Breadboard / Chopping Board

SB asks:

>With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
>family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
>gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the enged
>leaving a "channel".
>
You are going to "get a piece of wood" in what manner?

There is a little more to making a cutting board than routing a groove around
the edge. Breadboards and cutting boards are different. Breadboards seldom need
a blood groove, which is what those grooves are. And breadboards are probably
best left for bread.

>Now I've got 2 questions..
>1) Which type of router bit do I use?

Cove.

>2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
>they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought the
>wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
>probably be poisonous.

It doesn't need a finish as such. Most normal varnishes are not poisonous after
they dry, incidentally, though I don't think they'll become flavoring of the
month for Coke or Pepsi. My wife is still using the cutting board I made for
her some 15 years ago, and it has never had any kind of finish applied. Simply
cherry and maple strips glued together and smoothed with a lightly relieved
edge.


Charlie Self
"It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of
common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever
ineligible for public office." H. L. Mencken

Make that piece of wood one which has small pores and no smell for best
results. Splintery woods are a bad choice as well. You rout with a core
box bit, not a cove, and the primary reason is to distinguish the board
used for food to be cooked from the one you use for bread or salad.

Best finish is nothing. Second best a curing oil or resin thinned so it is
not a surface finish, but helps keep bacteria from hiding from the detergent
or bleach you use to wipe the board. The one thing people are going to
suggest in droves - mineral oil - doesn't cure, and so becomes a swiffer and
a shelter for bacteria while the oil's present, and a bare board when the
detergent finally gets the oil and its lipid-loving passengers fully
emulsified. Of course, everyone will recommend periodic re-oiling.


"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> SB asks:
>
> >With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to
the
> >family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
> >gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the
enged
> >leaving a "channel".

>
> >Now I've got 2 questions..
> >1) Which type of router bit do I use?
>
> Cove.
>
> >2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
> >they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought
the
> >wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
> >probably be poisonous.
>
> It doesn't need a finish as such. Most normal varnishes are not poisonous
after
> they dry, incidentally, though I don't think they'll become flavoring of
the
> month for Coke or Pepsi. My wife is still using the cutting board I made
for
> her some 15 years ago, and it has never had any kind of finish applied.
Simply
> cherry and maple strips glued together and smoothed with a lightly
relieved
> edge.
>

Behlen's salad bowl finish is a tung-oil varnish.

Tyke, take a look at one show of The Router Workshop and you'll see how
easily templates for blood grooves can be done, as long as you're using a
collar.

"patrick conroy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Not sure varnish is poisionous -- after it cures. But you want something
> that will seal the wood up tight and take a beating. Try looking at
> something called a "Salad Bowl Finish" of you really want something food
> save.
>
> Do a Google search on those words and read what a lot of other folks have
> written about the topic.
>
>

I route the juice groove in the cutting boards with a Whiteside #1374
bit. Darned if I remember anymore what they called the thing. I have a
few hardboard templates I attach to the cutting board with double stick
tape and let a collar on the router follow it. I finish the cutting
boards with tung/varnish combo. No surface build, just what will soak
into the wood. Some folks use mineral oil but it has to be renewed
fairly frequently, the tung only every few years.

bob g.

SB wrote:

> Hi,
>
> With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
> family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
> gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the enged
> leaving a "channel".
>
> Now I've got 2 questions..
> 1) Which type of router bit do I use?
> 2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
> they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought the
> wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
> probably be poisonous.
>
> Please reply,
>
> SB
>
>

Charlie,
You don't say whether the board you describe is used for meat or
bread. BTW we use the ones with the "blood" groove for both but they
get washed with the rest of the dishes after being used with meat.

bob g.
>
> It doesn't need a finish as such. Most normal varnishes are not poisonous after
> they dry, incidentally, though I don't think they'll become flavoring of the
> month for Coke or Pepsi. My wife is still using the cutting board I made for
> her some 15 years ago, and it has never had any kind of finish applied. Simply
> cherry and maple strips glued together and smoothed with a lightly relieved
> edge.
>
>
> Charlie Self
> "It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of
> common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever
> ineligible for public office." H. L. Mencken

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 19:29:45 -0600, Robert Galloway
<[email protected]> wrote:

>> Don't use commercial "finishing oil" These are "drying" oils, that
>> are intended to form a skin of cured oil. Now IMHO, this doesn;t work
>> too well on wooden kitchenware that gets washed regularly.

>Can't agree with this. I've used a tung/varnish mix on cutting boards
>for about fifteen years.

That's a different finish though. I'm talking about an oil finish on
a cutting board, you're putting a surface film onto it. Now that's a
fine sort of finish to use, and a good way to produce it, but IMHE,
any finish that sits on the surface of a wooden kitchen implement is
going to get scraped off pretty easily. Once it's scraped, it look
untidy and the timber is bare beneath. Now I know an oil finish won;t
last for ever either, but it's removed gradually by washing, not
penetrated totally in spots.

BTW - Do you wash by hand or dishwasher ? I can imagine a surface
finish lasting on a salad bowl that's washed by hand much more than a
chopping board thats regularly scrubbed in boiling hot water.

--
Smert' spamionam

As the others have stated breadboard implies cutting bread/dry items. These
have simple rounding on the edges and no groove.

A board intended for cutting meat typically has a blood groove. This is
routed with a roundnose (core box) bit which as the name implies has a
rounded profile and no bearing on the bottom. The router will need a
template to follow which will be much smaller than the board. This takes
some calculation to get the appropriate diameter of the corners of the
template since the radius needs to be smaller than the board. The
difference depends on the distance from the template to the bit. Too
complex to attempt to explain in a message. I tried this once and really
messed up the board. I ended up abandoning the groove.

Depending on your desired board size you may not find a single piece of
wood. Many people make these from strips of wood to make them more stable
over time. This is my preference and allows me to make a board of the depth
desired by the wife.

I personally finish mine with salad bowl oil. This is a personal
preference. A board from good dense wood such as maple, will technically
not need oiling. I like the finish and the way water to rinse the board
rinses off.

I personally make my bread boards with "bread board" ends which is a piece
of wood glued across the strips at the end. I mortice the bread board end
and cut a blind mortise on the board ends.

Dave Paine.


"SB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi,
>
> With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
> family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
> gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the
enged
> leaving a "channel".
>
> Now I've got 2 questions..
> 1) Which type of router bit do I use?
> 2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
> they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought
the
> wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
> probably be poisonous.
>
> Please reply,
>
> SB
>
>

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 07:53:16 -0000, "SB" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Hi,
>
>With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
>family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
>gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the enged
>leaving a "channel".
>
>Now I've got 2 questions..
>1) Which type of router bit do I use?
>2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
>they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought the
>wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
>probably be poisonous.

Use mineral oil. You can get the oil at a corner drug store. Apply
until it doesn't soak up any more. Touch up with more about
once a year, if needed.

Thunder

>
>Please reply,
>
>SB
>

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 07:53:16 -0000, "SB" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
>family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
>gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the enged
>leaving a "channel".

>Now I've got 2 questions..

Actually you have 3....

>1) Which type of router bit do I use?

Whichever one you like. When you get your cheap set of a dozen
different bits (you're going to want one of these anyway), then take
some scrap and try routing with each of them. See what shape they
generate. Try moving the bit up and down relative to the edge, and see
how the shape changes.

If it's a big board, then you might use a cove bit to rout a
round-bottomed groove just in from the edge. This works best if you
rounded off the corners of the board before doing it, as it's hard to
put a sharp corner into a groove like this. Although it's called a
"blood groove", it's also useful as a hand grip on a big heavy board.

For the outside edge itself, then you'll probably use a big roundover
bit, maybe from both sides. Big and little radii on top and bottom
edges can work well. You might even use a more complex moulding, if
you have a big enough router cutter.


>2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing)

Yes, it's important. Incidentally, this is probably the _most_ asked
question on this ng. Use a light non-drying oil such as walnut or
grapeseed oil (good salad oils, you might have them in the kitchen).
You should then re-oil the boards "Once a day for a week, once a week
for a month, once a month for a year, then quarterly".

You might use sunflower oil. Many people do. Bit sticky, IMHO, but it
does work.

Don't use olive oil, as it goes "off" and rancid.

Some people use "mineral oil", which you can get from a (UK) chemist
as "liquid paraffin". I don't do this, simply because I don't keep any
in the kitchen.

Don't use linseed oil. Tastes horrible.

Don't use commercial "finishing oil" These are "drying" oils, that
are intended to form a skin of cured oil. Now IMHO, this doesn;t work
too well on wooden kitchenware that gets washed regularly. There are
also concerns over their healthiness, but modern recipes are usually
food-safe check the tin). This is however a good finishing oil to
have a tin of in the workshop - try Liberon's (from Axminster).


3)

Now the hard one - how to make a breadboard.

You might like to make a chopping board the _wrong_ way too. You'll
learn something about wood this way. Just take a flat-sawn board and
use it. Watch what happens as it gets washed and dried a few times -
see how the timber warps, so that the growth rings tend to straighten
out. That's wood movement, and it's going to be a nuisance to you for
a long time to come !

If you make a breadboard from a single flat board, then it needs to be
a good grade of timber or else you will get a lot of trouble with this
warping. Mainly it needs to have been cut from near the centre of a
large trunk (or else "quartersawn", but we won't talk about that just
now). If the rings are very curved, as from a small trunk, then you
get more warping.

So for a simple "single plank" breadboard, you have to rely on the
tree staying stable. You can do this, but only with the right timber.
You'll need to be buying a short piece of wide beech (maybe maple if
you can find it) or a tropical. Ash is OK if you seal the pores well,
oak tends to stain when washing. This sort of board _might_ show up in
the offcuts of a good timber merchant, A "cheat" is to go into
Poundstretcher and buy a ready-made breadboard or tray, made from
strips of glued-together rubberwood ! This is blatant cheating, but
don't knock it - it's real timber, not MDF, it's wide and stays
reasonably flat, and it's cheaper than buying wide boards from a real
merchant.

The way to make a big breadboard and keep it flat is with "breadboard
ends". You make the breadboard from several thin strips (so they can't
all warp as far in total) and there's a strip of timber running across
the ends. Web searching should explain more, and pictures. It's a
tricky bit of joinery though, to just make a mere breadboard. You'll
know the difference (and it will improve your skills) but the
recipients won't. If you can get access to a table saw, then do it,
but it's not really a router job.

Personally I'd suggest you make some fairly smallish circular
breadboards first. These will help to hide any warping that does goes
on. Make them from a good timber, like beech, or even the recycled
rubberwood.

When you've got it to shape, there's a _lot_ of sanding needed. Get
yourself some glasspaper in various grades (80, 120, 180 should do)
and a cork block to wrap it round. You can use any sort of block if
you need to, but don't use glasspaper with bare fingers to sand a flat
surface.

BTW - Whereabouts in the UK are you ? What's it like for getting
timber ?
--
Smert' spamionam

patrick conroy wrote:
>SB wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
>> family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
>> gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the
>> enged
>> leaving a "channel".
>>
>> Now I've got 2 questions..
>> 1) Which type of router bit do I use?
>
>Sam - that's a COVE bit to make the channel. See
>http://www.routerbits.com/cgi-routerbits/sr.cgi?1100354234_1866+24
<snip>

It would be easier to rout a groove using one of these:
http://www.routerbits.com/cgi-routerbits/sr.cgi?1100355133_4927+17

R,
Tom Q.

"SB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Hi,
>
> With Xmas fast approaching, I want to make some breadboards to give to the
> family to show what I can do with a few tools. What I intend doing is
> gettinga piece of wood which is square / rectangle and rout round the
> enged
> leaving a "channel".
>
> Now I've got 2 questions..
> 1) Which type of router bit do I use?

Sam - that's a COVE bit to make the channel. See
http://www.routerbits.com/cgi-routerbits/sr.cgi?1100354234_1866+24

> 2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing) because allthough
> they're called "breadboards" you can cut meat etc. on them and I thought
> the
> wood might stain.. If I used normal varnish to seal the wood, it would
> probably be poisonous.

Not sure varnish is poisionous -- after it cures. But you want something
that will seal the wood up tight and take a beating. Try looking at
something called a "Salad Bowl Finish" of you really want something food
save.

Do a Google search on those words and read what a lot of other folks have
written about the topic.

>
>>2) How can I waterproof the board (if it needs doing)
>
>
> Yes, it's important. Incidentally, this is probably the _most_ asked
> question on this ng. Use a light non-drying oil such as walnut or
> grapeseed oil (good salad oils, you might have them in the kitchen).
> You should then re-oil the boards "Once a day for a week, once a week
> for a month, once a month for a year, then quarterly".
>
> You might use sunflower oil. Many people do. Bit sticky, IMHO, but it
> does work.
>
> Don't use olive oil, as it goes "off" and rancid.
>
> Some people use "mineral oil", which you can get from a (UK) chemist
> as "liquid paraffin". I don't do this, simply because I don't keep any
> in the kitchen.
>
> Don't use linseed oil. Tastes horrible.
>
> Don't use commercial "finishing oil" These are "drying" oils, that
> are intended to form a skin of cured oil. Now IMHO, this doesn;t work
> too well on wooden kitchenware that gets washed regularly. There are
> also concerns over their healthiness, but modern recipes are usually
> food-safe check the tin). This is however a good finishing oil to
> have a tin of in the workshop - try Liberon's (from Axminster).

Can't agree with this. I've used a tung/varnish mix on cutting boards
for about fifteen years. They don't smell, don't flavor the food and
need renewing only when the cutting has resulted is a "fuzzy" surface on
the board. I sand a little and recoat, wiping off all the excess after
a few minutes. Dries to a surface that doesn't soak up the blood or
juice or dish water. Have yet to find the downside and doesn't involve
any day, week, month, year, quarter algorithm.

bob g.
>
>
> 3)
>
> Now the hard one - how to make a breadboard.
>
> You might like to make a chopping board the _wrong_ way too. You'll
> learn something about wood this way. Just take a flat-sawn board and
> use it. Watch what happens as it gets washed and dried a few times -
> see how the timber warps, so that the growth rings tend to straighten
> out. That's wood movement, and it's going to be a nuisance to you for
> a long time to come !
>
> If you make a breadboard from a single flat board, then it needs to be
> a good grade of timber or else you will get a lot of trouble with this
> warping. Mainly it needs to have been cut from near the centre of a
> large trunk (or else "quartersawn", but we won't talk about that just
> now). If the rings are very curved, as from a small trunk, then you
> get more warping.
>
> So for a simple "single plank" breadboard, you have to rely on the
> tree staying stable. You can do this, but only with the right timber.
> You'll need to be buying a short piece of wide beech (maybe maple if
> you can find it) or a tropical. Ash is OK if you seal the pores well,
> oak tends to stain when washing. This sort of board _might_ show up in
> the offcuts of a good timber merchant, A "cheat" is to go into
> Poundstretcher and buy a ready-made breadboard or tray, made from
> strips of glued-together rubberwood ! This is blatant cheating, but
> don't knock it - it's real timber, not MDF, it's wide and stays
> reasonably flat, and it's cheaper than buying wide boards from a real
> merchant.
>
> The way to make a big breadboard and keep it flat is with "breadboard
> ends". You make the breadboard from several thin strips (so they can't
> all warp as far in total) and there's a strip of timber running across
> the ends. Web searching should explain more, and pictures. It's a
> tricky bit of joinery though, to just make a mere breadboard. You'll
> know the difference (and it will improve your skills) but the
> recipients won't. If you can get access to a table saw, then do it,
> but it's not really a router job.
>
> Personally I'd suggest you make some fairly smallish circular
> breadboards first. These will help to hide any warping that does goes
> on. Make them from a good timber, like beech, or even the recycled
> rubberwood.
>
> When you've got it to shape, there's a _lot_ of sanding needed. Get
> yourself some glasspaper in various grades (80, 120, 180 should do)
> and a cork block to wrap it round. You can use any sort of block if
> you need to, but don't use glasspaper with bare fingers to sand a flat
> surface.
>
> BTW - Whereabouts in the UK are you ? What's it like for getting
> timber ?