I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he advises
not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He advises to use
rubber coated gloves. While I partially subscribe to not using push stick
and or pads when using the jointer to straighten the "edge" of a wide board,
the photographs show him wearing rubber coated cloves while surfacing the
face of a board on the jointer. He claims it gives him more feel for
knowing when the knives are hitting high spots. Personally I use my ears
and push pads.
What feel is he going to have after the board he is surfacing, shatters?
http://blogs.popularwoodworking.com/editorsblog/PermaLink%2Cguid%2C21d7d1a5-0cc8-491f-a0d6-8b3903ef9479.aspx
IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what safety
measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
push pad.
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:55:28 -0500, "EXT"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Having destroyed a number of pushsticks on a table saw, I find it cheap
>insurance to make or buy more if they save my fingers. I always try to keep
>fingers away from sharp edges, particularly powered sharp edges. I still
>have all 10 after over 30 years as a woodworker.
Pushsticks are disposable, make them by the dozens because they will
come into contact with the spinning blade. That's what they're there
for, to get closer to the blade than any rational person would ever
allow their fingers to be.
Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
On Jan 17, 11:33 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews:[email protected]...
>
> > I don't own a jointer, and I've never used one.
>
> > But this has me curious. Pulling stock through makes sense after a point.
> > But you have to get to that point where there is some stock on the outfeed
> > table.
>
> > I would assume that with a piece that's 4' long, you'd push from a safe
> > distance until you have enough wood on the outfeed to be able to shift
> > your grip and pull from there.
>
> > Would that be a correct and safe way to do it?
>
> Yes
No. Your hands may be in front of the blade, but you're still pushing.
Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:28:52 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation that
>> makes me shudder just thinking about it.
>
> It's very hard to screw up on a bandsaw in a way that will take your
> fingers off. I guess Maloof can afford to crimp a blade now and then.
True, if all you have is a toy bandsaw. You don't know your stump from
a hole in the ground, dingle-berry.
On Jan 17, 1:06=A0pm, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> Leon wrote:
>
> > BUT that is if every thing goes well. =A0If every thing goes well no
> > precautions would need to be observed. =A0What happens if the board you =
are
> > running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
>
> My hands would move away from the blades.
>
>
>
> > The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>
> > You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
> > jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
>
> I think his pictures are dangerous. =A0My hands are on the outfeed side,
> moving away from the cutter. =A0I don't know how many more times I should
> type that my hands are moving away from the cutter, and are not over the
> blades.
>
> Basic safety =3D the natural momentum of the motion takes the flesh
> towards safety, not danger.
I am in agreement with regard to face planing on the jointer. I don't
want my hands anywhere near those cutters, so push pads are the
answer. I do wear mechanic's gloves that have rubber gripping
surfaces, but I only use gloved hands for edge jointing, not face
planing. It is amazing to me how often publications illustrate unsafe
shortcuts. The worst examples I see are on the DYI shows on
television. On occasion they actually wear safety glasses, but I
seldom see them wearing hearing protection. I saw a show recently
where they are building a log home. The "Star" was helping screen in
the porch. He was ripping a board on a contractor saw without the blad
guard when the host approached. He looked up and was talking while
ripping. I could see the board rise up and start to kick back. He just
caught it in time.
Regards,
Dave G.
Jeff wrote:
> For flat parallel sides, I go from rough cut to planer, to jointer
> (edge) to table saw (opposite edge). Feel free to expound the virtues
> of face jointing. I've never had a need.
If the board starts out twisted or bowed, the planer will make a smooth
board of even thickness--but it will still be twisted or bowed.
Chris
Thu, Jan 17, 2008, 3:12pm (EST+5) [email protected] (Leon)
doth sayeth:
I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he
advises not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. <snip>
Well, you know,if stupid was a crime, half the population would be
in jain. Just a shame he's trying to convert people to being stupid
too. I'm with you, on edge no push stick (unless it's very narrow), and
push sticks and/or push pad otherwise.
JOAT
10 Out Of 10 Terrorists Prefer Hillary For President
- Bumper Sticker
I don't have a problem with a woman president - just not Hillary.
I stand convicted. I got used to doing just that exact manuever for
that exact reason after I started using rubber faced gloves. I really
like using them on the table saw too. I must admit my balls do crawl
up inside a bit at the jointer whenever I do it. I have had others in
the shop comment and I just shrugged it off.
Now that I think about it, one of my main saftey teaching statements
is to say"Always think about what would happen if the board suddenly
vanished. Where are your hands? What would happen?" This keeps me from
pushing behind the TS or bandsaw blade, that's where I've seen the
most problems. But this thread just convinced me... I'm an idiot.
Never again.
ThanKs all.
On Jan 17, 7:12=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he advise=
s
> not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. =A0He advises to use
> rubber coated gloves. =A0While I partially subscribe to not using push sti=
ck
> and or pads when using the jointer to straighten the "edge" of a wide boar=
d,
> the photographs show him wearing rubber coated cloves while surfacing the
> face of a board on the jointer. =A0He claims it gives him more feel for
> knowing when the knives are hitting high spots. =A0Personally I use my ear=
s
> and push pads.
> What feel is he going to have after the board he is surfacing, shatters?
>
> http://blogs.popularwoodworking.com/editorsblog/PermaLink%2Cguid%2C21...
>
> IMHO =A0this is just plain stupid. =A0I do not care who you are and what s=
afety
> measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or=
> will have an accident. =A0While he does warn of certain dangerous practice=
s
> while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
> push pad.
"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>>
>
> If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
> capacity to make thickness planers...
>
>
>
Care to support that comment, keeping in mind 1 face of the board should be
flattened before the other is introduced to the thickness planer?
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:12:08 GMT, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he advises
>not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He advises to use
>rubber coated gloves. While I partially subscribe to not using push stick
>and or pads when using the jointer to straighten the "edge" of a wide board,
>the photographs show him wearing rubber coated cloves while surfacing the
>face of a board on the jointer. He claims it gives him more feel for
>knowing when the knives are hitting high spots. Personally I use my ears
>and push pads.
>What feel is he going to have after the board he is surfacing, shatters?
>
>http://blogs.popularwoodworking.com/editorsblog/PermaLink%2Cguid%2C21d7d1a5-0cc8-491f-a0d6-8b3903ef9479.aspx
>
>IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what safety
>measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
>will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
>while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
>push pad.
>
>
Face jointing without push pads? Why that's just plain dumb. And
why does one need to know when the knives are hitting the high spots?
You run it through, turn it over and if it hasn't cleaned up you go
again. You're trying to create a flat plane, not find high spots.
Frank
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 22:35:08 -0600, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Care to support that comment, keeping in mind 1 face of the board should be
>flattened before the other is introduced to the thickness planer?
Just throw 'em straight into the thicknesser. Anythign too warped to
come out was too warped to be much use anyway 8-)
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 00:21:56 GMT, "Bonehenge (B A R R Y)"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Would know that even if you don't agree with everything he says, the
>man has lots to offer.
So leave him in the workshop, but don't let him write for a mass
audience.
Printing that sort of advice in a magazine is going to cause other
people, of less "skill" than this guy, to lose fingers.
Having destroyed a number of pushsticks on a table saw, I find it cheap
insurance to make or buy more if they save my fingers. I always try to keep
fingers away from sharp edges, particularly powered sharp edges. I still
have all 10 after over 30 years as a woodworker.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Leon wrote:
>>>
>>> IMHO this is just plain stupid.
>>
>> Maybe.
>>
>> I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is exerted
>> on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
>>
>> Most of the time, I use push blocks. The times I don't are when the
>> stock is thick and heavy.
>>
>> With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my
>> hands are on the outfeed side of the machine. I'm PULLING the work
>> across the cutterhead. If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
>>
>> A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is
>> always referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't
>> unintentionally rock the board as it moves.
>
>
> BUT that is if every thing goes well. If every thing goes well no
> precautions would need to be observed. What happens if the board you are
> running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
>
> The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>
> You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
> jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
>
On Jan 17, 10:07 am, [email protected] (J T) wrote:
> Thu, Jan 17, 2008, 3:12pm (EST+5) [email protected] (Leon)
> doth sayeth:
> I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he
> advises not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. <snip>
>
> Well, you know,if stupid was a crime, half the population would be
> in jain. Just a shame he's trying to convert people to being stupid
> too. I'm with you, on edge no push stick (unless it's very narrow), and
> push sticks and/or push pad otherwise.
A few weekends ago the TV was on DIY network or something like that
while I was eating lunch. I watched some "carpenter" cross cutting
using the rip fence as a guide. They even showed the cut piece get
thrown about 30 feet.
Way to educate!
Leon said:
>I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he advises
>not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He advises to use
>....
>IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what safety
>measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
>will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
>while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
>push pad.
Wow. I concur. Not that it matters... Convenience is hardly a
consideration in lieu of the possible loss of digits/flesh.
Greg G.
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
<[email protected]> wrote:
What an oddly descriptive addy.
Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
$100 says he speaks fluent 1337...or webtv.
>Registrant Contact:
>
> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
> +1.xxxxxxxxxx
> Fax: na
> 287 Some St.
> na
> Somewhere, CA
> US
>
>Administrative Contact:
>
>Technical Contact:
>
>Name Servers:
> ns1.hosterx0x.com
> ns2.hosterx0x.com
>
>Creation date: 17 Apr 2004 00:40:56
>Expiration date: 17 Apr 2008 00:40:56
--
LRod
Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite
Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999
http://www.woodbutcher.net
http://www.normstools.com
Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997
email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.
Jointing well, both edge and face, is a learned art. The machine looks
so bulky and basic but the slightest differences in technique make a
huge difference. You want to get some down pressure on the outfeed
side shortly after the material passess onto that side. For face joint
outfeed is the reference surface that controls the plane of the cut if
things are working correctly. In edge jointing, it and the fence are
equally important.
Everyone develops their own technique and the length and heft of the
material makes a difference too.
Yes, pulling can kind of be effective but the real key is consistency
in pressure and speed across the entire span of the cut.
If you switch from a push to a pull at the cost of loosing consistency
you will be able to find the wave (or worse) in the face surface.
The strangest thing for me is if you push too hard down into the table
you will taper the board, even on a perfectly configured machine. A
smooth fine touch is really needed for excellent jointing. Sharp
blades, a feel for the cut and a few hundred cuts under your belt to
find your chi.
On Jan 17, 6:19=A0pm, Tanus <[email protected]> wrote:
> Leon wrote:
> > "B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> >> Leon wrote:
> >>> IMHO =A0this is just plain stupid.
> >> Maybe.
>
> >> I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is exert=
ed
> >> on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
>
> >> Most of the time, I use push blocks. =A0The times I don't are when the =
stock
> >> is thick and heavy.
>
> >> With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my ha=
nds
> >> are on the outfeed side of the machine. =A0I'm PULLING the work across =
the
> >> cutterhead. =A0If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
>
> >> A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is alw=
ays
> >> referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't unintentiona=
lly
> >> rock the board as it moves.
>
> > BUT that is if every thing goes well. =A0If every thing goes well no
> > precautions would need to be observed. =A0What happens if the board you =
are
> > running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
>
> > The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>
> > You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
> > jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
>
> I don't own a jointer, and I've never
> used one.
>
> But this has me curious. Pulling stock
> through makes sense after a point. But
> you have to get to that point where
> there is some stock on the outfeed table.
>
> I would assume that with a piece that's
> 4' long, you'd push from a safe distance
> until you have enough wood on the
> outfeed to be able to shift your grip
> and pull from there.
>
> Would that be a correct and safe way to
> do it?
>
> --
> Tanus
>
> This is not really a sig.
>
> http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 21:39:15 -0600, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Agreed, every one does something wrong. ;~)
>
It happens!
Personally, I'd be afraid to post what he did. It works for him, but
he is completely aware and comfortable with the physics of the
operation.
Unfortunately, I just know somebody will get a glove stuck, and his
personal injury lawyer will be contacting Mr. Huey and the magazine.
"Greg G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Swingman said:
>
>>"Leon" wrote
>>
>>> IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what
>>safety
>>> measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can
>>> or
>>> will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous
>>> practices
>>> while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
>>> push pad.
>>
>>One of my supplier's reps has the first joints of three fingers on one
>>hand
>>basically nonexistent from just such an accident on a jointer (aptly named
>>in this unfortunate instance).
>>
>>The "thickness" of the work piece, regardless of how thick when 'face
>>jointing', is something I personally NEVER rely upon to protect me from
>>the
>>jointer blades. That specific task on the jointer is one of the reason why
>>I
>>own two, count'em - 2, Grrrippers ... and use them.
>>
>>PW, although having some good stuff between its pages, is just another
>>example of not believing/taking at face value what you read, see, or hear
>>in
>>this, the age of the idiocracy.
>
> IIRC, Sam Maloof had a similar accident with a jointer that resulted
> in the loss of several fingertips to the joint. Although watching him
> work, would have guessed the accident occurred at the bandsaw.
>
>
> Greg G.
Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation that makes me
shudder just thinking about it. I guess it comes down to what's comfortable
for one, may/will not be comfortable for all.
Jc
LRod took a can of maroon spray paint on January 19, 2008 02:15 pm and wrote
the following:
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> What an oddly descriptive addy.
>
> Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
> easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
> he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
> sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
>
> $100 says he speaks fluent 1337...or webtv.
>
Hey now, you'll upset JOAT.
;-)
--
Lits Slut #9
Life would be so much easier if we could just look at the source code.
Leon <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:05646105-2f96-4e2e-8310-5f00216496a4@s13g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>> On Jan 17, 11:33 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> "Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in
>>> messagenews:[email protected]...
>>>> I don't own a jointer, and I've never used one.
>>>
>>>> But this has me curious. Pulling stock through makes sense after a
>>>> point.
>>>> But you have to get to that point where there is some stock on the
>>>> outfeed
>>>> table.
>>>
>>>> I would assume that with a piece that's 4' long, you'd push from a
>>>> safe distance until you have enough wood on the outfeed to be able
>>>> to shift your grip and pull from there.
>>>
>>>> Would that be a correct and safe way to do it?
>>>
>>> Yes
>>
>> No. Your hands may be in front of the blade, but you're still
>> pushing.
>
> Right again Charlie. It would be safer but would be an incorrect
> method. You would indeed need to push from either location.
Wrong again Leon. You either misunderstand or are simply a contrary "me
too" type of dummy.
WARN Nameservers on separate class C's WARNING: All of your
nameservers (listed at the parent nameservers) are in the same Class C
(technically, /24) address space, which means that they are probably at
the same physical location. Your nameservers should be at geographically
dispersed locations. You should not have all of your nameservers at the
same location. RFC2182 3.1 goes into more detail about secondary
nameserver location.
PASS All NS IPs public OK. All of your NS records appear to use
public IPs. If there were any private IPs, they would not be reachable,
causing DNS delays.
WARN TCP Allowed WARNING: One or more of your DNS servers does not
accept TCP connections. Although rarely used, TCP connections are
occasionally used instead of UDP connections. When firewalls block the
TCP DNS connections, it can cause hard-to-diagnose problems. The problem
servers are:
64.14.72.90: Error [Connection refused (10061)]. 64.14.72.91:
Error [Connection refused (10061)].
WARN Acceptance of abuse address WARNING: One or more of your
mailservers does not accept mail to [email protected].
Mailservers are expected by RFC2142 to accept mail to abuse.
mail.jadedragononline.com's abuse response:<br /> >>> RCPT
TO:<[email protected]><br /> <<< 511 sorry, no mailbox here by
that name (#5.1.1 - chkuser) <br />
WARN SPF record Your domain does not have an SPF record. This
means that spammers can easily send out E-mail that looks like it came
from your domain, which can make your domain look bad (if the recipient
thinks you really sent it), and can cost you money (when people complain
to you, rather than the spammer). You may want to add an SPF record
ASAP, as 01 Oct 2004 was the target date for domains to have SPF records
in place (Hotmail, for example, started checking SPF records on 01 Oct
2004).
Using 0 day old cached answer (or, you can get fresh results).
Displaying E-mail address (use sparingly -- this will make it more
likely that you will trigger our rate limiting system).
=-=-=-=
Visit AboutUs.org for more information about JadeDragonOnline.com
<a href="http://www.aboutus.org/JadeDragonOnline.com">AboutUs:
JadeDragonOnline.com</a>
Registration Service Provided By: ICDSoft.com
Contact: [email protected]
Visit: http://www.ICDSoft.com
Domain name: JadeDragonOnline.com
Registrant Contact:
Brian Henderson ([email protected])
+1.9093072010
Fax: na
287 Alabama St.
na
Redlands, CA
US
Administrative Contact:
Brian Henderson ([email protected])
+1.9093072010
Fax: na
287 Alabama St.
na
Redlands, CA
US
Technical Contact:
Brian Henderson ([email protected])
+1.9093072010
Fax: na
287 Alabama St.
na
Redlands, CA
US
Status: Locked
Name Servers:
ns1.hoster909.com
ns2.hoster909.com
Creation date: 17 Apr 2004 00:40:56
Expiration date: 17 Apr 2008 00:40:56
64.14.72.90 PTR record: hoster909.com. [TTL 86400s] [A=64.14.72.90]
To see the reverse DNS traversal, to make sure that all DNS servers are
reporting the correct results, you can Click Here.
"Jeff" wrote in message
> On Jan 18, 8:17 am, "Swingman" wrote:
> > "Jeff" wrote
> >
> > > If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
> > > capacity to make thickness planers...
> >
> > ... strictly for the benefit of those unsure of the difference between
the
> > machines/operations. :)
> >
> > Two machines/operations with very different purposes: one used to
flatten an
> > edge or face (jointer); the other to mill opposite surfaces parallel
> > (planer).
> >
> > A jointer won't necessarily mill opposite faces/edges parallel; and a
planer
> > won't necessarily mill stock flat.
> >
> > Both machines, used in conjunction, in a methodical manner, and in the
> > proper order (along with other tools like table saws/hand planes) will
allow
> > a woodworker to mill straight, flat, and dimensioned, project stock from
> > rough lumber.
> >
>
> For flat parallel sides, I go from rough cut to planer, to jointer
> (edge) to table saw (opposite edge). Feel free to expound the virtues
> of face jointing. I've never had a need.
Never mind <sigh> ... just go buy us both lottery tickets while your luck's
still holding.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/14/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)
J. Clarke <[email protected]> wrote:
> Twayne wrote:
>> Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:28:52 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation that
>>>> makes me shudder just thinking about it.
>>>
>>> It's very hard to screw up on a bandsaw in a way that will take
>>> your
>>> fingers off. I guess Maloof can afford to crimp a blade now and
>>> then.
>>
>> True, if all you have is a toy bandsaw. You don't know your stump
>> from a hole in the ground, dingle-berry.
>
> OK, so explain to us how you are likely to hurt yourself freehanding
> on a band saw, other than by running your hand into the blade.
>
> And how do you do scrollwork on a band saw without freehanding? Or
> are you not aware that that is a standard band saw operation that
> would be taught in any training curriculum and is described in just
> about any book you pick up about the band saw?
>
> And if you're going to make fun of people's names, then consider that
> yours easily goes to "twit" and "twat".
>
> --
That's what I figured; ignorance is bliss for you. So far. Too bad.
Also, there is no "us". And you're a dangerous fool.
"Bonehenge (B A R R Y)" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Anyone who has:
>
> A.) Seen Glen's work...
>
> -- or --
>
> B.) Read any of the hundreds of other things he's written, including
> his books...
>
> Would know that even if you don't agree with everything he says, the
> man has lots to offer.
Agreed, every one does something wrong. ;~)
Leon <[email protected]> wrote:
> "B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:r%[email protected]...
>
>>
>> However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
>>
>> <http://www.bburke.com/woodworking/shopmadejigsandtools.html>
>>
>> Some sticks can be dangerous and provide a false sense of security in
>> respect to the hand's direction of travel and application of force.
>>
>> For example: The standard "push stick" has the user providing
>> force at about a 45 degree angle to the stock travel, with the hand
>> moving towards the cutter and a small contact patch all the way out
>> at the tip. If the stock sticks, jams, starts to kick back, etc...
>> the stick goes away, and the hand moves directly at the cutter!
>>
>> I always like to think of leaning on a door. If someone opens the
>> door, I'll fall in. So... I don't lean on doors. <G>
>
> Agreed, however and hoping that the term push stick is a generic
> term, the examples shown by your link are what you should be using.
>
> Those pointey sticks with a notch on the forward end probably cause
> as many accidents as they prevent. You really should use a push
> device that lets you hold down the work also. Typically a pointy
> push stick does nothing to prevent and often because of its lack of
> support will encourage kick back on a TS. Typically Kick back starts
> off as a minor deflection that can be prevented if you simply hold
> the work down and let the blade make its mark. Pointy sticks do
> nothing to prevent the beginning of a kick back to become a total
> kick back.
I've been lucky and never had a kick back while using a push block but
your hand is still moving toward the blade if things get spun out from
under your hand, so caution and allowing the tool to do the work are
always required. One has to watch out for over-confidence.
Said one bloated, bottom feeding idiot:
Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:12:08 GMT, "Leon"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he
>> advises not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He
>> advises to use rubber coated gloves.
>
> So now you know that's a magazine that's not worth reading. Neither
> the writer nor the editor ought to be working there.
More like, we know who's a closed minded fool you mean.
"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:05646105-2f96-4e2e-8310-5f00216496a4@s13g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 17, 11:33 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews:[email protected]...
>>
>> > I don't own a jointer, and I've never used one.
>>
>> > But this has me curious. Pulling stock through makes sense after a
>> > point.
>> > But you have to get to that point where there is some stock on the
>> > outfeed
>> > table.
>>
>> > I would assume that with a piece that's 4' long, you'd push from a safe
>> > distance until you have enough wood on the outfeed to be able to shift
>> > your grip and pull from there.
>>
>> > Would that be a correct and safe way to do it?
>>
>> Yes
>
> No. Your hands may be in front of the blade, but you're still pushing.
Right again Charlie. It would be safer but would be an incorrect method.
You would indeed need to push from either location.
"LRod" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> What an oddly descriptive addy.
>
> Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
> easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
> he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
> sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
>
> $100 says he speaks fluent 1337...or webtv.
and a recent graduate from AOL.
...or maybe he didn't graduate...
--
"Anybody can have more birthdays; but it takes
balls to get old!"
"Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 08:16:56 -0500, "J. Clarke" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>>OK, so explain to us how you are likely to hurt yourself freehanding
>>on a band saw, other than by running your hand into the blade.
>>
>>And how do you do scrollwork on a band saw without freehanding?
>
> What;'s "freehanding" ? Wiggling a line in plywood is one thing, but
> Maloof is doing it in three dimensions. That means you've little support
> under the workpiece, and support you do have is some distance (i.e. a
> lever arm) away from the blade. Have the blade catch, and the work
> slams downwards, bending a crimp into the blade.
>
> I do this, but I can't say I enjoy it. I also lose blades by doing it.
> The trick is to have a _big_ bandsaw, which just never catches.
I *thought* a couple folks misunderstood what i meant by freehanding. You,
of course, nailed it.
jc
Leon wrote:
> >
> BUT that is if every thing goes well. If every thing goes well no
> precautions would need to be observed. What happens if the board you are
> running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
My hands would move away from the blades.
>
> The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>
> You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
> jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
I think his pictures are dangerous. My hands are on the outfeed side,
moving away from the cutter. I don't know how many more times I should
type that my hands are moving away from the cutter, and are not over the
blades.
Basic safety = the natural momentum of the motion takes the flesh
towards safety, not danger.
In article <bbf06e6c-497c-4bca-8f57-233786c81359
@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, [email protected] says...
>
> If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
> capacity to make thickness planers...
Come back when you learn what a jointer is for.
Good link, Barry; thank you.
Good to see some decent reasoning too; good post.
B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> Brian Henderson wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:55:28 -0500, "EXT"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Having destroyed a number of pushsticks on a table saw, I find it
>>> cheap insurance to make or buy more if they save my fingers. I
>>> always try to keep fingers away from sharp edges, particularly
>>> powered sharp edges. I still have all 10 after over 30 years as a
>>> woodworker.
>>
>> Pushsticks are disposable, make them by the dozens because they will
>> come into contact with the spinning blade.
>
> Right on! Make lots! It's also great practice in pattern routing,
> shaping, and curved sawing to a line.
>
> However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
>
> <http://www.bburke.com/woodworking/shopmadejigsandtools.html>
>
> Some sticks can be dangerous and provide a false sense of security in
> respect to the hand's direction of travel and application of force.
>
> For example: The standard "push stick" has the user providing force
> at about a 45 degree angle to the stock travel, with the hand moving
> towards the cutter and a small contact patch all the way out at the
> tip. If the stock sticks, jams, starts to kick back, etc... the
> stick goes away, and the hand moves directly at the cutter!
>
> I always like to think of leaning on a door. If someone opens the
> door, I'll fall in. So... I don't lean on doors. <G>
"Twayne" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:9r3kj.12$pC5.0@trnddc05...
>>> No. Your hands may be in front of the blade, but you're still
>>> pushing.
>>
>> Right again Charlie. It would be safer but would be an incorrect
>> method. You would indeed need to push from either location.
>
> Wrong again Leon. You either misunderstand or are simply a contrary "me
> too" type of dummy.
You said,
I would assume that with a piece that's
4' long, you'd push from a safe distance
until you have enough wood on the
outfeed to be able to shift your grip
and pull from there.
I did not clearly read what you had written. You indicated that you would
push the stock until enough wood was on the out feed surface and then shift
your grip and pull from there.
I replied Yes indicating that this would be a safe procedure visualizing you
switching to the out feed side of the jointer when the stock had begun to
pass to that side.
Charlie pointed out that you would still push from both sides regardless of
which end of the jointer you were working over.
I neglected to pick up on the key words you mentioned that were incorrect.
You indicated that when switching hand locations to the out feed side that
you would then pull, that is incorrect. You would continue to push the
stock on the out feed side.
I indicated Right again to Charlie because Charlie is most often right and
he corrected my misunderstanding of what you had said.
"Leon" wrote
> IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what
safety
> measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
> will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
> while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
> push pad.
One of my supplier's reps has the first joints of three fingers on one hand
basically nonexistent from just such an accident on a jointer (aptly named
in this unfortunate instance).
The "thickness" of the work piece, regardless of how thick when 'face
jointing', is something I personally NEVER rely upon to protect me from the
jointer blades. That specific task on the jointer is one of the reason why I
own two, count'em - 2, Grrrippers ... and use them.
PW, although having some good stuff between its pages, is just another
example of not believing/taking at face value what you read, see, or hear in
this, the age of the idiocracy.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/14/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)
"B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:r%[email protected]...
>
> However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
>
> <http://www.bburke.com/woodworking/shopmadejigsandtools.html>
>
> Some sticks can be dangerous and provide a false sense of security in
> respect to the hand's direction of travel and application of force.
>
> For example: The standard "push stick" has the user providing force at
> about a 45 degree angle to the stock travel, with the hand moving towards
> the cutter and a small contact patch all the way out at the tip. If the
> stock sticks, jams, starts to kick back, etc... the stick goes away, and
> the hand moves directly at the cutter!
>
> I always like to think of leaning on a door. If someone opens the door,
> I'll fall in. So... I don't lean on doors. <G>
Agreed, however and hoping that the term push stick is a generic term, the
examples shown by your link are what you should be using.
Those pointey sticks with a notch on the forward end probably cause as many
accidents as they prevent. You really should use a push device that lets
you hold down the work also. Typically a pointy push stick does nothing to
prevent and often because of its lack of support will encourage kick back on
a TS. Typically Kick back starts off as a minor deflection that can be
prevented if you simply hold the work down and let the blade make its mark.
Pointy sticks do nothing to prevent the beginning of a kick back to become a
total kick back.
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 11:43:33 +0000, Andy Dingley
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>Printing that sort of advice in a magazine is going to cause other
>people, of less "skill" than this guy, to lose fingers.
I hear ya'.
On Jan 18, 12:15 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > Never mind <sigh> ... just go buy us both lottery tickets while your
> > luck's
> > still holding.
>
> Count me in too, ROTFLMAO
>
Heh. Is it luck or the fact that I buy wood on a per project basis?
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote:
>"Jeff" wrote
>
>> If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
>> capacity to make thickness planers...
>
>... strictly for the benefit of those unsure of the difference between the
>machines/operations. :)
>
>Two machines/operations with very different purposes: one used to flatten an
>edge or face (jointer); the other to mill opposite surfaces parallel
>(planer).
>
>A jointer won't necessarily mill opposite faces/edges parallel; and a planer
>won't necessarily mill stock flat.
>
>Both machines, used in conjunction, in a methodical manner, and in the
>proper order (along with other tools like table saws/hand planes) will allow
>a woodworker to mill straight, flat, and dimensioned, project stock from
>rough lumber.
And to further confuse things, our English brethren have the right
(IMHO) names for these machines: A planer (Am. "jointer") creates a
surface or edge in a single plane, while a thicknesser (Am. "Planer")
creates a board of uniform thickness (NOT one in a single plane).
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:28:52 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation that makes me
>shudder just thinking about it.
It's very hard to screw up on a bandsaw in a way that will take your
fingers off. I guess Maloof can afford to crimp a blade now and then.
On Jan 17, 10:56 am, "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Leon" wrote
>
>
>
> > IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what
> safety
> > measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
> > will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
> > while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
> > push pad.
>
> One of my supplier's reps has the first joints of three fingers on one hand
> basically nonexistent from just such an accident on a jointer (aptly named
> in this unfortunate instance).
>
> The "thickness" of the work piece, regardless of how thick when 'face
> jointing', is something I personally NEVER rely upon to protect me from the
> jointer blades. That specific task on the jointer is one of the reason why I
> own two, count'em - 2, Grrrippers ... and use them.
>
> PW, although having some good stuff between its pages, is just another
> example of not believing/taking at face value what you read, see, or hear in
> this, the age of the idiocracy.
>
If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
capacity to make thickness planers...
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Never mind <sigh> ... just go buy us both lottery tickets while your
> luck's
> still holding.
>
Count me in too, ROTFLMAO
> --
> www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 12/14/07
> KarlC@ (the obvious)
>
>
>
Spoken from true ignorance:
LRod <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> What an oddly descriptive addy.
>
> Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
> easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
> he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
> sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
>
> $100 says he speaks fluent 1337...or webtv.
"FrozenNorth" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> LRod took a can of maroon spray paint on January 19, 2008 02:15 pm and
> wrote
> the following:
>
>> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> What an oddly descriptive addy.
>>
>> Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
>> easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
>> he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
>> sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
>>
>> $100 says he speaks fluent 1337...or webtv.
>>
> Hey now, you'll upset JOAT.
> ;-)
>
Only if you email him...
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
"Twayne" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AQpkj.2222$k15.671@trnddc06...
> WARN
Wow. You're so cool.
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> WARN Nameservers on separate class C's WARNING: All of your
>nameservers (listed at the parent nameservers) are in the same Class C
>(technically, /24) address space, which means that they are probably at
>the same physical location. Your nameservers should be at geographically
>dispersed locations. You should not have all of your nameservers at the
>same location. RFC2182 3.1 goes into more detail about secondary
>nameserver location.
> PASS All NS IPs public OK. All of your NS records appear to use
>public IPs. If there were any private IPs, they would not be reachable,
>causing DNS delays.
> WARN TCP Allowed WARNING: One or more of your DNS servers does not
>accept TCP connections. Although rarely used, TCP connections are
>occasionally used instead of UDP connections. When firewalls block the
>TCP DNS connections, it can cause hard-to-diagnose problems. The problem
>servers are:
>
> 64.14.72.90: Error [Connection refused (10061)]. 64.14.72.91:
>Error [Connection refused (10061)].
>
>
> WARN Acceptance of abuse address WARNING: One or more of your
>mailservers does not accept mail to [email protected].
>Mailservers are expected by RFC2142 to accept mail to abuse.
>
> mail.jadedragononline.com's abuse response:<br /> >>> RCPT
>TO:<[email protected]><br /> <<< 511 sorry, no mailbox here by
>that name (#5.1.1 - chkuser) <br />
>
> WARN SPF record Your domain does not have an SPF record. This
>means that spammers can easily send out E-mail that looks like it came
>from your domain, which can make your domain look bad (if the recipient
>thinks you really sent it), and can cost you money (when people complain
>to you, rather than the spammer). You may want to add an SPF record
>ASAP, as 01 Oct 2004 was the target date for domains to have SPF records
>in place (Hotmail, for example, started checking SPF records on 01 Oct
>2004).
>
>
>Using 0 day old cached answer (or, you can get fresh results).
>Displaying E-mail address (use sparingly -- this will make it more
>likely that you will trigger our rate limiting system).
>
>=-=-=-=
>Visit AboutUs.org for more information about JadeDragonOnline.com
><a href="http://www.aboutus.org/JadeDragonOnline.com">AboutUs:
>JadeDragonOnline.com</a>
>
>Registration Service Provided By: ICDSoft.com
>Contact: [email protected]
>Visit: http://www.ICDSoft.com
>
>Domain name: JadeDragonOnline.com
>
>Registrant Contact:
>
> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
> +1.9093072010
> Fax: na
> 287 Alabama St.
> na
> Redlands, CA
> US
>
>Administrative Contact:
>
> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
> +1.9093072010
> Fax: na
> 287 Alabama St.
> na
> Redlands, CA
> US
>
>Technical Contact:
>
> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
> +1.9093072010
> Fax: na
> 287 Alabama St.
> na
> Redlands, CA
> US
>
>Status: Locked
>
>Name Servers:
> ns1.hoster909.com
> ns2.hoster909.com
>
>Creation date: 17 Apr 2004 00:40:56
>Expiration date: 17 Apr 2008 00:40:56
>
>
>64.14.72.90 PTR record: hoster909.com. [TTL 86400s] [A=64.14.72.90]
>
>To see the reverse DNS traversal, to make sure that all DNS servers are
>reporting the correct results, you can Click Here.
>
Having fun asshat? Go ahead, it's not like anyone with half a clue
couldn't have done the same thing.
Prick.
Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
Brian Henderson <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 12:32:23 GMT, B A R R Y <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
>
> I was using 'pushstick' as a generic term for anything that replaces
> your hand when pushing wood past a whirring, spinny, sharp thing. Use
> whatever type you think is effective.
>
>
> Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
No, go blog yourelf. If you had a brain you'd know better.
On Jan 18, 8:17 am, "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Jeff" wrote
>
> > If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
> > capacity to make thickness planers...
>
> ... strictly for the benefit of those unsure of the difference between the
> machines/operations. :)
>
> Two machines/operations with very different purposes: one used to flatten an
> edge or face (jointer); the other to mill opposite surfaces parallel
> (planer).
>
> A jointer won't necessarily mill opposite faces/edges parallel; and a planer
> won't necessarily mill stock flat.
>
> Both machines, used in conjunction, in a methodical manner, and in the
> proper order (along with other tools like table saws/hand planes) will allow
> a woodworker to mill straight, flat, and dimensioned, project stock from
> rough lumber.
>
For flat parallel sides, I go from rough cut to planer, to jointer
(edge) to table saw (opposite edge). Feel free to expound the virtues
of face jointing. I've never had a need. Unless we're dealing with
conceptual differences. I have jointed right angles on stock cut for
legs, then finished it to size on the jointer. A piece like that would
have finished at 1-1/2 x 1-1/2. I suppose technically I face jointed
although it felt like I jointed two edges.
Jeff
Leon wrote:
> "B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Leon wrote:
>>> IMHO this is just plain stupid.
>> Maybe.
>>
>> I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is exerted
>> on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
>>
>> Most of the time, I use push blocks. The times I don't are when the stock
>> is thick and heavy.
>>
>> With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my hands
>> are on the outfeed side of the machine. I'm PULLING the work across the
>> cutterhead. If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
>>
>> A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is always
>> referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't unintentionally
>> rock the board as it moves.
>
>
> BUT that is if every thing goes well. If every thing goes well no
> precautions would need to be observed. What happens if the board you are
> running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
>
> The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>
> You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
> jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
>
>
I don't own a jointer, and I've never
used one.
But this has me curious. Pulling stock
through makes sense after a point. But
you have to get to that point where
there is some stock on the outfeed table.
I would assume that with a piece that's
4' long, you'd push from a safe distance
until you have enough wood on the
outfeed to be able to shift your grip
and pull from there.
Would that be a correct and safe way to
do it?
--
Tanus
This is not really a sig.
http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/
SonomaProducts.com wrote:
> Jointing well, both edge and face, is a learned art. The machine looks
> so bulky and basic but the slightest differences in technique make a
> huge difference. You want to get some down pressure on the outfeed
> side shortly after the material passess onto that side. For face joint
> outfeed is the reference surface that controls the plane of the cut if
> things are working correctly. In edge jointing, it and the fence are
> equally important.
>
> Everyone develops their own technique and the length and heft of the
> material makes a difference too.
>
> Yes, pulling can kind of be effective but the real key is consistency
> in pressure and speed across the entire span of the cut.
>
> If you switch from a push to a pull at the cost of loosing consistency
> you will be able to find the wave (or worse) in the face surface.
>
> The strangest thing for me is if you push too hard down into the table
> you will taper the board, even on a perfectly configured machine. A
> smooth fine touch is really needed for excellent jointing. Sharp
> blades, a feel for the cut and a few hundred cuts under your belt to
> find your chi.
>
> On Jan 17, 6:19 pm, Tanus <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Leon wrote:
>>> "B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>> Leon wrote:
>>>>> IMHO this is just plain stupid.
>>>> Maybe.
>>>> I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is exerted
>>>> on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
>>>> Most of the time, I use push blocks. The times I don't are when the stock
>>>> is thick and heavy.
>>>> With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my hands
>>>> are on the outfeed side of the machine. I'm PULLING the work across the
>>>> cutterhead. If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
>>>> A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is always
>>>> referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't unintentionally
>>>> rock the board as it moves.
>>> BUT that is if every thing goes well. If every thing goes well no
>>> precautions would need to be observed. What happens if the board you are
>>> running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
>>> The article provides pictures of thin stock.
>>> You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
>>> jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
>> I don't own a jointer, and I've never
>> used one.
>>
>> But this has me curious. Pulling stock
>> through makes sense after a point. But
>> you have to get to that point where
>> there is some stock on the outfeed table.
>>
>> I would assume that with a piece that's
>> 4' long, you'd push from a safe distance
>> until you have enough wood on the
>> outfeed to be able to shift your grip
>> and pull from there.
>>
>> Would that be a correct and safe way to
>> do it?
>>
>> --
>> Tanus
>>
>> This is not really a sig.
>>
>> http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
Thanks. I'm getting an idea on how this
works now. It may be a tool I use in the
future, and knowing that it requires
more of a "feel" for it than other tools
is valuable.
--
Tanus
This is not really a sig.
http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/
Leon wrote:
> "Twayne" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:9r3kj.12$pC5.0@trnddc05...
>
>>>> No. Your hands may be in front of the blade, but you're still
>>>> pushing.
>>> Right again Charlie. It would be safer but would be an incorrect
>>> method. You would indeed need to push from either location.
>> Wrong again Leon. You either misunderstand or are simply a contrary "me
>> too" type of dummy.
>
> You said,
>
> I would assume that with a piece that's
> 4' long, you'd push from a safe distance
> until you have enough wood on the
> outfeed to be able to shift your grip
> and pull from there.
>
I'm the OP on this part of the thread,
but not the OP of the entire thread.
>
> I did not clearly read what you had written. You indicated that you would
> push the stock until enough wood was on the out feed surface and then shift
> your grip and pull from there.
Yes, that's what I meant.
>
> I replied Yes indicating that this would be a safe procedure visualizing you
> switching to the out feed side of the jointer when the stock had begun to
> pass to that side.
That is also what I was thinking.
> Charlie pointed out that you would still push from both sides regardless of
> which end of the jointer you were working over.
Here's where I'm losing both you and
Charlie.
> I neglected to pick up on the key words you mentioned that were incorrect.
> You indicated that when switching hand locations to the out feed side that
> you would then pull, that is incorrect. You would continue to push the
> stock on the out feed side.
OOOhhhhh....Ok. Place hands on the wood,
bearing down a bit, and pushing the
stock that is on the outfeed, rather
than pulling the already jointed end. Is
that right?
>
> I indicated Right again to Charlie because Charlie is most often right and
> he corrected my misunderstanding of what you had said.
>
>
--
Tanus
This is not really a sig.
http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/
Andy Dingley wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:12:08 GMT, "Leon"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he
>> advises not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He
>> advises to use rubber coated gloves.
>
> So now you know that's a magazine that's not worth reading. Neither
> the writer nor the editor ought to be working there.
Well, if they keep using the jointer without push sticks but with
gloves then sooner or later neither of them will be able to type and
the problem will be solved <evil grin>.
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Twayne wrote:
> Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:28:52 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation that
>>> makes me shudder just thinking about it.
>>
>> It's very hard to screw up on a bandsaw in a way that will take
>> your
>> fingers off. I guess Maloof can afford to crimp a blade now and
>> then.
>
> True, if all you have is a toy bandsaw. You don't know your stump
> from a hole in the ground, dingle-berry.
OK, so explain to us how you are likely to hurt yourself freehanding
on a band saw, other than by running your hand into the blade.
And how do you do scrollwork on a band saw without freehanding? Or
are you not aware that that is a standard band saw operation that
would be taught in any training curriculum and is described in just
about any book you pick up about the band saw?
And if you're going to make fun of people's names, then consider that
yours easily goes to "twit" and "twat".
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Andy Dingley wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 22:35:08 -0600, "Leon"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Care to support that comment, keeping in mind 1 face of the board
>> should be flattened before the other is introduced to the thickness
>> planer?
>
> Just throw 'em straight into the thicknesser. Anythign too warped to
> come out was too warped to be much use anyway 8-)
If it's cupped then you can flatten it in the thickness planer if you
know what you're about, but if it's bowed or twisted going into the
thicknesser it will still be bowed or twisted coming out of the
thicknesser. For some purposes this is acceptable, for others it
isn't.
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Leon wrote:
> "Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>> OOOhhhhh....Ok. Place hands on the wood, bearing down a bit, and pushing
>> the stock that is on the outfeed, rather than pulling the already jointed
>> end. Is that right?
>
>
> Yes, you push the board all the way through the cycle. First from the in
> feed end at the beginning of the pass and then as the stock goes over the
> out feed end you move your hands to the out feed end and continue to push.
> You do not want to push down hard, as you indicated bearing down a bit, if
> you push down too hard and the board is warped you will end up removing
> stock that does not need to be removed.
>
> This is one machine that tends to be an acquired touch to get consistently
> good results.
>
>
Got it now. Finances and especially
space dictate that I won't be getting a
jointer any time soon, but if and when I
do, I'll certainly keep in mind that
it's a tool that has a bit of learning
curve.
Every tool I own does have one of
course. This sounds like it has a lot
more experimenting than most.
Thanks Leon. And Charlie.
--
Tanus
This is not really a sig.
http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/
Twayne wrote:
> Said one bloated, bottom feeding idiot:
>
> Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:12:08 GMT, "Leon"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and
>>> he
>>> advises not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He
>>> advises to use rubber coated gloves.
>>
>> So now you know that's a magazine that's not worth reading.
>> Neither
>> the writer nor the editor ought to be working there.
>
> More like, we know who's a closed minded fool you mean.
Yes, I think we do, stumpy.
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Twayne wrote:
> J. Clarke <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Twayne wrote:
>>> Andy Dingley <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:28:52 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Doesn't Maloof freehand on the bandsaw? That's an operation
>>>>> that
>>>>> makes me shudder just thinking about it.
>>>>
>>>> It's very hard to screw up on a bandsaw in a way that will take
>>>> your
>>>> fingers off. I guess Maloof can afford to crimp a blade now and
>>>> then.
>>>
>>> True, if all you have is a toy bandsaw. You don't know your stump
>>> from a hole in the ground, dingle-berry.
>>
>> OK, so explain to us how you are likely to hurt yourself
>> freehanding
>> on a band saw, other than by running your hand into the blade.
>>
>> And how do you do scrollwork on a band saw without freehanding? Or
>> are you not aware that that is a standard band saw operation that
>> would be taught in any training curriculum and is described in just
>> about any book you pick up about the band saw?
>>
>> And if you're going to make fun of people's names, then consider
>> that
>> yours easily goes to "twit" and "twat".
>>
>> --
>
> That's what I figured; ignorance is bliss for you. So far. Too
> bad.
> Also, there is no "us". And you're a dangerous fool.
Can't even tell me from Andy (hint--there's an ocean between us).
Oh, well, I gave you a chance, you don't deserve another.
<plonk>
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 23:53:01 +0000, Andy Dingley
<[email protected]> wrote:
>So now you know that's a magazine that's not worth reading. Neither the
>writer nor the editor ought to be working there.
Anyone who has:
A.) Seen Glen's work...
-- or --
B.) Read any of the hundreds of other things he's written, including
his books...
Would know that even if you don't agree with everything he says, the
man has lots to offer.
The blog post is HIS singular opinion.
Jeff <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Jan 18, 8:17 am, "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Jeff" wrote
>>
>> > If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
>> > capacity to make thickness planers...
>>
>> ... strictly for the benefit of those unsure of the difference between the
>> machines/operations. :)
>>
>> Two machines/operations with very different purposes: one used to flatten an
>> edge or face (jointer); the other to mill opposite surfaces parallel
>> (planer).
>>
>> A jointer won't necessarily mill opposite faces/edges parallel; and a planer
>> won't necessarily mill stock flat.
>>
>> Both machines, used in conjunction, in a methodical manner, and in the
>> proper order (along with other tools like table saws/hand planes) will allow
>> a woodworker to mill straight, flat, and dimensioned, project stock from
>> rough lumber.
>>
>
>For flat parallel sides, I go from rough cut to planer, to jointer
>(edge) to table saw (opposite edge).
Then you've never removed twist from a board.
Just for jollies, go to a big box and buy an 8' 2x8 with twist that
you can see. The follow your procedure on one 4' length of that board
with noticeable twist, until you are not able to discern any twist
with your winding sticks.
For comparison, face joint one face of the other board before
thicknessing the opposite face.
What are the thicknesses of the two resulting dressed, non-twisted
boards?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 02:18:19 GMT, "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>You, of course, nailed it.
I never nail anything. Bamboo pegs, if I must 8-)
Brian Henderson <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> WARN Nameservers on separate class C's WARNING: All of your
>> nameservers (listed at the parent nameservers) are in the same Class
>> C (technically, /24) address space, which means that they are
>> probably at the same physical location. Your nameservers should be
>> at geographically dispersed locations. You should not have all of
>> your nameservers at the same location. RFC2182 3.1 goes into more
>> detail about secondary nameserver location.
>> PASS All NS IPs public OK. All of your NS records appear to use
>> public IPs. If there were any private IPs, they would not be
>> reachable, causing DNS delays.
>> WARN TCP Allowed WARNING: One or more of your DNS servers does
>> not accept TCP connections. Although rarely used, TCP connections are
>> occasionally used instead of UDP connections. When firewalls block
>> the TCP DNS connections, it can cause hard-to-diagnose problems. The
>> problem servers are:
>>
>> 64.14.72.90: Error [Connection refused (10061)]. 64.14.72.91:
>> Error [Connection refused (10061)].
>>
>>
>> WARN Acceptance of abuse address WARNING: One or more of your
>> mailservers does not accept mail to [email protected].
>> Mailservers are expected by RFC2142 to accept mail to abuse.
>>
>> mail.jadedragononline.com's abuse response:<br /> >>> RCPT
>> TO:<[email protected]><br /> <<< 511 sorry, no mailbox here
>> by that name (#5.1.1 - chkuser) <br />
>>
>> WARN SPF record Your domain does not have an SPF record. This
>> means that spammers can easily send out E-mail that looks like it
>> came from your domain, which can make your domain look bad (if the
>> recipient thinks you really sent it), and can cost you money (when
>> people complain to you, rather than the spammer). You may want to
>> add an SPF record ASAP, as 01 Oct 2004 was the target date for
>> domains to have SPF records in place (Hotmail, for example, started
>> checking SPF records on 01 Oct 2004).
>>
>>
>> Using 0 day old cached answer (or, you can get fresh results).
>> Displaying E-mail address (use sparingly -- this will make it more
>> likely that you will trigger our rate limiting system).
>>
>> =-=-=-=
>> Visit AboutUs.org for more information about JadeDragonOnline.com
>> <a href="http://www.aboutus.org/JadeDragonOnline.com">AboutUs:
>> JadeDragonOnline.com</a>
>>
>> Registration Service Provided By: ICDSoft.com
>> Contact: [email protected]
>> Visit: http://www.ICDSoft.com
>>
>> Domain name: JadeDragonOnline.com
>>
>> Registrant Contact:
>>
>> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
>> +1.9093072010
>> Fax: na
>> 287 Alabama St.
>> na
>> Redlands, CA
>> US
>>
>> Administrative Contact:
>>
>> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
>> +1.9093072010
>> Fax: na
>> 287 Alabama St.
>> na
>> Redlands, CA
>> US
>>
>> Technical Contact:
>>
>> Brian Henderson ([email protected])
>> +1.9093072010
>> Fax: na
>> 287 Alabama St.
>> na
>> Redlands, CA
>> US
>>
>> Status: Locked
>>
>> Name Servers:
>> ns1.hoster909.com
>> ns2.hoster909.com
>>
>> Creation date: 17 Apr 2004 00:40:56
>> Expiration date: 17 Apr 2008 00:40:56
>>
>>
>> 64.14.72.90 PTR record: hoster909.com. [TTL 86400s] [A=64.14.72.90]
>>
>> To see the reverse DNS traversal, to make sure that all DNS servers
>> are reporting the correct results, you can Click Here.
>>
>
> Having fun asshat? Go ahead, it's not like anyone with half a clue
> couldn't have done the same thing.
>
> Prick.
>
>
> Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
Let's see YOU name where the info came from!
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 08:16:56 -0500, "J. Clarke" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>OK, so explain to us how you are likely to hurt yourself freehanding
>on a band saw, other than by running your hand into the blade.
>
>And how do you do scrollwork on a band saw without freehanding?
What;'s "freehanding" ? Wiggling a line in plywood is one thing, but
Maloof is doing it in three dimensions. That means you've little support
under the workpiece, and support you do have is some distance (i.e. a
lever arm) away from the blade. Have the blade catch, and the work
slams downwards, bending a crimp into the blade.
I do this, but I can't say I enjoy it. I also lose blades by doing it.
The trick is to have a _big_ bandsaw, which just never catches.
"B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I think his pictures are dangerous. My hands are on the outfeed side,
> moving away from the cutter. I don't know how many more times I should
> type that my hands are moving away from the cutter, and are not over the
> blades.
>
> Basic safety = the natural momentum of the motion takes the flesh towards
> safety, not danger.
Agreed, and I do not have so much problem with your hands on the out feed
side but they are on the in feed side for a period of time.
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> WARN
You are an idiot.
(sixoneeight) = 618
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 12:32:23 GMT, B A R R Y <[email protected]>
wrote:
>However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
I was using 'pushstick' as a generic term for anything that replaces
your hand when pushing wood past a whirring, spinny, sharp thing. Use
whatever type you think is effective.
Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
Tanus wrote:
> I would assume that with a piece that's 4' long, you'd push from a safe
> distance until you have enough wood on the outfeed to be able to shift
> your grip and pull from there.
>
> Would that be a correct and safe way to do it?
That's exactly what I'm talking about for bare handed or gloved face
jointing. My "short limit" is ~24". That allows my hand to be 12"
from the infeed side, and 6" from the outfeed. Shorter than that,
and I use pads.
Remember, the whole reason for skipping the pads is because certain
wood is more difficult to move with the pads. Shorter and thinner
boards are easier to begin with.
I have "danger zones" taped, painted, or marked, on all of my flesh
eaters and the sleds and jigs I use with them. For example, my jointer
has red tape on the top of the fence. If my hands will go into the red
area, I rethink the cut.
When edge jointing, I never, ever, use blocks or sticks. After ~ 8" of
stock has been cut, my right hand "pulls" the stock along the fence, and
my left is on the table, acting like a featherboard. The entire cut is
referenced to the outfeed table and fence for great accuracy, and my
hands apply no pressure that would send them towards danger in case of
unwanted adventure.
Leon wrote:
>
> IMHO this is just plain stupid.
Maybe.
I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is
exerted on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
Most of the time, I use push blocks. The times I don't are when the
stock is thick and heavy.
With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my
hands are on the outfeed side of the machine. I'm PULLING the work
across the cutterhead. If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is
always referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't
unintentionally rock the board as it moves.
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 19:15:44 +0000, LRod <[email protected]>
wrote:
>On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 16:47:28 GMT, "Twayne"
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>What an oddly descriptive addy.
>
>Truly a noob and a wannabe noob at that. Resorting to posting the
>easily obtained by anyone and public whois information of a person who
>he's trying to flame war with, as some sort of "wonder weapon" is a
>sure sign of desparation and untenable position.
Especially since Brian H. is a frequent and respectable poster here.
"Leon" wrote
> I indicated Right again to Charlie because Charlie is most often right and
> he corrected my misunderstanding of what you had said.
Ever notice that some long, wide boards will simpy not stay moving straight
over the cutter when all available hands are busy on the outfeed side?
My only problem with the method being commented upon is that, on long
boards, and particularly those that approach the maximum width capacity of
the jointer, you often need three hands, two pushing on the outfeed table,
and one on the infeed side to guide the stock past the blades.
But, there's hope for the future!
It's been my contention for some time now that evolution will eventually
give the wooddorker three hands and two more eyes on the back of his head so
no one can sneak up and scare shit out of him whilst attempting to
accomplish these often awkward tasks in the shop.
That said, all bets are off if you have an aircraft carrier flight deck
jointer, like B A R R Y ' S DJ-20! ;)
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/14/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)
Chris Friesen said:
>Jeff wrote:
>
>> For flat parallel sides, I go from rough cut to planer, to jointer
>> (edge) to table saw (opposite edge). Feel free to expound the virtues
>> of face jointing. I've never had a need.
>
>If the board starts out twisted or bowed, the planer will make a smooth
>board of even thickness--but it will still be twisted or bowed.
We have a winner!
Greg G.
Brian Henderson wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:55:28 -0500, "EXT"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Having destroyed a number of pushsticks on a table saw, I find it cheap
>> insurance to make or buy more if they save my fingers. I always try to keep
>> fingers away from sharp edges, particularly powered sharp edges. I still
>> have all 10 after over 30 years as a woodworker.
>
> Pushsticks are disposable, make them by the dozens because they will
> come into contact with the spinning blade.
Right on! Make lots! It's also great practice in pattern routing,
shaping, and curved sawing to a line.
However, I like hooks and blocks much better than sticks:
<http://www.bburke.com/woodworking/shopmadejigsandtools.html>
Some sticks can be dangerous and provide a false sense of security in
respect to the hand's direction of travel and application of force.
For example: The standard "push stick" has the user providing force at
about a 45 degree angle to the stock travel, with the hand moving
towards the cutter and a small contact patch all the way out at the tip.
If the stock sticks, jams, starts to kick back, etc... the stick goes
away, and the hand moves directly at the cutter!
I always like to think of leaning on a door. If someone opens the door,
I'll fall in. So... I don't lean on doors. <G>
"Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> OOOhhhhh....Ok. Place hands on the wood, bearing down a bit, and pushing
> the stock that is on the outfeed, rather than pulling the already jointed
> end. Is that right?
Yes, you push the board all the way through the cycle. First from the in
feed end at the beginning of the pass and then as the stock goes over the
out feed end you move your hands to the out feed end and continue to push.
You do not want to push down hard, as you indicated bearing down a bit, if
you push down too hard and the board is warped you will end up removing
stock that does not need to be removed.
This is one machine that tends to be an acquired touch to get consistently
good results.
On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 03:06:50 GMT, "Twayne"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>If you had a brain you'd know better.
You're an idiot, but then again, everyone knows that.
Blog Me! http://BitchSpot.JadeDragonOnline.com
On Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:12:08 GMT, "Leon" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>I just read an article by Glen D Huey of Popular Woodworking and he advises
>not using push stick or pads when using ht jointer. He advises to use
>rubber coated gloves.
So now you know that's a magazine that's not worth reading. Neither the
writer nor the editor ought to be working there.
Dave <[email protected]> wrote:
>It is amazing to me how often publications illustrate unsafe
>shortcuts. The worst examples I see are on the DYI shows on
>television.
That's why they refer to these particular shows as DYI (Do Yourself
In) shows rather than DIY (Do It Yourself)! <g, d, &r>
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
Swingman said:
>"Leon" wrote
>
>> IMHO this is just plain stupid. I do not care who you are and what
>safety
>> measures you take, the odds are against you and sooner or later you can or
>> will have an accident. While he does warn of certain dangerous practices
>> while wearing gloves, those concerns are a moot point if you are using a
>> push pad.
>
>One of my supplier's reps has the first joints of three fingers on one hand
>basically nonexistent from just such an accident on a jointer (aptly named
>in this unfortunate instance).
>
>The "thickness" of the work piece, regardless of how thick when 'face
>jointing', is something I personally NEVER rely upon to protect me from the
>jointer blades. That specific task on the jointer is one of the reason why I
>own two, count'em - 2, Grrrippers ... and use them.
>
>PW, although having some good stuff between its pages, is just another
>example of not believing/taking at face value what you read, see, or hear in
>this, the age of the idiocracy.
IIRC, Sam Maloof had a similar accident with a jointer that resulted
in the loss of several fingertips to the joint. Although watching him
work, would have guessed the accident occurred at the bandsaw.
Greg G.
"Jeff" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Jan 18, 12:15 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> > Never mind <sigh> ... just go buy us both lottery tickets while your
>> > luck's
>> > still holding.
>>
>> Count me in too, ROTFLMAO
>>
>
> Heh. Is it luck or the fact that I buy wood on a per project basis?
>
Picking and choosing your wood on a per project basis certainly affords you
the ability to get straighter and flatter stock. If you buy "a lot" of wood
you may not have that privilege. Some times you have to take what they
have, to be able to fill the order and what they have may not all be able to
go straight to the planer.
With that said, I use a planer jig/sled to assist in flattening one side if
the long wide board that will not go through my jointer.
On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 09:26:43 -0500, alexy <[email protected]> wrote:
>And to further confuse things, our English brethren have the right
>(IMHO) names for these machines: A planer (Am. "jointer") creates a
>surface or edge in a single plane, while a thicknesser (Am. "Planer")
>creates a board of uniform thickness (NOT one in a single plane).
American English *always* confuses things :)
--
B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
...
and my hands apply no pressure that would send them towards
> danger in case of unwanted adventure.
Bingo; them's the magic words. After one gets used to it, it's as
natual as writing with a pencil or riding a bike.
"B A R R Y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Leon wrote:
>>
>> IMHO this is just plain stupid.
>
> Maybe.
>
> I've jointed stock that way with a major difference, no effort is exerted
> on the infeed side once at least 6" clears the cutterhead.
>
> Most of the time, I use push blocks. The times I don't are when the stock
> is thick and heavy.
>
> With or without blocks, once the stock passes the blades, both of my hands
> are on the outfeed side of the machine. I'm PULLING the work across the
> cutterhead. If my hand slips it goes AWAY from the blades.
>
> A side benefit to pulling stock over a jointer is that the stock is always
> referenced to the outfeed surfaces, and the operator can't unintentionally
> rock the board as it moves.
BUT that is if every thing goes well. If every thing goes well no
precautions would need to be observed. What happens if the board you are
running through shatters or the cutters hit an embedded nail or a knot?
The article provides pictures of thin stock.
You really need something and more than a glove between your hand the
jointer cutters should the board not remain in tact.
"Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>>
>
> Thanks. I'm getting an idea on how this works now. It may be a tool I use
> in the future, and knowing that it requires more of a "feel" for it than
> other tools is valuable.
Good analysis! The machine for sure requires for you to learn the feel and
touch so keep in mind that practice makes perfect and you get better with it
over time.
"Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> I don't own a jointer, and I've never used one.
>
> But this has me curious. Pulling stock through makes sense after a point.
> But you have to get to that point where there is some stock on the outfeed
> table.
>
> I would assume that with a piece that's 4' long, you'd push from a safe
> distance until you have enough wood on the outfeed to be able to shift
> your grip and pull from there.
>
> Would that be a correct and safe way to do it?
Yes
"Jeff" wrote
> If humans were meant to face joint, they wouldn't have evolved the
> capacity to make thickness planers...
... strictly for the benefit of those unsure of the difference between the
machines/operations. :)
Two machines/operations with very different purposes: one used to flatten an
edge or face (jointer); the other to mill opposite surfaces parallel
(planer).
A jointer won't necessarily mill opposite faces/edges parallel; and a planer
won't necessarily mill stock flat.
Both machines, used in conjunction, in a methodical manner, and in the
proper order (along with other tools like table saws/hand planes) will allow
a woodworker to mill straight, flat, and dimensioned, project stock from
rough lumber.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/14/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)
"Tanus" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> Got it now. Finances and especially space dictate that I won't be getting
> a jointer any time soon, but if and when I do, I'll certainly keep in mind
> that it's a tool that has a bit of learning curve.
>
> Every tool I own does have one of course. This sounds like it has a lot
> more experimenting than most.
>
> Thanks Leon. And Charlie.
>
> --
> Tanus
>
> This is not really a sig.
>
> http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/
Keep in mind that I an not a big fan of the Jointer. It is the least used
machine in my shop although it's size is a lot of the problem. You can
flatten a board in a planer with the right sled/jig and you can very easily
straighten a board with the TS with the right jig/sled. IMHO the jointer is
not essential.