Making a 70.6 cut on miter saw

"Morris Dovey" wrote:

> Are you sure we wouldn't be better off using SketchUp?
-------------------------------------

I specialize in SketchDown.

Lew

On Feb 19, 8:09=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
>
> >> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>news:[email protected]...
>
> >> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
> >> degrees?
>
> > Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
> > degrees. Jeez.
>
> > Tom
>
> And he ends up with a miter at 19.4 degrees. =A0He needs 70.6 degrees. =
=A0The
> cut needs to be more towards a rip rather than closer to a cross cut. =A0=
DOH!

Another way to explain is this:
Your blade is 90 degrees relative to your fence, right?
Now subtract 19.4 degrees. Whatcha got now?

i know, I know, LOL

On Feb 18, 2:17=A0pm, "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:2dcf2459-fa12-4508-ade9-12d0acf5e9dc@x22g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 17, 7:34 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
> available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). =A0What the
> accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
> matter.
>
> Come on, people - have you forgotten how to work without using miter gaug=
es
> that have built-in stops???

Who said anything about stops?

"Larry Jaques" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 00:16:59 -0500, the infamous "J. Clarke"
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
> Aww, who cares, when caulk and putty will fill gaps up to 1/4-inch.
> <silly grin>

"Master Carpenter In A Can", eh?

Tom

"Steve Turner" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0
>>> degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY
>>> table saw.
>>
>>
>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>
> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>
> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>
> :-)


or,, :~)

http://www.incra.com/images/miter_5000_zoom.jpg

On Feb 20, 8:22=A0pm, Steve Turner <[email protected]>
wrote:
> On 2/20/2010 3:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>
> > Morris Dovey wrote:
> >> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
> >>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
> >>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking
> >>> came with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
> >>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
> >>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>
> >> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
> >> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
> >> legend according to the language...
>
> > <http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/keyboards-mice/9836/?cpg=3Dfroogle>
>
> Ah yes, the Optimus Maximus. =A0You'd have to be one HELL of a geek to sh=
ell out
> $1600 for a keyboard.
>
> --
> "Even if your wife is happy but you're unhappy, you're still happier
> than you'd be if you were happy and your wife was unhappy." - Red Green
> To reply, eat the taco.http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Tempting....

On Feb 18, 9:04=A0am, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/17/2010 11:17 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
>
>
>
> > Are you sure we wouldn't be better off using SketchUp?
>
> Or CNC. What would either do without keyboards ...
>
> --www.e-woodshop.net
> Last update: 10/22/08
> KarlC@ (the obvious)

My Ouija Board has a USB2 port.

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:9023f1ab-bc6e-40bb-9d2b-fd5183e8c36f@v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
>> Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.
>>
>> It's interesting that a set of plans would have such an odd angle
>> to cut, when no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a
>> precision cut like 70.6 degrees.
>>
>> Hmm,
>>
>> MJ
>
> You don't consider an accurate protracter a tool?


Does your accurat protractor have teeth to cut the wood??? He is looking
for a tool to "make" the cut not measure the cut.

[email protected] wrote:
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>

When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
problem to a problem that has already been solved.

Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3° cut with a miter saw?

>
> Does your accurat protractor have teeth to cut the wood??? He is looking
> for a tool to "make" the cut not measure the cut.

You use the protractor to set the miter gauge, then you use the table saw to
make the cut. How complicated is that?

Tom

On Feb 20, 2:30=A0pm, FrozenNorth <[email protected]>
wrote:
> On 2/20/10 2:09 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:> On 2/20/2010 12:26 PM, Leon wrot=
e:
> >> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com.=
..
>
> >>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
> >>> thingy
> >>> show up after the 3?
>
> >> What degree thingy?
>
> >> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>
> > ALT+0176 =3D
>
> Spoilsport.
> ;-)
>
> --
> Froz...
>
> The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

Option-shift-8 does it here...ohhhhh you don't HAVE an Option key????
No options for you! No soup either!

"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>>>
>
> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
> tool, not a measuring tool.
>

Mike, let's go back to the actual post:

>when no tool that I know of, would ALLOW you to make a
>precision cut like 70.6 degrees

The emphasis, of course, is mine, because he was just asking a question, not
telling you how to think.

I'll stand by all comments I've made on this thread.

Tom

On Feb 17, 7:34=A0pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
wrote:
> Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.
>
> After consideration, I've decided that the "close enough" effort
> (half way between 70 and 71, with a SLIGHT bump to 70) is
> good for me.
>
> As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
> math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
> Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.
>
> It's interesting that a set of plans would have such an odd angle
> to cut, when no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a
> precision cut like 70.6 degrees.

A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). What the
accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
matter.

On Feb 19, 3:31=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > [email protected] wrote:
> >> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> >> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> >> then use it on the miter.
>
> >> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> >> Suggestions?
>
> > When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
> > problem to a problem that has already been solved.
>
> > Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3=B0 cut with a miter saw?
>
> Nevermind the answer to that question, =A0how did you make the degree thi=
ngy
> show up after the 3?

What degree thingy?=B0

On Feb 17, 6:28=A0pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Swingman" wrote:
> > Or, graphically speaking:
>
> >http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/30-60Cuts.pdf
>
> -----------------
> Use 70.6 triangle as aux fence and leave miter saw set at "0".
>
> Keeps life simple.
>
> Time to get a beer.
>
> Lew

These are handy:
http://www.mortisejig.com/Angle%20divider.jpg

"HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] wrote:
>> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>>
>> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>> then use it on the miter.
>>
>> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>>
>> Suggestions?
>>
>
> When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
> problem to a problem that has already been solved.
>
> Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3° cut with a miter saw?

Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree thingy
show up after the 3?

On Feb 20, 9:02=A0pm, Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Feb 20, 8:22=A0pm, Steve Turner <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2/20/2010 3:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>
> > > Morris Dovey wrote:
> > >> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
> > >>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!=
!!
> > >>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking
> > >>> came with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
> > >>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
> > >>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>
> > >> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
> > >> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that chang=
ed
> > >> legend according to the language...
>
> > > <http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/keyboards-mice/9836/?cpg=3Dfroogl=
e>
>
> > Ah yes, the Optimus Maximus. =A0You'd have to be one HELL of a geek to =
shell out
> > $1600 for a keyboard.
>
> > --
> > "Even if your wife is happy but you're unhappy, you're still happier
> > than you'd be if you were happy and your wife was unhappy." - Red Green
> > To reply, eat the taco.http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/
>
> Tempting....

They'll be sub 300 dollars soon enough.

<[email protected]> wrote:

> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
---------------------------
Any reason to limit yourself to the table and miter saws?

Consider the following:

tan70.6 = 2.8396 or 2.84 for wood working purposes.

Lay out a triangle using trig function above with a vertical of 2.84
and a horizontal of 1.0.

Strike a line connecting the two points (hypotenuse) then cut proud of
this line with a hand saw (circular, saber, etc), then follow up with
a straight edge clamped in place and a router with a pattern bit.

You now have a triangle with 70.6 degrees as one internal angle.

Use triangle as a gauge to set angle needed.

Lew

[email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:

>Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
>I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>then use it on the miter.
>
>The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
>Suggestions?
>

At 70.6 degrees halfway between 70 and 71 would be close enough for me.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]

"Swingman" wrote:

> Or, graphically speaking:
>
> http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/30-60Cuts.pdf
-----------------
Use 70.6 triangle as aux fence and leave miter saw set at "0".

Keeps life simple.

Time to get a beer.

Lew

"Swingman" wrote:

> No beer until you take the time to make the "70.6 triangle" first,
> which is apparently not that easy for some, according to the OP.
---------------------------------
You could always layout the 70.6 line on a sled, then tack in a cleat
on the line.

Simple fast, but doesn't leave a permanet record if you need to repeat
the process down the road as a triangle does.

A $10 scientific calculator is in the same category as a dial vernier
caliper in the shop IMHO.

Both are very useful.

Lew

[email protected] wrote:

> As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
> math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
> Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.
----------------------------------------
Simple, the answer is 1.

The only challenge is to define the units.<G>

BTW, use trigonometry not plane geometry if you truly want to minimize
errors.

Lew

"Leon" wrote:
>
> Yeahbut Why even use the miter saw if you have to set up a jig?
-----------------------------
Way back when thread started, laying out an angle was offered as an
alternative to a miter saw.

Lew

"HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Hold down the Alt-key and type "0176" on the numeric keypad. Another
> useful one is ? (Alt-0162). For more, stir up "Character Map" and
> select "Courier" font. Pick the character you want and look in the
> lower right corner for the key combination. For example, the "Euro"
> symbol "?" is Alt-0128, and the plus-minus symbol "+" is Alt-0177.
>
> These may not display properly on all screens in that some users may
> be using a font other than a normal one such as Courier or Times
> Roman.
>
>

I'm running Windows 7, and apparently they've modified character map.
The code is given in the lower left hand corner is hexadecimal and not
decimal. There's still copy and paste, but I wish the character map
people realized many people would rather use the alt-[code] format for
oft entered symbols than open yet another program.

I've looked for an option to change it, there is none.

FWIW, Calculator still has a base converter built in.

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

"J. Clarke" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> The code in the lower _left_ is the Unicode value. If there is a code
> for the character which may be entered using the ALT key it will be on
> the lower _right_. All characters don't have such a code. And if
> you're using Word then you can use the Unicode value by entering the
> hex then ALT-X (be nice if MS carried this through to all their
> applications but . . .).
>

Apparently I wasn't selecting the right characters. With the Times New
Roman font, the characters after the Tilde (starting with the no break
space) start showing codes on the lower right.

Why not show the codes for each character, so Character Map actually
reflects the functionality that's there? Probably some historical
reason...

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

"J. Clarke" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:


> I think they're seeing the use of the ASCII codes as "legacy". They
> only seem to be showing codes for symbols that don't have a marked
> key.
>
> There's a way to turn on using the Alt key to get the hexadecimal
> Unicode symbols but it doesn't work in Windows Mail. It does work
> though in Thunderbird: ALT-+-B0 gives ° (note-you gotta have the "+"
> in there), as does ALT-0176, but ALT-176 gives ░.
> Weird--Thunderbird works exactly like the Microsoft docs say that an
> application is supposed to act, but Windows Mail doesn't.
>
> You might want to bring up notepad or Word or something and give it a
> try--if your machine is not recognizing the ALT+hex Unicode
> combinations, <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt_code> tells how to
> turn it on.
>

Thanks, J. Clarke. I just tried it, and apparently will have to follow
the Alt_code instructions to get the hexadecimal entry to work. Notepad
would "ding" at me when I hit the plus key, while Wordpad appears to eat
the plus and keep going.

My understanding of this Windows feature has deepened quite a bit.

Puckdropper

--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

On Feb 16, 8:27=A0pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> The miter only has 1 degree increments.

Are you talking MARKINGS or STOPS? My Miter Saw has lots of litt;e
degrees painted in/on the scale but the only stops are at 90, 45,
37.5(?) and 15 (I think).

Not that this information "solves" your problem, But it might open you
up to another way of looking at the problem - out of the markings on
my saw box, Tes? No?

You didn't mention the stock you were using and the dimensions of the
noard(s) to be cut at the indicated angle.

Since you mentioned Miter Saw, folks are likely to think of dimensions
usually cut on such a saw - no 4 x 8 sheets for instance - and offer
suggestions based in some part upon this premise.

Having said all that, thanks for your post as it unearthed quite a
nice load of information.

Thanks Tom.

If into crown cutting - some expensive sticks of crowns pay in a day
or less. Cutting custom boxes or angles on most anything and doing
it for a business - the real stuff pays and can be used to verify
a quality job later in a QA stance.

Martin

Tom Dacon wrote:
> "Martin H. Eastburn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> What you need is a "Precision Universal Bevel Vernier Protractor"
>> http://www.starrett.com/download/371_cat_70_p95.pdf
>> A lot of times you can find these in pawn shops.
>> Set this to the angle and align the saw blade and table to the blades.
>> A model 360 (non vernier) would be very good. Vernier version Is best!
>> New it was $250. Something like it in plastic and lower in precision
>> can be had at office suppliers. This one is rated at 1/12 degree with
>> vernier.
>>
>> Martin
>>
>
> You nailed it, Martin. That's the kind of thing I was talking about.
>
> Early on in this benighted thread I talked about using a protractor as a
> tool to solve a problem which as the original poster posed it was to measure
> an arbitrary angle to the precision of a tenth of a degree and make a
> suitable cut. Machinists are accustomed to solving problems like this, and
> consequently they have the tools to solve them. If a machinist gets an angle
> called out as 70.6 degrees, he understands that he needs to produce an angle
> between 70.55 and 70.65 degrees. He HAS to produce an angle to that
> measurement and those constraints. This is a nice tool, Starrett as you
> might expect, and well within the constraints of the problem. I have a
> slightly less accurate machinist's protracter of my own, but I'm going to be
> on the lookout for one of these. Thanks for the tip. I hope we don't end up
> in a bidding war :-)
>
> Glad to see someone here who doesn't have something to prove :-)
>
> Tom
>
>
>
>

On Feb 19, 2:15=A0pm, Steve Turner <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 02/19/2010 12:55 PM, Swingman wrote:
>
> > On 2/19/2010 12:42 PM, Steve Turner wrote:
>
> >>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>
> > Crocodile Dundee ... how soon we forget! ;)
>
> Rawight! =A0:-)
>
> --
> Free bad advice available here.
> To reply, eat the taco.http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Nawww.. THIS is a FENCE!!!!

http://www.australiantraveller.com/index.php?view=3Darticle&id=3D2685

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>
>> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
>> degrees?
>
> Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
> degrees. Jeez.
>
> Tom
>

And he ends up with a miter at 19.4 degrees. He needs 70.6 degrees. The
cut needs to be more towards a rip rather than closer to a cross cut. DOH!

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:2dcf2459-fa12-4508-ade9-12d0acf5e9dc@x22g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 17, 7:34 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
> available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). What the
> accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
> matter.
>
> Come on, people - have you forgotten how to work without using miter
> gauges that have built-in stops???
>
> Tom


I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6 degrees?

On Feb 18, 10:14=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:2dcf2459-fa12-4508-ade9-12d0acf5e9dc@x22g2000yqx.googlegroups.com..=
.
> > On Feb 17, 7:34 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
> > wrote:
> > A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
> > available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). =A0What the
> > accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
> > matter.
>
> > Come on, people - have you forgotten how to work without using miter
> > gauges that have built-in stops???
>
> > Tom
>
> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6 degre=
es?

When you set it at 19.4. It's all in how you look at it <G>

On Feb 20, 4:01=A0pm, FrozenNorth <[email protected]>
wrote:
> On 2/20/10 3:31 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wr=
ote:
>
> >> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
> >> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
> >> with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
> >> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
> >> people on the planet as well.<G>
>
> > Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
> > keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
> > legend according to the language...
>
> http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/9836/
>
> Festool pricing, but it is available.
>
> --
> Froz...
>
> The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

Geebus... that's nice...but that's not Festool pricing, it's more like
Audemars Piguet pricing. (Their tourbillon watches are drool-worthy.
Google tourbillon and find out exactly how nuts ultra-geek becomes in
the world of mechanical watch movements.)

On 2/18/2010 2:32 PM, -MIKE- wrote:

> The point is.... in the OP's original statement, which you quoted, he
> stated...
> "no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a precision cut like
> 70.6 degrees."
>
> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
> tool, not a measuring tool.

Fercrissakes, quit clouding the issue with facts! <g>

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:06:05 -0800 (PST), the infamous Robatoy
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>On Feb 19, 3:31 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> > [email protected] wrote:
>> >> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>>
>> >> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>> >> then use it on the miter.
>>
>> >> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>>
>> >> Suggestions?
>>
>> > When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
>> > problem to a problem that has already been solved.
>>
>> > Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3° cut with a miter saw?
>>
>> Nevermind the answer to that question,  how did you make the degree thingy
>> show up after the 3?
>
>What degree thingy?°

I know what you mean, Toy. I'm getting all lost in this high-tech
vocab they're tossing around, too.

--
"Just think of the tragedy of teaching children not to doubt."
-- Clarence Darrow

Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.

After consideration, I've decided that the "close enough" effort
(half way between 70 and 71, with a SLIGHT bump to 70) is
good for me.

As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.

It's interesting that a set of plans would have such an odd angle
to cut, when no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a
precision cut like 70.6 degrees.

Hmm,

MJ

On Feb 20, 10:14=A0am, Steve Turner <[email protected]>
wrote:
> On 2/19/2010 11:09 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > -MIKE- wrote:
> >> On 2/19/10 1:57 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> >>> -MIKE- wrote:
> >>>> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
> >>>>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the
> >>>>>>> blade is 0 degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the
> >>>>>>> way it appears on MY table saw.
>
> >>>>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>
> >>>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>
> >>>>>http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DE=
L...
>
> >>>> What an idiot. =A0Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?
>
> >>> It has a 70.5 degree stop and can be fine tuned from there.
>
> >>> If you gotta have 70.6 actually marked on the gage you need a 1000SE
> >>> or 1000HD, both of which have 1/10 degree verniers.
>
> >> Did you look at the picture? =A0 =A0:-)
>
> Apparently not...
>
> > Did you read the manual?
>
> J., you seem to be referring to the picture of the Incra miter gauge that=
Leon
> posted; Mike is referring to the picture of the Biesemeyer fence that I p=
osted,
> which (if you note the quoting above, none of which I've snipped) is what=
this
> branch of the thread is about.
>
> There, I fixed it. =A0:-)
>
That's what YOU think!

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:e8f30b7d-41b7-44d0-b6fd-52f824016129@q21g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 20, 1:26 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
> > thingy
> > show up after the 3?
>
> What degree thingy?°
>
> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?

You a Johnny Dangerously fan, Leon? One of my favourite movies in that
genre, along with Fish Called Wanda etc..


P R E C I C E L Y ! ! ! Farkin Ice Hole! That is exactly where I got
that. LOL

On Feb 18, 9:23=A0am, Swingman <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/18/2010 8:18 AM, Robatoy wrote:
>
> > On Feb 18, 9:04 am, Swingman<[email protected]> =A0wrote:
> >> On 2/17/2010 11:17 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
>
> >>> Are you sure we wouldn't be better off using SketchUp?
>
> >> Or CNC. What would either do without keyboards ...
>
> >> --www.e-woodshop.net
> >> Last update: 10/22/08
> >> KarlC@ (the obvious)
>
> > My Ouija Board has a USB2 port.
>
> My tape measures have wireless connections.
>


*tips hat*
.
.
.
and then wonders why not and when?

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:9023f1ab-bc6e-40bb-9d2b-fd5183e8c36f@v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
> Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.
>
> It's interesting that a set of plans would have such an odd angle
> to cut, when no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a
> precision cut like 70.6 degrees.
>
> Hmm,
>
> MJ

You don't consider an accurate protracter a tool?

Tom

"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>
> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
> tool, not a measuring tool.

Let's go back to the OP's post:

Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.

I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
then use it on the miter.

The miter only has 1 degree increments.

Suggestions?


ALL my comments apply.

Tom

On 02/16/2010 07:27 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.

Some more options:

1) Lay out the angle using geometry, set a bevel gauge to it, use that
to set the saw.

2) Take a bevel gauge, set it to 70.6 using the wixey and your tablesaw
top. Use the bevel gauge to set the saw.

3) If your stock isn't too wide you could stand it on edge and use the
bevel angle and your wixey.

4) Lay the saw on its back and zero out the wixey on the fence, then use
it to set the angle.

5) Buy an angle gauge. $5 for a plastic one, $25 for a digital one.

Chris

"Steve Turner" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> Another way to explain is this:
>> Your blade is 90 degrees relative to your fence, right?
>> Now subtract 19.4 degrees. Whatcha got now?
>>
>> i know, I know, LOL
>
> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0
> degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY
> table saw.


I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:64a1d472-d766-41d0-b4b3-9abb1131818f@a17g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> MJ

Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting to
19.4 degrees.

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
snip


> There it is. I hope this helps a bit. I don't have trig right at my
> fingertips any more either, even though I've used it a lot in my lifetime,
> and sometimes I have to bumble around a little to remember what I need to
> do to solve a problem, but this part of it - the tangent - the rise and
> the run - is easy to remember and really pays its way.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Tom Dacon


"Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have done
this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and that
knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct results
in "much" less time than it takes to explain.

On 2/17/2010 10:13 PM, Nonny wrote:
>
> "Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2/17/2010 5:28 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
>>> "Swingman" wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or, graphically speaking:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/30-60Cuts.pdf
>>> -----------------
>>> Use 70.6 triangle as aux fence and leave miter saw set at "0".
>>>
>>> Keeps life simple.
>>>
>>> Time to get a beer.
>>
>> No beer until you take the time to make the "70.6 triangle" first,
>> which is apparently not that easy for some, according to the OP.
>
> Bull. . . something between 65 and 75 degrees plus Bondo works well for
> me. <grin>

:)

When the sun's over the yardarm, there is such a thing as close enough.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
> On Feb 20, 2:47 pm, Morris Dovey<[email protected]> wrote:
>> On 2/20/2010 1:41 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> Option-shift-8 does it here...ohhhhh you don't HAVE an Option key????
>>> No options for you! No soup either!
>>
>> Then you probably have Swing's missing ê for bête, too...
>>
>> --
>> Morris Dovey
>> DeSoto Solar
>> DeSoto, Iowa USAhttp://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/
>
> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
> with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
> people on the planet as well.<G>

This Dell laptop keyboard takes a couple of extra, and mysterious,
combo keystrokes and six fingers on each hand just to do a F5 refresh.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
>> experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have
>> done this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and
>> that knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct
>> results in "much" less time than it takes to explain.
>
> Well, of course it takes much less time to do it than to read about it. I
> gave a detailed explanation of the process, so that someone using it would
> have an understanding of what was going on, rather than just following a
> cookbook. In practice, it takes no more than a minute or two to lay out
> the angle and set the miter gauge.

Actually, ;~) just so we are clear, it takes less time to make the set up
and make the cut than simply saying this,

Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting to
19.4 degrees and make the cut.

"Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >
>> Does your accurat protractor have teeth to cut the wood??? He is looking
>> for a tool to "make" the cut not measure the cut.
>
> You use the protractor to set the miter gauge, then you use the table saw
> to make the cut. How complicated is that?


Have you ever set your TS miter gauge to 70.6 degrees?

Puckdropper wrote:
> "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> Hold down the Alt-key and type "0176" on the numeric keypad. Another
>> useful one is ? (Alt-0162). For more, stir up "Character Map" and
>> select "Courier" font. Pick the character you want and look in the
>> lower right corner for the key combination. For example, the "Euro"
>> symbol "?" is Alt-0128, and the plus-minus symbol "+" is Alt-0177.
>>
>> These may not display properly on all screens in that some users may
>> be using a font other than a normal one such as Courier or Times
>> Roman.
>>
>>
>
> I'm running Windows 7, and apparently they've modified character map.
> The code is given in the lower left hand corner is hexadecimal and not
> decimal. There's still copy and paste, but I wish the character map
> people realized many people would rather use the alt-[code] format for
> oft entered symbols than open yet another program.
>

It's there on my Win7 machine.

Try scrolling and watch it flash by - again not all characers have a
keyboard equivalent.

On 2/17/2010 5:28 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> Or, graphically speaking:
>>
>> http://www.e-woodshop.net/files/30-60Cuts.pdf
> -----------------
> Use 70.6 triangle as aux fence and leave miter saw set at "0".
>
> Keeps life simple.
>
> Time to get a beer.

No beer until you take the time to make the "70.6 triangle" first, which
is apparently not that easy for some, according to the OP.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 2/19/2010 3:09 PM, Leon wrote:
> "Tom Dacon"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Leon"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>> "Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
>>> experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have
>>> done this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and
>>> that knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct
>>> results in "much" less time than it takes to explain.
>>
>> Well, of course it takes much less time to do it than to read about it. I
>> gave a detailed explanation of the process, so that someone using it would
>> have an understanding of what was going on, rather than just following a
>> cookbook. In practice, it takes no more than a minute or two to lay out
>> the angle and set the miter gauge.
>
> Actually, ;~) just so we are clear, it takes less time to make the set up
> and make the cut than simply saying this,
>
> Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting to
> 19.4 degrees and make the cut.

Or graphically speaking:

Just kidding ... dejavu all over again, I gotta get back to work. :)


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:ed10445d-0654-4fcc-8db3-2b00b07161d0@i39g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 19, 8:09 am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
>
> >> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>news:[email protected]...
>
> >> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
> >> degrees?
>
> > Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
> > degrees. Jeez.
>
> > Tom
>
> And he ends up with a miter at 19.4 degrees. He needs 70.6 degrees. The
> cut needs to be more towards a rip rather than closer to a cross cut. DOH!

Well, then you didn't look at Swing's SU pic. It *is* closer to a rip
than a cross cut.

Which is... what I said he needs...... right?

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...

> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
> degrees?

Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
degrees. Jeez.

Tom

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree thingy
> show up after the 3?

What degree thingy?°


Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?

"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Swingman" wrote:
>
>> No beer until you take the time to make the "70.6 triangle" first, which
>> is apparently not that easy for some, according to the OP.
> ---------------------------------
> You could always layout the 70.6 line on a sled, then tack in a cleat on
> the line.
>


Yeahbut Why even use the miter saw if you have to set up a jig?

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/19/2010 3:09 PM, Leon wrote:
>>
>> Actually, ;~) just so we are clear, it takes less time to make the set
>> up
>> and make the cut than simply saying this,
>>
>> Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting
>> to
>> 19.4 degrees and make the cut.
>
> Or graphically speaking:
>
> Just kidding ... dejavu all over again, I gotta get back to work. :)
>


Mutt'n Jeff?

"Morris Dovey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/20/2010 12:26 PM, Leon wrote:
>> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
>>> thingy
>>> show up after the 3?
>>
>> What degree thingy?°
>>
>>
>> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>
> ALT+0176 = °

Thank you Morris. ;~)

What you need is a "Precision Universal Bevel Vernier Protractor"
http://www.starrett.com/download/371_cat_70_p95.pdf
A lot of times you can find these in pawn shops.
Set this to the angle and align the saw blade and table to the blades.
A model 360 (non vernier) would be very good. Vernier version Is best!
New it was $250. Something like it in plastic and lower in precision
can be had at office suppliers. This one is rated at 1/12 degree with vernier.

Martin

Tom Dacon wrote:
> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>> Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting
>> to
>> 19.4 degrees and make the cut.
>
> Leon, maybe you're missing my point. What I have been describing is an
> accurate method to get the exact 19.4 degrees, not what you do once you get
> your miter gauge set to it.
>
> Tom
>
>

Leon wrote:
> "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>>>
>>> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>>> then use it on the miter.
>>>
>>> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>>>
>>> Suggestions?
>>>
>>
>> When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
>> problem to a problem that has already been solved.
>>
>> Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3° cut with a miter saw?
>
> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
> thingy show up after the 3?

Hold down the Alt-key and type "0176" on the numeric keypad. Another useful
one is ? (Alt-0162). For more, stir up "Character Map" and select "Courier"
font. Pick the character you want and look in the lower right corner for the
key combination. For example, the "Euro" symbol "?" is Alt-0128, and the
plus-minus symbol "+" is Alt-0177.

These may not display properly on all screens in that some users may be
using a font other than a normal one such as Courier or Times Roman.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:64a1d472-d766-41d0-b4b3-9abb1131818f@a17g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> MJ

Set it for 71 and give it a tap, or the left handed version is to set it to
70 and tap the other side. 1/10th of a degree is important for a moon shot,
but I doubt you're going to tell it on anything in wood. What is the
humidity today? Tomorrow?

On Feb 20, 3:39=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:e8f30b7d-41b7-44d0-b6fd-52f824016129@q21g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 20, 1:26 pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> >news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com..=
.
>
> > > Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
> > > thingy
> > > show up after the 3?
>
> > What degree thingy?=B0
>
> > Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>
> You a Johnny Dangerously fan, Leon? One of my favourite movies in that
> genre, along with Fish Called Wanda etc..
>
> P R E C I C E L Y ! ! ! =A0 =A0Farkin Ice Hole! =A0That is exactly where =
I got
> that. =A0LOL

Danny Vermin: I got something to stop him.
Dutch: They made it for him special. It's an eighty-eight Magnum.
Danny Vermin: It shoots through schools

and this:

Roman Moroni: You fargin sneaky bastage. I'm gonna take your dwork.
I'm gonna nail it to the wall. I'm gonna crush your boils in a meat
grinder. I'm gonna cut off your arms. I'm gonna shove 'em up your
icehole. Dirty son-a-ma-batches

but my favourite:

Newspaper Headline: Roman Moroni Deported to Sweden. Says He's Not
From There.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:2dcf2459-fa12-4508-ade9-12d0acf5e9dc@x22g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 17, 7:34 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
wrote:
A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). What the
accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
matter.

Come on, people - have you forgotten how to work without using miter gauges
that have built-in stops???

Tom

On Feb 19, 10:19=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
> snip
>
> > There it is. I hope this helps a bit. I don't have trig right at my
> > fingertips any more either, even though I've used it a lot in my lifeti=
me,
> > and sometimes I have to bumble around a little to remember what I need =
to
> > do to solve a problem, but this part of it - the tangent - the rise and
> > the run - is easy to remember and really pays its way.
>
> > Hope this helps,
> > Tom Dacon
>
> "Typically " =A0an explanation like this is not one of repeated =A0practi=
ced
> experience, more so a repeat of something published. =A0Those that have d=
one
> this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and that
> knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct resu=
lts
> in "much" less time than it takes to explain.

Balderdash, hogwash, nonsense......waitasec...oh...okay.

On 2/19/2010 12:42 PM, Steve Turner wrote:

>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:

Crocodile Dundee ... how soon we forget! ;)


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Feb 19, 10:38=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:bd527cff-b0f4-4eef-8899-d7080edc1061@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > > There it is. I hope this helps a bit. I don't have trig right at my
> > > fingertips any more either, even though I've used it a lot in my
> > > lifetime,
> > > and sometimes I have to bumble around a little to remember what I nee=
d
> > > to
> > > do to solve a problem, but this part of it - the tangent - the rise a=
nd
> > > the run - is easy to remember and really pays its way.
>
> > > Hope this helps,
> > > Tom Dacon
>
> > "Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
> > experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have do=
ne
> > this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and that
> > knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct
> > results
> > in "much" less time than it takes to explain.
>
> Balderdash, hogwash, nonsense......waitasec...oh...okay.
>
> Is that a definite maybe?

I used to have trouble making up my mind, now I'm not so sure.

On 2/19/2010 1:13 AM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:64a1d472-d766-41d0-b4b3-9abb1131818f@a17g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
>> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>>
>> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>> then use it on the miter.
>>
>> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>>
>> Suggestions?
>>
>> MJ
>
> To everyone on this thread, here's a trigonometry lesson, and for
> something like this, it is really, really all you need to know.

Everything that "you need to know" was posted with Leon's one line post,
and my graphic representation of that one line that immediately
proceeded it.

Simple, elegant, and with no need for an epic saga.

As Mike says, you doth protest too much ... if you're not a government
worker, you missed your calling in life.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

No option key - what kind of kinky key is that - not ASCII must be a
home brew of Apple or someone.

Martin

Robatoy wrote:
> On Feb 20, 2:30 pm, FrozenNorth <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>> On 2/20/10 2:09 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:> On 2/20/2010 12:26 PM, Leon wrote:
>>>> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
>>>>> thingy
>>>>> show up after the 3?
>>>> What degree thingy?
>>>> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>>> ALT+0176 =
>> Spoilsport.
>> ;-)
>>
>> --
>> Froz...
>>
>> The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
>
> Option-shift-8 does it here...ohhhhh you don't HAVE an Option key????
> No options for you! No soup either!

On Feb 20, 2:47=A0pm, Morris Dovey <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/20/2010 1:41 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
> > Option-shift-8 does it here...ohhhhh you don't HAVE an Option key????
> > No options for you! No soup either!
>
> Then you probably have Swing's missing =EA for b=EAte, too...
>
> --
> Morris Dovey
> DeSoto Solar
> DeSoto, Iowa USAhttp://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
(Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
people on the planet as well. <G>

On 2/17/2010 7:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.
>
> After consideration, I've decided that the "close enough" effort
> (half way between 70 and 71, with a SLIGHT bump to 70) is
> good for me.
>
> As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
> math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
> Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.
>
> It's interesting that a set of plans would have such an odd angle
> to cut, when no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a
> precision cut like 70.6 degrees.

Depends upon the size of your project. 1/10 degree of angle will put you
around 1/64+, at 12"; 3/64*" off at 24"; and 5/64+" at 4'; mas or menas.

That could be unacceptable for some projects.

I routinely use my digital angle gauge and the table saw to cut angles
to .1 degrees, cut a reference angle in a piece of scrap, and use it to
set up any other tool, miter saw, etc.

Or, you can set a bevel gauge to the angle of the table saw
blade/reference piece and transfer it wherever.

We all know it's woodworking, but it never hurts to endeavor to be as
precise as possible at every step because error becomes cumulative down
the road and around the corners.

Attention to detail is the difference between mediocrity and supremacy.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Feb 20, 1:26=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree thin=
gy
> > show up after the 3?
>
> What degree thingy?=B0
>
> Ice Hole! =A0 Howd ju do dat?

You a Johnny Dangerously fan, Leon? One of my favourite movies in that
genre, along with Fish Called Wanda etc..

On Feb 19, 8:09=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
>
> >> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>news:[email protected]...
>
> >> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
> >> degrees?
>
> > Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
> > degrees. Jeez.
>
> > Tom
>
> And he ends up with a miter at 19.4 degrees. =A0He needs 70.6 degrees. =
=A0The
> cut needs to be more towards a rip rather than closer to a cross cut. =A0=
DOH!

Well, then you didn't look at Swing's SU pic. It *is* closer to a rip
than a cross cut.

Thank you

On 2/17/2010 9:08 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>> As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
>> math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
>> Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.
> ----------------------------------------
> Simple, the answer is 1.
>
> The only challenge is to define the units.<G>
>
> BTW, use trigonometry not plane geometry if you truly want to minimize
> errors.

Are you sure we wouldn't be better off using SketchUp?

;-)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>>
>> Does your accurat protractor have teeth to cut the wood??? He is
>> looking for a tool to "make" the cut not measure the cut.
>
> You use the protractor to set the miter gauge, then you use the table
> saw to make the cut. How complicated is that?
>
> Tom
>

The point is.... in the OP's original statement, which you quoted, he
stated...
"no tool that I know of, would allow you to make a precision cut like
70.6 degrees."

It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
tool, not a measuring tool.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

Leon wrote:
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:2dcf2459-fa12-4508-ade9-12d0acf5e9dc@x22g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
>> On Feb 17, 7:34 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>> A few miter gauges have a 1/10 degree vernier, so the precision is
>> available (though perhaps not to 70 degrees, directly). What the
>> accuracy of the gauge is, including miter slot slop, may be another
>> matter.
>>
>> Come on, people - have you forgotten how to work without using miter
>> gauges that have built-in stops???
>>
>> Tom
>
>
> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
> degrees?

Sure. You move it to the position and tigten the screw. Geez.

On 2/18/10 11:17 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>>
>> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
>> tool, not a measuring tool.
>
> Let's go back to the OP's post:
>
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>
>
> ALL my comments apply.
>
> Tom
>

Then why didn't you quote that?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/18/10 11:43 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>>>>
>>
>> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
>> tool, not a measuring tool.
>>
>
> Mike, let's go back to the actual post:
>
>> when no tool that I know of, would ALLOW you to make a
>> precision cut like 70.6 degrees
>
> The emphasis, of course, is mine, because he was just asking a question,
> not telling you how to think.
>
> I'll stand by all comments I've made on this thread.
>
> Tom
>

Methinks the lady doth protesteth too much. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 02/19/2010 07:45 AM, Robatoy wrote:
> On Feb 19, 8:09 am, "Leon"<[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Tom Dacon"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>>
>>> "Leon"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>> "Tom Dacon"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>> I'll ask this again,,, can yo actually set your miter gauge to 70.6
>>>> degrees?
>>
>>> Come on, Leon. Stop trying to be cute. He sets his miter guage at 19.4
>>> degrees. Jeez.
>>
>>> Tom
>>
>> And he ends up with a miter at 19.4 degrees. He needs 70.6 degrees. The
>> cut needs to be more towards a rip rather than closer to a cross cut. DOH!
>
> Another way to explain is this:
> Your blade is 90 degrees relative to your fence, right?
> Now subtract 19.4 degrees. Whatcha got now?
>
> i know, I know, LOL

Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0 degrees relative to
the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY table saw.

--
"Once upon a time, The END."
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Tom Dacon wrote:
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2/18/10 2:15 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
>>
>> It seems to be obvious to most of us that he's referring to a cutting
>> tool, not a measuring tool.
>
> Let's go back to the OP's post:
>
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>
>
> ALL my comments apply.

Figure out the thickness of the block you have to put at one end of the
fence to get .4 degrees, and put one there.

On 02/19/2010 08:27 AM, Leon wrote:
> "Steve Turner"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>> Another way to explain is this:
>>> Your blade is 90 degrees relative to your fence, right?
>>> Now subtract 19.4 degrees. Whatcha got now?
>>>
>>> i know, I know, LOL
>>
>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0
>> degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY
>> table saw.
>
>
> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.

That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:

http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg

:-)

--
What percentage of the driving populace do you suppose actually
understands the rules of engagement at a four-way stop?
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0
>>> degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY
>>> table saw.
>>
>>
>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>
> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>
> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>

What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 02/19/2010 12:07 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade is 0
>>>> degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it appears on MY
>>>> table saw.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>>
>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>>
>> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>
> What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?

No, but it's BIG. And it's a FENCE. And it's really awesome, and... what the hell were we
talking about again? :-)

--
"Once upon a time, The END."
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On 02/19/2010 12:55 PM, Swingman wrote:
> On 2/19/2010 12:42 PM, Steve Turner wrote:
>
>>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>
> Crocodile Dundee ... how soon we forget! ;)

Rawight! :-)

--
Free bad advice available here.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

-MIKE- wrote:
> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade
>>>> is 0 degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it
>>>> appears on MY table saw.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>>
>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>>
>> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>>
>
> What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?

It has a 70.5 degree stop and can be fine tuned from there.

If you gotta have 70.6 actually marked on the gage you need a 1000SE or
1000HD, both of which have 1/10 degree verniers.

On 2/19/10 1:57 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the blade
>>>>> is 0 degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the way it
>>>>> appears on MY table saw.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>>>
>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>>>
>>> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>>>
>>
>> What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?
>
> It has a 70.5 degree stop and can be fine tuned from there.
>
> If you gotta have 70.6 actually marked on the gage you need a 1000SE or
> 1000HD, both of which have 1/10 degree verniers.
>

Did you look at the picture? :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
> experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have done
> this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and that
> knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct
> results in "much" less time than it takes to explain.

Well, of course it takes much less time to do it than to read about it. I
gave a detailed explanation of the process, so that someone using it would
have an understanding of what was going on, rather than just following a
cookbook. In practice, it takes no more than a minute or two to lay out the
angle and set the miter gauge.

I wrote the procedure from my own experience and my own practice in the
shop, not from something I read in a book (although I learned trigonometry
from a book, of course, back in high school). For most shop requirements,
the fixed-stop miter gauges like the Kreg and the Incra and their like do a
fine job - quick, accurate, and repeatable. I use one myself. But when they
can't do the job, as in the case of the OP, you have to have some other way
to handle the problem, and the one I described is both simple and accurate.
You just have to read it with an open mind, preferably in the shop where you
can try it out and prove to yourself that it works.

By the way, while I didn't mention it in my post, if you have to do an
angled cut on a large panel this procedure is almost essential for an
accurate cut. In that case, you lay the angle out right on the panel, clamp
a straight-edge, and make the cut with a circular saw. Because for long runs
the procedure is sensitive to the accuracy of the perpendicular line, I
would strike it using the beam compass method, with a modified version of
this technique: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpendicular, or by the
well-known technique of flipping the square and splitting the difference.
You could, if you liked, trust the squareness of the panel, but I don't.
After you have an accurate perpendicular your accuracy is assured.

Tom

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Tom Dacon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>
> Put your wood on the mitersaw 90 degrees to normal, adjust miter setting
> to
> 19.4 degrees and make the cut.

Leon, maybe you're missing my point. What I have been describing is an
accurate method to get the exact 19.4 degrees, not what you do once you get
your miter gauge set to it.

Tom

"Martin H. Eastburn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> What you need is a "Precision Universal Bevel Vernier Protractor"
> http://www.starrett.com/download/371_cat_70_p95.pdf
> A lot of times you can find these in pawn shops.
> Set this to the angle and align the saw blade and table to the blades.
> A model 360 (non vernier) would be very good. Vernier version Is best!
> New it was $250. Something like it in plastic and lower in precision
> can be had at office suppliers. This one is rated at 1/12 degree with
> vernier.
>
> Martin
>

You nailed it, Martin. That's the kind of thing I was talking about.

Early on in this benighted thread I talked about using a protractor as a
tool to solve a problem which as the original poster posed it was to measure
an arbitrary angle to the precision of a tenth of a degree and make a
suitable cut. Machinists are accustomed to solving problems like this, and
consequently they have the tools to solve them. If a machinist gets an angle
called out as 70.6 degrees, he understands that he needs to produce an angle
between 70.55 and 70.65 degrees. He HAS to produce an angle to that
measurement and those constraints. This is a nice tool, Starrett as you
might expect, and well within the constraints of the problem. I have a
slightly less accurate machinist's protracter of my own, but I'm going to be
on the lookout for one of these. Thanks for the tip. I hope we don't end up
in a bidding war :-)

Glad to see someone here who doesn't have something to prove :-)

Tom

"HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] wrote:

> When faced with a new problem, it is often helpful to reduce this new
> problem to a problem that has already been solved.
>
> Tell me, have you ever made a 35.3° cut with a miter saw?

Well, at least there's SOMEONE here with a sense of humor.

A mathematician knows that rule: problems are either trivial (we know how to
solve them), or hard (we don't).

As it happen, maestro, I HAVE solved this one. Not this exact one, of
course, but once in the distant past I had to cut an angle of
2.35333333333333333 degrees, and I made a template from it. All I have to do
is produce twenty-nine exact duplicates of it, stack them up on the miter
gauge, and I've nailed this 70.6 degree problem.

So what else have you got for me?

Tom

Tom Dacon wrote:
> "Martin H. Eastburn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> What you need is a "Precision Universal Bevel Vernier Protractor"
>> http://www.starrett.com/download/371_cat_70_p95.pdf
>> A lot of times you can find these in pawn shops.
>> Set this to the angle and align the saw blade and table to the
>> blades. A model 360 (non vernier) would be very good. Vernier
>> version Is best! New it was $250. Something like it in plastic and
>> lower in precision can be had at office suppliers. This one is
>> rated at 1/12 degree with vernier.
>>
>> Martin
>>
>
> You nailed it, Martin. That's the kind of thing I was talking about.
>
> Early on in this benighted thread I talked about using a protractor
> as a tool to solve a problem which as the original poster posed it
> was to measure an arbitrary angle to the precision of a tenth of a
> degree and make a suitable cut. Machinists are accustomed to solving
> problems like this, and consequently they have the tools to solve
> them. If a machinist gets an angle called out as 70.6 degrees, he
> understands that he needs to produce an angle between 70.55 and 70.65
> degrees. He HAS to produce an angle to that measurement and those
> constraints. This is a nice tool, Starrett as you might expect, and
> well within the constraints of the problem. I have a slightly less
> accurate machinist's protracter of my own, but I'm going to be on the
> lookout for one of these. Thanks for the tip. I hope we don't end up
> in a bidding war :-)
>
> Glad to see someone here who doesn't have something to prove :-)

FWIW, Grizzly has a dial protracter readable to 5 minutes for 40 bucks and a
digital readable to .1 degree for 90. Not Starrett quality of course but
should do most hobbyists just fine.

-MIKE- wrote:
> On 2/19/10 1:57 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the
>>>>>> blade is 0 degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the
>>>>>> way it appears on MY table saw.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>>>>
>>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>>>>
>>>
>>> What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?
>>
>> It has a 70.5 degree stop and can be fine tuned from there.
>>
>> If you gotta have 70.6 actually marked on the gage you need a 1000SE
>> or 1000HD, both of which have 1/10 degree verniers.
>>
>
> Did you look at the picture? :-)

Did you read the manual?

On 2/19/2010 11:09 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
>> On 2/19/10 1:57 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>>> On 2/19/10 8:44 AM, Steve Turner wrote:
>>>>>>> Well ya cornfused me on that one, Bubba. I'm pretty sure the
>>>>>>> blade is 0 degrees relative to the fence, at least that's the
>>>>>>> way it appears on MY table saw.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think he is talking about the miter gauge fence.
>>>>>
>>>>> That's not a FENCE. THIS is a fence:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.deltaportercable.com//ProductImages/PC_Graphics/PHOTOS/DELTA/ACCESSORIES/LARGE/78-902_1.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What an idiot. Do *YOU* see a 70.6 degree setting on that fence?
>>>
>>> It has a 70.5 degree stop and can be fine tuned from there.
>>>
>>> If you gotta have 70.6 actually marked on the gage you need a 1000SE
>>> or 1000HD, both of which have 1/10 degree verniers.
>>>
>>
>> Did you look at the picture? :-)

Apparently not...

> Did you read the manual?

J., you seem to be referring to the picture of the Incra miter gauge that Leon
posted; Mike is referring to the picture of the Biesemeyer fence that I posted,
which (if you note the quoting above, none of which I've snipped) is what this
branch of the thread is about.

There, I fixed it. :-)

--
Any given amount of traffic flow, no matter how
sparse, will expand to fill all available lanes.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On 2/20/10 1:26 PM, Leon wrote:
> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree thingy
>> show up after the 3?
>
> What degree thingy?°
>
>
> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>
We use a metric keyboard in Canada °

Hope that helps.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

On 2/20/2010 12:26 PM, Leon wrote:
> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree thingy
>> show up after the 3?
>
> What degree thingy?°
>
>
> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?

ALT+0176 = °

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On 2/20/10 2:09 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
> On 2/20/2010 12:26 PM, Leon wrote:
>> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:2e1b81f4-5f91-4141-8546-07c02a6727e7@a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>> Nevermind the answer to that question, how did you make the degree
>>> thingy
>>> show up after the 3?
>>
>> What degree thingy?°
>>
>>
>> Ice Hole! Howd ju do dat?
>
> ALT+0176 = °
>
Spoilsport.
;-)

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

On 2/20/2010 1:41 PM, Robatoy wrote:

> Option-shift-8 does it here...ohhhhh you don't HAVE an Option key????
> No options for you! No soup either!

Then you probably have Swing's missing ê for bête, too...

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:

> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
> with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
> people on the planet as well.<G>

Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
legend according to the language...

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On 2/20/10 3:31 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
>> with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>
> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
> legend according to the language...
>
http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/9836/

Festool pricing, but it is available.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

On 2/20/2010 3:01 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
> On 2/20/10 3:31 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
>> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
>>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking came
>>> with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
>>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
>>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>>
>> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
>> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
>> legend according to the language...
>>
> http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/9836/
>
> Festool pricing, but it is available.

OLEDS! 48p x 48p! Shazam!

English/Arabic/French/Portuguese/Spanish/Russian/APL! Gottahavit!

<Morris takes out wallet, peeks inside>

8-(

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

Morris Dovey wrote:
> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking
>> came with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>
> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
> legend according to the language...

<http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/keyboards-mice/9836/?cpg=froogle>

Puckdropper wrote:
> "HeyBub" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> Hold down the Alt-key and type "0176" on the numeric keypad. Another
>> useful one is ? (Alt-0162). For more, stir up "Character Map" and
>> select "Courier" font. Pick the character you want and look in the
>> lower right corner for the key combination. For example, the "Euro"
>> symbol "?" is Alt-0128, and the plus-minus symbol "+" is Alt-0177.
>>
>> These may not display properly on all screens in that some users may
>> be using a font other than a normal one such as Courier or Times
>> Roman.
>>
>>
>
> I'm running Windows 7, and apparently they've modified character map.
> The code is given in the lower left hand corner is hexadecimal and not
> decimal. There's still copy and paste, but I wish the character map
> people realized many people would rather use the alt-[code] format for
> oft entered symbols than open yet another program.

The code in the lower _left_ is the Unicode value. If there is a code for
the character which may be entered using the ALT key it will be on the lower
_right_. All characters don't have such a code. And if you're using Word
then you can use the Unicode value by entering the hex then ALT-X (be nice
if MS carried this through to all their applications but . . .).

On 2/20/2010 3:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> Morris Dovey wrote:
>> On 2/20/2010 2:10 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> We got yur aigus, your graves your circumflexes und UMLAUTS!! HEIL!!!
>>> (Sorry, got carried away there for a moment. That way of thinking
>>> came with my membership in TWB. (Typists Without Borders))
>>> Seems that Apple understood a long time ago that there were other
>>> people on the planet as well.<G>
>>
>> Good stuff - I've been thinking that the world is about ready for a
>> keyboard with a language selector and keys with tiny LCDs that changed
>> legend according to the language...
>
> <http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/keyboards-mice/9836/?cpg=froogle>

Ah yes, the Optimus Maximus. You'd have to be one HELL of a geek to shell out
$1600 for a keyboard.

--
"Even if your wife is happy but you're unhappy, you're still happier
than you'd be if you were happy and your wife was unhappy." - Red Green
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On 2/21/2010 1:13 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> "J. Clarke"<[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>>
>> The code in the lower _left_ is the Unicode value. If there is a code
>> for the character which may be entered using the ALT key it will be on
>> the lower _right_. All characters don't have such a code. And if
>> you're using Word then you can use the Unicode value by entering the
>> hex then ALT-X (be nice if MS carried this through to all their
>> applications but . . .).
>>
>
> Apparently I wasn't selecting the right characters. With the Times New
> Roman font, the characters after the Tilde (starting with the no break
> space) start showing codes on the lower right.
>
> Why not show the codes for each character, so Character Map actually
> reflects the functionality that's there? Probably some historical
> reason...
>
> Puckdropper

I think they're seeing the use of the ASCII codes as "legacy". They
only seem to be showing codes for symbols that don't have a marked key.

There's a way to turn on using the Alt key to get the hexadecimal
Unicode symbols but it doesn't work in Windows Mail. It does work
though in Thunderbird: ALT-+-B0 gives ° (note-you gotta have the "+" in
there), as does ALT-0176, but ALT-176 gives ░. Weird--Thunderbird works
exactly like the Microsoft docs say that an application is supposed to
act, but Windows Mail doesn't.

You might want to bring up notepad or Word or something and give it a
try--if your machine is not recognizing the ALT+hex Unicode
combinations, <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt_code> tells how to turn
it on.

On 2/22/2010 5:51 AM, Puckdropper wrote:
> "J. Clarke"<[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>
>> I think they're seeing the use of the ASCII codes as "legacy". They
>> only seem to be showing codes for symbols that don't have a marked
>> key.
>>
>> There's a way to turn on using the Alt key to get the hexadecimal
>> Unicode symbols but it doesn't work in Windows Mail. It does work
>> though in Thunderbird: ALT-+-B0 gives ° (note-you gotta have the "+"
>> in there), as does ALT-0176, but ALT-176 gives ░.
>> Weird--Thunderbird works exactly like the Microsoft docs say that an
>> application is supposed to act, but Windows Mail doesn't.
>>
>> You might want to bring up notepad or Word or something and give it a
>> try--if your machine is not recognizing the ALT+hex Unicode
>> combinations,<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt_code> tells how to
>> turn it on.
>>
>
> Thanks, J. Clarke. I just tried it, and apparently will have to follow
> the Alt_code instructions to get the hexadecimal entry to work. Notepad
> would "ding" at me when I hit the plus key, while Wordpad appears to eat
> the plus and keep going.
>
> My understanding of this Windows feature has deepened quite a bit.
>
> Puckdropper

This is interesting--where you quoted my message, the unicode character
for the degree sign got split into an A-circumflex followed by degree,
and the Alt-176 gives a-circumflex followed by a grave accent. I guess
that's what happens when you feed Unicode to a non-Unicode-aware
application, it tries to make two letters out of it.

>

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:bd527cff-b0f4-4eef-8899-d7080edc1061@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...

> > There it is. I hope this helps a bit. I don't have trig right at my
> > fingertips any more either, even though I've used it a lot in my
> > lifetime,
> > and sometimes I have to bumble around a little to remember what I need
> > to
> > do to solve a problem, but this part of it - the tangent - the rise and
> > the run - is easy to remember and really pays its way.
>
> > Hope this helps,
> > Tom Dacon
>
> "Typically " an explanation like this is not one of repeated practiced
> experience, more so a repeat of something published. Those that have done
> this time and again realize that it is not a complicated feat and that
> knowing how to place the material on the machine accomplishs correct
> results
> in "much" less time than it takes to explain.

Balderdash, hogwash, nonsense......waitasec...oh...okay.

Is that a definite maybe?

In article <64a1d472-d766-41d0-b4b3-9abb1131818f@a17g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
[email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
>Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
>I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
>then use it on the miter.
>
>The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
>Suggestions?

Just the 'obvious' one -- use a shim to wedge the stock a an angle to the
'reference plane' (presumably the _back_ of the miter bed), such that it is
"mumble point 6" degrees off 'true'. Then set the miter saw to the appropriate
number of whole degrees, so that the comination gives the desired 70.6 angle.

Note: depending on which way you swing the blade, you may need to set the shim
wedge angle to "mumble point 4" degrees.

On 2/18/2010 9:40 AM, Leon wrote:
> "Lew Hodgett"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Swingman" wrote:
>>
>>> No beer until you take the time to make the "70.6 triangle" first, which
>>> is apparently not that easy for some, according to the OP.
>> ---------------------------------
>> You could always layout the 70.6 line on a sled, then tack in a cleat on
>> the line.
>>
>
>
> Yeahbut Why even use the miter saw if you have to set up a jig?

Why?

For sake of argument ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/18/2010 9:40 AM, Leon wrote:

>>>
>>
>>
>> Yeahbut Why even use the miter saw if you have to set up a jig?
>
> Why?
>
> For sake of argument ...


Well, there is that. Doh! LOL

"[email protected]" <[email protected]> writes:

> Want to thank all of you who responded to my question.
>
> After consideration, I've decided that the "close enough" effort
> (half way between 70 and 71, with a SLIGHT bump to 70) is
> good for me.
>
> As much as I would love to deal with a geometry question, my
> math interests are more towards the theoretical these days (Riemann
> Zeta Function anyone?), which can cause many hours of brain freeze.
>

If you solve the Hilbert problem, I will trust that you also know basic
plane geometry & trig... ;)

On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 00:16:59 -0500, the infamous "J. Clarke"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:

>Tom Dacon wrote:

>> Glad to see someone here who doesn't have something to prove :-)
>
>FWIW, Grizzly has a dial protracter readable to 5 minutes for 40 bucks and a
>digital readable to .1 degree for 90. Not Starrett quality of course but
>should do most hobbyists just fine.

Aww, who cares, when caulk and putty will fill gaps up to 1/4-inch.
<silly grin>

--
"Just think of the tragedy of teaching children not to doubt."
-- Clarence Darrow

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:64a1d472-d766-41d0-b4b3-9abb1131818f@a17g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
> Can't quite wrap my brain on how to tackle this.
>
> I could make a template on my TS with my Wixey and
> then use it on the miter.
>
> The miter only has 1 degree increments.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> MJ

To everyone on this thread, here's a trigonometry lesson, and for something
like this, it is really, really all you need to know.

Who here has ever built a set of stairs, or put up a roof? It's all about
the RISE and the RUN, right? The RISE is the vertical distance between the
tops of two steps, the RUN is the horizontal distance between the noses of
the steps. Or for a shed roof, the RISE is the height of the peak above the
low side of the span, and the RUN is the width of the span.

Well the RISE divided by the RUN is what's called the tangent of the angle.

We're starting with an angle that we want on the edge of a board: 70.6. A
little thought tells us that to get that on a table saw we need to set our
miter gauge at 90 degrees minus 70.6, or 19.4 degrees. That's the angle we
need between the miter gauge bar and the face of the gauge. When we put a
piece of wood against the miter gauge face and run it through, we'll leave
an edge on the board that has an angle of 70.6 degrees with respect to the
side that rested against the miter gauge.

Now, we all have PC's right? And they all have a little application called
the Calculator. Or we have a hand calculator and if it's a scientific
calculator it has a TAN button on it. If it doesn't, fire up your PC.

Start up Calculator, or use your scientific calculator, and type in 19.4,
then hit the TAN button. What you'll see is the tangent of 19.4 degrees:
0.3521555 plus a whole bunch of other digits. Now here's the deal: if you
think of that in inches, it's the RISE over a RUN of one inch. For each
horizontal inch, the line rises about 11/32 inches or a little more. For ten
inches of run, it rises 3.521555 inches or about 3 17/32 inches.

Now take a piece of scrap plywood, about 24 inches by 24 inches, with one
good straight side. At about the middle of the best side, strike a line
across it with your most accurate square - and it should be an accurate
one - using a sharp hard-lead pencil or a striking knife. Since we have a
24-inch piece of plywood, let's use most of it: measure up that line exactly
20 inches and strike a mark across it. That 20 inches is going to be our
RUN.

With me so far? Now to use the tangent: Multiply the RISE over one inch
(0.3521555...) by the RUN (20 inches), and you get 7.0431118... inches. In
fractional inches, that's damned close to seven inches plus a 32nd and a
half, or 3/64ths. At my age, they might as well not put 64ths on scales any
more, so I'd do a 32nd and a half, as best as I could judge it.

Measure that distance to the right from the perpendicular line and strike it
on the good edge of the panel.

Finally, draw an angled line between that point and that 20-inch cross-mark
you made on the vertical line.

There it is. A line that describes an angle of 70.6 degrees with respect to
your good straight edge.

Finally the rubber hits the road: take your miter gauge and turn it over and
lay it down on the panel. Swing the bar until it lies along that angled line
as closely as your eye can gauge it. Tighten down the screw.

But wait, you might say, what if I'm a little off with my measurements -
what angle would I get instead? Well, as the calculator tells us with a
little keypunching, if you were to use 7 1/32 instead of 7 3/64 (a 64th
short), you'd get 70.63 degrees; if you were to use 7 1/16 (a 64th long)
you'd get 70.55 degrees, and in either case we're out no more than 1/64 inch
over a board width of 20 inches. Unfortunately our OP didn't tell us how
wide his board needed to be, but it's probably nowhere near this wide. At
ten inches of width, it turns out, it'll be no more than a thousandth of an
inch off.

So put the miter gauge in the table saw and make your cut. Then offer the
piece up to see how good your fit is, like we do with every board we've ever
cut in our lives. It's going to be perfect, or damned near to it.

And if it's not, what do we do? We reach into our aprons, don't we, and we
pull out a block plane and correct the fit by whatever it takes to make the
fit air-tight. A 64th of an inch is one and a half thousandths of an inch,
remember.

A faster and easier way to do this is to use an accurate protractor, as I've
recommended elsewhere in this thread. You'll eyeball the .6 degree on any
protractor I've ever seen - even a machinist's protractor- you'll make your
cut, and you'll correct the fit with a block plane if you have to. For a
reasonably narrow board you'll be damned near perfect. But even then, taking
the time to lay it out as I described will get get you closer than the
protractor would for a wide board.

Of course, if your miter gauge bar fits loosely in the slot, or there's some
spring or flex, no measurement no matter how accurate will give you the
results you want. But you need to fix that problem anyway, not just for this
one cut.

There it is. I hope this helps a bit. I don't have trig right at my
fingertips any more either, even though I've used it a lot in my lifetime,
and sometimes I have to bumble around a little to remember what I need to do
to solve a problem, but this part of it - the tangent - the rise and the
run - is easy to remember and really pays its way.

Hope this helps,
Tom Dacon

On 2/18/2010 8:18 AM, Robatoy wrote:
> On Feb 18, 9:04 am, Swingman<[email protected]> wrote:
>> On 2/17/2010 11:17 PM, Morris Dovey wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Are you sure we wouldn't be better off using SketchUp?
>>
>> Or CNC. What would either do without keyboards ...
>>
>> --www.e-woodshop.net
>> Last update: 10/22/08
>> KarlC@ (the obvious)
>
> My Ouija Board has a USB2 port.

My tape measures have wireless connections.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)