge, so I can probably
start at 400.
===========================================================================
Smooth it all up like that and you will not notice much difference other
than it will be shinier. Still going to need the wax for really smooth
going.
In article <[email protected]>,
Puckdropper wrote:
> Couple of questions about planes:
>
> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
> After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
> about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
> to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
> slickness?
>
> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
> point?
You've received some great advice, and I don't disagree with any of it.
First, however, scary sharp the blade. A very, very sharp blade will
make a HUGE difference.
My $0.02
--
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside a dog, it's too dark to
read. - Groucho Marx
> On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 20:59:25 -0800 (PST), Father Haskell
>
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >If you can find mutton tallow, its residues, if any, are
> >supposed not to interfere with gluing or finishing.
> Dixie Gun Works. $5.75 for a 12-16 ounce jar, plus shipping.
How different is this from lanolin? The market for lanolin
around here, is all $13/ounce at pharmacies
The usual 'lanolin substitute' is waterless hand cleaner (the
white no-abrasive kind); would that be effective on planes?
I'm going to give it a try this afternoon...
On Feb 20, 3:45=A0pm, [email protected] (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
>
> Puckdropper =A0<puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
> >Couple of questions about planes:
>
> >I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sol=
e.
> >After that, it works great.
>
> And puts wax onto your wood. =A0Have fun finishing it later.
Which the plane removes. You'll have more problems
staining carpenter's glue lines, which, because they
dry water resistant, resist stain, as well.
If you can find mutton tallow, its residues, if any, are
supposed not to interfere with gluing or finishing.
On Monday, February 25, 2013 9:36:11 AM UTC-6, Lee Michaels wrote:
> I became a historical expert among her nursing friends. They all asked m=
e about the original use of bag balm and how the cows reacted to me applyin=
g it=20
Should have given them a first-hand demonstration.
> Father Haskell=20
>=20
>If you can find mutton tallow,=20
Regarding sheep tallow or balm, I think that might be too oily, if your pro=
duct is similar to what I'm thinking. I have an old jar of home made sheep=
balm, my grandfather made, and not only does it smell to high heaven, it's=
oily. *I never use it, except when particular relatives or friends come o=
ver and I extoll its virtues and of course they have to try it. LOL.
Sonny
"Mike Marlow" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> Puckdropper wrote:
>
>> Couple of questions about planes:
>>
>> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the
>> sole. After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only
>> last for about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary
>> sharp process) to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally
>> keep that smooth slickness?
>>
>
> Sure will. The wax is probably hiding a "rough" surface on the sole
> of your plane. Try 1500 - that may be plenty smooth enough. If not,
> go finer.
>
I shall acquire some sheets of fine paper and report back. The sole
looked pretty flat when checked with my straight edge, so I can probably
start at 400.
Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.
Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
>
> I shall acquire some sheets of fine paper and report back. The sole
> looked pretty flat when checked with my straight edge, so I can
> probably start at 400.
>
> Puckdropper
Reporting back...
The plane might have been flat, but it wasn't smooth and flat. The
normal oxidation on the plane sole caused excessive drag which made it
hard to use. As I started to sand it, it started to get really shiny.
I had started out with 320 grit, but it didn't last long at all. So, I
dropped down to 150 grit.
The 150 grit has left a smooth and flat surface that works properly
without lubrication. Where the plane rarely took a full width shaving
before, it did so with little hesitation.
I haven't decided whether I need to do anything about the plane sides (I
don't see myself using it in a shooting board), but maybe I'll sand them
down some and put some paste wax on them.
Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.
"Scott Lurndal" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> writes:
>>
>>"whit3rd" wrote:
>>
>>> How different is this from lanolin? The market for lanolin
>>> around here, is all $13/ounce at pharmacies
>>---------------------------------------------------------
>>Udder Balm, a dairy supply item.
>>
>
> AKA Bag Balm, available from costco pharamacy counter.
Ahh..., brings back memories.
My wife, who was a nurse for many years, got all upset and focused because
she did not have any bag balm. Apparently wearing those latex gloves and
hand washing many times per shift can lead to chapped hands. And many
medical people swear by bag balm. When she finally located a can of the
fabled bag balm, she proceeded to tell me about it.
I laughed and told her that I used to apply it directly to the cow's udder
back in the 1950's. As a farmboy, I had to perform many first aid and minor
veterinary functions. I was VERY familiar with bag balm. I became a
historical expert among her nursing friends. They all asked me about the
original use of bag balm and how the cows reacted to me applying it (They
did not like it.)
There is still a can of bag balm on the shelves above the toilet. And we do
use it from time to time.
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 20:59:25 -0800 (PST), Father Haskell
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>If you can find mutton tallow, its residues, if any, are
>supposed not to interfere with gluing or finishing.
Dixie Gun Works. $5.75 for a 12-16 ounce jar, plus shipping.
http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_reviews.php?products_id=3686
On 2/20/2013 3:45 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>> Couple of questions about planes:
>>
>> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
>> After that, it works great.
>
> And puts wax onto your wood. Have fun finishing it later.
>
Wrong.
--
Jeff
On 2/20/2013 10:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> Couple of questions about planes:
>
> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
> After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
> about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
> to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
> slickness?
>
> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
> point?
>
> Puckdropper
>
So wax or oil (yes oil) can help a plane get moving.
And yes they wear off quickly.
No having a totally smooth bottom devoid of scratches won't help. The
problem is that you are experiencing like a hydraulic lock. Where the
surfaces suck together. Think of the corrugated bottom planes that tried
to eliminate this.
Across the grain is much easier to plane than with the grain. Get the
high spots first.I chamfer the edge to prevent blowing it out (tear out).
I keep candle wax handy and just hit it with a little every now and
then. Some use oil (Frank Klauz for example).
--
Jeff
On Feb 20, 10:15=A0am, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/20/2013 9:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
>
> > Couple of questions about planes:
>
> > I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the so=
le.
> > After that, it works great. =A0The effects of the wax last only last fo=
r
> > about 5 minutes. =A0If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp pr=
ocess)
> > to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
> > slickness?
>
> Certainly helps...a plane needs be "tuned" just as a chisel back to be
> true and flat and polished its entire surface. =A0And, of course, the
> blade sharpened the same way that the back should be perfectly flattened
> so the edge is pure. =A0The wax is probably making up for the otherwise
> rough surface by being an interface until it's worn away. =A0If the
> surface is slick the need for help is reduced, obviously.
>
> > When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> > across the grain. =A0When doing this, what am I looking for as a stoppi=
ng
> > point?
>
> It's normally done w/ a scrub plane--has two purposes; one to remove
> high spots selectively to bring the board into plane surface and
> secondly to ease the plane force required by slicing partially across
> grain just as skewing a plane slight when going with the grain...
>
> You're looking only to hit the high spots--when the marks disappear,
> revert to longitudinal finish strokes. =A0Again, it will work better w/ a
> scrub plane or if you have only the one, a blade that is sharpened to
> have a very slight convex shape so the corners don't bite and leave any
> gouge marks will suffice.
A narrower iron can take out a heavier shaving for the same
push. A #4 is ideal for setting up as a scrub.
On Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:51:44 AM UTC-6, Puckdropper wrote:
> Puckdropper Reporting back... I haven't decided whether I need to do anything about the plane sides
Just make sure there are no burrs on the side edges, adjacent to the sole. If the bottom was pitted, even slightly, there may be a few burrs on the bottom-side edges.
Sonny
"CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>"Puckdropper" wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>
>"Mike Marlow" <[email protected]> wrote in
>news:[email protected]:
>
>> Puckdropper wrote:
>===========================================================================
>Smooth it all up like that and you will not notice much difference other
>than it will be shinier. Still going to need the wax for really smooth
>going.
>
Agreed. At any level of "shine", wax will make the plane slide easier.
If you can see yourself in the sole you are increasing friction as
there is more complete surface contact. Kind of like the way gauge
blocks stick together when wrung. I polished one #6 plane like that,
and have seen small pieces of wood lift with the plane at the end of a
stroke.
Whatever you lube a plane with will wear off quickly. A candle or a
chunk of paraffin is fine for small jobs. For extended planing
sessions I use a wick soaked in mineral spirits. I made the wick from
an old cloth belt, rolled tightly and held by a chunk of scrap lumber
with a 1.5" hole drilled deep enough so that the edge of the belt roll
sticks out about a quarter inch. A couple swipes of the plane
backwards over the wick lubes the sole nicely without needing to stop
or change hand positions. A better holder can be made using a metal or
plastic container with a lid to reduce evaporation, but I made this
one as a trial, and then ran out of roundtoits.
"Puckdropper" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>Couple of questions about planes:
>I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
>After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
>about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
>to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
>slickness?
>When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
>across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
>point?
If you are using this as a jack plane, with a relatively heavy camber on the
iron, I don't think I'd bother polishing the sole... Jack planes are
typically the first plane to touch the wood (unless you have a scrub) and
you are likely to have dust, dirt, pebbles, etc. on or embedded in the
surface that will quickly scratch up the sole. Those scratches will negate
all your efforts to polish the sole. Unless you have noticeable corrosion
or damage on the sole I'd stick with the wax or risk frustrating yourself as
the new scratches quickly appear! In the cases of corrosion or damage
taking it to 600 grit or so should be fine enough.
In use, the initial strokes are typically diagonally across the board to
flatten. Go diagonally from both directions and once all the diagonal plane
tracks are even then take a pass with the grain and move on to the jointer
plane. If you are thicknessing the board continue the diagonal passes until
you are approaching the desired thickness and then go with the grain. You do
not want to go so far that the low points of the cuts end up below the
surface of the desired thickness unless this is "class C" work where only
thickness and not appearance matters.
John
On 2/20/2013 9:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> Couple of questions about planes:
>
> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
> After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
> about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
> to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
> slickness?
Certainly helps...a plane needs be "tuned" just as a chisel back to be
true and flat and polished its entire surface. And, of course, the
blade sharpened the same way that the back should be perfectly flattened
so the edge is pure. The wax is probably making up for the otherwise
rough surface by being an interface until it's worn away. If the
surface is slick the need for help is reduced, obviously.
> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
> point?
It's normally done w/ a scrub plane--has two purposes; one to remove
high spots selectively to bring the board into plane surface and
secondly to ease the plane force required by slicing partially across
grain just as skewing a plane slight when going with the grain...
You're looking only to hit the high spots--when the marks disappear,
revert to longitudinal finish strokes. Again, it will work better w/ a
scrub plane or if you have only the one, a blade that is sharpened to
have a very slight convex shape so the corners don't bite and leave any
gouge marks will suffice.
Puckdropper wrote:
> Couple of questions about planes:
>
> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the
> sole. After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only
> last for about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary
> sharp process) to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally
> keep that smooth slickness?
>
Sure will. The wax is probably hiding a "rough" surface on the sole of your
plane. Try 1500 - that may be plenty smooth enough. If not, go finer.
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
On 2/20/2013 7:15 AM, dpb wrote:
> On 2/20/2013 9:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
>> Couple of questions about planes:
>
>> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
>> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
>> point?
>
> It's normally done w/ a scrub plane--has two purposes; one to remove
> high spots selectively to bring the board into plane surface and
> secondly to ease the plane force required by slicing partially across
> grain just as skewing a plane slight when going with the grain...
>
> You're looking only to hit the high spots--when the marks disappear,
> revert to longitudinal finish strokes. Again, it will work better w/ a
> scrub plane or if you have only the one, a blade that is sharpened to
> have a very slight convex shape so the corners don't bite and leave any
> gouge marks will suffice.
A real scrub plane would be cool, but they are often expensive. I
converted a cheapo smoothing plane into a "scrub" plane by honing a
rather tight arc into the blade. Setting the blade with a good bite and
planing across the grain I can remove lots of wood and old paint
quickly. And I don't care too much about dirt, paint, and old staples
because it was a $2 plane that I expect to abuse. A very useful tool,
especially if you like to recycle wood (like the 15"-wide vertical-grain
redwood shelf I got from my grandmother's house).
On 2/20/2013 10:20 AM, scritch wrote:
> On 2/20/2013 7:15 AM, dpb wrote:
> > On 2/20/2013 9:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> >> Couple of questions about planes:
> >
> >> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> >> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
> >> point?
> >
> > It's normally done w/ a scrub plane--has two purposes; one to remove
> > high spots selectively to bring the board into plane surface and
> > secondly to ease the plane force required by slicing partially across
> > grain just as skewing a plane slight when going with the grain...
...
> A real scrub plane would be cool, but they are often expensive. I
> converted a cheapo smoothing plane into a "scrub" plane by honing a
> rather tight arc into the blade. Setting the blade with a good bite and
> planing across the grain I can remove lots of wood and old paint
> quickly. And I don't care too much about dirt, paint, and old staples
> because it was a $2 plane that I expect to abuse. A very useful tool,
> especially if you like to recycle wood (like the 15"-wide vertical-grain
> redwood shelf I got from my grandmother's house).
Indeed...a reasonable solution.
--
On 2/20/2013 10:42 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> "Mike Marlow"<[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> Puckdropper wrote:
>>
>>> Couple of questions about planes:
>>>
>>> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the
>>> sole. After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only
>>> last for about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary
>>> sharp process) to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally
>>> keep that smooth slickness?
>>>
>>
>> Sure will. The wax is probably hiding a "rough" surface on the sole
>> of your plane. Try 1500 - that may be plenty smooth enough. If not,
>> go finer.
>>
>
> I shall acquire some sheets of fine paper and report back. The sole
> looked pretty flat when checked with my straight edge, so I can probably
> start at 400.
The way to tell when is enough is when you have a uniform scratch
pattern over the entire sole--then you can begin to polish. Be certain,
however, that the reference surface you use is flat or you'll be
grinding in curvature you definitely don't want.
--
In article <[email protected]>,
Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>Couple of questions about planes:
>
>I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
>After that, it works great.
And puts wax onto your wood. Have fun finishing it later.
--
-Ed Falk, [email protected]
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/
In article <[email protected]>,
Edward A. Falk <[email protected]> wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>,
>Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>Couple of questions about planes:
>>
>>I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
>>After that, it works great.
>
>And puts wax onto your wood. Have fun finishing it later.
That said, you've got me all inspired to polish my plane too.
--
-Ed Falk, [email protected]
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/
On 2/20/2013 9:27 PM, woodchucker wrote:
...
> No having a totally smooth bottom devoid of scratches won't help. The
> problem is that you are experiencing like a hydraulic lock. Where the
> surfaces suck together. Think of the corrugated bottom planes that tried
> to eliminate this.
...
Certainly not until one has already reached a nearly perfect
surface--and OP's talking about flattening where he doesn't even yet
have twist/cup/etc., out...the likelihood of that being his problem is
minimal at best methinks.
The corrugated soles help simply by reducing surface area.
--
"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> writes:
>
>"whit3rd" wrote:
>
>> How different is this from lanolin? The market for lanolin
>> around here, is all $13/ounce at pharmacies
>---------------------------------------------------------
>Udder Balm, a dairy supply item.
>
AKA Bag Balm, available from costco pharamacy counter.
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 22:27:32 -0500, woodchucker <[email protected]>
wrote:
>On 2/20/2013 10:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
>> Couple of questions about planes:
>>
>> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
>> After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
>> about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
>> to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
>> slickness?
>>
>> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
>> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
>> point?
>>
>> Puckdropper
>>
>So wax or oil (yes oil) can help a plane get moving.
>And yes they wear off quickly.
>
>No having a totally smooth bottom devoid of scratches won't help. The
>problem is that you are experiencing like a hydraulic lock. Where the
>surfaces suck together. Think of the corrugated bottom planes that tried
>to eliminate this.
>
>Across the grain is much easier to plane than with the grain. Get the
>high spots first.I chamfer the edge to prevent blowing it out (tear out).
>
>I keep candle wax handy and just hit it with a little every now and
>then. Some use oil (Frank Klauz for example).
BoeLube - Or Boeshield T9
On 2/20/2013 10:06 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> Couple of questions about planes:
>
> I have a #5 plane that works ok until a little wax is applied to the sole.
> After that, it works great. The effects of the wax last only last for
> about 5 minutes. If I was to sand the sole (basically scary sharp process)
> to about 1500 or even 3000 grit, would it naturally keep that smooth
> slickness?
I did the scary sharp process on a small block plane. What can I say?
The blade looked so good I got carried away and did the sole of the
plane too. Fortunately, the sole was pretty flat to begin with and it
didn't take long. I went to 2000 grit and it is like a mirror. It
could be my imagination, but it seems a lot easier to control now.
>
> When I try to flatten a board, one of things I've seen people do is go
> across the grain. When doing this, what am I looking for as a stopping
> point?
>
> Puckdropper
>