OT- Captain jumps overboard, SEALs shoot pirates (Apr 12) (US 3, Pirates 0)

"HeyBub" wrote:

>I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
>Obama
>should get all the credit for killing the children.


Gee whiz, it's happy horse shit time.

Has Rush used this one yet?

It's about his speed.

Lew

Stuart wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
>> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|
>
Case in point is Ossama bin Laden. His family is one of the richest in
Saudi Arabia.

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote

Oh yea?? Well *I* gots a trebuchet and one of my ex's cheese-cakes!!
So there!
========================

Caewful there. We have an unlimited supply of "perpetual fruitcakes" we
could toss your way.

On Apr 12, 10:12=A0pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> >> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> >> that they were killed."
>
> > Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk th=
em
> into another line of work. =A0They could sell Amway instead.
>
> They made the choice to play with guns.

Sure, Amway. Something does need to be done to help improve conditions
in the area, so that piracy is a less attractive option. With a few
more operations such as the one yesterday, piracy is going to look
less good to unemployed, and unemployable, youth, but there seem to be
few other options avaiable.

What I can't understand is how these impoverished people come by all
their AK47s and RPGs and other weapons, none of which, in operating
conditon, is cheap. Not to mention the ammo they seem to blast into
the air every few minutes to express anger, joy, dismay or peaceful
intent.

On Apr 12, 10:51=A0pm, Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
> Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> > "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> >>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> >>> that they were killed."
> >> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> > Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk =
them
> > into another line of work. =A0They could sell Amway instead.
>
> Yessir... and Mary Kay Cosmetics, and Tupperware, and Avon, and...
> encyclopedias. Especially encyclopedias. Burial plots, too.
>
> > They made the choice to play with guns.
>
> Yeah, although I wonder how many of 'em had wanted to be pirates when
> they grew up...
>
> --
> Morris Dovey
> DeSoto Solar
> DeSoto, Iowa USAhttp://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

There always seems to be another point of view. It all depends on
where you're standing at the time, eh?

http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/war/bushs_terrorism_war/=
news.php?q=3D1239471001

"HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> LRod wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 15:51:39 -0400, "Matt" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says
>>
>>
>> The one thing I find disturbing in all this is that the neo-cons
>> have
>> been whining for years that liberals are soft on everything. I saw
>> a
>> post on one of the other message boards yesterday that said:
>>
>> "The last time we had a US President with the balls to face
>> down pirates..."
>>
>> followed by a link to an article, no doubt about Jefferson
>> and the Barbary pirates, and nothing else.
>>
>> So, let me see if I have this straight:
>>
>> Who ordered the SEALs in? The battalion commander?
>> The captain of the ship carrying them? Southern Command?
>> SecNav? DefSec?
>>
>> No, I'm guessing an overt military act like that pretty much
>> had to come from the Commander in Chief, just like in Jefferson's
>> day. I guess the implication is pretty clear, Obama does have
>> balls,
>> and he deserves as much credit for it as Jefferson gets.
>
> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
> Obama should get all the credit for killing the children.

Well, lets think about that for a minute, when I was in Vietnam, the
"children" along
the side of the road with a grenade would kill you just as quick as a
NVA soldier, not to
forget, the women who are now carrying bombs strapped around their
waist killing US
soldiers in the war we are now in, It doesn't matter who kills you,
you are still dead.
War is hell and that is the way it is, kill or be killed,, the other
option is talk about it and
just let them kill you. It's your life, which do you want?
War is hell
CC
>
>

On Apr 14, 4:13=A0pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "HeyBub" wrote:
> >I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
> >Obama
> >should get all the credit for killing the children.
>
> Gee whiz, it's happy horse shit time.
>
> Has Rush used this one yet?
>
> It's about his speed.
>
> Lew

WTF is next? Our friends the Saudis allow marriage to an 8-year old.
Why wouldn't somebody from over there arm a 9-year old to " get
himself a few of those capitalist pigs"?
Just when you think mankind couldn't sink any lower....guess what?

LRod wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 15:51:39 -0400, "Matt" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says
>
>
> The one thing I find disturbing in all this is that the neo-cons have
> been whining for years that liberals are soft on everything. I saw a
> post on one of the other message boards yesterday that said:
>
> "The last time we had a US President with the balls to face
> down pirates..."
>
> followed by a link to an article, no doubt about Jefferson
> and the Barbary pirates, and nothing else.
>
> So, let me see if I have this straight:
>
> Who ordered the SEALs in? The battalion commander?
> The captain of the ship carrying them? Southern Command?
> SecNav? DefSec?
>
> No, I'm guessing an overt military act like that pretty much
> had to come from the Commander in Chief, just like in Jefferson's
> day. I guess the implication is pretty clear, Obama does have balls,
> and he deserves as much credit for it as Jefferson gets.

I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct, Obama
should get all the credit for killing the children.

HeyBub wrote:

> But you can't win this conflict on the sea, you have to destroy the nest
> that's on land.

Which nest - the one near Mudug or the ones at the other end of that
location's (satellite) internet connection?

> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home port
> which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's what we did in
> 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.

Hmm - and how many hostages will that kill?

CERN has satellite views available at

http://unosat.web.cern.ch/unosat/freeproducts/somalia/Piracy/UNOSAT_SOM_Hijacked_Ships_Garacad_A2_Highres.pdf

and I imagine the DOD birds provide considerably more detail.

Perhaps it might be more productive to follow the internet traffic and
the money - and then quietly convert the money-movers and the
weapons-dealers to chum.

2c

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Tom Veatch wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:09:36 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 12, 4:33 pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Robatoy wrote:
>>>> On Apr 12, 3:51 pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...
>>>> GO NAVY!
>>> Go SEALS
>>> --
>>> "You can lead them to LINUX
>>> but you can't make them THINK"
>>> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
>>> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/
>> Fantastic results.
>
>
> Yes, indeed!!!

Agreed.

> There was a tongue-in-cheek opinion among Marines at the time of my
> tour that the worst thing you could do is give a Swabbie a rifle and
> run him up on the beach. I'm very happy to see a counter example to
> that opinion. Well done, Navy!!!

Old ex-Army paratrooper: "And the guy only had to jump overboard twice
before the swabbies had it figured out!" ;-)

> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> that they were killed."

Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Martin H. Eastburn wrote:

> Killing bankers won't stop the piracy. You have to cut the head off
> of the snake and wipe the nest out.

Then it'd be a good idea to identify the "head of the snake". Somehow I
doubt that it's the grunts out on the water.

There have been over $60 million dollars in ransoms paid by shipping
companies. Those funds have been converted to spendable form by
/someone/ and again, I doubt it's the grunts out on the water.

I don't care if it's the Russian mafia or an exec at Credit Suisse -
whoever it is is (to my way of thinking, YMMV) is an accomplice to the
piracies, and should be held to account for their participation.

There is apparently some reason to believe that the pirate operations
have been funded at least in part by wealthy parties - and should that
be proven true, I think that their complete assets should be taken to
compensate first the shipping companies for the ransoms and losses due
to having their vessels out of service, secondly the hostage crew
members for their time in captivity, and thirdly any assets left over
should be used under UN supervision to improve conditions in Somalia -
perhaps starting with repatriation and restoration of some semblance of
normal (pre-genocide) life in the Darfur region.

> The area has been a cess pool for years. The war lords killed off the
> government and then couldn't decide who or how to run a government.
>
> I say start them over.

That's a tall order and much easier said than done. Are you ready to
spend the next ten years of /your/ life "starting them over"? Are you
prepared to require your offspring to pay for you to make that effort?

If not, then it might be helpful if you'd explain more clearly what you
meant, who's to do that job, and how it's going to be funded.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>>> that they were killed."
>> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk them
> into another line of work. They could sell Amway instead.

Yessir... and Mary Kay Cosmetics, and Tupperware, and Avon, and...
encyclopedias. Especially encyclopedias. Burial plots, too.

> They made the choice to play with guns.

Yeah, although I wonder how many of 'em had wanted to be pirates when
they grew up...

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Doug Miller wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> There is apparently some reason to believe that the pirate operations
>> have been funded at least in part by wealthy parties - and should that
>> be proven true, I think that their complete assets should be taken to
>> compensate first the shipping companies for the ransoms and losses due
>> to having their vessels out of service, secondly the hostage crew
>> members for their time in captivity, and thirdly any assets left over
>> should be used under UN supervision to improve conditions in Somalia -
>> perhaps starting with repatriation and restoration of some semblance of
>> normal (pre-genocide) life in the Darfur region.
>
> Improving conditions in Somalia, while a laudable goal, has nothing to do with
> the genocide in Darfur, which is some 3000km, and two international borders,
> to the west in Sudan.

You're correct, but...

I'm not sure that borders have a great deal to do with any of what's
going on in the region, other than to excuse non-pursuit across
boundaries of those folks who've decided that rule of law doesn't solve
their problems or meet their needs. The importance that westerners
attach to national boundaries is not universal.

The piracy problem in Somalia bears more than just a passing resemblance
to the (foreign) oil producer extortions and kidnappings still farther
west. It doesn't take much imagination to find elements of these
behavioral modes in activities like the Nigerian internet-based scams.
Different perps, but (IMO) similarly rooted in a desperate notion that
in order to get one's "fair share" of the planet's wealth, one must
wrest it from those who appear to have more than their share.

It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.

I don't think removing four Somali pirates (or even blowing up a pirate
HQ) is going to produce any noticeable change.

Along with playing whack-a-mole with zero-sum predators, we might better
serve everyone (including ourselves) by finding more effective permanent
solutions to the healthy family and full belly problems.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Morris Dovey" wrote:
>
>> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a
>> full belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> That idea has been suggested to solve the world's aggression problems
> for probably more years than either one of us have lived.
>
> Only problem seems to be getting some agreement on how to implement
> it.

I noticed that. :) I decided to make agreement a non-problem by taking
the bit between my teeth and seeing if anyone would follow.

I also noticed that the "healthy family" part wasn't completely separate
from the "full belly" problem (not much rocket surgery there).

The "full belly" problem, when it actually /was/ a problem seemed to
resolve into a problem of having water in the wrong place - a concept
that crystallized for me when I heard a Minnesota farm neighbor talking
about recent heavy rains. "None or too much", he quipped - and so gave
me a flash of insight that extended well beyond rain.

That was 30 years ago, and by a really strange chain of events, I ended
up designing a cheap/simple/reliable engine/pump that can be powered
directly by sunshine - no gas, oil, or electricity needed. (The wreck's
Canukistani stirmeister provided some of the early encouragement and
suggestions.)

It's working - not as well as I'd like, but it /is/ working. There's a
picture of the weird engine at the bottom of

http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Projects/Stirling/Dyne.html

and the really good news is my off-the-wall efforts have been joined in
the past month or so by a team of students in Pakistan and a very
capable researcher in France. Their work can be seen at

http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Projects/Stirling/Elsewhere/

There's still much to be done, but I've been encouraged that (unlike the
cold fusion research) the present engine has been successfully
duplicated elsewhere - and it appears to be simple enough for people to
build and maintain for themselves.

Interestingly, two of these engines can be coupled together to make a
heat pump for cooling/refrigeration. There's a bit about that tucked
into the web page at

http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Journey.html

I'm hoping the pump will help irrigate the crops to fill more bellies
and so help families to be healthier - and maybe, just maybe, help
reduce some of that desperation.

Anyone who'd like to join in is welcome.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Stuart wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
>> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|

Very true - and it's worth noting that although religious extremism pops
up in many guises, its most common threads appear to be the fear and
desperation that result from the inability to find a path from yesterday
to tomorrow.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Swingman wrote:
> Morris Dovey wrote:
>> http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Journey.html
>>
>> I'm hoping the pump will help irrigate the crops to fill more bellies
>> and so help families to be healthier - and maybe, just maybe, help
>> reduce some of that desperation.
>>
>> Anyone who'd like to join in is welcome.
>
> Well done, Morris! ... and while you should be commended for both the
> hard work and altruism, it's a damned shame that there are more and more
> folks who would prefer that you do the work and then provide them with
> the fruits of *your* labor, gratis.

Thanks but I haven't really worked all that hard - and I work to serve
my own ends at least as much as others'.

My work, if it can be called work, is to provide a sense of the
/Possible/ to folks who can use that.

Since it can't be bought or sold, it pretty much has to be a gift.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Larry Blanchard wrote:

> And therein lies the problem. You're doing a good job Morris, but there
> will always be people like the ones described above. And the fanatics
> who think killing _____________ will get them a ticket to paradise.

That's true, and it's worth considering whether, why, how, and by whom
their activities are supported - because a fanatic without a support
context is just another shouter.

The fanatics feed on perceived unfairness, injustice, and dishonesty -
and accumulate power when they succeed at inducing others to resonate
with their outrage.

The rest of us have, as I see it, these options:

[1] We can ignore, either by conscious choice or by choosing to not
inform ourselves, what's happening in the world around us.

[2] We can act to suppress any and all destabilizing influences.

[3] We can examine the situation and attempt to reveal truth, ensure
fairness, and provide justice.

The first is the usual option. The second is generally the knee-jerk
response when the first option is removed. The third is the most
expensive and least comfortable option.

Yes, I suppose there'll always be fanatics. Some of 'em will simply be
crazies - but it's probably worth noticing that at least some will be
people acting to provoke the third kind of response.

I'm inclined toward finding criminally insane all of those who believe
that any kind of paradise can be achieved through murder.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Jack Stein wrote:
> Stuart wrote:
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a
>>> full belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>>
>> Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|
>
> Seems the most popular reason to pick up a gun is socialism. Think of
> the National Socialist Party of Germany (Nazi's) or Stalin, or Mao. The
> second most popular reason to pick up a gun is to fight the socialists
> trying to kill everyone. I was born just after WWII, but no one in my
> circle of family or friends that picked up a weapon to fight Hitlers
> socialist party were very hungry. Come to think of it, no one I know
> that are picking up guns to fight in Iraq or Afghanistan are very hungry
> either.

I won't argue with your observations of those within your family circle,
but will encourage you to consider the conditions that led to the those
three political forces acquiring their political power.

> Come to think of it some more, and in the US during the depression, when
> people were a bit hungry, violent crime was nothing like it is today,
> after the War on Poverty put a chicken in every pot....

An interesting observation. It might be even more interesting to
discover the social conditions that have produced today's level of
violence. It's also been interesting to contemplate the underpinnings of
the current level of ammunition sales - to the point that some
manufacturers have gone to round-the-clock production and still can't
meet demand. It leads one to wonder if the problem is with the chicken
or the pot - or something else.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

In article <[email protected]>,
HeyBub <[email protected]> wrote:

> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home
> port which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's what
> we did in 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.

They're probably spread out along the coast in all sorts of little hidden
bays.

I believe that during WWII we had some special ships, just looked like
ordinary merchant ships but with concealed armaments. Should deploy a few
of those, wait for the pirates to turn up and blow the bastards out of the
water - no questions asked.

In article <[email protected]>,
Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:

> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.

Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|

On Apr 12, 4:33=A0pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Apr 12, 3:51=A0pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_..=
.
>
> > GO NAVY!
>
> Go SEALS
> --
> "You can lead them to LINUX
> but you can't make them THINK"
> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/

Fantastic results.

DGDevin wrote:
> LRod wrote:
>
>
>> No, I'm guessing an overt military act like that pretty much
>> had to come from the Commander in Chief, just like in Jefferson's
>> day. I guess the implication is pretty clear, Obama does have balls,
>> and he deserves as much credit for it as Jefferson gets.
>
> According to news reports Obama twice authorized the military to use deadly
> force to resolve the situation, but no way will you see Obamaphobes giving
> him credit for that. If it had gone wrong and Capt. Phillips had been
> killed it would be a different story, then they'd be blaming Obama every
> hour on the hour, but since it was successful the President is out of the
> equation so far as they're concerned.

Oh pshaw.

> This is what we've come to, hyper-partisanship to the point of absurdity.

In which you're not also participating?

Ok, that's enough for me; I'll go back to waiting for the woodworking
threads now.

<waiting>
<waiting>

--
"Our beer goes through thousands of quality Czechs every day."
(From a Shiner Bock billboard I saw in Austin some years ago)
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Keel haul him. That is the old way. Effective.

Martin

Jack Stein wrote:
> Morris Dovey wrote:
>> Tom Veatch wrote:)
>>
>>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>>> that they were killed."
>>
>> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> I'm far more worried about torturing terrorists with naked pictures of
> themselves and other swine than blowing the heads off a couple of
> "pirates".
>

On Apr 15, 12:22=A0pm, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 15-Apr-2009, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
> > > warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
> > > instead of a bum. =A0We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because ther=
e were
> > > none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
>
> > When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy their
> > weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>
> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? =A0Or less of one?

Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.

J. Clarke wrote:
>>
>>
>> What happened to all those guys from Blackwater? Arene't a lot of
>> them unemployed these days? How much could it cost to put a few of
>> them on a merchant ship, with armament of their choice?
>
> You mean set a pirate to catch a pirate?

U.S. Constitution, Section 8

The Congress shall have the power... To ... grant Letters of Marque and
Reprisal*...

--------------
* A letter of marque is an official warrant or commission from a government
authorizing the designated agent to search, seize, or destroy specified
assets or personnel belonging to a foreign party which has committed some
offense under the laws of nations against the assets or citizens of the
issuing nation, and has usually been used to authorize private parties to
raid and capture merchant shipping of an enemy nation...

HeyBub wrote:
> Matt wrote:
>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says
>
> Outstanding!
>
> But you can't win this conflict on the sea, you have to destroy the nest
> that's on land.
>
> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home port
> which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's what we did in
> 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.
>
> Roosevelt: "The American people want Pedicaris alive or Raisuli dead...The
> fate of the nation will be decided by the American people in November, and
> the fate of Morocco will be decided tomorrow by me. And now, if you don't
> mind, I'd just like to be alone with my bear!"

Hostis humani generis

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Apr 15, 12:08=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> =A0 If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he'd
>
> > have been re-elected in a landslide,
>
> You are being funny right? =A0It was his total inability to be effective =
with
> every thing the =A0he was involved in that got him elected out of office.=
=A0The
> economy was the bigger problem.
>
> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>
> > warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
> > instead of a bum. =A0We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there =
were
> > none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
>
> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy their
> weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....

Nothing to hide. Hussein was just full of shit trying to intimidate
the area.

But I tell you Americans one thing: Don't even THINK of trying to
invade Sarnia, Ontario, because I have a 1 gigaton neutron particle
anihilator sword.

Robatoy wrote:
> On Apr 15, 12:08 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he'd
>>
>>> have been re-elected in a landslide,
>> You are being funny right? It was his total inability to be effective with
>> every thing the he was involved in that got him elected out of office. The
>> economy was the bigger problem.
>>
>> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>>
>>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
>>> instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there were
>>> none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
>> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy their
>> weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>
> Nothing to hide. Hussein was just full of shit trying to intimidate
> the area.
>
> But I tell you Americans one thing: Don't even THINK of trying to
> invade Sarnia, Ontario, because I have a 1 gigaton neutron particle
> anihilator sword.
That's Nuthin'. I gots a 5 giga-ohm computer desk!
gronk,
j4

On Apr 12, 3:51=A0pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...

GO NAVY!

On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:09:36 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Apr 12, 4:33 pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>> > On Apr 12, 3:51 pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...
>>
>> > GO NAVY!
>>
>> Go SEALS
>> --
>> "You can lead them to LINUX
>> but you can't make them THINK"
>> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
>> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/
>
>Fantastic results.


Yes, indeed!!!

There was a tongue-in-cheek opinion among Marines at the time of my
tour that the worst thing you could do is give a Swabbie a rifle and
run him up on the beach. I'm very happy to see a counter example to
that opinion. Well done, Navy!!!

Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
that they were killed."

Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA

Charlie Self wrote:
>>
>> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>
> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.

There were deficits under Bush, true. In his last year it was about $400
billion. A lot, but a robust economy could overcome that. Obama's 1st year
deficit is projected at $1.85 trillion (CBO).

In fact the 1st year Obama deficit alone is larger than the deficits for all
the Bush years combined. Obama's second year's deficit is projected at $1.4
trillion. The deficit drops a bit faster after that, the third year's
deficit a more modest $1 trillion.

The president has taken note of this, however. According to the Washington
post just today:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/19/AR2009041902009.html

The president has ordered his departments to come up with $100 million in
cuts. Considering the entire budget is $3.5 trillion, the cuts the president
proposes are equivalent to a family with a $75,000 income giving up two cups
of coffee. Or a family making $250,000 giving up one paperback book. Per
year.

"Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>> that they were killed."
>
> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...

Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk them
into another line of work. They could sell Amway instead.

They made the choice to play with guns.

"Swingman" wrote:

> Yep, you got that right ... but for a short span of time there would
> now be headlines screaming about Bush murdering 3 black,
> impoverished, muslim, Somalian teenager's.

Naw, he already has a full ration, they are members of the US
military.

Lew

Jack Stein wrote:
> HeyBub wrote:
>
>> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
>> Obama should get all the credit for killing the children.
>
> Not saying anything was done wrong, but seems to me if you can hook up a
> towline to the boat, you should have been able to do something other
> than blow the kids heads off. I wondered from the beginning why they
> couldn't just blow some holes in the boat. The boat was already dead in
> the water so these punks had little negotiating power. Sink the boat and
> 4 punks swimming 30 miles from shore seems like a weak bargaining
> position for the kids... Of course, if I were the pilot, I'd go for the
> head explosions, particularly after the fact.
>
> On that note, has anyone seen interviews of the pilot to get his in
> depth thoughts? I don't watch left wing media much, so I could have
> missed him...
>
Good idea except for one thing. The damn things are unsinkable.....

"Morris Dovey" wrote:

> An interesting observation. It might be even more interesting to
> discover the social conditions that have produced today's level of
> violence.

IMHO, it is parents who abdicate their parental responsibilities to
whatever will fill the time in the lives of these young people, rather
than doing the hard work of being a parent.

Lew

Swingman wrote:


>> This is what we've come to,
>> hyper-partisanship to the point of absurdity.
>
> Yep, you got that right ... but for a short span of time there would
> now be headlines screaming about Bush murdering 3 black, impoverished,
> muslim, Somalian teenager's.

Rubbish. I accept that the media as a whole leans liberal. But you seem to
have forgotten the NY Times cheerleading for the invasion of Iraq, to
pretend the media did nothing but attack Bush whether he deserved it or not
is not a credible position. There were certainly people prepared to believe
that if it rained on their birthday Bush was responsible, but there were at
least as many willing to cut his administration a mind-boggling amount of
slack. If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he'd
have been re-elected in a landslide, and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there were
none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.

"Charlie Self" wrote:

> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.

So true.

Lew

"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:0e09b307-48d1-4029-a457-014c5ef584c4@w40g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
On Apr 12, 10:12 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> >> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> >> that they were killed."
>
> > Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk
> them
> into another line of work. They could sell Amway instead.
>
> They made the choice to play with guns.

Snip

What I can't understand is how these impoverished people come by all
their AK47s and RPGs and other weapons, none of which, in operating
conditon, is cheap. Not to mention the ammo they seem to blast into
the air every few minutes to express anger, joy, dismay or peaceful
intent.


They had the ability to steal on the high seas, I imagine stealing what they
wanted on the ground may have been less trouble. They steal what they want
and need.

"DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...



If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he'd
> have been re-elected in a landslide,

You are being funny right? It was his total inability to be effective with
every thing the he was involved in that got him elected out of office. The
economy was the bigger problem.




and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
> instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there were
> none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.


When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy their
weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....

Charlie Self wrote:
>
> Sure, Amway. Something does need to be done to help improve conditions
> in the area, so that piracy is a less attractive option. With a few
> more operations such as the one yesterday, piracy is going to look
> less good to unemployed, and unemployable, youth, but there seem to be
> few other options avaiable.
>
> What I can't understand is how these impoverished people come by all
> their AK47s and RPGs and other weapons, none of which, in operating
> conditon, is cheap. Not to mention the ammo they seem to blast into
> the air every few minutes to express anger, joy, dismay or peaceful
> intent.

AK47s go for as little as $30 in most parts of the world (of course $30 is a
lot of money is most parts of the world). The weapon itself only has seven
moving parts and can be fabricated from scratch in most machine shops.

I have one and am impressed with how simple the sucker is. Search the web
and compare exploded diagrams for an AK47 and an AR15. Heck, even a modern
Smith & Wesson revolver has twice as many parts as an AK47!

AK47
http://www.ak47rifles.net/ak47rifleschematics.asp

AR15
http://www.dogfightink.com/ARparts.html


And, yes, there are machine shops in Somalia (and TV stations and
waffle-irons).

Charlie Self wrote:
> On Apr 12, 7:34 pm, Tom Veatch <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:09:36 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
>>
>>
>>
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> On Apr 12, 4:33 pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Robatoy wrote:
>>>>> On Apr 12, 3:51 pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...
>>>>> GO NAVY!
>>>> Go SEALS
>>>> --
>>>> "You can lead them to LINUX
>>>> but you can't make them THINK"
>>>> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
>>>> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/
>>> Fantastic results.
>> Yes, indeed!!!
>>
>> There was a tongue-in-cheek opinion among Marines at the time of my
>> tour that the worst thing you could do is give a Swabbie a rifle and
>> run him up on the beach. I'm very happy to see a counter example to
>> that opinion. Well done, Navy!!!
>>
>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>> that they were killed."
>>
>> Tom Veatch
>> Wichita, KS
>> USA
>
> Actually, as another former Marine, I am delighted that was a planned
> part of the operation. Let's the shits know what's in store for the
> next group, too.
>
> Semper fi!

It's good to see, even if only occasionally in this cultural climate
change, that if you fuck with the bull, you get the horns ...


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

HeyBub wrote:
> Charlie Self wrote:
>>> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
>> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.
>
> There were deficits under Bush, true. In his last year it was about $400
> billion. A lot, but a robust economy could overcome that. Obama's 1st year
> deficit is projected at $1.85 trillion (CBO).
>
> In fact the 1st year Obama deficit alone is larger than the deficits for all
> the Bush years combined. Obama's second year's deficit is projected at $1.4
> trillion. The deficit drops a bit faster after that, the third year's
> deficit a more modest $1 trillion.
>
> The president has taken note of this, however. According to the Washington
> post just today:
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/19/AR2009041902009.html
>
> The president has ordered his departments to come up with $100 million in
> cuts. Considering the entire budget is $3.5 trillion, the cuts the president
> proposes are equivalent to a family with a $75,000 income giving up two cups
> of coffee. Or a family making $250,000 giving up one paperback book. Per
> year.
>
>
$3.5 trillion is almost $10,000 for every person in the US or $40,000
for a family of four. Since the median household income is about
$50,000 a year...

Morris Dovey wrote:

> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.

The 9/11 perps weren't bloated belly, starving folks. On the contrary,
they seemed to be well educated, some of which education led to their
actions. The British bus bombers had a fairly good life situation other
than being led down the Islamic fundamentalist religious path...

"Morris Dovey" wrote:

> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a
> full belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.


That idea has been suggested to solve the world's aggression problems
for probably more years than either one of us have lived.

Only problem seems to be getting some agreement on how to implement
it.

Lew

Robatoy wrote:
> On Apr 15, 3:54 pm, "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Charlie Self wrote:
>>> On Apr 15, 12:22 pm, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> On 15-Apr-2009, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>>>>>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a
>>>>>> hero instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because
>>>>>> there were none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us
>>>>>> about it.
>>>>> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy
>>>>> their weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>>>> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>>> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
>>> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.
>> "Swaggering?" Heh! That's what Sadaam thought. We invaded his country,
>> evicted him from his homes, confiscated his money, exiled his family,
>> imprisoned his friends, killed his children, then, ultimately, had his
>> skanky ass hanged.
>>
>> As for "paying the bill," I'll remind you that the deficit under Obama's
>> first year is larger than the deficits of all the Bush years.
>>
>> Combined.
>>
>> Here's a graph:http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/files/2009/04/obamadebt.jpg
>
> Now, add the war costs to Bush's graphs....

And the $400 billion or so of the trust funds that are counted as
revenue and spent every year and replaced with an IOU which isn't
counted as an expenditure.

Interesting that the graph shows a surplus in 2000 and 2001, but the
national debt has increased each and every year since 1960.

HeyBub wrote:
> Charlie Self wrote:
>>> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
>> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.
>
> There were deficits under Bush, true. In his last year it was about $400
> billion. A lot, but a robust economy could overcome that. Obama's 1st year
> deficit is projected at $1.85 trillion (CBO).
>
> In fact the 1st year Obama deficit alone is larger than the deficits for all
> the Bush years combined. Obama's second year's deficit is projected at $1.4
> trillion. The deficit drops a bit faster after that, the third year's
> deficit a more modest $1 trillion.
>
> The president has taken note of this, however. According to the Washington
> post just today:
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/19/AR2009041902009.html
>
> The president has ordered his departments to come up with $100 million in
> cuts. Considering the entire budget is $3.5 trillion, the cuts the president
> proposes are equivalent to a family with a $75,000 income giving up two cups
> of coffee. Or a family making $250,000 giving up one paperback book. Per
> year.
>
>
There is a report circulating in the newspages that at the end of the
first half obama's deficit is over 900 billion dollars, principally
caused by the democrat passed stimulus bill.

Charlie Self wrote:
> On Apr 15, 12:22 pm, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On 15-Apr-2009, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>>>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a
>>>> hero instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because
>>>> there were none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us
>>>> about it.
>>
>>> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy
>>> their weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>>
>> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>
> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.

"Swaggering?" Heh! That's what Sadaam thought. We invaded his country,
evicted him from his homes, confiscated his money, exiled his family,
imprisoned his friends, killed his children, then, ultimately, had his
skanky ass hanged.

As for "paying the bill," I'll remind you that the deficit under Obama's
first year is larger than the deficits of all the Bush years.

Combined.

Here's a graph:
http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/files/2009/04/obamadebt.jpg

LRod wrote:


> No, I'm guessing an overt military act like that pretty much
> had to come from the Commander in Chief, just like in Jefferson's
> day. I guess the implication is pretty clear, Obama does have balls,
> and he deserves as much credit for it as Jefferson gets.

According to news reports Obama twice authorized the military to use deadly
force to resolve the situation, but no way will you see Obamaphobes giving
him credit for that. If it had gone wrong and Capt. Phillips had been
killed it would be a different story, then they'd be blaming Obama every
hour on the hour, but since it was successful the President is out of the
equation so far as they're concerned. This is what we've come to,
hyper-partisanship to the point of absurdity.

Lew Hodgett wrote:

>
> "Morris Dovey" wrote:
>
>> An interesting observation. It might be even more interesting to
>> discover the social conditions that have produced today's level of
>> violence.
>
> IMHO, it is parents who abdicate their parental responsibilities to
> whatever will fill the time in the lives of these young people, rather
> than doing the hard work of being a parent.
>
> Lew

Studies that take out inner-city gang violence indicate that violence is
no worse than it has ever been. So the question to be asking is why
inner-city violence has increased in the past decades. One question to aid
that inquiry is to ask what locations have been most subjected to removing
individual responsibility and substituting dependency upon government
handouts. When one is being taken care of by others, it reduces motivation
and self-respect. When you look at what the war on poverty has done to
inner city families, it is both tragic and criminal.

--
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

Morris Dovey wrote:
>
> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a
> full belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> I don't think removing four Somali pirates (or even blowing up a
> pirate HQ) is going to produce any noticeable change.
>

Uh, I don't think you can find a case where the hungry, the destitute, the
deprived of all hope, has, as a group, taken up arms to better their
condition.

It takes weapons, planning, and leadership to wage a war. But more
importantly, it takes calories. Despots don't retain power by providing a
society of plenty; they remain in control by making the populace weak. Weak
in spirit and in body.

"Only the hard and strong may call themselves Spartans. Only the hard. Only
the strong."

Matt wrote:
> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says

Outstanding!

But you can't win this conflict on the sea, you have to destroy the nest
that's on land.

They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home port
which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's what we did in
1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.

Roosevelt: "The American people want Pedicaris alive or Raisuli dead...The
fate of the nation will be decided by the American people in November, and
the fate of Morocco will be decided tomorrow by me. And now, if you don't
mind, I'd just like to be alone with my bear!"

Killing bankers won't stop the piracy. You have to cut the head off
of the snake and wipe the nest out.

The area has been a cess pool for years. The war lords killed off the
government and then couldn't decide who or how to run a government.

I say start them over.

Martin

Morris Dovey wrote:
> HeyBub wrote:
>
>> But you can't win this conflict on the sea, you have to destroy the
>> nest that's on land.
>
> Which nest - the one near Mudug or the ones at the other end of that
> location's (satellite) internet connection?
>
>> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home
>> port which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's
>> what we did in 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.
>
> Hmm - and how many hostages will that kill?
>
> CERN has satellite views available at
>
> http://unosat.web.cern.ch/unosat/freeproducts/somalia/Piracy/UNOSAT_SOM_Hijacked_Ships_Garacad_A2_Highres.pdf
>
>
> and I imagine the DOD birds provide considerably more detail.
>
> Perhaps it might be more productive to follow the internet traffic and
> the money - and then quietly convert the money-movers and the
> weapons-dealers to chum.
>
> 2c
>

Jack Stein wrote:
> mac davis wrote:
>
>> Just MHO, but if I was the hostage, I'd be praying for those snipers
>> to get it
>> done SOON..
>
> Me too.
>
>> I've been shot at and it ain't a lot of fun..
>> A 10 year old with an AK on full auto has got a pretty good chance of
>> hitting a
>> swimmer from a few yards away..
>
> The guy had already jumped in the water to swim away, and they didn't
> shoot him. My thought would be if the boat sank, they wouldn't shoot
> him either. Once they were in the water, 30 miles from shore, they
> probably would be looking more for rescue than looking to shoot someone.
> Didn't we already "rescue" one of the sick pirates?
>
>> Assuming a banana clip, he'd have 30 tries..
>
> but nowhere to go... Still, I agree, kill'em now would be my thoughts
> as a hostage... I wonder what he was thinking...
>
I believe that was the second time that he jumped overboard but the
snipers were not in position and the pirates forced him back into their
boat. What happened to the armed pirates was no different than what
would have happened to them if they were holding hostages in the US.

"Stuart" wrote:

> I believe that during WWII we had some special ships, just looked
> like
> ordinary merchant ships but with concealed armaments. Should deploy
> a few
> of those, wait for the pirates to turn up and blow the bastards out
> of the
> water - no questions asked.


Firearms leave a trail.

Give me a vessel equipped as a fire boat.

Wash the decks CLEAN with 1,500 GMM from an 8" nozzle.

About like washing bug splatter from the windshield of your car.

Ship would be clean with nothing to trace except sea water and you're
providing something for the sharks to investigate.

Lew

DGDevin wrote:

> This is what we've come to,
> hyper-partisanship to the point of absurdity.

Yep, you got that right ... but for a short span of time there would now
be headlines screaming about Bush murdering 3 black, impoverished,
muslim, Somalian teenager's.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Apr 12, 11:50=A0pm, "MikeWhy" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "evodawg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > Hey they started chewing that Weed which makes them higher then kites w=
hen
> > just infants. Most haven't a clue what they're doing. Guess you could s=
ay
> > they're the "Walking Dead".. So someone needs to stop them from
> > walking.
> > --
> > "You can lead them to LINUX
> > but you can't make them THINK"
>
> Say... Does anyone else see the irony?

Hard not to.

Leon wrote:
> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he'd
>> have been re-elected in a landslide,
>
> You are being funny right? It was his total inability to be
> effective with every thing the he was involved in that got him
> elected out of office. The economy was the bigger problem.
>

I dunno. Some think his response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan -
boycotting the Moscow Olympics - was a masterstroke of the unexpected.

Then there was the whole sordid business with the rabbit...

>
>
>
> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
>> instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there
>> were none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
>
>
> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy
> their weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....

On Apr 15, 2:45=A0pm, jo4hn <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Apr 15, 12:08 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> >>news:[email protected]...
>
> >> =A0 If Carter's attempted rescue of the hostages in Iran had worked he=
'd
>
> >>> have been re-elected in a landslide,
> >> You are being funny right? =A0It was his total inability to be effecti=
ve with
> >> every thing the =A0he was involved in that got him elected out of offi=
ce. =A0The
> >> economy was the bigger problem.
>
> >> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
>
> >>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
> >>> instead of a bum. =A0We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because ther=
e were
> >>> none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
> >> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy thei=
r
> >> weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>
> > Nothing to hide. Hussein was just full of shit trying to intimidate
> > the area.
>
> > But I tell you Americans one thing: Don't even THINK of trying to
> > invade Sarnia, Ontario, because I have a 1 gigaton neutron particle
> > anihilator sword.
>
> That's Nuthin'. =A0I gots a 5 giga-ohm computer desk!
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 gronk,
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 j4

Oh yea?? Well *I* gots a trebuchet and one of my ex's cheese-cakes!!
So there!

On Apr 13, 7:16=A0am, Charlie Self <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Apr 12, 10:12=A0pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > >> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> > >> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> > >> that they were killed."
>
> > > Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>
> > Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk =
them
> > into another line of work. =A0They could sell Amway instead.
>
> > They made the choice to play with guns.
>
> Sure, Amway. Something does need to be done to help improve conditions
> in the area, so that piracy is a less attractive option. With a few
> more operations such as the one yesterday, piracy is going to look
> less good to unemployed, and unemployable, youth, but there seem to be
> few other options avaiable.
>
> What I can't understand is how these impoverished people come by all
> their AK47s and RPGs and other weapons, none of which, in operating
> conditon, is cheap. Not to mention the ammo they seem to blast into
> the air every few minutes to express anger, joy, dismay or peaceful
> intent.

That could explain this?:

http://www.idahostatesman.com/worldnews/story/729917.html

There are always a few misguided people who think everything is stage-
craft. (AKA Never mind what it is..what does it LOOK like?)(AKA HOW
can we score political points with the tax-paying serfs so they keep
thinking we're all heroes?)

But *I* think that Ted Nugent's suggestion that if you drill a few car-
jackers, right through the door of your car, and putting a .45 on your
lap as you drive through bad areas of Detroit, had a LOT to do with
that car-jacking incident rate dropping like a stone. Nobody likes
their junk shot off.

THAT is change *I* can believe in.

On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 23:28:22 +0100, Stuart <[email protected]>
wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
> HeyBub <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home
>> port which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's what
>> we did in 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.
>
>They're probably spread out along the coast in all sorts of little hidden
>bays.
>
>I believe that during WWII we had some special ships, just looked like
>ordinary merchant ships but with concealed armaments. Should deploy a few
>of those, wait for the pirates to turn up and blow the bastards out of the
>water - no questions asked.


What happened to all those guys from Blackwater? Arene't a lot of
them unemployed these days? How much could it cost to put a few of
them on a merchant ship, with armament of their choice?

Reply-to address is real
John

On Apr 12, 7:34=A0pm, Tom Veatch <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:09:36 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
>
>
>
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >On Apr 12, 4:33=A0pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Robatoy wrote:
> >> > On Apr 12, 3:51=A0pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >>http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U=
_...
>
> >> > GO NAVY!
>
> >> Go SEALS
> >> --
> >> "You can lead them to LINUX
> >> but you can't make them THINK"
> >> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
> >> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/
>
> >Fantastic results.
>
> Yes, indeed!!!
>
> There was a tongue-in-cheek opinion among Marines at the time of my
> tour that the worst thing you could do is give a Swabbie a rifle and
> run him up on the beach. I'm very happy to see a counter example to
> that opinion. Well done, Navy!!!
>
> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> that they were killed."
>
> Tom Veatch
> Wichita, KS
> USA

Actually, as another former Marine, I am delighted that was a planned
part of the operation. Let's the shits know what's in store for the
next group, too.

Semper fi!

Steve Turner wrote:

>> According to news reports Obama twice authorized the military to use
>> deadly force to resolve the situation, but no way will you see
>> Obamaphobes giving him credit for that. If it had gone wrong and
>> Capt. Phillips had been killed it would be a different story, then
>> they'd be blaming Obama every hour on the hour, but since it was
>> successful the President is out of the equation so far as they're
>> concerned.
>
> Oh pshaw.

So if I'm wrong you should have no problem pointing me to those folks who
would normally crawl over broken glass for a chance to slam Obama but who
have given him credit for making the right call on this occasion.

<crickets>

>> This is what we've come to, hyper-partisanship to the point of
>> absurdity.
>
> In which you're not also participating?

Correct, I'm not. I have no problem criticizing the Obama administration
when it screws up, e.g. their incredibly idiotic proposal for making wounded
veterans use their own private health insurance to pay for their medical
care. That was one of the worst plans ever to come out of Washington, the
home planet for bad plans, the only bright spot is they quickly dropped it
when even their own party treated it with the contempt it deserved. However
unlike some folks I'm also prepared to give them credit when they get it
right, that's the difference.

> Ok, that's enough for me; I'll go back to waiting for the woodworking
> threads now.
>
> <waiting>
> <waiting>

I visited the College of the Redwoods fine woodworking campus last week. I
think I saw some future stars in their formative years--very cool place.

On Apr 15, 3:54=A0pm, "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Charlie Self wrote:
> > On Apr 15, 12:22 pm, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> On 15-Apr-2009, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >>> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
> >>>> warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a
> >>>> hero instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because
> >>>> there were none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us
> >>>> about it.
>
> >>> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy
> >>> their weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....
>
> >> Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?
>
> > Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
> > to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.
>
> "Swaggering?" Heh! That's what Sadaam thought. We invaded his country,
> evicted him from his homes, confiscated his money, exiled his family,
> imprisoned his friends, killed his children, then, ultimately, had his
> skanky ass hanged.
>
> As for "paying the bill," I'll remind you that the deficit under Obama's
> first year is larger than the deficits of all the Bush years.
>
> Combined.
>
> Here's a graph:http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/files/2009/04/obamadeb=
t.jpg

Now, add the war costs to Bush's graphs....

On Apr 13, 3:45=A0pm, "David G. Nagel" <[email protected]>
wrote:
> Stuart wrote:
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > =A0 =A0Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a ful=
l
> >> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> > Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|
>
> Case in point is Ossama bin Laden. His family is one of the richest in
> Saudi Arabia.

In most other societies, he'd be in a padded cell, talking to others
through a mike.

HeyBub wrote:

> Matt wrote:
>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says
>
> Outstanding!
>
> But you can't win this conflict on the sea, you have to destroy the
> nest that's on land.
>
> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home
> port which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's
> what we did in 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.

The day in which it is possible to annihilate villages full of women and
children because some bad guys are based there is probably passed, at least
for America. So while this idea would probably be quite successful it isn't
about to happen. What might be effective is the use of Q-ships such as the
British invented in WWI. An assortment of helpless-looking commercial
vessels, yachts etc. concealing Special Forces teams augmented with some
heavier metal would result in pirate vessels never returning home and with
no explanation being apparent. The element of uncertainty would be
discouraging....

Of course so long as Somalia is a hell-hole with no effective government and
famine, disease etc. being commonplace then there will be no shortage of men
willing to risk all for almost unimaginable fortunes by their reckoning.

Robatoy wrote:

> On Apr 12, 3:51 pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...
>
> GO NAVY!
Go SEALS
--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.biz/

Tom Veatch wrote:

> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:09:36 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Apr 12, 4:33 pm, evodawg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Robatoy wrote:
>>> > On Apr 12, 3:51 pm, "Matt" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_...
>>>
>>> > GO NAVY!
>>>
>>> Go SEALS
>>> --
>>> "You can lead them to LINUX
>>> but you can't make them THINK"
>>> Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
>>> Website Addresshttp://rentmyhusband.biz/
>>
>>Fantastic results.
>
>
> Yes, indeed!!!
>
> There was a tongue-in-cheek opinion among Marines at the time of my
> tour that the worst thing you could do is give a Swabbie a rifle and
> run him up on the beach. I'm very happy to see a counter example to
> that opinion. Well done, Navy!!!
>
> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> that they were killed."
>
> Tom Veatch
> Wichita, KS
> USA

Good that they kept one alive. Now all they need is Jack Bauer to extract
some info out of him. Oh I forgot Obama's words "we don't torture"..
Shucks!!!

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.biz/

Morris Dovey wrote:

> Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>>>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>>>> that they were killed."
>>> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>>
>> Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk
>> them
>> into another line of work. They could sell Amway instead.
>
> Yessir... and Mary Kay Cosmetics, and Tupperware, and Avon, and...
> encyclopedias. Especially encyclopedias. Burial plots, too.
>
>> They made the choice to play with guns.
>
> Yeah, although I wonder how many of 'em had wanted to be pirates when
> they grew up...
>

Hey they started chewing that Weed which makes them higher then kites when
just infants. Most haven't a clue what they're doing. Guess you could say
they're the "Walking Dead".. So someone needs to stop them from
walking..Specially if they're walking with a rifle.

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.biz/

John wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 23:28:22 +0100, Stuart <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> HeyBub <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> They've got one survivor. He can be encouraged to divulge their home
>>> port which, about a half-hour later, should cease to exist. That's
>>> what we did in 1802 and 1907. That's what we should do now.
>>
>> They're probably spread out along the coast in all sorts of little
>> hidden bays.
>>
>> I believe that during WWII we had some special ships, just looked
>> like ordinary merchant ships but with concealed armaments. Should
>> deploy a few of those, wait for the pirates to turn up and blow the
>> bastards out of the water - no questions asked.
>
>
> What happened to all those guys from Blackwater? Arene't a lot of
> them unemployed these days? How much could it cost to put a few of
> them on a merchant ship, with armament of their choice?

You mean set a pirate to catch a pirate?

In article <[email protected]>,
HeyBub <[email protected]> wrote:
>Charlie Self wrote:
<...snipped...>
>I have one and am impressed with how simple the sucker is. Search the web
>and compare exploded diagrams for an AK47 and an AR15. Heck, even a modern
>Smith & Wesson revolver has twice as many parts as an AK47!
>
>AK47
>http://www.ak47rifles.net/ak47rifleschematics.asp
>
>AR15
>http://www.dogfightink.com/ARparts.html
<...snipped...>

Perhaps the AK parts are simpler than the AR, but surprisingly, according to
the drawings in the links, the AK has more parts than the AR.


--
Better to be stuck up in a tree than tied to one.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org

In article <[email protected]>,
HeyBub <[email protected]> wrote:
<...snipped...>
>--------------
>* A letter of marque is an official warrant or commission from a government
>authorizing the designated agent to search, seize, or destroy specified
>assets or personnel belonging to a foreign party which has committed some
>offense under the laws of nations against the assets or citizens of the
>issuing nation, and has usually been used to authorize private parties to
>raid and capture merchant shipping of an enemy nation...
<...snipped...>

Interesting trivia: The only letter of marque issued since the war of 1812
was for a dirigible used to patrol for submarines during WW2.




--
Better to be stuck up in a tree than tied to one.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org

On 15-Apr-2009, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:

> "DGDevin" <[email protected]> wrote in message

> and if those WMDs in Iraq we were
> > warned about had really been there Bush would have left office a hero
> > instead of a bum. We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there were
> > none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.
>
> When you tell your enemy that you are going to invade and destroy their
> weapons AND give them 6 months to hide them....

Thus making Bush more of a bum...? Or less of one?

LRod wrote:

> The one thing I find disturbing in all this is that the neo-cons have
> been whining for years that liberals are soft on everything.

The "neo-cons" are very wrong. Socialists have been killing people by
the millions for years. Think of Hitler, Stalin, Mao and others. I
would expect Obama to have no trouble exploding heads of folks getting
in his way...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

HeyBub wrote:

> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct, Obama
> should get all the credit for killing the children.

Not saying anything was done wrong, but seems to me if you can hook up a
towline to the boat, you should have been able to do something other
than blow the kids heads off. I wondered from the beginning why they
couldn't just blow some holes in the boat. The boat was already dead in
the water so these punks had little negotiating power. Sink the boat and
4 punks swimming 30 miles from shore seems like a weak bargaining
position for the kids... Of course, if I were the pilot, I'd go for the
head explosions, particularly after the fact.

On that note, has anyone seen interviews of the pilot to get his in
depth thoughts? I don't watch left wing media much, so I could have
missed him...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

J. Clarke wrote:

>> What happened to all those guys from Blackwater? Arene't a lot of
>> them unemployed these days? How much could it cost to put a few of
>> them on a merchant ship, with armament of their choice?
>
> You mean set a pirate to catch a pirate?

You mean if you defend yourself from attack, you become an attacker?

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Stuart wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:

>> It struck me some time ago that anyone with a healthy family and a full
>> belly was unlikely to pick up a gun or strap on a suicide vest.
>
> Unless motivated by religious extremism >-|

Seems the most popular reason to pick up a gun is socialism. Think of
the National Socialist Party of Germany (Nazi's) or Stalin, or Mao. The
second most popular reason to pick up a gun is to fight the socialists
trying to kill everyone. I was born just after WWII, but no one in my
circle of family or friends that picked up a weapon to fight Hitlers
socialist party were very hungry. Come to think of it, no one I know
that are picking up guns to fight in Iraq or Afghanistan are very hungry
either.

Come to think of it some more, and in the US during the depression, when
people were a bit hungry, violent crime was nothing like it is today,
after the War on Poverty put a chicken in every pot....

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

DGDevin wrote:

> Rubbish. I accept that the media as a whole leans liberal.

Not difficult to accept! Well, Bush is a liberal, the media is more
socialist or, Obama-like.

> We haven't heard about WMDs in Iraq because there were
> none to be found, not because the media didn't tell us about it.

I think there were a list of reasons, 9 perhaps, that we decided to go
into Iraq. The left wing UN, and left wing US congress approved. The
potential for WMD's was just one of the reasons. The media made certain
to beat the WMD thing to death and insure it made Bush look bad, even
though about everyone on earth thought IRAQ had WMD's, and had little
problem with the other bunch of reasons for going into Iraq.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Morris Dovey wrote:
> Tom Veatch wrote:)
>
>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
>> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
>> that they were killed."
>
> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...

I'm far more worried about torturing terrorists with naked pictures of
themselves and other swine than blowing the heads off a couple of
"pirates".

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

evodawg wrote:

> Good that they kept one alive. Now all they need is Jack Bauer to extract
> some info out of him. Oh I forgot Obama's words "we don't torture"..
> Shucks!!!

Hey, I'm willing to send them a naked picture of ME if they are willing
to show it to the bastard!

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Robatoy wrote:

> WTF is next? Our friends the Saudis allow marriage to an 8-year old.
> Why wouldn't somebody from over there arm a 9-year old to " get
> himself a few of those capitalist pigs"?
> Just when you think mankind couldn't sink any lower....guess what?

Yeah, no more "capitalist pigs" just us socialist pigs...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

HeyBub wrote:
> Doug Winterburn wrote:
>> And the $400 billion or so of the trust funds that are counted as
>> revenue and spent every year and replaced with an IOU which isn't
>> counted as an expenditure.
>>
>> Interesting that the graph shows a surplus in 2000 and 2001, but the
>> national debt has increased each and every year since 1960.
>
> Rounding error.

Whats a few trillion here and there?

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Charlie Self" wrote:
>
>> Bush is a swaggering loudmouth who knows that he isn't going to have
> to pay the bill, be it economic or physical.
>
> So true.

Obama is a "community organizer" so I reckon he will be paying the bills...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

HeyBub wrote:

> As for "paying the bill," I'll remind you that the deficit under Obama's
> first year is larger than the deficits of all the Bush years.
>
> Combined.

But... Obama is a "Community Organizer" so he WILL feel your pain...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

mac davis wrote:

> Just MHO, but if I was the hostage, I'd be praying for those snipers to get it
> done SOON..

Me too.

> I've been shot at and it ain't a lot of fun..
> A 10 year old with an AK on full auto has got a pretty good chance of hitting a
> swimmer from a few yards away..

The guy had already jumped in the water to swim away, and they didn't
shoot him. My thought would be if the boat sank, they wouldn't shoot
him either. Once they were in the water, 30 miles from shore, they
probably would be looking more for rescue than looking to shoot someone.
Didn't we already "rescue" one of the sick pirates?

> Assuming a banana clip, he'd have 30 tries..

but nowhere to go... Still, I agree, kill'em now would be my thoughts
as a hostage... I wonder what he was thinking...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

David G. Nagel wrote:
> Jack Stein wrote:
>> HeyBub wrote:
>>
>>> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
>>> Obama should get all the credit for killing the children.
>>
>> Not saying anything was done wrong, but seems to me if you can hook up
>> a towline to the boat, you should have been able to do something other
>> than blow the kids heads off. I wondered from the beginning why they
>> couldn't just blow some holes in the boat. The boat was already dead
>> in the water so these punks had little negotiating power. Sink the
>> boat and 4 punks swimming 30 miles from shore seems like a weak
>> bargaining position for the kids... Of course, if I were the pilot,
>> I'd go for the head explosions, particularly after the fact.
>>
>> On that note, has anyone seen interviews of the pilot to get his in
>> depth thoughts? I don't watch left wing media much, so I could have
>> missed him...
>>
> Good idea except for one thing. The damn things are unsinkable.....


Just like the Titanic:-)

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

HeyBub wrote:

> The president has taken note of this, however. According to the Washington
> post just today:
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/19/AR2009041902009.html
>
> The president has ordered his departments to come up with $100 million in
> cuts. Considering the entire budget is $3.5 trillion, the cuts the president
> proposes are equivalent to a family with a $75,000 income giving up two cups
> of coffee. Or a family making $250,000 giving up one paperback book. Per
> year.

No pain, no gain...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Doug Winterburn wrote:

> $3.5 trillion is almost $10,000 for every person in the US or $40,000
> for a family of four. Since the median household income is about
> $50,000 a year...

No one should need more than 64K memory, or $10 grand a year to live on.
I think Obama should tax any income over 10 grand at 90%... Perhaps
then his rich bitch wife could no longer afford those $400 lunches I
heard about on the internet...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

Keith Nuttle wrote:

> There is a report circulating in the newspages that at the end of the
> first half obama's deficit is over 900 billion dollars, principally
> caused by the democrat passed stimulus bill.

What better way to stimulate the economy than to put it into bankruptcy?

Perhaps the fruit cakes in California can help us some...

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

On Tue, 14 Apr 2009 14:03:57 -0500, "HeyBub" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct, Obama
>should get all the credit for killing the children.

I'm not sure where you're going with that, but a 10 year old kid with
a grenade or AK47 or whatever, can kill you just as dead as an adult.
When the individual is armed and actively threatening, age is the last
consideration.

Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 09:18:52 -0500, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:

>HeyBub wrote:
>
>> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct, Obama
>> should get all the credit for killing the children.
>
>Not saying anything was done wrong, but seems to me if you can hook up a
>towline to the boat, you should have been able to do something other
>than blow the kids heads off. I wondered from the beginning why they
>couldn't just blow some holes in the boat. The boat was already dead in
>the water so these punks had little negotiating power. Sink the boat and
> 4 punks swimming 30 miles from shore seems like a weak bargaining
>position for the kids... Of course, if I were the pilot, I'd go for the
>head explosions, particularly after the fact.
>
>On that note, has anyone seen interviews of the pilot to get his in
>depth thoughts? I don't watch left wing media much, so I could have
>missed him...

Just MHO, but if I was the hostage, I'd be praying for those snipers to get it
done SOON..
I've been shot at and it ain't a lot of fun..
A 10 year old with an AK on full auto has got a pretty good chance of hitting a
swimmer from a few yards away..
Assuming a banana clip, he'd have 30 tries..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

HeyBub wrote:
> Doug Winterburn wrote:
>> And the $400 billion or so of the trust funds that are counted as
>> revenue and spent every year and replaced with an IOU which isn't
>> counted as an expenditure.
>>
>> Interesting that the graph shows a surplus in 2000 and 2001, but the
>> national debt has increased each and every year since 1960.
>
> Rounding error.
>
>
Yup, a $300+ billion one - every year...

Doug Winterburn wrote:
>
> And the $400 billion or so of the trust funds that are counted as
> revenue and spent every year and replaced with an IOU which isn't
> counted as an expenditure.
>
> Interesting that the graph shows a surplus in 2000 and 2001, but the
> national debt has increased each and every year since 1960.

Rounding error.

Morris Dovey wrote:
> Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that
>>>> pirates were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a
>>>> royal shit that they were killed."
>>> Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
>>
>> Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should
>> talk them into another line of work. They could sell Amway instead.
>
> Yessir... and Mary Kay Cosmetics, and Tupperware, and Avon, and...
> encyclopedias. Especially encyclopedias. Burial plots, too.
>
>> They made the choice to play with guns.
>
> Yeah, although I wonder how many of 'em had wanted to be pirates when
> they grew up...

It was either that or corporate CEO. Oh, wait...they're the same.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Tue, 14 Apr 2009 14:48:07 -0500, Tom Veatch <[email protected]> wrote:


>When the individual is armed and actively threatening, age is the last
>consideration.

It's not last. It's not on the list of considerations.



--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net
http://www.normstools.com

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.

"evodawg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> Hey they started chewing that Weed which makes them higher then kites when
> just infants. Most haven't a clue what they're doing. Guess you could say
> they're the "Walking Dead".. So someone needs to stop them from
> walking.
> --
> "You can lead them to LINUX
> but you can't make them THINK"

Say... Does anyone else see the irony?

On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 15:51:39 -0400, "Matt" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>http://digg.com/world_news/American_captain_rescued_pirates_killed_U_S_official_says


The one thing I find disturbing in all this is that the neo-cons have
been whining for years that liberals are soft on everything. I saw a
post on one of the other message boards yesterday that said:

"The last time we had a US President with the balls to face
down pirates..."

followed by a link to an article, no doubt about Jefferson
and the Barbary pirates, and nothing else.

So, let me see if I have this straight:

Who ordered the SEALs in? The battalion commander?
The captain of the ship carrying them? Southern Command?
SecNav? DefSec?

No, I'm guessing an overt military act like that pretty much
had to come from the Commander in Chief, just like in Jefferson's
day. I guess the implication is pretty clear, Obama does have balls,
and he deserves as much credit for it as Jefferson gets.





--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net
http://www.normstools.com

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.

On 2009-04-12, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:

> Hostis humani generis

aquia plankto terrapostualus!

nb

In article <[email protected]>, Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:

>There is apparently some reason to believe that the pirate operations
>have been funded at least in part by wealthy parties - and should that
>be proven true, I think that their complete assets should be taken to
>compensate first the shipping companies for the ransoms and losses due
>to having their vessels out of service, secondly the hostage crew
>members for their time in captivity, and thirdly any assets left over
>should be used under UN supervision to improve conditions in Somalia -
>perhaps starting with repatriation and restoration of some semblance of
>normal (pre-genocide) life in the Darfur region.

Improving conditions in Somalia, while a laudable goal, has nothing to do with
the genocide in Darfur, which is some 3000km, and two international borders,
to the west in Sudan.

On Mon, 13 Apr 2009 05:50:10 -0500, Swingman wrote:

> Well done, Morris! ... and while you should be commended for both the
> hard work and altruism, it's a damned shame that there are more and more
> folks who would prefer that you do the work and then provide them with
> the fruits of *your* labor, gratis.

And therein lies the problem. You're doing a good job Morris, but there
will always be people like the ones described above. And the fanatics
who think killing _____________ will get them a ticket to paradise.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

Charlie Self wrote:

> On Apr 12, 10:12 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > "Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > >> Saw one news blurb that almost apologetically mentioned that pirates
> > >> were killed in the rescue. My reaction was "Who gives a royal shit
> > >> that they were killed."
> >
> > > Probably neither you nor I - but their families might...
> >
> > Right Morris, but if the families are that concerned, they should talk them
> > into another line of work.  They could sell Amway instead.
> >
> > They made the choice to play with guns.
>
> Sure, Amway. Something does need to be done to help improve conditions
> in the area, so that piracy is a less attractive option. With a few
> more operations such as the one yesterday, piracy is going to look
> less good to unemployed, and unemployable, youth, but there seem to be
> few other options avaiable.
>
> What I can't understand is how these impoverished people come by all
> their AK47s and RPGs and other weapons, none of which, in operating
> conditon, is cheap. Not to mention the ammo they seem to blast into
> the air every few minutes to express anger, joy, dismay or peaceful
> intent.

AKs are one of the most copied weapons in the world , china makes millions of them .

The old soviet block and the west have supplied weapons and ammunition to the varous
African states for decades.

Morris Dovey wrote:
> http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/Journey.html
>
> I'm hoping the pump will help irrigate the crops to fill more bellies
> and so help families to be healthier - and maybe, just maybe, help
> reduce some of that desperation.
>
> Anyone who'd like to join in is welcome.

Well done, Morris! ... and while you should be commended for both the
hard work and altruism, it's a damned shame that there are more and more
folks who would prefer that you do the work and then provide them with
the fruits of *your* labor, gratis.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Jack Stein wrote:
> David G. Nagel wrote:
>> Jack Stein wrote:
>>> HeyBub wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm with you. If some news reports of the pirates ages are correct,
>>>> Obama should get all the credit for killing the children.
>>>
>>> Not saying anything was done wrong, but seems to me if you can hook
>>> up a towline to the boat, you should have been able to do something
>>> other than blow the kids heads off. I wondered from the beginning
>>> why they couldn't just blow some holes in the boat. The boat was
>>> already dead in the water so these punks had little negotiating
>>> power. Sink the boat and 4 punks swimming 30 miles from shore seems
>>> like a weak bargaining position for the kids... Of course, if I were
>>> the pilot, I'd go for the head explosions, particularly after the fact.
>>>
>>> On that note, has anyone seen interviews of the pilot to get his in
>>> depth thoughts? I don't watch left wing media much, so I could have
>>> missed him...
>>>
>> Good idea except for one thing. The damn things are unsinkable.....
>
>
> Just like the Titanic:-)
>
No, the RMS Titanic sideswiped an iceberg and ripped the hull open.
There is absolutely no flotation material in the ship. A modern life
boat hull is composed of flotation material. Even if holed as bad as
Captain Smith's command the life boat won't sink. If broken into small
pieces you can use the chunks as flotation devices.