On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:20 +0000, jo4hn wrote
(in article <[email protected]>):
> Digger wrote:
>> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>> laminate) surface.
>> Thanks in advance
>> kenneth
> KY Jelly. grape.
Don't ya just hate it when your tongue sticks in the mitre slot?
On Feb 10, 10:33=A0am, jo4hn <[email protected]> wrote:
> Digger wrote:
> > Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
> > better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
> > laminate) surface.
> > Thanks in advance
> > kenneth
>
> KY Jelly. =A0grape.
Try the bacon.
On Feb 9, 5:36=A0pm, Digger <[email protected]> wrote:
> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
> laminate) surface.
> Thanks in advance
> kenneth
Try Plexus. Available at any motorcycle shop or plastics company.
It's used for motorcycle windshields. I used it on mine. Your most
economical resource is definitely Johnson's Paste Wax or Minwax
Paste. A little more work, but definitely less expensive and a great
slide for your wood. When I didn't have Plexus, I did use Top Coat
and it was the best. Economic times have changed that now. :-(
Jimmy Mac wrote:
> On Feb 10, 1:38 pm, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Jimmy Mac wrote:
>>
>>> Try Plexus.
>> Got a reasonably priced source?
>>
>> I use that on airplane windshields, because I have to, and I pay more
>> for a can of Plexus than Top Cote.
>
> Top Cote runs around $17.95 here in Vegas
> Plexus is $9.25 at Jensen USA
> http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/CM407E01-Plexus+Plastic+Cleaner+Spray.aspx?sc=FRGL
7 oz. can? <G> That would clean my windshield 3 times.
I pay ~ $13.95 for a 16 oz. can at the airplane supply house. Top Cote
is ~ $12.95, for the big can locally.
"Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
> laminate) surface.
> Thanks in advance
> kenneth
Right now Woodworkers Hardware has it for $8.72 for a 10.75 oz can.
Empire products, the original makers of Top Coat makes an equally effective
product.
Sac Dave wrote:
> "Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>>better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>>laminate) surface.
>>Thanks in advance
>>kenneth
>
>
> I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
Some automotive waxes contain silicone, which can cause finishing
problems if it gets on your wood. Whether or not enough will transfer
from the saw to the wood to cause problems may depend on how much is
applied and how well it's buffed off.
Chris
On Feb 12, 10:04=A0am, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>
> > Somehow I think you missed my point. =A0Any silicone transferred to the
> > wood will get sanded off before finishing.
>
> You'd be surprised...
Does that mean it would be an "eye opener?" Get it - fish eye . . .
eye opener????
Lord forgive me and bless the Pygmies in New Guinea . . . amen. :-)
Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> writes:
> I usually cut my wood BEFORE I sand it - why would I worry about a
> miniscule transfer of silicone to unsanded wood?
Because silicone can cause fisheyes in the finish.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Buy some BoeLube. Not cheap, but EXCELLENT and will not interfere
> with finishing.
Which one do you use and where do you get it? I am looking here,
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/boelube.php
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 08:19:46 -0500, Maxwell Lol wrote:
> Larry Blanchard <[email protected]> writes:
>
>> I usually cut my wood BEFORE I sand it - why would I worry about a
>> miniscule transfer of silicone to unsanded wood?
>
> Because silicone can cause fisheyes in the finish.
Somehow I think you missed my point. Any silicone transferred to the
wood will get sanded off before finishing.
"Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
> laminate) surface.
> Thanks in advance
> kenneth
I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
"Larry Blanchard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:09:03 +0000, Doug Miller wrote:
>
> That may be true. I live in Eastern Washington and my shop is unheated/
> uncooled except when I'm in it. We have low humidity in the summer and
> high humidity in the winter. No rust problems.
>
> But it may also be the application of the wax. When I first get a power
> tool with a cast iron top, it seems I have to apply wax every month or
> so. Over time this requirement gradually diminishes until after a couple
> of years I only have to do it once or twice a year. Seems the pores get
> filled up.
The first day that I had my new saw, 8 years ago, I coated the top with
Boeshield. So much so that the top was not visible until I wiped it down.
I had been using TopCote and or what ever what they were calling it at the
time for about 12 years prior, then I continued to assemble the saw. There
was rust the next morning and oddly I never get condensing moisture that is
visible.
Back then the product was sold as a top lubricant, I was pleasantly
surprised back in the late 80's when I discovered that it also prevented
rust, Bonus!. Say what you will about Craftsman TSs, Mine had the rough
grind cast iron top. It always processed wood more smoothly than the top on
my Jet cabinet saw. Better brand equipment does not have highly polished
work surfaces. The ground grooves in the top provided/s less friction.
J. Clarke wrote:
> Sac Dave wrote:
>> "Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>>> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>>> laminate) surface.
>>> Thanks in advance
>>> kenneth
>>
>> I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
>
> Not a good idea, unless you're absolutely sure it doesn't contain
> silicone. If you're going to use wax, Johnson's or Butcher's is a
> better bet. Personally I use Boeshield, which one can get at Sears.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I love it! Glad you have a sense of humor.
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA
You know what I always say...
In article <[email protected]>, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
>BTW, my old shop was in the basement that got water in it when it
>rained. Wax was horrible as a lubricant and lasted about no time before
>rust reared it's ugly head.
It seems to me that whether wax works for you, or not, depends on the
humidity. I live in Indianapolis; not the most arid part of the U.S. by a
long shot, but nothing like the Gulf Coast either. My shop is also in the
basement, but I don't have water infiltration problems, and I run
dehumidifiers year-round. Wax works just fine as a rust protectant for me.
Leon, who lives in Houston, and has his shop in the garage IIRC, has a *very*
different opinion of how well wax works as a rust protectant. <g>
"Jack Stein" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I bought this 3M dry Lube in the 1970's. My buddy worked for 3M and he was
> at a seminar or something in Minnesota or where ever their head quarters
> are and he found this stuff in the company store. Not sure if it was
> available any where else but I assume it was. I can't be the only living
> guy around that knew about it though, and it I will attest it worked
> unbelievably well for our purposes as woodworkers, and much better than
> wax. The can said it was good to 400° F so probably good for saw blades
> too, but I don't think I ever tried that, figured it would be a waste of
> time.
>
> I don't suppose you recognized the can or you would have said something.
I recognized the style label, they changed to a picture on the label in the
90's. I did not recognize the product, that said I was only dealing with
the automotive 3M products. I always had an endless supply of sand paper.
The seminar was probably in Minnesota, their head quarters location, 3M,
Minnesota Mining & Manufacturing.
>
> The can has lots of warnings about breathing the stuff and even said don't
> smoke or even keep tobacco products in the work area. I figured the stuff
> would cause cancer in a few minutes of use so 3M quit making it and denied
> even knowing about it.:-)
>
> TopCote was
>> originally developed and manufactured by the current makers of Empire
>> products. They also manufactured a bearing lubricant for router bits,
>> and a lubricant for router bit and saw cutting edges. The original
>> TopCote products were dispensed from a plastic pump bottle. It went on
>> and looked the same as it does now. Empire TopSaver and their other
>> products are again/also dispensed from a plastic pump bottle.
>
> I've only used TopCoat, I cleaned off all my tops with lacquer thinner,
> and spayed it on about 6 months ago... still slick, and no rust. Thing
> is, with absolutely nothing on my tops, it takes about a year for my tops
> to turn a rusty color. My old shop that would happen in hours, and with
> wax about a month or less. The 3M stuff lasted about a year of heavy
> (hobbyist, not commercial) use in the nastiest of conditions. I still
> have some in the can but the aerosol went south. If the TopCoat is half
> as good, I'll be happy.
I originally started using the TopCote back in the 80's before it was sold
to Bostitch. I kinda swap off between Empire Top Saver and TopCote. The
Empire Top Saver will clean the top very nicely, it will get rid of the rust
and most of the patina stains. It also retards the formation of rust. My
top never had any rust so to speak while using TopCote but it would get that
dark color. I tried TopSaver with a 3M Scotch Brite pad setting under my
ROS and spent about 2 or 3 minutes letting the ROS scrub in the product and
wiped it clean afterwards. That 7 year old top looked almost new again.
Oddly, and you have to try it to believe it, put a small drop of "Titebond
or like" glue on a tarnished spot on your cast iron top, let it dry and pop
the dried glue off with your finger nail. The iron will be silvery in color
once again. I accidentally discovered this several years ago when gluing up
a project on top of the saw. Several drops fell on the surface and I was
quite surprised when I cleaned the dry glue off.
Jimmy Mac wrote:
> On Feb 12, 10:04 am, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>>
>>> Somehow I think you missed my point. Any silicone transferred to the
>>> wood will get sanded off before finishing.
>> You'd be surprised...
>
> Does that mean it would be an "eye opener?" Get it - fish eye . . .
> eye opener????
>
> Lord forgive me and bless the Pygmies in New Guinea . . . amen. :-)
Peace on you. You are forgiven.
Go4d
On Feb 10, 1:38=A0pm, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> Jimmy Mac wrote:
>
> > Try Plexus.
>
> Got a reasonably priced source?
>
> I use that on airplane windshields, because I have to, and I pay more
> for a can of Plexus than Top Cote.
Top Cote runs around $17.95 here in Vegas
Plexus is $9.25 at Jensen USA
http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/CM407E01-Plexus+Plastic+Cleaner+Spra=
y.aspx?sc=3DFRGL
On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:55:52 -0600, Chris Friesen
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Sac Dave wrote:
>> "Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>>>better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>>>laminate) surface.
>>>Thanks in advance
>>>kenneth
>>
>>
>> I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
>
>Some automotive waxes contain silicone, which can cause finishing
>problems if it gets on your wood. Whether or not enough will transfer
>from the saw to the wood to cause problems may depend on how much is
>applied and how well it's buffed off.
>
>Chris
Buy some BoeLube. Not cheap, but EXCELLENT and will not interfere
with finishing.
Sac Dave wrote:
> "Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>> laminate) surface.
>> Thanks in advance
>> kenneth
>
> I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
Not a good idea, unless you're absolutely sure it doesn't contain
silicone. If you're going to use wax, Johnson's or Butcher's is a
better bet. Personally I use Boeshield, which one can get at Sears.
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Larry Blanchard wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 13:04:02 -0500, B A R R Y wrote:
>
>> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>>>
>>> Somehow I think you missed my point. Any silicone transferred to the
>>> wood will get sanded off before finishing.
>>
>> You'd be surprised...
>
> I haven't been yet :-).
Don't let experience get in the way of the facts...
BTW, my old shop was in the basement that got water in it when it
rained. Wax was horrible as a lubricant and lasted about no time before
rust reared it's ugly head. I stumbled over a spray lube from 3M that
worked almost exactly like Top Coat, and never once got any rust and
wood slid like there was ZERO friction, like it was on an air cushion.
They apparently no longer make the stuff so I bought some Top Coat. It
goes on the same and slides just as good as the 3M stuff. How well it
stops rust or lasts I don't know because I no longer have a water
problem and rust is almost a non-issue, and I've only used top coat a
few months, one coat still is working fine, little usage though.
I paid $9.99 for a spray can of Top Coat at a local wood machinery
dealer. After using wax and Top Coat, Top Coat wins hands down.
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com
Doug Miller wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, Jack Stein <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> BTW, my old shop was in the basement that got water in it when it
>> rained. Wax was horrible as a lubricant and lasted about no time before
>> rust reared it's ugly head.
>
> It seems to me that whether wax works for you, or not, depends on the
> humidity. I live in Indianapolis; not the most arid part of the U.S. by a
> long shot, but nothing like the Gulf Coast either. My shop is also in the
> basement, but I don't have water infiltration problems, and I run
> dehumidifiers year-round. Wax works just fine as a rust protectant for me.
>
> Leon, who lives in Houston, and has his shop in the garage IIRC, has a *very*
> different opinion of how well wax works as a rust protectant. <g>
Yes, my shop was an extreme condition. I figure if wax didn't work
under those circumstances and something else did, then that something
else would work better under more normal conditions. Unfortunately,
that something that worked is no longer available. I even sent email to
3M with the product number (I still have an empty can of it from 28
years ago) They sent me back they didn't know nothing about it... Top
Coat has very similar looking can though, check out the Old 3M can and
the new TopCoat can here in these side by side pictures I took:
http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube1.jpg
http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube2.jpg
Top Coat I know goes on the same as the 3M stuff did, and it is super
slick, as the 3M stuff was. How durable or long lasting and how good it
is at protecting against rust I don't know, because I don't use my tools
as much as I did, and my shop now is dry as a bone, other than normal
Pittsburgh humidity. So far though, my $10 can of top coat is doing the
job.
Anyhow, if anyone knows anything about the 3M product pictured, I'd LOVE
to know about it.
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com
Leon wrote:
> "Jack Stein" wrote in message
Top Coat has very
>> similar looking can though, check out the Old 3M can and the new TopCoat
>> can here in these side by side pictures I took:
>>
>> http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube1.jpg
>> http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube2.jpg
> Food for thought, I bought and sold 3M products in the 70's, 80's, and
> 90's. Pretty much all their aerosol products looked the same.
I bought this 3M dry Lube in the 1970's. My buddy worked for 3M and he
was at a seminar or something in Minnesota or where ever their head
quarters are and he found this stuff in the company store. Not sure if
it was available any where else but I assume it was. I can't be the
only living guy around that knew about it though, and it I will attest
it worked unbelievably well for our purposes as woodworkers, and much
better than wax. The can said it was good to 400° F so probably good
for saw blades too, but I don't think I ever tried that, figured it
would be a waste of time.
I don't suppose you recognized the can or you would have said something.
The can has lots of warnings about breathing the stuff and even said
don't smoke or even keep tobacco products in the work area. I figured
the stuff would cause cancer in a few minutes of use so 3M quit making
it and denied even knowing about it.:-)
TopCote was
> originally developed and manufactured by the current makers of Empire
> products. They also manufactured a bearing lubricant for router bits, and a
> lubricant for router bit and saw cutting edges. The original TopCote
> products were dispensed from a plastic pump bottle. It went on and looked
> the same as it does now. Empire TopSaver and their other products are
> again/also dispensed from a plastic pump bottle.
I've only used TopCoat, I cleaned off all my tops with lacquer thinner,
and spayed it on about 6 months ago... still slick, and no rust. Thing
is, with absolutely nothing on my tops, it takes about a year for my
tops to turn a rusty color. My old shop that would happen in hours, and
with wax about a month or less. The 3M stuff lasted about a year of
heavy (hobbyist, not commercial) use in the nastiest of conditions. I
still have some in the can but the aerosol went south. If the TopCoat
is half as good, I'll be happy.
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 18:19:06 -0600, Larry Blanchard
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 13:04:02 -0500, B A R R Y wrote:
>
>> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>>>
>>> Somehow I think you missed my point. Any silicone transferred to the
>>> wood will get sanded off before finishing.
>>
>>
>> You'd be surprised...
>
>I haven't been yet :-).
Wait 'till you use some porous wood, like walnut.
On Mon, 09 Feb 2009 19:36:27 -0600, Digger <[email protected]> wrote:
>Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>laminate) surface.
>Thanks in advance
>kenneth
For half the price you can get a can of Johnson's Wax that will last
10 years or more. I use it on the plastic laminate tablesaw extension
too. Usually I hand buff, sometimes use an electric auto buffer. No
rust at all, but having A/C in the shop helps.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:14:17 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
> Sac Dave wrote:
>> "Digger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>>> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>>> laminate) surface.
>>> Thanks in advance
>>> kenneth
>>
>> I just use any automotive paste wax one can will last years
>
> Not a good idea, unless you're absolutely sure it doesn't contain
> silicone. If you're going to use wax, Johnson's or Butcher's is a
> better bet. Personally I use Boeshield, which one can get at Sears.
>
> --
I usually cut my wood BEFORE I sand it - why would I worry about a
miniscule transfer of silicone to unsanded wood?
BTW, I like Trewax better than Johnsons - haven't tried Butchers.
After a couple of years of monthly use (approx.) I now wax once or twice
a year. In an unheated shop in a wet winter climate I never see rust.
Well, there was the time I set a piece of green wood on the tablesaw
overnight :-(.
"Jack Stein" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Doug Miller wrote:
>> In article <[email protected]>, Jack Stein
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>
> Yes, my shop was an extreme condition. I figure if wax didn't work under
> those circumstances and something else did, then that something else would
> work better under more normal conditions. Unfortunately, that something
> that worked is no longer available. I even sent email to 3M with the
> product number (I still have an empty can of it from 28 years ago) They
> sent me back they didn't know nothing about it... Top Coat has very
> similar looking can though, check out the Old 3M can and the new TopCoat
> can here in these side by side pictures I took:
>
> http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube1.jpg
> http://jbstein.com/Flick/Lube2.jpg
>
> Top Coat I know goes on the same as the 3M stuff did, and it is super
> slick, as the 3M stuff was. How durable or long lasting and how good it
> is at protecting against rust I don't know, because I don't use my tools
> as much as I did, and my shop now is dry as a bone, other than normal
> Pittsburgh humidity. So far though, my $10 can of top coat is doing the
> job.
Food for thought, I bought and sold 3M products in the 70's, 80's, and
90's. Pretty much all their aerosol products looked the same. TopCote was
originally developed and manufactured by the current makers of Empire
products. They also manufactured a bearing lubricant for router bits, and a
lubricant for router bit and saw cutting edges. The original TopCote
products were dispensed from a plastic pump bottle. It went on and looked
the same as it does now. Empire TopSaver and their other products are
again/also dispensed from a plastic pump bottle.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:44:03 -0600, "Leon"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> Buy some BoeLube. Not cheap, but EXCELLENT and will not interfere
>> with finishing.
>
>Which one do you use and where do you get it? I am looking here,
>http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/boelube.php
>
09-01731. And at $3.65 it's cheap.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:44 -0500, B A R R Y <[email protected]>
wrote:
>Digger wrote:
>> Anyone have a reasonably priced supplier for TopCote or a equal or
>> better product to lubricate saw top and surrounding table (plastic
>> laminate) surface.
>> Thanks in advance
>> kenneth
>
>
>I use paste wax, like Butcher's, TreWax, Minwax...
>
>A $5 can lasts me years.
OK I tried Johnson Paste Wax and don't see a need to use anything
else. Works great!!
Appreciate all the comments
Thanks
On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:09:03 +0000, Doug Miller wrote:
>
> It seems to me that whether wax works for you, or not, depends on the
> humidity. I live in Indianapolis; not the most arid part of the U.S. by
> a long shot, but nothing like the Gulf Coast either. My shop is also in
> the basement, but I don't have water infiltration problems, and I run
> dehumidifiers year-round. Wax works just fine as a rust protectant for
> me.
That may be true. I live in Eastern Washington and my shop is unheated/
uncooled except when I'm in it. We have low humidity in the summer and
high humidity in the winter. No rust problems.
But it may also be the application of the wax. When I first get a power
tool with a cast iron top, it seems I have to apply wax every month or
so. Over time this requirement gradually diminishes until after a couple
of years I only have to do it once or twice a year. Seems the pores get
filled up.