Electric Heater

"Denver Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> So after belly-aching about the different types of natural gas heating . . .
> I got the BRH-562 5600W/19000Btu unit that wound up costing $145 (including
> shipping). . .

> I do have one question (other than a request for a general analysis of
> thoughts above), and that is what are the safety considerations of a
> forced-air electric portable heater. The manual in the first link above
> does mention about allowing it to operate in dusty environments, but I have
> no experience with this type of heater. Any thoughts?

I suggest that the dust warning related to accumulation in the
heater which would reduce proper heat transfer - resulting in
overheating the element. The forced-air is probably only somewhat
forceful, so the unit should probably be blown out with compressed air
periodically.
The insulating dust would also reduce the heating efficiency, so if
the unit does not suffer meltdown, longer runtimes would increase the
cost of operation.
No mention was made of a thermostat - is one available?

The propane or fuel-oil construction heaters have a more forceful
circulation due to the combustion which occurs in addition to the fan.

"Denver Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> So after belly-aching about the different types of natural gas heating
> options for my garage and getting several expensive bids from contractors,
I
> was leaning towards installing a 45,000 Btu HotDawg heater myself. That
> option was still going to cost around $750, as I would've had to pay some
> friends to do the gas and electric (at fairly cheap labor rates). It was
> recommended to me by a relative to consider just an electric unit, as the
> natural gas prices here in Colorado are projected (by the gas company
> itself) to increase about 75% this winter. Also, it was expected that the
> electric unit heaters would be cheaper to purchase and install anyway. So
I
> wound up ordering this unit...
>
> http://www.marleymeh.com/Develop/products/portheat/QBRH.htm
>
> at this site...
>
> http://www.thermalinc.com/comfort/berko_brh.htm
>
> I got the BRH-562 5600W/19000Btu unit that wound up costing $145
(including
> shipping). My brother-in-law will install the 240V/30A line for only the
> cost of parts (negligible). So I've saved a ton of money and will get a
> 220V outlet in my garage for the eventual tool that will need it, and I
> expect it will be a long time before the difference in heating costs
between
> electric and natural gas compensate for the purchase/installation savings.
> Plus, it may just not be the case here in Colorado that natural gas is
> cheaper to operate than electric...I don't know, I haven't done the math.
>
> I do have one question (other than a request for a general analysis of
> thoughts above), and that is what are the safety considerations of a
> forced-air electric portable heater. The manual in the first link above
> does mention about allowing it to operate in dusty environments, but I
have
> no experience with this type of heater. Any thoughts?
>
> Thanks,
> DW

I guess I have a question and an observation. First, how did you go from a
45,000 BTU gas heater to a 19,000 BTU electric? Seems like a large
disparity. I would have guessed you needed the 45,000 BTU since a 30,000
BTU Hot Dawg is also available.
My comment (very open for discussion - I'm not an energy consultant) is
this. First, I'm only going by the energy costs here in Chicago. I have no
idea what prices are in CO. Electric rates here are roughly $0.07 /kWh and
gas (last winter) was roughly $0.13/therm (1 therm = 100,000 BTU). Your
electric heater is rated at 5600W, which would cost $0.40/hr to operate. In
contrast, 19,000 BTU would cost about $0.03/hr. You gotta run a fan either
way, so I'm not including that...probably negligible anyway. The 30,000 BTU
Hot Dawg is available for $420 + shipping (we'll call it $450). Let's say
there's a $300 difference between that and the electric unit. At the
difference in energy costs, it would take 800 hours to break even. It's not
a direct comparison because we're talking about 19k vs 30k bTU. I'm leaving
out the cost of running gas or electric because my guess is that those would
come close to evening out. For a gas unit, you'd obviously have to run a
gas line, but you wouldn't have to run a 30A circuit. A lot of us don't
have 25-30 amps to spare anyway, so electric wouldn't even be an option.

It all depends on how much you're in the shop and how you heat it as to
where the 800 hours falls. My guess is that for most of us, 800 hours of
use would take us out quite a few winters.

todd

todd.

> I guess I have a question and an observation. First, how did you go from
a
> 45,000 BTU gas heater to a 19,000 BTU electric? Seems like a large
> disparity. I would have guessed you needed the 45,000 BTU since a 30,000
> BTU Hot Dawg is also available.

Todd-

That's the one disparity that didn't completely make sense to me. I came
across one website that indicated that 10W were needed for every square
foot...approximately. So for my 20' X 20' shop of 400 square feet that
comes to 4000W. The unit I purchased produces 5600W, which supposedly is
equivalent (don't know the conversion factor on this one) to 19,000 Btu. I
guess I'll just have to wait and see how I fare. The price difference
between this and the Hot Dawg 45,000 Btu unit was $300 (not including the
venting and the thermostat for the Hot Dawg), and installation of that Hot
Dawg would've increased that difference.

The other factor was that I was told by one contractor that if my gas unit
caused a fire and I didn't pull a permit, my insurance company wouldn't pay
for anything. So pulling permits would've tacked on even more money. I'm
"comfortable" with having a person I know do the electrical work for the
electric heater without pulling a permit, but I was a little leary about the
gas unit when you consider the factor of the gas lines, the electrical
lines, combustion in the heater, and the proper exhausting of the
by-products. I guess I've got a little fear of the unknown to not pull
permits in that case...and so I went with the safer, cheaper option.

This is not likely going to be a permanent home for us, so I thought a
temporary, cheap solution might be prudent in this case, especially given
the complexity of decisions and the money involved with going with a gas
unit.

Thanks,
DW

"Tom Kendrick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Denver Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > So after belly-aching about the different types of natural gas heating .
. .
> > I got the BRH-562 5600W/19000Btu unit that wound up costing $145
(including
> > shipping). . .
>
> > I do have one question (other than a request for a general analysis of
> > thoughts above), and that is what are the safety considerations of a
> > forced-air electric portable heater. The manual in the first link above
> > does mention about allowing it to operate in dusty environments, but I
have
> > no experience with this type of heater. Any thoughts?
>
> I suggest that the dust warning related to accumulation in the
> heater which would reduce proper heat transfer - resulting in
> overheating the element. The forced-air is probably only somewhat
> forceful, so the unit should probably be blown out with compressed air
> periodically.
> The insulating dust would also reduce the heating efficiency, so if
> the unit does not suffer meltdown, longer runtimes would increase the
> cost of operation.
> No mention was made of a thermostat - is one available?
>
> The propane or fuel-oil construction heaters have a more forceful
> circulation due to the combustion which occurs in addition to the fan.

This unit does have a thermostat. As a unit "designed to be placed on the
ground", it probably is already going to see more dust exposure than a
ceiling or wall-mounted gas unit. Blowing out the dust (I do have a
compressor, thankfully) is a good idea.

Thanks,
DW

todd wrote:

> It all depends on how much you're in the shop and how you heat it as to
> where the 800 hours falls. My guess is that for most of us, 800 hours of
> use would take us out quite a few winters.

Yeah, unfortunately. :(

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

I faced a similar dilemma last year. I bought a propane job site heater for
$125. It's 80,000 BTU and boy does it get my garage shop toasty. I'm not
sure if I would've went with an electric, as the price of that is pretty
steep. last winter here in CT I only used 2.5 20 lb. propane tanks, so I
think that's about $30 worth of fuel.

Mike

"Denver Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> So after belly-aching about the different types of natural gas heating
> options for my garage and getting several expensive bids from contractors,
I
> was leaning towards installing a 45,000 Btu HotDawg heater myself. That
> option was still going to cost around $750, as I would've had to pay some
> friends to do the gas and electric (at fairly cheap labor rates). It was
> recommended to me by a relative to consider just an electric unit, as the
> natural gas prices here in Colorado are projected (by the gas company
> itself) to increase about 75% this winter. Also, it was expected that the
> electric unit heaters would be cheaper to purchase and install anyway. So
I
> wound up ordering this unit...
>
> http://www.marleymeh.com/Develop/products/portheat/QBRH.htm
>
> at this site...
>
> http://www.thermalinc.com/comfort/berko_brh.htm
>
> I got the BRH-562 5600W/19000Btu unit that wound up costing $145
(including
> shipping). My brother-in-law will install the 240V/30A line for only the
> cost of parts (negligible). So I've saved a ton of money and will get a
> 220V outlet in my garage for the eventual tool that will need it, and I
> expect it will be a long time before the difference in heating costs
between
> electric and natural gas compensate for the purchase/installation savings.
> Plus, it may just not be the case here in Colorado that natural gas is
> cheaper to operate than electric...I don't know, I haven't done the math.
>
> I do have one question (other than a request for a general analysis of
> thoughts above), and that is what are the safety considerations of a
> forced-air electric portable heater. The manual in the first link above
> does mention about allowing it to operate in dusty environments, but I
have
> no experience with this type of heater. Any thoughts?
>
> Thanks,
> DW
>
>