Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and after
removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.
First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should be no
more water penetration.
Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the end of
the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and rafter meet and
they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jpg
Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below the leak
is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached, the section
labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now the good news is
that the roof is still up and it has been like this for years this truss has
not been supporting it's share of the load for a long time now. The ends
where it is rotted away is about 12" or so in length.
I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove "A" and
"B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be near
impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric conduits
nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very tight space.
So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one adjacent to
the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the entire length. The
question is now should I attach the two?
Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts through
both and tie them together?
Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both together?
Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them together?
Or all of the above?
I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new sister
rafter and joist.
Or this is all wrong?
Thanks in advance,
MC
Brace, jack, shim, shore. Do whatever to get everything
straightened out. Check the roof line and the ceiling joist line.
I am a bit surprised if there are no signs of the rotted out
portion.
Remove and replace any wood that has active rot - cut back to good
sound wood.
If you can put in 12 footers, do it. If there are any other truss
members, duplicate them also. Sister the new members on using
plenty of panel adhesive and a generous nail pattern using common
nails alternating a high/low nail pattern. If the existing truss
is old and well seasoned, you may need to use a nail gun or pre
drill a lead hole. Air gun nails are thinner and do not generate
the same sheer numbers that common nails do.
Custom cut a plywood gusset for each side of the damaged truss
that fits fairly well from the bottom of the bottom chord to
rafter top, from outside plate line to whatever 4' plywood would
cover, keep the grain vertical. Use good marine grade 7 ply.
Glue everything. Throughbolt ply to ply with 3/8 bolts with
fender washers. The sandwich will be about 4 1/2" thick.
--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)
[email protected]
"MiamiCuse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage,
> and after removing some sections of it I realized there is more
> damage.
>
> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there
> should be no more water penetration.
>
> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as
> the end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist
> and rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as
> shown below:
>
> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jpg
>
> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly
> below the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image
> attached, the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just
> crumbled. Now the good news is that the roof is still up and it
> has been like this for years this truss has not been supporting
> it's share of the load for a long time now. The ends where it
> is rotted away is about 12" or so in length.
>
> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to
> remove "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is
> going to be near impossible with all the AC duct work running
> across, electric conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and
> fans etc...and very tight space.
>
> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
> adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost
> the entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?
>
> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2")
> bolts through both and tie them together?
>
> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
> together?
>
> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
> together?
>
> Or all of the above?
>
> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
> sister rafter and joist.
>
> Or this is all wrong?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> MC
>
"steve robinson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> MiamiCuse wrote:
>
>> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
>> after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.
>>
>> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
>> be no more water penetration.
>>
>> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
>> end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
>> rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:
>>
>> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jp
>> g
>>
>> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
>> the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
>> the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
>> the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
>> for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
>> for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
>> or so in length.
>>
>> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
>> "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
>> near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
>> conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
>> tight space.
>>
>> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
>> adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
>> entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?
>>
>> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
>> through both and tie them together?
>>
>> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
>> together?
>>
>> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
>> together?
>>
>> Or all of the above?
>>
>> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
>> sister rafter and joist.
>>
>> Or this is all wrong?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> MC
>
> Cut back the rot treat the timber
>
> bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
> spike washers / timber connectors
>
> Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair
>
> before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
> rest of the system and prop it in place
>
> --
>
Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are those the
metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing nails?
Thanks.
MC
OK. So to create plywood gusset in the end like in this picture:
http://www.sweethaven02.com/BldgConst/Bldg02/fig0104.jpg
only make it as big as possible to reach as far back?
Since my sister timber will be right next to the existing one with the last
12" rotted out, how will this help? so instead of a 2x4, with my reinforced
timber it will have a total of 4x4 in size, how would a gusset along the
"side face" help? I must not be visualizing something correctly.
Thanks, MC
"DanG" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Homemade trusses were and are made with plywood gussets glued and nailed
> instead of the gang press plates used at truss factories. You and I have
> no way to press those plates into the lumber. The suggestion was to use
> plywood gussets that you can glue, nail, bolt, etc.
>
> ____________________________
> Keep the whole world singing . . . .
> DanG (remove the sevens)
> [email protected]
>
>
>
> "MiamiCuse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "steve robinson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> MiamiCuse wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
>>>> after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.
>>>>
>>>> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
>>>> be no more water penetration.
>>>>
>>>> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
>>>> end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
>>>> rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:
>>>>
>>>> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jp
>>>> g
>>>>
>>>> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
>>>> the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
>>>> the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
>>>> the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
>>>> for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
>>>> for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
>>>> or so in length.
>>>>
>>>> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
>>>> "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
>>>> near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
>>>> conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
>>>> tight space.
>>>>
>>>> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
>>>> adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
>>>> entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?
>>>>
>>>> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
>>>> through both and tie them together?
>>>>
>>>> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
>>>> together?
>>>>
>>>> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
>>>> together?
>>>>
>>>> Or all of the above?
>>>>
>>>> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
>>>> sister rafter and joist.
>>>>
>>>> Or this is all wrong?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>>
>>>> MC
>>>
>>> Cut back the rot treat the timber
>>>
>>> bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
>>> spike washers / timber connectors
>>>
>>> Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair
>>>
>>> before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
>>> rest of the system and prop it in place
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>
>> Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are those the
>> metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing nails?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> MC
>>
>
>
"DanG" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Brace, jack, shim, shore. Do whatever to get everything straightened out.
> Check the roof line and the ceiling joist line. I am a bit surprised if
> there are no signs of the rotted out portion.
Nope. What happened was the water ran down the rotted wood member (since
it's sloped) and at the end there drip into the block wall. The block wall
has furring strips on them, then sheet rock. Then a custom floor to ceiling
book case was mounted on the studs. So most of the staining was on the
sheet rock and furring strips and the book case blocked everything. It was
not until I ripped the book case out then the sheet rock I saw this.
>
> Remove and replace any wood that has active rot - cut back to good sound
> wood.
>
Done that.
> If you can put in 12 footers, do it. If there are any other truss
> members, duplicate them also. Sister the new members on using plenty of
> panel adhesive and a generous nail pattern using common nails alternating
> a high/low nail pattern. If the existing truss is old and well seasoned,
> you may need to use a nail gun or pre drill a lead hole. Air gun nails
> are thinner and do not generate the same sheer numbers that common nails
> do.
Yes existing lumber there is 35 years old.
>
> Custom cut a plywood gusset for each side of the damaged truss that fits
> fairly well from the bottom of the bottom chord to rafter top, from
> outside plate line to whatever 4' plywood would cover, keep the grain
> vertical. Use good marine grade 7 ply. Glue everything. Throughbolt ply
> to ply with 3/8 bolts with fender washers. The sandwich will be about 4
> 1/2" thick.
OK you mean to use the gusset on one side which is the damaged wood, the
other side will be over the new sistering wood right? Making the total
width 4 1/2".
What is the reason to use a gusset on the good side which is new?
The other problem I see is I would like to use a piece as large as possible
like up to 4' you suggested. However a big issue is there are AC ducts
running through there, and that would limit how far back I can go. Also
there is no way I can cut a piece this big and get it up through the 24"
hatch access and pass it through other trusses. I would have to cut an
access hole over 6' in length right where this is happening to get it in
there and still the AC duct would be in the way.
Can I use a gusset on either side of the AC duct?
Thanks,
MC
>
> --
> ______________________________
> Keep the whole world singing . . . .
> DanG (remove the sevens)
> [email protected]
>
>
>
> "MiamiCuse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and after
>> removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.
>>
>> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should be
>> no more water penetration.
>>
>> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the end of
>> the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and rafter meet and
>> they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:
>>
>> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jpg
>>
>> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below the
>> leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached, the
>> section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now the
>> good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this for
>> years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load for a
>> long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12" or so in
>> length.
>>
>> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove "A"
>> and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be near
>> impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric conduits
>> nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very tight space.
>>
>> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one adjacent
>> to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the entire length.
>> The question is now should I attach the two?
>>
>> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
>> through both and tie them together?
>>
>> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both together?
>>
>> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them together?
>>
>> Or all of the above?
>>
>> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new sister
>> rafter and joist.
>>
>> Or this is all wrong?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> MC
>>
>
>
Homemade trusses were and are made with plywood gussets glued and
nailed instead of the gang press plates used at truss factories.
You and I have no way to press those plates into the lumber. The
suggestion was to use plywood gussets that you can glue, nail,
bolt, etc.
____________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)
[email protected]
"MiamiCuse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "steve robinson" <[email protected]> wrote in
> message news:[email protected]...
>> MiamiCuse wrote:
>>
>>> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage,
>>> and
>>> after removing some sections of it I realized there is more
>>> damage.
>>>
>>> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there
>>> should
>>> be no more water penetration.
>>>
>>> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as
>>> the
>>> end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist
>>> and
>>> rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown
>>> below:
>>>
>>> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jp
>>> g
>>>
>>> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly
>>> below
>>> the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image
>>> attached,
>>> the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just
>>> crumbled. Now
>>> the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been
>>> like this
>>> for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the
>>> load
>>> for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is
>>> about 12"
>>> or so in length.
>>>
>>> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to
>>> remove
>>> "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is
>>> going to be
>>> near impossible with all the AC duct work running across,
>>> electric
>>> conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and
>>> very
>>> tight space.
>>>
>>> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put
>>> one
>>> adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for
>>> almost the
>>> entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?
>>>
>>> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2")
>>> bolts
>>> through both and tie them together?
>>>
>>> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue
>>> both
>>> together?
>>>
>>> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
>>> together?
>>>
>>> Or all of the above?
>>>
>>> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the
>>> new
>>> sister rafter and joist.
>>>
>>> Or this is all wrong?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>
>>> MC
>>
>> Cut back the rot treat the timber
>>
>> bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber
>> insert
>> spike washers / timber connectors
>>
>> Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair
>>
>> before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment
>> with the
>> rest of the system and prop it in place
>>
>> --
>>
>
> Got it, except for one part - what is a 18mm ply gusset? Are
> those the metal plates with lots of holes in it for framing
> nails?
>
> Thanks.
>
> MC
>
MiamiCuse wrote:
> Hi I am repairing some stained ceiling sheetrock in my garage, and
> after removing some sections of it I realized there is more damage.
>
> First the leak in the roof has been found and repair, so there should
> be no more water penetration.
>
> Now I can see the water leak has been there for a long time as the
> end of the truss were severly damaged. The end of the joist and
> rafter meet and they rest on the concrete block wall as shown below:
>
> http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w67/143house/framing/garagetruss.jp
> g
>
> Now there is a truss every 24" or so but one of them directly below
> the leak is damaged very badly. If you look at the image attached,
> the section labeled "C" in green when I pushed it just crumbled. Now
> the good news is that the roof is still up and it has been like this
> for years this truss has not been supporting it's share of the load
> for a long time now. The ends where it is rotted away is about 12"
> or so in length.
>
> I went up to the attic and tried to see if it's possible to remove
> "A" and "B" completely and put new lumbers in but this is going to be
> near impossible with all the AC duct work running across, electric
> conduits nailed along it, ceiling hi hats and fans etc...and very
> tight space.
>
> So what I plan to do is to get two 12' 2x4s. I plan to put one
> adjacent to the rafter and one adjacent to the joist for almost the
> entire length. The question is now should I attach the two?
>
> Should I drill a hole every 18" or so and insert large (1/2") bolts
> through both and tie them together?
>
> Or should I use some sort of structural glue/epocy to glue both
> together?
>
> Or should I use those galvanized steel tie/straps to nail them
> together?
>
> Or all of the above?
>
> I also plan to insert some vertical wood members between the new
> sister rafter and joist.
>
> Or this is all wrong?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> MC
Cut back the rot treat the timber
bolt your timber either side , between the truss and timber insert
spike washers / timber connectors
Fit a 18mm ply gusset over the repair
before you do any of the above check the truss for alignment with the
rest of the system and prop it in place
--