dust collection shed - any thoughts?

Mike, weather you attach the shed or not, you should return the air to the
shop. The air your removing will have to be replaced somehow. If you don't
return it thru duct work, it will replace its self thru loose windows, doors,
cracks ect. You may want to heat the place some day. Put a filter on the return
air duct to reduce dust. If you are concerned about noise, you can insulate the
duct on the INSIDE. Duct insulation is available at HVAC suppliers or have a
sheet metal shop do it for you. Make sure you size the duct so the insulation
doesn't restrict the air. Making the duct oversized will slow the air down and
serve to quiet the rushing sound as the air leaves the duct.
Mike in LC
PS By the way, My wife and I visited your seaport last Oct. Wonderful place. Of
course we had to stop for pizza.

Mike,

I have built things like this in industrial situations, so some of my
experience may apply to your situation.

1. The compressor -- these things are usually in a corner away from
everything else, although it is best to keep it above freezing due to water
buildup in the compressed air. This may not be a problem if it gets plenty
of use -- compression heats the air, so things stay warm of their own
accord. Otherwise, no issues, just keep it dry.

2. Most of the dust reclaimation I have done has been with toxic or
corrosive chemicals, so returning the air to the shop was not an option.
With wood dust that is probably not a real issue (but there will be fine
particles blowing through the bag...). The blower will probably not care if
it gets cold, so where it lives should not be an issue. I expect that you
will have ductwork inside the shop to collect the contaminated air, then
shove it through a centrifugal seperator and into a bag house of some sort.
Yes, this can get pretty noisy. Industrial applications just park all this
stuff outside in a shed -- often on the roof for convenience. The suction
line can just be punched through the wall. But you have to deal with the
makeup air and/or the return. I would just have an intake grill of
sufficient size with a washable filter to screen out the bugs and low flying
birds -- letting air in from outside. I presume you are switching this
system with your power tools. You could bring the bag house air back in
through a big duct with insulation inside to dampen the noise -- it is
tricky to get right but doable. But I wouldn't do that simply because of the
real fine particles that just blow through the bags.

The sheds for this stuff are nothing fancy, just something to keep the snow
and rain away. And no point making it air tight, may even need an exit
grill.

Hope this helps.

greg


--
Greg Latiak
[email protected]
Images http://members.rogers.com/greglatiak/

"Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:Jd83b.34674
>
> I'm about decided on building a small enclosure behind my garage shop to
> house my dust collector and air compressor. I want to free up space and
> reduce noise and improve air quality, if possible.
>
> Also, is it acceptable
> to just build a secondary structure and then simply cut a hole through the
> garage wall and run a bit of duct in order to tie in to the dust collector
> vs. attaching the structure directly to the outside wall? Obviously, if
it
> isn't a big deal, I would rather make this "shed" stand alone and not mess
> with the garage.

Hi Mike,
Any "news" yet?

My plan was to add a shed on the back of my garage, but other things came up
and it will probably wait until spring.

In my case, adding on the back of the garage means building three walls
instead of four. I'll use the same siding as the garage. My intent is to
put the DC in there along with other accumulated non-wood related stuff.
The DC will suck some air from the barely heated garage. I'm going to add
in a vent with a filter. That will allow air to return, but keep out the
unwanted dust particles. While it will make for more total heat loss than I
have now, it will be better than the 100% loss of no return.

My shed will not be visible from the street. It is a detached garage and
the addition will be 10 x 12. If all you are doing is putting the DC and AC
in there, it can be pretty small keeping heat loss minimal. It can also be
a "feature" if you decide to sell in a few years. The new buyers may like
having a place for the trash cans.
Ed
[email protected]
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
>
> "Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:Jd83b.34674
> >
> > I'm about decided on building a small enclosure behind my garage shop to
> > house my dust collector and air compressor. I want to free up space and
> > reduce noise and improve air quality, if possible.
> >
> > Also, is it acceptable
> > to just build a secondary structure and then simply cut a hole through the
> > garage wall and run a bit of duct in order to tie in to the dust collector
> > vs. attaching the structure directly to the outside wall? Obviously, if
> it
> > isn't a big deal, I would rather make this "shed" stand alone and not mess
> > with the garage.
>
> Hi Mike,
> Any "news" yet?
>
> My plan was to add a shed on the back of my garage, but other things came up
> and it will probably wait until spring.
>
> In my case, adding on the back of the garage means building three walls
> instead of four. I'll use the same siding as the garage. My intent is to
> put the DC in there along with other accumulated non-wood related stuff.
> The DC will suck some air from the barely heated garage. I'm going to add
> in a vent with a filter. That will allow air to return, but keep out the
> unwanted dust particles. While it will make for more total heat loss than I
> have now, it will be better than the 100% loss of no return.
>
> My shed will not be visible from the street. It is a detached garage and
> the addition will be 10 x 12. If all you are doing is putting the DC and AC
> in there, it can be pretty small keeping heat loss minimal. It can also be
> a "feature" if you decide to sell in a few years. The new buyers may like
> having a place for the trash cans.
> Ed

If the garage isn't insulated and the addition is, then you
have effectively insulated part of one wall of your garage.
A reduction of heat loss.


If you vent all the filtered air back into your shop, all
the work the blower did on the air is returned in the form
of heated air. Another small gain. The amount of heat added
to the air is essentially the equivalent of the actual shaft
horsepower of the motor as you are using it. If you have a 2
hp motor and your blower actually loads it to a 2 hp load,
it's close to a 1500 Watt heater.

Rico


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Mike in Mystic wrote:

> Anyway, I don't think I'll get to this project until next spring either,
> unless something very miraculous occurs and SWMBO decides I can leave the
> baby's bodily function maintenance entirely up to her hehe.

Not much chance of that in this day and age. I just deleted my long post.
I didn't want to scare you. :)

I have mixed feelings about the baby days. Good stuff, bad stuff...
Sometimes I think having a third wouldn't be that bad, and other days I'm
realllllly glad that's no longer supposed to be feasible, and that thing we
had to sign about there being some out there chance of the sterilization
procedure spontaneously reversing itself after 10 years has me a little
edgy some nights.

Enjoy the baby. There's no other experience quite like it. That's for
sure... :)

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
Confirmed post number: 17428 Approximate word count: 522840
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

Hi Ed,

Yes, there is news, indeed. His name is Charles (Charlie) Michael Logman
and he was born on 8/21 at 5:01 PM, 9 lb. 0.4 oz. and 20.5" long (that's
just under 1' 23/32" hehe). He's doing great (and I haven't been in the
shop in a week and a half and am not sure when I will get back!).

I see what you mean about the heat loss as I'm in the exact same type of
situation as you. Even with that 80,000 BTU propane heater I got this last
winter, I don't know how much heat was being held in the shop. But, I guess
if I start pulling 1200 cfm of hot air out of the room, it won't be any
warmer.

My problem is that the garage has a dormer roof (I'm not really sure on the
terminology, but I think that's what it is). Basically the front of the
roof has a different pitch than the back adn the back slope comes very low
to the ground (something like 5 feet or so at teh outside edge). So, I
don't think I can really build anything attached to that wall without ending
up with something pretty bizarre looking. I was really thinking of pouring
some kind of concrete slab for the DC and AC to sit on and then building
some kind of "temporary" enclosure so if/when we move it won't be tough to
just take the thing down and bury the concrete slab hehe.

I'm not sure if the compressor will do too well in an uninsulated area,
though, as some of the responders pointed out. The main thing for me is to
get the DC outside so I have more room and then it should be easier to run
some PVC and improve my dust collection. At present, after 2 or 3 weeks of
working my shop is throughly covered with dust, even though I use the DC all
the time.

Anyway, I don't think I'll get to this project until next spring either,
unless something very miraculous occurs and SWMBO decides I can leave the
baby's bodily function maintenance entirely up to her hehe.

Let us know how things go when you get to this project, maybe I can adapt
some of what you learn or vice versa.

Mike



--

There are no stupid questions.
There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.


"Edwin Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:Jd83b.34674
> >
> > I'm about decided on building a small enclosure behind my garage shop to
> > house my dust collector and air compressor. I want to free up space and
> > reduce noise and improve air quality, if possible.
> >
> > Also, is it acceptable
> > to just build a secondary structure and then simply cut a hole through
the
> > garage wall and run a bit of duct in order to tie in to the dust
collector
> > vs. attaching the structure directly to the outside wall? Obviously, if
> it
> > isn't a big deal, I would rather make this "shed" stand alone and not
mess
> > with the garage.
>
> Hi Mike,
> Any "news" yet?
>
> My plan was to add a shed on the back of my garage, but other things came
up
> and it will probably wait until spring.
>
> In my case, adding on the back of the garage means building three walls
> instead of four. I'll use the same siding as the garage. My intent is to
> put the DC in there along with other accumulated non-wood related stuff.
> The DC will suck some air from the barely heated garage. I'm going to add
> in a vent with a filter. That will allow air to return, but keep out the
> unwanted dust particles. While it will make for more total heat loss than
I
> have now, it will be better than the 100% loss of no return.
>
> My shed will not be visible from the street. It is a detached garage and
> the addition will be 10 x 12. If all you are doing is putting the DC and
AC
> in there, it can be pretty small keeping heat loss minimal. It can also
be
> a "feature" if you decide to sell in a few years. The new buyers may like
> having a place for the trash cans.
> Ed
> [email protected]
> http://pages.cthome.net/edhome
>
>
>

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 20:09:13 GMT, "Mike in Mystic"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Some particular things I'm interested in are whether or not you returned the
>air back to the shop.

My inclination would be to not do this.

- A return path for air is a return path for compressor noise.

- Returning the air also means sealing the shed, lest the draughts
when not extracting make things colder than the heat saved by the
returned air.

- You're usually pulling dust extractor air from near floor level,
where it's coldest. This is the least valuable air to hang onto.

- I don't think you need it (although the most wintery I've been to
Boston was in November, and when I went in April I got sunburn !)


Even if you do go this way, you're only going to _want_ to return the
air for maybe 4 months of the year, the months you're least inclined
to be out in the workshop. So make it configurable either way - put a
shutter on the return duct and leave it blocked for much of the year.

"Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> I'm not sure if the compressor will do too well in an uninsulated area,
> though, as some of the responders pointed out.
> Mike

Most ALL commercial users have the air compressor outside. Good reason.
That is where they belong. <g>
--
Jim in NC