Building a cajon, structural strength issue

On Sunday, April 9, 2017 at 6:05:44 PM UTC-5, gdguarino wrote:
> For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially a wo=
oden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm a keyboard=
player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble in percussion. P=
lus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.=20
>=20
> I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any number of=
sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to ask about stru=
ctural strength.=20
>=20
> One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2" plywood. =
The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And some of us wan=
na-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a lifetime. I'm wonderin=
g about the strength of what is effectively a five-sided 1/2" ply box (the =
front side is made with very thin ply, maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will=
it need corner braces? Or 3/4" ply?

My granddaughter wanted on. Made it out of Home Depot bargain plywood and =
it has held up well. =20
Are you planning on putting the snare in it?

gdguarino <[email protected]> was heard to mutter:

>For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side.
>I'm a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
>
>I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here
>to ask about structural strength.
>
>One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2" plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And
>some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively
>a five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply, maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4" ply?

Last year I finally got around to purchase a Cajon on discount. I had
searched around locally and found only one model that I truly liked
which was at Sam Ash. I played around with it for two weeks and
decided I still was not satisfied with the sound. I decided maybe this
summer I would try and build my own.

I searched for plans and ideas and there are lots out there. Some
really good YouTube videos too. Many I have watched use plywood with
good results. Including weight handling. Check YouTube for ideas.

On Monday, April 24, 2017 at 5:19:10 PM UTC-4, Electric Comet wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 12:50:02 -0400
> Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon, which
> > is now temporarily finished.
>
> does that mean you reserve the right to tweak it here and there
>
Exactly.

gdguarino <[email protected]> wrote:

> For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially
> a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm
> a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble
> in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
>
> I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any
> number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to
> ask about structural strength.
>
> One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2"
> plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And
> some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a
> lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a
> five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply,
> maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4"
> ply?

Who da thunk the lid off a Brinkmann smoker and a big breasted gal
with legs spread across a wooden box could sound this good!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0s6sxxNG-I

On Monday, April 24, 2017 at 9:46:10 PM UTC-4, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 4/24/17 11:50 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
> > Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon, which
> > is now temporarily finished.
> >
> > Cajons come in at least two major varieties: with snare and without.
> > The "snare" variety has either snare-drum snares or some guitar
> > strings stretched across the back of the striking surface to add a
> > "snare-drum'-like quality to the higher-pitched sound you get by
> > striking near the edge.
> >
> > I made my Cajon with a set of snares that you can turn on or off.
> > They were mounted on a rod that can be turned so as to have the
> > snares contact the striking surface or not.
> >
> > https://flic.kr/p/SSaL2y
> >
> > (photo is shown with the striking surface - a piece of 1/8" plywood
> > - removed)
> >
> > I got the idea for the switchable snare from a Woodworking for Mere
> > Mortals video and used his placement of the rod. But there was a
> > problem. The angle of the snares to the striking surface was too
> > great, the snares only touched near their tips and didn't produce
> > much sound.
> >
> > I took a look at a couple of commercially-made cajons and saw that
> > the snares - like on a snare drum - were essentially laying lightly
> > on the back of the striking surface.
> >
> > I didn't want to move the rod at this stage; I'd have had to fill in
> > the holes that hold it in place. Instead, I made a couple of
> > "brackets" that attach to the rod and hold a narrow piece of 1/2" ply
> > that in turn holds the snares.
> >
> > https://flic.kr/p/TWZpCB https://flic.kr/p/TyBArq
> >
> > This now works pretty well. The snares, when "engaged" are nearly
> > parallel to the striking surface, and they produce the desired sound.
> > In addition, the sound can be adjusted a little bit my rotating the
> > knob to vary the "pressure" on the snares. Here's a poor photo inside
> > the cajon:
> >
> > https://flic.kr/p/U9xV56
> >
> > In the "disengaged" position the snares "jingle" softly from the
> > vibration of the box. I intend to install a piece of foam
> > weatherstripping for the snares to rest against when they are not in
> > use. That will probably wait until I decide on another experiment or
> > two that I might try to alter the sound.
> >
>=20
> The foam sounds like a good idea.
> I was thinking you could tape the strands together down a couple-few
> inches from the tips, just enough to wear the business end of the wires
> would contact the batter section of the cajon. The tape would keep them
> from jingling but still allow them to make a "snare" sound on the box.
> I suspect the jingling is from the separate wires percussing against one
> another.

That is exactly what is happening. The foam should be an easy fix, attached=
to the underside of the cajon top.=20
>=20
> BTW, if the snares don't work out, consider some sort of exterior pocket
> or something that would hold an existing shaker. Based on more the past
> 17 years of playing acoustic shows with singer/songwriters, I find
> certain shakers, rectangular, or pouch shakers filled with BB's or
> seeds, etc., sound much more like a snare drum than snare wires on
> anything other than the resonant head of a snare drum. :-)

Interesting. I actually have a pair of the LP "Finger Shots".=20
>=20
> Using an exterior shaker also give you the opportunity to
> customize/change the sound by simply attaching a different shaker.
>=20
> Back in the djembe fad of the noughties (2000s), I kept a velcro pad
> glued to the head of my djembe and spots of velcro stuck on just about
> every shaker device I owned. This allowed for a bunch of variation in
> sounds.

I'm not that up on what may be popular at any given time, but I have always=
loved percussion, the more different sounds the better. And I have a near-=
compulsion to tap on things in rhythm, finding the "sweet spot" of every ho=
usehold item that has any resonance at all. :)=20

Now that I finally have a home recording setup, I can preserve some ot that=
banging and tapping for posterity. =20

Thanks for the tips.

Greg Guarino <[email protected]> was heard to mutter:
>By the way, this is what it looks like all assembled:
>https://flic.kr/p/TWZvVC
>https://flic.kr/p/SXh1Jr
>---
>This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Greg it looks great. How does it sound? Are you happy with it?

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
>
> On 4/9/17 6:05 PM, gdguarino wrote:
> > For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially
> > a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm
> > a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble
> > in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
> >
> > I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any
> > number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to
> > ask about structural strength.
> >
> > One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2"
> > plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And
> > some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a
> > lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a
> > five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply,
> > maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4"
> > ply?
> >
>
> As a drummer and woodworker, I've avoided the cajon like the plague
> because it's just another gadget that will be piling up the corners of
> pawn shops and used music stores like the eleventy-zillion djembes that
> preceded the cajon.
>
> However, we often underestimate the strength of the average plywood box.
> With a 4-sided plywood rectangle, you have tremendous strength that is
> only weakened by lateral, diagonal force. That diagonal force is
> countered by the sides of the "cube" similar to how plywood sheathing
> provides the diagonal resistance to wind in the shear wall construction
> of a house.
>
> You have nothing to worry about. Even the thin side of the cajon is
> enough to provide enough diagonal strength. They are all made that way
> and I haven't seen one collapse yet.
>
> The more important factor to consider is what type of hardwood veneers
> to use in constructing your cajon. Use a wood that will provide and
> clean, consistent, even burning for when you inevitability end up making
> a camp fire out of the thing after the fad is over. :-)

Just a note but when I want to mess with somebody I'll take an empty medium
sized corrugated box, lay a piece of plywood on top, and use it for a step-
stool. People who haven't seen me do it don't believe that it works.

Compared to corrugated cardboard, half inch ply is _very_ strong.

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 16:05:42 -0700 (PDT), gdguarino
<[email protected]> wrote:

>For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
>
>I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to ask about structural strength.
>
>One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2" plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply, maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4" ply?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVZN_mdz7Ks

Here's a vid for you.

Otherwise go south, get a good strong cajun woman to sit on and.... :)

On 2017-04-13, Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:

> I'm guessing I'm a little larger than your granddaughter, but I'm
> reasonably persuaded that a 1/2" ply box will be robust enough.

I hafta agree. I wanted to ship a Fender Champ lap steel from CA to
NY:

<https://www.well.com/~wellvis/steels/Fender/FenderChamp-StudioDeluxe.jpg>

A local shipping store wanted to charge me $80USD fer packaging
(bubble wrap=$60USD! All cardboard!). I made a small box of a single
sheet of 1/2" ply. I bought some foam from our local suplus store,
put it all together with brass wood screws. Cost? $40USD. This
about 12 yrs ago.

Bottom line: I weighed about 260 lbs and could jump up and down on sed
box, all day long, with zero ill effects. ;)

nb

On Wed, 19 Apr 2017 11:54:47 -0400, Greg Guarino <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I've started building the cajon. The top and bottom are 3/4 prefinished
>birch ply; the sides and back are 1/2". The different thicknesses were
>mostly chosen because that's what I had available in scrap lumber, but
>it also allowed me to feel more comfortable about rabbeting the top and
>bottom to accept the side pieces and the back.
>
>https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33947797231/in/album-72157682631167556/
>
>The rod, by the way, will have snare wires attached to it and the knob
>will allow me to engage the snares or disengage them.
>
>The back also fits into rabbets. I decided to attach it with pocket
>screws for now. . If it seems like there is air leakage around the
>edges, I'll either glue it or caulk the joints.
>
>https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33719061480/in/album-72157682631167556/
>
>As predicted by some of you here, it feels more than stout enough, even
>without the front piece.
>
>
>---
>This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>https://www.avast.com/antivirus



Will it have 4 feet attached ? to allow bottom
to resonate a little ?
Perhaps an easy experiment, when it's all done -
to see if it makes a difference.
John T.

On 4/9/17 6:05 PM, gdguarino wrote:
> For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially
> a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm
> a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble
> in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
>
> I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any
> number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to
> ask about structural strength.
>
> One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2"
> plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And
> some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a
> lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a
> five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply,
> maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4"
> ply?
>

As a drummer and woodworker, I've avoided the cajon like the plague
because it's just another gadget that will be piling up the corners of
pawn shops and used music stores like the eleventy-zillion djembes that
preceded the cajon.

However, we often underestimate the strength of the average plywood box.
With a 4-sided plywood rectangle, you have tremendous strength that is
only weakened by lateral, diagonal force. That diagonal force is
countered by the sides of the "cube" similar to how plywood sheathing
provides the diagonal resistance to wind in the shear wall construction
of a house.

You have nothing to worry about. Even the thin side of the cajon is
enough to provide enough diagonal strength. They are all made that way
and I haven't seen one collapse yet.

The more important factor to consider is what type of hardwood veneers
to use in constructing your cajon. Use a wood that will provide and
clean, consistent, even burning for when you inevitability end up making
a camp fire out of the thing after the fad is over. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 4/9/2017 8:53 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> As a drummer and woodworker, I've avoided the cajon like the plague
> because it's just another gadget that will be piling up the corners of
> pawn shops and used music stores like the eleventy-zillion djembes that
> preceded the cajon.

Thanks for the construction tips. That makes sense.

As for the rest, I've also been a musician my whole life, keyboards
mostly. But I've also always been a "drummer"; drumming on everything
(except drums). I tap on desks, doors, appliances, the steering wheel of
my car, garbage cans, bottles, various body parts, you name it. I search
for the "sweet" spots, listening for different tones. Odd? Yeah, I know.

Being a keyboard player with a home recording setup, I now have access
to an absurd number of increasingly-convincing sampled sounds; notably
including drums and percussion. Even got myself a dedicated pad
controller - a vast improvement over trying to program percussion on a
keyboard.

But I'm finishing out my sixth decade this year, and I find that I want
to try some new things, one of which is adding some genuine percussion
to my recordings. The samples are pretty great these days, and are
recorded better than I'm likely to do at home. But the parts I play live
have a little more variability to them, replacing some of the
"perfection" with "feel". I like that.

Over the last couple of months I've acquired a set of Bongos, a Darbuka
and - yes - a Djembe. The Djembe is already on a recording. Adds a
touch of realism, even though my playing is still inexpert. That's
another great thing about these computer recording setups; I only need
to get the part right *once*. :) So far it's the Bongos that I seem to
have the most natural affinity for.

Fad or not, Cajons have been around for a long time. I first became
aware of them quite a while back on a Ruben Blades record. I like the
sound, at least on record. My attempts in the music store have not been
inspiring - yet. But I happen to have a bunch of pieces of prefinished
1/2" Birch ply courtesy of the discard pile behind a cabinet shop near
my house; enough to build a cajon. I figure a few hours work should
yield a cajon for just the expense of a piece of 1/8" ply. I can
probably even get a broken snare from my drummer, if I decide to put
snares in.

If it sucks, or I suck at playing it, there's not much loss.

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"gdguarino" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially a
wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm a
keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble in
percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.

I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any number of
sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to ask about
structural strength.

One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2" plywood. The
wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And some of us wanna-be
percussionists have put on a few pounds over a lifetime. I'm wondering about
the strength of what is effectively a five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front
side is made with very thin ply, maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it
need corner braces? Or 3/4" ply?

1/2" should be more than enough.

When I was a photographer I had some posing boxes made; varying sizes, 1/4"
ply. Never a problem.

On 4/12/2017 7:52 PM, Dr. Deb wrote:
>> One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2" plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply, maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4" ply?
> My granddaughter wanted on. Made it out of Home Depot bargain plywood and it has held up well.
> Are you planning on putting the snare in it?

I'm guessing I'm a little larger than your granddaughter, but I'm
reasonably persuaded that a 1/2" ply box will be robust enough.

As for the snares, I tend to prefer the no-snare sound, but I'm doing
this for fun and experimentation with different sounds, so I'll probably
add in a "switchable" snare. I don't watch that much of Woodworking for
Mere Mortals, but I have to say that his "mechanism" looks awfully easy
to accomplish; no reason not to add on that feature.

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On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 16:05:42 -0700 (PDT) [email protected] wrote:

> a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble
> in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.

what kind of ply is it

would expect only the active drum head part to make up most of the sound
signature so the box could be what ever holds you up

looking at other designs can give ideas and inspiration


make sure whatever you use will not splinter horribly should it fail

maybe add a cajones protector on the top of the cajon

I've started building the cajon. The top and bottom are 3/4 prefinished
birch ply; the sides and back are 1/2". The different thicknesses were
mostly chosen because that's what I had available in scrap lumber, but
it also allowed me to feel more comfortable about rabbeting the top and
bottom to accept the side pieces and the back.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33947797231/in/album-72157682631167556/

The rod, by the way, will have snare wires attached to it and the knob
will allow me to engage the snares or disengage them.

The back also fits into rabbets. I decided to attach it with pocket
screws for now. . If it seems like there is air leakage around the
edges, I'll either glue it or caulk the joints.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33719061480/in/album-72157682631167556/

As predicted by some of you here, it feels more than stout enough, even
without the front piece.


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On 4/19/17 10:54 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
> I've started building the cajon. The top and bottom are 3/4
> prefinished birch ply; the sides and back are 1/2". The different
> thicknesses were mostly chosen because that's what I had available in
> scrap lumber, but it also allowed me to feel more comfortable about
> rabbeting the top and bottom to accept the side pieces and the back.
>
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33947797231/in/album-72157682631167556/
>
>
>
> The rod, by the way, will have snare wires attached to it and the
> knob will allow me to engage the snares or disengage them.
>
> The back also fits into rabbets. I decided to attach it with pocket
> screws for now. . If it seems like there is air leakage around the
> edges, I'll either glue it or caulk the joints.
>
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33719061480/in/album-72157682631167556/
>
>
>
> As predicted by some of you here, it feels more than stout enough,
> even without the front piece.
>

Looking good.
You may be aware of this but the thicker the wood, the higher the pitch.
That's one reason for having a thinner "batter" side. Also, think about
a port. Do some reading on it. A port with usually add some low end
and resonance.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 4/19/2017 12:53 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 4/19/17 10:54 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
>> I've started building the cajon. The top and bottom are 3/4
>> prefinished birch ply; the sides and back are 1/2". The different
>> thicknesses were mostly chosen because that's what I had available in
>> scrap lumber, but it also allowed me to feel more comfortable about
>> rabbeting the top and bottom to accept the side pieces and the back.
>>
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33947797231/in/album-72157682631167556/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> The rod, by the way, will have snare wires attached to it and the
>> knob will allow me to engage the snares or disengage them.
>>
>> The back also fits into rabbets. I decided to attach it with pocket
>> screws for now. . If it seems like there is air leakage around the
>> edges, I'll either glue it or caulk the joints.
>>
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33719061480/in/album-72157682631167556/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> As predicted by some of you here, it feels more than stout enough,
>> even without the front piece.
>>
>
> Looking good.
> You may be aware of this but the thicker the wood, the higher the pitch.
> That's one reason for having a thinner "batter" side. Also, think about
> a port. Do some reading on it. A port with usually add some low end
> and resonance.
>
>
The front piece (the "tapa") will be 1/8" birch ply, because that's what
they had at the crafts store near me. :)

Funny you should mention a "port", I was thinking about that, even
though I have not seen any cajons that have one. I found a floor drain
flange at HD that mates with 4" PVC pipe. I might give it a try,
depending on how the cajon sounds once it's complete. I see that someone
actually sells an add-on for cajons, but it's only about 5" long.

I also wondered about possibly adding piece of ply inside, parallel to
the tapa, extending from the top of the cajon almost to the bottom,
giving the air a longer path to the hole in the rear.

For me, this may be one of those "getting there is half the fun"
situations. It might sound great without any tweaking, but if not (which
seems likely), I'm up for some experimentation.



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On 4/19/2017 12:29 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Wed, 19 Apr 2017 11:54:47 -0400, Greg Guarino <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> I've started building the cajon. The top and bottom are 3/4 prefinished
>> birch ply; the sides and back are 1/2". The different thicknesses were
>> mostly chosen because that's what I had available in scrap lumber, but
>> it also allowed me to feel more comfortable about rabbeting the top and
>> bottom to accept the side pieces and the back.
>>
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33947797231/in/album-72157682631167556/
>>
>> The rod, by the way, will have snare wires attached to it and the knob
>> will allow me to engage the snares or disengage them.
>>
>> The back also fits into rabbets. I decided to attach it with pocket
>> screws for now. . If it seems like there is air leakage around the
>> edges, I'll either glue it or caulk the joints.
>>
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/gdguarino/33719061480/in/album-72157682631167556/
>>
>> As predicted by some of you here, it feels more than stout enough, even
>> without the front piece.
>>
>>
>> ---
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>
>
>
> Will it have 4 feet attached ? to allow bottom
> to resonate a little ?
> Perhaps an easy experiment, when it's all done -
> to see if it makes a difference.
> John T.
>
My sense of things tells me that the materials for the five
"non-striking" sides of the cajon don't affect the sound as much. But I
have indeed put rubber feet on it; the room it will most often be used
in has porcelain tile.

Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon, which is
now temporarily finished.

Cajons come in at least two major varieties: with snare and without. The
"snare" variety has either snare-drum snares or some guitar strings
stretched across the back of the striking surface to add a
"snare-drum'-like quality to the higher-pitched sound you get by
striking near the edge.

I made my Cajon with a set of snares that you can turn on or off. They
were mounted on a rod that can be turned so as to have the snares
contact the striking surface or not.

https://flic.kr/p/SSaL2y

(photo is shown with the striking surface - a piece of 1/8" plywood -
removed)

I got the idea for the switchable snare from a Woodworking for Mere
Mortals video and used his placement of the rod. But there was a
problem. The angle of the snares to the striking surface was too great,
the snares only touched near their tips and didn't produce much sound.

I took a look at a couple of commercially-made cajons and saw that the
snares - like on a snare drum - were essentially laying lightly on the
back of the striking surface.

I didn't want to move the rod at this stage; I'd have had to fill in the
holes that hold it in place. Instead, I made a couple of "brackets" that
attach to the rod and hold a narrow piece of 1/2" ply that in turn holds
the snares.

https://flic.kr/p/TWZpCB
https://flic.kr/p/TyBArq

This now works pretty well. The snares, when "engaged" are nearly
parallel to the striking surface, and they produce the desired sound. In
addition, the sound can be adjusted a little bit my rotating the knob to
vary the "pressure" on the snares. Here's a poor photo inside the cajon:

https://flic.kr/p/U9xV56

In the "disengaged" position the snares "jingle" softly from the
vibration of the box. I intend to install a piece of foam
weatherstripping for the snares to rest against when they are not in
use. That will probably wait until I decide on another experiment or two
that I might try to alter the sound.


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On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 12:50:02 -0400
Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:

> Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon, which
> is now temporarily finished.

does that mean you reserve the right to tweak it here and there

> I got the idea for the switchable snare from a Woodworking for Mere
> Mortals video and used his placement of the rod. But there was a

like his videos
low drama and little fanfare

not saying i always agree with his methods

On 4/24/17 11:50 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
> Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon, which
> is now temporarily finished.
>
> Cajons come in at least two major varieties: with snare and without.
> The "snare" variety has either snare-drum snares or some guitar
> strings stretched across the back of the striking surface to add a
> "snare-drum'-like quality to the higher-pitched sound you get by
> striking near the edge.
>
> I made my Cajon with a set of snares that you can turn on or off.
> They were mounted on a rod that can be turned so as to have the
> snares contact the striking surface or not.
>
> https://flic.kr/p/SSaL2y
>
> (photo is shown with the striking surface - a piece of 1/8" plywood
> - removed)
>
> I got the idea for the switchable snare from a Woodworking for Mere
> Mortals video and used his placement of the rod. But there was a
> problem. The angle of the snares to the striking surface was too
> great, the snares only touched near their tips and didn't produce
> much sound.
>
> I took a look at a couple of commercially-made cajons and saw that
> the snares - like on a snare drum - were essentially laying lightly
> on the back of the striking surface.
>
> I didn't want to move the rod at this stage; I'd have had to fill in
> the holes that hold it in place. Instead, I made a couple of
> "brackets" that attach to the rod and hold a narrow piece of 1/2" ply
> that in turn holds the snares.
>
> https://flic.kr/p/TWZpCB https://flic.kr/p/TyBArq
>
> This now works pretty well. The snares, when "engaged" are nearly
> parallel to the striking surface, and they produce the desired sound.
> In addition, the sound can be adjusted a little bit my rotating the
> knob to vary the "pressure" on the snares. Here's a poor photo inside
> the cajon:
>
> https://flic.kr/p/U9xV56
>
> In the "disengaged" position the snares "jingle" softly from the
> vibration of the box. I intend to install a piece of foam
> weatherstripping for the snares to rest against when they are not in
> use. That will probably wait until I decide on another experiment or
> two that I might try to alter the sound.
>

The foam sounds like a good idea.
I was thinking you could tape the strands together down a couple-few
inches from the tips, just enough to wear the business end of the wires
would contact the batter section of the cajon. The tape would keep them
from jingling but still allow them to make a "snare" sound on the box.
I suspect the jingling is from the separate wires percussing against one
another.

BTW, if the snares don't work out, consider some sort of exterior pocket
or something that would hold an existing shaker. Based on more the past
17 years of playing acoustic shows with singer/songwriters, I find
certain shakers, rectangular, or pouch shakers filled with BB's or
seeds, etc., sound much more like a snare drum than snare wires on
anything other than the resonant head of a snare drum. :-)

Using an exterior shaker also give you the opportunity to
customize/change the sound by simply attaching a different shaker.

Back in the djembe fad of the noughties (2000s), I kept a velcro pad
glued to the head of my djembe and spots of velcro stuck on just about
every shaker device I owned. This allowed for a bunch of variation in
sounds.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 4/24/17 9:17 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
> On Monday, April 24, 2017 at 9:46:10 PM UTC-4, -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 4/24/17 11:50 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:
>>> Should anyone be interested, I did some more work on the Cajon,
>>> which is now temporarily finished.
>>>
>>> Cajons come in at least two major varieties: with snare and
>>> without. The "snare" variety has either snare-drum snares or
>>> some guitar strings stretched across the back of the striking
>>> surface to add a "snare-drum'-like quality to the higher-pitched
>>> sound you get by striking near the edge.
>>>
>>> I made my Cajon with a set of snares that you can turn on or off.
>>> They were mounted on a rod that can be turned so as to have the
>>> snares contact the striking surface or not.
>>>
>>> https://flic.kr/p/SSaL2y
>>>
>>> (photo is shown with the striking surface - a piece of 1/8"
>>> plywood - removed)
>>>
>>> I got the idea for the switchable snare from a Woodworking for
>>> Mere Mortals video and used his placement of the rod. But there
>>> was a problem. The angle of the snares to the striking surface
>>> was too great, the snares only touched near their tips and
>>> didn't produce much sound.
>>>
>>> I took a look at a couple of commercially-made cajons and saw
>>> that the snares - like on a snare drum - were essentially laying
>>> lightly on the back of the striking surface.
>>>
>>> I didn't want to move the rod at this stage; I'd have had to
>>> fill in the holes that hold it in place. Instead, I made a couple
>>> of "brackets" that attach to the rod and hold a narrow piece of
>>> 1/2" ply that in turn holds the snares.
>>>
>>> https://flic.kr/p/TWZpCB https://flic.kr/p/TyBArq
>>>
>>> This now works pretty well. The snares, when "engaged" are nearly
>>> parallel to the striking surface, and they produce the desired
>>> sound. In addition, the sound can be adjusted a little bit my
>>> rotating the knob to vary the "pressure" on the snares. Here's a
>>> poor photo inside the cajon:
>>>
>>> https://flic.kr/p/U9xV56
>>>
>>> In the "disengaged" position the snares "jingle" softly from the
>>> vibration of the box. I intend to install a piece of foam
>>> weatherstripping for the snares to rest against when they are
>>> not in use. That will probably wait until I decide on another
>>> experiment or two that I might try to alter the sound.
>>>
>>
>> The foam sounds like a good idea. I was thinking you could tape
>> the strands together down a couple-few inches from the tips, just
>> enough to wear the business end of the wires would contact the
>> batter section of the cajon. The tape would keep them from
>> jingling but still allow them to make a "snare" sound on the box.
>> I suspect the jingling is from the separate wires percussing
>> against one another.
>
> That is exactly what is happening. The foam should be an easy fix,
> attached to the underside of the cajon top.
>>
>> BTW, if the snares don't work out, consider some sort of exterior
>> pocket or something that would hold an existing shaker. Based on
>> more the past 17 years of playing acoustic shows with
>> singer/songwriters, I find certain shakers, rectangular, or pouch
>> shakers filled with BB's or seeds, etc., sound much more like a
>> snare drum than snare wires on anything other than the resonant
>> head of a snare drum. :-)
>
> Interesting. I actually have a pair of the LP "Finger Shots".
>>
>> Using an exterior shaker also give you the opportunity to
>> customize/change the sound by simply attaching a different shaker.
>>
>> Back in the djembe fad of the noughties (2000s), I kept a velcro
>> pad glued to the head of my djembe and spots of velcro stuck on
>> just about every shaker device I owned. This allowed for a bunch
>> of variation in sounds.
>
> I'm not that up on what may be popular at any given time, but I have
> always loved percussion, the more different sounds the better. And I
> have a near-compulsion to tap on things in rhythm, finding the
> "sweet spot" of every household item that has any resonance at all.
> :)
>
> Now that I finally have a home recording setup, I can preserve some
> ot that banging and tapping for posterity.
>
> Thanks for the tips.
>

The best "snare sound" shaker I ever used was a Remo Pocket Shaker--
flat plastic pouch filled with some sort of small BB's. What I loved
about it (beyond its sound) was that it would sit flat on anything and
could be struck with hands or any of the various other sticks/mallets I
used.

It was the one that gave a perfect snare sound on the djembe. I had one
sound guy looking all puzzled, walking around my kit trying to figure
out where the snare was.
When I set it on the head just right, its buzz would sustain a bit. I
dubbed that sound my "Honda Civic With a Subwoofer" because it sounded
like a license plate buzzing on one of those little rice burners the
kids put huge sound systems in. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

By the way, this is what it looks like all assembled:

https://flic.kr/p/TWZvVC
https://flic.kr/p/SXh1Jr



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On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 19:09:39 -0700 (PDT)
Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:

> Exactly.

speaking of exact

i guess the weight of the drummer does change the tension on the drum
and change the tone or is the cajon meant to be stiff enough that this
is not a factor

or maybe the weight of the drummer is considered part of the design

light player get a different tonal then heavier players

On 4/29/2017 1:06 PM, Electric Comet wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Apr 2017 19:09:39 -0700 (PDT)
> Greg Guarino <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Exactly.
>
> speaking of exact
>
> i guess the weight of the drummer does change the tension on the drum
> and change the tone or is the cajon meant to be stiff enough that this
> is not a factor

I'm no expert, but the box I built is pretty stout. I doubt there was
significant deflection.
>
> or maybe the weight of the drummer is considered part of the design
>
> light player get a different tonal then heavier players
>
>
>
>
>
>


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On 5/3/2017 12:17 PM, Casper wrote:
> Greg Guarino <[email protected]> was heard to mutter:
>> By the way, this is what it looks like all assembled:
>> https://flic.kr/p/TWZvVC
>> https://flic.kr/p/SXh1Jr
>> ---
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>
> Greg it looks great. How does it sound? Are you happy with it?
>
It sounds pretty decent, but half of the reason I built it was to
experiment with tweaking the sound. When I get around to it I have a
couple of ideas.

On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 02:23:57 +0000, Spalted Walt
<[email protected]> wrote:

>gdguarino <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> For the uninitiated, a cajon is a percussion instrument, essentially
>> a wooden box with one thin side and a hole in the opposite side. I'm
>> a keyboard player, but have recently developed a hankering to dabble
>> in percussion. Plus, I have a pile plywood scraps lying around.
>>
>> I've seen various plans online, and I'm sure that there are any
>> number of sound-related variables to consider, but I'm mostly here to
>> ask about structural strength.
>>
>> One plan I saw calls for a box 12"x12"x18" tall, made with 1/2"
>> plywood. The wrinkle is, one plays a cajon while *sitting* on it. And
>> some of us wanna-be percussionists have put on a few pounds over a
>> lifetime. I'm wondering about the strength of what is effectively a
>> five-sided 1/2" ply box (the front side is made with very thin ply,
>> maybe 1/8")for say, 250 pounds. Will it need corner braces? Or 3/4"
>> ply?
>
>Who da thunk the lid off a Brinkmann smoker and a big breasted gal
>with legs spread across a wooden box could sound this good!
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0s6sxxNG-I

Sound? Wooden box (splinters?)?