HI Joe
My primary HVLP system is the Fuji Q4. Can't say enough good about it.
On the other hand my first system and now secondary on was a Campbell
Hausfeld 2500. Far less expensive. I also see lots of posts on the Harbor
Freight and Rockler $100.00 units.
My take, owning and using two units at different ends of the spectrum, and
from reports on the HF and Rockler unit has been, and remains, any unit
turbine HVLP unit putting out about 5 PSI at the nozzle at around 80 CFM
will do as good a job as you are capable of.
The question you would probably ask next is if the CH was so good why buy
the Fuji. Simple answer is that I do a fair amount of spraying and the extra
bucks go to life expectancy of the unit and it's versatility in what it will
spray. There were also some features about the Fuji I like better then the
other units in it's price range.
Having explored the situation before buying and watching other posts on the
subject any unit of equal price, and, again, I can't say enough about the
Fuji, Turbinair, Accuspray, etc, are all on a par with one and other.
Good luck
--
Mike G.
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>
>
--------------040407040508030505030901
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
I'm surprised you get anything decent out of the airless. If your high
pressure gun was leaving a rough finish, it could be that you were
putting it on too dry, or it could be overspray from improper spray
technique. Taunton Press has a couple of books with articles from Fine
Woodworking" that will help you.
If you wish to spray lacquer and not pollute the environment too much,
buy an HVLP gun. If you already have a reasonable sized compressor, you
can get a conversion HVLP gun to do the job. You will find that there
is very little overspray with HVLP; they use much less material, cleanup
and changeover is very easy, and there is no long hose full of material
at the end.
Len
---------------------
GeeDubb wrote:
>"Not Telling" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>
>
>>Choices, Choices!
>>
>>
>
>For having a name like "Not Telling" you sure have given some great advice.
>Answers like these are why I keep reading the wreck.
>
>One thing I did not see was info on spraying restriction for lacquer and
>other oil based products. I live in an area where it is illegal to spray
>these products (though that hasn't stopped me but makes me much more careful
>about how I spray).
>
>What are your opinions about using an airless sprayer for these
>applications? I was given an airless and use it a lot with pretty decent
>results (compared to using a conventional sprayer that always left a
>sandpaper finish). The only drawback I have found is the pint or so of
>finish that is always in the hose and changing from stains to sealers to
>finish.
>
>Gary
>
>
>
>
--------------040407040508030505030901
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
I'm surprised you get anything decent out of the airless. If your high pressure
gun was leaving a rough finish, it could be that you were putting it on too
dry, or it could be overspray from improper spray technique. Taunton Press
has a couple of books with articles from Fine Woodworking" that will help
you.<br>
<br>
If you wish to spray lacquer and not pollute the environment too much, buy
an HVLP gun. If you already have a reasonable sized compressor, you can
get a conversion HVLP gun to do the job. You will find that there is very
little overspray with HVLP; they use much less material, cleanup and changeover
is very easy, and there is no long hose full of material at the end.<br>
<br>
Len<br>
---------------------<br>
<br>
GeeDubb wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="[email protected]">
<pre wrap="">"Not Telling" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email protected]"><[email protected]></a> wrote in message
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="news:[email protected]">news:[email protected]</a>...
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Choices, Choices!
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
For having a name like "Not Telling" you sure have given some great advice.
Answers like these are why I keep reading the wreck.
One thing I did not see was info on spraying restriction for lacquer and
other oil based products. I live in an area where it is illegal to spray
these products (though that hasn't stopped me but makes me much more careful
about how I spray).
What are your opinions about using an airless sprayer for these
applications? I was given an airless and use it a lot with pretty decent
results (compared to using a conventional sprayer that always left a
sandpaper finish). The only drawback I have found is the pint or so of
finish that is always in the hose and changing from stains to sealers to
finish.
Gary
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>
--------------040407040508030505030901--
Choices, Choices!
Ok, lets suppose you have choices. You can spray poly with an HVLP gun or a
regular gun if you want. Prefer HVLP. I have both an HVLP gun to work
either on a HVLP turbine or compressor. I prefer the compressor. Why? more
control over fluid flow. I have mabey used my HVLP Turbine 3 times and I
have had it for 3 years now. Remember what I said, you got to find out what
works for you!. I have sprayed poly many times with my HVLP gun and
compressor with very little mess. The key here is viscosity! Check your
manufactures recommedations for viscosity, tip, and cap selection. Make
sure you have a stop watch when checking viscosity as being off by even a
few seconds can mess up your whole spraying. Another tip of yopu mess up
while spraying DO NOT STOP continue until your are done. Then take a 50/50
rag simi-damp and lightly and I mean lightly swipe your mistakes. Let the
poly dry and sand down. Then apply your next coat.
Now, if no available HVLP you can brush on the poly but make sure you have
the right brush. I use a china bristle brush. Buy a good one not a cheap
imitation to save a dollar or two.
Ok, Lacq top or Poly Top? In my experieces, I always try to find out if the
piece will be getting any heavy use. Thus the trick question? what is heavy
use? It varies, soory but that is just the way it is. There are a lot of
factors here. Everyday use for writting, reading, drawing, kids, weather,
day light hitting top surface, humidity, dry air, sex toy table top, get the
idea? All in all Lacq is a very good finish for a desk a lousy one for a
dinning table. What I try and recommend to my customers is to incorporate a
leather top with some nice 19K gold trim. So, if they hose up the leather
with pens, inks, sex stains, who cares easy to remove and replace. The cost
is very low as well about 50 bucks for a medium size writting area. Now the
whole top does not have to be covered in leather just the writting area. Go
vist a desk store and get some ideas to size! Take your tape measure. And
poly dries pretty fast but curing does take longer just like Lacquer.
Water Base or Oil Base?
I have worked before with water base solution and I dont like them. To much
garin raising for me ( I am going to get flamed) but just as I said before
it just does not work for me. Oil does! Besides my customers demand oil
only! luckly me! Water has its advantages, let me see what were
they????????????????OH! yea, easy clean up and ummmmmm...non toxic to the
environment. If thats the case why then do FEDS still tack on an
environmental TAX the same as poly? The stuff can still kill you and cause
health issues.
Always remember, The Quality of the Finish = proper preperation + quality
materials / time spent.
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Wow! I dare say that was an in depth, most informative response! I
> can't thank you enough. I understood what you said, and I have a follow
> up question (or two), if you don't mind, regarding the application of
> poly to the top. I understand that spraying it would be an ungodly
> mess, since it'll stick to everything in the vicinity.
>
> First off, are you saying that pre-cat laq is not up to the task of an
> oft used desk? If poly is needed, how do I apply it so that it's gonna
> look perfect? I DO have an 18" applicator pad that was made for putting
> down a water based floor finish. Would that work to get a smooth finish
> on a table top? I know that I could thin poly and wipe. that takes a
> LOT of coats. and lots of drying time...
>
> If it's gotta be poly should it be oil based?
>
> I'll shut up now and let you teach me, if you'd be so kind, again.
>
> dave
>
> Not Telling wrote:
>
> > Yes and No, Any wood species will have oil, what sets them apart is the
> > quantity and them the viscosity of that oil. As far as Oak is
concerned?
> > Mostly in Red Oak species and some in the White Oak spices. In my years
of
> > wood working I have only one problem with Oak and that was Red Oak.
> > Applying sealer is the key. I have read many books on finishing and
have a
> > large collection on this subject and the common denominator from all of
them
> > is surface preparation. In my initial start of this hobby turned full
time
> > business there was much confusion on this subject especially in trying
what
> > and when to use a sanding sealer, filler, stain sealer, on so on! From
this
> > I learned the hard way by experimenting with the woods that I would more
> > then likely be using and restoring. I then broke them down into two
> > categories ( I will get flamed for this, but It works for me). Those of
> > open grain i.e. oak and those of closed grain i.e. maple as an example.
> > What I discovered was that with open grain woods if I would sand to 220
and
> > then apply stain, allow to dry and sand again with 220, and begin to wet
> > sand up to 400 with the stain I ended up with mirror smooth finish with
> > depth. I then applied my seal coat, and then my final finish. What I
am
> > trying to get here is that everyone has a method that works for them and
> > that method may not work for you. Why? simple we all have different
ways of
> > doing things that work for the way we do things. So, where does this
leave
> > you? Easy, get a basic understanding of the process and always remember
that
> > it is a process and can be modified just as a recipe is to make it more
> > sweet or spicy. The result is the same. Ok, by now I have confused you
so
> > let me walk you through in what I would do with this project. I am going
to
> > assume it is white oak, actually it does not matter as my process is the
> > same.
> >
> > 1.) First this project is going to be a desk so the process is going to
> > require two processes. One for the table top and one for the rest of
the
> > desk.
> > 2.) I next take my oak and thoroughly sand up to 220 the end grain is
sanded
> > up 320. Why, because end grain absorbs 2 too 3 times as much stain.
> > 3.) Got to decide how much color saturation I want ( light too dark)
> > 4.) Next if deep color saturation is needed then I will use a full
bodied
> > clean rag. Note that deep saturation is not how light or dark the color
is.
> > What it does is when using a full bodies rag (terry towel) the grain
pores
> > will absorb most of the stain where the closed pores will absorb the
least.
> > For even stain with grain and pores use a clean rag made from 50/50
> > cotton/poly blend similar to a hanky. The full bodied rag will give you
the
> > dark open grain and light grain look. The 50/50 will give you a more
even
> > color saturation.
> > 5.) Allow to dry, and sand up to 220
> > 6.) Color saturation should be real close now, if not use 50./50 rag
concept
> > above in step 4
> > 7.) If it is now we are ready for the color sanding. Get some 220 and
your
> > stain pour a small puddle and begin to color sand small areas first.
Start
> > out the ends first. The key here is pressure not to little not to much.
If
> > the sand paper is lightly slipping between your hand and the wood then
its
> > perfect amount of pressure.
> > 8.) Once the stain gets slurry (mixture of stain and wood dust) wipe
clean
> > and restart with new sand paper and higher grit. I usually go up to 400
but
> > always end up with 600.
> > 9.) Examine each color sand step for color blend and imperfections and
fix
> > those. Small imperfections may require further sanding with a little
more
> > pressure.
> > 10.) I am done and ready for the sealing coat. My customer in this case
> > likes Lacquer so I will prepare my solution 60 per cent Lacq thinner and
40
> > percent Lacq. Once sprayed and try, I will sand with 400 then 600 with
just
> > enough pressure at 600 to cut any little nibs left over.
> > 11.) Next a take a damp 50/50 rag in Lacq thinner and quickly wipe my
> > project. When I say damp I mean damp not wet. Ask your wife or
girlfriend
> > to show you what damp is. This is important very important as this step
> > clears and removes this that we can not feel or see.
> > 12.) Now I am ready for the finish, Now Lacquer sucks for table tops
but
> > works great for the rest. So, I suggest either a poly base varnish or
> > acrylic base.
> > 13.) You will have to build up at least 5 coats with sanding between
coats
> > with 400 or 600. I always use 600. Only sand lightly to remove sheen
and
> > any dust or nibs. The last coat is never sanded, what you do is get
some
> > compound cleaner, compound, and polishing compound. Go to an auto
supply
> > store for this. If you have an auto polisher great! use that with wool
> > bonnets. If you screw up somewhere no problem see step 11 it will help.
> > 14.) Call customer tell them it is done and collect the money.
> >
> > Caveats:
> > As I said before it all boils down to what works for you and your style.
> > The process is going to be different no two people will do it the same.
> > What matters is the final result. The best advice get comfortable with
one
> > process know it inside out, how it works with different woods and then
begin
> > to create your own way. Going from one process to another, and then
another
> > is one of the most stressing things to do. Especially in wood finishing
> > which scares a lot of people and prevents them from getting into this
> > wonderful gratifying hobby.
> >
> > Today, I only work with 4 processes that work for me and have never come
to
> > any situation where I was leery of taking on a project. Including color
> > matching.
> >
> > Any way hope this helps and gets you started in the right direction.
> >
> > "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>I'll be doing an oak desk next Oak isn't considered oily, is it?
> >>
> >>What is the solvent for the vinyl sealer? Laq thinner?
> >>
> >>Thanks for a very informative post.
> >>
> >>dave
> >>
> >>Not Telling wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY
> >
> > WOODS.
> >
> >>>The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it
> >
> > protects
> >
> >>>what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to
> >
> > prevent it
> >
> >>>from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to
> >
> > level
> >
> >>>evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils
> >
> > interference.
> >
> >>>The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the
> >
> > sealer
> >
> >>>manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by
> >
> > checking,
> >
> >>>cracking, lifting.
> >>>
> >>>Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes
> >
> > for
> >
> >>>oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to
> >
> > apply
> >
> >>>any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to
> >
> > be
> >
> >>>sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
> >>>imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction
> >
> > to
> >
> >>>take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood
> >
> > oil,
> >
> >>>etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly,
> >
> > level,
> >
> >>>and cure properly.
> >>>
> >>>Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much easier
> >
> > and
> >
> >>>more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
> >>>>undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you
know
> >>>>what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
> >>>>"dentable" than precat lac?
> >>>>
> >>>>dave
> >>>>
> >>>>Not Telling wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Joe,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
> >>>
> >>>sure
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3.
One
> >>>>>thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast.
Before
> >>>>>applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
> >>>
> >>>spray
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any
> >
> > imperfections
> >
> >>>>>such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there
apply
> >>>>>second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
> >>>
> >>>however
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you
> >
> > have
> >
> >>>to
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
> >>>
> >>>letter!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
> >>>
> >>>chemicals,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per
cent
> >>>
> >>>is
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity
> >
> > gun
> >
> >>>is
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
> >>>
> >>>either
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>a small cup or larger cup.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system
and
> >>>>>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>
> >
> >
>
>
Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY WOODS.
The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it protects
what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to prevent it
from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to level
evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils interference.
The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the sealer
manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by checking,
cracking, lifting.
Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes for
oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to apply
any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to be
sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction to
take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood oil,
etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly, level,
and cure properly.
Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much easier and
more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
> undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
> what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
> "dentable" than precat lac?
>
> dave
>
> Not Telling wrote:
>
> > Joe,
> >
> > 90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
sure
> > that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
> > thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
> > applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
spray
> > piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any imperfections
> > such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
> > second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
however
> > depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you have
to
> > add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
letter!
> > Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
chemicals,
> > etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent
is
> > composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity gun
is
> > a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
either
> > a small cup or larger cup.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> >>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
Yes and No, Any wood species will have oil, what sets them apart is the
quantity and them the viscosity of that oil. As far as Oak is concerned?
Mostly in Red Oak species and some in the White Oak spices. In my years of
wood working I have only one problem with Oak and that was Red Oak.
Applying sealer is the key. I have read many books on finishing and have a
large collection on this subject and the common denominator from all of them
is surface preparation. In my initial start of this hobby turned full time
business there was much confusion on this subject especially in trying what
and when to use a sanding sealer, filler, stain sealer, on so on! From this
I learned the hard way by experimenting with the woods that I would more
then likely be using and restoring. I then broke them down into two
categories ( I will get flamed for this, but It works for me). Those of
open grain i.e. oak and those of closed grain i.e. maple as an example.
What I discovered was that with open grain woods if I would sand to 220 and
then apply stain, allow to dry and sand again with 220, and begin to wet
sand up to 400 with the stain I ended up with mirror smooth finish with
depth. I then applied my seal coat, and then my final finish. What I am
trying to get here is that everyone has a method that works for them and
that method may not work for you. Why? simple we all have different ways of
doing things that work for the way we do things. So, where does this leave
you? Easy, get a basic understanding of the process and always remember that
it is a process and can be modified just as a recipe is to make it more
sweet or spicy. The result is the same. Ok, by now I have confused you so
let me walk you through in what I would do with this project. I am going to
assume it is white oak, actually it does not matter as my process is the
same.
1.) First this project is going to be a desk so the process is going to
require two processes. One for the table top and one for the rest of the
desk.
2.) I next take my oak and thoroughly sand up to 220 the end grain is sanded
up 320. Why, because end grain absorbs 2 too 3 times as much stain.
3.) Got to decide how much color saturation I want ( light too dark)
4.) Next if deep color saturation is needed then I will use a full bodied
clean rag. Note that deep saturation is not how light or dark the color is.
What it does is when using a full bodies rag (terry towel) the grain pores
will absorb most of the stain where the closed pores will absorb the least.
For even stain with grain and pores use a clean rag made from 50/50
cotton/poly blend similar to a hanky. The full bodied rag will give you the
dark open grain and light grain look. The 50/50 will give you a more even
color saturation.
5.) Allow to dry, and sand up to 220
6.) Color saturation should be real close now, if not use 50./50 rag concept
above in step 4
7.) If it is now we are ready for the color sanding. Get some 220 and your
stain pour a small puddle and begin to color sand small areas first. Start
out the ends first. The key here is pressure not to little not to much. If
the sand paper is lightly slipping between your hand and the wood then its
perfect amount of pressure.
8.) Once the stain gets slurry (mixture of stain and wood dust) wipe clean
and restart with new sand paper and higher grit. I usually go up to 400 but
always end up with 600.
9.) Examine each color sand step for color blend and imperfections and fix
those. Small imperfections may require further sanding with a little more
pressure.
10.) I am done and ready for the sealing coat. My customer in this case
likes Lacquer so I will prepare my solution 60 per cent Lacq thinner and 40
percent Lacq. Once sprayed and try, I will sand with 400 then 600 with just
enough pressure at 600 to cut any little nibs left over.
11.) Next a take a damp 50/50 rag in Lacq thinner and quickly wipe my
project. When I say damp I mean damp not wet. Ask your wife or girlfriend
to show you what damp is. This is important very important as this step
clears and removes this that we can not feel or see.
12.) Now I am ready for the finish, Now Lacquer sucks for table tops but
works great for the rest. So, I suggest either a poly base varnish or
acrylic base.
13.) You will have to build up at least 5 coats with sanding between coats
with 400 or 600. I always use 600. Only sand lightly to remove sheen and
any dust or nibs. The last coat is never sanded, what you do is get some
compound cleaner, compound, and polishing compound. Go to an auto supply
store for this. If you have an auto polisher great! use that with wool
bonnets. If you screw up somewhere no problem see step 11 it will help.
14.) Call customer tell them it is done and collect the money.
Caveats:
As I said before it all boils down to what works for you and your style.
The process is going to be different no two people will do it the same.
What matters is the final result. The best advice get comfortable with one
process know it inside out, how it works with different woods and then begin
to create your own way. Going from one process to another, and then another
is one of the most stressing things to do. Especially in wood finishing
which scares a lot of people and prevents them from getting into this
wonderful gratifying hobby.
Today, I only work with 4 processes that work for me and have never come to
any situation where I was leery of taking on a project. Including color
matching.
Any way hope this helps and gets you started in the right direction.
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I'll be doing an oak desk next Oak isn't considered oily, is it?
>
> What is the solvent for the vinyl sealer? Laq thinner?
>
> Thanks for a very informative post.
>
> dave
>
> Not Telling wrote:
>
> > Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY
WOODS.
> > The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it
protects
> > what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to
prevent it
> > from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to
level
> > evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils
interference.
> > The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the
sealer
> > manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by
checking,
> > cracking, lifting.
> >
> > Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes
for
> > oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to
apply
> > any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to
be
> > sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
> > imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction
to
> > take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood
oil,
> > etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly,
level,
> > and cure properly.
> >
> > Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much easier
and
> > more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
> >
> >
> > "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
> >>undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
> >>what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
> >>"dentable" than precat lac?
> >>
> >>dave
> >>
> >>Not Telling wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Joe,
> >>>
> >>>90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
> >
> > sure
> >
> >>>that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
> >>>thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
> >>>applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
> >
> > spray
> >
> >>>piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any
imperfections
> >>>such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
> >>>second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
> >
> > however
> >
> >>>depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you
have
> >
> > to
> >
> >>>add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
> >
> > letter!
> >
> >>>Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
> >
> > chemicals,
> >
> >>>etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent
> >
> > is
> >
> >>>composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity
gun
> >
> > is
> >
> >>>a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
> >
> > either
> >
> >>>a small cup or larger cup.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> >>>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> >
>
I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
"dentable" than precat lac?
dave
Not Telling wrote:
> Joe,
>
> 90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make sure
> that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
> thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
> applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and spray
> piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any imperfections
> such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
> second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can, however
> depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you have to
> add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to letter!
> Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq, chemicals,
> etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent is
> composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity gun is
> a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use either
> a small cup or larger cup.
>
>
>
> "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>>
>>
>
>
>
"Not Telling" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Choices, Choices!
For having a name like "Not Telling" you sure have given some great advice.
Answers like these are why I keep reading the wreck.
One thing I did not see was info on spraying restriction for lacquer and
other oil based products. I live in an area where it is illegal to spray
these products (though that hasn't stopped me but makes me much more careful
about how I spray).
What are your opinions about using an airless sprayer for these
applications? I was given an airless and use it a lot with pretty decent
results (compared to using a conventional sprayer that always left a
sandpaper finish). The only drawback I have found is the pint or so of
finish that is always in the hose and changing from stains to sealers to
finish.
Gary
I have sprayed several pieces with nitrocellulose lacquer. I bought the
FUJI HVLP sprayer and it works incredibly well. I was surprised how easy it
was to set up and shoot (having never used one before). I got a beautiful
finish with 8 coats of lacquer and very little overspray. I imagine any of
the HVLP sprayers will all be fine.
Good luck.
J
"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>
>
Wow! I dare say that was an in depth, most informative response! I
can't thank you enough. I understood what you said, and I have a follow
up question (or two), if you don't mind, regarding the application of
poly to the top. I understand that spraying it would be an ungodly
mess, since it'll stick to everything in the vicinity.
First off, are you saying that pre-cat laq is not up to the task of an
oft used desk? If poly is needed, how do I apply it so that it's gonna
look perfect? I DO have an 18" applicator pad that was made for putting
down a water based floor finish. Would that work to get a smooth finish
on a table top? I know that I could thin poly and wipe. that takes a
LOT of coats. and lots of drying time...
If it's gotta be poly should it be oil based?
I'll shut up now and let you teach me, if you'd be so kind, again.
dave
Not Telling wrote:
> Yes and No, Any wood species will have oil, what sets them apart is the
> quantity and them the viscosity of that oil. As far as Oak is concerned?
> Mostly in Red Oak species and some in the White Oak spices. In my years of
> wood working I have only one problem with Oak and that was Red Oak.
> Applying sealer is the key. I have read many books on finishing and have a
> large collection on this subject and the common denominator from all of them
> is surface preparation. In my initial start of this hobby turned full time
> business there was much confusion on this subject especially in trying what
> and when to use a sanding sealer, filler, stain sealer, on so on! From this
> I learned the hard way by experimenting with the woods that I would more
> then likely be using and restoring. I then broke them down into two
> categories ( I will get flamed for this, but It works for me). Those of
> open grain i.e. oak and those of closed grain i.e. maple as an example.
> What I discovered was that with open grain woods if I would sand to 220 and
> then apply stain, allow to dry and sand again with 220, and begin to wet
> sand up to 400 with the stain I ended up with mirror smooth finish with
> depth. I then applied my seal coat, and then my final finish. What I am
> trying to get here is that everyone has a method that works for them and
> that method may not work for you. Why? simple we all have different ways of
> doing things that work for the way we do things. So, where does this leave
> you? Easy, get a basic understanding of the process and always remember that
> it is a process and can be modified just as a recipe is to make it more
> sweet or spicy. The result is the same. Ok, by now I have confused you so
> let me walk you through in what I would do with this project. I am going to
> assume it is white oak, actually it does not matter as my process is the
> same.
>
> 1.) First this project is going to be a desk so the process is going to
> require two processes. One for the table top and one for the rest of the
> desk.
> 2.) I next take my oak and thoroughly sand up to 220 the end grain is sanded
> up 320. Why, because end grain absorbs 2 too 3 times as much stain.
> 3.) Got to decide how much color saturation I want ( light too dark)
> 4.) Next if deep color saturation is needed then I will use a full bodied
> clean rag. Note that deep saturation is not how light or dark the color is.
> What it does is when using a full bodies rag (terry towel) the grain pores
> will absorb most of the stain where the closed pores will absorb the least.
> For even stain with grain and pores use a clean rag made from 50/50
> cotton/poly blend similar to a hanky. The full bodied rag will give you the
> dark open grain and light grain look. The 50/50 will give you a more even
> color saturation.
> 5.) Allow to dry, and sand up to 220
> 6.) Color saturation should be real close now, if not use 50./50 rag concept
> above in step 4
> 7.) If it is now we are ready for the color sanding. Get some 220 and your
> stain pour a small puddle and begin to color sand small areas first. Start
> out the ends first. The key here is pressure not to little not to much. If
> the sand paper is lightly slipping between your hand and the wood then its
> perfect amount of pressure.
> 8.) Once the stain gets slurry (mixture of stain and wood dust) wipe clean
> and restart with new sand paper and higher grit. I usually go up to 400 but
> always end up with 600.
> 9.) Examine each color sand step for color blend and imperfections and fix
> those. Small imperfections may require further sanding with a little more
> pressure.
> 10.) I am done and ready for the sealing coat. My customer in this case
> likes Lacquer so I will prepare my solution 60 per cent Lacq thinner and 40
> percent Lacq. Once sprayed and try, I will sand with 400 then 600 with just
> enough pressure at 600 to cut any little nibs left over.
> 11.) Next a take a damp 50/50 rag in Lacq thinner and quickly wipe my
> project. When I say damp I mean damp not wet. Ask your wife or girlfriend
> to show you what damp is. This is important very important as this step
> clears and removes this that we can not feel or see.
> 12.) Now I am ready for the finish, Now Lacquer sucks for table tops but
> works great for the rest. So, I suggest either a poly base varnish or
> acrylic base.
> 13.) You will have to build up at least 5 coats with sanding between coats
> with 400 or 600. I always use 600. Only sand lightly to remove sheen and
> any dust or nibs. The last coat is never sanded, what you do is get some
> compound cleaner, compound, and polishing compound. Go to an auto supply
> store for this. If you have an auto polisher great! use that with wool
> bonnets. If you screw up somewhere no problem see step 11 it will help.
> 14.) Call customer tell them it is done and collect the money.
>
> Caveats:
> As I said before it all boils down to what works for you and your style.
> The process is going to be different no two people will do it the same.
> What matters is the final result. The best advice get comfortable with one
> process know it inside out, how it works with different woods and then begin
> to create your own way. Going from one process to another, and then another
> is one of the most stressing things to do. Especially in wood finishing
> which scares a lot of people and prevents them from getting into this
> wonderful gratifying hobby.
>
> Today, I only work with 4 processes that work for me and have never come to
> any situation where I was leery of taking on a project. Including color
> matching.
>
> Any way hope this helps and gets you started in the right direction.
>
> "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>I'll be doing an oak desk next Oak isn't considered oily, is it?
>>
>>What is the solvent for the vinyl sealer? Laq thinner?
>>
>>Thanks for a very informative post.
>>
>>dave
>>
>>Not Telling wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY
>
> WOODS.
>
>>>The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it
>
> protects
>
>>>what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to
>
> prevent it
>
>>>from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to
>
> level
>
>>>evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils
>
> interference.
>
>>>The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the
>
> sealer
>
>>>manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by
>
> checking,
>
>>>cracking, lifting.
>>>
>>>Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes
>
> for
>
>>>oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to
>
> apply
>
>>>any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to
>
> be
>
>>>sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
>>>imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction
>
> to
>
>>>take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood
>
> oil,
>
>>>etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly,
>
> level,
>
>>>and cure properly.
>>>
>>>Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much easier
>
> and
>
>>>more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
>>>
>>>
>>>"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>>
>>>>I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
>>>>undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
>>>>what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
>>>>"dentable" than precat lac?
>>>>
>>>>dave
>>>>
>>>>Not Telling wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Joe,
>>>>>
>>>>>90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
>>>
>>>sure
>>>
>>>
>>>>>that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
>>>>>thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
>>>>>applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
>>>
>>>spray
>>>
>>>
>>>>>piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any
>
> imperfections
>
>>>>>such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
>>>>>second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
>>>
>>>however
>>>
>>>
>>>>>depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you
>
> have
>
>>>to
>>>
>>>
>>>>>add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
>>>
>>>letter!
>>>
>>>
>>>>>Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
>>>
>>>chemicals,
>>>
>>>
>>>>>etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent
>>>
>>>is
>>>
>>>
>>>>>composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity
>
> gun
>
>>>is
>>>
>>>
>>>>>a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
>>>
>>>either
>>>
>>>
>>>>>a small cup or larger cup.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
>>>>>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>
>
I'll be doing an oak desk next Oak isn't considered oily, is it?
What is the solvent for the vinyl sealer? Laq thinner?
Thanks for a very informative post.
dave
Not Telling wrote:
> Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY WOODS.
> The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it protects
> what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to prevent it
> from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to level
> evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils interference.
> The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the sealer
> manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by checking,
> cracking, lifting.
>
> Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes for
> oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to apply
> any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to be
> sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
> imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction to
> take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood oil,
> etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly, level,
> and cure properly.
>
> Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much easier and
> more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
>
>
> "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
>>undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
>>what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
>>"dentable" than precat lac?
>>
>>dave
>>
>>Not Telling wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Joe,
>>>
>>>90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
>
> sure
>
>>>that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
>>>thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
>>>applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
>
> spray
>
>>>piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any imperfections
>>>such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
>>>second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
>
> however
>
>>>depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you have
>
> to
>
>>>add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
>
> letter!
>
>>>Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
>
> chemicals,
>
>>>etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent
>
> is
>
>>>composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity gun
>
> is
>
>>>a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
>
> either
>
>>>a small cup or larger cup.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
>>>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
Joe,
90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make sure
that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and spray
piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any imperfections
such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can, however
depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you have to
add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to letter!
Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq, chemicals,
etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent is
composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity gun is
a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use either
a small cup or larger cup.
"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>
>
You are Joking or purposely leading everyone astray, aren't you?
I have been spraying Lacquers for over 40 years, and have probably over 100
different people over those years that sprayed for a good deal of time
before and after working for me.
With all the different ways of finishing that I have ever heard off some I
agreed with some I didn't
I have never heard of doing anything remotely close to what you propose you
are doing.
I had to read your process 3 times because I couldn't believe what I was
reading.
I hesitated strongly on writing this because I do not like to criticize
people.
If this is working for you, I say Great but some very strong advise that I
give to you is to get back to those books or better still get the proper
information about staining and lacquering.
You can flame me all you want, I will not answer anything and have no
intention of getting into a pissing contest with you or anyone else.
George
"Not Telling" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Yes and No, Any wood species will have oil, what sets them apart is the
> quantity and them the viscosity of that oil. As far as Oak is concerned?
> Mostly in Red Oak species and some in the White Oak spices. In my years
of
> wood working I have only one problem with Oak and that was Red Oak.
> Applying sealer is the key. I have read many books on finishing and have
a
> large collection on this subject and the common denominator from all of
them
> is surface preparation. In my initial start of this hobby turned full
time
> business there was much confusion on this subject especially in trying
what
> and when to use a sanding sealer, filler, stain sealer, on so on! From
this
> I learned the hard way by experimenting with the woods that I would more
> then likely be using and restoring. I then broke them down into two
> categories ( I will get flamed for this, but It works for me). Those of
> open grain i.e. oak and those of closed grain i.e. maple as an example.
> What I discovered was that with open grain woods if I would sand to 220
and
> then apply stain, allow to dry and sand again with 220, and begin to wet
> sand up to 400 with the stain I ended up with mirror smooth finish with
> depth. I then applied my seal coat, and then my final finish. What I am
> trying to get here is that everyone has a method that works for them and
> that method may not work for you. Why? simple we all have different ways
of
> doing things that work for the way we do things. So, where does this
leave
> you? Easy, get a basic understanding of the process and always remember
that
> it is a process and can be modified just as a recipe is to make it more
> sweet or spicy. The result is the same. Ok, by now I have confused you
so
> let me walk you through in what I would do with this project. I am going
to
> assume it is white oak, actually it does not matter as my process is the
> same.
>
> 1.) First this project is going to be a desk so the process is going to
> require two processes. One for the table top and one for the rest of the
> desk.
> 2.) I next take my oak and thoroughly sand up to 220 the end grain is
sanded
> up 320. Why, because end grain absorbs 2 too 3 times as much stain.
> 3.) Got to decide how much color saturation I want ( light too dark)
> 4.) Next if deep color saturation is needed then I will use a full bodied
> clean rag. Note that deep saturation is not how light or dark the color
is.
> What it does is when using a full bodies rag (terry towel) the grain pores
> will absorb most of the stain where the closed pores will absorb the
least.
> For even stain with grain and pores use a clean rag made from 50/50
> cotton/poly blend similar to a hanky. The full bodied rag will give you
the
> dark open grain and light grain look. The 50/50 will give you a more even
> color saturation.
> 5.) Allow to dry, and sand up to 220
> 6.) Color saturation should be real close now, if not use 50./50 rag
concept
> above in step 4
> 7.) If it is now we are ready for the color sanding. Get some 220 and your
> stain pour a small puddle and begin to color sand small areas first.
Start
> out the ends first. The key here is pressure not to little not to much.
If
> the sand paper is lightly slipping between your hand and the wood then its
> perfect amount of pressure.
> 8.) Once the stain gets slurry (mixture of stain and wood dust) wipe clean
> and restart with new sand paper and higher grit. I usually go up to 400
but
> always end up with 600.
> 9.) Examine each color sand step for color blend and imperfections and fix
> those. Small imperfections may require further sanding with a little more
> pressure.
> 10.) I am done and ready for the sealing coat. My customer in this case
> likes Lacquer so I will prepare my solution 60 per cent Lacq thinner and
40
> percent Lacq. Once sprayed and try, I will sand with 400 then 600 with
just
> enough pressure at 600 to cut any little nibs left over.
> 11.) Next a take a damp 50/50 rag in Lacq thinner and quickly wipe my
> project. When I say damp I mean damp not wet. Ask your wife or
girlfriend
> to show you what damp is. This is important very important as this step
> clears and removes this that we can not feel or see.
> 12.) Now I am ready for the finish, Now Lacquer sucks for table tops but
> works great for the rest. So, I suggest either a poly base varnish or
> acrylic base.
> 13.) You will have to build up at least 5 coats with sanding between coats
> with 400 or 600. I always use 600. Only sand lightly to remove sheen and
> any dust or nibs. The last coat is never sanded, what you do is get some
> compound cleaner, compound, and polishing compound. Go to an auto supply
> store for this. If you have an auto polisher great! use that with wool
> bonnets. If you screw up somewhere no problem see step 11 it will help.
> 14.) Call customer tell them it is done and collect the money.
>
> Caveats:
> As I said before it all boils down to what works for you and your style.
> The process is going to be different no two people will do it the same.
> What matters is the final result. The best advice get comfortable with
one
> process know it inside out, how it works with different woods and then
begin
> to create your own way. Going from one process to another, and then
another
> is one of the most stressing things to do. Especially in wood finishing
> which scares a lot of people and prevents them from getting into this
> wonderful gratifying hobby.
>
> Today, I only work with 4 processes that work for me and have never come
to
> any situation where I was leery of taking on a project. Including color
> matching.
>
> Any way hope this helps and gets you started in the right direction.
>
> "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > I'll be doing an oak desk next Oak isn't considered oily, is it?
> >
> > What is the solvent for the vinyl sealer? Laq thinner?
> >
> > Thanks for a very informative post.
> >
> > dave
> >
> > Not Telling wrote:
> >
> > > Ok, The only time I will use a vinyl sealer made for Lacq is for OILY
> WOODS.
> > > The vinyl sealer creates an almost impregnable surface. That is it
> protects
> > > what ever is lying under it whether bare wood, glaze, or stain to
> prevent it
> > > from causing problems with your Lacq and it also allows the Lacq to
> level
> > > evenly and cure properly without the worry of the wood oils
> interference.
> > > The gotcha is simply to spray your Lacq in the time allotted from the
> sealer
> > > manufacture. failure to do so WILL result in the Lacq to fail by
> checking,
> > > cracking, lifting.
> > >
> > > Ah, but the real question is, Do you really need it ? Yes and No, Yes
> for
> > > oily woods and No when they are not oily woods. The real reason to
> apply
> > > any sealer is for SURFACE PREPARATION. Any sealer applied is meant to
> be
> > > sanded down as much as possible to remove any lifted grain and
> > > imperfections. And most importantly, to prevent any chemical reaction
> to
> > > take place between the wood and Lacq because of the stain, glaze, wood
> oil,
> > > etc. Added benefits are from allowing the Lacq to adhere properly,
> level,
> > > and cure properly.
> > >
> > > Now, you can also use shellac for a sealer instead which is much
easier
> and
> > > more forgiving. But only use clear shellac!
> > >
> > >
> > > "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > > news:[email protected]...
> > >
> > >>I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinly
> > >>undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you
know
> > >>what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
> > >>"dentable" than precat lac?
> > >>
> > >>dave
> > >>
> > >>Not Telling wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>Joe,
> > >>>
> > >>>90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make
> > >
> > > sure
> > >
> > >>>that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3.
One
> > >>>thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast.
Before
> > >>>applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and
> > >
> > > spray
> > >
> > >>>piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any
> imperfections
> > >>>such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there
apply
> > >>>second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can,
> > >
> > > however
> > >
> > >>>depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you
> have
> > >
> > > to
> > >
> > >>>add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to
> > >
> > > letter!
> > >
> > >>>Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq,
> > >
> > > chemicals,
> > >
> > >>>etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per
cent
> > >
> > > is
> > >
> > >>>composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity
> gun
> > >
> > > is
> > >
> > >>>a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use
> > >
> > > either
> > >
> > >>>a small cup or larger cup.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > >>>news:[email protected]...
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system
and
> > >>>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
"Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
> looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>
>
I like the Porter Cable conversion gun that I got at Lowes a year or so ago.
I think they still carry it. It is gravity feed, and is very consistent,
and easy to use.
I have not sprayed lacquer, but I have sprayed auto Polyurethane (very
dangerous stuff, I used forced fresh air mask), to oil paint, to sanding
sealer, to satin and gloss polly. All good results.
You do need a pretty high cfm compressor. At home I used a 20 gal tank, 15
amp, 2 stage unit, tied to a 2 tube tank oilless compressor. The two of
them ran full time, but could hold pressures as high as 35 lbs.
--
Jim in NC
I was recently in a Kelly Moore store and they suggested using a vinyl
undercoat made for use with the precat lacquers they sell. Do you know
what the pros and cons of using the sealer are? Is that stuff more
"dentable" than precat lac?
dave
Not Telling wrote:
> Joe,
>
> 90 per cent of my spraying is done with an HVLP and Lacq. Just make sure
> that you have the right needle for it. My Apollo uses a #2 or #3. One
> thing only pour what you need as the Lacq settles rather fast. Before
> applying a full spray I preseal as follows. Cut Lacq 60 percent and spray
> piece, let dry, and sand down with 400. Next feel for any imperfections
> such as raised grain and sand down, if open pores are still there apply
> second coat. Once smooth apply Lacq full strength right from can, however
> depending on where you live in dealing with heat, humidity, etc you have to
> add retarder or thin down. READ manufactures label and follow to letter!
> Never substitute from another manufacture or mix different lacq, chemicals,
> etc, from different manufactures. Oh, by the way the other 10 per cent is
> composed of Shellac and padding Lac. As mentioned on post a Gravity gun is
> a must have. get one designed for your HVLP and get one that can use either
> a small cup or larger cup.
>
>
>
> "Joe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Anybody here spray with lacquer? I'm interested in a HVLP system and
>>looking for comments on different brands etc. Thanks
>>
>>
>
>
>