Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 pounds.
2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
Ivan Vegvary
On 4/4/2017 6:15 PM, Puckdropper wrote:
> Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>
>> To confirm this, unplug the saw, expose as much of the blade as
>> possible and then mark the front most tooth with a Sharpie. Then
>> measure the front most tooth, to the edge of the saw shoe. Rotate the
>> blade so that the marked tooth is at the back of the saw and make the
>> same measurement. If the measurements are not "precisely" the same
>> you have found your problem. The blade absolutely has to be parallel
>> to to the fence reference.
>>
>
> It might not hurt to do this with a second tooth, say 90 degrees away
> from the first. If your blade is flat and your arbor is running true,
> you'll get the same readings.
>
> I think Leon's on the right track with the blade not being parallel to
> the fence, but in the back of my mind is the possibility of a bent blade.
>
> Puckdropper
>
I think because he is getting the exact opposite effect when using the
opposite side of the saw it pretty much insures that the blade alignment
to the shoe is the issue.
BUT NOW, it could be a number of issues if he forced a narrow kerf blade
into submission. The blade is probably warped now, too.
On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 6:20:06 PM UTC-4, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the =
last 5 years.
> Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as th=
e fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot al=
uminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>=20
> 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 in=
ches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes huma=
nly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 p=
ounds.
>=20
> 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) i=
t is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approxim=
ately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>=20
> What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw fo=
r thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by =
eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>=20
> All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>=20
> Ivan Vegvary
Sounds like the edge of the saw base is not parallel to the blade, pulling =
tight one direction, and wandering away in the other. Not sure whether ther=
e is adjustment built in, or if you need to either fab a suitable wedge, or=
otherwise grind/trim the sides to be parallel. I have no experience with y=
our issue (or a Makita saw), so these are no more than pure guesses/suggest=
ions...
Good luck
On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 3:20:06 PM UTC-7, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the =
last 5 years.
> Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as th=
e fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot al=
uminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>=20
> 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 in=
ches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes huma=
nly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 p=
ounds.
>=20
> 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) i=
t is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approxim=
ately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>=20
> What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw fo=
r thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by =
eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>=20
> All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>=20
> Ivan Vegvary
Thank you everybody.
Did check for blade parallel to shoe. Exactly 3-3/8" on both ends of the b=
lade using same tooth. Checked the blade on my granite surface plate. Abso=
lutely flat. Blade is extremely thin and ve.....eerey old. Will buy a new=
6-1/2" blade tomorrow with a wider kerf. Hopefully that will solve the p=
roblem. Otherwise I will go to my ancient Skill Worm Drive saw. It's amaz=
ing how much heavier everything gets after 25-30 years of ownership! It wei=
ghs a ton. No way would I ever try and cut with it while 'out of position'=
. Can't handle it at my age (74).
Thank you again, Ivan Vegvary, Oregon
On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 8:52:09 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Ivan Vegvary <[email protected]> writes:
> >Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
> >Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
> >
>
> I would guess that the blade is not parallel to edge of the
> baseplate.
Some suggestions here:
http://lumberjocks.com/topics/7671
You have plenty of good advice, and all of it I certainly agree with. So t=
hese are just a couple of more thoughts.
I use straight edges to break down material and the circular saw/straight e=
dge combo was the preferred job site method from the time I started. Still =
it isn't perfect. =20
I found on my older saws that they lined up parallel as needed, but once sw=
itched on they fell out of alignment. This happened on my saws that had sl=
eeve bearings at the arbor blade side, not roller bearings. Of course, whe=
n the roller bearings wore, they would do the same thing. So measuring the=
saw revealed nothing, but using it did.
Out of balance saw blades that appeared true and flat, but when whirling at=
5K+ r.p.m.s, it made it difference.
Last, and the hardest for me to find the first couple of times was the shoe=
of the saw wasn't clean. It would pick up a bit of adhesive, some wood re=
sin, or even a small gouge in the sole plate and that would turn the saw. =
Now I check the sole plate and the blade guard point that rides on the wood=
and clean or polish them up with 220gr sand paper as needed before cutting=
along a straight edge.
Robert
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> To confirm this, unplug the saw, expose as much of the blade as
> possible and then mark the front most tooth with a Sharpie. Then
> measure the front most tooth, to the edge of the saw shoe. Rotate the
> blade so that the marked tooth is at the back of the saw and make the
> same measurement. If the measurements are not "precisely" the same
> you have found your problem. The blade absolutely has to be parallel
> to to the fence reference.
>
It might not hurt to do this with a second tooth, say 90 degrees away
from the first. If your blade is flat and your arbor is running true,
you'll get the same readings.
I think Leon's on the right track with the blade not being parallel to
the fence, but in the back of my mind is the possibility of a bent blade.
Puckdropper
--
http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking
A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst!
Ivan Vegvary <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> Thank you everybody.
> Did check for blade parallel to shoe. Exactly 3-3/8" on both ends of
> the blade using same tooth. Checked the blade on my granite surface
> plate. Absolutely flat. Blade is extremely thin and ve.....eerey old.
> Will buy a new 6-1/2" blade tomorrow with a wider kerf. Hopefully
> that will solve the problem. Otherwise I will go to my ancient Skill
> Worm Drive saw. It's amazing how much heavier everything gets after
> 25-30 years of ownership! It weighs a ton. No way would I ever try
> and cut with it while 'out of position'. Can't handle it at my age
> (74). Thank you again, Ivan Vegvary, Oregon
Sounds like the saw is ok, did you check the fence? It might be worth a
test cut with a 2x4 fence to make sure the fence isn't flexing on you.
Puckdropper
--
http://www.puckdroppersplace.us/rec.woodworking
A mini archive of some of rec.woodworking's best and worst!
On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 6:20:06 PM UTC-4, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
> Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>
> 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 pounds.
>
> 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>
> What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>
> All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>
> Ivan Vegvary
Have you checked for parallel between the blade and the edge of the base?
It sure sounds like they are not parallel. If they are not, the blade will
win every time.
On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 15:20:02 -0700 (PDT), Ivan Vegvary
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
>Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>
>1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 pounds.
>
>2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>
>What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>
>All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>
>Ivan Vegvary
Ivan, I agree with Leon in that the problem is your saw. Make sure the
saw blade is attached properly, take it off and put it back on, with
everything cleaned. Then make sure it does not wobble when you
physically manhandle the blade. (like for worn bearings. Up/down,
sideways.
Then check to see if your blade is parallel to the foot of your saw.
Measure each end to the opening parallels to it. Sometimes you can
loosed and realign the foot. Then check to see if the blades is
parallel to the outside edges of your saw.
Hope this helps.
On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 11:18:31 PM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 4, 2017 at 6:20:06 PM UTC-4, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
> > Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
> > Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
> >
> > 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 pounds.
> >
> > 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
> >
> > What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
> >
> > All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
> >
> > Ivan Vegvary
>
> Have you checked for parallel between the blade and the edge of the base?
>
> It sure sounds like they are not parallel. If they are not, the blade will
> win every time.
Whoops, sorry, late to the game. For some reason I didn't see all
the other posts. Strange.
On 4/5/2017 4:50 PM, Doug Miller wrote:
> Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> On 4/4/2017 5:20 PM, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
>>> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with
>>> it for the last 5 years. Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing
>>> guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16
>>> inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium
>>> (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>>>
> [...]
>>>
>> Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would
>> say it is toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
>
> I don't think so. I think the teeth on one side of the blade are dull, probably from hitting some
> foreign object.
>
Think about that. How often do you hit a foreign object that does not
hit both sides of the blade... It is possible but less likely than the
whole blade hitting that object.
Either way the blade apparently was worn out. LOL
BUT what you said would certainly cause the blade to track off center.
Ivan Vegvary <[email protected]> writes:
>Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
>Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>
I would guess that the blade is not parallel to edge of the
baseplate.
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> On 4/4/2017 5:20 PM, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
>> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with
>> it for the last 5 years. Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing
>> guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16
>> inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium
>> (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>>
[...]
>>
> Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would
> say it is toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
I don't think so. I think the teeth on one side of the blade are dull, probably from hitting some
foreign object.
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> On 4/5/2017 4:50 PM, Doug Miller wrote:
>> Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
>> news:[email protected]:
>>
>>> On 4/4/2017 5:20 PM, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
>>>> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with
>>>> it for the last 5 years. Trying to make a long (8 foot)
>>>> sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to
>>>> 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot
>>>> aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>>>>
>> [...]
>>>>
>>> Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would
>>> say it is toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
>>
>> I don't think so. I think the teeth on one side of the blade
>> are dull, probably from hitting some foreign object.
>>
>
> Think about that. How often do you hit a foreign object that
> does not hit both sides of the blade... It is possible but less
> likely than the whole blade hitting that object.
Depends on what you're using the saw for. Roughing cabinet plywood
to size almost never involves hitting foreign objects of any sort.
In home remodeling, though, it's pretty easy to almost miss a nail
head, and dull only one side of the blade. In my experience, in
that type of work, it's much more common to hit a nail with only
one side of the blade than full-on.
>
> Either way the blade apparently was worn out. LOL
>
> BUT what you said would certainly cause the blade to track off
> center.
>
On 05 Apr 2017 04:42:38 GMT, Puckdropper
<puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>Ivan Vegvary <[email protected]> wrote in
>news:[email protected]:
>
>> Thank you everybody.
>> Did check for blade parallel to shoe. Exactly 3-3/8" on both ends of
>> the blade using same tooth. Checked the blade on my granite surface
>> plate. Absolutely flat. Blade is extremely thin and ve.....eerey old.
>> Will buy a new 6-1/2" blade tomorrow with a wider kerf. Hopefully
>> that will solve the problem. Otherwise I will go to my ancient Skill
>> Worm Drive saw. It's amazing how much heavier everything gets after
>> 25-30 years of ownership! It weighs a ton. No way would I ever try
>> and cut with it while 'out of position'. Can't handle it at my age
>> (74). Thank you again, Ivan Vegvary, Oregon
>
>Sounds like the saw is ok, did you check the fence? It might be worth a
>test cut with a 2x4 fence to make sure the fence isn't flexing on you.
Before I had a track saw I made a "fence" by fastening a ~3" strip of
MDF down to a ~12 strip. the 3" piece as the fence to cut the 12" in
the right spot. The whole thing is pretty rigid - not much flex. I
still use it if I can't clamp the track down like a floor).
On 4/4/2017 5:50 PM, Leon wrote:
> On 4/4/2017 5:20 PM, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
>> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for
>> the last 5 years.
>> Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as
>> the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7
>> foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>>
>> 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4
>> inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it
>> becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I
>> can push 80-100 pounds.
>>
>> 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the
>> fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A
>> gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>>
>> What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw
>> for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a
>> line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>>
>> All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>>
>> Ivan Vegvary
>>
>
>
> Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would say it is
> toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
>
> I am not sure if this can be adjusted with that saw.
>
> To make this work you need to set the saw on a small sled to index
> against you fence instead of the saw shoe/base. You will also need to
> be able to adjust the minute angle that the saw sets/attaches to the sled.
>
>
To confirm this, unplug the saw, expose as much of the blade as
possible and then mark the front most tooth with a Sharpie. Then
measure the front most tooth, to the edge of the saw shoe. Rotate the
blade so that the marked tooth is at the back of the saw and make the
same measurement. If the measurements are not "precisely" the same you
have found your problem. The blade absolutely has to be parallel to to
the fence reference.
On 4/6/2017 6:38 PM, Doug Miller wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't think so. I think the teeth on one side of the blade
>>> are dull, probably from hitting some foreign object.
>>>
>>
>> Think about that. How often do you hit a foreign object that
>> does not hit both sides of the blade... It is possible but less
>> likely than the whole blade hitting that object.
>
> Depends on what you're using the saw for. Roughing cabinet plywood
> to size almost never involves hitting foreign objects of any sort.
> In home remodeling, though, it's pretty easy to almost miss a nail
> head, and dull only one side of the blade. In my experience, in
> that type of work, it's much more common to hit a nail with only
> one side of the blade than full-on.
Not trying to drag this to prove who is right... ;~)
When remodeling, removing a wall or cabinets I always used a bimetal
recip saw. The blades are made to cut through nails cause you are going
to cut through nails. ;~)
BUT my above thoughts were me remembering cutting through finish nails
on my TS looong ago.. I do not recall the reason but it happened. I
tried not to do it and fortunately there was no issue.
And having said that I was always using carbide toothed blades.
>>
>> Either way the blade apparently was worn out. LOL
>>
>> BUT what you said would certainly cause the blade to track off
>> center.
>>
>
"Doug Miller" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote in
> Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would
> say it is toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
>I don't think so. I think the teeth on one side of the blade are dull,
>probably from hitting some
>foreign object.
This is a plausible explanation... I'd also add that I've used circular saws
that had a lot of end-play in the shaft such that the blade moved away from
the motor as I ran the wide side of the shoe down a straight edge. One of
those saws (Sears or Black and Decker??) led me to buy my first Porter Cable
tool...
On 4/4/2017 5:20 PM, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for the last 5 years.
> Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using a 1"x 1/4" slat as the fence, secured to 7/16 inch thick plywood. Slat aligned with a 7 foot aluminium (extremely straight) extrusion. Two problems.
>
> 1. When I try to pass the saw along the fence with the blade about 3-4 inches from the fence, I can only saw about 7-8 inches before it becomes humanly impossible to push the saw forward. I'm a big guy, I can push 80-100 pounds.
>
> 2. When I pass along with the saw flipped (blade 1-1/2" from the fence) it is impossible to keep the saw plate against the fence. A gap of approximately 1/8" develops no matter how hard I try.
>
> What am I doing wrong? Has anybody run into this. I've used this saw for thousands of cuts, but always cross-cuts, or, simply following a line by eyeball. This is the first time I've cut along side a fence.
>
> All suggestions appreciated. Thank you
>
> Ivan Vegvary
>
Your blade is not parallel to to the saw shoe rdges. I would say it is
toed in toward the wider section of the shoe.
I am not sure if this can be adjusted with that saw.
To make this work you need to set the saw on a small sled to index
against you fence instead of the saw shoe/base. You will also need to
be able to adjust the minute angle that the saw sets/attaches to the sled.
On Tue, 4 Apr 2017 15:20:02 -0700 (PDT)
Ivan Vegvary <[email protected]> wrote:
> Using a Makita battery operated circular saw. Very happy with it for
> the last 5 years. Trying to make a long (8 foot) sawing guide. Using
what is the blade diameter
may be that it wanders and is not stiff enough
maybe you should plunk down 1000 bucks for an uncle festool
have seen some nice and somewhat affordable track saws for around 100
or 120 or thereabouts
On 4/5/2017 2:37 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> You have plenty of good advice, and all of it I certainly agree with.
> So these are just a couple of more thoughts.
>
> I use straight edges to break down material and the circular
> saw/straight edge combo was the preferred job site method from the
> time I started. Still it isn't perfect.
>
> I found on my older saws that they lined up parallel as needed, but
> once switched on they fell out of alignment. This happened on my
> saws that had sleeve bearings at the arbor blade side, not roller
> bearings. Of course, when the roller bearings wore, they would do
> the same thing. So measuring the saw revealed nothing, but using it
> did.
>
> Out of balance saw blades that appeared true and flat, but when
> whirling at 5K+ r.p.m.s, it made it difference.
>
> Last, and the hardest for me to find the first couple of times was
> the shoe of the saw wasn't clean. It would pick up a bit of
> adhesive, some wood resin, or even a small gouge in the sole plate
> and that would turn the saw. Now I check the sole plate and the
> blade guard point that rides on the wood and clean or polish them up
> with 220gr sand paper as needed before cutting along a straight
> edge.
>
> Robert
>
One other thing I have witnessed many years ago. A thin kerf blade on a
saw like this can warp from heat. I have seen one warp and stay warped
until it cooled, as it cooled it suddenly popped back flat. I just
happened to be looking at the blade when it did that.
Oddly while it was still relatively hot I could easily wiggle it from
warped to flat and it would stay which ever way I left it.
Once it cooled it popped back to and stayed flat.