Felder

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 9:39:23 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 17:54:26 -0400, ads wrote:
>
> >On Fri, 9 Aug 2019 23:14:49 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
> ><[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 12:58:22 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
> >>> Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
> >>> seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
> >>>
> >>> I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
> >>> cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
> >>> expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
> >>> give up.
> >>
> >>I once had a subscription to Woodsmith magazine. Almost as soon as I got
> >>my first issue I started getting emails from their "partners" offering me
> >>all sorts of greats deals on books and plans. In order to take advantage of
> >>the deals, all I had to do was *get a subscription to Woodsmith magazine*.
> >>
> >>What? I called Woodsmith customer service and all they would tell me was
> >>that I agreed to accept emails from their partners when I started the
> >>subscription and that I could opt-out at any time. They didn't seem to
> >>get the point that their "partners" were requiring me to sign up for a
> >>subscription that I already had in order to take advantage of their offers.
> >>"We don't control the terms of our partner's offers." WTF?
> >
> >Sounds like the "partners" get kickbacks on the subsriptions they
> >generate so your current subscription isn't valid because it doesn't
> >get them anything. Some days I'd like to be so rich I can't count it,
> >because then I'd buy some of the really annoying companies (and
> >politicians - many are for sale) and take them out of the marketplace
> >- some should be permanently removed. Not being able to do that kind
> >of change, I vote with the $$$ I do have. Some brands I buy; some I
> >don't (never owned a Crapsler product and never will - vehicles that
> >won't go into Park or come out of cruise and the fan speed for the
> >heater buried 2 or 3 pages deep in the 7 inch display?) I don't buy
> >Apple products either. In the days of the Apple II, they sold
> >thousands of those $2500 computers to schools. If they bought 5, they
> >"gave" the school a free one. But those computers only cost them $500
> >to manufacture. When they made $10,000 off sales for children's
> >education, they effectively donated $500. Why not just sell the
> >computers to the schools at helf price? They wouldn't have been seen
> >as 'donating" and "helping education" - nor would that have made Jobs
> >and Wozniak as many million$.
> >Cynical? Yes, and I plan to stay that way.
>
> I am reminded of the time one of my students came to me asking for
> advice. Seems he had become aware that the state vocational/technical
> schools had run into an issue with their CAD curriculum. The students
> coming in couldn't run MS-DOS so much of the first Autocad course was
> teaching them DOS. The decision was made to have an MS-DOS course
> that was a prerequisite for the first AUTOCAD course. Fine so far.
> But the state put the contract out for bids and somehow or other Apple
> won. I wrote my state legislator about it and he came back with
> assurances from his "expert" that a Mac was a fine machine for
> teaching MS-DOS.

So what was the final outcome?

A fine machine as claimed, a miserable failure or a change of hardware
platform from the get-go?

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 00:58:19 -0400, J. Clarke
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
> >seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
> >
> >I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
> >cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
> >expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
> >give up.
>
> There's a lot of that going around. I signed up for a Cook Woods
> catalog at a woodworking show about five years ago. I've received
> over an email a day from them since. Most days, now, I get three or
> four emails from them. I've never bought anything from them but email
> is "free".

Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:

>
>Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)

From lots of experience, not all the "opt out" or "unsubscribe"
options work - especially those that go to an error page...

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 12:58:22 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
> Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
> seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>
> I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
> cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
> expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
> give up.

I once had a subscription to Woodsmith magazine. Almost as soon as I got
my first issue I started getting emails from their "partners" offering me
all sorts of greats deals on books and plans. In order to take advantage of
the deals, all I had to do was *get a subscription to Woodsmith magazine*.

What? I called Woodsmith customer service and all they would tell me was
that I agreed to accept emails from their partners when I started the
subscription and that I could opt-out at any time. They didn't seem to
get the point that their "partners" were requiring me to sign up for a
subscription that I already had in order to take advantage of their offers.
"We don't control the terms of our partner's offers." WTF?

On 8/10/2019 11:26 PM, ads wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>
>>
>> Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)
>
> From lots of experience, not all the "opt out" or "unsubscribe"
> options work - especially those that go to an error page...
>

From lots of experience, about 98% work for me Silly not to try.

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 00:58:19 -0400, J. Clarke
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
>> >seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>> >
>> >I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
>> >cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
>> >expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
>> >give up.
>>
>> There's a lot of that going around. I signed up for a Cook Woods
>> catalog at a woodworking show about five years ago. I've received
>> over an email a day from them since. Most days, now, I get three or
>> four emails from them. I've never bought anything from them but email
>> is "free".
>
>Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)

No obvious way to do it and I certainly don't want to let them know
that I really exist!

The problem is that it costs them nothing to spam, once they have an
email address.

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 00:58:19 -0400, J. Clarke
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
>seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>
>I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
>cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
>expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
>give up.

There's a lot of that going around. I signed up for a Cook Woods
catalog at a woodworking show about five years ago. I've received
over an email a day from them since. Most days, now, I get three or
four emails from them. I've never bought anything from them but email
is "free".

On 8/10/2019 12:58 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
> Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
> seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>
> I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
> cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
> expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
> give up.
>

Could be worse. When my wife was on hospice care I wanted to make
arrangements for her so started to check out funeral homes and crematory
services. Made the mistake of giving information to one of them.

I instantly got an email, then a phone call, then two more emails and a
phone call at 8 PM on a Sunday night. That did not go over well. They
know it too!

Hope you never need them but if you do, Hospice people are fantastic and
helpful for the patient and family.

On Sunday, August 11, 2019 at 7:04:44 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
> >> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 00:58:19 -0400, J. Clarke
> >> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
> >> >seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
> >> >
> >> >I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
> >> >cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
> >> >expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
> >> >give up.
> >>
> >> There's a lot of that going around. I signed up for a Cook Woods
> >> catalog at a woodworking show about five years ago. I've received
> >> over an email a day from them since. Most days, now, I get three or
> >> four emails from them. I've never bought anything from them but email
> >> is "free".
> >
> >Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)
>
> I was wrong. There is an opt-out button. It's been a _long_ time
> since I've actually read one. It's right there at the bottom in very
> small type. We'll se if it works.

I was going to suggest that you "read the small print" but you apparently
already did.

Sometimes they hide the opt-out option by using "Change your email
preferences" or words to that effect.

Per the CAN-SPAM act of 2003, commercial email *must* include an opt-out
mechanism.

CAN-SPAM: Controlling the Assault of Non-Solicited Pornography and Marketing

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/can-spam-act-compliance-guide-business

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 17:54:26 -0400, ads wrote:

>On Fri, 9 Aug 2019 23:14:49 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 12:58:22 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
>>> Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
>>> seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>>>
>>> I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
>>> cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
>>> expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
>>> give up.
>>
>>I once had a subscription to Woodsmith magazine. Almost as soon as I got
>>my first issue I started getting emails from their "partners" offering me
>>all sorts of greats deals on books and plans. In order to take advantage of
>>the deals, all I had to do was *get a subscription to Woodsmith magazine*.
>>
>>What? I called Woodsmith customer service and all they would tell me was
>>that I agreed to accept emails from their partners when I started the
>>subscription and that I could opt-out at any time. They didn't seem to
>>get the point that their "partners" were requiring me to sign up for a
>>subscription that I already had in order to take advantage of their offers.
>>"We don't control the terms of our partner's offers." WTF?
>
>Sounds like the "partners" get kickbacks on the subsriptions they
>generate so your current subscription isn't valid because it doesn't
>get them anything. Some days I'd like to be so rich I can't count it,
>because then I'd buy some of the really annoying companies (and
>politicians - many are for sale) and take them out of the marketplace
>- some should be permanently removed. Not being able to do that kind
>of change, I vote with the $$$ I do have. Some brands I buy; some I
>don't (never owned a Crapsler product and never will - vehicles that
>won't go into Park or come out of cruise and the fan speed for the
>heater buried 2 or 3 pages deep in the 7 inch display?) I don't buy
>Apple products either. In the days of the Apple II, they sold
>thousands of those $2500 computers to schools. If they bought 5, they
>"gave" the school a free one. But those computers only cost them $500
>to manufacture. When they made $10,000 off sales for children's
>education, they effectively donated $500. Why not just sell the
>computers to the schools at helf price? They wouldn't have been seen
>as 'donating" and "helping education" - nor would that have made Jobs
>and Wozniak as many million$.
>Cynical? Yes, and I plan to stay that way.

I am reminded of the time one of my students came to me asking for
advice. Seems he had become aware that the state vocational/technical
schools had run into an issue with their CAD curriculum. The students
coming in couldn't run MS-DOS so much of the first Autocad course was
teaching them DOS. The decision was made to have an MS-DOS course
that was a prerequisite for the first AUTOCAD course. Fine so far.
But the state put the contract out for bids and somehow or other Apple
won. I wrote my state legislator about it and he came back with
assurances from his "expert" that a Mac was a fine machine for
teaching MS-DOS.

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 11:26:22 PM UTC-4, ads wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>
> >
> >Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)
>
> From lots of experience, not all the "opt out" or "unsubscribe"
> options work - especially those that go to an error page...

Thus the reason I always have a few throw-away email addresses.

I create/use them for that kind of stuff. They can always be changed if
really want the emails but want to dump the throw-away address.

No subscription or forum or on-line business ever gets my *real* email
address.

On Fri, 9 Aug 2019 23:14:49 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 12:58:22 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
>> Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
>> seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>>
>> I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
>> cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
>> expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
>> give up.
>
>I once had a subscription to Woodsmith magazine. Almost as soon as I got
>my first issue I started getting emails from their "partners" offering me
>all sorts of greats deals on books and plans. In order to take advantage of
>the deals, all I had to do was *get a subscription to Woodsmith magazine*.
>
>What? I called Woodsmith customer service and all they would tell me was
>that I agreed to accept emails from their partners when I started the
>subscription and that I could opt-out at any time. They didn't seem to
>get the point that their "partners" were requiring me to sign up for a
>subscription that I already had in order to take advantage of their offers.
>"We don't control the terms of our partner's offers." WTF?

Sounds like the "partners" get kickbacks on the subsriptions they
generate so your current subscription isn't valid because it doesn't
get them anything. Some days I'd like to be so rich I can't count it,
because then I'd buy some of the really annoying companies (and
politicians - many are for sale) and take them out of the marketplace
- some should be permanently removed. Not being able to do that kind
of change, I vote with the $$$ I do have. Some brands I buy; some I
don't (never owned a Crapsler product and never will - vehicles that
won't go into Park or come out of cruise and the fan speed for the
heater buried 2 or 3 pages deep in the 7 inch display?) I don't buy
Apple products either. In the days of the Apple II, they sold
thousands of those $2500 computers to schools. If they bought 5, they
"gave" the school a free one. But those computers only cost them $500
to manufacture. When they made $10,000 off sales for children's
education, they effectively donated $500. Why not just sell the
computers to the schools at helf price? They wouldn't have been seen
as 'donating" and "helping education" - nor would that have made Jobs
and Wozniak as many million$.
Cynical? Yes, and I plan to stay that way.

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 10:35:02 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 00:58:19 -0400, J. Clarke
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >Just a heads up--do _not_ register on the Felder site unless you're
>> >seriously interested in buying a saw _now_.
>> >
>> >I made the mistake of registering just to see what the blasted things
>> >cost, and I'm being bombarded with email, phone calls, etc. I'd have
>> >expected them to take the hint after a few months, but they just don't
>> >give up.
>>
>> There's a lot of that going around. I signed up for a Cook Woods
>> catalog at a woodworking show about five years ago. I've received
>> over an email a day from them since. Most days, now, I get three or
>> four emails from them. I've never bought anything from them but email
>> is "free".
>
>Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)

I was wrong. There is an opt-out button. It's been a _long_ time
since I've actually read one. It's right there at the bottom in very
small type. We'll se if it works.

On 8/11/2019 7:00 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 19:47:52 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
>
>> Have you considered opting out or do you like to feel popular? ;-)
>
> No obvious way to do it and I certainly don't want to let them know
> that I really exist!
>
> The problem is that it costs them nothing to spam, once they have an
> email address.

I filter all my mail. Stuff I don't want goes to a kill file. Ads I
might want get moved to an AD folder. I wrote an app that goes though
Thunderbird's kill log and neatly lists whats in the trash from my kill
file, in case there is something I want. I delete the trash messages
once a month. I keep ads from HD, HF, Rockler, and a few others in the
AD folder. I peruse them occasionally and read what looks interesting
then delete them wholesale.

This also costs me nothing, and actually makes it a bit interesting for
me. I bought one shirt from King Size Direct about 10 years ago and
they send me an ad at least every day ever since. Woot, FineWoodworking,
Fine Cooking and a host of others are relentless. Gives my computer
something to do, gives me a bit of entertainment.

--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.