Hello Group,
I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
your thoughts on this...
Thanks!
Steven
In article <[email protected]>, Steven Flynn
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> your thoughts on this...
>
> Thanks!
>
> Steven
I never move the arm on my radial arm saw, I use one or the other of
these jigs for miter cuts, this way I find it stays accurate:
http://sawdustmaking.com/Radial%20Arm%20Saws/radial_arm_saws.html#Miter%
20Gauge
I also have a miter saw that I bought to take to job sites, if suppose
if I didn't already have the radial arm saw I might have went for the
sliding model. I find it handy to have both sometimes, each set for
different angles.
FrankC
--
http://sawdustmaking.com
I will second this opinion. I have a 34 year old one that I also don't use
much, but there are certain cuts, especially across long boards, that no
other tool can match, nor do as accurately, nor as quick. Most other cuts I
use a chop saw, table saw or band saw.
"skeezics" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Hello Group,
> >
> >I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> >and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> >arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> >compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> >a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> >still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> >your thoughts on this...
> >
> >Thanks!
> >
> >Steven
>
> the RAS will do everything a CMS will do but it will take longer for
> setups. it will do most things a tablesaw will do also. if properly
> tuned it is at the very least as accurate as a CMS also. i dont use
> mine much but when i want it its there. i wouldnt part with it.
>
> skeez
Doug Winterburn wrote:
>
> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 23:02:02 +0000, Jerry McCaffrey wrote:
>
> > A third on all this. Number one macine should be a good table saw. I
> > started with a RAS and it was a LOT harder. CMS is a pleasure to set for
> > miters, but I trimmed an entire house with a RAS on a stand that I rolled
> > from room to room. Yet if you need to go from 45l to 45r to 90 etc, it's
> > crank up the RAS, unlock and move, then crank down. Real slow compared to
> > CMS. Never felt comfortable ripping on a RAS, but YMMV.
>
> With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the cranking
> up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the arm are
> made with the blade behind the fence. In fact, one should never cut into
> the factory main table and always use a sacrificial table cover of 1/4"
> ply or tempered hardboard covering the front factory table. The standard
> kerfs can then be cut and raising/lowering the arm isn't required even for
> changing from crosscut to rip.
>
> -Doug
>
> --
> "If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
> then you and I will still each have one apple.
> But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
> ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
It depends on your how your table is set up. Mine, for example has a
solid piece and then toward the back are two loose table parts so that
the fence can be placed directly against the immoveable part, between
the two moveable parts, and at the very back. This allows more depth
for ripping and more depth for cross cutting. As a result the
moveable board (normally behind the fence) must be the same height as
the rest of the table and the cross cut goes into both board.
Consequently the saw must be raised to move the arm left and right.
I agree with the 1/4" cover, but it has to be on all parts of the
table, and cutting into the original table may not be bad as many
original tables are so poor that immediate removal and placement in
the rain is the best possible solution. I kept my original table only
long enough to make a new table of plywood an rip the two moveable
parts. Made new fences also, since the original only stuck up about
1/2 inch above the surface.
Doug Winterburn wrote:
>
> On Mon, 09 Aug 2004 21:42:38 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
>
> > It depends on your how your table is set up. Mine, for example has a
> > solid piece and then toward the back are two loose table parts so that the
> > fence can be placed directly against the immoveable part, between the two
> > moveable parts, and at the very back. This allows more depth for ripping
> > and more depth for cross cutting. As a result the moveable board
> > (normally behind the fence) must be the same height as the rest of the
> > table and the cross cut goes into both board. Consequently the saw must be
> > raised to move the arm left and right. I agree with the 1/4" cover, but it
> > has to be on all parts of the table, and cutting into the original table
> > may not be bad as many original tables are so poor that immediate removal
> > and placement in the rain is the best possible solution. I kept my
> > original table only long enough to make a new table of plywood an rip the
> > two moveable parts. Made new fences also, since the original only stuck
> > up about 1/2 inch above the surface.
>
> Your setup is the same as mine, and there is no reason to have the two
> rear table parts permanently covered as well as the front table. I use an
> appropiately sized strip of 1/4" ply not permannetly attached when the
> fence must be placed in either of the rearmost positions. When all the
> way back, it is only for ripping operations and the arm still does not
> need to be raised and lowered if the standard kerfs are cut in the front
> table. If in the middle position for ripping, the same applies. If in the
> middle position for cross cutting or mitering, the blade is still behind
> the fence (unless using a tall fence) and and no raising/lowering is
> required for this either.
>
> The standard kerfs include a 90 degree crosscut, right 45 degree miter,
> (optional) left 45 degree miter, 45 degree bevel (requires
> lowering/raising arm), inrip arc and trough, and outrip arc and trough.
> The only operation that requires an arm height adjustment is a bevel cut
> or some operation using other than the standard 10" blade, such as a dado
> stack, sanding drum/disc, drill chuck, rotary surface planer, etc.
>
> Here's a link showing the standard kerf:
>
> <http://www.winterburn.net/doug/pictures/woodworking/R0010248.JPG>
>
> -Doug
>
> --
> "If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
> then you and I will still each have one apple.
> But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
> ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and
lowering the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
Doug Winterburn wrote:
>
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:14:40 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
>
> > Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
> > same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and lowering
> > the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
>
> Well, the OP was saying what a pain in the tookas it was to raise and
> lower the arm every time he had to change the arm for mitering, and I
> thought I'd show him how raising/lowering the arm was unneceessary with a
> properly set up saw. Covering just the front part of the table is
> standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
> has worked well for me for 35 years.
>
> -Doug
>
> --
> "If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
> then you and I will still each have one apple.
> But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
> ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
You're right, you're just answering the op's question, I didn't intend
to criticize. I should have put my comment under the OP's comment. I
raise and lower my saw blade all the time-- to change the blade, to
swing the arm left or right, to swing the saw blade from cross to rip,
to cut less than full depth, and some others. I just can't see the
problem that the OP has--raising and lower the blade of my table saw
is as much a problem. You go, crank crank (in about the same time as
it takes to read it), and the saw is up or down.
Steven,
The RAS is your best option for the small shop, especially if you need
miters etc for moulding in the home.
Suggest reading "How To Master The Radial Saw" by Wally Kunkel
http://mr.sawdust.com .
Also join us on the radial saw forum:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Steven Flynn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw.
>I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
Wrong blade perhaps, out of alignment, trying to cut a board that isn't
straight?
> Don't ever put an arm in front of that thing or it will cut it off.
There is no need to place your arm/hand/leg in front of the blade.
> Mine is a craftsman and doesn't stay very true.
A DeWalt will hold alignment.
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Greg Ostrom" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
> Greg O.
>
>
> I'm curious, what are the three books that you have. The ones I know are
> Mr. Sawdust, Jon Eakes, and one from Sears. Have I missed one?
Doug,
The Silken book is the one I forgot. I've read it but don't own a copy, it's
good. The Mr. Sawdust book by Walley Kunkel is the best IMO for shaping,
irregular shaping and moulding operations on the RAS. The Eakes book is a
great book for set up and alignment of most makes RAS's.
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The RAS doesn't hold setup as well as a CMS, but it does many things very
well, as has been said. I would add that there is no equal for ripping long
boards, especially if you build a logn table. Mine is 8', but when I was
building my house I had a 16' table.
The RAS is not as righd as a TS, so you have to watch the angles, especially
the main arm angle, as you work.
Cutting very small pieces is dicey, since you must hold them near the blade.
Other than that, I think the RAS is safer than a TS, because you can put one
hand firmly on the table, even holding the fence sometimes. and the other on
the handle. With no hands moving, it's hard to get cut. Once in a while a
rip will kick back, but no worse than a TS. Besides, when ripping you can
stand to the front, out of the line of fire.
For big rips, I sometimes get a wife or kid to help guide the outfeed side.
Then when well along I go to the outfeed side and pull the rest of the cut.
Get a RAS book and see what you think. Sears used to put one out.
Wilson
"Steven Flynn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> your thoughts on this...
>
> Thanks!
>
> Steven
Many of us earn a living with just the RAS and no TS. It isn't religion,
it's what works and works well.
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Robert Galloway" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have a Jet contractor's saw. I have a Delta RAS. If put to the test,
> I'd have to give up the RAS first, by a narrow margin. Why this
> ridiculous contest? Each constributes a lot to the shop. I love my
> RAS. It does a lot of things well. I could get along without it
> before the table saw. Big Deal.
>
> bob g.
>
> Greg Ostrom wrote:
>
> > I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
> >
> > Don't ever put an arm in front of that thing or it will cut it off.
> >
> > Mine is a craftsman and doesn't stay very true. Great for quick
crosscuts
> > that don't have to be too accurate.
> >
> > My sliding miter is much straighter and cuts where you aim it.
> >
> > Greg O.
> >
> >
>
>With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the cranking
up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the arm are
made with the blade behind the fence
Good suggestion Doug. IMHO RAS users should scrap the factory table and
build the steel reinforced two layer Mr. Sawdust style table, cover it with
a 1/4" layer and they will have a FLAT, accurate, stable, work table for
life.
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
"Eric Tonks" <etonks@sunstormADD-DOT-COM> wrote in
<[email protected]>:
>I will second this opinion. I have a 34 year old one that I also don't
>use much, but there are certain cuts, especially across long boards,
>that no other tool can match, nor do as accurately, nor as quick. Most
>other cuts I use a chop saw, table saw or band saw.
>
>"skeezics" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >Hello Group,
>> >
>> >I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic
>> >woodworking and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman
>> >10" radial arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff,
>> >including compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had
>> >planned to buy a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm
>> >saw, would I still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw.
>> >Please offer your thoughts on this...
>> >
>> >Thanks!
>> >
>> >Steven
>>
>> the RAS will do everything a CMS will do but it will take longer for
>> setups. it will do most things a tablesaw will do also. if properly
>> tuned it is at the very least as accurate as a CMS also. i dont use
>> mine much but when i want it its there. i wouldnt part with it.
>>
>> skeez
>
>
>
A third on all this. Number one macine should be a good table saw. I
started with a RAS and it was a LOT harder. CMS is a pleasure to set for
miters, but I trimmed an entire house with a RAS on a stand that I rolled
from room to room. Yet if you need to go from 45l to 45r to 90 etc, it's
crank up the RAS, unlock and move, then crank down. Real slow compared to
CMS. Never felt comfortable ripping on a RAS, but YMMV.
Jerry
Doug Winterburn <[email protected]> wrote in
<[email protected]>:
>On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 23:02:02 +0000, Jerry McCaffrey wrote:
>
>
>> A third on all this. Number one macine should be a good table saw. I
>> started with a RAS and it was a LOT harder. CMS is a pleasure to set
>> for miters, but I trimmed an entire house with a RAS on a stand that I
>> rolled from room to room. Yet if you need to go from 45l to 45r to 90
>> etc, it's crank up the RAS, unlock and move, then crank down. Real
>> slow compared to CMS. Never felt comfortable ripping on a RAS, but
>> YMMV.
>
>With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the
>cranking up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the
>arm are made with the blade behind the fence. In fact, one should never
>cut into the factory main table and always use a sacrificial table cover
>of 1/4" ply or tempered hardboard covering the front factory table. The
>standard kerfs can then be cut and raising/lowering the arm isn't
>required even for changing from crosscut to rip.
>
>-Doug
>
Actually I covered the entire table with 1/4" so that didn't work for me,
but it is a good idea for the future. The saw I was using was a Sears 9" and
didn't seem to have all that much room behind the fence. That one was
relegated to the garage for misc cutoff work and the 10" that I inherited
migrated to the shop. The table on that one was trashed when I got it and I
built a new one from MDF and decided not to cover it, just replace it every
so often. Now with your comments, maybe that was a bad idea on my part, but
easily fixed!
Jerry
A neighbor bought one about 15 years ago from Sears that I bought from
him and trying to adjust for heel problem found an adjustment that
needed two mating parts but only one was there, from the factory! Be
wary!
On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>Hello Group,
>
>I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
>and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
>arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
>compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
>a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
>still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
>your thoughts on this...
>
>Thanks!
>
>Steven
Steven Flynn wrote:
>
>
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> your thoughts on this...
A radial arm saw can do anything a compound miter saw can do, a lot of what
a table saw can do, and has its own collection of tricks as well. Main
problem is that tuning it is a bit finicky and you have to keep an eye on
it to make sure it doesn't get misaligned.
Couple of "must have" books,"Fine Tuning Your Radial Arm Saw" by Jon
Eakes--out of print but you can order it in ebook form from
<http://www.wired-2-shop.com/joneakes/ProductDetail.asp?ProdID=3&nPrdImageID=&CatID=3>,
and "How to Master the Radial Saw" by the late Wallace Kunkel aka "Mr.
Sawdust" <http://www.mrsawdust.com/>.
If you have a radial arm saw in good tune you don't strictly speaking _need_
either a compound miter saw or a table saw--just about anything you might
want to do that a circular-blade saw can do you can probably figure out a
way to do with the radial arm saw--but after you've worked with it a while
and learned its strengths and its limitations you'll find that you probably
_want_ both--each does some things really well, other things only with much
effort, and for each type there are some things that it just plain can't
do.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Steven
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Steven Flynn wrote:
>
>
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> your thoughts on this...
Something I neglected to mention--after you have it check out
<http://www.radialarmsawrecall.com/index2.htm> and see if yours is one for
which an upgraded guard is available. If so, order it--it's free and
includes a new table.
> Thanks!
>
> Steven
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Doug Winterburn wrote:
> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 23:02:02 +0000, Jerry McCaffrey wrote:
>
>
>> A third on all this. Number one macine should be a good table saw. I
>> started with a RAS and it was a LOT harder. CMS is a pleasure to set for
>> miters, but I trimmed an entire house with a RAS on a stand that I rolled
>> from room to room. Yet if you need to go from 45l to 45r to 90 etc, it's
>> crank up the RAS, unlock and move, then crank down. Real slow compared to
>> CMS. Never felt comfortable ripping on a RAS, but YMMV.
>
> With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the cranking
> up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the arm are
> made with the blade behind the fence. In fact, one should never cut into
> the factory main table and always use a sacrificial table cover of 1/4"
> ply or tempered hardboard covering the front factory table. The standard
> kerfs can then be cut and raising/lowering the arm isn't required even for
> changing from crosscut to rip.
Going to 45R may result in hitting the fence if the fence is unusually high
or thick--solution is to put the blade in the inrip position while moving
the carriage.
> -Doug
>
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Rumpty wrote:
>>With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the cranking
> up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the arm are
> made with the blade behind the fence
>
> Good suggestion Doug. IMHO RAS users should scrap the factory table and
> build the steel reinforced two layer Mr. Sawdust style table, cover it
> with a 1/4" layer and they will have a FLAT, accurate, stable, work table
> for life.
Even with the factory table the 1/4" overlay is desirable.
>
> --
>
> Rumpty
>
> Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Robert Galloway wrote:
> I have a Jet contractor's saw. I have a Delta RAS. If put to the test,
> I'd have to give up the RAS first, by a narrow margin. Why this
> ridiculous contest? Each constributes a lot to the shop. I love my
> RAS. It does a lot of things well. I could get along without it
> before the table saw. Big Deal.
For some reason this is a religious issue for some people. It never ceases
to amaze me the things that people will adopt as religious icons.
> bob g.
>
> Greg Ostrom wrote:
>
>> I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
>>
>> Don't ever put an arm in front of that thing or it will cut it off.
>>
>> Mine is a craftsman and doesn't stay very true. Great for quick
>> crosscuts that don't have to be too accurate.
>>
>> My sliding miter is much straighter and cuts where you aim it.
>>
>> Greg O.
>>
>>
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Rumpty wrote:
> Many of us earn a living with just the RAS and no TS. It isn't religion,
> it's what works and works well.
And I don't notice you acting like it's "us against them" like some folks.
> --
>
> Rumpty
>
> Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>
> "Robert Galloway" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> I have a Jet contractor's saw. I have a Delta RAS. If put to the test,
>> I'd have to give up the RAS first, by a narrow margin. Why this
>> ridiculous contest? Each constributes a lot to the shop. I love my
>> RAS. It does a lot of things well. I could get along without it
>> before the table saw. Big Deal.
>>
>> bob g.
>>
>> Greg Ostrom wrote:
>>
>> > I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
>> >
>> > Don't ever put an arm in front of that thing or it will cut it off.
>> >
>> > Mine is a craftsman and doesn't stay very true. Great for quick
> crosscuts
>> > that don't have to be too accurate.
>> >
>> > My sliding miter is much straighter and cuts where you aim it.
>> >
>> > Greg O.
>> >
>> >
>>
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Doug Winterburn wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:14:40 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
>
>> Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
>> same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and lowering
>> the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
>
> Well, the OP was saying what a pain in the tookas it was to raise and
> lower the arm every time he had to change the arm for mitering, and I
> thought I'd show him how raising/lowering the arm was unneceessary with a
> properly set up saw. Covering just the front part of the table is
> standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
> has worked well for me for 35 years.
I'm curious, what are the three books that you have. The ones I know are
Mr. Sawdust, Jon Eakes, and one from Sears. Have I missed one?
> -Doug
>
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
I have both a Radial Arm Saw (RAS) and a Compound Miter Saw (CMS). I
only use the RAS when I need to make a crosscut that is wider than the
capacity of the CMS, or sometimes to cut a dado across a long board.
The reason is that the RAS is inherently less accurate than the CMS
and is much more difficult and time consuming to set up for each cut.
My RAS stays locked on 90 degrees in each direction because it's such
a pain to set up. If I didn't already own the RAS, I would never buy
one INSTEAD of a CMS, even if I got a good deal on it.
DonkeyHody
"We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom
that is in it - and stop there; lest we be like the cat that sits down
on a hot stove-lid. She will never sit down on a hot stove-lid
again---and that is well; but also she will never sit down on a cold
one anymore." - Mark Twain
Steven Flynn <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Hello Group,
>
> I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
> compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
> a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
> still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
> your thoughts on this...
>
> Thanks!
>
> Steven
On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>Hello Group,
>
>I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
>and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
>arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
>compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
>a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
>still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
>your thoughts on this...
>
>Thanks!
>
>Steven
if all of your work will be in the shop you don't need both. hauling a
RAS around is a pain....
I have a Jet contractor's saw. I have a Delta RAS. If put to the test,
I'd have to give up the RAS first, by a narrow margin. Why this
ridiculous contest? Each constributes a lot to the shop. I love my
RAS. It does a lot of things well. I could get along without it
before the table saw. Big Deal.
bob g.
Greg Ostrom wrote:
> I hate my RAS. When it kicks, it kicks right at you.
>
> Don't ever put an arm in front of that thing or it will cut it off.
>
> Mine is a craftsman and doesn't stay very true. Great for quick crosscuts
> that don't have to be too accurate.
>
> My sliding miter is much straighter and cuts where you aim it.
>
> Greg O.
>
>
I have owned all three. My first table saw was a Craftsman RAS, about a
1965 model. Made lots of decent furniture with it. I did a LOT of rips
with it without problems. In fact, I didn't get a CS until the late 70s
and replaced it with a PM66 in the late 90s. I bought a CMS in the
early 90s (Craftsman) and ended up using it for carpenter type jobs
because I couldn't get it to maintain its setup if I moved it off 90d.
Sold it. Still have the RAS (mainly crosscuts, dados, cheek cuts, etc.)
and the PM (all else). Works for me. YMMV.
mahalo,
jo4hn
On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 06:04:31 -0700, Doug Winterburn
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:14:40 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
>
>> Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
>> same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and lowering
>> the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
>
>Well, the OP was saying what a pain in the tookas it was to raise and
>lower the arm every time he had to change the arm for mitering, and I
>thought I'd show him how raising/lowering the arm was unneceessary with a
>properly set up saw. Covering just the front part of the table is
>standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
>has worked well for me for 35 years.
And if you'd bought a Sawsmith those 35 years ago, all you'd have to
do is flip up the table-locking handles, slide the table (and its
attached fence) forward, swing the arm, push the table back, and flip
down the handles.
Still love my good ol' 1964 Sawsmith!
--John W. Wells
On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 23:02:02 +0000, Jerry McCaffrey wrote:
> A third on all this. Number one macine should be a good table saw. I
> started with a RAS and it was a LOT harder. CMS is a pleasure to set for
> miters, but I trimmed an entire house with a RAS on a stand that I rolled
> from room to room. Yet if you need to go from 45l to 45r to 90 etc, it's
> crank up the RAS, unlock and move, then crank down. Real slow compared to
> CMS. Never felt comfortable ripping on a RAS, but YMMV.
With a RAS set up properly with a 1/4" thick aux front table, the cranking
up and down isn't required as the left and right motions of the arm are
made with the blade behind the fence. In fact, one should never cut into
the factory main table and always use a sacrificial table cover of 1/4"
ply or tempered hardboard covering the front factory table. The standard
kerfs can then be cut and raising/lowering the arm isn't required even for
changing from crosscut to rip.
-Doug
--
"If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
then you and I will still each have one apple.
But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
On Mon, 09 Aug 2004 21:42:38 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
> It depends on your how your table is set up. Mine, for example has a
> solid piece and then toward the back are two loose table parts so that the
> fence can be placed directly against the immoveable part, between the two
> moveable parts, and at the very back. This allows more depth for ripping
> and more depth for cross cutting. As a result the moveable board
> (normally behind the fence) must be the same height as the rest of the
> table and the cross cut goes into both board. Consequently the saw must be
> raised to move the arm left and right. I agree with the 1/4" cover, but it
> has to be on all parts of the table, and cutting into the original table
> may not be bad as many original tables are so poor that immediate removal
> and placement in the rain is the best possible solution. I kept my
> original table only long enough to make a new table of plywood an rip the
> two moveable parts. Made new fences also, since the original only stuck
> up about 1/2 inch above the surface.
Your setup is the same as mine, and there is no reason to have the two
rear table parts permanently covered as well as the front table. I use an
appropiately sized strip of 1/4" ply not permannetly attached when the
fence must be placed in either of the rearmost positions. When all the
way back, it is only for ripping operations and the arm still does not
need to be raised and lowered if the standard kerfs are cut in the front
table. If in the middle position for ripping, the same applies. If in the
middle position for cross cutting or mitering, the blade is still behind
the fence (unless using a tall fence) and and no raising/lowering is
required for this either.
The standard kerfs include a 90 degree crosscut, right 45 degree miter,
(optional) left 45 degree miter, 45 degree bevel (requires
lowering/raising arm), inrip arc and trough, and outrip arc and trough.
The only operation that requires an arm height adjustment is a bevel cut
or some operation using other than the standard 10" blade, such as a dado
stack, sanding drum/disc, drill chuck, rotary surface planer, etc.
Here's a link showing the standard kerf:
<http://www.winterburn.net/doug/pictures/woodworking/R0010248.JPG>
-Doug
--
"If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
then you and I will still each have one apple.
But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:14:40 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
> Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
> same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and lowering
> the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
Well, the OP was saying what a pain in the tookas it was to raise and
lower the arm every time he had to change the arm for mitering, and I
thought I'd show him how raising/lowering the arm was unneceessary with a
properly set up saw. Covering just the front part of the table is
standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
has worked well for me for 35 years.
-Doug
--
"If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
then you and I will still each have one apple.
But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 17:24:38 +0000, Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
> J. Clarke wrote:
>> I'm curious, what are the three books that you have. The ones I know
>> are Mr. Sawdust, Jon Eakes, and one from Sears. Have I missed one?
>
The three I have are the Sears Power Tool Know how for the RAS, the Eakes
RAS book and a DeWalt RAS book by Howard Silken. The Mr Sawdust book is
on my list.
-Doug
--
"If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
then you and I will still each have one apple.
But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
J. Clarke wrote:
> I'm curious, what are the three books that you have. The ones I know are
> Mr. Sawdust, Jon Eakes, and one from Sears. Have I missed one?
I was going to order the Jon Eakes book until I found the order page on the
website wasn't secure. I emailed them about it and have gotten no reply yet.
Oh, well.
I don't order things on the internet unless they're on secure servers.
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
[email protected]
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
>Covering just the front part of the table is
standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
has worked well for me for 35 years.
If you use your RAS for shaping, moulding and delicate saw cuts you want the
back board to be a bit lower and adjustable with respect to the front table.
Doug what 3 books do you refer to? Kunkel, Eakes and ????
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Doug Winterburn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:14:40 +0000, George E. Cawthon wrote:
>
> > Hmm. I prefer the rear parts covered; all parts of the table with the
> > same height. Don't know what the big deal is about raising and lowering
> > the arm. It just takes a couple of turns of the crank.
>
> Well, the OP was saying what a pain in the tookas it was to raise and
> lower the arm every time he had to change the arm for mitering, and I
> thought I'd show him how raising/lowering the arm was unneceessary with a
> properly set up saw. Covering just the front part of the table is
> standard procedure in the three books I have on RAS setup and use, and it
> has worked well for me for 35 years.
>
> -Doug
>
> --
> "If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples
> then you and I will still each have one apple.
> But if you have an idea and I have one idea and we exchange these
> ideas,then each of us will have two ideas" George B. Shaw
>
>
The correct link to Mr.. Sawdust http://mrsawdust.com/
--
Rumpty
Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Rumpty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Steven,
>
> The RAS is your best option for the small shop, especially if you need
> miters etc for moulding in the home.
>
> Suggest reading "How To Master The Radial Saw" by Wally Kunkel
> http://mr.sawdust.com .
>
> Also join us on the radial saw forum:
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
>
>
>
> --
>
> Rumpty
>
> Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>
> "Steven Flynn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> >
> > Hello Group,
> >
> > I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
> > and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
> > arm saw.
>
>
On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn
<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>Hello Group,
>
>I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
>and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
>arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
>compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
>a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
>still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
>your thoughts on this...
>
>Thanks!
>
>Steven
the RAS will do everything a CMS will do but it will take longer for
setups. it will do most things a tablesaw will do also. if properly
tuned it is at the very least as accurate as a CMS also. i dont use
mine much but when i want it its there. i wouldnt part with it.
skeez
I faced that same decision maybe 5 years ago. I needed only shop work, but
needed precision. They had (then) just come out with their current RAS model
at Sears, and it had better stability, precision and range than the Delta or
earlier Sears RAS's. I now also have a chop saw (for portability), but find
that most of my use is split about 70% TS and 28% RAS. I only use the chop saw
in the shop if the RAS is setup for something.
When set up properly, you can change the RAS between left/right-45 and center
nearly as fast as the chop saw. The RAS maintains somewhat better accuracy,
though you'd really have to compare against a sliding chop saw to be fair. I
only know of one slider that's as good, as that costs nearly what the RAS
does.
While far more versatile, beware that the RAS does require more careful
initial alignment, and more knowledge and skill to use it well. Mine has seen
molding made, certain types of routing, and fly cutting surfaces.
If you enjoy learning how to use tools, have the time, and don't need the
portability, I'd recommend the RAS. Else, save up for a good sliding chop saw.
GerryG
On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:56:19 -0500, Steven Flynn <[email protected]>
wrote:
>
>
>Hello Group,
>
>I'm in the process of (slowly) outfitting a shop for basic woodworking
>and furniture making. I recently came across a craftsman 10" radial
>arm saw. Seems like this thing can do all kinds of stuff, including
>compound miter cuts. Before coming across this, I had planned to buy
>a compound miter (chop) saw. If I have a radial arm saw, would I
>still need the miter? I also intend to buy a table saw. Please offer
>your thoughts on this...
>
>Thanks!
>
>Steven