I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
the flutes, etc.
Any such tool exist?
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:NFjYj.5707$bG1.5413@trndny04...
> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without
stopping
> the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
> blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
> the flutes, etc.
>
> Any such tool exist?
>
> Regards,
> Joe Agro, Jr.
> (800) 871-5022
> 01.908.542.0244
> Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
> Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
> V8013-R
>
>
>
>
>
Does it have to be a standard twist drill ? For instance:
1.A flat spade bit doesn't hold wood chips as much as a twist drill.
2. How about a spiral router bit instead of the drill ? The flutes are more
open on them.
3. Have you tried putting a hard teflon coat on the drill bit (like the
frying pan coating) ?
If all of these fail or are not acceptable for some reason then you will
likely need to use a reversable motor and install a cleaning brush on an
actuator that engages and follows the drill flutes down when the motor is
reversed to clean the bit. This would be done while the drill spindle is in
it's retracted position. This would add a cleaning cycle after each hole was
drilled, but it should be able to be done in just a few seconds.
Charley (retired automation engineer)
Work with vacuum at the drill bit + short stiff brush like dead or new
tooth brush.
Keep hands away. Retract drill frequently whilst all of this is going
on. If the work is not clamped down and against a fence you will be in
for an ER visit.
Drills>>> far more than routs:|
www.patwarner.com
****************************************************************************=
*****8
On May 19, 11:29=A0am, "Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...=
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stoppi=
ng
> the rotation of the tooling. =A0I told them to try a very high pressure ai=
r
> blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down=
> the flutes, etc.
>
> Any such tool exist?
>
> Regards,
> Joe Agro, Jr.
> (800) 871-5022
> 01.908.542.0244
> Automatic / Pneumatic Drills:http://www.AutoDrill.com
> Multiple Spindle Drills:http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
> V8013-R
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote:
>I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
>drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
>They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
>the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
>blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
>the flutes, etc.
>
>Any such tool exist?
>
>Regards,
>Joe Agro, Jr.
>(800) 871-5022
>01.908.542.0244
>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
>V8013-R
>
>
>
Unless the device you are using is spinning faster than the drill, it
will push material up the flutes, not down them. How about some
sacrificial medium that has enough "body" to push out the waste, but
is soft enough to not overly dull your drill? Or a medium that
lubricates the bit to use before each drilling, to keep the offending
substance from sticking?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
> A fixed disk that spins with the drill, and has interior "fingers"
> into the flutes. Disk would be constrained from vertical movement by
> fixed plates above and below the disk (with bearings either on these
> fixed plates or in the disk, so that the disk can be constrained from
> vertical movement but still be allowed to spin freely with the drill).
> on the return stroke after drilling, the drill would retract as far as
> it can leaving the disk just engaged, and the disk will sweep out the
> debris.
>
> I'll call to give you address to send the royalty payments. ;-)
LOL... Royalty... You can't prove a royal bloodline in an e-mail! <G>
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
Normally I simply touch the bit with my finger or a piece of wood while it
is spinning.
That is probably not going to be a reasonable solution.
What if the bit was Teflon coated.
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:NFjYj.5707$bG1.5413@trndny04...
>I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without
> stopping the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high
> pressure air blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method
> that runs down the flutes, etc.
>
> Any such tool exist?
>
> Regards,
> Joe Agro, Jr.
> (800) 871-5022
> 01.908.542.0244
> Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
> Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
> V8013-R
>
>
>
>
>
on 5/19/2008 2:29 PM Joe AutoDrill said the following:
> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
> the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
> blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
> the flutes, etc.
>
> Any such tool exist?
>
In a manufacturing process that uses drills, they use a water based
lubricant that is constantly applied to the drill.
--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @
> Does it have to be a standard twist drill ? For instance:
> 1.A flat spade bit doesn't hold wood chips as much as a twist drill.
> 2. How about a spiral router bit instead of the drill ? The flutes are
> more
> open on them.
Mustbe standard twist drill but can (and probably will be coated, etc.)
> 3. Have you tried putting a hard teflon coat on the drill bit (like the
> frying pan coating) ?
Not yet. First discussion about the process was 3 days ago. "Testing" of
sorts starts in a week with a drill press.
> If all of these fail or are not acceptable for some reason then you will
> likely need to use a reversable motor and install a cleaning brush on an
> actuator that engages and follows the drill flutes down when the motor is
> reversed to clean the bit. This would be done while the drill spindle is
> in
> it's retracted position. This would add a cleaning cycle after each hole
> was
> drilled, but it should be able to be done in just a few seconds.
Agreed. Inverter rated and programmed with a PLC, this should be easy to do
with a solenoid activated valve, air stroked brush, etc.
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
On Mon, 19 May 2008 19:35:17 +0000, Joe AutoDrill wrote:
>
> This is for an automated process with no manual inputs. automatically
> loaded part, stroked machine, etc... No human interaction within 30'
>
> So it has to be some type of automated process... Or a very tiny person
> with lots of health and life insurance and a death wish.
How about changing the bit(s)?
This looks like it deals with the chip clearance/no clogging issue better
than a standard wood drill would..
<http://www.bamanufacturing.com/rrh_series.html>
Are they definitely closed to any sort of non-mechanical process like
through-coolant lubrication that might cut down on the clogging?
There are quite a few patents that talk about anti-clogging and clog-
clearing devices so somebody out there must have actually made one at
some point - they can't all be patent trolls, can they?
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:571609a2-cb16-47e5-8995-41dd533b11fe@u12g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>Work with vacuum at the drill bit + short stiff brush like dead or new
>tooth brush.
>Keep hands away. Retract drill frequently whilst all of this is going
>on. If the work is not clamped down and against a fence you will be in
>for an ER visit.
This is for an automated process with no manual inputs. automatically
loaded part, stroked machine, etc... No human interaction within 30'
So it has to be some type of automated process... Or a very tiny person
with lots of health and life insurance and a death wish.
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
"willshak" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> on 5/19/2008 2:29 PM Joe AutoDrill said the following:
>> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
>> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but
>> could...
>>
>> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without
>> stopping the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high
>> pressure air blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method
>> that runs down the flutes, etc.
>>
>> Any such tool exist?
>>
>
> In a manufacturing process that uses drills, they use a water based
> lubricant that is constantly applied to the drill.
Imagine you are drilling over a well finished piece of MDF and for some
reason, the MF you drill sticks in the flutes and causes problems... I need
to clear the offending "stuck stuff" without contaminating the part below.
Coolant is good for some plastics, almost all metals and a variety of other
materials, but this customer has a substance that is both absorbant and
"stainable" and not powerdery like some woods... Tough problem if the air
blast doesn't work... I thought maybe there was something similar to the
cogsdill that expanded on retraction to force the removal of debris, etc.
Expensive to design, but possibly sellable to this customer.
BTW if it matters, the customer will pay $10k+ for my machines and drill
every 4-5 seconds so this is not a hobby-like application.
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
On May 19, 11:29=A0am, "Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill ...
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stoppi=
ng
Two solutions haven't been mentioned yet: you could use
a nylon-bristle circular brush, driven at such speed that
the drill leading edge won't catch it, at an angle so that
it pushes the chips along the flutes. Even an idler
brush, with a low-friction bearing, would do (the drill
friction will start it up) if you don't mind extra wear.
And in addition to an air blast, you could put some mild abrasive
into that air stream (like coarse sawdust or soap powder).
That adds to the mess, of course, but it WILL scour
without hurting the edge.
Joe AutoDrill <[email protected]> wrote:
: I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
: drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
: They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
: the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
: blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
: the flutes, etc.
Here's an idea:
I'm picturing a simple twist bit drill bit.
Take a ball bearing with inner diameter larger than the drill bit.
Place wire brushes on the inside that fits around the shank of the
drill bit and into the flutes. The brushes have to be soft/flexible
enough not to dull the bit, but firm enough to clean out the flutes.
The collar sits on the drill bit above the work piece. The inside of
the bearing is "attached" to the drill bit by the friction and
pressure of the brushes, and the outside of the bearing is attached to
an arm that holds it above the workpiece.
When the drill bit spins up, the inner collar spins with it, since it
is not fixed to anything other than the drill bit. The brushes are
stationary with respect to the spinning drill bit (spinning at the
same speed). When the drill moves down into the work piece and up out
of it, the brushes follow the flutes and clean out the gunk.
Let me know how this works,
--- Chip
Joe AutoDrill <[email protected]> wrote:
: "Chip Buchholtz" <[email protected]>
: > When the drill bit spins up, the inner collar spins with it, since it
: > is not fixed to anything other than the drill bit. The brushes are
: > stationary with respect to the spinning drill bit (spinning at the
: > same speed). When the drill moves down into the work piece and up out
: > of it, the brushes follow the flutes and clean out the gunk.
: You make it and I'll try to sell it to my customer... Seriously.
Sorry, sounds too much like work. Besides, my father's the automated
production machinery designer. I'm the computer guy.
If you're having trouble visualizing it I'll send you a drawing.
--- Chip
Joe AutoDrill wrote:
> "willshak" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> on 5/19/2008 2:29 PM Joe AutoDrill said the following:
>>> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes
>>> of the drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause
>>> problems, but could...
>>>
>>> They want to physically remove the material between strokes
>>> without
>>> stopping the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very
>>> high pressure air blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a
>>> physical method that runs down the flutes, etc.
>>>
>>> Any such tool exist?
>>>
>>
>> In a manufacturing process that uses drills, they use a water based
>> lubricant that is constantly applied to the drill.
>
> Imagine you are drilling over a well finished piece of MDF and for
> some reason, the MF you drill sticks in the flutes and causes
> problems... I need to clear the offending "stuck stuff" without
> contaminating the part below. Coolant is good for some plastics,
> almost all metals and a variety of other materials, but this
> customer
> has a substance that is both absorbant and "stainable" and not
> powerdery like some woods... Tough problem if the air blast doesn't
> work... I thought maybe there was something similar to the cogsdill
> that expanded on retraction to force the removal of debris, etc.
> Expensive to design, but possibly sellable to this customer.
>
> BTW if it matters, the customer will pay $10k+ for my machines and
> drill every 4-5 seconds so this is not a hobby-like application.
You haven't said the depth or diameter or whether it's a through
hole--if it's six inches across and a sixteenth of an inch deep the
available options are different from if it's a sixteenth of an inch in
diameter and six inches deep.
Have you determined the process that is resulting in the sticking
(like is something melting and solidifying or is there a permanently
tacky layer within the workpiece or is it all just naturally
sticky--what works for one problem won't necessarily work for
another).
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote:
>I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
>drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
>They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
>the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
>blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
>the flutes, etc.
>
>Any such tool exist?
>
>Regards,
>Joe Agro, Jr.
>(800) 871-5022
>01.908.542.0244
>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
>V8013-R
>
>
>
>
A fixed disk that spins with the drill, and has interior "fingers"
into the flutes. Disk would be constrained from vertical movement by
fixed plates above and below the disk (with bearings either on these
fixed plates or in the disk, so that the disk can be constrained from
vertical movement but still be allowed to spin freely with the drill).
on the return stroke after drilling, the drill would retract as far as
it can leaving the disk just engaged, and the disk will sweep out the
debris.
I'll call to give you address to send the royalty payments. ;-)
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
On Mon, 19 May 2008 18:39:37 -0400, Gerald Ross <[email protected]> wrote:
>Joe AutoDrill wrote:
>> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
>> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>>
>> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
>> the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
>> blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
>> the flutes, etc.
>>
>> Any such tool exist?
>>
>
>
>I use a soft wire brush. A rotating wire brush might do the job while
>the drill is rotating.
Good thought, Gerald... Maybe make the brush(s) inside some type of rotating
collar/drill guide, so that the bit passes through it on both the in and out
stroke?
mac
Please remove splinters before emailing
"Chip Buchholtz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Joe AutoDrill <[email protected]> wrote:
> : I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> : drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but
> could...
>
> : They want to physically remove the material between strokes without
> stopping
> : the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure
> air
> : blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs
> down
> : the flutes, etc.
>
> Here's an idea:
>
> I'm picturing a simple twist bit drill bit.
>
> Take a ball bearing with inner diameter larger than the drill bit.
> Place wire brushes on the inside that fits around the shank of the
> drill bit and into the flutes. The brushes have to be soft/flexible
> enough not to dull the bit, but firm enough to clean out the flutes.
> The collar sits on the drill bit above the work piece. The inside of
> the bearing is "attached" to the drill bit by the friction and
> pressure of the brushes, and the outside of the bearing is attached to
> an arm that holds it above the workpiece.
>
> When the drill bit spins up, the inner collar spins with it, since it
> is not fixed to anything other than the drill bit. The brushes are
> stationary with respect to the spinning drill bit (spinning at the
> same speed). When the drill moves down into the work piece and up out
> of it, the brushes follow the flutes and clean out the gunk.
>
> Let me know how this works,
>
> --- Chip
Chip,
You make it and I'll try to sell it to my customer... Seriously.
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
Joe AutoDrill wrote:
> I have a customer working in a material that sticks in the flutes of the
> drill between strokes and doesn't necessarily cause problems, but could...
>
> They want to physically remove the material between strokes without stopping
> the rotation of the tooling. I told them to try a very high pressure air
> blast nozzle on the tooling but they want a physical method that runs down
> the flutes, etc.
>
> Any such tool exist?
>
I use a soft wire brush. A rotating wire brush might do the job while
the drill is rotating.
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA
Profanity is the one language all
programmers know best.