Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
Larry
On Sep 13, 5:07=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> >>> The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> >>> of wood from flying backwards.
> >> Are you sure about that? =A0(not trying to be argumentative, here)
>
> >> I have a decent Delta 6" and I can slide a piece of wood forwards and
> >> back against that smooth paint job, without much effort at all.
>
> >> To my knowledge the spring only exerts the minimal amount of force
> >> required to keep the chop over the blades and not impede the progress =
of
> >> the wood.
>
> > If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>
> Not buying it, sorry. =A0 :-)
>
> All the cutter guards I've seen have a very smoothly painted surface and
> are very easy to move.
>
> Is this adjustment and/or purpose described in any jointer manual you
> know?
>
> Again, I'm not busting your balls.
> Maybe the higher end planers have the feature and I just haven't seen it.
>
> --
>
> =A0 -MIKE-
>
> =A0 "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> =A0 =A0 =A0--Elvin Jones =A0(1927-2004)
> =A0 --
> =A0http://mikedrums.com
> =A0 [email protected]
> =A0 ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
On Sep 13, 6:06=A0pm, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
> ...
>
> > Next time you edge joint a board...try to pull it back towards
> > you...assuming you have a porkchop style guard.
>
> It'll just slide--the edges are smooth and the spring isn't strong
> enough. =A0They're a knives guard and that's it.
>
> If you can find any manufacturer in any user manual or safety
> documentation make any representation otherwise, I'll color meself more
> than surprised.
>
> I just did a global search on the words guard and kickback in the Delta
> manual I posted a link to earlier and there's a lot of references to
> using push sticks and so on to guard against kickback but nary a word
> that indicates the cutterhead guard has any role other than its function
> by name.
>
> Again, any semblance to being effective in an actual kickback event
> (which I've never experienced in 40+ years on a jointer) is a fignewton
> of your imagination... =A0:)
>
> --
I'll spare you a smart-ass reply but try this:
One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence.
Should.
It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
On Sep 13, 9:36=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
> > One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
> > guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
> > Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
> > table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
> > It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
>
> Did it, the first time I replied, and it doesn't hold a bit.
>
> With all do respect (because from your posts you obviously know your
> stuff) I think the porkchop is the shape it is so that it will move out
> of the way, in the same manner and with the same effort, not matter how
> narrow or wide the board is, that is being pushed into it.
>
I appreciate your semi vote of confidence..LOL
I did spend some time looking at a lot of images of cutter guards and
it is clear that many won't do a thing to stop kick back. The european
guards will not do a thing to stop kick-back. Like Mini Max, for
instance.Conversely, many will, and many will at varying thicknesses
(widths?)
Some of the Powermatic ones look like they'd do a pretty good job at
most of their spec'd widths.
The General ones, like mine, are more 'iffy' at wider widths.
In summation: Mine works like a cam and stops my being able to pull
back a board, certainly up to 2" thick.
Yours might not.
Steve Turner's does, somewhat, up to a point.
So... what izzit? Smooth or Crunchy?
On Sep 13, 1:51=A0pm, Nova <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
> > the edge.
> > How is kick-back covered?
>
> How is kick back covered in ANY operation on a jointer? =A0There are no
> hardware provisions to control kick back on any jointer I've ever seen.
>
> --
> Jack Novak
> Buffalo, NY - USA
> [email protected]
The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
of wood from flying backwards.
On Sep 12, 6:44=A0pm, Nova <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
>
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
> > dangerous that is?
> > That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
> > anti-kick-back device.
>
> > That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
> > anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
>
> The cutterhead guard on my jointer would never do anything to prevent
> kick back.
No pinching cam action?
>
> To use the jointer to cut a rabbet the owner's manual states,
>
> "Rabbet Cut: A rabbet cut is a groove cut along the long edge of the
> wood stock, usually used for making simple joints.
>
> The cutterhead guard must be removed for this operation, so great
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> care is needed for safe operation."
>
> --
> Jack Novak
> Buffalo, NY - USA
> [email protected]
I have never seen that done in real life. I can see it will work, but
why do it?
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
> planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less than
> 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle boards
> wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber impede
> getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I could
> experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
You can plane right away.. but it will only make the board smooth, not flat.
A planer will take out cup (you maya have to alternatively take a nibble off
each fave if the board is thin or baddly cupped), but it will not remove bow
or twist.
If your stock if pretty straight and you're not too really anal, it will
work just fine. I have an 8" jointer but bump into the same problem
occaisionally. If I want, say a 10" wide (unspliced) single piece of wood
for a pannel, I'll just go directly to the planer (or mitigate as stated
below).
Alternatives are:
1. rip to <6" then joint
2. mitigate bow or twist by jointing the 6" that you can and then rotating
to get the other side of the face. take small bites.
3. mitigate bow or twist with an hand plane to knock off the high spots.
BTW always crosscut to rough length first
-Steve
On Sep 12, 9:44=A0pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "dpb" wrote:
> > It's specifically designed for the task -- that's why there's the
> > extension table on the front and the rabbet removed for stock
> > clearance and the support on the rear bed.
>
> > Lengthwise, it's the tool of choice...
>
> I'll pass.
>
> Lew
So will I. It is not necessary, not safe and not what a jointer is
designed to do.
If that 'feature' is mentioned, I think it is because that particular
model 'needs' another feature because the rest of it is suspect.
On Sep 13, 2:08=A0pm, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 13, 11:41 am, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Robatoy wrote:
>
> >> ...
>
> >>> Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
> >> Where do you get the dangerous bit from?
>
> >> Look at the instruction manual picture at
>
> >> <http://www.dewaltservicenet.com/documents/English/Instruction%20Manua=
...>
>
> >> p21, Fig. 43. =A0and tell me what you see as a problem.
>
> >> --
>
> > I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
> > the edge.
> > How is kick-back covered?
>
> Same as in normal operation -- your contention the blade guard is an
> effective anti-kickback device is wishful thinking at best...
>
> --
Next time you edge joint a board...try to pull it back towards
you...assuming you have a porkchop style guard.
"Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On Sep 11, 12:26 pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>>> > planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
>>> > than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
>>> > boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
>>> > impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is?
>>> > I
>>> > could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>>>
>>> > Larry
>>>
>>> If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
>>> maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
>>> and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
>>> can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
>>> to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
>>> originally jointed face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
>>> mill then glue as StephenM wrote. Tom
>>
>>Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
>>dangerous that is?
>>That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
>>anti-kick-back device.
>>
>>That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
>>anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
>
> Wow, I would never remove a jointer guard! There are safer (and
> wiser) methods.
But aren't you supposed to remove the guard to use the ledge to make rabbets
on a joiner? Of course, the fence
should be positioned to cover the unused portion of the blade.
On Sep 13, 3:12=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
> > The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> > of wood from flying backwards.
>
> Are you sure about that? =A0(not trying to be argumentative, here)
>
> I have a decent Delta 6" and I can slide a piece of wood forwards and
> back against that smooth paint job, without much effort at all.
>
> To my knowledge the spring only exerts the minimal amount of force
> required to keep the chop over the blades and not impede the progress of
> the wood.
>
If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
On Sep 11, 10:48=A0am, "StephenM" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. =A0I recently purchased a 1=
2"
> > planer and have a 6" jointer. =A0I'll true the face of any boards less =
than
> > 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. =A0How do I handle board=
s
> > wider than 6"? =A0Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber impede
> > getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? =A0I cou=
ld
> > experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
> You can plane right away.. but it will only make the board smooth, not fl=
at.
>
> A planer will take out cup (you maya have to alternatively take a nibble =
off
> each fave if the board is thin or baddly cupped), but it will not remove =
bow
> or twist.
>
With a simple jig you can use a planer to flatten a board.
http://www.woodworkingtips.com/etips/2006/10/27/ws
Maybe not the most ideal way but it can be done
On Sep 11, 12:26=A0pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. =A0I recently purchased a 1=
2"
> > planer and have a 6" jointer. =A0I'll true the face of any boards less
> > than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. =A0How do I handle
> > boards wider than 6"? =A0Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
> > impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? =
=A0I
> > could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
> > Larry
>
> If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
> maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
> and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
> can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
> to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
> originally jointed =A0face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
> mill then glue as StephenM wrote. =A0Tom
Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
dangerous that is?
That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
anti-kick-back device.
That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
On Sep 12, 6:40 am, Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sep 11, 12:26 pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
> > > planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
> > > than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
> > > boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
> > > impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
> > > could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
> > > Larry
>
> > If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
> > maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
> > and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
> > can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
> > to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
> > originally jointed face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
> > mill then glue as StephenM wrote. Tom
>
> Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
> dangerous that is?
> That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
> anti-kick-back device.
>
> That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
> anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
Of course I know the danger involved, and I appreciate your concern. I
probably should have written a disclaimer, huh? A friend of mine got a
fingertip taken off by his jointer. The very same jointer I now own. I
had to make my own guard for this jointer, as the original was lost,
and it's usually on. Unless there are teeth or pawls along the edge of
the guard(which I've never seen), it will not prevent kickback.
There's just not enough pressure against the fence. It merely prevents
a careless hand from dropping down onto the spinning cutterhead. I
have removed the guard, pawls and splitter from my tablesaw, too. It
is_ the_ most dangerous hobby I enjoy. Tom
On Sep 13, 11:41=A0am, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
> ...
>
> > Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
>
> Where do you get the dangerous bit from?
>
> Look at the instruction manual picture at
>
> <http://www.dewaltservicenet.com/documents/English/Instruction%20Manua...=
>
>
> p21, Fig. 43. =A0and tell me what you see as a problem.
>
> --
I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
the edge.
How is kick-back covered?
"dpb" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Lew Hodgett wrote:
>> "dpb" wrote:
>>
>>> It almost always has been a design feature -- look at any vintage text
>>> or manufacturer's literature. That either one may be too young to have
>>> learned it or simply started after the router became ubiquitous is quite
>>> likely a major factor...
>>>
>>> It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
>>
>> There was also a time when blood letting was considered state of the art
>> medical practice.
>
>
> Actually, in some forms it again is...
>
> --
Speaking of that, if you cut a rabbit on the jointer, won't the blood get
all over the surface? I'd rather cook it whole if that's the case.
Phisherman wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Sep 2009 09:25:35 -0500, "[email protected]"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>>planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
>>than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
>>boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
>>impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
>>could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>>
>>Larry
>
>
> Forget about the jointer and run the boards through the planer only,
> flipping the board between passes. There are certain guidelines to
> follow (in terms of board shape, thickness, hardness etc) when using a
> surface planer but a well-tuned planer should handle rough-cut lumber
> with ease. Dust collection helps.
I would have to agree. I just planed out a piece of walnut that was cupped.
I planed a flat on one side, not fully smooth and then flipped it and took
very light passes until I was planing the full board, then back over and
cleaned up the first side. The result was a flat board with two smooth and
flat sides.
Deb
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, "Leon"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>And there is the option of buying S2S which has already been flattened and
>>is considerably cheaper than S4S.
>
> Lest there be any confusion over the meaning of the term "flattened",
> let's be
> specific: S2S lumber has been *planed* on two faces. It has *not* been
> jointed.
Correct, flattened, not straightened. Straightening can easily be and very
accurately done on the TS with a "long sled type taper joint jig", if the
wood is flat.
"John Siegel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Wow, I would never remove a jointer guard! There are safer (and
>> wiser) methods.
>
> But aren't you supposed to remove the guard to use the ledge to make
> rabbets on a joiner? Of course, the fence
> should be positioned to cover the unused portion of the blade.
Yes... and I'm a bit puzzled about why using a jointer for rabbeting is
viewed as extraordinarily dangerous... My Delta DJ-20 has a rabbeting ledge
and I wouldn't call that machine a gimmick laden tool... The 6" Reliant I
had before that also had a rebatting ledge. In use the fence and uncut
portion of the board cover the cutter whereas for jointing a combination of
the board, fence and guard cover the cutter. The difference being that in
the former some cutter is exposed when no board is being fed through and in
the later the cutter is covered whether there is a board being fed through
or not.
In most applications I've encountered the board is run on edge along the
fence so no more cutter is exposed in this operation than would be exposed
using a dado cutter in a table saw... With wide rabbets the board is run
through flat on the tables. Again the entire cutter is covered by the fence
and the board. Here is a case where the jointer may beat out the table saw
as you can cut a very wide rabbet with the board well supported and the
cutter unexposed. Table saw dado cutters on the other hand are typically an
inch or less wide and wide rebbates on the table saw require multiple passes
and the rebatted area is unsupported by the tool.
On the DJ-20 long boards are well supported due to the long in feed and out
feed tables. I cannot say that about boards run through my shaper as
discontinuous stands are needed to support the board. I'd never use my bench
top router table for such purposes as it's too small to support long boards
and is underpowered. Molding cutters on my molder/planer will do the job but
between installing the cutters and building feed guides set up is very time
consuming. However, if I were doing 1,000s of linear feet that would be the
machine of choice for me.... between the pressure rollers and guides the
board is well controlled with little user influence. For small quantities of
short boards I generally make two to four cuts on the table saw with a combo
blade for rebates or use a plow plane for the task if solid wood is
involved.
I've come to the conclusion that I am the most dangerous tool in my shop...
the only shop injuries I've sustained outside of splinters or cuts from the
sharp corners of boards occurred when I was fatigued and rushing. They both
involved kickbacks on the table saw and resulted in nasty bruises. In one
case I failed to reinstall the T-Splitter for a through cut after making
non-through cuts, this as "I only had one cut to make" and in my fatigued
state didn't control the board properly. In the other case, again in a
fatigued state, I turned the saw off and accidently dropped the small,
roughly 4" x 8", piece of oak veneer plywood onto the still spinning blade
while trying to pick up the wood. In both cases that marked quitting time as
I was clearly too tired to continue.
The comfort level experienced by users boils down to what specific tools are
available and the attentiveness and skill of the user. I figure that any one
of my floor, stand, bench top, or hand power tools, and even my meat powered
tools, can bite me if I don't do my part. Overall, I suspect that abused and
improperly used screw drivers rank very high on the "tools that injure" list
and they are about as simple a tool as there is!
John
Robatoy wrote:
> I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
> the edge.
> How is kick-back covered?
How is kick back covered in ANY operation on a jointer? There are no
hardware provisions to control kick back on any jointer I've ever seen.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
> planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less than
> 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle boards
> wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber impede
> getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I could
> experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
> Larry
If the board is relative straight and flat you can go straight to the
plainer. I did that for years. I not, you may be better off using a jig on
the TS to straighten the board and rip it to the capacity of the jointer.
And there is the option of buying S2S which has already been flattened and
is considerably cheaper than S4S.
"Nova" wrote:
> I've used the jointer for rabbets on the occasions when the rabbet
> was wide. One example was transition molding for flooring where the
> rabbet was about 2.5" wide and 1/4" deep.
Seems like a table saw with a stacked dado or even a router with a jig
similar to a scarfing jig would have been a lot safer.
Lew
"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, "John
> Grossbohlin" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> [long post trimmed to its bare essentials]
>
>>I've come to the conclusion that I am the most dangerous tool in my
>>shop...
>
> Amen. Well stated. We would all do well to keep that in the forefront of
> our
> minds.
Agreed there.
I have always maintained that it is not "if" you will get hurt in the shop,
it is "when" you will get hurt in the shop.
After 30 years of serious woodworking I look back on my first 10 years and
think, I only thought I knew all the safety precautions to take.
Thanks, guys. I'm picking up some rough cut walnut this weekend and
will give it a try.
tom wrote:
> On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>> planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
>> than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
>> boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
>> impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
>> could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>>
>> Larry
>
> If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
> maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
> and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
> can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
> to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
> originally jointed face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
> mill then glue as StephenM wrote. Tom
On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
> planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
> than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
> boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
> impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
> could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
> Larry
If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
originally jointed face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
mill then glue as StephenM wrote. Tom
On Sep 13, 8:11=A0pm, [email protected] (Larry W) wrote:
> In article <[email protected].=
com>,Robatoy =A0<[email protected]> wrote:
>
> <<...snipped...>>
>
> >If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>
> Maybe if the curved part of the guard had teeth cut into it like
> a table saw anti-kickback pawl,
And scratch a good board?
On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 01:44:53 GMT, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"dpb" wrote:
>
>> It's specifically designed for the task -- that's why there's the
>> extension table on the front and the rabbet removed for stock
>> clearance and the support on the rear bed.
>>
>> Lengthwise, it's the tool of choice...
>
>
>I'll pass.
>
>Lew
Me too.
In my first few minutes of introduction to a joiner, it threw a short board across the shop. That
board laughed at any effort my pork chop guard put out at stopping the kickback. My fingers (all 4
of them plus the thumb) of my right hand were numb for several minutes, and I am sure I felt an urge
to urinate when I realized how close I'd come to serious injury. I had RTFM at least twice, and
still screwed up. That was some years ago, but I've never forgotten the lesson.
I'd never cut a rebate on a joiner. My weapon of choice nowadays would be a Stanley #78 (fillister
plane, Jeff). Since I don't do woodworking for a living, most of my work is one off. For small
jobs, a hand plane is often quicker than setting up a dado for the saw. Certainly quieter.
Need dozens to hundreds of feet of rebate? I'd break out the TS and dado and have at it. I'd even
consider using one of those tailed banshee's of a router with that much to cut.
My $0.02.
Regards,
Roy
On Sep 12, 11:51=A0pm, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 12, 9:44 pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> "dpb" wrote:
> >>> It's specifically designed for the task -- that's why there's the
> >>> extension table on the front and the rabbet removed for stock
> >>> clearance and the support on the rear bed.
> >>> Lengthwise, it's the tool of choice...
> >> I'll pass.
>
> >> Lew
>
> > So will I. It is not necessary, not safe and not what a jointer is
> > designed to do.
>
> It almost always has been a design feature -- look at any vintage text
> or manufacturer's literature. =A0That either one may be too young to have
> learned it or simply started after the router became ubiquitous is quite
> likely a major factor...
>
> It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
>
Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com:
> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>
> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
serious table saw user?
Puckdropper
--
"The potential difference between the top and bottom of a tree is the
reason why all trees have to be grounded..." -- Bored Borg on
rec.woodworking
To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm
"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> John Grossbohlin wrote:
>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
>>> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
>>> serious table saw user?
>>
>> Well, I never installed the factory guard on my 3 HP cabinet saw... opted
>> to put a Biesemeyer T-Splitter on instead and it is highly unusual for me
>> to not have it in place while making through cuts (exceptions are using
>> the sled or the tenon jig). The 1.5 HP contractor saw before that started
>> with the factory guard but it was such a nasty item to work with I took
>> it off and shortly there after replaced it with a T-Splitter... Having
>> been whacked twice by kickbacks that occurred when I was tired and didn't
>> have a splitter installed is enough to convince me that it should be
>> there. I don't use the guards over the blade though as I think being able
>> to see what I'm doing and being able to use a push stick on narrow pieces
>> are pretty important issues.
>>
>> John
>
>
> That T-Splitter thing is kind of like keeping the guard, but just taking
> off the shield, right?
>
> Since it's still guarding against half the potential danger, I'd say it's
> only half foolish. :-)
It's more like having a quick release riving knife with anti-kick back pawls
that is convenient enough to use that it actually gets used... All that
guard stuff that is cumbersome to remove and replace and/or interferes with
push sticks is what ends up in the drawer or trash.
John
On Sep 15, 4:44=A0pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sep 15, 1:29 pm, Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On Sep 15, 4:15 pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
> > > about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
> > > uttered? =A0Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
> > > Tom
>
> > Come on now, there is a difference. Isn't there?
>
> I haven't watched his show, so I'm not sure. How do you feel about
> this Glenn Beck guy? =A0Tom
An ex-drinker, aka a 'dry drunk' like George W Bush, and now will say
anything to suck up to the redneck right-wing fundy lunatic Fox crowd.
NOT that there is anything wrong with that. A guy has to make a
living... no matter how.
On Sep 16, 1:12=A0pm, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> >>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
I wasn't talking to you, you fucking misguided douche-nozzle.
On Sep 16, 6:50=A0pm, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 16, 1:12 pm, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Robatoy wrote:
> >>>>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
> > I wasn't talking to you, you fucking misguided douche-nozzle.
>
> You talking to ME?
Very poor Travis Bickle imitation. Try it in front of a mirror.
On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 08:06:07 -0600, Chris Friesen
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On 09/13/2009 02:50 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
>> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>
>Not buying it. If kickback were an issue, the european machines would
>have dealt with it. As it stands, they have guards that always cover
>the cutterhead and the stock slides under the guard. No provision
>whatsoever for kickback prevention.
>
>Chris
I just tried a few boards on my DJ20 with no power. Every board could
be easily pulled back through the safety guard, unlike a featherboard.
On Sep 15, 2:33=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 15, 12:24 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Robatoy wrote:
> >>> On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>> Puckdropper wrote:
> >>>>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
> >>>>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
> >>>>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
> >>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> >>>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> >>>>> guard from their saw. =A0So, the real questions are: How many serio=
us
> >>>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make y=
ou a
> >>>>> serious table saw user?
> >>>>> Puckdropper
> >>>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard=
.
> >>>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. =A0I won't
> >>>> apologize for saying that.
> >>>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pull=
ing
> >>>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in thi=
s
> >>>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same =
thing.
> >>> THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >>> How do you reach that conclusion?
> >>> You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
> >>> You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
> >>> just do that?
> >> Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
> >> which you omitted.
> >> I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
>
> >> I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
> >> beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could'v=
e
> >> said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. =A0=
=A0:-)
>
> > For that I am supposed to be grateful? Or are you pretending to be
> > sanctimonious?
>
> > You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
>
> Smiley face. =A0Lighten up.
>
> The lengths people will go to keep from admitting they were wrong... and
> for such a trivial thing.
>
You ARE a Glen Beck fan!!! Kinda figured as much.
You see... I was NOT wrong. MY jointer grabs a board when I try to
pull it backwards.
Fact.
Now YOU, who does not have that happen on YOUR jointer, is trying to
tell ME that it doesn't happen on MY jointer.
Which makes YOU full of shit...not me.
Are you getting this yet Big Guy?
On Sep 14, 8:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
> apologize for saying that.
>
> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>
> (*seemingly, because I'm not for certain why it was said, so I can't go
> any further than to point out the potential irony.) :-)
I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
uttered? Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
Tom
On Sep 15, 12:24=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Puckdropper wrote:
> >>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
> >>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
> >>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
> >>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> >>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> >>> guard from their saw. =A0So, the real questions are: How many serious
> >>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you=
a
> >>> serious table saw user?
> >>> Puckdropper
> >> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
> >> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. =A0I won't
> >> apologize for saying that.
>
> >> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pullin=
g
> >> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
> >> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same th=
ing.
>
> > THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
> > How do you reach that conclusion?
> > You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
>
> > You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
> > just do that?
>
> Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
> which you omitted.
> I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
>
> I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
> beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could've
> said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. =A0 =
=A0:-)
>
For that I am supposed to be grateful? Or are you pretending to be
sanctimonious?
You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
On Sep 15, 3:35=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
> > On Sep 15, 2:33 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Robatoy wrote:
> >>> On Sep 15, 12:24 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>> Robatoy wrote:
> >>>>> On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>>> Puckdropper wrote:
> >>>>>>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
> >>>>>>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guard=
s
> >>>>>>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
> >>>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> >>>>>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed t=
he
> >>>>>>> guard from their saw. =A0So, the real questions are: How many ser=
ious
> >>>>>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make=
you a
> >>>>>>> serious table saw user?
> >>>>>>> Puckdropper
> >>>>>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the gua=
rd.
> >>>>>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. =A0I won'=
t
> >>>>>> apologize for saying that.
> >>>>>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pu=
lling
> >>>>>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in t=
his
> >>>>>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the sam=
e thing.
> >>>>> THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >>>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> >>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >>>>> How do you reach that conclusion?
> >>>>> You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws=
.
> >>>>> You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
> >>>>> just do that?
> >>>> Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
> >>>> which you omitted.
> >>>> I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
> >>>> I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
> >>>> beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could=
've
> >>>> said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. =
=A0 =A0:-)
> >>> For that I am supposed to be grateful? Or are you pretending to be
> >>> sanctimonious?
> >>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
> >> Smiley face. =A0Lighten up.
>
> >> The lengths people will go to keep from admitting they were wrong... a=
nd
> >> for such a trivial thing.
>
> > You ARE a Glen Beck fan!!! Kinda figured as much.
>
> > You see... I was NOT wrong. MY jointer grabs a board when I try to
> > pull it backwards.
> > Fact.
> > Now YOU, who does not have that happen on YOUR jointer, is trying to
> > tell ME that it doesn't happen on MY jointer.
> > Which makes YOU full of shit...not me.
>
> > Are you getting this yet Big Guy?
>
> Ahh, you got your little feelings hurt and now you're lashing out.
>
> Let me use little words and short sentences so you can understand.
>
> I never said it didn't happen with your jointer.
>
> You said the following...
> "The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> of wood from flying backwards."
> "If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards."
>
> In the context of these two quotes, you were referring to jointers in
> general, not your own.
>
Whose jointer was I talking about? Obviously not yours.
But, hey, bro'... if you want to stick to your assumptions, go for it.
I'm done here.
On Sep 14, 11:42=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> Puckdropper wrote:
> > Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
>
> >>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
> >>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>
> >> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
> > All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> > guard from their saw. =A0So, the real questions are: How many serious
> > table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
> > serious table saw user?
>
> > Puckdropper
>
> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. =A0I won't
> apologize for saying that.
>
> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing=
.
THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> >> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
How do you reach that conclusion?
You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
just do that?
On Sep 15, 3:35=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
[drivel snipped]
>
> Ahh, you got your little feelings hurt and now you're lashing out.
>
> Let me use little words and short sentences so you can understand.
>
Shall I get you a saucer of milk?
On Sep 15, 12:07=A0am, "CW" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (excep=
t
> > those foolish enough to remove them),
> > Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
> I didn't remove mine. I never put it on.
I've tried using a saw with a guard a couple times and have come to
the conclusion that it is decidedly unsafe for this woodworker. A
riving knife, OTOH, is a godsend. WRT the jointer, I pretty much
always keep it on.
JP
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>
> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
Is THAT what that thing was?
tom wrote:
> On Sep 14, 8:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
>> apologize for saying that.
>>
>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>>
>> (*seemingly, because I'm not for certain why it was said, so I can't go
>> any further than to point out the potential irony.) :-)
>
> I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
> about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
> uttered? Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
Godwin's Law
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
--
Froz...
"Robatoy" wrote:
--------------------------------------------
An ex-drinker, aka a 'dry drunk' like George W Bush, and now will say
anything to suck up to the redneck right-wing fundy lunatic Fox crowd.
--------------------------------------------------------
Dateline Hesperia, CA
Quite a brouhaha in this high desert community east of Los Angeles.
A bank has put up a billboard in Spanish as part of a campaign to
attract new customers.
The "Whitey" element is screaming that the billboard is "un-American".
(The over 50, gray at the temples and wearing a baseball hat with
military markings crowd)
So what else is new?
The "Whitey" element of our population is feeling threatened by
current events.
Many of the jobs they performed for generations have disappeared and
will not return.
Non white immigrants are moving into once all white areas, taking the
low wage jobs,
operating the high risk businesses(Want the night shift at your local
7-11?),
but more importantly, filling the seats of the classes of our colleges
and universities.
A man of mixed race is president.
How long will it be before mixed marriage invades the "Whitey" gene
pool?
Will it ever end?
Face it, the "Whitey" portion of the population will no longer be a
majority portion
of the population in a few years and there is little they can do about
it so when the bigots
feed on their apprehensions, they tend to run in circles, scream and
shout rather than try
to adapt and move on, which is what we are seeing from the Republicans
in Congress
these days.
Lew
"Puckdropper" <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>>
>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
> serious table saw user?
Well, I never installed the factory guard on my 3 HP cabinet saw... opted to
put a Biesemeyer T-Splitter on instead and it is highly unusual for me to
not have it in place while making through cuts (exceptions are using the
sled or the tenon jig). The 1.5 HP contractor saw before that started with
the factory guard but it was such a nasty item to work with I took it off
and shortly there after replaced it with a T-Splitter... Having been whacked
twice by kickbacks that occurred when I was tired and didn't have a splitter
installed is enough to convince me that it should be there. I don't use the
guards over the blade though as I think being able to see what I'm doing and
being able to use a push stick on narrow pieces are pretty important issues.
John
"Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 08:06:07 -0600, Chris Friesen
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On 09/13/2009 02:50 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>>
>>Not buying it. If kickback were an issue, the european machines would
>>have dealt with it. As it stands, they have guards that always cover
>>the cutterhead and the stock slides under the guard. No provision
>>whatsoever for kickback prevention.
>>
>>Chris
>
>
> I just tried a few boards on my DJ20 with no power. Every board could
> be easily pulled back through the safety guard, unlike a featherboard.
That has been my experience with my DJ-20 and the 6" Reliant before that...
and the spring tension on the DJ-20 is significantly higher than the
Reliant.
John
On Sep 15, 1:29 pm, Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sep 15, 4:15 pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
> > I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
> > about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
> > uttered? Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
> > Tom
>
> Come on now, there is a difference. Isn't there?
I haven't watched his show, so I'm not sure. How do you feel about
this Glenn Beck guy? Tom
On Sep 14, 5:24=A0pm, "John Grossbohlin"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> "Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 08:06:07 -0600, Chris Friesen
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >>On 09/13/2009 02:50 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>
> >>> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards=
.
>
> >>Not buying it. =A0If kickback were an issue, the european machines woul=
d
> >>have dealt with it. =A0As it stands, they have guards that always =A0co=
ver
> >>the cutterhead and the stock slides under the guard. =A0No provision
> >>whatsoever for kickback prevention.
>
> >>Chris
>
> > I just tried a few boards on my DJ20 with no power. =A0Every board coul=
d
> > be easily pulled back through the safety guard, unlike a featherboard.
>
> That has been my experience with my DJ-20 and the 6" Reliant before that.=
..
> and the spring tension on the DJ-20 is significantly higher than the
> Reliant.
>
> John
And my 6" General grabs a board just nicely.
.
.
.
We can go on like this for a while, eh?
On Sep 14, 9:08=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
> those foolish enough to remove them),
Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
On Sep 15, 4:15=A0pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sep 14, 8:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
> > Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. =A0I won't
> > apologize for saying that.
>
> > I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
> > the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
> > thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thi=
ng.
>
> > (*seemingly, because I'm not for certain why it was said, so I can't go
> > any further than to point out the potential irony.) :-)
>
> I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
> about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
> uttered? =A0Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
> Tom
Come on now, there is a difference. Isn't there?
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 14, 5:24 pm, "John Grossbohlin"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 08:06:07 -0600, Chris Friesen
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> On 09/13/2009 02:50 PM, Robatoy wrote:
>>>>> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>>>> Not buying it. If kickback were an issue, the european machines would
>>>> have dealt with it. As it stands, they have guards that always cover
>>>> the cutterhead and the stock slides under the guard. No provision
>>>> whatsoever for kickback prevention.
>>>> Chris
>>> I just tried a few boards on my DJ20 with no power. Every board could
>>> be easily pulled back through the safety guard, unlike a featherboard.
>> That has been my experience with my DJ-20 and the 6" Reliant before that...
>> and the spring tension on the DJ-20 is significantly higher than the
>> Reliant.
>>
>> John
>
> And my 6" General grabs a board just nicely.
> .
> .
> .
> We can go on like this for a while, eh?
I think the point is, it was never designed to, nor intended to stop
kickback.
Like another guy wrote, how come you don't (and won't, I'd guess) see it
in any manuals.
We have one guy who claims his works and everyone else claiming theirs
does not.
Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
those foolish enough to remove them), everyone would report back that
the teeth held the board. If everyone in here went out to check their
fingerboards, everyone would report back that they held the board.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
>> those foolish enough to remove them),
>
> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
Yes, it's foolish.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Puckdropper wrote:
> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
>
>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>>
>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
> serious table saw user?
>
> Puckdropper
There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
apologize for saying that.
I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
(*seemingly, because I'm not for certain why it was said, so I can't go
any further than to point out the potential irony.) :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
On Wed, 16 Sep 2009 02:31:27 GMT, the infamous "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>"Steve Turner" wrote:
>
>> <blah blah blah - SNIP>
>>
>> Oh yeah? Well chew on this one for a while:
>
>Okay, you repost a blow hard like Joe Hall which is fine, but it
>solves nothing and more to the point what is/are your suggestion(s) to
>address the problem?
Open season on illegals and attorneys?
--
"Giving every man a vote has no more made men wise and free
than Christianity has made them good." --H. L. Mencken
---
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Puckdropper wrote:
>>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
>>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
>>> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
>>> serious table saw user?
>>> Puckdropper
>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
>> apologize for saying that.
>>
>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>
> THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
> ======================
>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> ======================
>
> How do you reach that conclusion?
> You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
>
> You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
> just do that?
Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
which you omitted.
I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could've
said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 15, 12:24 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>> On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Puckdropper wrote:
>>>>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
>>>>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>>>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>>>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
>>>>> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
>>>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
>>>>> serious table saw user?
>>>>> Puckdropper
>>>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
>>>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
>>>> apologize for saying that.
>>>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
>>>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
>>>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>>> THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
>>> ======================
>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>>> ======================
>>> How do you reach that conclusion?
>>> You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
>>> You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
>>> just do that?
>> Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
>> which you omitted.
>> I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
>>
>> I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
>> beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could've
>> said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. :-)
>>
>
> For that I am supposed to be grateful? Or are you pretending to be
> sanctimonious?
>
> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
>
Smiley face. Lighten up.
The lengths people will go to keep from admitting they were wrong... and
for such a trivial thing.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 15, 2:33 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>> On Sep 15, 12:24 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Robatoy wrote:
>>>>> On Sep 14, 11:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> Puckdropper wrote:
>>>>>>> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
>>>>>>>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>>>>>>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>>>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>>>>>>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
>>>>>>> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
>>>>>>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
>>>>>>> serious table saw user?
>>>>>>> Puckdropper
>>>>>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
>>>>>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
>>>>>> apologize for saying that.
>>>>>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
>>>>>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
>>>>>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>>>>> THIS is 'seemingly' my taking 'offense'?
>>>>> ======================
>>>>>>>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>>>>> ======================
>>>>> How do you reach that conclusion?
>>>>> You have NO idea how I feel about TS guards, on my- or others' saws.
>>>>> You're making shit up out of whole cloth. With what purpose did you
>>>>> just do that?
>>>> Holy cow, I went out of my way to give you the benefit of the doubt,
>>>> which you omitted.
>>>> I should've worded it better and for that, I apologize.
>>>> I figure the civility with which I've conducted this debate from the
>>>> beginning would've warranted the same from you, when in fact I could've
>>>> said from the very beginning that you're full of it... but didn't. :-)
>>> For that I am supposed to be grateful? Or are you pretending to be
>>> sanctimonious?
>>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
>> Smiley face. Lighten up.
>>
>> The lengths people will go to keep from admitting they were wrong... and
>> for such a trivial thing.
>>
>
> You ARE a Glen Beck fan!!! Kinda figured as much.
>
> You see... I was NOT wrong. MY jointer grabs a board when I try to
> pull it backwards.
> Fact.
> Now YOU, who does not have that happen on YOUR jointer, is trying to
> tell ME that it doesn't happen on MY jointer.
> Which makes YOU full of shit...not me.
>
> Are you getting this yet Big Guy?
>
Ahh, you got your little feelings hurt and now you're lashing out.
Let me use little words and short sentences so you can understand.
I never said it didn't happen with your jointer.
You said the following...
"The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
of wood from flying backwards."
"If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards."
In the context of these two quotes, you were referring to jointers in
general, not your own.
A bunch of guys report back that it doesn't work their jointers.
More guys report they can't find reference anywhere of anti-kickback
ever being mentioned as a purpose or benefit of the blade guard.
You still claim you are not wrong, because it works on yours.
Who's full of it?
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
tom wrote:
> On Sep 14, 8:42 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>> There are obviously techniques for which one has to remove the guard.
>> Not putting it back on is lazy and like I said, foolish. I won't
>> apologize for saying that.
>>
>> I find it ironic that the guy, who's admonishment of the OP for pulling
>> the guard off his jointer precipitated the bulk of the debate in this
>> thread, now has seemingly* taken offense to me criticizing the same thing.
>>
>> (*seemingly, because I'm not for certain why it was said, so I can't go
>> any further than to point out the potential irony.) :-)
>
> I'm the guy with the (sometimes) guardless jointer. What's that law
> about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
> uttered? Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
> Tom
lol :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
John Grossbohlin wrote:
>> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
>> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
>> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
>> serious table saw user?
>
> Well, I never installed the factory guard on my 3 HP cabinet saw...
> opted to put a Biesemeyer T-Splitter on instead and it is highly unusual
> for me to not have it in place while making through cuts (exceptions are
> using the sled or the tenon jig). The 1.5 HP contractor saw before that
> started with the factory guard but it was such a nasty item to work with
> I took it off and shortly there after replaced it with a T-Splitter...
> Having been whacked twice by kickbacks that occurred when I was tired
> and didn't have a splitter installed is enough to convince me that it
> should be there. I don't use the guards over the blade though as I think
> being able to see what I'm doing and being able to use a push stick on
> narrow pieces are pretty important issues.
>
> John
That T-Splitter thing is kind of like keeping the guard, but just taking
off the shield, right?
Since it's still guarding against half the potential danger, I'd say
it's only half foolish. :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> Dateline Hesperia, CA
>
> Quite a brouhaha in this high desert community east of Los Angeles.
>
> A bank has put up a billboard in Spanish as part of a campaign to
> attract new customers.
>
> The "Whitey" element is screaming that the billboard is "un-American".
<blah blah blah - SNIP>
Oh yeah? Well chew on this one for a while:
Subj: Moving to Mexico
I can't stand it anymore, so I'm moving on if Obama can pull some
strings for me. Hope they have some nice golf courses in Mexico
Dear Mr. President:
I'm planning to move my family and extended family into Mexico for my
health, and I would like to ask you to assist me.
We're planning to simply walk across the border from the U.S. Into
Mexico , and we'll need your help to make a few arrangements. We plan
to skip all the legal stuff like visas, passports, immigration quotas
and laws.
I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do here. So, would
you mind telling your buddy, President Calderon, that I'm on my way
over?
Please let him know that I will be expecting the following:
1. Free medical care for my entire family.
2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all services I might
need, whether I use them or not.
3. Please print all Mexican government forms in English.
4. I want my grandkids to be taught Spanish by English-speaking
(bi-lingual) teachers.
5. Tell their schools they need to include classes on American culture
and history.
6. I want my grandkids to see the American flag on one of the flag
poles at their school.
7. Please plan to feed my grandkids at school for both breakfast and lunch.
8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I can get easy
access to government services.
9. I do plan to get a car and drive in Mexico , but, I don't plan to
purchase car insurance, and I probably won't make any special effort
to learn local traffic laws.
10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not get the memo
from their president to leave me alone, please be sure that every
patrol car has at least one English-speaking officer.
11. I plan to fly the U.S. Flag from my house top, put U S. Flag
decals on my car, and have a gigantic celebration on July 4th. I do
not want any complaints or negative comments from the locals.
12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying any taxes, or
have any labor or tax laws enforced on any business I may start.
13. Please have the president tell all the Mexican people to be
extremely nice and never say a critical things about me or my family,
or about the strain we might place on their economy.
14. I want to receive free food stamps.
15. Naturally, I'll expect free rent subsidies.
16. I'll need Income tax credits so although I don't pay Mexican
Taxes, I'll receive money from the government.
17. Please arrange it so that the Mexican Gov't pays $ 4,500 to help
me buy a new car.
18. Oh yes, I almost forgot, please enroll me free into the Mexican
Social Security program so that I'll get a monthly income in
retirement.
I know this is an easy request because you already do all these
things for all his people who come to the U.S. From Mexico . I am
sure that President Calderon won't mind returning the favor if you ask
him nicely.
Thank you so much for your kind help. You're the man!!!
Joe Hall
LaQuinta, CA
Robatoy wrote:
>>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
>> Smiley face. Lighten up.
>>
>> The lengths people will go to keep from admitting they were wrong... and
>> for such a trivial thing.
> You ARE a Glen Beck fan!!! Kinda figured as much.
>
> You see... I was NOT wrong. MY jointer grabs a board when I try to
> pull it backwards. Fact.
> Now YOU, who does not have that happen on YOUR jointer, is trying to
> tell ME that it doesn't happen on MY jointer.
> Which makes YOU full of shit...not me.
Seems it doesn't work for anyone else either, and, more important,
doesn't seem to be a design feature of ANY ones jointer except yours,
and, Glenn Beck has nothing to do with any of it.
My Delta wouldn't stop kick back either, but fortunately, in 33+ years
of jointing with it, I never experienced kick back. Counting me and
the other guy with 40 years w/o kickback, that would be 73 years
experience w/o kickback.
Just a thought, but perhaps that's why the guards are not designed to
stop something that just doesn't happen.
> Are you getting this yet Big Guy?
Everyone gets it dude, you must be an Obama supporter, and obviously
full of shit.
--
Jack
Got Change: General Motors ====> Government Motors!
http://jbstein.com
Puckdropper wrote:
> Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com:
>> On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards
>>> (except those foolish enough to remove them),
>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
> All serious table saw users have at one time or another removed the
> guard from their saw. So, the real questions are: How many serious
> table saw users do we have here, and does removing the guard make you a
> serious table saw user?
No TS I've used even came with one (old iron). I don't want one either,
they look damned dangerous to me. Norm never uses one, but thats just
for TV (right!) and I don't *think* David Marks used one on TV either.
Scott Phillips uses one and watching him makes a guard look dangerous.
Like I said, I personally never used one, and I'm (33 years so far)
always VERY respectful when using the saw, but I can see as I age, the
likelihood of me screwing up and cutting off a finger, a hand, or even
an arm is getting better. Not just age, but less usage. I still think
a guard would be a waste of time for me, I would be better off getting a
saw stop, but then that can wait until it's too late:-)
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com
-MIKE- wrote:
> I never said it didn't happen with your jointer.
> You said the following...
> "The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> of wood from flying backwards."
> "If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards."
> In the context of these two quotes, you were referring to jointers in
> general, not your own.
He sure sounded like it to me...
> A bunch of guys report back that it doesn't work their jointers.
My pork chop guard doesn't do anything on my jointer either, I actually
had to go down to the shop to check, just like everyone else.
Fortunately, whacking off 1/16th at a time doesn't seem to cause much
kick back....
> More guys report they can't find reference anywhere of anti-kickback
> ever being mentioned as a purpose or benefit of the blade guard.
> You still claim you are not wrong, because it works on yours.
> Who's full of it?
My guess is he's an Obama supporter, does that help you at all?
--
Jack
Got Change: Capitalism =====> Collectivism!
http://jbstein.com
Robatoy wrote:
What's that law
>> about a discussion that devolves down to the point of "nazi" being
>> uttered? Only this time, it's Glenn Beck!
>> Tom
> Come on now, there is a difference. Isn't there?
Yeah, one is a Right wing American capitalist, and one is a Left wing
NAZI Socialist.
--
Jack
Got Change: Individual Control =====> Government Control!
http://jbstein.com
John Grossbohlin wrote:
I don't use the guards over the blade though as I think
> being able to see what I'm doing and being able to use a push stick on
> narrow pieces are pretty important issues.
I guess that's how I feel about too. I'm sure the Obama supporters are
wringing their collective hands in fear though, not that there is
anything wrong with that, they have to bitch about something!
--
Jack
Got Change: Private Property =====> Government Property!
http://jbstein.com
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 16, 1:12 pm, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>>>> You're a Glenn Beck fan, ain'tcha?
> I wasn't talking to you, you fucking misguided douche-nozzle.
You talking to ME?
--
Jack
Got Change: General Motors ======> Government Motors!
http://jbstein.com
"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:b80a7383-efd2-4afd-9cc4-8820f31a0fe5@f10g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 14, 5:24 pm, "John Grossbohlin"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> >"Phisherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
> >> I just tried a few boards on my DJ20 with no power. Every board could
>> > be easily pulled back through the safety guard, unlike a featherboard.
>>
> >That has been my experience with my DJ-20 and the 6" Reliant before
> >that...
>> and the spring tension on the DJ-20 is significantly higher than the
>> Reliant.
>>
>> John
>And my 6" General grabs a board just nicely.
>.
>.
>.
>We can go on like this for a while, eh?
Guess we could treat it like a social science issue instead of a hard
science issue here...
"The empirical evidence suggests that on average we can expect the guard on
a jointer to fail to prevent kick back." Which lets outliers like the above
mentioned General through while keeping the typical user safe by them not
expecting the guard to prevent kick back.
If someone wants to turn it into a hard science experiment and report the
results I'm for it...
H1: We can expect the guard on a jointer to fail to prevent kick back.
Got any engineers in the group who can conduct the testing? Hmmm... maybe
I'll run this by Chris Schwarz... those guys always need ideas for articles!
John
"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
> those foolish enough to remove them),
> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
I didn't remove mine. I never put it on.
On 2009-09-15, Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> anything to suck up to the redneck right-wing fundy lunatic Fox crowd.
I never heard of him, either, but when I did a google search and found
this down at the bottom....
Searches related to: glen beck
rush limbaugh michael savage sean hannity
....it became pretty clear where the Godwins Law reference came in.
nb
"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Steve Turner" wrote:
>
>> <blah blah blah - SNIP>
>>
>> Oh yeah? Well chew on this one for a while:
>
> Okay, you repost a blow hard like Joe Hall which is fine, but it solves
> nothing and more to the point what is/are your suggestion(s) to address
> the problem?
>
Claymores along the border.
On Sep 13, 10:06=A0pm, Steve Turner <[email protected]>
wrote:
> Nova wrote:
> > Robatoy wrote:
>
> >> One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
> >> guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
> >> Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
> >> table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
> >> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
>
> > The design of the porkchop shape is to allow the guard to cover the
> > portion of the blades not being used when jointing varying width boards=
.
> > =A0Its design has nothing to do with preventing kickback.
>
> > If you've tried running a board backwards through your jointer as you
> > suggest you'll see the guard offer absolutely no resistance. =A0I've tr=
ied
> > it before I first suggested to you.
>
> I think there are some limited circumstances where Rob's assertion will
> be true (I just tried it to test my theory). =A0If you're edge jointing a
> relatively thin (say 4/4) board with the fence all the way retracted,
> the guard will offer some amount of kickback protection, mainly because
> the distance between the pivot point and the fence is maximized and
> there is leverage present. =A0As soon as the guard pivots further away
> from the fence that leverage is lost.
>
> --
> Free bad advice available here.
> To reply, eat the taco.http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/
I did mention ...and a cut and paste:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D
48. Robatoy
View profile
More options Sep 13, 2:19 pm
On Sep 13, 2:08 pm, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
- Show quoted text -
Next time you edge joint a board...try to pull it back towards
you...assuming you have a porkchop style guard.
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D
If the board is 5" on a 6" jointer, that cam action would indeed need
teeth.
On Sep 12, 9:15=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Dr. Deb" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > Phisherman wrote:
>
> > I would have to agree. =A0I just planed out a piece of walnut that was
> > cupped.
> > I planed a flat on one side, not fully smooth and then flipped it and t=
ook
> > very light passes until I was planing the full board, then back over an=
d
> > cleaned up the first side. =A0The result was a flat board with two smoo=
th
> > and
> > flat sides.
>
> > Deb
>
> And this works more often than not if there is generally only one of a fe=
w
> issues with the board. =A0This is pretty much impossible if the board is
> longer and has a bend from end to end and or a twist.
>
> That said, I use a 8' long sled to set my rough cut wood on when sending =
it
> throught my 15" planer.
That is the only accurate and safe way to deal with this. Not a big
deal to make ether.
In article <[email protected]>, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>> planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less than
>> 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle boards
>> wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber impede
>> getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I could
>> experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>>
>> Larry
>
>If the board is relative straight and flat you can go straight to the
>plainer. I did that for years. I not, you may be better off using a jig on
>the TS to straighten the board and rip it to the capacity of the jointer.
>
>And there is the option of buying S2S which has already been flattened and
>is considerably cheaper than S4S.
>
>
In article <[email protected]>, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>And there is the option of buying S2S which has already been flattened and
>is considerably cheaper than S4S.
Lest there be any confusion over the meaning of the term "flattened", let's be
specific: S2S lumber has been *planed* on two faces. It has *not* been
jointed.
Dr. Deb wrote:
...
> ... I just planed out a piece of walnut that was cupped.
> I planed a flat on one side, not fully smooth and then flipped it and took
> very light passes until I was planing the full board, then back over and
> cleaned up the first side. The result was a flat board with two smooth and
> flat sides.
That only works if the piece thickness is sufficient to prevent the
planer feed roller pressure from deforming (flattening) the piece.
Otherwise, one will end up w/ a board of uniform thickness but still cupped.
--
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "John Siegel" wrote:
>
>> But aren't you supposed to remove the guard to use the ledge to make
>> rabbets on a joiner? Of course, the fence
>> should be positioned to cover the unused portion of the blade.
>
> Trying to make rabbets with a joiner is a very poor choice of tools
> for a task IMHO.
>
> Lew
>
Just about every manual I've seen shows direction for doing it.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "John Siegel" wrote:
>
>> But aren't you supposed to remove the guard to use the ledge to make
>> rabbets on a joiner? Of course, the fence
>> should be positioned to cover the unused portion of the blade.
>
> Trying to make rabbets with a joiner is a very poor choice of tools
> for a task IMHO.
It's specifically designed for the task -- that's why there's the
extension table on the front and the rabbet removed for stock clearance
and the support on the rear bed.
Lengthwise, it's the tool of choice...
--
In article <[email protected]>, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>"Doug Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> In article <[email protected]>, "Leon"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>And there is the option of buying S2S which has already been flattened and
>>>is considerably cheaper than S4S.
>>
>> Lest there be any confusion over the meaning of the term "flattened",
>> let's be
>> specific: S2S lumber has been *planed* on two faces. It has *not* been
>> jointed.
>
>Correct, flattened, not straightened. Straightening can easily be and very
>accurately done on the TS with a "long sled type taper joint jig", if the
>wood is flat.
If it hasn't been jointed, I wouldn't say that it's been "flattened". The
straightening you describe on the TS makes an edge straight, but not a face.
To make a face both straight and flat, the board needs to be jointed -- not
necessarily with a jointer. Other techniques include hand-planing, machine
planing with a sled, or using a router and jig. (Note that I'm not disagreeing
with you -- I know you know all that already -- I'm just trying to make sure
the OP understands the difference.)
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 12, 9:44 pm, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "dpb" wrote:
>>> It's specifically designed for the task -- that's why there's the
>>> extension table on the front and the rabbet removed for stock
>>> clearance and the support on the rear bed.
>>> Lengthwise, it's the tool of choice...
>> I'll pass.
>>
>> Lew
>
> So will I. It is not necessary, not safe and not what a jointer is
> designed to do.
It almost always has been a design feature -- look at any vintage text
or manufacturer's literature. That either one may be too young to have
learned it or simply started after the router became ubiquitous is quite
likely a major factor...
It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
--
Robatoy wrote:
>>
>> It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
>>
>
> Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
>
The way it is described in my manual, it's no more dangerous than using
a router.
Only a small portion of the blade is uncovered, about the same size as a
router bit.
I don't see any more chance of your hand going into the blade than with
a router table.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
In article <[email protected]>, "John Grossbohlin" <[email protected]> wrote:
[long post trimmed to its bare essentials]
>I've come to the conclusion that I am the most dangerous tool in my shop...
Amen. Well stated. We would all do well to keep that in the forefront of our
minds.
Robatoy wrote:
...
> Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
Where do you get the dangerous bit from?
Look at the instruction manual picture at
<http://www.dewaltservicenet.com/documents/English/Instruction%20Manual/Delta/EnA06586.pdf>
p21, Fig. 43. and tell me what you see as a problem.
--
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "dpb" wrote:
>
>> It almost always has been a design feature -- look at any vintage
>> text or manufacturer's literature. That either one may be too young
>> to have learned it or simply started after the router became
>> ubiquitous is quite likely a major factor...
>>
>> It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
>
> There was also a time when blood letting was considered state of the
> art medical practice.
Actually, in some forms it again is...
--
Robatoy wrote:
> Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
> dangerous that is?
Not very unless you are making a really wide rabbit.
> That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
> anti-kick-back device.
I've never had kick back from my jointer? Not sure how the guard would
do anything to prevent kickback?
> That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
> anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
Most rabbits are not that wide, so not much of the blade is ever
exposed. The knives are not going to do much other than knock off a
finger tip or two. Much more dangerous jobs going on in a shop than
using a jointer. As for using it to make rabbits, I did it a few times
just to do it, but I like leaving my jointer set to 1/32 so 2 passes
make a 1/16th. I don't like changing it and there are better ways to
make a rabbit most of the time. Also, jointer fences are not made for
fine tuned adjustments. The last reason not to use a jointer for a
rabbit is danger.
As for removing the guard, I vaguely recall David Marks doing that on
his giant jointer on TV. I won't swear to it, but I think he used it
facing wide boards w/o the guard which I thought was a little wild, but
David made it look safe. This jointer was really old looking, and
about 20 or 24 inches... really a huge one. Anyone recall him using it
without a guard? Maybe even w/o a fence? I know he would run boards
over it at an angle, but the thing was so wide you could do that with
the fence on, but not sure anymore how he did it.
Interestingly, Scott Phillips makes everything look dangerous. He has
table saw guards, 20 different types of push sticks, splitters, and
every time I see him use his table saw I figure he has a 50/50 chance of
whacking off a hand or at least a finger. He just looks out of place and
uncomfortable in a shop. How he got on TV has been a mystery to me...
He's the only one left in my area... Norm's repeats, David is gone, the
Woodsmith shop is gone... Next I guess will have some babe with a chop
saw and a nail gun building deck furniture while the old man brings her
ice tea...
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 13, 11:41 am, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>
>> ...
>>
>>> Why do something dangerous when it can be done safely?
>> Where do you get the dangerous bit from?
>>
>> Look at the instruction manual picture at
>>
>> <http://www.dewaltservicenet.com/documents/English/Instruction%20Manua...>
>>
>> p21, Fig. 43. and tell me what you see as a problem.
>>
>> --
>
> I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
> the edge.
> How is kick-back covered?
Same as in normal operation -- your contention the blade guard is an
effective anti-kickback device is wishful thinking at best...
--
Robatoy wrote:
>> --
>
> I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
> the edge.
> How is kick-back covered?
How is it covered on a router?
By only exposing a little bit of the bit at a time?
Isn't that hat those anti-kickback designs do?
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Nova wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
>> I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
>> the edge.
>> How is kick-back covered?
>
> How is kick back covered in ANY operation on a jointer? There are no
> hardware provisions to control kick back on any jointer I've ever seen.
>
Those pork chops (thanks to whoever gave me that) don't do anything.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy wrote:
>
> The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> of wood from flying backwards.
Are you sure about that? (not trying to be argumentative, here)
I have a decent Delta 6" and I can slide a piece of wood forwards and
back against that smooth paint job, without much effort at all.
To my knowledge the spring only exerts the minimal amount of force
required to keep the chop over the blades and not impede the progress of
the wood.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
On Oct 30, 7:59 am, Larry Jaques <novalidaddress@di\/ersify.com>
wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 21:07:37 -0700, the infamous "CW"
> <[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>
>
> >"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
> >On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
> >> those foolish enough to remove them),
>
> >> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
> >I didn't remove mine. I never put it on.
>
> Dina, my old 1920 tablesaur, came without a guard, a riving knife, and
> she's a real gaper. No zero-clearance here. She passes the nickel
> test if you count vibrating a flat nickel off her top. ;) Some day
> I'll straighten that motor shaft...
>
> --------------------------------------------
> Proud (occasional) maker of Hungarian Paper Towels
> ======================================================
I didn't have a nickel to test my saw, so I taped 5 pennies together.
It passed! (thanks, JOAT!) Tom
On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 21:07:37 -0700, the infamous "CW"
<[email protected]> scrawled the following:
>
>"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:d6914bf1-1cf9-43f1-abae-8985c02b7652@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
>On Sep 14, 9:08 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Yet if everyone in here went out to check their table saw guards (except
>> those foolish enough to remove them),
>
>> Any idea how many here HAVE removed their TS guards?
>
>
>
>I didn't remove mine. I never put it on.
Dina, my old 1920 tablesaur, came without a guard, a riving knife, and
she's a real gaper. No zero-clearance here. She passes the nickel
test if you count vibrating a flat nickel off her top. ;) Some day
I'll straighten that motor shaft...
--------------------------------------------
Proud (occasional) maker of Hungarian Paper Towels
======================================================
Robatoy wrote:
>>> The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
>>> of wood from flying backwards.
>> Are you sure about that? (not trying to be argumentative, here)
>>
>> I have a decent Delta 6" and I can slide a piece of wood forwards and
>> back against that smooth paint job, without much effort at all.
>>
>> To my knowledge the spring only exerts the minimal amount of force
>> required to keep the chop over the blades and not impede the progress of
>> the wood.
>>
> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>
Not buying it, sorry. :-)
All the cutter guards I've seen have a very smoothly painted surface and
are very easy to move.
Is this adjustment and/or purpose described in any jointer manual you
know?
Again, I'm not busting your balls.
Maybe the higher end planers have the feature and I just haven't seen it.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy wrote:
...
> Next time you edge joint a board...try to pull it back towards
> you...assuming you have a porkchop style guard.
It'll just slide--the edges are smooth and the spring isn't strong
enough. They're a knives guard and that's it.
If you can find any manufacturer in any user manual or safety
documentation make any representation otherwise, I'll color meself more
than surprised.
I just did a global search on the words guard and kickback in the Delta
manual I posted a link to earlier and there's a lot of references to
using push sticks and so on to guard against kickback but nary a word
that indicates the cutterhead guard has any role other than its function
by name.
Again, any semblance to being effective in an actual kickback event
(which I've never experienced in 40+ years on a jointer) is a fignewton
of your imagination... :)
--
-MIKE- wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>>>> The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal
>>>> piece of wood from flying backwards.
>>> Are you sure about that? (not trying to be argumentative, here)
>>>
>>> I have a decent Delta 6" and I can slide a piece of wood forwards
>>> and back against that smooth paint job, without much effort at all.
>>>
>>> To my knowledge the spring only exerts the minimal amount of force
>>> required to keep the chop over the blades and not impede the
>>> progress of the wood.
>>>
>> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement
>> backwards.
>>
>
> Not buying it, sorry. :-)
>
> All the cutter guards I've seen have a very smoothly painted surface
> and are very easy to move.
>
> Is this adjustment and/or purpose described in any jointer manual you
> know?
>
> Again, I'm not busting your balls.
> Maybe the higher end planers have the feature and I just haven't seen
> it.
If kickback is an issue with your planer you're doing something wrong IMO.
In article <[email protected]>,
Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
<<...snipped...>>
>If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
>
Maybe if the curved part of the guard had teeth cut into it like
a table saw anti-kickback pawl, but don't count on the typical jointer
guard to keep a board from moving. Just try letting go of a short board
during a deep cut and see what happens!
--
Often wrong, never in doubt.
Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org
Robatoy wrote:
>
> One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
> guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
> Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
> table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
Did it, the first time I replied, and it doesn't hold a bit.
With all do respect (because from your posts you obviously know your
stuff) I think the porkchop is the shape it is so that it will move out
of the way, in the same manner and with the same effort, not matter how
narrow or wide the board is, that is being pushed into it.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Nova wrote:
> Robatoy wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
>> guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
>> Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
>> table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
>> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
>
> The design of the porkchop shape is to allow the guard to cover the
> portion of the blades not being used when jointing varying width boards.
> Its design has nothing to do with preventing kickback.
>
> If you've tried running a board backwards through your jointer as you
> suggest you'll see the guard offer absolutely no resistance. I've tried
> it before I first suggested to you.
I think there are some limited circumstances where Rob's assertion will
be true (I just tried it to test my theory). If you're edge jointing a
relatively thin (say 4/4) board with the fence all the way retracted,
the guard will offer some amount of kickback protection, mainly because
the distance between the pivot point and the fence is maximized and
there is leverage present. As soon as the guard pivots further away
from the fence that leverage is lost.
--
Free bad advice available here.
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 13, 9:36 pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>> One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
>>> guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
>>> Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
>>> table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
>>> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
>> Did it, the first time I replied, and it doesn't hold a bit.
>>
>> With all do respect (because from your posts you obviously know your
>> stuff) I think the porkchop is the shape it is so that it will move out
>> of the way, in the same manner and with the same effort, not matter how
>> narrow or wide the board is, that is being pushed into it.
>>
> I appreciate your semi vote of confidence..LOL
> I did spend some time looking at a lot of images of cutter guards and
> it is clear that many won't do a thing to stop kick back. The european
> guards will not do a thing to stop kick-back. Like Mini Max, for
> instance.Conversely, many will, and many will at varying thicknesses
> (widths?)
> Some of the Powermatic ones look like they'd do a pretty good job at
> most of their spec'd widths.
> The General ones, like mine, are more 'iffy' at wider widths.
>
> In summation: Mine works like a cam and stops my being able to pull
> back a board, certainly up to 2" thick.
> Yours might not.
> Steve Turner's does, somewhat, up to a point.
> So... what izzit? Smooth or Crunchy?
Chocolate. :-)
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply
Robatoy <[email protected]> wrote:
:>
: If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
If you set the cam spring really tight, it'll bang so hard into the fence
you'll knock it out of square.
And you still won't prevent kickback. You'd need something to grip or
bite into the board if it started to move backwards.
-- Andy Barss
Robatoy wrote:
...
> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
It is beyond incredible the design was intended to have that function
and _NO_ manufacturer makes mention of it...
As somebody else noted, the shape has two functions --
a) cover the cutterhead for all positions of the fence for all widths of
stock, and
b) allow easy passage of material by it for the same conditions.
The shape comes from "form follows function".
Finis
--
Robatoy wrote:
> On Sep 13, 1:51 pm, Nova <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Robatoy wrote:
>>
>>>I see that the cutter is covered when the fence is all the way over to
>>>the edge.
>>>How is kick-back covered?
>>
>>How is kick back covered in ANY operation on a jointer? There are no
>>hardware provisions to control kick back on any jointer I've ever seen.
>>
>>--
>>Jack Novak
>>Buffalo, NY - USA
>>[email protected]
>
>
> The porkchop shaped guard works as a cam and will stop a normal piece
> of wood from flying backwards.
Try this:
1. Set your infeed table equal to the outfeed table.
2. With the jointer turned off run a board through the jointer in the
normal direction.
3. With the jointer turned off run the same board through the jointer
in the direction opposite normal.
4. Note the zero difference in resistance between steps 2 & 3.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
Robatoy wrote:
>
>
> One more try. Put a board...like a 2x4 in between the fence and the
> guard. (Without cutter running... for safety)
> Go to the front of the outfeed table and push back towards the infeed
> table. The guard should bind the work piece against the fence. Should.
> It is the whole point of the porkchop shape.
The design of the porkchop shape is to allow the guard to cover the
portion of the blades not being used when jointing varying width boards.
Its design has nothing to do with preventing kickback.
If you've tried running a board backwards through your jointer as you
suggest you'll see the guard offer absolutely no resistance. I've tried
it before I first suggested to you.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
"dpb" wrote:
> It almost always has been a design feature -- look at any vintage
> text or manufacturer's literature. That either one may be too young
> to have learned it or simply started after the router became
> ubiquitous is quite likely a major factor...
>
> It still works "most excellent" for the purpose...
There was also a time when blood letting was considered state of the
art medical practice.
Lew
On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On Sep 11, 12:26 pm, tom <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Sep 11, 7:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> > Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>> > planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
>> > than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
>> > boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
>> > impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
>> > could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>>
>> > Larry
>>
>> If the board's not too much wider than the jointer's capacity (25%
>> maybe?) and the grain not too argumentative, I'll pull off the guard
>> and make a few light passes while turning the board fore and aft. I
>> can usually get an acceptable/consistant face that'll allow the planer
>> to flatten the other side just fine, then turn her over and plane the
>> originally jointed face. Or just rip down to the jointer's width,
>> mill then glue as StephenM wrote. Tom
>
>Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
>dangerous that is?
>That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
>anti-kick-back device.
>
>That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
>anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
Wow, I would never remove a jointer guard! There are safer (and
wiser) methods.
On Fri, 11 Sep 2009 09:25:35 -0500, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Up to now I have been buying my lumber S4S. I recently purchased a 12"
>planer and have a 6" jointer. I'll true the face of any boards less
>than 6" on the jointer and then plane to thickness. How do I handle
>boards wider than 6"? Will the chatter marks on the rough cut lumber
>impede getting a smooth surface if I run it through the planer as is? I
>could experiment, but why mess up a decent board? <G>
>
>Larry
Forget about the jointer and run the boards through the planer only,
flipping the board between passes. There are certain guidelines to
follow (in terms of board shape, thickness, hardness etc) when using a
surface planer but a well-tuned planer should handle rough-cut lumber
with ease. Dust collection helps.
My 1948ish 4" HomeCraft / Delta is built to make a rabbit. Yes, you
remove the pork chop to do it.
Mike in Ohio
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "John Siegel" wrote:
>
>> But aren't you supposed to remove the guard to use the ledge to make
>> rabbets on a joiner? Of course, the fence
>> should be positioned to cover the unused portion of the blade.
>
> Trying to make rabbets with a joiner is a very poor choice of tools
> for a task IMHO.
>
> Lew
>
>
>
On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
> <[email protected]> wrote:
<snip>
>>
>> The cutterhead guard on my jointer would never do anything to prevent
>> kick back.
>>
>> To use the jointer to cut a rabbet the owner's manual states,
>>
>> "Rabbet Cut: A rabbet cut is a groove cut along the long edge of the
>> wood stock, usually used for making simple joints.
>>
>> The cutterhead guard must be removed for this operation, so great
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> care is needed for safe operation."
>
>
> I have never seen that done in real life. I can see it will work, but
> why do it?
I've used the jointer for rabbets on the occasions when the rabbet was
wide. One example was transition molding for flooring where the rabbet
was about 2.5" wide and 1/4" deep.
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]
On 09/13/2009 02:50 PM, Robatoy wrote:
> If set up properly, the cam action will impede the movement backwards.
Not buying it. If kickback were an issue, the european machines would
have dealt with it. As it stands, they have guards that always cover
the cutterhead and the stock slides under the guard. No provision
whatsoever for kickback prevention.
Chris
"Dr. Deb" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Phisherman wrote:
>
>
>
> I would have to agree. I just planed out a piece of walnut that was
> cupped.
> I planed a flat on one side, not fully smooth and then flipped it and took
> very light passes until I was planing the full board, then back over and
> cleaned up the first side. The result was a flat board with two smooth
> and
> flat sides.
>
> Deb
And this works more often than not if there is generally only one of a few
issues with the board. This is pretty much impossible if the board is
longer and has a bend from end to end and or a twist.
That said, I use a 8' long sled to set my rough cut wood on when sending it
throught my 15" planer.
On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Pull off the guard on a jointer? Do you have ANY idea how incredibly
> dangerous that is?
> That guard does more than just cover that meat-grinder. It is also an
> anti-kick-back device.
>
> That cutter will pull your hand IN and there will be no hope of
> anybody sewing a bucket of slime back onto your wrist.
>
The cutterhead guard on my jointer would never do anything to prevent
kick back.
To use the jointer to cut a rabbet the owner's manual states,
"Rabbet Cut: A rabbet cut is a groove cut along the long edge of the
wood stock, usually used for making simple joints.
The cutterhead guard must be removed for this operation, so great
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
care is needed for safe operation."
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
[email protected]