What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get it? Menards has a
couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is thicker and would
need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer for spraying
that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they have 6 different
types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
Andy Arhelger
On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:59:39 -0600, Andy Arhelger
<[email protected]> wrote:
>What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get it? Menards has a
>couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is thicker and would
>need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer for spraying
>that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they have 6 different
>types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
What you want is Ultima Spray Lacquer from Target Coatings.
http://www.targetcoatings.com/products/coatings/oxford_spray_lacq.html
Waterborne, easy thinning & cleanup, fast drying, no clogging when
sanded. Its also water-clear, but tintable.
On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:46:45 -0800, Andy Arhelger
<[email protected]> wrote:
>LP wrote:
>> On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:17:23 -0800, Andy Arhelger
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice. Trouble is I couldn't
>>> find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up paying a lot for
>>> shipping.
>>>
>>> One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after spraying. I don't think
>>> it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed. I believe there
>>> was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe the surface with
>>> my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault, but I am not sure
>>> how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I an not sure why.
>>>
>> What are you using to spray with? That dust/mist in the air is very
>> uncharacteristic of HVLP so I'm guessing you're using either high
>> pressure or a high pressure conversion gun?
>
>I am using an HVLP gun.
Hmmm...since I dont know your shop I'm not sure what advice I might
offer here. when I said "That dust/mist in the air is very
uncharacteristic of HVLP" that wasnt entirely true as there will be
some amount, its just usually not much of a problem. What comes to
mind is that you need to somehow move the air in your spraying area.
Perhaps with an overhead air filter, or a simple floor fan (on low).
If you persevere you'll find ways to solve this and other problems
and, in the end, I think you'll be very happy with your finishes.
"LP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:04:32 -0600, "todd" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>I just received mine from Homestead Finishing. This will be my first
>>foray
>>into spraying. I was reading the booklet they send with the gun and from
>>what I read a good starting point for something like lacquer is to thin it
>>50%. I'm curious what your experience has been. I'm going to start
>>playing
>>with my new gun in the next day or so.
>
> Yes, Homestead adverttises as another source. I've never been able to
> get them to answer their phone.
>
I have always had great luck with Homestead and think that Jeff is the most
knowledgeable person I have ever met concerning finishing. He is a great
resource.
"Andy Arhelger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:4416f678$1@kcnews01...
> What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get
it? Menards has a
> couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is
thicker and would
> need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer
for spraying
> that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they
have 6 different
> types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
>
> Andy Arhelger
You will likely need to thin any lacquer you buy Andy. I've never shot a
lacquer - or a urethane, that didn't require reducing.
As for what you should chose - you don't give enough information. Post a
link to the web page that has the 6 lacquers you're looking at as well as
details about your clock. What type of wood? Are you shooting on shellac
first? Stain?
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
"Andy Arhelger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:442d952e$1@kcnews01...
> LP wrote:
> > On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:17:23 -0800, Andy Arhelger
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice.
Trouble is I couldn't
> >> find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up
paying a lot for
> >> shipping.
> >>
> >> One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after
spraying. I don't think
> >> it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed.
I believe there
> >> was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe
the surface with
> >> my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault,
but I am not sure
> >> how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I
an not sure why.
> >>
> > What are you using to spray with? That dust/mist in the air is very
> > uncharacteristic of HVLP so I'm guessing you're using either high
> > pressure or a high pressure conversion gun?
>
> I am using an HVLP gun.
How big is your spray area Andy? If you are working in too small of an area
you will end up with a fog in the room and it will settle on your workpiece.
Even HVLP puts overspray into the room. A lot of people think HVLP means no
overspray but in reality it's usually more like 20%-30% less overspray than
a conventional gun, but still a factor to contend with. For smaller
pieces - even the size of normal furniture, that overspray may not be a big
problem, but for bigger things the overspray becomes quite noticeable.
That's why respirators are still required even for HVLP. If the stuff
wasn't in the air, you wouldn't need a respirator.
The nice part about lacquer is that you can buff it out and get rid of that
stuff. If your spray technique was good to start with and you have a nice
even coat on the piece, you can take a little rubbing compound and buff that
dust right out of the finish and back to a nice even, shiny finish.
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
Thanks for the pointer.
I bought this stuff and have one coat on so far. It was very easy to use, dried nice, no
runs, almost no fumes, very nice. I didn't need to thin it, used it as is. Next coat goes
on tonight. Am happy so far. If this works as good as I hope it will be my preferred
finish from now on.
LP wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:59:39 -0600, Andy Arhelger
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get it? Menards has a
>> couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is thicker and would
>> need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer for spraying
>> that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they have 6 different
>> types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
>
> What you want is Ultima Spray Lacquer from Target Coatings.
>
>
> http://www.targetcoatings.com/products/coatings/oxford_spray_lacq.html
>
> Waterborne, easy thinning & cleanup, fast drying, no clogging when
> sanded. Its also water-clear, but tintable.
I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice. Trouble is I couldn't
find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up paying a lot for
shipping.
One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after spraying. I don't think
it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed. I believe there
was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe the surface with
my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault, but I am not sure
how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I an not sure why.
LP wrote:
>
> On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 11:41:53 -0800, Andy Arhelger
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for the pointer.
>>
>> I bought this stuff and have one coat on so far. It was very easy to use, dried nice, no
>> runs, almost no fumes, very nice. I didn't need to thin it, used it as is. Next coat goes
>> on tonight. Am happy so far. If this works as good as I hope it will be my preferred
>> finish from now on.
>>
>> LP wrote:
>>> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:59:39 -0600, Andy Arhelger
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get it? Menards has a
>>>> couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is thicker and would
>>>> need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer for spraying
>>>> that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they have 6 different
>>>> types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
>>> What you want is Ultima Spray Lacquer from Target Coatings.
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.targetcoatings.com/products/coatings/oxford_spray_lacq.html
>>>
>>> Waterborne, easy thinning & cleanup, fast drying, no clogging when
>>> sanded. Its also water-clear, but tintable.
>
> Glad to hear it worked out for you. I don't know of anyone who's ever
> had anything bad to say about Target's lacquer.
>
> As you get more into it, they have several other products that you
> will find to be equally impressive.
LP wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:17:23 -0800, Andy Arhelger
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice. Trouble is I couldn't
>> find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up paying a lot for
>> shipping.
>>
>> One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after spraying. I don't think
>> it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed. I believe there
>> was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe the surface with
>> my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault, but I am not sure
>> how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I an not sure why.
>>
> What are you using to spray with? That dust/mist in the air is very
> uncharacteristic of HVLP so I'm guessing you're using either high
> pressure or a high pressure conversion gun?
I am using an HVLP gun.
My spray area is about 9x11. I have an exhaust fan (not super powerful) and a window this
is opened a bit. I am happy with the finish and was able to buff out (or simply wipe off)
the overspray. I was spraying a number of larger pieces so maybe the volume of the
workspace just wasn't large enough. And fan blowing out the window might help. I will try
to fine tune the procedure. I have a picture of the finished product I should post.
Andy Arhelger
Mike Marlow wrote:
> "Andy Arhelger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:442d952e$1@kcnews01...
>> LP wrote:
>>> On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:17:23 -0800, Andy Arhelger
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice.
> Trouble is I couldn't
>>>> find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up
> paying a lot for
>>>> shipping.
>>>>
>>>> One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after
> spraying. I don't think
>>>> it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed.
> I believe there
>>>> was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe
> the surface with
>>>> my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault,
> but I am not sure
>>>> how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I
> an not sure why.
>>> What are you using to spray with? That dust/mist in the air is very
>>> uncharacteristic of HVLP so I'm guessing you're using either high
>>> pressure or a high pressure conversion gun?
>> I am using an HVLP gun.
>
> How big is your spray area Andy? If you are working in too small of an area
> you will end up with a fog in the room and it will settle on your workpiece.
> Even HVLP puts overspray into the room. A lot of people think HVLP means no
> overspray but in reality it's usually more like 20%-30% less overspray than
> a conventional gun, but still a factor to contend with. For smaller
> pieces - even the size of normal furniture, that overspray may not be a big
> problem, but for bigger things the overspray becomes quite noticeable.
> That's why respirators are still required even for HVLP. If the stuff
> wasn't in the air, you wouldn't need a respirator.
>
> The nice part about lacquer is that you can buff it out and get rid of that
> stuff. If your spray technique was good to start with and you have a nice
> even coat on the piece, you can take a little rubbing compound and buff that
> dust right out of the finish and back to a nice even, shiny finish.
>
Here are some pictures:
http://webpages.charter.net/aarhelger/clock1.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/aarhelger/clock2.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/aarhelger/clock3.jpg
Andy Arhelger
Mike Marlow wrote:
> "Andy Arhelger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:44312b82$1@kcnews01...
>> My spray area is about 9x11. I have an exhaust fan (not super powerful)
> and a window this
>> is opened a bit. I am happy with the finish and was able to buff out (or
> simply wipe off)
>> the overspray. I was spraying a number of larger pieces so maybe the
> volume of the
>> workspace just wasn't large enough. And fan blowing out the window might
> help. I will try
>> to fine tune the procedure. I have a picture of the finished product I
> should post.
>
> Yeah - go ahead and post a picture in the binaries group. I'd like to see
> what you produced.
>
> 9X11 is pretty small. It would be easy to fog an area that small. You
> might want to take a quick look at how dry your fan is (your spray fan - not
> your window fan). Maybe you're shooting just a bit too dry and creating
> more fog than you need to. Or maybe you've got just a bit too much
> pressure - also creating a bit more fog than you want. Often you can lay on
> a wetter coat to overcome this kind of problem. Or - if it just wiped off,
> you can do nothing and just keep shooting like you are. A dust that simply
> wipes off is nothing to worry about.
>
> I've painted complete cars in two bays of my garage with nothing more than a
> 24" box fan sealed under a partially opened overhead door, with no dusting
> problems. I just stick the fan on the floor and lower the overhead door
> down on it, and then seal the open space with plastic. Works very well to
> exhaust the garage on the cheap. My garage is 26 feet deep but the area
> that I drape in plastic to paint in, is about 22X23 or so, which makes it
> about twice the size of the space you're working in. Then again, I'm
> shooting a bunch more paint than you are also, and I don't usually shoot
> HVLP. I'd stick the fan in your window, blowing out and I think you'll find
> it helps evacuate the room a lot.
>
"Frank Drackman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "LP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:04:32 -0600, "todd" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I just received mine from Homestead Finishing. This will be my first
>>>foray
>>>into spraying. I was reading the booklet they send with the gun and from
>>>what I read a good starting point for something like lacquer is to thin
>>>it
>>>50%. I'm curious what your experience has been. I'm going to start
>>>playing
>>>with my new gun in the next day or so.
>>
>> Yes, Homestead adverttises as another source. I've never been able to
>> get them to answer their phone.
>>
>
>
> I have always had great luck with Homestead and think that Jeff is the
> most knowledgeable person I have ever met concerning finishing. He is a
> great resource.
That was a part of the reason I purchased the gun from him. I'm sure many,
if not most, of those here know who you're referring to, but for those who
don't, Frank is referring to Jeff Jewitt. Jeff is the author of several
books on the topic of finishing. I have his book _Hand Applied Finishes_.
todd
On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:17:23 -0800, Andy Arhelger
<[email protected]> wrote:
>I did look at their other products and some of them look very nice. Trouble is I couldn't
>find a place locally to get it. I had to mail order it and ending up paying a lot for
>shipping.
>
>One problem I had was a fine dust that settled on the finish after spraying. I don't think
>it was actually over spray because it happened on every item I sprayed. I believe there
>was a fine lacquer dust in the air that settled on things. I could wipe the surface with
>my hand after and I could see white dust on my hand. Probably my fault, but I am not sure
>how to eliminate it. The last coat I put on seemed to be better but I an not sure why.
>
What are you using to spray with? That dust/mist in the air is very
uncharacteristic of HVLP so I'm guessing you're using either high
pressure or a high pressure conversion gun?
"Andy Arhelger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:44312b82$1@kcnews01...
> My spray area is about 9x11. I have an exhaust fan (not super powerful)
and a window this
> is opened a bit. I am happy with the finish and was able to buff out (or
simply wipe off)
> the overspray. I was spraying a number of larger pieces so maybe the
volume of the
> workspace just wasn't large enough. And fan blowing out the window might
help. I will try
> to fine tune the procedure. I have a picture of the finished product I
should post.
>
Yeah - go ahead and post a picture in the binaries group. I'd like to see
what you produced.
9X11 is pretty small. It would be easy to fog an area that small. You
might want to take a quick look at how dry your fan is (your spray fan - not
your window fan). Maybe you're shooting just a bit too dry and creating
more fog than you need to. Or maybe you've got just a bit too much
pressure - also creating a bit more fog than you want. Often you can lay on
a wetter coat to overcome this kind of problem. Or - if it just wiped off,
you can do nothing and just keep shooting like you are. A dust that simply
wipes off is nothing to worry about.
I've painted complete cars in two bays of my garage with nothing more than a
24" box fan sealed under a partially opened overhead door, with no dusting
problems. I just stick the fan on the floor and lower the overhead door
down on it, and then seal the open space with plastic. Works very well to
exhaust the garage on the cheap. My garage is 26 feet deep but the area
that I drape in plastic to paint in, is about 22X23 or so, which makes it
about twice the size of the space you're working in. Then again, I'm
shooting a bunch more paint than you are also, and I don't usually shoot
HVLP. I'd stick the fan in your window, blowing out and I think you'll find
it helps evacuate the room a lot.
--
-Mike-
[email protected]
"LP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:59:39 -0600, Andy Arhelger
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get
>>it? Menards has a
>>couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is
>>thicker and would
>>need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer
>>for spraying
>>that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they
>>have 6 different
>>types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
>
> What you want is Ultima Spray Lacquer from Target Coatings.
>
>
> http://www.targetcoatings.com/products/coatings/oxford_spray_lacq.html
>
> Waterborne, easy thinning & cleanup, fast drying, no clogging when
> sanded. Its also water-clear, but tintable.
I just received mine from Homestead Finishing. This will be my first foray
into spraying. I was reading the booklet they send with the gun and from
what I read a good starting point for something like lacquer is to thin it
50%. I'm curious what your experience has been. I'm going to start playing
with my new gun in the next day or so.
For the OP, as for Sherwin-Williams, if you were going to go that direction,
they make a pre-cat lacquer that you can get in 4 different gloss levels,
IIRC. I also seem to remember them recommending their vinyl sealer as a
first coat.
todd
On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 19:17:27 -0500, LP <[email protected]>
wrote:
>
>Off the top of my head Homestead Finishinging is another seller. If
>you go to http://www.targetcoatings.com they have a rather short
>distributors list.
Thanks!
It looks like it's direct to Target or Homestead.
My local guys can often get many niche finishing products via large
wholesalers, which saves me money (often on shipping AND product), and
gives them a new item to stock. It dosen't look like Target deals
with any of the wholesalers I recognize. If they did, the locals can
often get a minimal quantity combined with a large order, which is in
turn shipped LTL truck, which is where the savings kicks in.
When it works, it's great to have good local retailer relationships.
I've been known to learn of a product here, or in one of the better
woodworking rags, suggest it to them, school them on the basic uses
and benefits of the product, and before you know it, other locals are
using and loving it. I actually did this a few years back with Seal
Coat, and nowadays, it's not unusual for the guys to toss me a free
can. <G>
On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 11:41:53 -0800, Andy Arhelger
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Thanks for the pointer.
>
>I bought this stuff and have one coat on so far. It was very easy to use, dried nice, no
>runs, almost no fumes, very nice. I didn't need to thin it, used it as is. Next coat goes
>on tonight. Am happy so far. If this works as good as I hope it will be my preferred
>finish from now on.
>
>LP wrote:
>> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:59:39 -0600, Andy Arhelger
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> What type/brand of lacquer do you use for spraying and where do you get it? Menards has a
>>> couple types of brushing lacquer. As I understand it brushing lacquer is thicker and would
>>> need to be thinned more. Maybe not a big deal. Does anybody make a lacquer for spraying
>>> that would be thinner? I checked the Sherwin-Williams web page and they have 6 different
>>> types of lacquers, which one would I use for a clock I am making?
>>
>> What you want is Ultima Spray Lacquer from Target Coatings.
>>
>>
>> http://www.targetcoatings.com/products/coatings/oxford_spray_lacq.html
>>
>> Waterborne, easy thinning & cleanup, fast drying, no clogging when
>> sanded. Its also water-clear, but tintable.
Glad to hear it worked out for you. I don't know of anyone who's ever
had anything bad to say about Target's lacquer.
As you get more into it, they have several other products that you
will find to be equally impressive.
"LP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:04:32 -0600, "todd" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>I just received mine from Homestead Finishing. This will be my first
>>foray
>>into spraying. I was reading the booklet they send with the gun and from
>>what I read a good starting point for something like lacquer is to thin it
>>50%. I'm curious what your experience has been. I'm going to start
>>playing
>>with my new gun in the next day or so.
>
> Yes, Homestead adverttises as another source. I've never been able to
> get them to answer their phone.
I've called three times and gotten an answer three times.
> As for thinning:
> I'm using an Accuspray turbine driven HVLP gun. Most waterborne
> lacquers, even tho they appear thick, spray fine right out of the can.
> I dont remember the exact number but I think Target recommends adding
> a maximum of 10-20% water if thinning is necessary. They also have a
> "flow out additive", which thins the product and retards drying
> somewhat.
>
> Thinning to 50% sounds like the older nitrocellulose lacquers shot
> thru a high pressure gun. 50% with the waterborne finishes would be
> way too much.
Thanks for the info. I've just started reading and haven't even gotten to
the Target instructions yet.
> You didnt say what type of gun, however:
I have a Walcom Slim-S, which is a compressor-fed HVLP.
> I have no actual experience with waterborne products and high pressure
> guns, but if I had to do it that way, I'd start with the finish at
> full strength and add water until it sprayed properly. You might also
> need to go to a larger tip. A few minutes experimentation should get
> you in the ball park.
I expect it will take me a bit of experimentation to dial it in. Thanks
again.
todd
On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 13:09:52 GMT, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
>LP wrote:
>
>>
>> Glad to hear it worked out for you. I don't know of anyone who's ever
>> had anything bad to say about Target's lacquer.
>
>I have got to try that stuff...
>
>Do you know who distributes it, so I can ask my local guys to get me some?
Off the top of my head Homestead Finishinging is another seller. If
you go to http://www.targetcoatings.com they have a rather short
distributors list.
I've always just dealt direct with Target. They use FEDEX which is
quite quick, and if FEDEX bends up your can Target will replace it
instantly no questions asked.
On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:04:32 -0600, "todd" <[email protected]> wrote:
>I just received mine from Homestead Finishing. This will be my first foray
>into spraying. I was reading the booklet they send with the gun and from
>what I read a good starting point for something like lacquer is to thin it
>50%. I'm curious what your experience has been. I'm going to start playing
>with my new gun in the next day or so.
Yes, Homestead adverttises as another source. I've never been able to
get them to answer their phone.
As for thinning:
I'm using an Accuspray turbine driven HVLP gun. Most waterborne
lacquers, even tho they appear thick, spray fine right out of the can.
I dont remember the exact number but I think Target recommends adding
a maximum of 10-20% water if thinning is necessary. They also have a
"flow out additive", which thins the product and retards drying
somewhat.
Thinning to 50% sounds like the older nitrocellulose lacquers shot
thru a high pressure gun. 50% with the waterborne finishes would be
way too much.
You didnt say what type of gun, however:
I have no actual experience with waterborne products and high pressure
guns, but if I had to do it that way, I'd start with the finish at
full strength and add water until it sprayed properly. You might also
need to go to a larger tip. A few minutes experimentation should get
you in the ball park.