Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. I got a few pieces of
5"x15"x7' Douglas fir glulam beams, and am nearing completion of a rather
heavy workbench using them. Although the top will be 4 inches thick, and
very stiff, I am beginning to be a little concerned that the top surface
will be a bit soft, so I am thinking of putting on a layer of hardwood for
durability. My concern is that differing rates of expansion over the 29"
width of the top will break the glue joint between the two types of wood.
Thus, I have a few questions for the ng:
1) Am I too worried? The bench is in an unheated garage, and the climate
here near Seattle is very mild, so I don't anticipate that the wood in the
bench will change that much in moisture content over the year.
2) Can I just try to pick a hardwood that is fairly close in wood movement
to Douglas fir? I am going to try to use some recycled flooring, so
obvious options are hard maple, red or white oak, or hickory.
3) If I do glue on a layer of hardwood, what might be the best glue choice?
I know some glues are not flexible at all, such as hide glue, but others
are much more forgiving, like polyurethane. What might be a good choice?
Thanks for your help.
On Fri, 14 Nov 2008 02:01:30 +0000, MIKE- wrote
(in article <[email protected]>):
> Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
> Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
> sticks? :-)
or worse still, wear gloves while playing..
or more worserer even, wear gloves while bench pressing..
ah.. benches, yes...
Sacrificial hardboard top, if you must an' you want to re-flat the surface
every few years by chucking and replacing it. That way it'll have good
surface for lay-ups and assemblifying stuff an' you'll never be scared of
ruining it
Else a used (but not abused) workbench with a few dings, worn bits, blood
stains etc.looks rather nice, don'tya think? the patina of function gives it
some credibility. Of course crap stuff won't ever take on that used, aged and
bedded-in look.. it just falls apart. Think Ikea "furniture" vs. say, Shaker
or (insert favourite style here.)
<obtuse ramble>
Ever been to someone's house where they keep the soft furniture covered in
the shrink wrap it came in from the store, to "keep it nice"?
I haven't seen it for a few years. I don't go to total strangers' houses very
often but when I was doing deliveries and installation jobs in college
vacation time, I would occasionally encounter this weird phenomenon, together
with carpets covered in clear pvc mats so you could walk on the carpet
without, er, walking on the carpet.
In the north of England, back in the 'fifties, it was common to have one room
in the house NEVER used, but kept for "best" This was in a house that only
had two downstairs rooms and a kitchen.
Of course, the only occasions that warranted using the best room - the
'front" room, or "parlour" were entertaining the Vicar with a cup of tea and
a ceremonial biscuit (cookie) and laying out a recently departed member of
the household. It was never used as a drawing room, for example, and the door
to the street was permanently locked and may have gone for several years
without being opened. Normally the only reason to go into the room would be
to dust it, wind the clock and add yet another layer of polish to the
undisturbed polish on the furniture.
The room was essentially a museum; full of fine things, and like the
artefacts in a Pharaoh's tomb, maybe for use in the afterlife.
I have seen workshops like this.
No dust.. I mean NO dust, like even creating sawdust would be "abusing" the
set-up, but they are a display area for a collection of tools which are some
sort of trophy acquisition and a statement about masculinity or somesuch. Mr
Wood Whisperer does a lovely skit on this.
A tool ain't a tool unless it's drawn blood at least once and any furniture
you've not had sex on at least once is not yet part of the house, though the
picnic table on the front lawn has a different agenda, maybe.
</obtuse ramble>
Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
On Sat, 15 Nov 2008 00:29:45 +0000, MIKE- wrote
(in article <[email protected]>):
> Bored Borg wrote:
>>
>> Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
>>
>
> Why?
>
>
>
so it looks classy
I cleaned my '60s Zildjian A 'hats the day I bought them, to get the green
stuff off and check 'em out for cracks (none at all.) That was about 10 years
ago.
I used a toofbrush and lots and lots of mild detergent and rinsed for ages.
Finished off with guaranteed non abrasive polish and haven't cleaned 'em
since, and anyone who tries will have to have a 5a-ectomy performed by a
proctologist of their choice.
That's one extreme,
here's another.
I bought a 20" nameless nasty in 1971. (Krud? Zit?) It cost me 50 pence -
around a dollar at today's X rates.
Sounded like a saucepan falling off a stove, but it did me sterling service
for many years and clipped to a 20" drum, made a useful in-transport
protector..
When I finally replaced it with a Sabian ultra-heavy HH 22 (not in the
catalogue btw) I took the 20, and on a nothing to lose basis, carefully
hammered sets of concentric rings into it, expecting I'd have to toss it away
afterwards.
By some sod's law defeating miracle, the vandalism transformed this pile of
trash into a gorgeous-sounding deep-rumbling long-sustaining and sweet
tam-tam soundalike that J. Arthur Rank would be proud of. I've now gone
precious on it. I'd be terrified of hammering it again and ruining this now
fine instrument.. but I'm quite happy to polish it. It has virtually no
lathing (grooves) in it, The Zildjians, for example, have quite pronounced
grooves and I think this makes some difference, though I still wouldn't
polish the HH which has a brilliant finish and not much groovery.
I experimented briefly with armor-all (?) as a surface protectant on the
grounds that it is supposed to be molecular-thin and beautifies everything.
It left nasty marks everywhere, on the cymbals and drum heads. Don't do it.
It is Folly.
You'll notice that nothing matches in my set-up. Everything chosen on sound,
not appearance, so I've got Sabian ride and crash, Zildjian hats and crashes,
Meinl crash (fast!!) and Wuhan bell/splash. I've got some Pearls somewhere
for eating Pizza off of..
Does anyone notice or care?
Maybe 14 yr old drummers who buy signature drumsticks so they'll sound
exactly like Joey.. but I'm not playing to them - (I'm playing to their
girlfriends :-) ) would probably notice the different logos and think
I'm playing cast-offs. Unpolished cast-offs.
AS you know, all 14 yr olds spend a lot of time polishing.
But not French polishing.
On Sat, 15 Nov 2008 13:58:37 +0000, Swingman wrote
(in article <[email protected]>):
> We'd have to arrest you here. It's against the law for a drummer to bring
> more than a kick, snare and hi-hat to a gig ... or otherwise annoy a bass
> player.
>
> As Billy Mooney would say, ya fookin' right!
>
>>>
Annoy a bass player? How do you do that.. start the gig on time instead of
waiting for 'em to show up? :-)
>
>
Last few gigs I've been out front, wailing on blues harp. All me kit in one
pocket...
Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
*snip*
>
> I don't own a 3" thick maple top, and if I did, I'd be afraid to use
> the sucker. No fear in using "white wood" My only suggestion is make
> sure you throw on some varnish, preferably something that yellows with
> age. Varnish keeps the dirt out, and dirty wood is ugly.
>
There's another advantage to the "white wood" SPF tops, and that's its
hardness. Since it dents easily it'll serve to cushion and protect a
little better than a harder wood. Inevitabily, you'll be holding something
up to get a better look and drop it. ;-)
Puckdropper
--
If you're quiet, your teeth never touch your ankles.
To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm
"Scritch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. I got a few
> pieces of
> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir glulam beams, and am nearing completion of a
> rather
> heavy workbench using them. Although the top will be 4 inches
> thick, and
> very stiff, I am beginning to be a little concerned that the top
> surface
> will be a bit soft, so I am thinking of putting on a layer of
> hardwood for
> durability. My concern is that differing rates of expansion over
> the 29"
> width of the top will break the glue joint between the two types
> of wood.
I built my workbench using Douglas Fir glulams about 7 years ago.
The dimensions are 60" x 30" x 4". It also has a protective edge of
1.5" Jarrah, dowelled and screwed to the Douglas Fir. I also gave it
several applications of diluted raw linseed oil.
I have used it for everything, - ...boat building .... mechanical
repairs on motorcycles, ... cutting and welding .... and more.
Currently I'm building new kitchen cabinets for SWMBO.
I have not yet found the need to re-finish the surface, - just a
twice yearly application of raw linseed- it seems to get better with
age,
If I were to build another bench, I would use the same material
again.
In article <[email protected]>,
-MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Aren't workbenches made to get banged up? Isn't that kind of their sole
> purpose?
Yes but I was a bit p****d off when when I made a mess of mine before I'd
even finished building it!
I am currently building a new bench and it has this lovely laminated Beech
top (actually a solid beech kitchen worktop) I had to break off and do
something else which involved cutting up some plywood. The new bench was
occupying most of the free space in my workshop so I just clamped it down
to that.
Now, it's always a good idea when using a circular saw to make sure your
cut is clear of whatever your work is fixed to................
I now have a slash about 1" deep and 10" long running across one corner of
my new bench. It's worse than anything on my old bench, which has seen
over 20 years of service :-(
> Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
> Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
> sticks? :-)
Sweat is acidic enough to corrode the metal and affect the sound.
--
Stuart Winsor
For Barn dances and folk evenings in the Coventry and Warwickshire area
See: http://www.barndance.org.uk
In article <[email protected]>,
-MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Well, yes and no..... and all the more reason to touch 'em.. a lot.
> I'll explain...
<SNIP>
Thank you for the explanation.
As a guitar player (12 string acoustic), I know that after a while strings
begin to sound dull and lifeless. Of course some of the deterioration is
due to wear but they do need to be changed regularly. When very new they
sound over-bright but then settle into a more mellow sound before,
eventually, becoming "dead". I had sort of assumed it would be similar
with cymbals, requiring occasional cleaning when they became too dull
sounding.
Stuart
--
Stuart Winsor
For Barn dances and folk evenings in the Coventry and Warwickshire area
See: http://www.barndance.org.uk
In article <[email protected]>,
-MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> It's like getting that first dent or scratch in a new car.
> You're actually relieved to get it over with. :-)
It would be nice to get it out of the showroom though first ;-|
--
Stuart Winsor
For Barn dances and folk evenings in the Coventry and Warwickshire area
See: http://www.barndance.org.uk
"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Bored Borg wrote:
>>
>> Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
>>
>
> Why?
Practice and SHMBO will really like it.
TGIF
I am trying to visualize how you used the gluelams but if the upward
facing part is edge grain, which I suppose it is, then you really
won't get much movement in the Fir.
You could just put whatever sacrificial material on there you want. If
you use 3/4" thick anything, you can just do some counter bored or
counter sinked holes and screw or bolt it down. If you used ply or MDF
then no need to account for movement (if Fir is edge grain). If you
use a panel or slats of hardwood (which seems odd), then the outer
hold down fastners should be in slots or oblonged holes.
On Nov 13, 10:21=A0am, Scritch <[email protected]> wrote:
> Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. =A0I got a few pieces=
of
> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir glulam beams, and am nearing completion of a rather
> heavy workbench using them. =A0Although the top will be 4 inches thick, a=
nd
> very stiff, I am beginning to be a little concerned that the top surface
> will be a bit soft, so I am thinking of putting on a layer of hardwood fo=
r
> durability. =A0My concern is that differing rates of expansion over the 2=
9"
> width of the top will break the glue joint between the two types of wood.=
=A0
> Thus, I have a few questions for the ng:
>
> 1) Am I too worried? =A0The bench is in an unheated garage, and the clima=
te
> here near Seattle is very mild, so I don't anticipate that the wood in th=
e
> bench will change that much in moisture content over the year.
>
> 2) Can I just try to pick a hardwood that is fairly close in wood movemen=
t
> to Douglas fir? =A0I am going to try to use some recycled flooring, so
> obvious options are hard maple, red or white oak, or hickory.
>
> 3) If I do glue on a layer of hardwood, what might be the best glue choic=
e? =A0
> I know some glues are not flexible at all, such as hide glue, but others
> are much more forgiving, like polyurethane. =A0What might be a good choic=
e?
>
> Thanks for your help.
"Bored Borg" wrote
> You'll notice that nothing matches in my set-up. Everything chosen on
> sound,
> not appearance, so I've got Sabian ride and crash, Zildjian hats and
> crashes,
> Meinl crash (fast!!) and Wuhan bell/splash. I've got some Pearls somewhere
> for eating Pizza off of..
Of course, you only play all that crap at home just to bother the neighbors,
eh?
We'd have to arrest you here. It's against the law for a drummer to bring
more than a kick, snare and hi-hat to a gig ... or otherwise annoy a bass
player.
As Billy Mooney would say, ya fookin' right!
:)
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)
"Scritch" wrote:
> Although the top will be 4 inches thick, and
> very stiff, I am beginning to be a little concerned that the top
> surface
> will be a bit soft, so I am thinking of putting on a layer of
> hardwood for
> durability.
Consider putting down a sacrificial piece of 1/4" hardboard held in
place with either fiddles or double backed tape at the corners only.
Simple, neat, easy and low cost.
Lew
Bored Borg wrote:
>
> Annoy a bass player? How do you do that.. start the gig on time instead of
> waiting for 'em to show up? :-)
>
>>
That and keep poking them each time they nod off during the gig. ;-)
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
Scritch wrote:
> dpb <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
>> Scritch wrote:
>> ...
>>> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir ...workbench ... top will be 4 inches thick,
>>> and [while] very stiff, ... am ... concerned that the top surface
>>> will be a bit soft, ...
>>
>> What on earth do you intend to be doing on it? Unless it's going to
>> be a mechanic's (as in heavy truck) bench, can't imagine what would
>> be doing that would cause _that_ much problem w/ Doug fir...
>>
>> imo, $0.02, ymmv, etc., etc., etc., ...
>>
>> --
>>
>
> Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
>
> Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
>
> Hammer slip when nailing
>
> etc.
When you get lots and lots of etceteras, sand down that 4" top to, say, 3
15/16. Or even 3 7/8.
--
dpb <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
> Scritch wrote:
> ...
>> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir ...workbench ... top will be 4 inches thick, and
>> [while] very stiff, ... am ... concerned that the top surface
>> will be a bit soft, ...
>
> What on earth do you intend to be doing on it? Unless it's going to be
> a mechanic's (as in heavy truck) bench, can't imagine what would be
> doing that would cause _that_ much problem w/ Doug fir...
>
> imo, $0.02, ymmv, etc., etc., etc., ...
>
> --
>
Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
Hammer slip when nailing
etc.
Come to think of it, however, my first workbench was made out of 2x4's
(fir), and got very chewed up, but I *was* rebuilding motorcycle engines on
it...
"dadiOH" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
>> etc.
>
> When you get lots and lots of etceteras, sand down that 4" top to,
> say, 3 15/16. Or even 3 7/8.
>
Finally got the top on the base last night. Not actually bolted on, just
sitting there. It's pretty heavy. I figure about 150 lb. Now I need to
get the vises on, bolt it to the base, then flatten the top. I haven't
decided yet whether to just use hand planes or if I should set up the
router sled. The only real hitch to setting up the sled is finding two
really straight 6' boards for the sled rails, but because of lots of
reversing grain and a few knots it will probably be worth it.
"Scritch" wrote:
> Finally got the top on the base last night. Not actually bolted on,
> just
> sitting there. It's pretty heavy. I figure about 150 lb. Now I
> need to
> get the vises on, bolt it to the base, then flatten the top. I
> haven't
> decided yet whether to just use hand planes or if I should set up
> the
> router sled. The only real hitch to setting up the sled is finding
> two
> really straight 6' boards for the sled rails, but because of lots of
> reversing grain and a few knots it will probably be worth it.
If you truly want to get a flat top, use a commercial drum sander.
Lew
-MIKE- <[email protected]> writes:
>>> Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
>>>
>>> Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
>>>
>>> Hammer slip when nailing
>>
>> I promise that whatever hardwood you use, it won't be as hard as a chisel or
>> a hammer.
>>
>> todd
>>
>
>
>You guys are crackin me up. It's a workbench, not the White House
>banquet table.
>Aren't workbenches made to get banged up? Isn't that kind of their sole
>purpose?
>
>Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
>Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
>sticks? :-)
drumsticks don't sweat.
scott
Scritch wrote:
...
> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir ...workbench ... top will be 4 inches thick, and
> [while] very stiff, ... am ... concerned that the top surface
> will be a bit soft, ...
What on earth do you intend to be doing on it? Unless it's going to be
a mechanic's (as in heavy truck) bench, can't imagine what would be
doing that would cause _that_ much problem w/ Doug fir...
imo, $0.02, ymmv, etc., etc., etc., ...
--
>> Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
>>
>> Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
>>
>> Hammer slip when nailing
>
> I promise that whatever hardwood you use, it won't be as hard as a chisel or
> a hammer.
>
> todd
>
You guys are crackin me up. It's a workbench, not the White House
banquet table.
Aren't workbenches made to get banged up? Isn't that kind of their sole
purpose?
Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
sticks? :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
>> Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
>> Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
>> sticks? :-)
>
> drumsticks don't sweat.
>
> scott
The point is, do you want to make stuff (music) with your tools
(instruments),
or sit and admire how shiny they look all set up in the basement? :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Bored Borg wrote:
> On Fri, 14 Nov 2008 02:01:30 +0000, MIKE- wrote
> (in article <[email protected]>):
>
>> Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
>> Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
>> sticks? :-)
>
> or worse still, wear gloves while playing..
>
> or more worserer even, wear gloves while bench pressing..
>
>
> ah.. benches, yes...
>
> Sacrificial hardboard top, if you must an' you want to re-flat the
> surface every few years by chucking and replacing it. That way it'll
> have good surface for lay-ups and assemblifying stuff an' you'll
> never be scared of ruining it
>
> Else a used (but not abused) workbench with a few dings, worn bits,
> blood stains etc.looks rather nice, don'tya think? the patina of
> function gives it some credibility. Of course crap stuff won't ever
> take on that used, aged and bedded-in look.. it just falls apart.
> Think Ikea "furniture" vs. say, Shaker or (insert favourite style
> here.)
>
> <obtuse ramble>
> Ever been to someone's house where they keep the soft furniture
> covered in the shrink wrap it came in from the store, to "keep it
> nice"?
>
> I haven't seen it for a few years. I don't go to total strangers'
> houses very often but when I was doing deliveries and installation
> jobs in college vacation time, I would occasionally encounter this
> weird phenomenon, together with carpets covered in clear pvc mats so
> you could walk on the carpet without, er, walking on the carpet.
>
> In the north of England, back in the 'fifties, it was common to have
> one room in the house NEVER used, but kept for "best" This was in a
> house that only had two downstairs rooms and a kitchen.
Not just England--my parents always had a "living room" in which
living was not allowed except when they had a party. Just as well,
the furniture was selected for appearance, not comfort.
> Of course, the only occasions that warranted using the best room -
> the
> 'front" room, or "parlour" were entertaining the Vicar with a cup of
> tea and a ceremonial biscuit (cookie) and laying out a recently
> departed member of the household. It was never used as a drawing
> room, for example, and the door to the street was permanently locked
> and may have gone for several years without being opened. Normally
> the only reason to go into the room would be to dust it, wind the
> clock and add yet another layer of polish to the undisturbed polish
> on the furniture.
>
> The room was essentially a museum; full of fine things, and like the
> artefacts in a Pharaoh's tomb, maybe for use in the afterlife.
>
> I have seen workshops like this.
>
> No dust.. I mean NO dust, like even creating sawdust would be
> "abusing" the set-up, but they are a display area for a collection
> of
> tools which are some sort of trophy acquisition and a statement
> about
> masculinity or somesuch. Mr Wood Whisperer does a lovely skit on
> this.
>
> A tool ain't a tool unless it's drawn blood at least once and any
> furniture you've not had sex on at least once is not yet part of the
> house, though the picnic table on the front lawn has a different
> agenda, maybe.
>
> </obtuse ramble>
>
> Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Bored Borg wrote:
> <obtuse ramble>
> </obtuse ramble>
>
> Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
>
That was entertaining.
I get the feeling you'd be good company for a cup of coffee.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Stuart wrote:
> I now have a slash about 1" deep and 10" long running across one corner of
> my new bench. It's worse than anything on my old bench, which has seen
> over 20 years of service :-(
>
It's like getting that first dent or scratch in a new car.
You're actually relieved to get it over with. :-)
>> Reminds me of drummers who wear gloves to handle their cymbals.
>> Umm, what about when you're hitting them real hard with big wooden
>> sticks? :-)
>
> Sweat is acidic enough to corrode the metal and affect the sound.
>
Well, yes and no..... and all the more reason to touch 'em.. a lot.
I'll explain...
Technically yes, the sebum secreted by human skin is acidic and
therefore corrosive to metals.
High end cymbals are B-20 Bronze-- 80 percent Copper, 20 Percent Tin,
with trace Silver and a few proprietary trade secret metals.
Anyone who has bronze art will tell you the extent of corrosion that
takes place, even when it's left out in the weather. That pretty green
patina we all love is about all that would ever happen. If they can dig
up artifacts that are thousands of years old with little more damage
than some patination, I think my cymbals will survive my lifetime.
So, about those cymbals. Very few of them are in raw state, meaning
most either have a protective coating applied, or they've been buffed so
shiny, they are virtually impervious to sweat. (My cat peed on one of
mine and it produced a cool patina almost overnight, so if you're
looking for a good patination formula, well..... see the cat.)
But let's just say there is no protection and the cymbals are raw, like
many of my older ones. As a younger dude, I made the mistake of
cleaning a cymbal loaned to me by my drum teacher. I brought it back
all shiny and new looking, with a grin on my face. I was proud,
expecting all kinds of thanks and kudos from my mentor. I'll never
forget the look on his face as I handed him his vintage 60's Zildjian A
ride. He looked at it and said, "What's this?" When I told him it was
the cymbal he loaned me, he got this look on his face I'll never forget.
It was a mix of sorrow and rage, with a touch of bewilderment, which
immediately translated his thoughts to me, "What the hell did you do!?"
That was my first lesson in learning that corrosion does in fact effect
the sound of a cymbal, as you correctly pointed out..... in a GOOD way.
But young pups, like I was, don't know this because they haven't been
around long enough to hear their cymbals age. Cleaning all that
"corrosion" off the cymbal takes away a lot of the character and dryness
in the sound. It brightens it up too much and makes it sound like any
other cymbal you can go down to the music store and buy. Problem is,
you have to wait another 20 years for it to sound good. :-)
All that to point back to by original analogy. Young inexperience
drummers care more about having shiny new equipment, while experienced
drummers just want to make great music. The same can be said for
woodworkers and our tools.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Bored Borg wrote:
>
> Yeah, hardboard. But French polish it.
>
Why?
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
joe wrote:
>>> Scritch wrote:
>>> ...
>> Come to think of it, however, my first workbench was made out of 2x4's
>> (fir), and got very chewed up, but I *was* rebuilding motorcycle engines
>> on
>> it...
>
> the dings, scratches and other such character marks you're speaking of will
> be easily removed/minimized when you occasionally resurface your 4" thick
> top.
>
> In other words, use it, don't abuse it, don't fret the occasional nick and
> mark and it will be ready for what you and your grandson and his grandson
> will dish out.
The first thing I built out of wood was my workbench. I made it out of
construction grade pine, the top is 2x4's ripped in half glued and
all-threaded together. If you ever had the pleasure of ripping 8'
construction grade 2xs in half, you know it is an experience. Anyway,
the top was not even close to being flat, so I borrowed a 4" belt sander
and sanded the hell out of it. When finished, the thing waved at anyone
that walked past. I quickly learned a lot on that bench but that was in
the mid 70's, and while I was going to replace the top with something
less "friendly" I never did. This sucker has served me well, and I'm
betting it will serve my son well some day. I'd never replace a thing
on this bench, and the patina from many years of abuse, blood sweat and
tears is awesome (to me) I have benches with replaceable hard board tops
but they suck as far as giving you that warm feeling that you get with
real wood.
The fact it is nowhere near flat has not bothered me much as I initially
thought. When I build stuff, I build it flat for the most part, so the
dimensions pretty much make it flat. When building a chair, I usually
set it on my table saw if I want to see how it looks on a perfectly flat
surface. While I do have some perfectly flat surfaces, only my table
saw top has a chance of seeing light, so rather than clear off a spot on
a bench, I just use the only clear surface in my shop.
Here's a flick of my old bench, can you tell how nice/nasty the top is?
Can you see the top?
http://www.jbstein.com/Flick/Bench.jpg
Anyhow, since then, my bench tops are always made of cheap, 2x6 pine, or
"White board" or whatever the borgs call it today. It's easy to work
with, ages nicely, and if you accidentally cut one in half with your
circular saw, you can quickly and cheaply replace it. I've never had to
replace any of my tops and I personally like the looks of finished pine
and the dents and bruises it gets over the years is a bonus. My guess
is most people will never replace their tops either, in fact, most
pictures of shops I see you can't see the top of anything. You can't
replace what you can't find:-)
I don't own a 3" thick maple top, and if I did, I'd be afraid to use the
sucker. No fear in using "white wood" My only suggestion is make sure
you throw on some varnish, preferably something that yellows with age.
Varnish keeps the dirt out, and dirty wood is ugly.
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com
Bored Borg wrote:
> I cleaned my '60s Zildjian A 'hats the day I bought them, to get the green
> stuff off and check 'em out for cracks (none at all.) That was about 10 years
> ago.
>
NewBeats?
And to think I came here from a percussion news group so I could talk
woodworking. :-)
> here's another.
>
> When I finally replaced it with a Sabian ultra-heavy HH 22 (not in the
> catalogue btw) I took the 20, and on a nothing to lose basis, carefully
> hammered sets of concentric rings into it, expecting I'd have to toss it away
> afterwards.
> By some sod's law defeating miracle, the vandalism transformed this pile of
> trash into a gorgeous-sounding deep-rumbling long-sustaining and sweet
> tam-tam soundalike that J. Arthur Rank would be proud of. I've now gone
> precious on it.
I don't know what the drum shops are like where you reside, but if you
get a chance to check out any Dream Bliss cymbals, it'll rock your world.
http://www.virtualcymbals.com/bliss.html
They're cheap Chinese hand hammered cast cymbals that sound ridiculously
similar to vintage K's and Istanbuls. I got 20 for $113, then I drilled
it for rivets, because... well, it was 113 bucks.
http://www.mikedrums.com/DreamBliss.mp3
I've also been hand hammering brass snare drum shells, lately.
> You'll notice that nothing matches in my set-up. Everything chosen on sound,
> not appearance, so I've got Sabian ride and crash, Zildjian hats and crashes,
> Meinl crash (fast!!) and Wuhan bell/splash. I've got some Pearls somewhere
> for eating Pizza off of..
>
> Does anyone notice or care?
>
Hmmm, lets see... I already mentions the Dream ride. I have Zildian,
Sabian, Paiste, Ufip, a Wuhan somewhere in the pile and some really
cheap generic splashes that I use for X-hats. And I picked them all
because I liked the sound. :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
> If you truly want to get a flat top, use a commercial drum sander.
>
> Lew
>
Because we all have one of those sitting around.
It's in the closet with the full sized plywood veneer press, behind the
autobody dipping tank, right next to the portable sawmill. :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
-MIKE- wrote:
>> If you truly want to get a flat top, use a commercial drum sander.
>>
>> Lew
>>
>
> Because we all have one of those sitting around.
> It's in the closet with the full sized plywood veneer press, behind
> the autobody dipping tank, right next to the portable sawmill. :-)
You mean above the elephant barn?
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Lew Hodgett wrote:
>> Because we all have one of those sitting around.
>
> Depends on how close one of the companies listed in Wolley Segap are.
>
Wha? Is this a regional thing. A business listing or what?
> In my case, it is less than 20 miles.
>
> They have a 3 drum, 75HP unit complete with a 20HP, bag house, dust
> collector.
>
> Less than $30 and you are good to go.
>
Is this a coop? Or a industrial woodworking company that takes in work?
Yeah, 30 bucks might be well worth it.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
J. Clarke wrote:
> You mean above the elephant barn?
>
LOL. I actually get to be in one of those on a regular basis.
The inhabitants LOVE watermelon and coconuts.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Lew Hodgett wrote:
>> Wha? Is this a regional thing. A business listing or what?
>
> Yellow Pages spelled backwards (Wolley Segap)
>
Don't I feel like a toidi.
>> Is this a coop? Or a industrial woodworking company that takes in
>> work?
>
> Commercial drum sander.
>
> Check with a local top or cabinet shop to find who they use.
>
> Lew
>
Learn some thing new every day.
I will definitely keep that in mind for future needs.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
-MIKE- wrote:
>
> Is this a coop? Or a industrial woodworking company that takes in work?
>
> Yeah, 30 bucks might be well worth it.
>
>
Check around with your local cabinet shops. I'd be surprised if you
didn't find one willing to provide the service.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
"Scritch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
>
> Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
>
> Hammer slip when nailing
I promise that whatever hardwood you use, it won't be as hard as a chisel or
a hammer.
todd
"-MIKE-" wrote:
>> Depends on how close one of the companies listed in Wolley Segap
>> are.
>>
>
> Wha? Is this a regional thing. A business listing or what?
Yellow Pages spelled backwards (Wolley Segap)
> Is this a coop? Or a industrial woodworking company that takes in
> work?
Commercial drum sander.
Check with a local top or cabinet shop to find who they use.
Lew
"Scritch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> dpb <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
>> Scritch wrote:
>> ...
>>> 5"x15"x7' Douglas fir ...workbench ... top will be 4 inches thick, and
>>> [while] very stiff, ... am ... concerned that the top surface
>>> will be a bit soft, ...
>>
>> What on earth do you intend to be doing on it? Unless it's going to be
>> a mechanic's (as in heavy truck) bench, can't imagine what would be
>> doing that would cause _that_ much problem w/ Doug fir...
>>
>> imo, $0.02, ymmv, etc., etc., etc., ...
>>
>> --
>>
>
> Chisel slip when chopping dovetails
>
> Dropping sharp, hard boards on benchtop
>
> Hammer slip when nailing
>
> etc.
>
>
>
> Come to think of it, however, my first workbench was made out of 2x4's
> (fir), and got very chewed up, but I *was* rebuilding motorcycle engines
> on
> it...
the dings, scratches and other such character marks you're speaking of will
be easily removed/minimized when you occasionally resurface your 4" thick
top.
In other words, use it, don't abuse it, don't fret the occasional nick and
mark and it will be ready for what you and your grandson and his grandson
will dish out.
jc