They've all been answered correctly:
412. Mason's line holder
413. Cable puller
414. Pencil launcher
415. Valve spring compressor, I wasn't sure about this one until I found
another one ebay
416. Tube bending spring
417. Piston groove cleaner
A couple new photos and links can be found on the answer page:
http://pzphotosan75.blogspot.com/
Rob
""Nick Müller"" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1h0jda6.kqjwgs1xrtcwfN%[email protected]...
> Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> where access is through a removable plate, it's the
>> easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
>
> I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> are talking about the same type of construction.
>
> And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> - Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> tension!) and valve head.
> - Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
> If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> compressor.
>
>
>> Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
>
> Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
>
> I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> for compressing automobile valve springs.
>
> Nick
> --
> Motormodelle / Engine Models:
> <http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
> Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
> more to come ...
I worked as a mechanic from 1962 -1980, in various dealerships (mostly GM)
and in my own Gas Station - was one of the first in NH to pass the SASE
Certification tests as a Master Mechanic (don't think we called it that at
the time - just had a shirtsleeve full of patches by the time it was all
over). I was a drag racer (AA Fuel), a hot rodder (41 Ford Pickup with a
Buick engine was my favorite), an antique car enthusiast (37 Buicks were a
particular passion), A collector of hand tools (they just seemed to
multiply), and spent most of my waking hours doing something to cars and
boats.
Having said all that, I was introduced to this particular tool by a fellow
mechanic who explained its' use to me. I have never personally used one or
owned one.
With the head still in place, however, you could replace either a broken
spring or a leaky valve guide seal, usually after applying air to the
cylinder through the spark plug hole with an adapter to keep the valve
seated. On overhead engines , of course, there are simple lever type tools
to do that.
Hope this helps!
I have used valve spring compressors similar to this, both the type that
goes on each end to squeeze the spring between the jaws and the type that
goes between the spring and the lifter, but I tend to think this tool is not
a valve spring compressor. The shape of the jaws is unlike any I have seen
and seems very poor for that purpose, either to squeeze the spring between
the jaws or to force the keeper away from the lifter.
Don Young
""Nick Müller"" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1h0idcj.1xmp2m3c5esrjN%[email protected]...
> Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> It compresses the valve springs on flathead engines.
>
> Oh, a hammer would do that too!
> This tool is so dammned crude, that it might work for a huge engine. But
> no one having a bit of brain would work on a 4-stroke with that thing.
>
> Let's take a closer look at it:
> - teeth on the outside: Would anybody like to ruin the surface with
> them? Do you want to wedge it between the spring and the case? And if,
> it's quite a stupid way to go.
> - teet again: If it is to compress (and it only can compress something),
> what are the teeth good for?
> - The slot. Well, a valve stem would go in there, but could you reach
> the keys that hold the valve spring retainer? Think about where the
> retainer contacts the tool. Not a good contact surface _and_ it _must_
> be parallel, or the retainer will tilt and lock on the stem.
>
> All the valve-spring compressors I have seen look more like a C-clamp
> with _parallel_ surfaces.
>
> I really can't believe that.
>
> Nick
> --
> Motormodelle / Engine Models:
> <http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
> Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
> more to come ...
412 is a Mason's story-line cleat. Used for stretching a line from one end
of a wall to the other for establishing the next course's height.
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:s74Ge.1597$1E.548@trndny04...
> 412: Piece of wood.
>
> 413: Pipe wrench / grip / lifting tool / etc.
>
> 414: Binder clips, rubber bands and a laser light...
>
> 415: Torture device?
>
> 416: "spring" from a "don't open too far" door device / door stop.
>
> 417: Corner line scribe (non-techical name?)
>
>
> --
>
>
> Regards,
> Joe Agro, Jr.
> (800) 871-5022
> http://www.AutoDrill.com
> http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>
> V8013-R
>
>
>
R.H. <[email protected]> wrote:
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
#413: For lifting/handling sheet metal
#414: A homebrewn laser level.
But damnit, I really don't know what pieces of scrap
you've put together for whatever one time job. :-)
#415: Autsch! my balls!
#417: Scriber with dull edge?
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
gregj <[email protected]> wrote:
> 72
And I always thought that 42 is the right answer!
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
R.H. <[email protected]> wrote:
> I've been trying to post one non-tool photo each week, ...
Astonishing enough, someone has solved it.
Well, I'm gonna ignore the obious unobious things and stop complaining.
:-))
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
<[email protected]> wrote:
> #415: Valve spring compressor
Are you shure about that? I can't quite imagin how it serves the job. Is
it for automobile usege?
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> It compresses the valve springs on flathead engines.
Oh, a hammer would do that too!
This tool is so dammned crude, that it might work for a huge engine. But
no one having a bit of brain would work on a 4-stroke with that thing.
Let's take a closer look at it:
- teeth on the outside: Would anybody like to ruin the surface with
them? Do you want to wedge it between the spring and the case? And if,
it's quite a stupid way to go.
- teet again: If it is to compress (and it only can compress something),
what are the teeth good for?
- The slot. Well, a valve stem would go in there, but could you reach
the keys that hold the valve spring retainer? Think about where the
retainer contacts the tool. Not a good contact surface _and_ it _must_
be parallel, or the retainer will tilt and lock on the stem.
All the valve-spring compressors I have seen look more like a C-clamp
with _parallel_ surfaces.
I really can't believe that.
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> where access is through a removable plate, it's the
> easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
are talking about the same type of construction.
And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
tension!) and valve head.
- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
compressor.
> Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
for compressing automobile valve springs.
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
Mark and Kim Smith <[email protected]> wrote:
> Not all valve jobs are done with the head off of the engine. So the
> "C" clamp type won't work in all situations.
That's right and thank you for the link.
But I'm still not giving up. :-)
In modern cars, this tool is helpfull, if you want to replace the
packing of the valve guide. But when the "doubted" tool was built, there
were no packings. There was no reason to just remove the spring.
Well, if it was broken. But then the valve was bent and burned and had
to be replaced.
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
Dale Scroggins <[email protected]> wrote:
> No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
> HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
> block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
> spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
> between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve.
Ah!! From the other side!
It doesn't compress the spring by gripping the spring on it's both ends,
but going between valve retainer and somwhere in direction to the cam.
It doens't compress, but support the spring retainer. In the way a car
jack would.
Thank you very much for your explanation, I got it now. The tool does
what it is supposed to do.
My fault that I thought it grips the spring.
I was on the way to scan sectional drawings to prove that you can't
reach both ends of the spring in most cases. But the cam side end is
enough.
All that, only if you have side valves.
Thanks again,
Nick
--
Motormodelle / Engine Models:
<http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
more to come ...
> But damnit, I really don't know what pieces of scrap
> you've put together for whatever one time job. :-)
I've been trying to post one non-tool photo each week, but it's getting
harder and harder to find something good for each set. I've got enough
tools to last a little while but I have to scrounge every week for a decent
close-up or other non-hardware pieces.
Rob
Nick Müller wrote:
>
> Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > It compresses the valve springs on flathead engines.
>
> Oh, a hammer would do that too!
> This tool is so dammned crude, that it might work for a huge engine. But
> no one having a bit of brain would work on a 4-stroke with that thing.
>
> Let's take a closer look at it:
> - teeth on the outside: Would anybody like to ruin the surface with
> them? Do you want to wedge it between the spring and the case? And if,
> it's quite a stupid way to go.
> - teet again: If it is to compress (and it only can compress something),
> what are the teeth good for?
> - The slot. Well, a valve stem would go in there, but could you reach
> the keys that hold the valve spring retainer? Think about where the
> retainer contacts the tool. Not a good contact surface _and_ it _must_
> be parallel, or the retainer will tilt and lock on the stem.
>
> All the valve-spring compressors I have seen look more like a C-clamp
> with _parallel_ surfaces.
>
> I really can't believe that.
>
> Nick
Well you better believe it because he is right.
Strictly speaking though, last century, such devices were called
valve lifters, the term valve spring compressor, is a relatively
modern term.
I've posted a pic to the dropbox:
Tom
Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
> Nick Müller wrote:
> > Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
> >>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
> >
> >
> > I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> > flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> > are talking about the same type of construction.
> >
> > And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> > - Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> > the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> > better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> > tension!) and valve head.
>
> No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
> HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
> block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
> spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
> between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
> camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
> the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
> next valve.
>
> > - Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> > the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> > look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> > inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> > opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> > removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> > and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
>
> It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
> tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
> further to allow valve keeper removal.
>
> > If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> > because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> > compressor.
>
> Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
> and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
> >
> >
> >
> >>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
> >
> >
> > Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
> >
> > I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> > for compressing automobile valve springs.
>
> Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
> US.
>
> Dale Scroggins
Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
Tom
Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
> Tom wrote:
> > Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >
> >>Nick Müller wrote:
> >>
> >>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
> >>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> >>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> >>>are talking about the same type of construction.
> >>>
> >>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> >>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> >>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> >>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> >>>tension!) and valve head.
> >>
> >>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
> >>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
> >>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
> >>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
> >>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
> >>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
> >>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
> >>next valve.
> >>
> >>
> >>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> >>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> >>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> >>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> >>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> >>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> >>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
> >>
> >>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
> >>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
> >>further to allow valve keeper removal.
> >>
> >>
> >>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> >>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> >>>compressor.
> >>
> >>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
> >>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
> >>>
> >>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> >>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
> >>
> >>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
> >> US.
> >>
> >>Dale Scroggins
> >
> >
> > Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
> > the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
> > use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
> >
> > Tom
>
> While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
> installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
> compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
> pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
> and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
> no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
>
> My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
> technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
> tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
> When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
>
> Dale Scroggins
Why would you wish to remove the springs if you are only grinding
the valves?
Tom
Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
> Tom wrote:
> > Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >
> >>Tom wrote:
> >>
> >>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Nick Müller wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
> >>>>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> >>>>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> >>>>>are talking about the same type of construction.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> >>>>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> >>>>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> >>>>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> >>>>>tension!) and valve head.
> >>>>
> >>>>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
> >>>>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
> >>>>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
> >>>>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
> >>>>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
> >>>>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
> >>>>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
> >>>>next valve.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> >>>>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> >>>>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> >>>>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> >>>>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> >>>>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> >>>>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
> >>>>
> >>>>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
> >>>>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
> >>>>further to allow valve keeper removal.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> >>>>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> >>>>>compressor.
> >>>>
> >>>>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
> >>>>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> >>>>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
> >>>>
> >>>>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
> >>>> US.
> >>>>
> >>>>Dale Scroggins
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
> >>>the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
> >>>use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
> >>>
> >>>Tom
> >>
> >>While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
> >>installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
> >>compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
> >>pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
> >>and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
> >>no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
> >>
> >>My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
> >>technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
> >>tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
> >>When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
> >>
> >>Dale Scroggins
> >
> >
> > Why would you wish to remove the springs if you are only grinding
> > the valves?
> >
> > Tom
>
> Who said I was only grinding valves? It isn't worth opening the engine
> in most cases just to grind valves. Might as well do it all.
>
> Dale Scroggins
Really? LOL. I'm sure someone with a burnt valve in a straight eight
would be impressed with your philosophy. Still, someone who wires
springs
prior to installing has to be an expert...
Tom
Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
> Tom wrote:
> > Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >
> >>Tom wrote:
> >>
> >>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Tom wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Nick Müller wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
> >>>>>>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> >>>>>>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> >>>>>>>are talking about the same type of construction.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> >>>>>>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> >>>>>>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> >>>>>>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> >>>>>>>tension!) and valve head.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
> >>>>>>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
> >>>>>>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
> >>>>>>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
> >>>>>>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
> >>>>>>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
> >>>>>>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
> >>>>>>next valve.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> >>>>>>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> >>>>>>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> >>>>>>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> >>>>>>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> >>>>>>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> >>>>>>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
> >>>>>>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
> >>>>>>further to allow valve keeper removal.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> >>>>>>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> >>>>>>>compressor.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
> >>>>>>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> >>>>>>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
> >>>>>>US.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Dale Scroggins
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
> >>>>>the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
> >>>>>use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Tom
> >>>>
> >>>>While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
> >>>>installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
> >>>>compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
> >>>>pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
> >>>>and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
> >>>>no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
> >>>>
> >>>>My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
> >>>>technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
> >>>>tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
> >>>>When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
> >>>>
> >>>>Dale Scroggins
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Why would you wish to remove the springs if you are only grinding
> >>>the valves?
> >>>
> >>>Tom
> >>
> >>Who said I was only grinding valves? It isn't worth opening the engine
> >>in most cases just to grind valves. Might as well do it all.
> >>
> >>Dale Scroggins
> >
> >
> > Really? LOL. I'm sure someone with a burnt valve in a straight eight
> > would be impressed with your philosophy. Still, someone who wires
> > springs
> > prior to installing has to be an expert...
> >
> > Tom
>
> Tom,
>
> I have a distinct impression you are suspicious of my knowledge and
> skills as to engine repairs. I'm always open to learning from someone
> with more knowledge and experience than I have. If you could give me
> some idea of your background in this, I'd appreciate it. If your
> experience exceeds my forty+ years, my level of education, or my native
> intelligence, then I will welcome your comments. So far, I haven't been
> impressed.
>
> Dale Scroggins
As a repairer by replacement I'm sure you have no peers.
As for your level of education in these matters, I'd be
impressed with any text that you can quote stating wiring
springs for installation as acceptable & economic practice.
As for you native intelligence, not sure what your ethnic
origins has to do with the subject at hand.
As for myself, I couldn't care one way or other what
impresses you.
Tom
R.H. wrote:
> Another set has just been posted:
>
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Rob
>
>
Whistle.
Wire grabber, for fence stretching or pulling a span of electrical wire
tight.
Laser-propelled toy boat.
Spring compressor or Chinese proctology device.
Spring you put around tubing in hopes of bending it without kinking.
Spring-loaded thing for marking a line down the length of something.
John
R.H. wrote:
> Another set has just been posted:
>
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Rob
>
>
417 piston ring groove cleaner
--
Bill Berglin
http://home.comcast.net/~bberg100
"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of
arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid
in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly
proclaiming, 'WOW! What A RIDE!!" ... Unknown
""Nick Müller"" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1h0idcj.1xmp2m3c5esrjN%[email protected]...
> Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> It compresses the valve springs on flathead engines.
>
> Oh, a hammer would do that too!
> This tool is so dammned crude, that it might work for a huge engine. But
> no one having a bit of brain would work on a 4-stroke with that thing.
>
> Let's take a closer look at it:
> - teeth on the outside: Would anybody like to ruin the surface with
> them? Do you want to wedge it between the spring and the case? And if,
> it's quite a stupid way to go.
> - teet again: If it is to compress (and it only can compress something),
> what are the teeth good for?
> - The slot. Well, a valve stem would go in there, but could you reach
> the keys that hold the valve spring retainer? Think about where the
> retainer contacts the tool. Not a good contact surface _and_ it _must_
> be parallel, or the retainer will tilt and lock on the stem.
>
> All the valve-spring compressors I have seen look more like a C-clamp
> with _parallel_ surfaces.
>
> I really can't believe that.
>
> Nick
> --
> Motormodelle / Engine Models:
> <http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
> Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
> more to come ...
On Straight-six engines, where access is through a removable plate, it's the
easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack. Sorry if I
haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
--
Peter DiVergilio
Most of the money I've wasted was mostly spent trying to impress people who
were never going to like me anyway!
Tom wrote:
> Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
>>Nick Müller wrote:
>>
>>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
>>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
>>>
>>>
>>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
>>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
>>>are talking about the same type of construction.
>>>
>>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
>>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
>>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
>>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
>>>tension!) and valve head.
>>
>>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
>>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
>>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
>>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
>>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
>>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
>>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
>>next valve.
>>
>>
>>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
>>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
>>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
>>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
>>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
>>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
>>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
>>
>>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
>>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
>>further to allow valve keeper removal.
>>
>>
>>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
>>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
>>>compressor.
>>
>>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
>>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
>>>
>>>
>>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
>>>
>>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
>>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
>>
>>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
>> US.
>>
>>Dale Scroggins
>
>
> Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
> the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
> use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
>
> Tom
While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
Dale Scroggins
Tom wrote:
> Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
>>Tom wrote:
>>
>>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Tom wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Nick Müller wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
>>>>>>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
>>>>>>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
>>>>>>>are talking about the same type of construction.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
>>>>>>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
>>>>>>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
>>>>>>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
>>>>>>>tension!) and valve head.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
>>>>>>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
>>>>>>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
>>>>>>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
>>>>>>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
>>>>>>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
>>>>>>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
>>>>>>next valve.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
>>>>>>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
>>>>>>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
>>>>>>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
>>>>>>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
>>>>>>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
>>>>>>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
>>>>>>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
>>>>>>further to allow valve keeper removal.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
>>>>>>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
>>>>>>>compressor.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
>>>>>>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
>>>>>>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
>>>>>>US.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Dale Scroggins
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
>>>>>the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
>>>>>use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
>>>>>
>>>>>Tom
>>>>
>>>>While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
>>>>installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
>>>>compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
>>>>pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
>>>>and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
>>>>no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
>>>>
>>>>My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
>>>>technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
>>>>tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
>>>>When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
>>>>
>>>>Dale Scroggins
>>>
>>>
>>>Why would you wish to remove the springs if you are only grinding
>>>the valves?
>>>
>>>Tom
>>
>>Who said I was only grinding valves? It isn't worth opening the engine
>>in most cases just to grind valves. Might as well do it all.
>>
>>Dale Scroggins
>
>
> Really? LOL. I'm sure someone with a burnt valve in a straight eight
> would be impressed with your philosophy. Still, someone who wires
> springs
> prior to installing has to be an expert...
>
> Tom
Tom,
I have a distinct impression you are suspicious of my knowledge and
skills as to engine repairs. I'm always open to learning from someone
with more knowledge and experience than I have. If you could give me
some idea of your background in this, I'd appreciate it. If your
experience exceeds my forty+ years, my level of education, or my native
intelligence, then I will welcome your comments. So far, I haven't been
impressed.
Dale Scroggins
R.H. wrote:
> Another set has just been posted:
>
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Rob
>
>
414 A modern green laser pointer on a home cludged mount for a
telescope - use as a one-power finder.
--
Bill Berglin
http://home.comcast.net/~bberg100
"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of
arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid
in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly
proclaiming, 'WOW! What A RIDE!!" ... Unknown
R.H. wrote:
> Another set has just been posted:
>
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Rob
>
>
412. Block for attaching a mason's line to corners.
413. Identified by previous posters.
414. Laser level, missing the level?
415. Valve spring compressor for side-valve engine?
416 and 417. Identified by previous posters.
Tom wrote:
> Dale Scroggins wrote:
>
>>Tom wrote:
>>
>>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Nick Müller wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
>>>>>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
>>>>>flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
>>>>>are talking about the same type of construction.
>>>>>
>>>>>And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
>>>>>- Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
>>>>>the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
>>>>>better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
>>>>>tension!) and valve head.
>>>>
>>>>No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
>>>>HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
>>>>block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
>>>>spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
>>>>between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
>>>>camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
>>>>the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
>>>>next valve.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>- Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
>>>>>the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
>>>>>look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
>>>>>inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
>>>>>opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
>>>>>removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
>>>>>and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
>>>>
>>>>It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
>>>>tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
>>>>further to allow valve keeper removal.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
>>>>>because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
>>>>>compressor.
>>>>
>>>>Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
>>>>and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
>>>>>
>>>>>I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
>>>>>for compressing automobile valve springs.
>>>>
>>>>Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
>>>> US.
>>>>
>>>>Dale Scroggins
>>>
>>>
>>>Slight flaw in your reasoning, Dale, if it isn't used for compressing
>>>the spring, how does one replace the valve & keepers? All the ones I
>>>use are fully capable of compressing the springs.
>>>
>>>Tom
>>
>>While this tool would be capable of compressing the springs for valve
>>installation, I seldom used one on installation. It's easier for me to
>>compress the spring in a small vise, "mouse" the spring with a couple of
>>pieces of safety wire, install the spring, valves, and keepers, then cut
>>and remove the safety wire. The keepers are much easier to install with
>>no tool in the way, and everything is much easier to align.
>>
>>My comments weren't based on reasoning or theory, but experience. The
>>technique I described isn't the only way to remove the valves using the
>>tool. It is, in my experience, the fastest way to remove side valves.
>>When customers were paying by the hour, fast was good.
>>
>>Dale Scroggins
>
>
> Why would you wish to remove the springs if you are only grinding
> the valves?
>
> Tom
Who said I was only grinding valves? It isn't worth opening the engine
in most cases just to grind valves. Might as well do it all.
Dale Scroggins
"Rich Grise" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 17:55:07 +0000, R.H. wrote:
>> They've all been answered correctly:
>> 412. Mason's line holder
>> 413. Cable puller
>> 414. Pencil launcher
>> 415. Valve spring compressor, I wasn't sure about this one until I found
>> another one ebay
>> 416. Tube bending spring
>> 417. Piston groove cleaner
>>
>> A couple new photos and links can be found on the answer page:
>>
>> http://pzphotosan75.blogspot.com/
>
> One little nitpick - #416, the tube goes _inside_ the coil, the coil
> doesn't go inside the tube. I've used one of these before, and
> it seems like, after the tube is bent, the bender doesn't just slide
> off - it has to be unscrewed. It seems that the tube really _wants_
> to crimp - but the coil constrains it, but the tube expands into
> the interstices of the coil. I know this is true, because I bought
> a set of three once, and the cardboard blister pack called out the
> tube sizes that could be bent by each. I think they were 1/8", 1/4",
> and either 3/16" or 3/8" - it's been a few years.
>
> The nitpick is, the bender coil goes _outside_ the tube. :-)
>
> Cheers!
> Rich
>
"R.H." <[email protected]> wrote in news:w31Ge.34249$B52.29431
@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com:
> Another set has just been posted:
>
> http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
> Rob
>
>
>
413 - Part of a wire strainer kit
416 - copper tube bending spring
and that's burnt me out.
JB
--
After several glasses of cheap red, imabrowneye was heard to mention
that....
Vox audita perit, litteras scritpa manet.
""Nick Müller"" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1h0hm0y.1u7d2tb1jmkls2N%[email protected]...
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> #415: Valve spring compressor
>
> Are you shure about that? I can't quite imagin how it serves the job. Is
> it for automobile usege?
>
>
> Nick
> --
> Motormodelle / Engine Models:
> <http://www.motor-manufaktur.de>
> Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic
> more to come ...
It compresses the valve springs on flathead engines.
--
Peter DiVergilio
Most of the money I've wasted was mostly spent trying to impress people who
were never going to like me anyway!
R.H. wrote:
>Another set has just been posted:
>
>http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
>Rob
>
>
>
>
From rec.woodworking
#412: It's on the tip of my brain, I know I've seen that before somewhere.
#413: That's a wire grip. You'd love to see the ones I used to use
when building 500kv lines!
#414: Dunno
#415: Looks like an old ball joint separator
#416: Tubing bender
#417: Piston ring groove cleaner
In article <[email protected]>,
R.H. <[email protected]> wrote:
>Another set has just been posted:
>
>http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
O.K. Posting from rec.crafts.metalworking again:
Interesting collection.
412) Hmm ... not really sure about this at all.
Perhaps some form of whistle? Blow into the narrow end and the
air spreads out when it gets to the cross-hole and cycles up and
back?
Or it could be a "serving" block, for wrapping a binding around a
line (rope).
413) This is some kind of load binder. My guess is that these are
intended to be used in pairs on opposite edges of thick sheet
metal. Lifting ropes are attached to the eyes on the left, and
as the ropes pull upwards (to the left as oriented for the
photos) the clamp closes on the edge. (I've seen something like
this for binding on rope, but this one looks better oriented to
flat metal.) You would use them in pairs, as they would not be
strong pulling at right angles to the gripped edge.
414) The missing part is a mirror. This is a laser pointer
(rubber-banded to a conglomeration of binder clasps minus the
handles.)
Point it at a mirror, and slight changes in the angle of the
mirror will be magnified at as motion in the point where the
dot hits -- perhaps ten feet or so away.
415) For drawing two ball-shaped (or half-ball shaped) objects closer
together. Perhaps on the ends of two lines, to allow them to be
joined under load.
416) An *easy* one. This is for bending metal tubing (usually
copper but other possibilities are there.) Often found in
company with a tubing flaring kit. (A different size of this is
needed for each size of tubing.) The spring keeps the sides of
the tubing from spreading during the bending.
417) No real idea, other than something like a disc with a center hole
goes on the pin at the end of the upper handle, and that the
thumbscrew acts to limit the travel of the arm somewhat.
Now to see what others have said on this batch.
Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: <[email protected]> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Nick Müller wrote:
> <snip>
>
>
>All the valve-spring compressors I have seen look more like a C-clamp
>with _parallel_ surfaces.
>
>I really can't believe that.
>
>Nick
>
>
Not all valve jobs are done with the head off of the engine. So the
"C" clamp type won't work in all situations.
http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/tools.asp?tool=all&Group_ID=1575&store=snapon-store
http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/tools.asp?tool=all&Group_ID=1576&store=snapon-store
"Tom" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Dale Scroggins wrote:
>>
>> Tom wrote:
>> > Dale Scroggins wrote:
>> >
>> >>Tom wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>Tom wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>Dale Scroggins wrote:
>> >>>>>
Now gentlemen, let's play nicely. Here's one that specifies "for small
engines"
http://www.handsontools.com/store-products-Engine-Exhaust-Service--Repair-Tools-Compressors-KDT379-<font-color=red><b>KD-Tools-Valve-Spring-Compressor-for-Small-Engines<-b><-font>_24130.html
I don't doubt the knowledge or experience of any of the posters. Have some
knowledge and experience myself. There were a LOT of different designs tried
for valve spring compressors before the "C-clamp" type were developed, and
the c-clamp type only work with the head removed. I've used one similar to
the on posted by RH and similar to the one in the URL above for replacing
valve seals on overhead engines, holding the valve closed with an "air hold"
or another trick, stuffing some clothesline rope into the sparkplug hole,
then manually turn the engine until the piston squeezes the rope into the
top of the cylinder & holds the valve shut. Let's face it, there are lots of
different ways to accomplish things, and ingenuity was the order of the day
long before the tool manufacturers became so prolific with different
designs.
I think most of us are agreed that the pictured item has something to do
with valve springs, whether compressing or merely "holding" as Mr. Scroggins
says. Beyond that, it's all rhetoric.
My $.25
--
Nahmie
The greatest headaches are those we cause ourselves.
> The nitpick is, the bender coil goes _outside_ the tube. :-)
I've never used one and was going by what the seller told me. I did some
searching after seeing your post and found a site where they sell internal
and external bending springs, not sure when it would be appropriate to use
one instead of the other.
http://www.kelkoo.co.uk/b/a/sbs/uk/hgSubdept/department/Hand+Tools/name/pipe+bending/135901.html
As you stated, mine looks like an external one.
Rob
On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 08:54:52 GMT, "R.H." <[email protected]> wrote:
>Another set has just been posted:
>
>http://puzzlephotos.blogspot.com/
>
>
>Rob
>
#415 Valve spring compressor
#416 Helicoil
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 17:55:07 +0000, R.H. wrote:
> They've all been answered correctly:
> 412. Mason's line holder
> 413. Cable puller
> 414. Pencil launcher
> 415. Valve spring compressor, I wasn't sure about this one until I found
> another one ebay
> 416. Tube bending spring
> 417. Piston groove cleaner
>
> A couple new photos and links can be found on the answer page:
>
> http://pzphotosan75.blogspot.com/
One little nitpick - #416, the tube goes _inside_ the coil, the coil
doesn't go inside the tube. I've used one of these before, and
it seems like, after the tube is bent, the bender doesn't just slide
off - it has to be unscrewed. It seems that the tube really _wants_
to crimp - but the coil constrains it, but the tube expands into
the interstices of the coil. I know this is true, because I bought
a set of three once, and the cardboard blister pack called out the
tube sizes that could be bent by each. I think they were 1/8", 1/4",
and either 3/16" or 3/8" - it's been a few years.
The nitpick is, the bender coil goes _outside_ the tube. :-)
Cheers!
Rich
412: Piece of wood.
413: Pipe wrench / grip / lifting tool / etc.
414: Binder clips, rubber bands and a laser light...
415: Torture device?
416: "spring" from a "don't open too far" door device / door stop.
417: Corner line scribe (non-techical name?)
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
http://www.AutoDrill.com
http://www.Multi-Drill.com
V8013-R
Nick Müller wrote:
> Peter DiVergilio <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>where access is through a removable plate, it's the
>>easiest tool to use which will not bend things out of whack.
>
>
> I've been looking at old plans of automobile engines of that time, with
> flat head (hanging valves; if you also use this expression). I think we
> are talking about the same type of construction.
>
> And here comes the point where things get at least strange:
> - Hold the tool so, that the lower fork touches the spring retainer from
> the underside. That's OK. Now (practically, the other way round is/was
> better) you have to force and wag the upper fork between spring (under
> tension!) and valve head.
No. The tool is not intended to compress the valve spring, but merely
HOLD it in the compressed position. The valve cover on the side of the
block is removed. A valve is selected that is already open, with the
spring compressed. The tool is adjusted to slide around the lifter,
between the spring retainer and the block, below the valve. Then the
camshaft is rotated to lower the lifter. The keepers are removed from
the valve stem, and the valve removed from the block. Then on to the
next valve.
> - Do you think that this is an intelligent way if you consider what for
> the spring is compressed. Yes, to remove the valve. Now we do have to
> look way back to the early days of 4 strokes and see how valves were
> inserted. In T-heads (a sub kind of flat heads) there was a big plug
> opposide of the valve throug what the valve could be pulled out without
> removing the head. Now wouldn't it be much cleverer to open that plug
> and use a C-clamp spring compressor?
It is much easier to use the camshaft lobe to compress the spring. The
tool merely keeps the spring compressed as the camshaft is rotated
further to allow valve keeper removal.
> If you talk about flatheads without that plug, things don't change,
> because the head is removed and you can easily use the C-clamp
> compressor.
Valve servicing was often done with the engine in place, with manifolds
and other equipment still installed. The smaller tool was much less clumsy.
>
>
>
>>Sorry if I haven't explained it so you can visualize what I mean!!
>
>
> Hope you could visualize what I meant. :-)
>
> I'd also like to know where your knowledge is from that this tools is
> for compressing automobile valve springs.
Many small gasoline engines still used the side-valve design here in the
US.
Dale Scroggins