Hi All,
I just completed an oak box and stained it with Minwax dark
walnut. Wiped if off pretty good, I think. The next day, I put on a
coat of Armorall Oil and Urithane Topcoat. Not too thick, but as it
was the first coat, not real dry either. Put on with cloth pad. The
next day, it was still tacky. Wiped down with mineral spirits, and
recoated with juice from a different can of the same stuff. This
morning, the piece was still tacky.
Never had this problem before. Shop temp is 55 degrees, humidity
around 75%. Last night I did a test board, 1/3 gloss finish, 1/3
satin from an old can, and 1/3 from the just opened can. This
morning, all three areas were dry and ready for steel wool and more
coats.
Is it possible that the stain didn't "dry" and that is queering the
drying time of the topcoat???
I'm at a loss as to what to do next. SHMBO needs this box finished
by Sunday PM.
Any help will be MOST appreciated! Thanks to all.
Rich.....
On Feb 10, 4:42=A0pm, rich <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> I brought the box into the house, and it seems to be getting less
> tacky. =A0What baffled me on this was that it was the first time I've
> had any problem using the same finishes, same overnight shop temps.
> And a test run last night dried up overnight just as always.
>
> My thinking now is maybe the stain never dried enough. =A0Or Magic.
For borderline temps and smaller projects you can rig up an enclosure
and stick a lamp inside along with the work to boost the ambient
temperature. Works well, and you don't need a high wattage bulb.
R
Thanks to All. Puter server has been down since Thursday! Brought
the box inside, and stole some oven time. Lots of sweating of stain.
This was an old can of stain, so it will get replaced.
Good idea to let oak dry longer, hadn't thought of that. But all
in all, I have not had problems with shop environment over the past 4
years, using the same finishes, various woods. Stain one day, 1st
finish the next, etc.
Always nice to be able to discuss these problems, and get different
opinions.
Rich.....
>
> =A0 =A0Any help will be MOST appreciated! =A0Thanks to all.
>
> Rich.....
Most likely wet oil under the finish.
Minwax instructions indicate 8 to 24 hours before applying a finish. I
would say 48 to 72 is much safer, especially when only 55 degrees.
Also poly won't dry wel below 65 degrees.
You have a bit of a mess now. I would suggest to wipe it down with
mineral spirits as best possible. Then try coating with shellac. It
dries in minutes. It is good seperator between finishes and has
excellent adhesion in even extreme cases.
If the first coat works, then a few more coats of shellac.
> heat and air movement. if you had a convection oven, a few hours in there
> would do, but you'd probably not be able to use the oven again for food.
>
Thanks Charlie. I can just imagine the yelling if I used the oven!
I brought the box into the house, and it seems to be getting less
tacky. What baffled me on this was that it was the first time I've
had any problem using the same finishes, same overnight shop temps.
And a test run last night dried up overnight just as always.
My thinking now is maybe the stain never dried enough. Or Magic.
Minwax, and many others, have changed their formulas to satisfy the
latest VOC requierments, so most will take much longer to dry than
what their instructions say. After staining with an oil stain, you
should allow it to dry for at least 4 days (with normal temps and
humidity), before topcoating. A week of drying is best, because you
can never be sure of how thick you may have applied it and/or how deep
it penetrated.
I would wipe it down with naptha, allow to dry (at least until
Saturday afternoon), then coat with shellac (Sealcoat). If your wipe-
down lightened the color too much, tone the shellac.
Sonny
SonomaProducts.com wrote:
>> Any help will be MOST appreciated! Thanks to all.
>>
>> Rich.....
>
> Most likely wet oil under the finish.
>
> Minwax instructions indicate 8 to 24 hours before applying a finish. I
> would say 48 to 72 is much safer, especially when only 55 degrees.
> Also poly won't dry wel below 65 degrees.
>
> You have a bit of a mess now. I would suggest to wipe it down with
> mineral spirits as best possible. Then try coating with shellac. It
> dries in minutes. It is good seperator between finishes and has
> excellent adhesion in even extreme cases.
>
> If the first coat works, then a few more coats of shellac.
And, bring it into a warmer environment.
I'd never even consider <24 hrs over a mineral stain on oak even in warm
weather and certainly not at in the 50s w/ likely high humidideedew to
slow evaporation down even more.
--
rich wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I just completed an oak box and stained it with Minwax dark
> walnut. Wiped if off pretty good, I think. The next day, I put on a
> coat of Armorall Oil and Urithane Topcoat. Not too thick, but as it
> was the first coat, not real dry either. Put on with cloth pad. The
> next day, it was still tacky. Wiped down with mineral spirits, and
> recoated with juice from a different can of the same stuff. This
> morning, the piece was still tacky.
>
> Never had this problem before. Shop temp is 55 degrees, humidity
> around 75%. Last night I did a test board, 1/3 gloss finish, 1/3
> satin from an old can, and 1/3 from the just opened can. This
> morning, all three areas were dry and ready for steel wool and more
> coats.
>
> Is it possible that the stain didn't "dry" and that is queering the
> drying time of the topcoat???
>
> I'm at a loss as to what to do next. SHMBO needs this box finished
> by Sunday PM.
>
> Any help will be MOST appreciated! Thanks to all.
>
> Rich.....
heat and air movement. if you had a convection oven, a few hours in there
would do, but you'd probably not be able to use the oven again for food.
i am refinishing the kitchen knobs. i sandblasted them to bare metal,
sprayed on appliance epoxy paint, and let sit. after a day or so it's dry to
touch, but very soft. the can states it could take 7 days to fully harden
but i didn't want to wait that long.
4 hours at 200F in my kiln hardened it right up and they're usable as soon
as they cool off.
regards,
charlie
cave creek, az
dpb wrote:
...
> I'd never even consider <24 hrs over a mineral stain on oak ...
Realized didn't point out the "why"...unless used a sealer first to
close the pores, even rubbing out won't get all of the sizable amounts
left in open pores and that will take longer to dry than a surface coat
on a close-grained wood. When the topcoat is applied, it'll re-dissolve
the covering "skin" on those little globs and there ya' go w/ the drying
problem.
--
It is the garbage Minwax stain you used. It has changed it's formula.
This has been reported by a few here and caused a lot of flames by the
"can't change" crowd.
Stay tuned.
"rich" wrote in message
news:43691111-7084-4968-acca-8cfb06d4622b@s11g2000prs.googlegroups.com...
Hi All,
I just completed an oak box and stained it with Minwax dark
walnut. Wiped if off pretty good, I think. The next day, I put on a
coat of Armorall Oil and Urithane Topcoat. Not too thick, but as it
was the first coat, not real dry either. Put on with cloth pad. The
next day, it was still tacky. Wiped down with mineral spirits, and
recoated with juice from a different can of the same stuff. This
morning, the piece was still tacky.
Never had this problem before. Shop temp is 55 degrees, humidity
around 75%. Last night I did a test board, 1/3 gloss finish, 1/3
satin from an old can, and 1/3 from the just opened can. This
morning, all three areas were dry and ready for steel wool and more
coats.
Is it possible that the stain didn't "dry" and that is queering the
drying time of the topcoat???
I'm at a loss as to what to do next. SHMBO needs this box finished
by Sunday PM.
Any help will be MOST appreciated! Thanks to all.
Rich.....
On Thu, 10 Feb 2011 10:36:43 -0800 (PST), rich <[email protected]>
wrote:
>Hi All,
>
> I just completed an oak box and stained it with Minwax dark
>walnut. Wiped if off pretty good, I think. The next day, I put on a
>coat of Armorall Oil and Urithane Topcoat. Not too thick, but as it
>was the first coat, not real dry either. Put on with cloth pad. The
>next day, it was still tacky. Wiped down with mineral spirits, and
>recoated with juice from a different can of the same stuff. This
>morning, the piece was still tacky.
>
> Never had this problem before. Shop temp is 55 degrees, humidity
>around 75%. Last night I did a test board, 1/3 gloss finish, 1/3
>satin from an old can, and 1/3 from the just opened can. This
>morning, all three areas were dry and ready for steel wool and more
>coats.
Did you use pore filler on the oak? If not, the deep pores could have
pooled excess Minwhacked, preventing it from drying properly.
> Is it possible that the stain didn't "dry" and that is queering the
>drying time of the topcoat???
Yup. Let's see, you use two questionable products, one on top the
other, too quickly, in a too-humid environment, and then you expected
it to work? Interesting. (Am I too cynical? ;)
> I'm at a loss as to what to do next. SHMBO needs this box finished
>by Sunday PM.
>
> Any help will be MOST appreciated! Thanks to all.
Quickly make a new box out of real walnut. Finish with hand-rubbed
Waterlox Original finish. Lovely!
--
Remember, in an emergency, dial 1911.