If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane and
a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top? I've
laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
buy a better one to begin with.
What do you think?
Thanks,
Mike W.
I think this'll do it:
rec.woodworking drop nntp-posting-host:.*206.216.48
HTH
On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 16:54:35 -0400, "Montyhp" <montyhp at yahoo.com>
wrote:
>Can someone translate this to an Nfilter statement for us?
>
>montyhp
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> posted from:
>>
>> NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.216.48.105
>>
>>
>> This is "IGC.NET" the problem-child appears to be in NY state
>> (probably in the Long Island area).
>>
>> Filtering on "206.216.48" anywhere in the headers will suppress this
>guy,
>> without affecting the legit messages posted through Google.
>>
>>
>> and, of course:
>>
>> X-Complaints-To: [email protected]
>>
>>
>> is good advice.
>>
>
For "Mike W."
I'll second "Morgans" suggestion. I used SYP for my bench top ('though I did use
2x4's). However, I did joint and plane them square before the glue up. The
suggestion to rip off the rounded corners is a good one, 'though I'd recommend a
complete squaring up operation.
When you do the glue up, be sure to pay attention to the grain direction. On an
end view of the table, alternate the annual ring direction - ()()()()() instead
of ((((((((. May not do much to prevent warping in this kind of stack, but it's
cheap to do and can't hurt. In a side view, make sure the grain in each stick
slopes the same direction. If some slopes up to the right, and some slopes down
toward the right, when time comes to plane the top and renew the surface, no
matter which way you go, your will be planing against the grain on some of the
boards.
Good luck. I've been quite satisfied with my 2x4 laminated SYP benchtop.
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 15:34:07 -0400, "Morgans" <[email protected]> wrote:
=>
=>"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
=>news:[email protected]...
=>> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
=>and
=>> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
=>I've
=>> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
=>> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
=>> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
=>>
=>> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
=>> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
=>> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
=>>
=>> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
=>> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
=>> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
=>> buy a better one to begin with.
=>>
=>> What do you think?
=>>
=>> Thanks,
=>> Mike W.
=>>
=>>
=>Spf is too soft for a decent bench. If you want to stay softwood, go to the
=>lumberyard, and get some #1 Yellow Pine 2 x 10. You can rip it and glue it
=>up, but the 2 x 10 is around for use as floor joists. Let it air dry for a
=>while before working it flat.
Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
Thanks for the advice.
One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started? I have 5
laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that. I
just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence before
it would help.
Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact, I
don't have a hand plane yet either.
What plane do you suggest I start with?
Thanks,
Mike W
"Mike" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
and
> > a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
I've
> > laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> > rounded its not so good.
>
> I'm building a bench like that and I'm almost ready to add the vise
> hardware. Don't worry too much about the rounded corners as you'll
> probably remove most of that material as you flatten the top. The
> bigger concern for me (which I failed to notice while doing the glue
> up) is that the many of the boards I used were slightly thinner at the
> ends; probably from the milling process. This wasn't a big deal on
> individual boards but it added up after several boards, making a
> noticable curve along the edge. I had planned on a full 8 foot length
> bench so, if I were to do it again, I'd start with 10' lumber with the
> anticipation of cutting approx. 1 foot off each end.
>
> I've almost got the top flat using just a jack plane but I plan to get
> some further workout using a #8C for the final touches. As Bob Keys
> says in his website (paraphrased): Build your first bench *now*.
> Then you can use what you've learned as the basis for your future
> dream bench.
>
> > But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> > grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
> >
> > I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So
I
> > was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a
go
> > at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
> >
> > I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but
with
> > the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> > 2x8s.
>
> If you plane to use the 2x8 for a tool well, be very mindful of the
> curvature I mentioned above. That caused a big delay in my progress.
>
> > I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> > buy a better one to begin with.
>
> Why cheapo? For $35, you can probably find a nice plane and if you
> add another $20 to $30 you can almost guarantee finding a nice plane;
> provided you do your homework. Before you buy, consult the wreck for
> guidance.
>
> > What do you think?
>
> I think you're going to have a great opportunity to get *alot* of
> practice with wooddorking techniques and end up with a very useable
> bench in the process. Have fun and good luck!
>
> Cheers,
> Mike
Mike W. wrote:
>
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top? I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
>
> What do you think?
Time is money. Go with Douglas fir instead of cheap spruce 2x's if
possible. If you're stuck with spruce, use 2x8's and rip in half. That
discards the inner heartwood portion (aka "star shakes"), relieving
tension and creating more stable, near-quarter sawn, timbers.
Short answer, yes.
If you have a table saw, its faster to cut 1/8 inch off 2 sides to
make square corners, then finish flattening once you've glued them up.
If you plane the 2x4's to square prior to glueing up, its a lot
easier.
(I just made a stand for my lathe by glueing up 2x4's to make a bench
type top. (face glued, to make a top 3 inches thick, 18 inches wide).
Didn't make the 2x4's square prior to glueing up. Seemed to take for
ever to flatten the top.---I made the 2x4's square prior to glueing up
the legs, made life much easier)
tim
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top? I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike W.
Mike, my Dear Buttercup! Did your Daddy ever teach you that sometimes
you need to spend a little more to attain quality? Or did you become a
cheapskate on your own? Do you have a Jewish background?
"Life aint nothin' but twinks and chinks!" (Sexy gay young men and
Chinese food!) -JOAT (Jerk-Off All Twinks)
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 18:22:22 GMT, "Mike W." <[email protected]>
wrote:
>I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
>was thinking about making my bench top out of them...
Save your time, spend some more money. Make your stacked softwood
top, but stick a layer of 3/4" ply over the top, and a layer of 4mm
MDF over that. Replace the MDF if it gets chewed in a few years time.
--
Die Gotterspammerung - Junkmail of the Gods
In article <[email protected]>,
Mike W. <[email protected]> wrote:
>Thanks for that great advice. I ran a couple scrap pieces through that I
>brad nailed to a small piece of craft wood I had and it looks great. I
>glued them together to see how it was and WOW. That will save me a ton of
>time with a planer.
glad to help! ;)
> Now I just need to get a board that is straight and 72"
>long to use with the full size 2x4s that I have. I'll also have to work out
>a way to put a 2x4 'sideways' on it to get 2 sides squared. Perhaps a jig?
Doesn't have to be a jig -- reel or hornpipe, or even a waltz, foxtrot, or
tango; whatever works *FOR*YOU* <muffled guffaw>
Seriously, a jig cum carrier sounds like a viable approach. something a
bit longer than your longest pieces, with a couple of protruding sections,
one on each end, at 'just the right distance apart'. brad-nail through
them, into the ends of the 'target' material, and run the whole mess through
the saw. sorta like this:
(fixed-pitch font -- e.g. 'system', assumed for viewing:
"
"
"
"
v
=====|
+---+ |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+ + |
+---+ |
=====|
^
This is just a standard 'taper jig', bing used for a 'zero taper'. <grin>
>
>I'm gonna scrap the pieces that I've glued up so far... after seeing the
>results this way I think that the time I'll save will be worth it if I have
>a to buy a few more 2x's. I'm not as cheap as I sound... I'm just being
>careful with this hobby as I have been in and out of many expensive hobbies
>in my lifetime with little but a few expensive toys to show for it. I want
>to work my way into it.
>
>Thanks again!
>Mike W.
>
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> Mike W. <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >Thanks for the advice.
>> >
>> >One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
>> >the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
>> >better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
>> >
>> >Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
>> >
>> >Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
>> >
>> >Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started? I have
>5
>> >laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that.
>I
>> >just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
>> >was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence
>before
>> >it would help.
>>
>> A straight edge against the fence is *not* an absolute requirement. Yes,
>it
>> *does* make life a 'whole bunch' simpler, but is not an absolute
>necessity.
>>
>> Two approaches:
>> 1) *IF* the board is 'short', relative to the length of the fence on the
>> saw, *AND* if the board has a single "simple" curve to it -- i.e. it
>is
>> 'bowed out' on one side, with a corresponding 'bow in' on the
>other --
>> make the 1st pass with the "bowed in" side against the fence. This
>> _should_ have just the 'ends' of the bowed part touching the fence
>(with
>> a gap in the middle of the board), so you'll have a *consistent* path
>for
>> the board as it goes by the blade. Eureka! You've now got a straight
>> edge on the side that went by the blade. Turn the piece over, and
>cut
>> the _other_ edge. Voila! _two_ straight and parallel edges.
>> 2) if it's a long board, or there is more 'complex' curvature to the
>> board -- e.g. 's-curves', or worse -- then the above doesn't work so
>> well. The 'do it right' solution is to use a 'carrier' piece (which
>> *does* have a straight edge, -or- has 'two-point-of-contact' with the
>> fence) to provide the guiding contact with the fence, *and* supports
>> the piece being cut. A piece of Masonite, particle board, or
>'whatever'
>> that you might have lying around will work fine -- as long as it is
>wide
>> enough to let you 'tack it down' (some way, that is; *any* method
>that
>> works is fine :) to the piece you're trying to cut, _with_ the
>straight
>> edge extending out past the 'back side' of it, for the entire length
>of
>> the board. This gets you one straight edge on the board, now you can
>> remove it from the carrier, and use that straight edge against the
>> fence to make the other edge straight. This stuff isn't difficult,
>merely
>> a matter of 'out-thinking the materials you work with'. <grin>
>> >
>> >Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact,
>I
>> >don't have a hand plane yet either.
>> >What plane do you suggest I start with?
>> >
>> >Thanks,
>> >Mike W
>> >
>
>
In article <[email protected]>,
Mike W. <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>Thanks for the advice.
>
>One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
>the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
>better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
>
>Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
>
>Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
>
>Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started? I have 5
>laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that. I
>just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
>was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence before
>it would help.
A straight edge against the fence is *not* an absolute requirement. Yes, it
*does* make life a 'whole bunch' simpler, but is not an absolute necessity.
Two approaches:
1) *IF* the board is 'short', relative to the length of the fence on the
saw, *AND* if the board has a single "simple" curve to it -- i.e. it is
'bowed out' on one side, with a corresponding 'bow in' on the other --
make the 1st pass with the "bowed in" side against the fence. This
_should_ have just the 'ends' of the bowed part touching the fence (with
a gap in the middle of the board), so you'll have a *consistent* path for
the board as it goes by the blade. Eureka! You've now got a straight
edge on the side that went by the blade. Turn the piece over, and cut
the _other_ edge. Voila! _two_ straight and parallel edges.
2) if it's a long board, or there is more 'complex' curvature to the
board -- e.g. 's-curves', or worse -- then the above doesn't work so
well. The 'do it right' solution is to use a 'carrier' piece (which
*does* have a straight edge, -or- has 'two-point-of-contact' with the
fence) to provide the guiding contact with the fence, *and* supports
the piece being cut. A piece of Masonite, particle board, or 'whatever'
that you might have lying around will work fine -- as long as it is wide
enough to let you 'tack it down' (some way, that is; *any* method that
works is fine :) to the piece you're trying to cut, _with_ the straight
edge extending out past the 'back side' of it, for the entire length of
the board. This gets you one straight edge on the board, now you can
remove it from the carrier, and use that straight edge against the
fence to make the other edge straight. This stuff isn't difficult, merely
a matter of 'out-thinking the materials you work with'. <grin>
>
>Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact, I
>don't have a hand plane yet either.
>What plane do you suggest I start with?
>
>Thanks,
>Mike W
>
UPDATE: he's posting through random hosts in the ICG netblock. presumably
a dial-up-connection.
The following nFilter magic will catch all the ICG hosts
You *WILL* need to have 'enable regular expressions' selected in the
configuration panel.
rec.woodworking drop nntp-posting-host:.*206\.216\.[456]
For those who care, the 'general form' of an nFilter incantation is:
newsgroup_name action header:matchstring
The usual 'action' is 'drop', you can also 'flag', or 'score' see the manual
'header' is the header you want to filter on,
and 'matchstring' is the 'regular expression' you want to match,
a 'regular expression' can be a literal string, that requires an exact match,
or can contain 'patterns' that match any of a number things -- e.g. the
'[456]' in the nFilter rule above is a pattern that matches "either a 4,
or a 5, or a 6".
NOTE: '.' has a special meaning in a regular expression (i.e. 'match _any_
character'), so when you want to match *only* a '.', you have to
precede it with a '\', to indicate you mean the 'literal character .',
not the 'match any' symbol. Caveat: the first '.' must -not- be
'escaped' that way, because it *is* being used as 'match any character'.
a 'reading' of the rule is
match the string 'nntp-posting-host' (*WITHOUT* regard to case),
followed by a ':',
followed by 'any character' (indicated by the '.') occurring ZERO
OR MORE TIMES (indicated by the '*' following the '.')
followed by the string '206',
followed by a literal '.',
followed by the string '216'
followed by a literal '.',
followed by one of the characters '4', '5', or '6'
In article <[email protected]>,
Mike Patterson <[email protected]> wrote:
>I think this'll do it:
>
>rec.woodworking drop nntp-posting-host:.*206.216.48
>
>HTH
>
>On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 16:54:35 -0400, "Montyhp" <montyhp at yahoo.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Can someone translate this to an Nfilter statement for us?
>>
>>montyhp
>><[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> posted from:
>>>
>>> NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.216.48.105
>>>
>>>
>>> This is "IGC.NET" the problem-child appears to be in NY state
>>> (probably in the Long Island area).
>>>
>>> Filtering on "206.216.48" anywhere in the headers will suppress this
>>guy,
>>> without affecting the legit messages posted through Google.
>>>
>>>
>>> and, of course:
>>>
>>> X-Complaints-To: [email protected]
>>>
>>>
>>> is good advice.
>>>
>>
>
posted from:
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.216.48.105
This is "IGC.NET" the problem-child appears to be in NY state
(probably in the Long Island area).
Filtering on "206.216.48" anywhere in the headers will suppress this guy,
without affecting the legit messages posted through Google.
and, of course:
X-Complaints-To: [email protected]
is good advice.
Thanks for that great advice. I ran a couple scrap pieces through that I
brad nailed to a small piece of craft wood I had and it looks great. I
glued them together to see how it was and WOW. That will save me a ton of
time with a planer. Now I just need to get a board that is straight and 72"
long to use with the full size 2x4s that I have. I'll also have to work out
a way to put a 2x4 'sideways' on it to get 2 sides squared. Perhaps a jig?
I'm gonna scrap the pieces that I've glued up so far... after seeing the
results this way I think that the time I'll save will be worth it if I have
a to buy a few more 2x's. I'm not as cheap as I sound... I'm just being
careful with this hobby as I have been in and out of many expensive hobbies
in my lifetime with little but a few expensive toys to show for it. I want
to work my way into it.
Thanks again!
Mike W.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Mike W. <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >Thanks for the advice.
> >
> >One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
> >the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
> >better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
> >
> >Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
> >
> >Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
> >
> >Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started? I have
5
> >laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that.
I
> >just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
> >was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence
before
> >it would help.
>
> A straight edge against the fence is *not* an absolute requirement. Yes,
it
> *does* make life a 'whole bunch' simpler, but is not an absolute
necessity.
>
> Two approaches:
> 1) *IF* the board is 'short', relative to the length of the fence on the
> saw, *AND* if the board has a single "simple" curve to it -- i.e. it
is
> 'bowed out' on one side, with a corresponding 'bow in' on the
other --
> make the 1st pass with the "bowed in" side against the fence. This
> _should_ have just the 'ends' of the bowed part touching the fence
(with
> a gap in the middle of the board), so you'll have a *consistent* path
for
> the board as it goes by the blade. Eureka! You've now got a straight
> edge on the side that went by the blade. Turn the piece over, and
cut
> the _other_ edge. Voila! _two_ straight and parallel edges.
> 2) if it's a long board, or there is more 'complex' curvature to the
> board -- e.g. 's-curves', or worse -- then the above doesn't work so
> well. The 'do it right' solution is to use a 'carrier' piece (which
> *does* have a straight edge, -or- has 'two-point-of-contact' with the
> fence) to provide the guiding contact with the fence, *and* supports
> the piece being cut. A piece of Masonite, particle board, or
'whatever'
> that you might have lying around will work fine -- as long as it is
wide
> enough to let you 'tack it down' (some way, that is; *any* method
that
> works is fine :) to the piece you're trying to cut, _with_ the
straight
> edge extending out past the 'back side' of it, for the entire length
of
> the board. This gets you one straight edge on the board, now you can
> remove it from the carrier, and use that straight edge against the
> fence to make the other edge straight. This stuff isn't difficult,
merely
> a matter of 'out-thinking the materials you work with'. <grin>
> >
> >Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact,
I
> >don't have a hand plane yet either.
> >What plane do you suggest I start with?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Mike W
> >
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top? I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good.
I'm building a bench like that and I'm almost ready to add the vise
hardware. Don't worry too much about the rounded corners as you'll
probably remove most of that material as you flatten the top. The
bigger concern for me (which I failed to notice while doing the glue
up) is that the many of the boards I used were slightly thinner at the
ends; probably from the milling process. This wasn't a big deal on
individual boards but it added up after several boards, making a
noticable curve along the edge. I had planned on a full 8 foot length
bench so, if I were to do it again, I'd start with 10' lumber with the
anticipation of cutting approx. 1 foot off each end.
I've almost got the top flat using just a jack plane but I plan to get
some further workout using a #8C for the final touches. As Bob Keys
says in his website (paraphrased): Build your first bench *now*.
Then you can use what you've learned as the basis for your future
dream bench.
> But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s.
If you plane to use the 2x8 for a tool well, be very mindful of the
curvature I mentioned above. That caused a big delay in my progress.
> I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
Why cheapo? For $35, you can probably find a nice plane and if you
add another $20 to $30 you can almost guarantee finding a nice plane;
provided you do your homework. Before you buy, consult the wreck for
guidance.
> What do you think?
I think you're going to have a great opportunity to get *alot* of
practice with wooddorking techniques and end up with a very useable
bench in the process. Have fun and good luck!
Cheers,
Mike
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Thanks for the advice.
>
> One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
> the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
> better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
>
> Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
>
> Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
I've done alot of planing of the top and I *thought* it was almost
flat. I had some time this morning to do some work on it and I
noticed that I still have a ways to go as one end is sort of cupped.
> Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started?
I didn't do anything to the lumber before glue up other than wipe off
loose dust. In hindsight, I should have been more careful checking
the boards for defects but it's not too bad and it's finally starting
to look like a real bench.
> I have 5
> laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that. I
> just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
> was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence before
> it would help.
I'm building my bench because I don't have a jointer and planer and a
bench will make life easier for preparing stock by hand. I think the
major benefit of the "bench by Borg" is that you can slap it together
with a relatively low cash outlay without worrying about it being
perfect. When all is said and done, all you really need is a flat
stable surface. The rest is aesthetics (but I will want one of those
purdy benches some day).
> Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact, I
> don't have a hand plane yet either.
> What plane do you suggest I start with?
Well, there are alot of wreckers with *way* more knowledge than me on
this topic but, for your bench project, I'd start by getting a decent
jack plane. Old Stanley/Baileys (#5) are a pretty safe bet and won't
set you back too far financially. You should not have to pay more
than $40 total (i.e. price + shipping) and that's at the high end
(okay, maybe a bit more if you're looking for a sweet Type 11, but
it's not really necessary). Depending on where you live, you might be
able to pick one up much cheaper. Depending on how unflat (is that a
word?) the top is, a scrub plane may be helpful. And a jointer plane
(#7 or #8 in the Bailey variety) will make life easier to get the top
as flat as possible.
Cheers,
Mike
Dimwnsional lumber is generally only kiln dried to maybe 12% mc befor
being sent to the lumber yard. If it has been kept indoors it has
been air-drying ever since. If 'ever since' isn't very long you
might get quite a bit of movement, including cupping, before that
benchtop stabilizes.
Notwithstanding, plenty of people have had good luck doing as you have.
I doubt that you'd need the sander, softwoods generally plane pretty
darned smooth. Besides, you don't want to embed grit into the benchtop.
That way if it does need to be planed again in a few weeks or months
you won't have grit in the wood chewing up yhour iron.
--
FF
Mike W. wrote:
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
> and a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
Everyone has good arguments why you shouldn't do this, but maybe they don't
understand being fiscally challenged and the value of free wood the way I
do. :)
I've been using a cheap kit bench for years. The top is construction grade
lumber, and it isn't even laminated. It's not a very good bench, but it's
been better than nothing for several years. If you laminated a similar
grade of wood into something solid, and made the top flat, you'd be a leg
up on me. You can always cover the top with something later, as the need
arises, and as finances allow.
> I've laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are
> somewhat rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little
>more elbow grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
I've made a lot of stuff out of construction scrap. I deal with the rounded
corners by cutting them off with my table saw. If you have a table saw,
that's probably the way to go. Just slice enough from either side to get
rid of the curvature. Use the cutoffs for paint stirs or something.
If you don't have a table saw, then you can plane them down, but it will
take you quite a lot of time to remove that much material. I'm doing a
project right now which involves removing 1/4" from several boards (poplar)
with hand planes, and it does take some doing even on these small,
box-sized pieces. If I weren't just trying to get in some practice, I
would definitely seek the aid of a table saw, a router, a bandsaw, or
pretty much any sort of machine to get these closer to size, and then plane
down the last 1/16th or so to get them perfect. All the finesse comes in
at the end anyway. Before that, it's just making shavings for the hell of
it.
Once it's all glued up, you'll have to plane it again. The wood might move
quite a lot, and you might even end up with a hideous mess. If I were
going to laminate a bunch of 2x4s into a bench top, I think I'd want help
convincing the wood to stay put. I might go across with dowels or even
threaded rods. Dowels would give you less to worry about when doing the
dog holes.
Finally, I'm just learning how to plane myself. Having a lot of fun, and
good things are finally starting to happen, but it isn't as easy as it
sounds to get things to come out straight and true. You should practice on
something non-critical until you get the hang of it, before you completely
screw up your bench top.
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
Use the $35 to buy an angle jig thingie so you can sharpen your plane iron.
You'll need it. All the sharp tool nuts here are absolutely right about
how much of a difference it makes. I made some shavings so thin they might
only be one layer of cells thick, and I couldn't have done that before I
finally got the iron sharp.
Anyway, I'm only a couple days more experienced than you when it comes to
this particular set of skills, so take my advice for what it's worth.
If it were ME in your situation, I'd probably use the 2x4s, but I have
extremely little cash, a comparatively large mount of time to invest, and a
certain fondness for doing things the hard way sometimes.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
"Morgans" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
> and
> > a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
> I've
> > laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> > rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> > grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
> >
> > I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> > was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> > at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
> >
> > I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> > the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> > 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> > buy a better one to begin with.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mike W.
> >
> >
> Spf is too soft for a decent bench. If you want to stay softwood, go to the
> lumberyard, and get some #1 Yellow Pine 2 x 10. You can rip it and glue it
> up, but the 2 x 10 is around for use as floor joists. Let it air dry for a
> while before working it flat.
Hey-- free is free & cheap is cheap. Maybe not the BEST material for
a bench, but My YP workbench is only 30 years old. While it IS time
to turn over the boards (originally 2 x 6). I think I'll just run them
thru the planer once & reinstall them. By the way, the whole bench
was free 20 years ago. A local college was getting new maple benches
& wanted to get rid of the unsightly old pine benches that had been
made by students about 10 - 15 years before. Like I say, free is
free;; cheap is cheap. ESPECIALLY if it's a first bench.
Phil
Sorry, in case anyone hasn't seen my recent posts... this is the bench Im
attempting to build:
http://www.terraclavis.com/bws/beginners.htm
I should have posted that in the initial posting so that you had some
context as to how I would be laminating and orienting the 2x4s.
Thanks,
Mike W.
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike W.
>
>
I KNOW it is a hell of a watse because I did back in '76. Wood is too
soft, is way to heavy to move, just generally too soft. Soaks up oil
and anything else quickly, stains, plus you will have a blast trying
to level it with a belt sander on those knots. I glued and ran a 36"
steel threaded rod through it every 16" for strength. look at making a
frame and placing a piece of Birch over it. the pine is just a waste.
It sits in my old milk barn now where it has for 27 years. I will sell
it cheap though.
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 18:22:22 GMT, "Mike W." <[email protected]>
wrote:
>If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane and
>a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top? I've
>laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
>rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
>grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
>I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
>was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
>at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
>I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
>the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
>2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
>buy a better one to begin with.
>
>What do you think?
>
>Thanks,
>Mike W.
>
Thanks for that great advice. I ran a couple scrap pieces through that I
brad nailed to a small piece of craft wood I had and it looks great. I
glued them together to see how it was and WOW. That will save me a ton of
time with a planer. Now I just need to get a board that is straight and 72"
long to use with the full size 2x4s that I have. I'll also have to work out
a way to put a 2x4 'sideways' on it to get 2 sides squared. Perhaps a jig?
I'm gonna scrap the pieces that I've glued up so far... after seeing the
results this way I think that the time I'll save will be worth it if I have
a to buy a few more 2x's. I'm not as cheap as I sound... I'm just being
careful with this hobby as I have been in and out of many expensive hobbies
in my lifetime with little but a few expensive toys to show for it. I want
to work my way into it.
Thanks again!
Mike W.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Mike W. <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >Thanks for the advice.
> >
> >One of the major reasons I am doing this is to learn some WW skills along
> >the way. I am 100% sure that at some time down the road I will want a
> >better bench. But for now, I just want something to cut my teeth on.
> >
> >Since you're doing something similar, here's a few questions:
> >
> >Have you planed the top of your bench at all yet?
> >
> >Did you 'square up' your 2x4s on a table saw before you started? I have
5
> >laminated together so far and could start over doing something like that.
I
> >just didnt think a table saw (cheapo craftsman) would help that much... I
> >was thinking you had to have a straight edge to go against the fence
before
> >it would help.
>
> A straight edge against the fence is *not* an absolute requirement. Yes,
it
> *does* make life a 'whole bunch' simpler, but is not an absolute
necessity.
>
> Two approaches:
> 1) *IF* the board is 'short', relative to the length of the fence on the
> saw, *AND* if the board has a single "simple" curve to it -- i.e. it
is
> 'bowed out' on one side, with a corresponding 'bow in' on the
other --
> make the 1st pass with the "bowed in" side against the fence. This
> _should_ have just the 'ends' of the bowed part touching the fence
(with
> a gap in the middle of the board), so you'll have a *consistent* path
for
> the board as it goes by the blade. Eureka! You've now got a straight
> edge on the side that went by the blade. Turn the piece over, and
cut
> the _other_ edge. Voila! _two_ straight and parallel edges.
> 2) if it's a long board, or there is more 'complex' curvature to the
> board -- e.g. 's-curves', or worse -- then the above doesn't work so
> well. The 'do it right' solution is to use a 'carrier' piece (which
> *does* have a straight edge, -or- has 'two-point-of-contact' with the
> fence) to provide the guiding contact with the fence, *and* supports
> the piece being cut. A piece of Masonite, particle board, or
'whatever'
> that you might have lying around will work fine -- as long as it is
wide
> enough to let you 'tack it down' (some way, that is; *any* method
that
> works is fine :) to the piece you're trying to cut, _with_ the
straight
> edge extending out past the 'back side' of it, for the entire length
of
> the board. This gets you one straight edge on the board, now you can
> remove it from the carrier, and use that straight edge against the
> fence to make the other edge straight. This stuff isn't difficult,
merely
> a matter of 'out-thinking the materials you work with'. <grin>
> >
> >Note: I don't have a power jointer or power planer. As a matter of fact,
I
> >don't have a hand plane yet either.
> >What plane do you suggest I start with?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Mike W
> >
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike W.
>
>
I'll save you the trouble of reading all those posts ready to spend your
hard earned grocery money on better wood for your bench. I pretty much did
exactly that. I did knock off the rounded corners at the table saw before
laminating the board. Originally, the bench was made for a sharpening
bench, but I still haven't had time to build my "Real" bench, so I added a
face vise, drilled some round dog holes, got some round dogs and a wonder
pup, and I've got a perfectly (sort of ) good temporary bench. The wonder
pup thing has it's limitations. It doesn't work with thin stock. I'd kill
for a decent end vise. But other than that, it's worked well so far. The
top is flat and stable. Yeah, it gets scratched and dinged easily, but it's
not exactly living room furniture, so who cares.
Go for it.
Eric
"Mike W." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack plane
and
> a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
I've
> laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are somewhat
> rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more elbow
> grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
>
> I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight. So I
> was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having a go
> at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
>
> I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but with
> the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the 2 -
> 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo plane or
> buy a better one to begin with.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike W.
>
>
Spf is too soft for a decent bench. If you want to stay softwood, go to the
lumberyard, and get some #1 Yellow Pine 2 x 10. You can rip it and glue it
up, but the 2 x 10 is around for use as floor joists. Let it air dry for a
while before working it flat.
--
Jim in NC
[snip]
> > > If I laminate 6-10 construction grade 2x4s together, using a Jack
plane
> > and
> > > a sander do you think I can make a relativley decent first bench top?
> > I've
> > > laminated 3 together already, and since the studs' corners are
somewhat
> > > rounded its not so good. But I dont mind putting in a little more
elbow
> > > grease with the planer if its gonna come out OK.
> > >
> > > I got some studs free from a buddy and they are all really straight.
So I
> > > was thinking about making my bench top out of them... at least having
a go
> > > at it for some practice since I've never used a hand planer before.
> > >
> > > I was counting on $50 - $60 minimum in lumber to build my bench, but
with
> > > the wood he's giving me if I can use it I will only need to buy the
2 -
> > > 2x8s. I can then apply the extra $35 or so to get another cheapo
plane or
> > > buy a better one to begin with.
> > >
> > > What do you think?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Mike W.
[snip]
Feb 2001 Pop. Woodworking has an article on this subject. $175 Workbench.
Most of that expense is in the vises that the guy put on.
Montyhp
Can someone translate this to an Nfilter statement for us?
montyhp
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> posted from:
>
> NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.216.48.105
>
>
> This is "IGC.NET" the problem-child appears to be in NY state
> (probably in the Long Island area).
>
> Filtering on "206.216.48" anywhere in the headers will suppress this
guy,
> without affecting the legit messages posted through Google.
>
>
> and, of course:
>
> X-Complaints-To: [email protected]
>
>
> is good advice.
>
I just built a bench using 3/4" maple cutoffs I got from a cabinet maker
for 50 cents a board foot. First I sawed the edges fairly straight,
then used biscuits and glue to make a 3" thick laminated top. If you
can get a deal like this, it won't add a lot to your bench cost and the
top will be harder.
Since I didn't have the equipment to joint and plane each piece before
gluing it up, or the inclination to obsess on each piece with the hand
plane (after all, I was building the bench I would want to use for such
shenanigans), the top was basically square and flat but it definitely
needed planing. I was able to get it quite flat with a jack plane.
One advantage of this lamination technique was that I could make nice
3/4" square dog holes by leaving gaps in the boards.
While planing the laminated maple, I found it hard to avoid chipout,
since the grain usually runs up for a while and then down, on each
board. So the grain direction is randomly changing. I still got it
flat, though; it was just hard to avoid a few chipouts.
With the uneven surface, it seemed like nothing was happening at first,
but once the high spots were down I started to get nice long curly
shavings. I had to tune the iron carefully (and resharpen some) to keep
the shavings thin, keeping planing effort and chipouts under control. I
used a straightedge to check for high spots, but the 14" plane was up to
the task of flattening them.