On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 16:45:12 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>Larry Blanchard wrote:
>
>> Sparky wrote:
>>
>>
>>>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>>
>>
>> I'd get the planer. With a sled and some wedges, you can flatten the first
>> face on a planer. Not very efficient use of time, but it does work.
>>
>> But a jointer cannot, unless there's some magical jig I don't know about, do
>> the work of a planer and make one face parallel to the other.
>>
>Thanks for all the input. I believe the planer will be first then the
>jointer next year. Thanks again.
Or, if you have an extra $1,800 laying around:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/g0633
mac
Please remove splinters before emailing
On Jul 25, 2:20?pm, Jim Behning
<[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
> >A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> >you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>
> I got a combi unit. I don't know if you can get one in the US anymore
> though. Mine was a Makita planer and jointer. Not a helpful answer.
>
> I would choose a planer first. I can get a straight edge on a board
> with a hand plane to rough in and a table saw. Or a router and
> straight edge.
Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
approach?
FoggyTown
On Jul 25, 8:24 am, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
Jointer. Probably.
You can plane rough lumber with a planer and, if you're lucky enough
to start with a straight and flat rough board, or tolerant enough to
accept a planed board that is less than perfectly straight and flat,
you can get acceptable results. Proper procedures, however, require
that you joint (surface plane) your stock before planing (thickness
planing).
It really depends on what kind of work you're doing, though, and with
what woods.
I recently made up some pine boxes. Started with 1 x 12" #4 Eastern
White Pine, sold S3S for board and batten siding. It was relatively
cheap at .70/foot, and was about the only 1" kiln dried stock the mill
had that hadn't been planed to 3/4" - I like to get a bit heavier than
that if I can. Planed the rough side to about 13/16"+. The planing
didn't take out the cupping that some boards had, but joining the
corners took care of it. And, they weren't too fussy. Had I been
doing a different project with different joining methods, using maple
or another hardwood, I wouldn't have been happy without jointing
first.
That said, you'll still find yourself using some hand methods or
shortcuts, because you are probably looking at a maximum of an 8"
jointer, and there will be times you'll want to use boards that are at
the capacity of your most likely planer size - 12" or 15".
On the other hand, if you see yourself doing mostly rough work using
lumber bought unplaned, I'd definitely recommend the planer first.
Eventually, you'll want both.
John Martin
On Jul 25, 6:30?pm, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> FoggyTown wrote:
>
> > Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
> > reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
> > times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
> > approach?
>
> Don't you want parallel faces?
Sure I do! But the issue turns on a a question of scale. What degree
of tapering and on what size stock? If I'm 1/32nd out on a 6' x 6" x
1" plank I'm not going to get too fussed. If I'm 1/16th out on a 12"
X 2" x 1/2" board then there could be a problem. The tolerances for a
king sized bed aren't the same as for a jewelry box.
FoggyTown
Leuf wrote:
>
> But on a planer with the cutter on top you can get shavings that sit
> on top of the board and then get pressed into it by the outfeed
> roller. With a jointer the shavings are all underneath, and on my Jet
> just slide down the chute into a box.
>
Whereas my DW735 Planer has a 1-Million CFM exhaust fan built in that
can shoot shavings down the driveway and into the street if I don't
connect something to it. Only did that once. :-)
--Steve
Doug Miller wrote:
> In article <ABLpi.11881$zy4.234@trndny07>, Nova <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Sparky wrote:
>>
>>>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>>
>>I'd go with the planer. You can always have the lumber yard surface one
>>face and join one edge until you get your own jointer.
>>
>
> Except that IME most lumberyards don't have jointers.
>
I have never dealt with a lumber yard (not home/building supply center)
that didn't have one.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
These are very different tools. It depends on the projects you want
to build. I use my jointer with my table saw, and need that more than
a thickness planer. One is not a substitute for the other.
"samson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
> says...
>> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any
>> suggestions.
>>
>
> Joiner. Many, many more uses for a joiner.
>
> S.
Yeah that was helpful. And he is asking about a joinTer not a joiner.
On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
I got a combi unit. I don't know if you can get one in the US anymore
though. Mine was a Makita planer and jointer. Not a helpful answer.
I would choose a planer first. I can get a straight edge on a board
with a hand plane to rough in and a table saw. Or a router and
straight edge.
Sparky wrote:
> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
I'd go with the planer. You can always have the lumber yard surface one
face and join one edge until you get your own jointer.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
Mike O. wrote:
>
> Which ever you buy, there will be times you will want the other.
> If you buy quality material from a good supplier you may not need
> either very often.
Having ANY thickness of material available on the spot has nothing to do
with the quality of the stock.
A planer makes virtually any thickness of hardwood stock available. For
instance: 5/32" blade splitters, 1/4" box dividers, 3/8" sled runners,
1/2" drawer sides. Built up moldings can take on new dimensions by
changing the thickness of the layers before edge forming.
Lots of artistic leeway is provided when we can have stock of any
thickness we want.
In article <[email protected]>, Steve <[email protected]> wrote:
>Leuf wrote:
>>
>> But on a planer with the cutter on top you can get shavings that sit
>> on top of the board and then get pressed into it by the outfeed
>> roller. With a jointer the shavings are all underneath, and on my Jet
>> just slide down the chute into a box.
>>
>Whereas my DW735 Planer has a 1-Million CFM exhaust fan built in that
>can shoot shavings down the driveway and into the street if I don't
>connect something to it. Only did that once. :-)
I only did it once, too. You came out of it better than I did, though. My
shop's in the house, in the basement. :-b
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
"FoggyTown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Jul 25, 2:20?pm, Jim Behning
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>> >you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any
>> >suggestions.
>>
>> I got a combi unit. I don't know if you can get one in the US anymore
>> though. Mine was a Makita planer and jointer. Not a helpful answer.
>>
>> I would choose a planer first. I can get a straight edge on a board
>> with a hand plane to rough in and a table saw. Or a router and
>> straight edge.
>
> Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
> reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
> times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
> approach?
Yes, you have no reference to insure uniform thickness. Not totally unlike
ripping a board on a TS with out a rip fence. It can be done but not
consistently accurately.
In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
says...
> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>
Joiner. Many, many more uses for a joiner.
S.
Sparky wrote:
> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>
>> Sparky wrote:
>>
>>
>>> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any
>>> suggestions.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'd get the planer. With a sled and some wedges, you can flatten the
>> first
>> face on a planer. Not very efficient use of time, but it does work.
>>
>> But a jointer cannot, unless there's some magical jig I don't know
>> about, do
>> the work of a planer and make one face parallel to the other.
>>
> Thanks for all the input. I believe the planer will be first then the
> jointer next year. Thanks again.
Sparky, good choice. Perhaps even rethink buying the jointer. My TS with
a Forrest blade WWII gives me a clean enough edge that I haven't use my
jointer for several years.It has worked for several table tops.
In article <[email protected]>, FoggyTown <[email protected]> wrote:
>Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
>reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
>times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
>approach?
Yep. You don't have any reference surface to ensure that opposite faces remain
parallel to each other -- you're almost guaranteed to taper the board in at
least one dimension.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
Sparky wrote:
> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
I'd get the planer. With a sled and some wedges, you can flatten the first
face on a planer. Not very efficient use of time, but it does work.
But a jointer cannot, unless there's some magical jig I don't know about, do
the work of a planer and make one face parallel to the other.
--
It's turtles, all the way down
Sparky wrote:
> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
As you see, you get a difference of opinion...
I'll go along w/ both w/ "depends"... :)
On what your work habits are and what your more pressing need is.
They are, imo, complementary and for the work I do and the stock I use,
I wouldn't want to be without either.
_But_, if I were forced to choose one only, I would probably take the
jointer initially. I say that based on the fact that was the way I
started and I did get along. That time was, of course, long before the
day of the large router and I didn't have a tablesaw but a RAS at the
time so edges were more problematical other than all neanderthal...
On the "jointing" by planer, I suppose one can manage w/ enough
gyrations and jigs, etc., but isn't very effective imo. The planer feed
rolls will mash anything thin flat as it goes through, so unless the
board is flat but just two faces out of parallel, it won't help much on
getting an initial surface. It's possible to shim and all, but far more
work. Again, this is tempered by having an old "heavy iron" planer, not
one of the modern lightweight guys -- it may be their roller pressure
isn't so likely for a larger class of stock, I don't know.
--
In article <[email protected]>, Leuf <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>But on a planer with the cutter on top you can get shavings that sit
>on top of the board and then get pressed into it by the outfeed
>roller. With a jointer the shavings are all underneath, and on my Jet
>just slide down the chute into a box.
That's a good point; I'd kinda forgotten about that. Guess I've gotten spoiled
with the fan-forced chip ejection on my DW735 -- that's a *nice* feature.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
"Sparky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would you
>buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
Planer
On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
Which ever you buy, there will be times you will want the other.
If you buy quality material from a good supplier you may not need
either very often.
Mike O.
In article <[email protected]>, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
>Doug Miller wrote:
>>
>> Except that IME most lumberyards don't have jointers.
>>
>
>My mistake. Lumber DEALER.
>
>All three of mine have jointers. BIG ones. <G>
I wish the ones around me did, or even knew what it is... I'm tired of hearing
"Huh?? Joint-ner? Whazzat fer?"
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
In article <[email protected]>, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
If I could buy only one, it would be the planer:
- with proper jigs and fixtures, you can face-joint on a planer
- with proper jigs and fixtures, you can edge-joint on a table saw
- ain't no way you can thickness-plane anything on a jointer.
If you can buy both, do so.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>>>>Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
>>>>reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
>>>>times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
>>>>approach?
>>>
>>> Yep. You don't have any reference surface to ensure that opposite faces
>>> remain
>>> parallel to each other -- you're almost guaranteed to taper the board in
>>> at
>>> least one dimension.
>>>
>>Except your scribe line, just as you would use to hand plane. No problem.
>
> Have you ever actually done that? Seems to me that it would be awfully
> hard to
> see the scribe line, what with the blade guard on the side toward you, and
> the
> fence on the side away.
>
Yes, I have, and the line is as visible as the one on the opposite edge of
the board I'm hand planing.
Nova wrote:
>
> I'd go with the planer. You can always have the lumber yard surface one
> face and join one edge until you get your own jointer.
Same here. Let the dealer provide at leas one straight edge and face,
finish it in the shop with the planer and table saw. A good glue line
rip blade can create boards ready for edge gluing right off the saw.
That said, a jointer is a very necessary tool to have, too.
"Sparky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would you
>buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
Not the answer you're looking for but if I had to do it all over my first
buy would have been a good radial arm saw. No, not the Craftsman but
something like a heavy duty Delta or DeWalt. If you have the right
attachments, you could do most everything including crosscut, rip, plan,
sand, mold, etc.
In article <ABLpi.11881$zy4.234@trndny07>, Nova <[email protected]> wrote:
>Sparky wrote:
>> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>
>I'd go with the planer. You can always have the lumber yard surface one
>face and join one edge until you get your own jointer.
>
Except that IME most lumberyards don't have jointers.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
In article <[email protected]>, Leuf <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>
>Just one other thing to mention, do you have a good dust collector?
>Because a planer pretty much requires one, whereas a jointer doesn't,
>or at least mine doesn't.
Shavings is shavings -- jointers don't produce as much as planers do because
they're not used to remove as much wood as planers (usually) are. Coupla light
passes through a planer doesn't produce a real big pile of shavings either. I
guess what I'm saying is that it's really dependent more on usage than on the
tool.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
Just one other thing to mention, do you have a good dust collector?
Because a planer pretty much requires one, whereas a jointer doesn't,
or at least mine doesn't. Or use the planer outside. I have a drum
sander which isn't so great at removing a lot of material, but I can
either resaw the board or use other means to get it close and then get
it flat on the sander.
-Leuf
On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 20:04:34 GMT, [email protected] (Doug Miller)
wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>, Leuf <[email protected]> wrote:
>>On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>>
>>Just one other thing to mention, do you have a good dust collector?
>>Because a planer pretty much requires one, whereas a jointer doesn't,
>>or at least mine doesn't.
>
>Shavings is shavings -- jointers don't produce as much as planers do because
>they're not used to remove as much wood as planers (usually) are. Coupla light
>passes through a planer doesn't produce a real big pile of shavings either. I
>guess what I'm saying is that it's really dependent more on usage than on the
>tool.
But on a planer with the cutter on top you can get shavings that sit
on top of the board and then get pressed into it by the outfeed
roller. With a jointer the shavings are all underneath, and on my Jet
just slide down the chute into a box.
-Leuf
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> FoggyTown <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
>>reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
>>times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
>>approach?
>
> Yep. You don't have any reference surface to ensure that opposite faces
> remain
> parallel to each other -- you're almost guaranteed to taper the board in
> at
> least one dimension.
>
Except your scribe line, just as you would use to hand plane. No problem.
Matter of fact, you can also plan your work as the old boys who had nothing
in the way of power tools to work with, and make precise thickness
unnecessary.
If you buy unplaned lumber, planer's a good choice, given the easier
workarounds for edging. Otherwise your board width is limited, for
practical purposes, to the width of your jointer knives.
FoggyTown wrote:
> On Jul 25, 2:20?pm, Jim Behning
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 06:24:11 -0600, Sparky <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what
>>> would
>>> you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any
>>> suggestions.
>>
>> I got a combi unit. I don't know if you can get one in the US
>> anymore though. Mine was a Makita planer and jointer. Not a
>> helpful answer.
>>
>> I would choose a planer first. I can get a straight edge on a board
>> with a hand plane to rough in and a table saw. Or a router and
>> straight edge.
>
> Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
> reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
> times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
> approach?
Not if the two surfaces wind up parallel. They often don't.
--
dadiOH
____________________________
dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
FoggyTown wrote:
> If I'm 1/32nd out on a 6' x 6" x
> 1" plank I'm not going to get too fussed.
If you can use a jointer (machine) to plane two parallel surfaces to
within 1/32" over 6'', you are extremely talented, and lucky.
I doubt many who are considering which machine to purchase first could
come close.
Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Sparky wrote:
>
>
>>A question to the group. Given a choice to buy a new tool, what would
>>you buy first, a jointer or a thickness planer? Thanks for any suggestions.
>
>
> I'd get the planer. With a sled and some wedges, you can flatten the first
> face on a planer. Not very efficient use of time, but it does work.
>
> But a jointer cannot, unless there's some magical jig I don't know about, do
> the work of a planer and make one face parallel to the other.
>
Thanks for all the input. I believe the planer will be first then the
jointer next year. Thanks again.
In article <[email protected]>, "George" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> FoggyTown <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>Admittedly I have never felt the need for a planer. But if I had to
>>>reduce stock from, say, 3/4" to 1/2" I would just run it a number of
>>>times over my jointer until I got there. Anything wrong with that
>>>approach?
>>
>> Yep. You don't have any reference surface to ensure that opposite faces remain
>> parallel to each other -- you're almost guaranteed to taper the board in at
>> least one dimension.
>>
>Except your scribe line, just as you would use to hand plane. No problem.
Have you ever actually done that? Seems to me that it would be awfully hard to
see the scribe line, what with the blade guard on the side toward you, and the
fence on the side away.
>Matter of fact, you can also plan your work as the old boys who had nothing
>in the way of power tools to work with, and make precise thickness
>unnecessary.
Yes, of course you can. You can also get to the grocery store in a horse and
buggy, too, and some folks still do.
>If you buy unplaned lumber, planer's a good choice, given the easier
>workarounds for edging. Otherwise your board width is limited, for
>practical purposes, to the width of your jointer knives.
Not really -- rip with a bandsaw, joint, glue up. Not perfect, of course, but
some would prefer that, to jointing and planing a 15"-wide board by hand.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.