There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
dave
Hi Mike,
I would still get the razee style for the jack plane. When using it, you're
taking off a bit more (potentially a lot more) material than with the
smoother. I find it easier to get momentum in the stroke, while applying
downforce with my left hand, as I move through the planing motion. With the
tote on the razee jack, I get very little hand fatigue and it just feels
more natural to me. When using the smoother for more than maybe 20 minutes
at a shot, my right hand seems to get a little cramped. Maybe I'm holding
it wrong or something, but I don't think so. I have pretty big hands, too,
so it isn't as if I am straining my hands to hold the plane. Even so, I
don't find the coffin plane difficult to use at all. The handle on the jack
just gives me a sense of more control.
Mike
--
There are no stupid questions.
There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.
"Mike in Idaho" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thanks Mike, that's starting to answer some questions. I just have one
more
> for ya:
>
> Having used the coffin smoother (non-razee style) and the jack (razee
style)
> if you were to purchase the jack again, would you go with the razee style
or
> the non-razee style? And why.
>
> Thanks a million,
> Mike
>
> "Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Hi Mike,
> >
> > No problem about the questions, glad to help if I can.
>
>
Thanks Mike, that's starting to answer some questions. I just have one more
for ya:
Having used the coffin smoother (non-razee style) and the jack (razee style)
if you were to purchase the jack again, would you go with the razee style or
the non-razee style? And why.
Thanks a million,
Mike
"Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Mike,
>
> No problem about the questions, glad to help if I can.
It's one of the two things that determine whether you get shavings or dust
for your efforts. You'd rather shavings, which means the combination of
close gap and chipbreaker on a bevel down, gap only on bevel up like the L-A
planes. Veritas L-A smoother, though not as pretty as the LN, seems a good
buy.
I've the LN, and it will do nice work on straight to gnarly, soft to hard.
Kids up at school who made dulcimers used it to smooth their soundboards,
and it didn't tear even in spruce, which is saying something.
Been to http://www.amgron.clara.net/ for the basic course? Gotta put in
some effort, as always.
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
> mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
> problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
> you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
> lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>
> dave
>
Bay Area Dave <[email protected]> schreef
the fit of the adjustable part is so precise ... for the low angle smoother
+ + +
... and now for the Veritas bench planes with a movable frog (including part
of the sole, as well as the handle). A different mechanism. Looks weird, but
makes sense provided the machining is done right. Still, having not one but
two openings in the sole at right angles to the direction of motion looks
unsettling.
PvR
Dave,
I have one of these and have been very happy with it.
The front part of the sole, which is moved to adjust the mouth,
fits very precisely. It is machined to fit into a machined
surface in the casting so that there should be no slop in the
fit when adjusting the mouth. Think of it as a large adjustable
mouth block plane with a tote and knob.
Ted
Bay Area Dave <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
> mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
> problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
> you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
> lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>
> dave
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 15:57:14 GMT, Bay Area Dave <[email protected]>
wrote:
> an adjustable
>mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
>problematic, since it's a movable component?
Not if you make it right.
--
Die Gotterspammerung - Junkmail of the Gods
Steve,
Do you know anyone that owns both the razee style and the regular style of
any of your planes? It would be interesting to get their feedback on the
usage differences. I've been in a bit of a quandry as to which style I
should be purchasing. I definitely like the look of the regular style
better, but since functionality is kind of important (ok, so it's really
important), then knowing which is preferred would be beneficial. Of course,
the problem with that is, if you only have a small set of people who fit
that criteria (if any at all), then how do you know it applies to everyone
(since preferrences tend to be extremely personal anyway). Ok, I'm rambling
now...
Thanks,
Mike
"Steve Knight" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 20:55:11 GMT, "Mike in Idaho" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Perfect. That was just the kind of information I was looking for. I
find
> >the same thing with the smoother, I wasn't sure if it was just me. But
I'll
> >be sure to get the razee style when I order my jack.
>
> So it sounds like a wide coffin is a good thing. I have been making the
sides
> thicker so they are wider now.
> it's feedback like that really helps me out.
>
> --
> Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
> Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
> See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.
Perfect. That was just the kind of information I was looking for. I find
the same thing with the smoother, I wasn't sure if it was just me. But I'll
be sure to get the razee style when I order my jack.
Thanks,
Mike
"Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Mike,
>
> I would still get the razee style for the jack plane. When using it,
you're
> taking off a bit more (potentially a lot more) material than with the
> smoother. I find it easier to get momentum in the stroke, while applying
> downforce with my left hand, as I move through the planing motion. With
the
> tote on the razee jack, I get very little hand fatigue and it just feels
> more natural to me. When using the smoother for more than maybe 20
minutes
> at a shot, my right hand seems to get a little cramped. Maybe I'm holding
> it wrong or something, but I don't think so. I have pretty big hands,
too,
> so it isn't as if I am straining my hands to hold the plane. Even so, I
> don't find the coffin plane difficult to use at all. The handle on the
jack
> just gives me a sense of more control.
>
> Mike
>
Now that is a most EXCELLENT website, George. (bowing and scraping...)
I book marked that one as a keeper. Read a bit of it just now and will
read the planing section completely a bit later. tanks!
dave
George wrote:
> It's one of the two things that determine whether you get shavings or dust
> for your efforts. You'd rather shavings, which means the combination of
> close gap and chipbreaker on a bevel down, gap only on bevel up like the L-A
> planes. Veritas L-A smoother, though not as pretty as the LN, seems a good
> buy.
>
> I've the LN, and it will do nice work on straight to gnarly, soft to hard.
> Kids up at school who made dulcimers used it to smooth their soundboards,
> and it didn't tear even in spruce, which is saying something.
>
> Been to http://www.amgron.clara.net/ for the basic course? Gotta put in
> some effort, as always.
>
> "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
>>mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
>>problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
>>you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
>>lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>>
>>dave
>>
>
>
>
Hi Mike,
No problem about the questions, glad to help if I can.
"Mike in Idaho" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Mike,
>
> I also have the knight coffin and my scrub should be here by Christmas :)
>
> I noticed you got the razee jack plane from Steve -- I've been bouncing
back
> and forth over whether I should get the razee style or not. What have you
> thought about the razee vs the standard style of Steve's planes? I
realize
> the planes are different types, but if you've got a sec, I'd love some
info
> on things like:
>
> 1) Hand fatigue after planing for awhile
I haven't used it for hours at a time or anything, but I haven't had any
problems in this regard at all. It's no different than the other "standard"
type bench planes I've used.
> 2) Control of the plane
This is a little difficult to describe, but it isn't a problem at all,
either. Basically, if you have a handle no using the coffin smoother than
you'll have no problem with this. "steering" is a little different IMO than
the knob-type planes, but it's mainly getting used to the feeling of holding
it that way. After that, it hasn't been an issue, and wasn't really a big
deal anyway.
> 3) Pressure required to work the plane
Not any different than the #5 Stanley I use.
> 4) Any other Pros and Cons
I find that the Knight jack plane works extremely well. I haven't gotten
the knack down for rapidly changing blade depth without a few iterations,
though, so I still use the iron planes a lot, too. It's just "feels" great
when you're using it. As far as overall performance, I'd say Steve's plane
tends to leave a better surface than the other planes. In some cases it was
almost as smooth as the coffin smoother when I planed some stock that wasn't
really too rough to begin with.
>
> Thanks (I realize I've asked a lot, but it would really be helpful for me
:)
>
> Mike "in Idaho"
>
> "Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Hi Dave,
> >
> > I don't have the smoother, but I do have the low angle block plane,
which
> > also has an adjustable mouth. It isn't a gimmick at all, and makes
> > adjusting the plane very easy. I'm no plane expert, but I've gotten bit
> by
> > the bug and have only in the last few months purchased a Clifton #6 (on
> sale
> > at Woodcraft, too good a deal to pass up) and a load of eBay Stanley's
(a
> > #3, 2 #4's, #5, #5 1/4 and a #7). I also have a Knight coffin smoother
> and
> > Knight razee jack plane. I'm also getting the Veritas scraper plane for
> > Christmas, DAMHIKT :).
> >
> > Anyway, my point is, on the bedrock style planes, you have to set the
frog
> > properly to fully set the mouth width. Again, I might not be using the
> > correct terminology here, but hopefully you'll see what I'm saying.
When
> > you adjust the iron to the depth you want, if the mouth opening isn't
the
> > way you want, then you have to readjust the frog - which isn't hard, but
> > it's just one more thing to do. On the Veritas block plane I have, you
> just
> > open the mouth all the way, set the blade depth how you want, then move
> the
> > mouth to the opening you want. It's a great thing, really.
> >
> > Mike
> >
>
>
Hi Dave,
I don't have the smoother, but I do have the low angle block plane, which
also has an adjustable mouth. It isn't a gimmick at all, and makes
adjusting the plane very easy. I'm no plane expert, but I've gotten bit by
the bug and have only in the last few months purchased a Clifton #6 (on sale
at Woodcraft, too good a deal to pass up) and a load of eBay Stanley's (a
#3, 2 #4's, #5, #5 1/4 and a #7). I also have a Knight coffin smoother and
Knight razee jack plane. I'm also getting the Veritas scraper plane for
Christmas, DAMHIKT :).
Anyway, my point is, on the bedrock style planes, you have to set the frog
properly to fully set the mouth width. Again, I might not be using the
correct terminology here, but hopefully you'll see what I'm saying. When
you adjust the iron to the depth you want, if the mouth opening isn't the
way you want, then you have to readjust the frog - which isn't hard, but
it's just one more thing to do. On the Veritas block plane I have, you just
open the mouth all the way, set the blade depth how you want, then move the
mouth to the opening you want. It's a great thing, really.
Mike
--
There are no stupid questions.
There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
> mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
> problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
> you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
> lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>
> dave
>
Hi Mike,
I also have the knight coffin and my scrub should be here by Christmas :)
I noticed you got the razee jack plane from Steve -- I've been bouncing back
and forth over whether I should get the razee style or not. What have you
thought about the razee vs the standard style of Steve's planes? I realize
the planes are different types, but if you've got a sec, I'd love some info
on things like:
1) Hand fatigue after planing for awhile
2) Control of the plane
3) Pressure required to work the plane
4) Any other Pros and Cons
Thanks (I realize I've asked a lot, but it would really be helpful for me :)
Mike "in Idaho"
"Mike in Mystic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Dave,
>
> I don't have the smoother, but I do have the low angle block plane, which
> also has an adjustable mouth. It isn't a gimmick at all, and makes
> adjusting the plane very easy. I'm no plane expert, but I've gotten bit
by
> the bug and have only in the last few months purchased a Clifton #6 (on
sale
> at Woodcraft, too good a deal to pass up) and a load of eBay Stanley's (a
> #3, 2 #4's, #5, #5 1/4 and a #7). I also have a Knight coffin smoother
and
> Knight razee jack plane. I'm also getting the Veritas scraper plane for
> Christmas, DAMHIKT :).
>
> Anyway, my point is, on the bedrock style planes, you have to set the frog
> properly to fully set the mouth width. Again, I might not be using the
> correct terminology here, but hopefully you'll see what I'm saying. When
> you adjust the iron to the depth you want, if the mouth opening isn't the
> way you want, then you have to readjust the frog - which isn't hard, but
> it's just one more thing to do. On the Veritas block plane I have, you
just
> open the mouth all the way, set the blade depth how you want, then move
the
> mouth to the opening you want. It's a great thing, really.
>
> Mike
>
cool. thanks, Ted. You are the 3rd person who's said that the fit of
the adjustable part is so precise, that I shouldn't be concerned about
the additional "complexity". I just went on the LV web site and found
that the prices have gone up quite a bit since those found in the
2002/2003 catalog. ($159 now for the low angle smoother) That's what I
get for being tardy! :)
dave
Ted Shuck wrote:
> Dave,
>
> I have one of these and have been very happy with it.
> The front part of the sole, which is moved to adjust the mouth,
> fits very precisely. It is machined to fit into a machined
> surface in the casting so that there should be no slop in the
> fit when adjusting the mouth. Think of it as a large adjustable
> mouth block plane with a tote and knob.
>
> Ted
>
> Bay Area Dave <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>
>>There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
>>mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
>>problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
>>you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
>>lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>>
>>dave
His best shot (picture) may be from behind but don't him fool ya; he
knows more than any 10 people I know put together. His planes are not
tools but works of art. Plus they work!
Fri, 07 Nov 2003 17:52:55 GMT, Steve Knight
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Do you know anyone that owns both the razee style and the regular style of
>>any of your planes? It would be interesting to get their feedback on the
>>usage differences. I've been in a bit of a quandry as to which style I
>>should be purchasing. I definitely like the look of the regular style
>>better, but since functionality is kind of important (ok, so it's really
>>important), then knowing which is preferred would be beneficial. Of course,
>>the problem with that is, if you only have a small set of people who fit
>>that criteria (if any at all), then how do you know it applies to everyone
>>(since preferrences tend to be extremely personal anyway). Ok, I'm rambling
>>now...
>
> I think it matters more how you use the plane. without a tote you can hold the
>plane in a lot of different ways. the bench does not have to be at the right
>height and you can push or pull it. with a tote you can have more leverage as a
>jack will need.
>but I am no expert planer really as anymore all I make is planes (G) and I never
>worked like other people do.
On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 20:55:11 GMT, "Mike in Idaho" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Perfect. That was just the kind of information I was looking for. I find
>the same thing with the smoother, I wasn't sure if it was just me. But I'll
>be sure to get the razee style when I order my jack.
So it sounds like a wide coffin is a good thing. I have been making the sides
thicker so they are wider now.
it's feedback like that really helps me out.
--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.
Hi Dave,
To clarify, I have the low-angle block plane, NOT the low-angle smoothing
plane.
By the way, you can probably get all the information about their planes at
the website rather than waiting for the catalog. The prices have gone up,
too, just FYI.
Mike
--
There are no stupid questions.
There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.
"Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Mike,
>
> So the one you have is the $139 Veritas with a 2" blade? After speaking
> with a rep at Lee Valley we decided I should get a newer catalog before
> ordering, as there is info on the planes in the new cat that's not in
> the one I have. I WAS gonna get the little $89 plane, but maybe I'd be
> better off with the larger one. I want to be able to use a shooting
> board to trim the length of a board "just so". I figure the smaller
> plane won't be able to accommodate much width in that configuration.
>
> Sounds like you've got a boatload of planes! You can weigh your bench
> down with those! :)
>
> I'm probably gonna get their burnisher and set of scrapers, oh and a
> honing guide. Where does it end? Some much stuff needed to keep
> Neander tools sharp.
>
> Mike in Mystic wrote:
>
> > Hi Dave,
> >
> > I don't have the smoother, but I do have the low angle block plane,
which
> > also has an adjustable mouth. It isn't a gimmick at all, and makes
> > adjusting the plane very easy. I'm no plane expert, but I've gotten bit
by
> > the bug and have only in the last few months purchased a Clifton #6 (on
sale
> > at Woodcraft, too good a deal to pass up) and a load of eBay Stanley's
(a
> > #3, 2 #4's, #5, #5 1/4 and a #7). I also have a Knight coffin smoother
and
> > Knight razee jack plane. I'm also getting the Veritas scraper plane for
> > Christmas, DAMHIKT :).
> >
> > Anyway, my point is, on the bedrock style planes, you have to set the
frog
> > properly to fully set the mouth width. Again, I might not be using the
> > correct terminology here, but hopefully you'll see what I'm saying.
When
> > you adjust the iron to the depth you want, if the mouth opening isn't
the
> > way you want, then you have to readjust the frog - which isn't hard, but
> > it's just one more thing to do. On the Veritas block plane I have, you
just
> > open the mouth all the way, set the blade depth how you want, then move
the
> > mouth to the opening you want. It's a great thing, really.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > There are no stupid questions.
> > There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.
> >
> >
> > "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
> >>mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
> >>problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
> >>you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
> >>lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
> >>
> >>dave
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
>Do you know anyone that owns both the razee style and the regular style of
>any of your planes? It would be interesting to get their feedback on the
>usage differences. I've been in a bit of a quandry as to which style I
>should be purchasing. I definitely like the look of the regular style
>better, but since functionality is kind of important (ok, so it's really
>important), then knowing which is preferred would be beneficial. Of course,
>the problem with that is, if you only have a small set of people who fit
>that criteria (if any at all), then how do you know it applies to everyone
>(since preferrences tend to be extremely personal anyway). Ok, I'm rambling
>now...
I think it matters more how you use the plane. without a tote you can hold the
plane in a lot of different ways. the bench does not have to be at the right
height and you can push or pull it. with a tote you can have more leverage as a
jack will need.
but I am no expert planer really as anymore all I make is planes (G) and I never
worked like other people do.
Hi Mike,
So the one you have is the $139 Veritas with a 2" blade? After speaking
with a rep at Lee Valley we decided I should get a newer catalog before
ordering, as there is info on the planes in the new cat that's not in
the one I have. I WAS gonna get the little $89 plane, but maybe I'd be
better off with the larger one. I want to be able to use a shooting
board to trim the length of a board "just so". I figure the smaller
plane won't be able to accommodate much width in that configuration.
Sounds like you've got a boatload of planes! You can weigh your bench
down with those! :)
I'm probably gonna get their burnisher and set of scrapers, oh and a
honing guide. Where does it end? Some much stuff needed to keep
Neander tools sharp.
Mike in Mystic wrote:
> Hi Dave,
>
> I don't have the smoother, but I do have the low angle block plane, which
> also has an adjustable mouth. It isn't a gimmick at all, and makes
> adjusting the plane very easy. I'm no plane expert, but I've gotten bit by
> the bug and have only in the last few months purchased a Clifton #6 (on sale
> at Woodcraft, too good a deal to pass up) and a load of eBay Stanley's (a
> #3, 2 #4's, #5, #5 1/4 and a #7). I also have a Knight coffin smoother and
> Knight razee jack plane. I'm also getting the Veritas scraper plane for
> Christmas, DAMHIKT :).
>
> Anyway, my point is, on the bedrock style planes, you have to set the frog
> properly to fully set the mouth width. Again, I might not be using the
> correct terminology here, but hopefully you'll see what I'm saying. When
> you adjust the iron to the depth you want, if the mouth opening isn't the
> way you want, then you have to readjust the frog - which isn't hard, but
> it's just one more thing to do. On the Veritas block plane I have, you just
> open the mouth all the way, set the blade depth how you want, then move the
> mouth to the opening you want. It's a great thing, really.
>
> Mike
>
>
> --
>
> There are no stupid questions.
> There are a LOT of inquisitive idiots.
>
>
> "Bay Area Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>There is a low angle smoother, 05P25.01 ($139) that has an adjustable
>>mouth. Is that a gimmick that causes the bottom surface to be
>>problematic, since it's a movable component? If you have one, what do
>>you think of it? Is the fit of the movable part so good, that when
>>lapped, the sole is still flat after adjusting the mouth width?
>>
>>dave
>>
>
>
>