RE NYW Kitchen Project

"Leon" wrote:
> The stile dados are through, top to bottom. The floor rail dado
> T's into the stile dado. You don't see a dado unless you remove the
> counter top or put a mirror under the toe kick.
-----------------------------
Do you use pocket screw joinery for the face frames?

Lew

"Swingman" wrote:

> You bet .. meaning once the cabinet sides, and top and bottom, are
> glued into those dadoes in the back of the face frame, which further
> reinforces the face frame joinery, you have a helluva stout unit ...
> and, if the face frame is square to start with, you now have a
> strong, "square" cabinet.

Now comes the next question.

Is the face frame stock wide enough to allow for the dado cut and the
pocket screw to be side by side or are the pocket screw and the dado
on top of one another?

Seems like side by side could be a problem.

Lew

"jo4hn" wrote:

> So Cal in winter. We have about 1.5 feet of snow. The worst part
> is the 3 foot berm that the &$#)^ amateur snow plow guy left on my
> driveway. Grumble. Good exercise. (^&#%*$!

========================================

AUG 12
Moved to our new home in Pennsylvania. It so beautiful here.
The mountains are so majestic. Can hardly wait to see them
with snow covering them. I love it here.

OCT 14
Pennsylvania is the most beautiful place on Earth. The
leaves are turned all the colors and shades of red and
orange. Went for a ride through the beautiful mountains and
saw some Deer. They are so graceful, certainly they are the
most wonderful animals on Earth. This must be Paradise, I
love it here.

NOV 11
Deer season will start soon. I can't imagine anyone wanting
to kill such a gorgeous creature. Hope it will snow soon. I
love it here.

DEC 02
It snowed last night. Woke up to find everything blanketed
in white. It looks like a postcard. We went outside and
cleaned the snow off the steps and shoveled the driveway. We
had a snowball fight (I won), and when the snowplow came by,
we had to shovel the driveway again. What a beautiful place,
I love Pennsylvania!

DEC 12
More snow last night. I love it. The snowplow did his trick
again to the driveway. I love it here.

DEC 19
More snow last night. Couldn't get of the driveway to get to
work. I am exhausted from shoveling. Fucking snowplow.

DEC 25
Merry Fucking Christmas. More friggin snow. If I ever get
my hands on that son of a bitch who drives that snowplow, I
swear I'll kill the bastard. Don't know why they don't use
more salt on the road to melt the fucking ice.

DEC 27
More white shit last night. Been inside for three (3) fucking
days except for shoveling out the driveway after that
snowplow goes through everytime. Can't go anywhere, car's
stuck in a mountain of white shit. The weatherman says to
expect another 10 inches of white shit again tonight. Do you
know how many shovels full of snow 10 inches is?

DEC 28
The fucking weatherman was WRONG. We got 34 inches of that
white shit this time! At this rate, it won't melt before next summer.
The snowplow got stuck up the road and the bastard came to the
door and asked to borrow my shovel.
After I told him I had broken six (6) shovels already shoveling all
the shit he pushed into the driveway,
I broke my last one over his fucking head.

JAN 04
Finally got out of the house today. Went to the store to get food
and on the way back a damned Deer ran in front of the car and I
hit it. Did about $4,500 damage to the car. Those fucking beasts
should be shot on sight. Wished the hunters had killed them all
last November.

MAY 03
Took the car to the garage in town. Would you believe the thing
is rusting out from all that fucking salt they put all over the road.

MAY 10
Moved to California. I can't imagine why anyone in their right
mind would ever live in that god-forsaken state of Pennsylvania.

"Swingman" wrote:

> I use a different method that uses a dado in the back of the face
> frame to accept the cabinet sides, floor and/ or top

Assume these are stopped dados.


> http://www.e-woodshop.net/Projects7.htm
>
> Scroll down to the two paragraphs just above "Day 2 ... "

SFWIW, a water level gets the job done with a lot less hassle.

A little water and some food coloring and you are in business.

Lew

"Larry Jaques" reveals his true culinary tastes by admitting...

> ..., so I bought a hot dog at Costco to splurge some of the savings.
>
>
I read an article recently about the CEO of Costco. It turns out those hot
dogs are world famous. The do an incredible volume of those hot dogs and
pledge to always make them available for a reasonable price. And they are
extra big sellers overseas.

You are not alone in "splurging" on Costco hot dogs. ;)

Dave Balderstone <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote in
news:071220091206083749%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca:

>>
>
> -31C (-24F) at 9 am here... Currently up to -27C (-16F).

What do you do to enjoy such cold weather? Build an ice rink or go out
skidding (slipping, sliding etc on skis or motor vehicle or sleds)? (Hm...
at such temperatures ice rinks might have to have their heaters on to get
ice rinks warm enough to skate on!)

Puckdropper

RE: Subject

Cold enough that coupled with a wet storm coming in from the Pacific
have closed I-5 from Los Angeles across the mountain to Bakersfield in
the central valley.

This section of I-5 across the mountains with a max elevation of about
4,000 ft is known as the "Grapevine" and will probably reopen with
highway patrol escort in the morning.

Welcome to California in the wintertime.

Lew

Larry Blanchard wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 10:14:48 -0800, Robatoy wrote:
>
>
>>I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have a
>>little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our Southern
>>friends some of our finest coolness.
>>
>>Enjoy!
>
>
> We received it here in Spokane - supposed to get down to -3F tonight with
> a wind chill of -20-30F.
>
> You can have it back anytime you want it :-).
>

The forecast for the Buffalo area for tomorrow, depending on what
forecaster one believes, is calling for winds up to 70 MPH, heavy lake
effect snow causing near blizzard conditions and temperatures dropping
into the lower teens. That should make the wind chill somewhere around
-55 F.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]

"Leon" wrote:

> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(


Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
nippy" category.

Lew

"Swingman" wrote:

> In short, not a problem ...

Ah So, understand.

This NYW project wsas designed to have painted Poplar cabinets.

The paint schedule was interesting.

Two (2) primer coats followed by a satin oil base finish coat.

The primer coats were sanded with 320 between coats.

No mention was made of the time schedule, but allowing the primer
enough time to cure enough for sanding didn't just happen.

Anybody want to hazard a guess?

Lew

"Swingman" wrote:

> You would notice, if you read it of course, that I do indeed mention
> the use of water levels?? <g>

Haven't checked lately, but these days my guess is that laser levels
are getting very competitively priced.

After all, they have been using them to shoot T-Bar ceilings in
commercial buildings since the early 70's.

Lew

"Leon" wrote:

> Swingman and I used a laser level on the last kitchen install that
> we did together. That worked out pretty nicely.


Did you/buy?

Would you do it on the next job?



Lew

"Swingman" wrote:

> Actually I have three laser levels.
>
> The one Leon is talking about is not a high dollar unit, runs in
> $50 - 70 range, IIRC from Lowe's or Home Depot. It does what I need
> it to do. Has both horizontal and vertical beams, is self leveling
> and fits on an old camera tripod. I always take it with me to a job
> site, so yes, it will be used on the next job. There are many, much
> more expensive, units available.
>
> If you want, I'll get the particulars when I get to the shop.

At $50, it's almost a throw away.

Sounds like it's limited to indoor work which isn't a problem.

What about outdoor work?

Significant price increase?

My interest was what was available today.

Lew

In article <[email protected]>, Rudy
<[email protected]> wrote:

> >> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
> >>
> >>
> >>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
> >>nippy" category.
> >
> > It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
> > when I go off workin' again. Brrrrr! My Columbia long johns are all
> > ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.
>
> I had to get the long legged sweats out today and put the shorts away..its
> 55 oF here in Tucson
>
>

-31C (-24F) at 9 am here... Currently up to -27C (-16F).

In article <[email protected]>, Puckdropper
wrote:

> Dave Balderstone <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote in
> news:071220091206083749%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca:
>
> >>
> >
> > -31C (-24F) at 9 am here... Currently up to -27C (-16F).
>
> What do you do to enjoy such cold weather? Build an ice rink or go out
> skidding (slipping, sliding etc on skis or motor vehicle or sleds)? (Hm...
> at such temperatures ice rinks might have to have their heaters on to get
> ice rinks warm enough to skate on!)

Take the dog for a walk, maybe down by the river. It'll be another few
days before we can go ice fishing, we need 4" to 6" ice. I don't like
driving on anything under 6" thick. And even then, you have to go slow
and think about the bow wave...

Unfortunately, up till a few days ago, it was too warm to flood a good
outdoor rink, so I imagine it will be another week or so before we can
strap on the skates and enjoy skating under the lights in the river
valley.

This is unseasonably cold, but to put it in perspective, my 14 year old
son did his paper route this morning (6 am) without checking the temp
and was surprised that the thermometer read what it did, as he didn't
feel the cold on his half-hour walk.

He walks about a mile to and from high school, and when he got home
from school this afternoon complained that he was was "too sweaty" with
the clothes he was wearing.

It's cold. That's all. So what?

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 12:36:18 -0500, the infamous Tom Watson
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Leon wrote:
>>
>>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
>>> red laser line over
>>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>>
>>Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>>
>>Thankee ... :)
>
>
>Hey Karl, I've got a kitchen ceiling to begin on Monday that is pretty
>much a potato chip, being 4" out in 12' and with an inconsistent
>variation to boot. I got my water level out and the tube is all green
>from bioshit. Sounds like one of these gizmos might be the ticket and
>cheap enough to absorb into a single project, if need be.

Probably. OTOH, filling the green tube with bleach water will clean
it out in half an hour, should you choose to accept that mission.
A new tool sounds like a much better idea. I picked up a HF
Multifunction tool yesterday for $35. That's a $365 savings over the
Fein, so I bought a hot dog at Costco to splurge some of the savings.


>If you have a good cheap one to vouch for, I'd be glad to hear about
>it. I've stayed away from them because anything better than a toy was
>too spendy.

I bought a StraitLine Intersect laser and haven't used it yet (no tile
or cabinet hangin' jobs in the 2 years since.) $8 + $7 priority
shipping from an eBay vendor. BTW, always doublecheck any laser line
which doesn't come from a unit costing $1,377 from Berger. ;)

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> You bet .. meaning once the cabinet sides, and top and bottom, are
>> glued into those dadoes in the back of the face frame, which further
>> reinforces the face frame joinery, you have a helluva stout unit ...
>> and, if the face frame is square to start with, you now have a
>> strong, "square" cabinet.
>
> Now comes the next question.
>
> Is the face frame stock wide enough to allow for the dado cut and the
> pocket screw to be side by side or are the pocket screw and the dado
> on top of one another?
>
> Seems like side by side could be a problem.

Pocket holes are usually on the rail, a bottom rail on a base cabinet,
and both top and bottom rails on a wall cabinet.

The only time it may remotely be an issue, then not much of one, is on
the bottom rail of the typical base cabinet.

A FF rail for a base cabinet that is 1 1 /2" wide has plenty of room for
a 3/4" dado AND one pocket hole screw on each side.

(most wall cabinets will have wider rails, both top and bottom, to make
room for trim on top, and recessed lighting on bottom, usually 2 to 2
1/2", or more).

This single pocket hole screw on the bottom rail is quite sufficient for
the purpose, particularly if you use glue on the joint (even though it
is end grain on on side) AND, most importantly, the cabinet sides and
bottom, when applied and glued into the dadoes, amply reinforce this
"single pocket hole screw" joint between the rail and stile.

In short, not a problem ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 12:40:55 -0600, the infamous Morris Dovey
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Robatoy wrote:
>
>> I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have
>> a little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our
>> Southern friends some of our finest coolness.
>>
>> Enjoy!
>
>Thank you too much! I'll remember you when tornado season comes around... :)

And we'll send SODS and pine bark beetles. I have frozen pipes this
morning and no water. I'm hoping they didn't burst first. It's up to
26F now, so I'm praying for a thaw.

--
To know what you prefer instead of humbly saying Amen
to what the world tells you you ought to prefer,
is to have kept your soul alive.
-- Robert Louis Stevenson

On Fri, 4 Dec 2009 07:57:40 -0800, the infamous "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>
>"Leon" wrote:
>
>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>
>
>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
>nippy" category.

It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
when I go off workin' again. Brrrrr! My Columbia long johns are all
ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.

But at least I have more work coming in at this time of year. I think
I'm going to regret one client's yard maintenance (I usually don't do
that but this lady is paying me $30/hr to rake leaves, so she's a
keeper.) from December to February or March. That account pays all my
monthly bills except the truck payment.

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

On Wed, 02 Dec 2009 10:58:52 -0600, the infamous Swingman
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Lew Hodgett wrote:
>> Been watching this mini series the last few weeks.
>>
>> Couple of interesting tricks.
>>
>> The use of a continuous groove in the cabinet wall for the biscuits
>> used to locate face frames thus eliminating nails, etc.
>>
>> Looks like a good approach.
>>
>> Anybody using this technique on a regular basis?
>
>I use a different method that uses a dado in the back of the face frame
>to accept the cabinet sides, floor and/ or top
>
>
>> An old boat builder's trick.
>>
>> Using a surveyor's transit or level to shoot a level reference line on
>> the walls to eliminate floor variations in an older building.
>>
>> Makes a lot of sense to me.
>>
>> Anybody else use this technique?
>
>http://www.e-woodshop.net/Projects7.htm
>
>Scroll down to the two paragraphs just above "Day 2 ... "

I love your Day 2 toe-kick drawers and their enlightened description
of use. ;)

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Leon" wrote:
>
>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>
>
> Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad nippy"
> category.


And it is not even Christmas yet. LOL.

On Dec 7, 1:03=A0pm, "Rudy" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Snowing at your house yet? =A0Too cold to work outside. =A0;~(
>
> >>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
> >>nippy" category.
>
> > It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
> > when I go off workin' again. =A0Brrrrr! =A0My Columbia long johns are a=
ll
> > ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.
>
> I had to get the long legged sweats out today and put the shorts away..it=
s
> 55 oF here in Tucson

I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have
a little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our
Southern friends some of our finest coolness.

Enjoy!


r

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:

>Leon wrote:
>
>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
>> red laser line over
>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>
>Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>
>Thankee ... :)


Hey Karl, I've got a kitchen ceiling to begin on Monday that is pretty
much a potato chip, being 4" out in 12' and with an inconsistent
variation to boot. I got my water level out and the tube is all green
from bioshit. Sounds like one of these gizmos might be the ticket and
cheap enough to absorb into a single project, if need be.

If you have a good cheap one to vouch for, I'd be glad to hear about
it. I've stayed away from them because anything better than a toy was
too spendy.

Thanks.

tom



Regards,

Tom Watson
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/

Larry Jaques wrote:

>
> Do both sides of the door in one hanging with these, Jeffo:
> (shit, I can't find them anywhere) Well, they're rotatable hooks with
> an expandable 30mm disc which fit into the euro hole in the cabinet
> doors so you can hang 'em for spraying. I could have sworn LVT had
> them, and I can't find them on WWHardware, either. Go figure.
>

You mean these:
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=11113&filter=cabinet%20door%20finishing

or these:

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=18907&filter=finishing%20hook

or these:

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=21448&filter=finishing%20hook

~Mark.

On Dec 2, 12:22=A0pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:

and some food coloring

Ah, that's the ticket. Thanks for that one. Only wish you had told me
twenty years ago!

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> I use a different method that uses a dado in the back of the face frame
>> to accept the cabinet sides, floor and/ or top
>
> Assume these are stopped dados.
>


The stile dados are through, top to bottom. The floor rail dado T's into
the stile dado. You don't see a dado unless you remove the counter top or
put a mirror under the toe kick.

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Larry Jaques wrote:
>
>> I love your Day 2 toe-kick drawers and their enlightened description
>> of use. ;)
>
> :)
>
> Before they became common, had one client that kept things she didn't want
> the maid to find in the kitchen toe-kick drawers.
>
> Impossible to see, I learned early that if you use them you'd better let
> the floor guys know not to nail them shut when applying shoe molding.


LOL. And remember to open the door before nailing the trim around a new
door jam.

Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(

Leon wrote:

> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
> red laser line over
> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.

Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>

Thankee ... :)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Tom Watson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Leon wrote:
>>
>>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the
>>> continous
>>> red laser line over
>>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>>
>>Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>>
>>Thankee ... :)
>
>
> I thought you were color blind?
>
> Now Leon has two different Ryobi levels posted. Which one is the
> right one?


Swingman has the Blue $50 version, the one I posted a link to first.
Not the Tek4 green version posted second.

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Leon" wrote:
>
>> Swingman and I used a laser level on the last kitchen install that
>> we did together. That worked out pretty nicely.
>
>
> Did you/buy?
>
> Would you do it on the next job?

Actually I have three laser levels.

The one Leon is talking about is not a high dollar unit, runs in $50 -
70 range, IIRC from Lowe's or Home Depot. It does what I need it to do.
Has both horizontal and vertical beams, is self leveling and fits on an
old camera tripod. I always take it with me to a job site, so yes, it
will be used on the next job. There are many, much more expensive, units
available.

If you want, I'll get the particulars when I get to the shop.

Let me know.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 10:14:48 -0800, Robatoy wrote:

> I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have a
> little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our Southern
> friends some of our finest coolness.
>
> Enjoy!

We received it here in Spokane - supposed to get down to -3F tonight with
a wind chill of -20-30F.

You can have it back anytime you want it :-).

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

Rudy wrote:

>
>>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>>>
>>>
>>>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
>>>nippy" category.
>>
>> It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
>> when I go off workin' again. Brrrrr! My Columbia long johns are all
>> ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.
>
> I had to get the long legged sweats out today and put the shorts away..its
> 55 oF here in Tucson

Yep, seems winter is coming a little early here.

Wind is the worst of it though. Hopefully it doesn't blow any oranges off
the trees, they aren't quite ripe yet.
--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "jo4hn" wrote:
>
>> So Cal in winter. We have about 1.5 feet of snow. The worst part is the
>> 3 foot berm that the &$#)^ amateur snow plow guy left on my driveway.
>> Grumble. Good exercise. (^&#%*$!
>
> ========================================
>
> AUG 12
> Moved to our new home in Pennsylvania. It so beautiful here.
> The mountains are so majestic. Can hardly wait to see them
> with snow covering them. I love it here.
>
> OCT 14
> Pennsylvania is the most beautiful place on Earth. The
> leaves are turned all the colors and shades of red and
> orange. Went for a ride through the beautiful mountains and
> saw some Deer. They are so graceful, certainly they are the
> most wonderful animals on Earth. This must be Paradise, I
> love it here.
>
> NOV 11
> Deer season will start soon. I can't imagine anyone wanting
> to kill such a gorgeous creature. Hope it will snow soon. I
> love it here.
>
> DEC 02
> It snowed last night. Woke up to find everything blanketed
> in white. It looks like a postcard. We went outside and
> cleaned the snow off the steps and shoveled the driveway. We
> had a snowball fight (I won), and when the snowplow came by,
> we had to shovel the driveway again. What a beautiful place,
> I love Pennsylvania!
>
> DEC 12
> More snow last night. I love it. The snowplow did his trick
> again to the driveway. I love it here.
>
> DEC 19
> More snow last night. Couldn't get of the driveway to get to
> work. I am exhausted from shoveling. Fucking snowplow.
>
> DEC 25
> Merry Fucking Christmas. More friggin snow. If I ever get
> my hands on that son of a bitch who drives that snowplow, I
> swear I'll kill the bastard. Don't know why they don't use
> more salt on the road to melt the fucking ice.
>
> DEC 27
> More white shit last night. Been inside for three (3) fucking
> days except for shoveling out the driveway after that
> snowplow goes through everytime. Can't go anywhere, car's
> stuck in a mountain of white shit. The weatherman says to
> expect another 10 inches of white shit again tonight. Do you
> know how many shovels full of snow 10 inches is?
>
> DEC 28
> The fucking weatherman was WRONG. We got 34 inches of that
> white shit this time! At this rate, it won't melt before next summer.
> The snowplow got stuck up the road and the bastard came to the
> door and asked to borrow my shovel.
> After I told him I had broken six (6) shovels already shoveling all
> the shit he pushed into the driveway,
> I broke my last one over his fucking head.
>
> JAN 04
> Finally got out of the house today. Went to the store to get food
> and on the way back a damned Deer ran in front of the car and I
> hit it. Did about $4,500 damage to the car. Those fucking beasts
> should be shot on sight. Wished the hunters had killed them all
> last November.
>
> MAY 03
> Took the car to the garage in town. Would you believe the thing
> is rusting out from all that fucking salt they put all over the road.
>
> MAY 10
> Moved to California. I can't imagine why anyone in their right
> mind would ever live in that god-forsaken state of Pennsylvania.
>
>
>


I'm now living in Washington (west side). Originally from Maine. People ask
me why I don't move back there...

Tom Watson wrote:
> On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Leon wrote:
>>
>>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
>>> red laser line over
>>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>> Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>>
>> Thankee ... :)
>
>
> Hey Karl, I've got a kitchen ceiling to begin on Monday that is pretty
> much a potato chip, being 4" out in 12' and with an inconsistent
> variation to boot. I got my water level out and the tube is all green
> from bioshit. Sounds like one of these gizmos might be the ticket and
> cheap enough to absorb into a single project, if need be.
>
> If you have a good cheap one to vouch for, I'd be glad to hear about
> it. I've stayed away from them because anything better than a toy was
> too spendy.

Tom,

As you well know, you get what you pay for, but this Ryobi unit that
Leon provided the links for works just fine for the price.

Obviously wouldn't recommend it for laying out a foundation, but it does
the job inside just fine. I would try to use it on a tripod if you have
one ... took a standard camera body thread, may have even had a adapter
for same.

I liked the fact that it self leveled very quickly, and had both
vertical and horizontal beams ... but it is plastic for the most part.

Basically paid for itself on the first kitchen, as far as I'm concerned.

IOW, I wouldn't hesitate to buy it again, if necessary, just to do one
kitchen installation with more than one wall.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 12/09/09 2:02 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 12:40:55 -0600, the infamous Morris Dovey
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have
>>> a little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our
>>> Southern friends some of our finest coolness.
>>>
>>> Enjoy!
>>
>> Thank you too much! I'll remember you when tornado season comes around... :)
>
> And we'll send SODS and pine bark beetles. I have frozen pipes this
> morning and no water. I'm hoping they didn't burst first. It's up to
> 26F now, so I'm praying for a thaw.
>
2 inches of very wet snow last night, raining and 39F right now, slush as
far as I can see. This was also the first of the season, here in
Toronto, Ontario, Canada

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> I use a different method that uses a dado in the back of the face
>> frame to accept the cabinet sides, floor and/ or top
>
> Assume these are stopped dados.
>
>
>> http://www.e-woodshop.net/Projects7.htm
>>
>> Scroll down to the two paragraphs just above "Day 2 ... "
>
> SFWIW, a water level gets the job done with a lot less hassle.
>
> A little water and some food coloring and you are in business.

You would notice, if you read it of course, that I do indeed mention the
use of water levels?? <g>


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

In news:[email protected],
Lew Hodgett <[email protected]> dropped this bit of wisdom:
> "Swingman" wrote:
>=20
>> Actually I have three laser levels.
>>=20
>> The one Leon is talking about is not a high dollar unit, runs in
>> $50 - 70 range, IIRC from Lowe's or Home Depot. It does what I need
>> it to do. Has both horizontal and vertical beams, is self leveling
>> and fits on an old camera tripod. I always take it with me to a job
>> site, so yes, it will be used on the next job. There are many, much
>> more expensive, units available.
>>=20
>> If you want, I'll get the particulars when I get to the shop.
>=20
> At $50, it's almost a throw away.
>=20
> Sounds like it's limited to indoor work which isn't a problem.
>=20
> What about outdoor work?
>=20
> Significant price increase?
>=20
> My interest was what was available today.
>=20
> Lew

I got one of those $50 levels which are really good indoors and also got =
to set the top rail on my fence. At 50 feet the dot got a little big =
but it was still useable. Wouldn't be without it. Only 1 caveat -- =
works better outdoors at night. ;-)
P D Q

Swingman wrote:
> Leon wrote:
...

>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>
> Flurries ... Michelle spent the night last night and it was like when
> she was a little girl again when I woke her and her Mom hollering
> upstairs: "It's snowing ... in Texas! Look out the window, quick, or
> you'll miss it!"
>
...

:) Often that way in TN, too, altho once't in a while even in the
valley it would really dump on us...

Definitely too cold here -- 'twas 7F when first looked out and since
we'd been near 70F and barely frozen before that was feelin' "right
nippy" this am doin' chores... :(

What's it doin' in the Valley--the cold gettin' that far down? Not
heard from mom's side of family re: citrus, etc., ...

--

Larry Jaques wrote:
> Note to WeeGee: The Master Rockhard Table Top Varnish I used on the
> freebie dining table was as follows:
>
> "Put a beautiful, hard amber finish on your fine furniture projects!
> This top-of-the-line phenolic resin “short oil” varnish has a low
> percentage of oil for a super durable finish. Perfect for tabletops
> where a harder finish is required. "

I love Behlen's Rockhard Table Top Varnish, but if you're sanding for a repair
or a re-coat and you happen to break through from one coat into the next, it
*will* give you "witness lines". DAMHIKT. This is why I tend to prefer
lacquer type finishes where later coats always "melt" into prior coats.

> http://www.waterlox.com/site/431/default.aspx
> Waterlox is tung oil and phenolic resin.
>
> "Waterlox vs. Urethane - Waterlox forms a protective finish that won’t
> chip, peel, crack, or wrinkle. Waterlox never requires sanding for
> adhesion purposes. So touch-ups can be done at any time without
> sanding down to the bare wood. Waterlox gives you a naturally
> beautiful, protective finish that never looks like a sheet of plastic"

Based on that description, it sounds like Waterlox isn't that much different
than Behlen's Rockhard... What do you perceive the differences to be Larry?

--
Free bad advice available here.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Robatoy wrote:

> I called Environment Canada's weather service today. Turns out we have
> a little extra cool weather we can spare. So, we are sending our
> Southern friends some of our finest coolness.
>
> Enjoy!

Thank you too much! I'll remember you when tornado season comes around... :)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Rudy wrote:

>
>>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>>>
>>>
>>>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
>>>nippy" category.
>>
>> It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
>> when I go off workin' again. Brrrrr! My Columbia long johns are all
>> ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.
>
> I had to get the long legged sweats out today and put the shorts away..its
> 55 oF here in Tucson

Suppose to get down to 36 tonight in Southern California brrrrrrr it rarely
gets down to 50. Think I will have to turn the heater on for the first time
this year.

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.biz/

Larry Jaques wrote:
...
> And we'll send SODS and pine bark beetles. I have frozen pipes this
> morning and no water. I'm hoping they didn't burst first. It's up to
> 26F now, so I'm praying for a thaw.
...

Wishin' for ya'...but you're in heat wave it seems; we just managed to
get above 10F at 1PM (but at least bright sun and the wind went down so
windchill is now >0F).

--

On Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:40:01 -0800, the infamous "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> In short, not a problem ...
>
>Ah So, understand.
>
>This NYW project wsas designed to have painted Poplar cabinets.
>
>The paint schedule was interesting.
>
>Two (2) primer coats followed by a satin oil base finish coat.
>
>The primer coats were sanded with 320 between coats.
>
>No mention was made of the time schedule, but allowing the primer
>enough time to cure enough for sanding didn't just happen.
>
>Anybody want to hazard a guess?

Primer dries in a heartbeat, Lew. What's to "cure"?

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

Larry Jaques wrote:

> I love your Day 2 toe-kick drawers and their enlightened description
> of use. ;)

:)

Before they became common, had one client that kept things she didn't
want the maid to find in the kitchen toe-kick drawers.

Impossible to see, I learned early that if you use them you'd better let
the floor guys know not to nail them shut when applying shoe molding.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> RE: Subject
>
> Cold enough that coupled with a wet storm coming in from the Pacific
> have closed I-5 from Los Angeles across the mountain to Bakersfield in
> the central valley.
>
> This section of I-5 across the mountains with a max elevation of about
> 4,000 ft is known as the "Grapevine" and will probably reopen with
> highway patrol escort in the morning.
>
> Welcome to California in the wintertime.
>
> Lew
>
>
>
So Cal in winter. We have about 1.5 feet of snow. The worst part is
the 3 foot berm that the &$#)^ amateur snow plow guy left on my
driveway. Grumble. Good exercise. (^&#%*$!

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Leon wrote:
>
>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the
>> continous red laser line over
>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>
> Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>


If you want it in green

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xr5/R-100671273/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

On Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:40:01 -0800, "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> In short, not a problem ...
>
>Ah So, understand.
>
>This NYW project wsas designed to have painted Poplar cabinets.
>
>The paint schedule was interesting.
>
>Two (2) primer coats followed by a satin oil base finish coat.
>
>The primer coats were sanded with 320 between coats.
>
>No mention was made of the time schedule, but allowing the primer
>enough time to cure enough for sanding didn't just happen.
>
>Anybody want to hazard a guess?
>
>Lew
>
>


Haven't seen the show, but it could be done in a day or two. It all
depends on the product they spray, size of the job, size of the crew
and spray booth/drying are size. Lacquers, surfacers and many water
based lacquers (modified acylics) dry quickly - easily in half an
hour, quicker if heat is used to help the process. Three coats in a
day possible with some jobs, doors can take a little longer having to
do both sides.

Jeffo

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 13:26:16 -0500, the infamous Tom Watson
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Leon wrote:
>>
>>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
>>> red laser line over
>>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>>
>>Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>>
>>Thankee ... :)
>
>
>I thought you were color blind?
>
>Now Leon has two different Ryobi levels posted. Which one is the
>right one?

Same unit, same price, but the one from CPO is a refurb. :\

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> You would notice, if you read it of course, that I do indeed mention the
>> use of water levels?? <g>
>
> Haven't checked lately, but these days my guess is that laser levels are
> getting very competitively priced.
>
> After all, they have been using them to shoot T-Bar ceilings in commercial
> buildings since the early 70's.
>
> Lew
>
>

Swingman and I used a laser level on the last kitchen install that we did
together. That worked out pretty nicely.

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Leon" wrote:
>> The stile dados are through, top to bottom. The floor rail dado
>> T's into the stile dado. You don't see a dado unless you remove the
>> counter top or put a mirror under the toe kick.
> -----------------------------
> Do you use pocket screw joinery for the face frames?

You bet .. meaning once the cabinet sides, and top and bottom, are glued
into those dadoes in the back of the face frame, which further
reinforces the face frame joinery, you have a helluva stout unit ...
and, if the face frame is square to start with, you now have a strong,
"square" cabinet.

Except for choice of materials, this is actually the way most high end
factory made kitchen cabinets are made because the method lends itself
well to batch cutting and doing production runs, ending up in components
that fit together well without having to hassle with fitting during
installation.

Strangely enough it is a method that is substantially like the one used
by an old cabinet maker I worked for in England many years ago ... which
I thought was kinda neat, but proving there are methods that are hard to
improve on and that have stood the test of time.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Fri, 04 Dec 2009 07:24:13 -0600, the infamous Swingman
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Larry Jaques wrote:
>
>> I love your Day 2 toe-kick drawers and their enlightened description
>> of use. ;)
>
>:)
>
>Before they became common, had one client that kept things she didn't
>want the maid to find in the kitchen toe-kick drawers.

Hah! She didn't want the maid using them, or what? <wink>


>Impossible to see, I learned early that if you use them you'd better let
>the floor guys know not to nail them shut when applying shoe molding.

That would tend to lower the usability factor a tad. but an Azebiki
would get in there and fix things in a hurry, huh?

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

Lew Hodgett wrote:
> Been watching this mini series the last few weeks.
>
> Couple of interesting tricks.
>
> The use of a continuous groove in the cabinet wall for the biscuits
> used to locate face frames thus eliminating nails, etc.
>
> Looks like a good approach.
>
> Anybody using this technique on a regular basis?

I use a different method that uses a dado in the back of the face frame
to accept the cabinet sides, floor and/ or top


> An old boat builder's trick.
>
> Using a surveyor's transit or level to shoot a level reference line on
> the walls to eliminate floor variations in an older building.
>
> Makes a lot of sense to me.
>
> Anybody else use this technique?

http://www.e-woodshop.net/Projects7.htm

Scroll down to the two paragraphs just above "Day 2 ... "

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

>> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(
>>
>>
>>Per Google, it's 36F in Houston real time which puts it in the "tad
>>nippy" category.
>
> It's 28F here right now, due for 18F tomorrow morning. Ditto Monday,
> when I go off workin' again. Brrrrr! My Columbia long johns are all
> ready for me to don when I go back out in those temps.

I had to get the long legged sweats out today and put the shorts away..its
55 oF here in Tucson

Leon wrote:
> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Larry Jaques wrote:
>>
>>> I love your Day 2 toe-kick drawers and their enlightened description
>>> of use. ;)
>> :)
>>
>> Before they became common, had one client that kept things she didn't want
>> the maid to find in the kitchen toe-kick drawers.
>>
>> Impossible to see, I learned early that if you use them you'd better let
>> the floor guys know not to nail them shut when applying shoe molding.
>
>
> LOL. And remember to open the door before nailing the trim around a new
> door jam.
>
> Snowing at your house yet? Too cold to work outside. ;~(

Flurries ... Michelle spent the night last night and it was like when
she was a little girl again when I woke her and her Mom hollering
upstairs: "It's snowing ... in Texas! Look out the window, quick, or
you'll miss it!"

They can move fast when they want to ... :)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Wed, 02 Dec 2009 19:04:02 -0500, the infamous Jeffo <[email protected]>
scrawled the following:

>On Wed, 2 Dec 2009 14:40:01 -0800, "Lew Hodgett"
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> "Swingman" wrote:
>>
>>> In short, not a problem ...
>>
>>Ah So, understand.
>>
>>This NYW project wsas designed to have painted Poplar cabinets.
>>
>>The paint schedule was interesting.
>>
>>Two (2) primer coats followed by a satin oil base finish coat.
>>
>>The primer coats were sanded with 320 between coats.
>>
>>No mention was made of the time schedule, but allowing the primer
>>enough time to cure enough for sanding didn't just happen.
>>
>>Anybody want to hazard a guess?
>>
>>Lew
>>
>>
>
>
>Haven't seen the show, but it could be done in a day or two. It all
>depends on the product they spray, size of the job, size of the crew
>and spray booth/drying are size. Lacquers, surfacers and many water
>based lacquers (modified acylics) dry quickly - easily in half an
>hour, quicker if heat is used to help the process. Three coats in a
>day possible with some jobs, doors can take a little longer having to
>do both sides.

Do both sides of the door in one hanging with these, Jeffo:
(shit, I can't find them anywhere) Well, they're rotatable hooks with
an expandable 30mm disc which fit into the euro hole in the cabinet
doors so you can hang 'em for spraying. I could have sworn LVT had
them, and I can't find them on WWHardware, either. Go figure.

Note to WeeGee: The Master Rockhard Table Top Varnish I used on the
freebie dining table was as follows:

"Put a beautiful, hard amber finish on your fine furniture projects!
This top-of-the-line phenolic resin “short oil” varnish has a low
percentage of oil for a super durable finish. Perfect for tabletops
where a harder finish is required. "


http://www.waterlox.com/site/431/default.aspx
Waterlox is tung oil and phenolic resin.

"Waterlox vs. Urethane - Waterlox forms a protective finish that won’t
chip, peel, crack, or wrinkle. Waterlox never requires sanding for
adhesion purposes. So touch-ups can be done at any time without
sanding down to the bare wood. Waterlox gives you a naturally
beautiful, protective finish that never looks like a sheet of plastic"

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

On Thu, 3 Dec 2009 10:24:27 -0800, the infamous "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>
>"Swingman" wrote:
>
>> Actually I have three laser levels.
>>
>> The one Leon is talking about is not a high dollar unit, runs in
>> $50 - 70 range, IIRC from Lowe's or Home Depot. It does what I need
>> it to do. Has both horizontal and vertical beams, is self leveling
>> and fits on an old camera tripod. I always take it with me to a job
>> site, so yes, it will be used on the next job. There are many, much
>> more expensive, units available.
>>
>> If you want, I'll get the particulars when I get to the shop.
>
>At $50, it's almost a throw away.
>
>Sounds like it's limited to indoor work which isn't a problem.
>
>What about outdoor work?

Iffy. Just work at night. <bseg>


>Significant price increase?

Indeed.


>My interest was what was available today.

The high-dollar units are usable outside because their lasers are much
brighter and the lines cleaner. That's just one of the major drawbacks
of the cheap units. Surveyors use laser detectors for longer distances
outdoors.

--
Follow the path of the unsafe, independent thinker. Expose your ideas
to the dangers of controversy. Speak your mind and fear less the label
of 'crackpot' than the stigma of conformity. And on issues that seem
important to you, stand up and be counted at any cost.
-- Thomas J. Watson

On Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:18:50 -0600, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:

>Leon wrote:
>
>> Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
>> red laser line over
>> a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.
>
>Damn ... didn't remember the name, and thought the line was green!! <g>
>
>Thankee ... :)


I thought you were color blind?

Now Leon has two different Ryobi levels posted. Which one is the
right one?



Regards,

Tom Watson
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Leon" wrote:
>
>> Swingman and I used a laser level on the last kitchen install that we did
>> together. That worked out pretty nicely.
>
>
> Did you/buy?
>
> Would you do it on the next job?
>
>
>
> Lew


Swingman bought it, Ryobi. I would certainly use it again, the continous
red laser line over
a level gives you a long level line around the room vs. chasing a level.

http://www.cporyobi.com/products/zrell0006.html

or HD

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xr5/R-100596757/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053