Help on some finish work?

On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Here in Las Vegas, real wood is virtually nonexistent for trim.
>The baseboards and door trim are made of a cardboard-like
>material.

I abhor that crap! It's what we used in the Habitat home and it took
about 40 nails per length to make it fit the wall tightly. Crom help
the guy who removes it for recarpeting.


>Doors have pre-mitered trim kits of the stuff, and that
>includes the casing as well. Windows here are aluminum trimmed on
>the outside and without trim on the inside. Surprisingly, the
>drywall is generally somewhere between very good-to-excellent in
>quality, with an orange peel texture on the ceiling and walls.
>Corners are ROUNDED, as opposed to square. This means that the
>baseboards are cut square and there's a transition piece on each
>outside corner.
>
>BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
>ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
>found exactly the same cardboard trim.

Disgusting.

--
Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
-- Earl Warren

On Mar 29, 1:35=A0am, Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:
> Larry Jaques wrote:
> > On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
> > "[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
> > following:
>
> >>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>
> > The irony strikes hard, Robert. =A0There's a phrase I never thought I'd
> > see on the Wreck. =A0"the correct grade of MDF." =A0Whoda thunk it?
> > <g>
>
> =A0 Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
> realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material. =A0A grou=
p of
> us helped our pre-school teacher move yesterday. =A0I helped the group wh=
o re-
> assembled the bedroom furniture; with the exception of the 3 pine 1 x 3
> slats across the width of the base, everything was MDF (fortunately, it t=
he
> lightweight breed of MDF). =A0The lower rails: 8" wide rounded over and
> painted (outside only) MDF with a 2" strip of MDF on the inside to serve =
as
> the ledge for the mattress slats. =A0Headboard and footboard completely M=
DF. =A0
> The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the mirror, the re=
st
> was all MDF. =A0One could probably buy the materials for the entire bedro=
om
> suite for less than $300. =A0Absolutely amazing.
>
> ... snip
>
> --
>
> There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage
>
> Rob Leatham


Don't confuse MDF with particleboard. What i'm speaking of is MDF,
medium density fiberboard

On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
following:

>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.

The irony strikes hard, Robert. There's a phrase I never thought I'd
see on the Wreck. "the correct grade of MDF." Whoda thunk it?
<g>

>It also comes in anywhere from 1/4' to 1" thickness like my old
>router table top. You can buy this, rip is, ease an edge over with a
>router as needed, and you are on your way to making your own trims.
>
>To finish the MDF, shoot it with BIN, not KILZ. BIN seals better and
>adheres better than just about anything. I like to prime first, then
>caulk/seal as it shows EVERY detail that needs to be corrected. After
>caulking/filling/re-sanding, reprime as needed. With a good coat of
>primer on the material, a couple of coats of quality enamel should
>give you great wear.

Excellent ideas, Naily. I shall have to remember them.


>As for the door, if you want maximum wear, use poly. These days, I
>wouldn't want to live on the edge of difference between poly, but my
>personal experience is that poly is more easily cleaned (and stands up
>to cleaning better than varnish) and is much more abrasion resistant.

What do you use to refinish after the <ick> poly? What's your
favorite DEpolyer?

--
"Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein
-=-=-

Picasso wrote:

> On Mar 29, 1:35 am, Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Larry Jaques wrote:
>> > On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
>> > "[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
>> > following:
>>
>> >>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>>
>> > The irony strikes hard, Robert.  There's a phrase I never thought I'd
>> > see on the Wreck.  "the correct grade of MDF."  Whoda thunk it?
>> > <g>
>>
>> Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
>> realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material.  A group
>> of us helped our pre-school teacher move yesterday.  I helped the group
>> who re- assembled the bedroom furniture; with the exception of the 3 pine
>> 1 x 3 slats across the width of the base, everything was MDF
>> (fortunately, it the lightweight breed of MDF).  The lower rails: 8" wide
>> rounded over and painted (outside only) MDF with a 2" strip of MDF on the
>> inside to serve as the ledge for the mattress slats.  Headboard and
>> footboard completely MDF. The only wood on the dresser was part of the
>> frame for the mirror, the rest was all MDF.  One could probably buy the
>> materials for the entire bedroom suite for less than $300.  Absolutely
>> amazing.
>>
>> ... snip
>>
>> --
>>
>> There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage
>>
>> Rob Leatham
>
>
> Don't confuse MDF with particleboard. What i'm speaking of is MDF,
> medium density fiberboard

As am I. The furniture in question was most assuredly *not* particle
board, it was MDF, the grain was very fine compared to particle board. The
binder however was lighter as it wasn't evil heavy, just moderately so.


--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>> Here in Las Vegas, real wood is virtually nonexistent for trim.
>> The baseboards and door trim are made of a cardboard-like
>> material.
>
> I abhor that crap! It's what we used in the Habitat home and it took
> about 40 nails per length to make it fit the wall tightly. Crom help
> the guy who removes it for recarpeting.
>
>
>> Doors have pre-mitered trim kits of the stuff, and that
>> includes the casing as well. Windows here are aluminum trimmed on
>> the outside and without trim on the inside. Surprisingly, the
>> drywall is generally somewhere between very good-to-excellent in
>> quality, with an orange peel texture on the ceiling and walls.
>> Corners are ROUNDED, as opposed to square. This means that the
>> baseboards are cut square and there's a transition piece on each
>> outside corner.
>>
>> BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
>> ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
>> found exactly the same cardboard trim.
>
> Disgusting.
>
> --
> Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
> -- Earl Warren

I have never seen this cardboard trim.. what are you talking about

On Mar 28, 10:35 pm, Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:

> Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
> realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material.

If you are in the building industry itself, I think even then it takes
a minute to think through how pervasive the use of MDF is in
building. Sometimes you use it but don't know it. And even if you
are installing a "wood" product, it is likely that it has MDF of one
grade or another in it somewhere.

> The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the mirror, the rest
> was all MDF. One could probably buy the materials for the entire bedroom
> suite for less than $300. Absolutely amazing.

The first time I saw a lot of MDF (the raw, naked stuff) used on a job
was when I was called to install a very expensive front door with a
very difficult box lock and hardware. The door/hardware installation
was all I was there to do.

The door was mounted in a heavy wood jamb. But all the trims, in and
out were MDF. The outside trim bundle was a package that came clearly
marked as the outside facing, and was some kind of very water
resistant stuff. It was heavy almost like it was solid resin.

I thought it was total crap when I installed it, but boy was I wrong.
They (client was an architect) wanted the MDF for the sharpness of
detail and the fact the outside layered pattern could be purchased as
a bundle. The trim went on fine, held nails great, and was easy to
cut. But the real star was when that stuff was finished.... wow!

Smooth, flat, all detailing and profiles were crisp and clean.

Inside, they used all MDF as well, except in the bathrooms.

The product looked great when installed inside, but they didn't prep
it and install it correctly as they handled the material like it was
regular wood trim. I didn't pay attention at the time as I was only
there to install the door and the lock, but I went back there later
for other work.

They didn't let the material acclimate, didn't glue or pin the joints,
they didn't seal the back of the trim before installing, and they
tried to use 45 degree scarfs on the joints.

You know the rest. The joints move, the open and close, the move away
from each other, etc. It still looks good, just not great.

Now a lot of that stuff I see is preprimed, so that's half the battle
right there. I don't think that it will be long before almost all our
trims are MDF, and wood (even finger jointed) will be special order
only.

Never thought I would live long enough to see it, but when the next
building boom hits, I am sure of it.

Robert

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:50:29 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
following:

>On Mar 28, 6:45 pm, Larry Jaques <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> >You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>>
>> The irony strikes hard, Robert.  There's a phrase I never thought I'd
>> see on the Wreck.  "the correct grade of MDF."  Whoda thunk it?
>> <g>
>
>It's nasty. But then, so is the "#1" grade, or "clear" grade of woods
>we have to work with these days. I have finished enough warped
>Chilean pine to reforest a small country. That seems to be the only
>clear stuff available that someone can afford. But with its aversion
>to moisture and problems it can bring with installation, a lot have
>turned to MDF. Personally, I would have never believed it either.
>But the hard, super dense stuff wears better than wood, and will give
>a great finish.

PAINTED finish, you mean? Agreed.


>> What do you use to refinish after the <ick> poly?  What's your
>> favorite DEpolyer?
>
>I don't mess around. I go straight for the guns on that. I buy from
>Dave here:
>
> http://kwickkleen.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=109

Wow, judging by the first page, his prices are great! He sells the
good stuff for 1/4 the price the Borgs get.


>Call him and ask him what you need. He has stuff that will
>permanently scar you in just minutes; it isn't the HD stuff. I used
>to buy his stuff 10 gallons at a time when I had a good line on
>refinishing work. (He also sells the best conversion lacquer made.)
>He sold me some stripper that cut through layers of oil based finish
>with one pass. I refinished some doors that had been "recoated" with
>poly over varnish, etc., to get about 5 coats of finish. His stuff
>ate it ALL off in just two coatings. Outside use only, will gloves,
>respirator, plenty of rags and heavy disposal bags.

I used the MEK-based strippers on Imron and the like, so I'm familiar
with precautions. Vapors come right through nitrile and latex gloves,
so I put on latex and two layers of nitrile when I work with it. At
he first sign of a chilly feeling (precedes the burning) I swap 'em
all out for new.


>If it isn't a really tough job, I like the BIX in the orange/red can.
>It is pretty effective.

Never tried it.


>Anymore Larry, I wouldn't worry about the difference between the
>polys, varnishes, and the products in between. They are all pretty
>much down to a finite difference the man made resins they use as well
>as the mix of solvents. Special applications still require certain
>products, and for example there isn't a substitute for a good marine
>grade varnish due to its elasticity and excellent UV resistance.

True.


>On the other hand, some of the super polys cure harder than varnish
>will, so that makes them more cleanable and more suitable for hard
>wear surfaces like floors, table tops, high use doors, etc.

Yeah, I wanted to try it out so I used Behlen's Rockhard varnish on my
recycled dining set. It had been outside for a month and the sun had
peeled some of the oak veneer off the MDF. Amazingly enough, the TTV
matched the oak veneer and the MDF perfectly. Unless you look closely,
you won't see the missing veneer which I feathered smooth. TTV has
phenolic resins, like the Waterlox I dearly love. TTV is so thick, it
takes away all "hand" from the wood, which I don't like. It doesn't
hide its plastic makeup, but it is fairly tough stuff with a nice,
amber tone, like older oil-based varnishes.

--
Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
-- Earl Warren

On Mar 28, 6:45=A0pm, Larry Jaques <[email protected]> wrote:

> >You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>
> The irony strikes hard, Robert. =A0There's a phrase I never thought I'd
> see on the Wreck. =A0"the correct grade of MDF." =A0Whoda thunk it?
> <g>

It's nasty. But then, so is the "#1" grade, or "clear" grade of woods
we have to work with these days. I have finished enough warped
Chilean pine to reforest a small country. That seems to be the only
clear stuff available that someone can afford. But with its aversion
to moisture and problems it can bring with installation, a lot have
turned to MDF. Personally, I would have never believed it either.
But the hard, super dense stuff wears better than wood, and will give
a great finish.


> What do you use to refinish after the <ick> poly? =A0What's your
> favorite DEpolyer?

I don't mess around. I go straight for the guns on that. I buy from
Dave here:

http://kwickkleen.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=3D109

Call him and ask him what you need. He has stuff that will
permanently scar you in just minutes; it isn't the HD stuff. I used
to buy his stuff 10 gallons at a time when I had a good line on
refinishing work. (He also sells the best conversion lacquer made.)
He sold me some stripper that cut through layers of oil based finish
with one pass. I refinished some doors that had been "recoated" with
poly over varnish, etc., to get about 5 coats of finish. His stuff
ate it ALL off in just two coatings. Outside use only, will gloves,
respirator, plenty of rags and heavy disposal bags.

If it isn't a really tough job, I like the BIX in the orange/red can.
It is pretty effective.

Anymore Larry, I wouldn't worry about the difference between the
polys, varnishes, and the products in between. They are all pretty
much down to a finite difference the man made resins they use as well
as the mix of solvents. Special applications still require certain
products, and for example there isn't a substitute for a good marine
grade varnish due to its elasticity and excellent UV resistance.

On the other hand, some of the super polys cure harder than varnish
will, so that makes them more cleanable and more suitable for hard
wear surfaces like floors, table tops, high use doors, etc.

Robert

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:74ac152d-1f1d-4a3c-be8e-6c3231455cc1@i25g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 28, 10:35 pm, Mark & Juanita <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I
>> did not
>> realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material.
>
> If you are in the building industry itself, I think even then it
> takes
> a minute to think through how pervasive the use of MDF is in
> building. Sometimes you use it but don't know it. And even if
> you
> are installing a "wood" product, it is likely that it has MDF of
> one
> grade or another in it somewhere.
>
>> The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the
>> mirror, the rest
>> was all MDF. One could probably buy the materials for the
>> entire bedroom
>> suite for less than $300. Absolutely amazing.
>
> The first time I saw a lot of MDF (the raw, naked stuff) used on
> a job
> was when I was called to install a very expensive front door
> with a
> very difficult box lock and hardware. The door/hardware
> installation
> was all I was there to do.
>
> The door was mounted in a heavy wood jamb. But all the trims,
> in and
> out were MDF. The outside trim bundle was a package that came
> clearly
> marked as the outside facing, and was some kind of very water
> resistant stuff. It was heavy almost like it was solid resin.
>
> I thought it was total crap when I installed it, but boy was I
> wrong.
> They (client was an architect) wanted the MDF for the sharpness
> of
> detail and the fact the outside layered pattern could be
> purchased as
> a bundle. The trim went on fine, held nails great, and was easy
> to
> cut. But the real star was when that stuff was finished....
> wow!
>
> Smooth, flat, all detailing and profiles were crisp and clean.
>
> Inside, they used all MDF as well, except in the bathrooms.
>
> The product looked great when installed inside, but they didn't
> prep
> it and install it correctly as they handled the material like it
> was
> regular wood trim. I didn't pay attention at the time as I was
> only
> there to install the door and the lock, but I went back there
> later
> for other work.
>
> They didn't let the material acclimate, didn't glue or pin the
> joints,
> they didn't seal the back of the trim before installing, and
> they
> tried to use 45 degree scarfs on the joints.
>
> You know the rest. The joints move, the open and close, the
> move away
> from each other, etc. It still looks good, just not great.
>
> Now a lot of that stuff I see is preprimed, so that's half the
> battle
> right there. I don't think that it will be long before almost
> all our
> trims are MDF, and wood (even finger jointed) will be special
> order
> only.
>
> Never thought I would live long enough to see it, but when the
> next
> building boom hits, I am sure of it.
>
> Robert


Here in Las Vegas, real wood is virtually nonexistent for trim.
The baseboards and door trim are made of a cardboard-like
material. Doors have pre-mitered trim kits of the stuff, and that
includes the casing as well. Windows here are aluminum trimmed on
the outside and without trim on the inside. Surprisingly, the
drywall is generally somewhere between very good-to-excellent in
quality, with an orange peel texture on the ceiling and walls.
Corners are ROUNDED, as opposed to square. This means that the
baseboards are cut square and there's a transition piece on each
outside corner.

BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
found exactly the same cardboard trim.

--
Nonny
Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member
of Congress.... But then I repeat myself.'

-Mark Twain
.

"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 01 Apr 2010 21:06:20 -0300, the infamous Picasso
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>Larry Jaques wrote:
>>> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
>>> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>>> BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker
>>>> box
>>>> ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m,
>>>> and
>>>> found exactly the same cardboard trim.
>>>
>>> Disgusting.
>>
>>I have never seen this cardboard trim.. what are you talking
>>about
>
> It's made of pressboard, like a soft, very low-grade hardboard.
> If
> you bend it, it comes apart like cardboard delaminating. I
> think some
> of the manufacturers are calling it "ultralight MDF", but it's
> nothing
> at all like wood or termite barf (MDF.) It's cheap, like $3 a
> stick,
> and flimsy, and horrible to work with.
>
> I simply cannot find a picture of this crap on the Web. <shrug>

Your description is right on. The stuff is molded, since the
details would fuzz off if it was routed. It's not unlike a low
grade of tempered hardboard. I've seen this kind of stuff used
for exterior lap siding in NC, and it was the subject of a class
action suit due to it taking on water, swell and soften back to
its cardboard heritage. When broken, it doesn't break cleanly
but in layers. It has pretty decent impact strength, since it is
almost impossible to dent with a hammer. . . though you'd like to.
<grin> The stuff is found even in multimillion dollar McMansions
here in the southwest, and I'm sure it's coming to a Home Depot
near the rest of you. When you cut it on the edge, as around a
door, it'll cut and hold the 45. However, on a baseboard, cut on
the flat, the joint fuzzes and looks like crud. Coping the joint
is impossible. That and the fact that most of the trim folk in
the southwest don't even own "no steenkin" miter saw, is why the
baseboards are cut square and fitted to a transition block on
outside corners. <grin> I'm kidding here, of course, since the
transition is needed because of the 1" radius used on almost all
outside drywall corners.

BTW, getting back to the cardboard trim, it isn't very water
resistant. I was in a mountain cabin once and noticed a very
unusual look to the door trim of the guy's back door. The bottom
of the trim was swelled out, both from the wall and parallel to
the baseboard, up about 6" from the floor. The door had some
water that came in by the threshold and the water was wicked up
the unsealed bottom of the cardboard trim, swelling it like a
sponge.

I'm all for progress in housing materials, but most of the "new
stuff" of the 90's and 2000's is a step backward.


--
Nonny
Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member
of Congress.... But then I repeat myself.'

-Mark Twain
.

My description :

Make a tank of tree soup from scraps - make sure all particles and strands are
in the micron size - e.g. soupy malt mix - then extruded and heated in the
stream. Out comes a stick. Made from bleached junk wood.

Martin

Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Thu, 01 Apr 2010 21:06:20 -0300, the infamous Picasso
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>> Larry Jaques wrote:
>>> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
>>> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>>> BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
>>>> ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
>>>> found exactly the same cardboard trim.
>>> Disgusting.
>> I have never seen this cardboard trim.. what are you talking about
>
> It's made of pressboard, like a soft, very low-grade hardboard. If
> you bend it, it comes apart like cardboard delaminating. I think some
> of the manufacturers are calling it "ultralight MDF", but it's nothing
> at all like wood or termite barf (MDF.) It's cheap, like $3 a stick,
> and flimsy, and horrible to work with.
>
> I simply cannot find a picture of this crap on the Web. <shrug>
>
> --
> It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent,
> but the one most responsive to change.
> -- Charles Darwin

On Mar 27, 9:10=A0pm, Picasso <[email protected]> wrote:
> Really like the look of these doors with the white trim...
>
> http://www.selectdoorexchange.com/pageView.cfm/pageID/275
> This one here looks like the same house/trim toohttp://www.selectdoorexch=
ange.com/pageView.cfm/pageID/273
>
> Trying to figure out how to replicate this trim in my home. =A0Only
> thing i'm not REAL crazy over is the quarter round on the floor
> against the base trim, but with the high base, it does actually look
> ok.
>
> What i'm thinking is this:
>
> 5/8" thick door case, approx 3" wide?
>
> Cap on the door looks like it might be 3/4" thick about 4" high,
> overhung 1/2" over the side case, and looks like a piece of 3/4" on its
> side, overhanging the cap by about 1/4" on the front, and 1/2" on the
> right and left?
>
> Base looks like its 3/8" because it doesnt look to be as thick as the
> door case??? =A0not sure what that base is....
>

I won't comment on what the material is since it's tough to really
know from a photo. I just finished up the trim in our new home over
the weekend; we modeled it after a 1917 prairie style home we now have
as a rental. I came into about 3k linear feet of quarter and rift
sawn red oak, ~5" wide x heavy 4/4, random lengths 8-12' so I used
that to make the trim. Painted it all builder's white of course
since I didn't want to see all that straight boring grain and those
funny rays; luckily there was only one knot to fill in the whole
house.

The headers, and legs for door's are the same thickness in both the
repro and the original. The juncture at the bottom of the door is
managed by plinth blocks with about 1/8" to 3/32" reveal. Plinths are
about 3/8" taller than the base, IIRC. In the photo you linked to the
legs go all the way to the floor. If you have a wide baseboard with
tile/wood/laminate you'll probably need some sort of shoe molding.
Even if the floor is perfectly flat now, in 50 years it probably won't
be. If you don't like the qtr round, you can make the shoe taller
and integrate it into the visual for the base so it doesn't look like
it was added in a fit of desperation.

As has been said elsewhere in replies to your message: mock up a full
door (and window if you can) before you commit to production. During
the mock up you can play with the subtle details even you already have
a basic plan.

(Ok, for those actually read this message: finish was really two
coats Pratt & Lambert stain followed by two coats of ML Campbell
lacquer, but there is really only one visible knot and it's in a
closet.)


hex
-30-

On Mar 27, 8:10=A0pm, Picasso <[email protected]> wrote:
> Really like the look of these doors with the white trim...
>
> http://www.selectdoorexchange.com/pageView.cfm/pageID/275
> This one here looks like the same house/trim toohttp://www.selectdoorexch=
ange.com/pageView.cfm/pageID/273
>
> Trying to figure out how to replicate this trim in my home. =A0Only
> thing i'm not REAL crazy over is the quarter round on the floor
> against the base trim, but with the high base, it does actually look
> ok.

These are pretty popular trim details these days. Simple trims with
little or no profiles seem to be going in more and more upper end
houses and office finish outs.

If you are going to do your whole house, take a moment and make the
trim to test out its appearance. Hang your door, and then tack the
trim on so you can get the actual "in the house" appearance you want.
This will allow you to add and subtract thickness, width, and reveals
as you want to get exactly what you are after.

Spray a litte KILZ on your material or slap some paint in the test
pieces so you will see what you are going to have in the final
product.

You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
It also comes in anywhere from 1/4' to 1" thickness like my old
router table top. You can buy this, rip is, ease an edge over with a
router as needed, and you are on your way to making your own trims.

To finish the MDF, shoot it with BIN, not KILZ. BIN seals better and
adheres better than just about anything. I like to prime first, then
caulk/seal as it shows EVERY detail that needs to be corrected. After
caulking/filling/re-sanding, reprime as needed. With a good coat of
primer on the material, a couple of coats of quality enamel should
give you great wear.

As for the door, if you want maximum wear, use poly. These days, I
wouldn't want to live on the edge of difference between poly, but my
personal experience is that poly is more easily cleaned (and stands up
to cleaning better than varnish) and is much more abrasion resistant.

I am not sure why you would want to put linseed oil/BLO on a piece of
wood before finishing, but be prepared to wait for up to 30 days
before top coating it to wait for he oil to cure out. I wouldn't do
it. Personally, that oiling method is fine for a guy making a project
in his garage with lots of fiddle time. but by the time you do a
house full of 6 panel doors that require 2 - 3 coats each, you will be
well tired of this project before you are finished.

Take your finish out and try it on piece of similar wood as your
doors. If you like the way it looks, just use that. For just about
any top coat over any virgin (unfinished) wood, the top coat material
itself is the best primer. Nothing sticks to a top coat finish like
itself. If you are refinishing these doors, clean them as well as you
can, then shoot some sanding sealer (shellac or other NC) and then
sand and apply your top coat.

Good luck!

Robert

Larry Jaques wrote:

> On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
> following:
>
>>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>
> The irony strikes hard, Robert. There's a phrase I never thought I'd
> see on the Wreck. "the correct grade of MDF." Whoda thunk it?
> <g>
>

Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material. A group of
us helped our pre-school teacher move yesterday. I helped the group who re-
assembled the bedroom furniture; with the exception of the 3 pine 1 x 3
slats across the width of the base, everything was MDF (fortunately, it the
lightweight breed of MDF). The lower rails: 8" wide rounded over and
painted (outside only) MDF with a 2" strip of MDF on the inside to serve as
the ledge for the mattress slats. Headboard and footboard completely MDF.
The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the mirror, the rest
was all MDF. One could probably buy the materials for the entire bedroom
suite for less than $300. Absolutely amazing.

... snip

--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

[email protected] wrote:

>>> You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.

Well now that the next cast iron(MDF) is no longer a sin, how do feel
about the other "wood" called miratec ???

http://www.miratectrim.com/

Fascia board that don't rot ???? who would have thunk it ...

"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 01 Apr 2010 21:06:20 -0300, the infamous Picasso
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>Larry Jaques wrote:
>>> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
>>> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>>> BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
>>>> ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
>>>> found exactly the same cardboard trim.
>>>
>>> Disgusting.
>>
>>I have never seen this cardboard trim.. what are you talking about
>
> It's made of pressboard, like a soft, very low-grade hardboard. If
> you bend it, it comes apart like cardboard delaminating. I think some
> of the manufacturers are calling it "ultralight MDF",

You owe me a monitor!

LMAO!!

On Thu, 01 Apr 2010 21:06:20 -0300, the infamous Picasso
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Larry Jaques wrote:
>> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:59:27 -0700, the infamous "Nonny"
>> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>>> BTW, this is almost universal in homes, and not just cracker box
>>> ones. I've been inside several that sold for as much as $3m, and
>>> found exactly the same cardboard trim.
>>
>> Disgusting.
>
>I have never seen this cardboard trim.. what are you talking about

It's made of pressboard, like a soft, very low-grade hardboard. If
you bend it, it comes apart like cardboard delaminating. I think some
of the manufacturers are calling it "ultralight MDF", but it's nothing
at all like wood or termite barf (MDF.) It's cheap, like $3 a stick,
and flimsy, and horrible to work with.

I simply cannot find a picture of this crap on the Web. <shrug>

--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent,
but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin

Larry Jaques wrote:

> On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:35:53 -0700, the infamous Mark & Juanita
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>>Larry Jaques wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
>>> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
>>> following:
>>>
>>>>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>>>
>>> The irony strikes hard, Robert. There's a phrase I never thought I'd
>>> see on the Wreck. "the correct grade of MDF." Whoda thunk it?
>>> <g>
>>>
>>
>> Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
>>realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material. A group
>>of
>>us helped our pre-school teacher move yesterday. I helped the group who
>>re- assembled the bedroom furniture; with the exception of the 3 pine 1 x
>>3 slats across the width of the base, everything was MDF (fortunately, it
>>the
>>lightweight breed of MDF). The lower rails: 8" wide rounded over and
>>painted (outside only) MDF with a 2" strip of MDF on the inside to serve
>>as
>>the ledge for the mattress slats. Headboard and footboard completely MDF.
>>The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the mirror, the
>>rest
>>was all MDF. One could probably buy the materials for the entire bedroom
>>suite for less than $300. Absolutely amazing.
>
> You didn't mean "Cool!" there, did you, Mark? I didn't think so.

Nope, not at all. Worst thing about the stuff is that even the
lightweight stuff is heavier than real wood. OK, that's not really the
*worst* thing about it, but is one of the bad things.

One of the positives is that it does make reasonably nice looking
furniture affordable to people just starting out and with lower incomes.
OTOH, it makes it real easy to just change furniture on a whim.

>
> --
> Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
> -- Earl Warren

--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 19:07:25 -0400, the infamous Pat Barber
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>[email protected] wrote:
>
>>>> You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>
>Well now that the next cast iron(MDF) is no longer a sin, how do feel
>about the other "wood" called miratec ???
>
> http://www.miratectrim.com/
>
>Fascia board that don't rot ???? who would have thunk it ...

I haven't tried either yet, but I think I'd prefer AZEK, et al,
instead. http://www.azek.com/

Composites do die, mostly because of drowning. (They eventually soak
up water.) My clients usually choose PT wood for the lower price and
some have already been disappointed by Trex and the other composites
due to staining, delamination, pitting from rain, and fading.

--
Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
-- Earl Warren

On 3/29/2010 1:59 PM, Nonny wrote:


> on the inside. Surprisingly, the drywall is generally somewhere between
> very good-to-excellent in quality, with an orange peel texture on the
> ceiling and walls. Corners are ROUNDED, as opposed to square. This means
> that the baseboards are cut square and there's a transition piece on
> each outside corner.

Like this?:

http://www.e-woodshop.net/images/ShoeBboard.jpg

Depends upon what the client wants, and it changes with the wind.

The above, which I finished recently, is very common, along with a very
light roller texture on the interior walls, and popcorn on the ceiling
is still a popular option.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:35:53 -0700, the infamous Mark & Juanita
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Larry Jaques wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:26:56 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
>> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> scrawled the
>> following:
>>
>>>You can make these trims easily enough with the correct grade of MDF.
>>
>> The irony strikes hard, Robert. There's a phrase I never thought I'd
>> see on the Wreck. "the correct grade of MDF." Whoda thunk it?
>> <g>
>>
>
> Having been building our own furniture for the past years, I did not
>realize the extent to which MDF has become a dominant material. A group of
>us helped our pre-school teacher move yesterday. I helped the group who re-
>assembled the bedroom furniture; with the exception of the 3 pine 1 x 3
>slats across the width of the base, everything was MDF (fortunately, it the
>lightweight breed of MDF). The lower rails: 8" wide rounded over and
>painted (outside only) MDF with a 2" strip of MDF on the inside to serve as
>the ledge for the mattress slats. Headboard and footboard completely MDF.
>The only wood on the dresser was part of the frame for the mirror, the rest
>was all MDF. One could probably buy the materials for the entire bedroom
>suite for less than $300. Absolutely amazing.

You didn't mean "Cool!" there, did you, Mark? I didn't think so.

--
Everything I did in my life that was worthwhile I caught hell for.
-- Earl Warren