I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the end
of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
A "dado blade" would appear to work well, perhaps even best, for everything
except the space between the tenons--and it is this space which I am
concerned about and which motivated me to make this post. Options appear to
be:
1. Drilling and routing it out (from both sides, before cutting any other
part of the tenon).
2. Cut as much of it as possible with a TS and chisel the rest of it away.
3, Relying on BS and (which doesn't seem as precise as #1, or even #2)
4. Other???
5. Compromise and shorten the tenon in order to cut it on a 10" TS (which
can make a 3" cut at 90 degrees)?
This is one of those details that, to the untrained eye, is easy to take for
granted at first, and then it sort of sneaks up on you! My eye is still
learning....
This problem made me wonder whether the original designer (Garrett Hack)
might have used a TS bigger than 10" to make easier work of this?
Bill
On 5/7/2010 2:44 AM, Bill wrote:
> "Swingman"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Are you familiar with using a guide of some type with a hand saw to help
>> make a square cut?
>>
>> If not, DAGS ...
>>
>
> I have used a mitre box before. I can imagine a custom version, clamped to
> my workpiece, which could possibly work similarly (if all of the clamps
> held). DAGS failed me. Would you please provide another clue to the idea
> to which you were referring?
Trust your imagination ... a picture being worth a couple of words, here
is one that comes quickly to mind, if I understand what you are trying
to do:
http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/SawGuide.pdf
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)
On May 6, 12:19=A0am, "Bill" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a =A0double-tenon on the =
end
> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
Here is the methodI would use.
1. First draw sharp lines, even use a knife to define all cuts both
shoulder and cheek etc so you end up with a shoulder line around 4
sides of the piece, cheek lines on two opossing faces and lines across
the end grain showing locations of the end of the tennons.
2. On my router table I would install the smallest straight bit I
have. Then using a fence I would adjust for maybe 1/4" deep cuts
aligned to the correct faces of the cut lines setting up a stop block
so all cuts stop at 3 1/2 exactly at the shoulder mark. Do slots on
two opposing faces along the edges of the tennons.
3. With slots now cut on two faces defining the edges of the tennons,
use a bandsaw (if you are good with a bandsaw and can trust your
setup), or use a hand saw (I would do this) and saw along the correct
face of the slots to the shoulder. Take your time and think about
Noah.
4. Hand cut the shoulder cuts on the two outside pieces. You could
router these first on the table if the 4x4 isn't two long or use a an
edge guide and free hand it. Use a backer to avoid blowout at the
exiting edge.
5. Drill out, with a single appropriatly sized drill or fostner bit,
the inside drop pieces drilling about 1/8" bach from the shoulder
line. Go slow and with light pressure to avoid drift. Then clean up
those two interior shoulders with a chisel.
On 2010-05-06 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]> said:
> I still need a TS and a DP...
I might be able to help with the table saw -- got one that needs a good
home. AND I'm somplace near the crossroads of America.
On May 6, 8:26=A0am, "SonomaProducts.com" <[email protected]> wrote:
> On May 6, 12:19=A0am, "Bill" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a =A0double-tenon on th=
e end
> > of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>
> Here is the methodI would use.
>
> 1. First draw sharp lines, even use a knife to define all cuts both
> shoulder and cheek etc so you end up with a shoulder line around 4
> sides of the piece, cheek lines on two opossing faces and lines across
> the end grain showing locations of the end of the tennons.
>
> 2. On my router table I would install the smallest straight bit I
> have. Then using a fence I would adjust for maybe 1/4" deep cuts
> aligned to the correct faces of the cut lines setting up a stop block
> so all cuts stop at 3 1/2 exactly at the shoulder mark. Do slots on
> two opposing faces along the edges of the tennons.
>
> 3. With slots now cut on two faces defining the edges of the tennons,
> use a bandsaw (if you are good with a bandsaw and can trust your
> setup), or use a hand saw (I would do this) and saw along the correct
> face of the slots to the shoulder. Take your time and think about
> Noah.
>
> 4. Hand cut the shoulder cuts on the two outside pieces. You could
> router these first on the table if the 4x4 isn't two long or use a an
> edge guide and free hand it. Use a backer to avoid blowout at the
> exiting edge.
>
> 5. Drill out, =A0with a single appropriatly sized drill or fostner bit,
> the inside drop pieces drilling about 1/8" bach from the shoulder
> line. Go slow and with light pressure to avoid drift. Then clean up
> those two interior shoulders with a chisel.
Sorry, single interior shoulder, I was thinking triple tenon I guess.
On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the end
> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all
previous with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and
chisel to clean up.
These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more
time wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be
an expert in no time. ;)
Are you familiar with using a guide of some type with a hand saw to help
make a square cut?
If not, DAGS ...
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)
"Bill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the end
> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>
I don't think you mentioned how long the 4x4 is, which affects the answer.
However, I think this is a prime opportunity to get in touch with your inner
Neander, grab the handsaw and go for it.
jc
> Nice idea! It seem one doesn't usually talk about stopped BS cuts
> (because
> of issues in backing up). Is this permissible here becuase these are
> straight-line cuts?
Frankly i did not know that it was a "rule". I drive in reverse regularly
(but with care).
make the first two cuts diagonally to remove the bulk of the waste and then
subsequent cust will be much more shallow.
> I was already wondering whether the "hardboard" mortissing jig I saw in a
> book
> is stuitably accurate for cutting the mortise... It basically consisted
> of two onebytwos, or so, placed one on
> each side of the (4by4) workpiece spanned by a piece of hardboard to which
> the router is afixed. As you mention, the desired accuracy is
> non-trivial!
I think the place where you are likely to have trouble is not the jig but
non-square stock.
"Never assume that wood is straight/flat/square. Only beleive that it is,
when *you* made it that way"
> I take it one of your first steps would be to put the 4by4s through a
> bench
> planer (which I do have)? BTW they are less than 30" long.
No. Jointer First. Not just for flatness, but establishing the first
90-degree edge.
In lieu of a jointer. just make sure you plane first with any bow facing
up. When the bow is gone, flip and get the other side. This will mitigate
the bow. OTOH, you could knock off the high spots with a a hand place.
Establish your 90 angles at the TS after planing.
One more asside. It sounds like you are making this with dimmensional
lumber. If I were doing it, I would (re)design my final dimmensions to
something a little smaller (1/8" or 1/4") than the supplied stock to that I
could mill to flat/square.
Cheers,
Steve
"Bill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the end
> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>
> A "dado blade" would appear to work well, perhaps even best, for
> everything except the space between the tenons--and it is this space which
> I am concerned about and which motivated me to make this post. Options
> appear to be:
>
> 1. Drilling and routing it out (from both sides, before cutting any other
> part of the tenon).
>
> 2. Cut as much of it as possible with a TS and chisel the rest of it
> away.
>
> 3, Relying on BS and (which doesn't seem as precise as #1, or even #2)
>
> 4. Other???
>
> 5. Compromise and shorten the tenon in order to cut it on a 10" TS (which
> can make a 3" cut at 90 degrees)?
>
> This is one of those details that, to the untrained eye, is easy to take
> for granted at first, and then it sort of sneaks up on you! My eye is
> still learning....
>
> This problem made me wonder whether the original designer (Garrett Hack)
> might have used a TS bigger than 10" to make easier work of this?
The simplest and probably easiest approach would be to simply put double
mortises in both pieces and use 2 floating tennons.
On Thu, 6 May 2010 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
wrote the following:
>
>"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the
>>> end
>>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>>
>> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all previous
>> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to clean
>> up.
>>
>> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more time
>> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
>> expert in no time. ;)
>
>Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
>different options.
>I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the space
>between
>two 3.5" long tenons?"
In that case, Bill, the answer is a resounding "Carefully and
precisely!", of course.
--
All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian,
or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up
to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.
--Thomas Paine
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the
>> end
>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>
> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all previous
> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to clean
> up.
>
> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more time
> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
> expert in no time. ;)
Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
different options.
I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the space
between
two 3.5" long tenons?" My questions are getting better, no? : ) You have
given me a lot of help. I appreciate everything
on-topic which people post to the newsgroup which furthers my thinking and I
thought there were some very fine
and useful responses to my post. There are lots of ways to "skin a
cat-fish". I think it's awesome
that we can discuss them here. I'm probably in a bit "over my head" like
StephanM's friend, but I'm
learning! I'm glad I asked for a Starrett combination square for
Christmas, it appears I'm going to need it! :)
I still need a TS and a DP... Will do what I can with a BS and router in
the meantime... Thanks!
Bill
> --
> www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/15/2010
> KarlC@ (the obvious)
"StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I would do it all on the TS and then get the last 1/2" with the BS. Any
>inherent sloppiness of the BS will be minimised.
>
> It should be easy to set a up the cut in the BS as you can just align it
> using the TS kerf. I would also make a couple of extra stopped BS cuts
> between the tennons to make it easier to chisel out the remaining center
> accurately (follow the depth of the kerfs).
Nice idea! It seem one doesn't usually talk about stopped BS cuts (because
of issues in backing up). Is this permissible here becuase these are
straight-line cuts?
>
> BTW I agree that making 3.5" thorugh tennons is deceiving. The geometery
> is straightforward but making those cuts with the desired accuracy is
> non-trivial. Make no assumptions about the squareness of your stock, jigs
> and fences. Check and tripplecheck.
I was already wondering whether the "hardboard" mortissing jig I saw in a
book
is stuitably accurate for cutting the mortise... It basically consisted of
two onebytwos, or so, placed one on
each side of the (4by4) workpiece spanned by a piece of hardboard to which
the router is afixed. As you mention, the desired accuracy is non-trivial!
>
> I helped a neighbor with a similar project (Red Oak headboard w/ 3"
> through tennons). Bless him; he thought the ends of his S4S oak came from
> the supplier square. He was in way over his head.
No doubt, I am in over my head too... Wait until I get to planing the
benchtop.... :)
This project represents a "curriculum of study" to me. Maybe that gives me
an
advantage over your neighbor, maybe not.
I take it one of your first steps would be to put the 4by4s through a bench
planer (which I do have)? BTW they are less than 30" long.
Bill
"Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2010-05-06 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]> said:
>
>> I still need a TS and a DP...
>
> I might be able to help with the table saw -- got one that needs a good
> home. AND I'm somplace near the crossroads of America.
>
Now, there's an attention getting post!!
Steve, Please send me further details. I just put my email address on my web
site:
http://web.newsguy.com/MySite/
Thanks!
Bill
"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 6 May 2010 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
> wrote the following:
>
>>
>>"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the
>>>> end
>>>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>>>
>>> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all
>>> previous
>>> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to
>>> clean
>>> up.
>>>
>>> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more
>>> time
>>> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
>>> expert in no time. ;)
>>
>>Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
>>different options.
>>I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the
>>space
>>between
>>two 3.5" long tenons?"
>
> In that case, Bill, the answer is a resounding "Carefully and
> precisely!", of course.
You may as well have said, "You're just talking about the space-- you don't
need to cut the space, you need to cut the wood!" : )
>
> --
> All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian,
> or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up
> to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.
> --Thomas Paine
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Are you familiar with using a guide of some type with a hand saw to help
> make a square cut?
>
> If not, DAGS ...
>
I have used a mitre box before. I can imagine a custom version, clamped to
my workpiece, which could possibly work similarly (if all of the clamps
held). DAGS failed me. Would you please provide another clue to the idea
to which you were referring?
Bill
> --
> www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/15/2010
> KarlC@ (the obvious)
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 5/7/2010 2:44 AM, Bill wrote:
>> "Swingman"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Are you familiar with using a guide of some type with a hand saw to help
>>> make a square cut?
>>>
>>> If not, DAGS ...
>>>
>>
>> I have used a mitre box before. I can imagine a custom version, clamped
>> to
>> my workpiece, which could possibly work similarly (if all of the clamps
>> held). DAGS failed me. Would you please provide another clue to the
>> idea
>> to which you were referring?
>
> Trust your imagination ... a picture being worth a couple of words, here
> is one that comes quickly to mind, if I understand what you are trying to
> do:
>
> http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/SawGuide.pdf
Nice way to take care of the "slipping clamp" issue I mention. Indeed, that
picture was worth more than 1000 words! Thanks!
> --
> www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/15/2010
> KarlC@ (the obvious)
"StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> Nice idea! It seem one doesn't usually talk about stopped BS cuts
>> (because
>> of issues in backing up). Is this permissible here becuase these are
>> straight-line cuts?
>
> Frankly i did not know that it was a "rule". I drive in reverse regularly
> (but with care).
>
> make the first two cuts diagonally to remove the bulk of the waste and
> then subsequent cust will be much more shallow.
>
>> I was already wondering whether the "hardboard" mortissing jig I saw in a
>> book
>> is stuitably accurate for cutting the mortise... It basically consisted
>> of two onebytwos, or so, placed one on
>> each side of the (4by4) workpiece spanned by a piece of hardboard to
>> which
>> the router is afixed. As you mention, the desired accuracy is
>> non-trivial!
>
> I think the place where you are likely to have trouble is not the jig but
> non-square stock.
>
> "Never assume that wood is straight/flat/square. Only beleive that it is,
> when *you* made it that way"
>
>> I take it one of your first steps would be to put the 4by4s through a
>> bench
>> planer (which I do have)? BTW they are less than 30" long.
>
> No. Jointer First. Not just for flatness, but establishing the first
> 90-degree edge.
>
> In lieu of a jointer. just make sure you plane first with any bow facing
> up. When the bow is gone, flip and get the other side. This will mitigate
> the bow. OTOH, you could knock off the high spots with a a hand place.
>
> Establish your 90 angles at the TS after planing.
>
> One more asside. It sounds like you are making this with dimmensional
> lumber. If I were doing it, I would (re)design my final dimmensions to
> something a little smaller (1/8" or 1/4") than the supplied stock to that
> I could mill to flat/square.
>
> Cheers,
>
Thank you for the numerous suggestions! It was my error for assuming a
carefully
selected 4by4 would be properly dimensioned. A good woodworker never blames
the wood, no?
I am sending your post to the printer and will be thinking about your
outline
as I work through this!
Bill
"StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> No. Jointer First. Not just for flatness, but establishing the first
> 90-degree edge.
>
> In lieu of a jointer. just make sure you plane first with any bow facing
> up. When the bow is gone, flip and get the other side. This will mitigate
> the bow. OTOH, you could knock off the high spots with a a hand place.
>
> Establish your 90 angles at the TS after planing.
I think I finally "get it" (great lesson)!
If I understand your instructions, the first of the sides at the TS is to be
cut using a *miter guage* (probably wise to use some sort of "sled" to help
support the stock, huh). Then the other side can be cut using the TS fence.
Finally the ends can be trimmed square.
Then it's time to take a break and admire the square stock...! : )
Bill
> Cheers,
>
> Steve
>
>
Bill wrote:
> "StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
...
>> In lieu of a jointer. just make sure you plane first with any bow facing
>> up. When the bow is gone, flip and get the other side. This will mitigate
>> the bow. OTOH, you could knock off the high spots with a a hand place.
...
Unless it is quite thick stock or your planer has very little down force
(in which case it probably doesn't feed well), the planer will have a
tendency to simply flatten the piece leaving you w/ two parallel (but
still cupped) surfaces.
The point of the jointer in the operation first is that it doesn't have
that mechanical force on the opposite side that does the "mashing down"
so will, indeed, only hit the high spots.
If going to do this w/ a planer unless the stock is so thick as to not
bow under pressure, you need to shim the cup places to prevent the
flattening that otherwise will occur. This generally entails a planer sled.
--
"dpb" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Bill wrote:
>> "StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
> ...
>
>>> In lieu of a jointer. just make sure you plane first with any bow
>>> facing up. When the bow is gone, flip and get the other side. This will
>>> mitigate the bow. OTOH, you could knock off the high spots with a a hand
>>> place.
> ...
>
> Unless it is quite thick stock or your planer has very little down force
> (in which case it probably doesn't feed well), the planer will have a
> tendency to simply flatten the piece leaving you w/ two parallel (but
> still cupped) surfaces.
>
> The point of the jointer in the operation first is that it doesn't have
> that mechanical force on the opposite side that does the "mashing down" so
> will, indeed, only hit the high spots.
>
> If going to do this w/ a planer unless the stock is so thick as to not bow
> under pressure, you need to shim the cup places to prevent the flattening
> that otherwise will occur. This generally entails a planer sled.
>
> --
Your comment is appreciated! In the case of 4by4 stock, I don't believe
any shimming is necessary, but it appears I'll be using this techique more
generally.
Thank you,
Bill
"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 7 May 2010 00:14:37 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
> wrote the following:
>
>>
>>"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>> On Thu, 6 May 2010 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
>>> wrote the following:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>>>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> end
>>>>>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>>>>>
>>>>> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all
>>>>> previous
>>>>> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to
>>>>> clean
>>>>> up.
>>>>>
>>>>> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more
>>>>> time
>>>>> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
>>>>> expert in no time. ;)
>>>>
>>>>Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
>>>>different options.
>>>>I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the
>>>>space
>>>>between
>>>>two 3.5" long tenons?"
>>>
>>> In that case, Bill, the answer is a resounding "Carefully and
>>> precisely!", of course.
>>
>>You may as well have said, "You're just talking about the space-- you
>>don't
>>need to cut the space, you need to cut the wood!" : )
>
> Verily, I could have, kind sir.
>
> BE the tenon and you will discover the truth of yourself.
>
> Namaste.
Let the wood talk to you. It knows whether or not it wants a tenon.
"Lobby Dosser" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On Fri, 7 May 2010 00:14:37 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
>> wrote the following:
>>
>>>
>>>"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>> On Thu, 6 May 2010 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
>>>> wrote the following:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>>> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>>>>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> end
>>>>>>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all
>>>>>> previous
>>>>>> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to
>>>>>> clean
>>>>>> up.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more
>>>>>> time
>>>>>> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
>>>>>> expert in no time. ;)
>>>>>
>>>>>Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
>>>>>different options.
>>>>>I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the
>>>>>space
>>>>>between
>>>>>two 3.5" long tenons?"
>>>>
>>>> In that case, Bill, the answer is a resounding "Carefully and
>>>> precisely!", of course.
>>>
>>>You may as well have said, "You're just talking about the space-- you
>>>don't
>>>need to cut the space, you need to cut the wood!" : )
>>
>> Verily, I could have, kind sir.
>>
>> BE the tenon and you will discover the truth of yourself.
>>
>> Namaste.
>
>
> Let the wood talk to you. It knows whether or not it wants a tenon.
The wood won't shut up--it's up to you to listen... T. Enon.
See!
On Fri, 7 May 2010 00:14:37 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
wrote the following:
>
>"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Thu, 6 May 2010 15:27:20 -0400, "Bill" <[email protected]>
>> wrote the following:
>>
>>>
>>>"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>> On 5/6/2010 2:19 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>>> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the
>>>>> end
>>>>> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>>>>
>>>> Bow saw and chisel; band saw and chisel; hand saw and chisel; all
>>>> previous
>>>> with coping saw to remove most of waste between tenons and chisel to
>>>> clean
>>>> up.
>>>>
>>>> These are not all that hard to do and tubafours are cheap. Spend more
>>>> time
>>>> wasting a few by practicing, and less time posting, and you'll be an
>>>> expert in no time. ;)
>>>
>>>Swingman, I do try to do my "homework" between posts. You saw me list 4
>>>different options.
>>>I didn't ask, "How do I cut a tenon?", I asked "How should I cut the
>>>space
>>>between
>>>two 3.5" long tenons?"
>>
>> In that case, Bill, the answer is a resounding "Carefully and
>> precisely!", of course.
>
>You may as well have said, "You're just talking about the space-- you don't
>need to cut the space, you need to cut the wood!" : )
Verily, I could have, kind sir.
BE the tenon and you will discover the truth of yourself.
Namaste.
--
Live forever or die in the attempt.
-- Joseph Heller, Catch 22
I would do it all on the TS and then get the last 1/2" with the BS. Any
inherent sloppiness of the BS will be minimised.
It should be easy to set a up the cut in the BS as you can just align it
using the TS kerf. I would also make a couple of extra stopped BS cuts
between the tennons to make it easier to chisel out the remaining center
accurately (follow the depth of the kerfs).
BTW I agree that making 3.5" thorugh tennons is deceiving. The geometery is
straightforward but making those cuts with the desired accuracy is
non-trivial. Make no assumptions about the squareness of your stock, jigs
and fences. Check and tripplecheck.
I helped a neighbor with a similar project (Red Oak headboard w/ 3" through
tennons). Bless him; he thought the ends of his S4S oak came from the
supplier square. He was in way over his head.
Regards,
Steve
"Bill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I have been contemplating the "best way" to cut a double-tenon on the end
> of a 4by4, the tenon should be 3.5" long 3" wide .
>
> A "dado blade" would appear to work well, perhaps even best, for
> everything except the space between the tenons--and it is this space which
> I am concerned about and which motivated me to make this post. Options
> appear to be:
>
> 1. Drilling and routing it out (from both sides, before cutting any other
> part of the tenon).
>
> 2. Cut as much of it as possible with a TS and chisel the rest of it
> away.
>
> 3, Relying on BS and (which doesn't seem as precise as #1, or even #2)
>
> 4. Other???
>
> 5. Compromise and shorten the tenon in order to cut it on a 10" TS (which
> can make a 3" cut at 90 degrees)?
>
> This is one of those details that, to the untrained eye, is easy to take
> for granted at first, and then it sort of sneaks up on you! My eye is
> still learning....
>
> This problem made me wonder whether the original designer (Garrett Hack)
> might have used a TS bigger than 10" to make easier work of this?
>
> Bill
>