Looking for ideas on how to distribute LP air in my shop.
My shop is 18' X 22' and I have a stair case in the back corner, under which
my compressor sits. Right now, I have a rubber hose running through the
ceiling with just one outlet at a hose reel in the front of the shop. I
would like to have the hose reel and a fixed outlet at the front of the
shop, a hose drop in the ceiling in the middle and a outlet at the back.
Maybe to elaborate for a small shop but things that make my work easier are
a bonus.
I have looked at the Rapid Air System, seems a bit pricey at $139.99 for
100ft of hose, a compressor manifold and 2 outlets. I was also looking at
building my own black pipe system that would give me the 3 outlets and the
hose reel for less money and more labor.
Any ideas?
Neil Larson
Crystal Lake, IL
"Max" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
>
> The local Lowe's carries 10' sections. (Threaded)
>
> Max (El Paso)
>
Lowe's is kinda funny, at least around here. If you need sections that add
to 10', it's much cheaper to have them cut and thread the 10' pipe rather
than buying parts.
Puckdropper
--
On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as some
writers are incorrigible.
To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm
> Any ideas?
What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is
okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need
a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
V8013-R
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>> Any ideas?
>
>What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is
>okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>
>If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
>fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need
>a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>
>Regards,
>Joe Agro, Jr.
>(800) 871-5022
>01.908.542.0244
>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>
>V8013-R
>
>
Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
"stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
could use a short chunk of air hose.
On Sat, 7 Mar 2009 14:36:46 -0600, "Greg O" <[email protected]>
wrote:
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> >>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
>>>> in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
>>>> outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
>>>> "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
>>>> condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
>>>> hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
>>>> could use a short chunk of air hose.
>>>
>>>"M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.
>>>http://www.copper.org/Applications/plumbing/techref/cth/tables/cth_table3c.html
>>>Greg
>
>> "M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in
>> price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff".
>
>
> It depends on the size. I see above 1" was mentioned. M would still be
>fine. Smaller diameters even better yet.
>Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20
>CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us!
>Greg
1/2" is adequate for most - 5/8" for the rest of us.
On Mar 6, 1:23=A0pm, "Neil Larson" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Looking for ideas on how to distribute LP air in my shop.
>
> My shop is 18' X 22' and I have a stair case in the back corner, under wh=
ich
> my compressor sits. Right now, I have a rubber hose running through the
> ceiling with just one outlet at a hose reel in the front of the shop. I
> would like to have the hose reel and a fixed outlet at the front of the
> shop, a hose drop in the ceiling in the middle and a outlet at the back.
> Maybe to elaborate for a small shop but things that make my work easier a=
re
> a bonus.
>
> I have looked at the Rapid Air System, seems a bit pricey at =A0$139.99 f=
or
> 100ft of hose, a compressor manifold and 2 outlets. I was also looking at
> building my own black pipe system that would give me the 3 outlets and th=
e
> hose reel for less money and more labor.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Neil Larson
> Crystal Lake, IL
Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might
generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air
throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. We had a very large dual-
stage compressor inherited from an auto body shop down the road. we
ran drops down from the ceiling, tapping them at working height and
incorporating drains below each drop after about 6-8 inches of pipe
with the petcock at the bottom. We ran air tools and Binks Spray guns.
Worked like a charm and much cheaper than iron (read expensive/
rusting) pipe.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>> Any ideas?
>>
>>What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube
>>is
>>okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>>
>>If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
>>fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't
>>need
>>a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Joe Agro, Jr.
>>(800) 871-5022
>>01.908.542.0244
>>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>>Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>>Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>>
>>V8013-R
>>
>>
> Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
> in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
> outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
> "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
> condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
> hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
> could use a short chunk of air hose.
"M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.
http://www.copper.org/Applications/plumbing/techref/cth/tables/cth_table3c.html
Greg
On Mar 6, 7:12 pm, "SonomaProducts.com" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Not that it really matters right now, it seems however I read the
> table that M is OK for my 110# system, but I can't really understand
> the table. I don't get the column headings S=4900 psi 200F means
> what?
It's giving the rating vs temperature.
-Kevin
"Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> Any ideas?
>
> What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube
> is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>
> If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
> fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't
> need a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>
> Regards,
> Joe Agro, Jr.
> (800) 871-5022
> 01.908.542.0244
> Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
> Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
> Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>
> V8013-R
>
If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plasitc pipe.
Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water pipe
style can explode without warning.
John G.
>
I fit gas pipe for a living. Buy a tank, it is easier and cheaper!
"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Greg O" wrote:
>
>> Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20
>> CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us!
>
> Added storage caqpacity out weighs flow rate for most DIY installations.
>
> 2' Black iron with 3/4 side taps bushed as required is hard to beat.
>
> BTDT
>
> Lew
>
>
Threading and assembling 2" black pipe is a pain, nothing I would recommend
to any one without experience and a couple high quality 24" pipe wrenches!
For the little extra you would gain in capacity you can pick up a tank and
add in the system if you feel the need for more capacity. Unless you get the
pipe for free I would not consider it, and even then I probably still would
go with 3/4"!! Figure the price of fittings in the mix and I think most will
agree.
2" black pipe will contain about 375 cubic inches per ten feet or 1.6
gallons.
I worked in a CNC machine shop, 20 HP recip compressor, later a 50 HP screw.
We had 1-1/4" mains that served us very well.
I will post a chart on binaries. It shows pressure drop of various pipe
sizes at 100 feet. 1/2" at 100 PSI will flow about 16 CFM. 3/4" at 100 PSI
will flow about 32 CFM.
Greg
On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 20:06:29 -0700 (PDT), Hoosierpopi
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might
>generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air
>throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. ...
Not a thing wrong with that as long as you're not subject to OSHA
inspection/fines and don't mind assuming a small risk of PVC shrapnel.
Tom Veatch
Wichita, KS
USA
"Greg O" wrote:
> Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well
> over 20 CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of
> us!
Added storage caqpacity out weighs flow rate for most DIY
installations.
2' Black iron with 3/4 side taps bushed as required is hard to beat.
BTDT
Lew
"Greg O" wrote:
> Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for
> air lines is crazy!
Agreed.
> Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say
> no to PVC!!
Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to
6 ft long.
No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon
paste and a couple of pipe wrenches..
Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not
a problem
Lew
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Greg O" wrote:
>
>> Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for
>> air lines is crazy!
>
> Agreed.
>
>> Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say
>> no to PVC!!
>
> Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to
> 6 ft long.
>
> No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon
> paste and a couple of pipe wrenches..
>
> Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not
> a problem
>
> Lew
>
>
Made me think of my deceased uncle. His saying about hogs was "when
they ain't rootin' they're a ruttin".
I used black iron iron in my shop, with two outside drops. Learned to
use a plastic slip cover on them to keep the little mud wasps from
clogging the connectors up.
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA
My favorite mythical creature? The
honest politician.
> If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plasitc
> pipe.
> Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water
> pipe style can explode without warning.
Agreed. It better be pneumatic tube and not your cousin's fish tank plastic
tube or some PVC drain pipe stuff.
--
Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
V8013-R
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >>>>
>>>>
>>> Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
>>> in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
>>> outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
>>> "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
>>> condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
>>> hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
>>> could use a short chunk of air hose.
>>
>>"M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.
>>http://www.copper.org/Applications/plumbing/techref/cth/tables/cth_table3c.html
>>Greg
> "M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in
> price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff".
It depends on the size. I see above 1" was mentioned. M would still be
fine. Smaller diameters even better yet.
Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20
CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us!
Greg
"WW" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to
> basement>125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years.
> Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so
> far. WW
But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing
makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce
shrapnel next time you pressurize it.
"John G." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Joe AutoDrill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>> Any ideas?
>>
>> What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube
>> is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>>
>> If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
>> fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't
>> need a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Joe Agro, Jr.
>> (800) 871-5022
>> 01.908.542.0244
>> Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>> Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>> Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>>
>> V8013-R
>>
> If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plastic
> pipe.
> Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water
> pipe style can explode without warning.
>
> John G.
>>
John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to
basement>125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. Have
3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so far. WW
Not that it really matters right now, it seems however I read the
table that M is OK for my 110# system, but I can't really understand
the table. I don't get the column headings S=3D4900 psi 200F means
what?
On Mar 6, 3:19=A0pm, "Greg O" <[email protected]> wrote:
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >>> Any ideas?
>
> >>What type of air do you need to transport? =A0Low volume where a small =
tube
> >>is
> >>okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>
> >>If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
> >>fittings all over. =A0Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don'=
t
> >>need
> >>a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>
> >>Regards,
> >>Joe Agro, Jr.
> >>(800) 871-5022
> >>01.908.542.0244
> >>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills:http://www.AutoDrill.com
> >>Multiple Spindle Drills:http://www.Multi-Drill.com
> >>Flagship Site:http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>
> >>V8013-R
>
> > Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
> > in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
> > outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
> > "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
> > condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
> > hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
> > could use a short chunk of air hose.
>
> "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.http:=
//www.copper.org/Applications/plumbing/techref/cth/tables/cth_ta...
> Greg- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
In article <[email protected]>,
"Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "WW" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to
> > basement>125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years.
> > Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so
> > far. WW
>
> But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing
> makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce
> shrapnel next time you pressurize it.
Agreed; the problem isn't so much that it can't withstand the pressure
in general (it can), but that the failure mode when it fails is
dangerous. Copper pipe tends to rend itself and split open to release
the pressure; plastic (at least PVC) pipe tends to shatter into many
shards. For water and such incompressible liquids, these shards don't
get any great velocity because the pressure instantly decreases once
released; but for compressed air, they are projected quite forcibly and
become dangerous shrapnel.
Other kinds of plastic piping/tubing may be suitable for compressed air
use, such as the kinds they sometimes make air hoses out of.
--
Andrew Erickson
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot
lose." -- Jim Elliot
WW wrote:
...
> John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to
> basement>125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. ...
> ... no problems so far. WW
The last two words are the key phrase here.
For 1/2" the volume isn't large enough to be a huge threat but as others
have said, not recommended application. The bigger threat normally
isn't just a spontaneous failure but that any impact may produce an
explosive fracture instead of just a break.
--
I'm doing the same project in my shop. Apologies for a minor thread
highjack.
I managed to score some black iron pipe at an auction for a plumbing shop
that was moving out of state. About 60 feet of 1 inch, 20 feet of
3/4 inch and 20 feet of 1/2 inch. Way more than I need, but I got it for
$30 (golly, is that my first gloat here?).
The problem is that a couple of the chunks are used. I guess for natural
gas, but I'm not sure. There is some black corrosion/residue/something
that flakes on the inside of them. Any suggestions on how to clean it
out?
--
Frank Stutzman
Frank Stutzman wrote:
...
> I managed to score some black iron pipe ...
> ...a couple of the chunks are used. ...
> ... There is some black corrosion/residue/something
> that flakes on the inside of them. Any suggestions on how to clean it
> out?
Once you cut to length, might try a stiff (#10, say) wire thru pulling a
brush first. After that, I'd just hook it up and use the air pressure
to flush it. If add a screen/filter should be no time before all that's
going to come loose is out.
--
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 17:19:07 -0600, "Greg O" <[email protected]>
wrote:
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>> Any ideas?
>>>
>>>What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube
>>>is
>>>okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed?
>>>
>>>If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release
>>>fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't
>>>need
>>>a tube too so you could make everything quick release.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Joe Agro, Jr.
>>>(800) 871-5022
>>>01.908.542.0244
>>>Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
>>>Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
>>>Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
>>>
>>>V8013-R
>>>
>>>
>> Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop
>> in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air
>> outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a
>> "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any
>> condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex
>> hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you
>> could use a short chunk of air hose.
>
>"M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.
>http://www.copper.org/Applications/plumbing/techref/cth/tables/cth_table3c.html
>Greg
"M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in
price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff".
"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:I%jtl.2293$%[email protected]...
>
> "Greg O" wrote:
>
>> Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air
>> lines is crazy!
>
> Agreed.
>
>> Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no
>> to PVC!!
>
> Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to 6
> ft long.
>
> No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon paste
> and a couple of pipe wrenches..
>
> Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not a
> problem
>
> Lew
The local Lowe's carries 10' sections. (Threaded)
Max (El Paso)
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 23:01:30 -0500, "Ed Pawlowski" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>
>"WW" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to
>> basement>125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years.
>> Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so
>> far. WW
>
>But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing
>makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce
>shrapnel next time you pressurize it.
>
Just don't strike it when it's cold and pressurized.
"Hoosierpopi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:34364519-a4b1-4e16-947c-3d85608db308@y13g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might
generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air
throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. We had a very large dual-
stage compressor inherited from an auto body shop down the road. we
ran drops down from the ceiling, tapping them at working height and
incorporating drains below each drop after about 6-8 inches of pipe
with the petcock at the bottom. We ran air tools and Binks Spray guns.
Worked like a charm and much cheaper than iron (read expensive/
rusting) pipe.
Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air lines
is crazy!
I used it myself in a couple differant shops, but when I saw the result of a
failure I ripped it all out! The stuff explodes like a hand grenade when it
fails.
Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no to
PVC!!
Greg