I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up the
jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do that
because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the same
gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the stone
do the "rest".
Dave
alexy said:
>I can't vouch for the technique based on personal experience, but I
>have found Feirer's book to be a pretty dependable reference.
>Combined with the page from PM, which is not a fly-by-night tool
>company either<g>, I tend to think there may be merit to trying this.
The blade 'jointing' technique has probably fallen from favor by the
proliferation of both homemade and commercial magnetic blade setting
jigs that are pretty capable of getting blades accurately aligned to
each other and the out-feed table - dependant, of course, on the
user's skill and determination. Some of those suckers are really
aggravating to align. And personal injury law suits have probably
helped push it along. Some folks can break an anvil in a sandbox.
Greg G.
Only when done by anyone.
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> CW wrote:
>
> > Yes, a subtle dulling.
> >
> > "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> only when done by the inept.
>
> Dave
David wrote:
> no(SPAM)vasys wrote:
>
>
> >
> > I agree.
> >
> > The fact that Powermatic changed the manual might be a hint.
> >
> I posted the page on the binaries. check it out! :)
>
> dave
Dave, they method you describe is what we did at a tech college in the
1960-1970s era. There was a specific jig to hold the stone although I
have seen it done just holding the stone freehand on the outfeed table.
There are safety concerns in doing this, for us it was done at least
weekly by the same person.
The new instruction mentioned in other posts suggest that somebody had
a nasty accident.
David wrote:
> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up the
> jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do that
> because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the same
> gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the stone
> do the "rest".
Seems to me that this would somewhat negate the whole point of putting a
specific bevel angle on the blade, if you're just going to grind it off
again after remounting the blades.
Chris
Jim Weisgram wrote:
> On 2 Nov 2005 17:03:59 -0800, "tom" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Dave, my 54A's manual says the same thing. It's scary, no? Plus you've
>>got to be sure your stone is flat.If you're diligent about knife
>>setting, the "honing" isn't necessary. Besides, it scratches up the
>>outfeed table. You wouldn't live in the Bay Area by any chance, would
>>you? Tom
>
>
>>>scratches up the outfeed table.
>
>
> I think there was some reference to using paper to protect the table;
> I wonder how well that really works. I'd also be concerned about
> getting all the grit and filings inside the works of the jointer.
You worry too much!
dave
On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 14:30:21 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>> It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in it's
>class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
You'll no doubt also be interested in a tub of my Patent Anti-Elephant
Omnibus Discouragement Dust. I sprinkle it out of the windows every time
I travel by bus and have yet to be plagued by elephants. It obviously
works perfectly.
I hone my jointer blades on the machine, with a diamond hone. But I do
it with the machine very much off, and I use the correct angle for the
blades, not a tangent.
no(SPAM)vasys wrote:
> David wrote:
>
>> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
>> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up
>> the jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do
>> that because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the
>> same gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the
>> stone do the "rest".
>>
>>
>> Dave
>
>
> I took a look at the 54A manual that's on-line at Powermatic's web site
> and it states:
>
> -----------------------------------------------
>
> 1. Disconnect the machine from the power
> source.
>
> 2. Remove the blade guard and belt cover.
>
> 3. To protect the infeed table from scratches,
> partially cover the sharpening stone with
> paper (Figure 47).
>
> 4. Lay the stone on the infeed table.
>
> 5. Lower the infeed table and turn the
> cutterhead by turning the cutterhead pulley.
> The infeed table height is set properly when
> the stone's surface is flush with the knife
> bevel.
>
> 6. Keep the cutterhead from rotating by
> grasping the cutterhead pulley while sliding <-------
> the stone back and forth across the table.
>
> 7. Take the same amount of passes for all
> three blades."
>
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> Nowhere that I can find does it mention honing the blades with the
> jointer running.
>
> The manual can be found at:
>
> http://www.wmhtoolgroup.com/partfiles/m_1791279DX.pdf
>
THEY CHANGED THE INSTRUCTIONS!! I'VE GOT THE MANUAL IN FRONT OF ME AND
IT STATES ON PAGE 14, STEP NUMBER 4, TURN THE MACHINE ON.
there is a picture showing a block of wood held by a clamp.
SO THERE!!!
Nice try, and thanks for playing
i can scan the entire page and put it on the binaries if you'd like!
Dave
no(SPAM)vasys wrote:
> David wrote:
>
>> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
>> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up
>> the jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do
>> that because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the
>> same gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the
>> stone do the "rest".
>>
>>
>> Dave
>
>
> I took a look at the 54A manual that's on-line at Powermatic's web site
> and it states:
>
> -----------------------------------------------
>
> 1. Disconnect the machine from the power
> source.
>
> 2. Remove the blade guard and belt cover.
>
> 3. To protect the infeed table from scratches,
> partially cover the sharpening stone with
> paper (Figure 47).
>
> 4. Lay the stone on the infeed table.
>
> 5. Lower the infeed table and turn the
> cutterhead by turning the cutterhead pulley.
> The infeed table height is set properly when
> the stone's surface is flush with the knife
> bevel.
>
> 6. Keep the cutterhead from rotating by
> grasping the cutterhead pulley while sliding <-------
> the stone back and forth across the table.
>
> 7. Take the same amount of passes for all
> three blades."
>
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> Nowhere that I can find does it mention honing the blades with the
> jointer running.
>
> The manual can be found at:
>
> http://www.wmhtoolgroup.com/partfiles/m_1791279DX.pdf
>
that date of my manual is 06/01
some idiot probably hurt himself, so they changed the instructions.
they work for me...
Dave
David wrote:
> Andy Dingley wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 14:30:21 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>>
>>
>>
>>> I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in
>>> it's class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
>>
>>
>>
>> You'll no doubt also be interested in a tub of my Patent Anti-Elephant
>> Omnibus Discouragement Dust. I sprinkle it out of the windows every time
>> I travel by bus and have yet to be plagued by elephants. It obviously
>> works perfectly.
>>
>>
>> I hone my jointer blades on the machine, with a diamond hone. But I do
>> it with the machine very much off, and I use the correct angle for the
>> blades, not a tangent.
>
> tangential, when applied to a .002-.004 distance, does not affect the
> quality of the edge, my friend, your preconceptions notwithstanding.
>
> Dave
Not picking sides or anything here, just truly curious. Wouldn't what Dave
is talking about doing result in pretty much the same thing as micro bevel?
-John in NH
CW wrote:
> Sure does. Take your Stanley #5, extend the blade about .002", run it
> accross a stone. Now, take that plane to a piece of wood. How well does it
> cut?
>
> "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>tangential, when applied to a .002-.004 distance, does not affect the
>>quality of the edge, my friend, your preconceptions notwithstanding.
>>
>>Dave
>
>
>
I'm sure you will take your preconceptions to the grave.
In the meantime, I'll continue to get EXCELLENT results from my long
lasting edges on my Powermatic jointer, YOUR NAY SAYING NOT WITHSTANDING.
Dave
No, a micro bevel is just a steeper bevel. It still provides clearence. The
jointer method being discussed provides zero clearence.
"John Girouard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Not picking sides or anything here, just truly curious. Wouldn't what Dave
> is talking about doing result in pretty much the same thing as micro
bevel?
>
> -John in NH
joey wrote:
> "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>joey wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>. Relax
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Joey, I'm relaxed. Perhaps a smiley would have helped convey the tone
>>better!!
>>
>>Dave
>
> Dude lose the caps
> BTW my 54A instructions had the same stoning recommendation I decided it
> was not a proceedure for me. I have resharpened my blades once and reset
> with a dial indicator to bout 1-2 thou. The faced and jointed results are
> excellant. Results rule
> Joey
>
>
actually, the procedure produces excellent results. perfectly aligned
blades and SHARP (I couldn't end this w/o some CAPS for you)
Dave
tom wrote:
> Dave, my 54A's manual says the same thing. It's scary, no? Plus you've
> got to be sure your stone is flat.If you're diligent about knife
> setting, the "honing" isn't necessary. Besides, it scratches up the
> outfeed table. You wouldn't live in the Bay Area by any chance, would
> you? Tom
>
Tom,
the first time I tried it, I had sweaty palms! :)
The second time I honed, I was more calm about the whole thing.
Yeah, San Jose. (The land of way overpriced lumber)
I wanted to ask DMT if their stones were up for this sort of thing, but
they never got back to me. I'd expect that wouldn't be a good idea (for
the DMT stone, that is).
Dave
True.
"Chris Friesen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Seems to me that this would somewhat negate the whole point of putting a
> specific bevel angle on the blade, if you're just going to grind it off
> again after remounting the blades.
>
> Chris
Andy Dingley wrote:
> On Wed, 02 Nov 2005 15:53:35 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>
>
> It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>
> Bad idea. Don't do it.
I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in it's
class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
Dave
David wrote:
> Andy Dingley wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 02 Nov 2005 15:53:35 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>>
>>
>>
>> It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>>
>> Bad idea. Don't do it.
>
> I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in it's
> class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
>
> Dave
in other words, THE PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING. I get smoothly milled wood
off my jointer, each and every time I run wood over it.
Dave
True.
"mike hide" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> I agree with Chris ,so what is the point of the bevel on the blades. The
> more this procedure is performed the more screwed up the blade geometry
> becomes .......mjh
>
>
Andy Dingley wrote:
> On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 14:30:21 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>>It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>
>
>>I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in it's
>>class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
>
>
> You'll no doubt also be interested in a tub of my Patent Anti-Elephant
> Omnibus Discouragement Dust. I sprinkle it out of the windows every time
> I travel by bus and have yet to be plagued by elephants. It obviously
> works perfectly.
>
>
> I hone my jointer blades on the machine, with a diamond hone. But I do
> it with the machine very much off, and I use the correct angle for the
> blades, not a tangent.
tangential, when applied to a .002-.004 distance, does not affect the
quality of the edge, my friend, your preconceptions notwithstanding.
Dave
David wrote:
> no(SPAM)vasys wrote:
>
>> 6. Keep the cutterhead from rotating by
>> grasping the cutterhead pulley while sliding <-------
>> the stone back and forth across the table.
>>
>> 7. Take the same amount of passes for all
>> three blades."
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Nowhere that I can find does it mention honing the blades with the
>> jointer running.
>>
>> The manual can be found at:
>>
>> http://www.wmhtoolgroup.com/partfiles/m_1791279DX.pdf
>>
> that date of my manual is 06/01
>
> some idiot probably hurt himself, so they changed the instructions.
>
> they work for me...
>
> Dave
I agree.
The fact that Powermatic changed the manual might be a hint.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
(Remove -SPAM- to send email)
[email protected] wrote:
> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 21:07:14 GMT, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>No, a micro bevel is just a steeper bevel. It still provides clearence. The
>>jointer method being discussed provides zero clearence.
>>
>>"John Girouard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>Not picking sides or anything here, just truly curious. Wouldn't what Dave
>>>is talking about doing result in pretty much the same thing as micro
>>
>>bevel?
>>
>>>-John in NH
>>
>
>
> it provides a zero relief angle.
>
> the jointer will still cut as long as the face is very small. because
> the relief angle is zero, there is more support behind the edge, so it
> will last a little longer before it needs sharpening. since the blades
> are now all cutting at exactly the same height you may actually get a
> better cut than you would have with the sharper blades before.
>
> at least that's the theory....
Ahh, thanks for that, both of you. I was scratching my head trying to figure
out what CW meant by 'clearance', but it makes total sense now. Friday
afternoon brain cramp, I guess.
-John in NH
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> tom wrote:
>
>> Dave, my 54A's manual says the same thing. It's scary, no? Plus you've
>> got to be sure your stone is flat.If you're diligent about knife
>> setting, the "honing" isn't necessary. Besides, it scratches up the
>> outfeed table. You wouldn't live in the Bay Area by any chance, would
>> you? Tom
>>
>
> Tom,
>
> the first time I tried it, I had sweaty palms! :)
>
> The second time I honed, I was more calm about the whole thing.
>
> Yeah, San Jose. (The land of way overpriced lumber)
>
> I wanted to ask DMT if their stones were up for this sort of thing, but
> they never got back to me. I'd expect that wouldn't be a good idea (for
> the DMT stone, that is).
>
> Dave
I agree with Chris ,so what is the point of the bevel on the blades. The
more this procedure is performed the more screwed up the blade geometry
becomes .......mjh
On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 05:29:32 GMT, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Only when done by anyone.
>
>"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> CW wrote:
>>
>> > Yes, a subtle dulling.
>> >
>> > "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> > news:[email protected]...
>> >
>> >>. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> only when done by the inept.
>>
>> Dave
>
CW... ya oughta know better than to get in a titfertat with bay area
davie...
but the procedure of spinning the blades against a stone isn't totally
bunk. I'd never do it to a woodworking machine, but there are some
setups where it really is the right thing to do.
it's basically a fine adjustment that does the same thing as the first
bit of use of the machine- it dulls the blades a little bit, producing
a microbevel (a tiny one only) with 0 relief angle. the edge produced
is not as sharp as it was before this, but it will last longer.
done even slightly wrong it will do serious damage to your blades,
your jointer and likely your body as well.
don't try it at home, folks.
On 2 Nov 2005 17:03:59 -0800, "tom" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Dave, my 54A's manual says the same thing. It's scary, no? Plus you've
>got to be sure your stone is flat.If you're diligent about knife
>setting, the "honing" isn't necessary. Besides, it scratches up the
>outfeed table. You wouldn't live in the Bay Area by any chance, would
>you? Tom
>> scratches up the outfeed table.
I think there was some reference to using paper to protect the table;
I wonder how well that really works. I'd also be concerned about
getting all the grit and filings inside the works of the jointer.
On Wed, 02 Nov 2005 15:53:35 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
It's also at completely the wrong angle.
Bad idea. Don't do it.
David <[email protected]> wrote:
>I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
>which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up the
>jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do that
>because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the same
>gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the stone
>do the "rest".
I've been fascinated by this thread, and some of the thought
experiments about why this will or will not work (particularly the
idea of why not just hone your plane blades the equivalent way). I
note that the page from the PM manual that was posted on abpw refers
to this technique as jointing the blades, not honing them. I found
another source that describes the same process. Feirer's Cabinetmaking
and Millwork, c 1970, follows a discussion of various alternative
methods for grinding jointer knives, and how to install them, with
this paragraph on page 258 (all typos mine):
**********
After the jointer knives have been sharpened and reset, it is wise to
joint the knives so they are exactly the same height. Cover all but
about one-fourth the length of a large abrasive stone with wax paper.
Place the stone on the rear table with the exposed section over the
knives. Clamp a wooden stop block to the front table to help guide
the stone. Lower the table until the stone barely touches the knives.
[reference to illustration] Turn on the poser. When the cutterhead is
revolving, move the stone slowly from one side to the other. A true
cutting circle will result. Be sure to joint the entire length of the
knives. The joint or land (sometimes called the heel) should not be
wider than 1/32". After jointing, replace the fence and guard.
*********
I can't vouch for the technique based on personal experience, but I
have found Feirer's book to be a pretty dependable reference.
Combined with the page from PM, which is not a fly-by-night tool
company either<g>, I tend to think there may be merit to trying this.
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
David wrote:
> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up the
> jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do that
> because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the same
> gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the stone
> do the "rest".
>
>
> Dave
I took a look at the 54A manual that's on-line at Powermatic's web site
and it states:
-----------------------------------------------
1. Disconnect the machine from the power
source.
2. Remove the blade guard and belt cover.
3. To protect the infeed table from scratches,
partially cover the sharpening stone with
paper (Figure 47).
4. Lay the stone on the infeed table.
5. Lower the infeed table and turn the
cutterhead by turning the cutterhead pulley.
The infeed table height is set properly when
the stone's surface is flush with the knife
bevel.
6. Keep the cutterhead from rotating by
grasping the cutterhead pulley while sliding <-------
the stone back and forth across the table.
7. Take the same amount of passes for all
three blades."
------------------------------------------------
Nowhere that I can find does it mention honing the blades with the
jointer running.
The manual can be found at:
http://www.wmhtoolgroup.com/partfiles/m_1791279DX.pdf
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
(Remove -SPAM- to send email)
FWIW,
http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/FULLPRES.exe?PARTNUM=95-420
I used one of these theother day to touch up the knives that have been in
use on my 8" jointer for the past 6 months and it made a very noticable
improvement. I will make a point this thing on a faily regular basis.
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up the
> jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do that
> because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the same
> gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the stone
> do the "rest".
>
>
> Dave
[email protected] said:
>CW... ya oughta know better than to get in a titfertat with bay area
>davie...
I thought so... Hey, Dave. ;-)
>it's basically a fine adjustment that does the same thing as the first
>bit of use of the machine- it dulls the blades a little bit, producing
>a microbevel (a tiny one only) with 0 relief angle. the edge produced
>is not as sharp as it was before this, but it will last longer.
This is the conclusion I came to as well. The physics of the process
just didn't add up to being the correct angle for 'honing'.
>done even slightly wrong it will do serious damage to your blades,
>your jointer and likely your body as well.
This, I am certain of.
>don't try it at home, folks.
Since you seem to be fairly well versed in this area, how about hand
honing the installed blades with a diamond paddle for a few strokes,
maintaining the original angles of the bevel - minus a degree. This
is what I have been doing to sweeten the edges before cutting
something difficult. Easy to rest the paddle hand on the outfeed
table and hold the cutter head at the proper angle with the other.
I know the stroke direction isn't optimal, but it sure seems to work.
Greg G.
[email protected] said:
>On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 02:22:33 -0500, Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> how about hand
>>honing the installed blades with a diamond paddle for a few strokes,
>>maintaining the original angles of the bevel - minus a degree. This
>>is what I have been doing to sweeten the edges before cutting
>>something difficult. Easy to rest the paddle hand on the outfeed
>>table and hold the cutter head at the proper angle with the other.
>>
>>I know the stroke direction isn't optimal, but it sure seems to work.
>>
>>
>>Greg G.
>
>the disadvantage of this is that the only thing keeping the grind
>consistent is stroke count and your subjective "feel" of how hard
>you're leaning into it. if you're careful you can do OK, but after a
>short few times you'd better pull the blades, sharpen properly and
>reset them.
Yup, that's what I do. That's why I said sweeten, not hone or
sharpen... I left out the other parts for brevity - imagine that...
Thanks,
Greg G.
On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 02:22:33 -0500, Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote:
> how about hand
>honing the installed blades with a diamond paddle for a few strokes,
>maintaining the original angles of the bevel - minus a degree. This
>is what I have been doing to sweeten the edges before cutting
>something difficult. Easy to rest the paddle hand on the outfeed
>table and hold the cutter head at the proper angle with the other.
>
>I know the stroke direction isn't optimal, but it sure seems to work.
>
>
>Greg G.
the disadvantage of this is that the only thing keeping the grind
consistent is stroke count and your subjective "feel" of how hard
you're leaning into it. if you're careful you can do OK, but after a
short few times you'd better pull the blades, sharpen properly and
reset them.
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Andy Dingley wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 14:30:21 -0800, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>It's also at completely the wrong angle.
>>
>>
>>>I'll put the cutting quality of my jointer up against anything in it's
>>>class, so I DON'T think honing is a "bad" idea, as you suggested.
>>
>>
>> You'll no doubt also be interested in a tub of my Patent Anti-Elephant
>> Omnibus Discouragement Dust. I sprinkle it out of the windows every time
>> I travel by bus and have yet to be plagued by elephants. It obviously
>> works perfectly.
>>
>>
>> I hone my jointer blades on the machine, with a diamond hone. But I do
>> it with the machine very much off, and I use the correct angle for the
>> blades, not a tangent.
> tangential, when applied to a .002-.004 distance, does not affect the
> quality of the edge, my friend, your preconceptions notwithstanding.
>
> Dave
A joiner with that kind of geometry is called a burnisher .....mjh
Greg G.<[email protected]> wrote:
>The blade 'jointing' technique has probably fallen from favor by the
>proliferation of both homemade and commercial magnetic blade setting
>jigs that are pretty capable of getting blades accurately aligned to
>each other and the out-feed table
I'd buy that, except that Feirer's book discusses using a magnetic jig
to align the blades when installed.
> - dependant, of course, on the user's skill and determination. Some
> of those suckers are really aggravating to align.
True. But while I've been happy with my success in aligning my knives
and the resultant cut quality, this does make me wonder...
>And personal injury law suits have probably
>helped push it along.
I suspect that had a lot to do with the change in the PM manual.
> Some folks can break an anvil in a sandbox.
LOL!
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
Sure does. Take your Stanley #5, extend the blade about .002", run it
accross a stone. Now, take that plane to a piece of wood. How well does it
cut?
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> tangential, when applied to a .002-.004 distance, does not affect the
> quality of the edge, my friend, your preconceptions notwithstanding.
>
> Dave
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> no(SPAM)vasys wrote:
>
> > David wrote:
> >
> >> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
> >> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up
> >> the jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do
> >> that because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the
> >> same gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the
> >> stone do the "rest".
> >>
> >>
> >> Dave
> >
> >
> > I took a look at the 54A manual that's on-line at Powermatic's web site
> > and it states:
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------
> >
> > 1. Disconnect the machine from the power
> > source.
> >
> > 2. Remove the blade guard and belt cover.
> >
> > 3. To protect the infeed table from scratches,
> > partially cover the sharpening stone with
> > paper (Figure 47).
> >
> > 4. Lay the stone on the infeed table.
> >
> > 5. Lower the infeed table and turn the
> > cutterhead by turning the cutterhead pulley.
> > The infeed table height is set properly when
> > the stone's surface is flush with the knife
> > bevel.
> >
> > 6. Keep the cutterhead from rotating by
> > grasping the cutterhead pulley while sliding <-------
> > the stone back and forth across the table.
> >
> > 7. Take the same amount of passes for all
> > three blades."
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Nowhere that I can find does it mention honing the blades with the
> > jointer running.
> >
> > The manual can be found at:
> >
> > http://www.wmhtoolgroup.com/partfiles/m_1791279DX.pdf
> >
> THEY CHANGED THE INSTRUCTIONS!! I'VE GOT THE MANUAL IN FRONT OF ME AND
> IT STATES ON PAGE 14, STEP NUMBER 4, TURN THE MACHINE ON.
>
> there is a picture showing a block of wood held by a clamp.
>
> SO THERE!!!
>
> Nice try, and thanks for playing
>
> i can scan the entire page and put it on the binaries if you'd like!
>
> Dave
He is back only a matter of time I guess. Relax
Yes, a subtle dulling.
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> . the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>
>
So it dulls it as little as posible.
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] wrote:
> The main "trick" is to be sure that the cut is VERY, VERY light.
>
> Dave
On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 21:07:14 GMT, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>No, a micro bevel is just a steeper bevel. It still provides clearence. The
>jointer method being discussed provides zero clearence.
>
>"John Girouard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> Not picking sides or anything here, just truly curious. Wouldn't what Dave
>> is talking about doing result in pretty much the same thing as micro
>bevel?
>>
>> -John in NH
>
it provides a zero relief angle.
the jointer will still cut as long as the face is very small. because
the relief angle is zero, there is more support behind the edge, so it
will last a little longer before it needs sharpening. since the blades
are now all cutting at exactly the same height you may actually get a
better cut than you would have with the sharper blades before.
at least that's the theory....
CW wrote:
> Yes, a subtle dulling.
>
> "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>>
>>
>
>
>
only when done by the inept.
Dave
[email protected] wrote:
> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 05:29:32 GMT, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Only when done by anyone.
>>
>>"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>CW wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Yes, a subtle dulling.
>>>>
>>>>"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>only when done by the inept.
>>>
>>>Dave
>>
>
>
> CW... ya oughta know better than to get in a titfertat with bay area
> davie...
>
>
> but the procedure of spinning the blades against a stone isn't totally
> bunk. I'd never do it to a woodworking machine, but there are some
> setups where it really is the right thing to do.
>
> it's basically a fine adjustment that does the same thing as the first
> bit of use of the machine- it dulls the blades a little bit, producing
> a microbevel (a tiny one only) with 0 relief angle. the edge produced
> is not as sharp as it was before this, but it will last longer.
>
> done even slightly wrong it will do serious damage to your blades,
> your jointer and likely your body as well.
>
> don't try it at home, folks.
The main "trick" is to be sure that the cut is VERY, VERY light.
Dave
CW wrote:
> Only when done by anyone.
>
> "David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>CW wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Yes, a subtle dulling.
>>>
>>>"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>>
>>>>. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>only when done by the inept.
>>
>>Dave
>
>
>
funny, but untrue.
They pass the "nick fingernail" test and they cut wood (oak and maple)
superbly.
Just because YOU can't hone jointer blades correctly doesn't mean others
can't.
Dave
Chris Friesen wrote:
> David wrote:
>
>> I hone my blades per the instructions that came with the 54a jointer,
>> which means holding a sharpening stone over the blades and firing up
>> the jointer (using precautions as listed in the manual). I like to do
>> that because I'm not perfect at getting 3 blades precisely set to the
>> same gnat's ass height. Once I think I'm within 2 or 3 thou, I let the
>> stone do the "rest".
>
>
> Seems to me that this would somewhat negate the whole point of putting a
> specific bevel angle on the blade, if you're just going to grind it off
> again after remounting the blades.
>
> Chris
seems to me the mfgr, who supplied the replacement blades, doesn't see a
problem, Chris. the process is "honing". it's very subtle.
Dave
"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> joey wrote:
>
>
> >. Relax
> >
> >
> Joey, I'm relaxed. Perhaps a smiley would have helped convey the tone
> better!!
>
> Dave
Dude lose the caps
BTW my 54A instructions had the same stoning recommendation I decided it
was not a proceedure for me. I have resharpened my blades once and reset
with a dial indicator to bout 1-2 thou. The faced and jointed results are
excellant. Results rule
Joey