Why does Uniguard go to the right?

I took a woodworking class at the local high school and they had the Unigard
system going to the left. It was the same long dust collection pipe and went
over the left of the saw and did not not interfer with large plywood
cutting. I believe they did this because this was the best place to put the
unisaw and the dust system was on the other side. There were no problems.
"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Mitch Berkson" wrote in message
>
> > 1. Why doesn't the Uniguard support pipe go to the left of the blade
> instead
> > of the right? It could be shorter (and cheaper), wouldn't interfere
with
> > the motor hatch cover and would be more stable (or lighter with
equivalent
> > stability).
>
> If I understand you correctly, it would make for a lot of unusable space
to
> the left of the saw to have that much pipe sticking out. The Uniguard
> support is designed to go along the back of any extension wings or table.
>
> IOW, it would just about double the footprint/space requirement for the
saw
> to do that.
>
> --
> www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 4/13/04
>
>

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 18:13:00 GMT, "Wood Butcher" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I've filed it under "Inspiration" for when I finally get around to
>needing a taper jig. Yours sure has those metal contraptions
>beat by a country mile.

It's MUCH safer and more accurate. The clamps are $7-8 each, so the
price is a wash.

However, I didn't invent it, I can't even remember where I saw it
first. It may have been in the good ol' Tage Frid book.

Barry

Mark Jerde wrote:

> I spent over $5k on an unsuccessful patent and don't have the $ to
> try again anytime soon. But I've often wondered why blowing
> compressed air over the blade just under the tabletop wouldn't work
> to get rid of most of the dust that comes out of the top of the TS.

Alternatively, perhaps the teeth could be shaped to shed the sawdust under
the table... ;-) At high velocity air acts a lot like concrete...

-- Mark

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 04:00:51 GMT, "Wood Butcher" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>That's a nice taper jig Barry. Is it a one off or adjustable?

Thanks! Technically, it's adjustable.

>If adjustable, how does it adjust?

Redrill the holes for the screws, the blocks aren't glued. It only
takes about 3 minutes to set it up using leg #1 of 5. Ever since I've
started making (5) legs for tables, I've never used the fifth! <G>

Barry

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:20:53 -0400, "Mitch Berkson"
<[email protected]> wrote:


>is high enough. So conceptually collecting under the table should work
>since it will remove dust before the blade can spin that gullet of it out
>the top.

You're right, it _should_, but it often dosen't work out that way.

Look here: <http://www.bburke.com/wood/images/Skinnysledtaper2.jpg>

This isn't even with a zero clearance insert, with a short 4" run to a
2hp DC. I clean the saw regularily, note how much dust is on top.

Is the Uni your first table saw?

Barry

I've filed it under "Inspiration" for when I finally get around to
needing a taper jig. Yours sure has those metal contraptions
beat by a country mile.

Art

"B a r r y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 04:00:51 GMT, "Wood Butcher" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >That's a nice taper jig Barry. Is it a one off or adjustable?
>
> Thanks! Technically, it's adjustable.
>
> >If adjustable, how does it adjust?
>
> Redrill the holes for the screws, the blocks aren't glued. It only
> takes about 3 minutes to set it up using leg #1 of 5. Ever since I've
> started making (5) legs for tables, I've never used the fifth! <G>
>
> Barry

"Mitch Berkson" wrote in message

> 1. Why doesn't the Uniguard support pipe go to the left of the blade
instead
> of the right? It could be shorter (and cheaper), wouldn't interfere with
> the motor hatch cover and would be more stable (or lighter with equivalent
> stability).

If I understand you correctly, it would make for a lot of unusable space to
the left of the saw to have that much pipe sticking out. The Uniguard
support is designed to go along the back of any extension wings or table.

IOW, it would just about double the footprint/space requirement for the saw
to do that.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/13/04

B a r r y wrote:
>
> That's the design DeWalt uses. What happens when you drop the arbor
> nut or an off cut clogs the hose? <G> I'd much rather dig my arbor
> nut out of the pile of dust in the bottom of my saw, which is not a
> Delta, than disassemble hoses.

Good point. But this could be taken care of by putting a piece of coarse
screen (like chicken wire) over the intake.

Maybe you're right about the dust coming out the top. But it seems as if
each tooth removes wood going down towards the table especially if the blade
is high enough. So conceptually collecting under the table should work
since it will remove dust before the blade can spin that gullet of it out
the top.

Mitch Berkson

That's a nice taper jig Barry. Is it a one off or adjustable?
If adjustable, how does it adjust?

Art

"B a r r y" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:20:53 -0400, "Mitch Berkson"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
> >is high enough. So conceptually collecting under the table should work
> >since it will remove dust before the blade can spin that gullet of it out
> >the top.
>
> You're right, it _should_, but it often dosen't work out that way.
>
> Look here: <http://www.bburke.com/wood/images/Skinnysledtaper2.jpg>
>
> This isn't even with a zero clearance insert, with a short 4" run to a
> 2hp DC. I clean the saw regularily, note how much dust is on top.
>
> Is the Uni your first table saw?
>
> Barry

Mitch Berkson wrote:

> Maybe you're right about the dust coming out the top. But it seems
> as if each tooth removes wood going down towards the table especially
> if the blade is high enough. So conceptually collecting under the
> table should work since it will remove dust before the blade can spin
> that gullet of it out the top.

I spent over $5k on an unsuccessful patent and don't have the $ to try again
anytime soon. But I've often wondered why blowing compressed air over the
blade just under the tabletop wouldn't work to get rid of most of the dust
that comes out of the top of the TS.

Thoughts?

-- Mark

"Jerry" wrote in message
> I took a woodworking class at the local high school and they had the
Unigard
> system going to the left. It was the same long dust collection pipe and
went
> over the left of the saw and did not not interfer with large plywood
> cutting. I believe they did this because this was the best place to put
the
> unisaw and the dust system was on the other side. There were no problems.
> "Swingman" wrote in message

> > If I understand you correctly, it would make for a lot of unusable space
> to
> > the left of the saw to have that much pipe sticking out. The Uniguard
> > support is designed to go along the back of any extension wings or
table.
> >
> > IOW, it would just about double the footprint/space requirement for the
> saw
> > to do that.

I am not saying it doesn't work, just that it makes for a bigger footprint
for the saw.

Fine and good for the local High School, with my taxpayer money ... but, I
don't know many folks with enough room in their shops to mount a Uniguard to
the left so that you could still cut an 8' sheet of plywood in half.

My bet is they are few and far between, and then only those with a smaller
configuration. Hell, the saw wouldn't even fit in my current shop that way,
unless you wanted to make a room divider out of it.

When I get a bigger shop, I'll try it and report back ... but keep
breathing, ITMT. :)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/13/04

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 12:06:00 -0400, "Mitch Berkson"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>I have two questions:
>1. Why doesn't the Uniguard support pipe go to the left of the blade instead
>of the right? It could be shorter (and cheaper), wouldn't interfere with
>the motor hatch cover and would be more stable (or lighter with equivalent
>stability).

Most people rip to the right of the blade and crosscut to the left.

A Uniguard mounted on the left would likely interfere when
crosscutting or dadoing wide stock, and using sleds and sliding
tables. When ripping, a left mounted Uniguard would limit the off cut
side of the cut as well. Mounting the guard to clear maximum rip
capacity on right keeps the post out of the way.

Don't forget, an awful lot of new Unisaws come with the motor cover on
the left, so motor cover clearance is kind of a moot point.

As far as the dust collector "design flaw", did you do ANY hands-on
research before you bought the saw? The Unisaw's connection is no
better or worse than that on just about any other saw I've looked at.

Barry

B a r r y wrote:
>
> Is the Uni your first table saw?

Yes.

Mitch Berkson

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 14:50:01 -0400, "Mitch Berkson"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I assume your quotation marks around "design flaw" are meant to suggest that
>you think this is somehow not a lame design? Is your only reason for
>thinking that because other dust collection connectors are equally poor?

Yup.

> Do
>other alternatives come without instructions and with extraneous screws?

Sometimes, other times, they're four inches from the bottom, with no
chute, use 2" connectors, or have louvers next to them.

>You should look at the SawStop saw's dust collection arrangement
>(http://snipurl.com/5xzr). That looks well designed.

That's the design DeWalt uses. What happens when you drop the arbor
nut or an off cut clogs the hose? <G> I'd much rather dig my arbor
nut out of the pile of dust in the bottom of my saw, which is not a
Delta, than disassemble hoses.

Really good table saw dust collection happens up top. You'll find
that with close or zero clearance inserts, most of the dust ends up on
top of the saw anyway. Many folks realize that if some dust sits in
the bottom of the saw, it really dosen't mean all that much. Some
people don't even bother with bottom end TS dust collection.

Barry

B a r r y wrote:
> On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 12:06:00 -0400, "Mitch Berkson"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> I have two questions:
>> 1. Why doesn't the Uniguard support pipe go to the left of the blade
>> instead of the right? It could be shorter (and cheaper), wouldn't
>> interfere with the motor hatch cover and would be more stable (or
>> lighter with equivalent stability).
>
> Most people rip to the right of the blade and crosscut to the left.
>
> A Uniguard mounted on the left would likely interfere when
> crosscutting or dadoing wide stock, and using sleds and sliding
> tables. When ripping, a left mounted Uniguard would limit the off cut
> side of the cut as well. Mounting the guard to clear maximum rip
> capacity on right keeps the post out of the way.

Those sound like good reasons.

> As far as the dust collector "design flaw", did you do ANY hands-on
> research before you bought the saw? The Unisaw's connection is no
> better or worse than that on just about any other saw I've looked at.

I assume your quotation marks around "design flaw" are meant to suggest that
you think this is somehow not a lame design? Is your only reason for
thinking that because other dust collection connectors are equally poor? Do
other alternatives come without instructions and with extraneous screws?

When I bought the saw I had looked at a few, though I wouldn't glorify that
overmuch by calling it research. Even so, at the time I bought it, dust
collection was not a high priority for me, I wouldn't have known what to
look for and I would have expected Delta to have some designs which were
somewhat better executed than what they have available. As it is, it looks
like they had the same perspective about dust collection as I did - first
just build the saw and then cobble together some way of handling dust
collection.

You should look at the SawStop saw's dust collection arrangement
(http://snipurl.com/5xzr). That looks well designed.

Mitch Berkson