On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> > Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
> > https://thriftycabinets.com
>
> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
> this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
> in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
> complain.
If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
a little better for you:
"Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
to my website?
Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
[Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
send-off.
On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:41:52 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
> I downloaded and looked at one and it was fine.
> Funniest part is that the zip file was something like 3.7mb and the
> extracted file was 3.8mb. Stupid. Sounds like someone who started
> with dial-up and is stuck in his ways. :-)
>
> Either way, I don't see anyone paying for these plans. There's nothing
> special about them and the same info is all over the web for free.
> Seems to me like a retired guy doing this as a hobby. Nobel enough
> venture, but decades behind in terms of marketability.
>
> The best part is the user agreement that forbids you from selling
> anything you make using his plans, without getting written permission
> first.
>
> I don't see anyone selling any of the stuff and making any money unless
> they hire kids in Taiwan to do it. All the designs look like RTA
> assemblies straight out of IKEA or Wayfair.
>
>
> --
>
> -MIKE-
>
> "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> --Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
> --
> www.mikedrums.com
Mike,
My plans are intended for beginning woodworkers and I think you agree with that. As for the rest of your comments, they are unnecessary. I have sold many of my plans to woodworkers who are very happy with the instructions.
I would hope this is a respectable forum for woodworkers seeking info and help. So far the comments I have received tell me otherwise.
On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 5:49:10 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote=
:
> On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 1:17:40 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 11:15:51 AM UTC-5, [email protected] =
wrote:
> > > On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:26:18 PM UTC-6, crystal...@gmail.=
com wrote:
> > > > Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. A=
lso, the plans show "out of stock".
> > > >=20
> > > > Bob
> > >=20
> > > The sample plan links are within each plan listing.=20
> >=20
> > No, they are not. There are a number of plans that do not have a sample=
.
> > It appears that if you are out of stock, there is not sample. I assume =
that
> > that is what "Crystal" was referring to.
> >=20
> > Speaking of "out of stock" items...
> >=20
> > The title of this thread (*your* thread) is "Thrifty Cabinets Plans". Y=
our
> > text says "easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans". However, the 2 i=
tems
> > shown under the drop-down for "Cabinet Plans" are both "Out-Of-Stock"
> >=20
> > 2 Questions:
> >=20
> > 1 - Why did you emphasize Cabinet Plans in your thread if they are not=
=20
> > available?
> > 2 - How can a zip file be "Out-Of-Stock"? You know that zip files aren'=
t
> > physical things that leave your inventory when someone downloads them, =
right?
>=20
> Good questions Bob.
>=20
Who the heck is "Bob"?
> 1 - Not all of the plans are completed. I've changed the wording to say "=
Coming Soon" instead of "Out of Stock." Hopefully, that will be clearer. As=
far as the name Thrifty Cabinets, it's a long story, but it is my domain n=
ame. At the present time, on my site, there are six completed plans and sev=
en other plans in the works. I guess I could remove the uncompleted ones fr=
om the site, but I would rather people see what is coming soon. I'm a week =
or so away from completing the Poker Caddy, and in my shop now I'm working =
on an eight-person rectangular dining table.
>=20
> 2 - I believe my #1 answer also answers your #2 question. I can only prod=
uce a sample of a plan after the plan is completed.
>=20
> Also, based on your comments, I plan to add more ways for people to recei=
ve and view sample plans. Thanks for helpful comments.
On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
> https://thriftycabinets.com
I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to complain.
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:14:53 PM UTC-5, Unquestionably Confused=
wrote:
> On 12/29/2018 4:24 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
> > On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> >> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6,=20
> >> [email protected] wrote:
> >>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and=
=20
> >>> furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan=20
> >>> available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy=
=20
> >>> the plan. Please take a look:
> >>> https://thriftycabinets.com
> >>
> >> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I=20
> >> thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who=
=20
> >> are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who=
=20
> >> just want to complain.
> >=20
> > I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
> > as such things go.=C2=A0 Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
> > to use it for commercial purposes.=C2=A0 It's a free internet, but
> > posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
> > these parts.
>=20
> Some folks would complain if hanged with a new rope.
>=20
> Hey, Brucie, do you also throw a temper tantrum when your FREE gmail=20
> account doesn't work to your satisfaction?
>=20
> Perhaps the biggest joke is your "licensing agreement"
>=20
> "Thrifty Cabinets plans are copyright =C2=A9 Bruce Kieffer 2018.
> Purchased plans are for the purchaser's personal use only. Plans may not=
=20
> be reconfigured, converted, distributed or sold. Finished products=20
> created from any Thrifty Cabinets plan cannot be sold without receiving=
=20
> written approval. Clicking the "Add to cart" button below and providing=
=20
> payment is your acceptance of this license agreement."
10 years after I build a dresser I'll make sure I contact Bruce before
I put it on Craigslist. ;-)
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:41:42 PM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 12/29/18 6:32 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:30:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> >> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:14:53 PM UTC-5, Unquestionably Con=
fused wrote:
> >>> On 12/29/2018 4:24 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
> >>>> On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> >>>>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6,
> >>>>> [email protected] wrote:
> >>>>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet a=
nd
> >>>>>> furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan
> >>>>>> available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you b=
uy
> >>>>>> the plan. Please take a look:
> >>>>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I
> >>>>> thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers wh=
o
> >>>>> are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people =
who
> >>>>> just want to complain.
> >>>>
> >>>> I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
> >>>> as such things go.=C2=A0 Maybe your problem is that you think it's O=
K
> >>>> to use it for commercial purposes.=C2=A0 It's a free internet, but
> >>>> posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
> >>>> these parts.
> >>>
> >>> Some folks would complain if hanged with a new rope.
> >>>
> >>> Hey, Brucie, do you also throw a temper tantrum when your FREE gmail
> >>> account doesn't work to your satisfaction?
> >>>
> >>> Perhaps the biggest joke is your "licensing agreement"
> >>>
> >>> "Thrifty Cabinets plans are copyright =C2=A9 Bruce Kieffer 2018.
> >>> Purchased plans are for the purchaser's personal use only. Plans may =
not
> >>> be reconfigured, converted, distributed or sold. Finished products
> >>> created from any Thrifty Cabinets plan cannot be sold without receivi=
ng
> >>> written approval. Clicking the "Add to cart" button below and providi=
ng
> >>> payment is your acceptance of this license agreement."
> >>
> >> 10 years after I build a dresser I'll make sure I contact Bruce before
> >> I put it on Craigslist. ;-)
> >=20
> > Wait! I have a better idea.
> >=20
> > I'll leave one screw out or something like that and then it'll never be=
a
> > "finished product". I can sell them like that and make a fortune!
> >=20
>=20
> Nope, nope!
> That would be "reconfigured" which is expressly forbidden by the user=20
> agreement!!
>=20
I'll tape the screw to the inside of a drawer with a note saying that I did=
n't=20
have time to finish it.
I have the law firm of Dewey, Cheatem and Howe on retainer so I'm not worri=
ed.
On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 7:11:33 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
> On 12/28/2018 10:23 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:41:52 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
> >
> >> I downloaded and looked at one and it was fine.
> >> Funniest part is that the zip file was something like 3.7mb and the
> >> extracted file was 3.8mb. Stupid. Sounds like someone who started
> >> with dial-up and is stuck in his ways. :-)
> >>
> >> Either way, I don't see anyone paying for these plans. There's nothing
> >> special about them and the same info is all over the web for free.
> >> Seems to me like a retired guy doing this as a hobby. Nobel enough
> >> venture, but decades behind in terms of marketability.
> >>
> >> The best part is the user agreement that forbids you from selling
> >> anything you make using his plans, without getting written permission
> >> first.
> >>
> >> I don't see anyone selling any of the stuff and making any money unless
> >> they hire kids in Taiwan to do it. All the designs look like RTA
> >> assemblies straight out of IKEA or Wayfair.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> -MIKE-
> >>
> >> "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> >> --Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
> >> --
> >> www.mikedrums.com
> >
> > Mike,
> >
> > My plans are intended for beginning woodworkers and I think you agree with that. As for the rest of your comments, they are unnecessary. I have sold many of my plans to woodworkers who are very happy with the instructions.
> >
> > I would hope this is a respectable forum for woodworkers seeking info and help. So far the comments I have received tell me otherwise.
> >
>
> Jumping into a newsgroup with SPAM and one that you do not participate
> in, is kinda, you know.
+1
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> > > Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
> > > https://thriftycabinets.com
> >
> > I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
> > this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
> > in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
> > complain.
>
> If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
> a little better for you:
>
> "Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
> furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
> for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
> that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
> to my website?
>
> Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
> offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
> list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
>
> [Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
>
> That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
> would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
> send-off.
Thanks DerbyDad03. It's obvious this forum needs a moderator.
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 05:33:56 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
wrote:
>On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>
>I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to complain.
So are we! No, moron, SPAM is *never* welcome on the Usenet. I don't
appreciate calls selling crap, either.
On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:26:18 PM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
>
> Bob
The sample plan links are within each plan listing. They are zip files because that is the only way I can get them to be downloadable using the web software I have.
On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 1:17:40 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 11:15:51 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wr=
ote:
> > On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:26:18 PM UTC-6, [email protected]=
m wrote:
> > > Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Als=
o, the plans show "out of stock".
> > >=20
> > > Bob
> >=20
> > The sample plan links are within each plan listing.=20
>=20
> No, they are not. There are a number of plans that do not have a sample.
> It appears that if you are out of stock, there is not sample. I assume th=
at
> that is what "Crystal" was referring to.
>=20
> Speaking of "out of stock" items...
>=20
> The title of this thread (*your* thread) is "Thrifty Cabinets Plans". You=
r
> text says "easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans". However, the 2 ite=
ms
> shown under the drop-down for "Cabinet Plans" are both "Out-Of-Stock"
>=20
> 2 Questions:
>=20
> 1 - Why did you emphasize Cabinet Plans in your thread if they are not=20
> available?
> 2 - How can a zip file be "Out-Of-Stock"? You know that zip files aren't
> physical things that leave your inventory when someone downloads them, ri=
ght?
Good questions Bob.
1 - Not all of the plans are completed. I've changed the wording to say "Co=
ming Soon" instead of "Out of Stock." Hopefully, that will be clearer. As f=
ar as the name Thrifty Cabinets, it's a long story, but it is my domain nam=
e. At the present time, on my site, there are six completed plans and seven=
other plans in the works. I guess I could remove the uncompleted ones from=
the site, but I would rather people see what is coming soon. I'm a week or=
so away from completing the Poker Caddy, and in my shop now I'm working on=
an eight-person rectangular dining table.
2 - I believe my #1 answer also answers your #2 question. I can only produc=
e a sample of a plan after the plan is completed.
Also, based on your comments, I plan to add more ways for people to receive=
and view sample plans. Thanks for helpful comments.
On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:26:18 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
>
> Bob
The sample plans are there for some items, but they appear to be zip files.
Forgive me I choose not to open them.
Spammer (or worse) be gone!
On 12/28/2018 10:23 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:41:52 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
>
>> I downloaded and looked at one and it was fine.
>> Funniest part is that the zip file was something like 3.7mb and the
>> extracted file was 3.8mb. Stupid. Sounds like someone who started
>> with dial-up and is stuck in his ways. :-)
>>
>> Either way, I don't see anyone paying for these plans. There's nothing
>> special about them and the same info is all over the web for free.
>> Seems to me like a retired guy doing this as a hobby. Nobel enough
>> venture, but decades behind in terms of marketability.
>>
>> The best part is the user agreement that forbids you from selling
>> anything you make using his plans, without getting written permission
>> first.
>>
>> I don't see anyone selling any of the stuff and making any money unless
>> they hire kids in Taiwan to do it. All the designs look like RTA
>> assemblies straight out of IKEA or Wayfair.
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> -MIKE-
>>
>> "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
>> --Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
>> --
>> www.mikedrums.com
>
> Mike,
>
> My plans are intended for beginning woodworkers and I think you agree with that. As for the rest of your comments, they are unnecessary. I have sold many of my plans to woodworkers who are very happy with the instructions.
>
> I would hope this is a respectable forum for woodworkers seeking info and help. So far the comments I have received tell me otherwise.
>
Jumping into a newsgroup with SPAM and one that you do not participate
in, is kinda, you know.
On 12/29/2018 4:24 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
> On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6,
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and
>>> furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan
>>> available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy
>>> the plan. Please take a look:
>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>
>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I
>> thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who
>> are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who
>> just want to complain.
>
> I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
> as such things go. Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
> to use it for commercial purposes. It's a free internet, but
> posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
> these parts.
Some folks would complain if hanged with a new rope.
Hey, Brucie, do you also throw a temper tantrum when your FREE gmail
account doesn't work to your satisfaction?
Perhaps the biggest joke is your "licensing agreement"
"Thrifty Cabinets plans are copyright © Bruce Kieffer 2018.
Purchased plans are for the purchaser's personal use only. Plans may not
be reconfigured, converted, distributed or sold. Finished products
created from any Thrifty Cabinets plan cannot be sold without receiving
written approval. Clicking the "Add to cart" button below and providing
payment is your acceptance of this license agreement."
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 11:32:24 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> > > On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> > > > Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
> > > > https://thriftycabinets.com
> > >
> > > I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
> > > this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
> > > in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
> > > complain.
> >
> > If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
> > a little better for you:
> >
> > "Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
> > furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
> > for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
> > that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
> > to my website?
> >
> > Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
> > offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
> > list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
> >
> > [Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
> >
> > That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
> > would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
> > send-off.
>
> Thanks DerbyDad03. It's obvious this forum needs a moderator.
rec.woodworking is not a forum. It's a usenet newsgroup. The vast majority of usenet newgroups don't have moderators. Usenet information, including a brief
mention of the limited use of moderators, can be found here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usenet_newsgroup
IMO, rec.woodworking - on usenet - will never be moderated. Content may be
moderated once it hits web-based forums that steal posts from usenet, but
that's a topic for a different discussion.
If this was a moderated group e.g. mod.rec.woodworking (which AFAIK doesn't
exist) your post would probably have been blocked. Instead, you got some
constructive criticism. You have now experienced the beauty of usenet in
all of its un-moderated glory.
On Friday, December 28, 2018 at 11:15:51 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:26:18 PM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
> > Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
> >
> > Bob
>
> The sample plan links are within each plan listing.
No, they are not. There are a number of plans that do not have a sample.
It appears that if you are out of stock, there is not sample. I assume that
that is what "Crystal" was referring to.
Speaking of "out of stock" items...
The title of this thread (*your* thread) is "Thrifty Cabinets Plans". Your
text says "easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans". However, the 2 items
shown under the drop-down for "Cabinet Plans" are both "Out-Of-Stock"
2 Questions:
1 - Why did you emphasize Cabinet Plans in your thread if they are not
available?
2 - How can a zip file be "Out-Of-Stock"? You know that zip files aren't
physical things that leave your inventory when someone downloads them, right?
On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:35:55 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:26:18 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
> > Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
> >
> > Bob
>
> The sample plans are there for some items, but they appear to be zip files.
>
> Forgive me I choose not to open them.
>
> Spammer (or worse) be gone!
Bob,
Given the world we live in today, I understand your fear about downloading a zip file. But seriously, you look at my site and you think I'm spamming you. I will be happy to email you a non-zip file if you want to see a sample.
On Fri, 28 Dec 2018 08:18:09 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
wrote:
>On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 5:35:55 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:26:18 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>> > Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
>> >
>> > Bob
>>
>> The sample plans are there for some items, but they appear to be zip files.
>>
>> Forgive me I choose not to open them.
>>
>> Spammer (or worse) be gone!
>
>Bob,
>
>Given the world we live in today, I understand your fear about downloading a zip file.
>But seriously, you look at my site and you think I'm spamming you.
Exactly what other conclusion can one come to? You *are* spamming the
group. You _do_ know what spam is, right?
>I will be happy to email you a non-zip file if you want to see a sample.
No thanks. We've already seen the spam. There are better and
cheaper places to get _good_ designs.
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 15:24:20 -0700, Just Wondering <[email protected]> wrote:
>On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>
>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to complain.
>
>I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
>as such things go. Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
>to use it for commercial purposes. It's a free internet, but
>posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
>these parts.
Especially when the web site is not ready for prime time and the
prices are higher than, say, Woodsmith.
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:30:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:14:53 PM UTC-5, Unquestionably Confus=
ed wrote:
> > On 12/29/2018 4:24 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
> > > On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> > >> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6,=20
> > >> [email protected] wrote:
> > >>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet an=
d=20
> > >>> furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan=20
> > >>> available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you bu=
y=20
> > >>> the plan. Please take a look:
> > >>> https://thriftycabinets.com
> > >>
> > >> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I=20
> > >> thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who=
=20
> > >> are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people w=
ho=20
> > >> just want to complain.
> > >=20
> > > I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
> > > as such things go.=C2=A0 Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
> > > to use it for commercial purposes.=C2=A0 It's a free internet, but
> > > posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
> > > these parts.
> >=20
> > Some folks would complain if hanged with a new rope.
> >=20
> > Hey, Brucie, do you also throw a temper tantrum when your FREE gmail=20
> > account doesn't work to your satisfaction?
> >=20
> > Perhaps the biggest joke is your "licensing agreement"
> >=20
> > "Thrifty Cabinets plans are copyright =C2=A9 Bruce Kieffer 2018.
> > Purchased plans are for the purchaser's personal use only. Plans may no=
t=20
> > be reconfigured, converted, distributed or sold. Finished products=20
> > created from any Thrifty Cabinets plan cannot be sold without receiving=
=20
> > written approval. Clicking the "Add to cart" button below and providing=
=20
> > payment is your acceptance of this license agreement."
>=20
> 10 years after I build a dresser I'll make sure I contact Bruce before
> I put it on Craigslist. ;-)
Wait! I have a better idea.=20
I'll leave one screw out or something like that and then it'll never be a
"finished product". I can sell them like that and make a fortune!
On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>
> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to complain.
I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
as such things go. Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
to use it for commercial purposes. It's a free internet, but
posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
these parts.
On 12/27/18 5:35 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:26:18 PM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>> Check your website. I could not find any links to sample plans. Also, the plans show "out of stock".
>>
>> Bob
>
> The sample plans are there for some items, but they appear to be zip files.
>
> Forgive me I choose not to open them.
>
> Spammer (or worse) be gone!
>
I downloaded and looked at one and it was fine.
Funniest part is that the zip file was something like 3.7mb and the
extracted file was 3.8mb. Stupid. Sounds like someone who started
with dial-up and is stuck in his ways. :-)
Either way, I don't see anyone paying for these plans. There's nothing
special about them and the same info is all over the web for free.
Seems to me like a retired guy doing this as a hobby. Nobel enough
venture, but decades behind in terms of marketability.
The best part is the user agreement that forbids you from selling
anything you make using his plans, without getting written permission
first.
I don't see anyone selling any of the stuff and making any money unless
they hire kids in Taiwan to do it. All the designs look like RTA
assemblies straight out of IKEA or Wayfair.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com
On 12/28/18 10:23 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:41:52 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
>
>> I downloaded and looked at one and it was fine. Funniest part is
>> that the zip file was something like 3.7mb and the extracted file
>> was 3.8mb. Stupid. Sounds like someone who started with dial-up
>> and is stuck in his ways. :-)
>>
>> Either way, I don't see anyone paying for these plans. There's
>> nothing special about them and the same info is all over the web
>> for free. Seems to me like a retired guy doing this as a hobby.
>> Nobel enough venture, but decades behind in terms of
>> marketability.
>>
>> The best part is the user agreement that forbids you from selling
>> anything you make using his plans, without getting written
>> permission first.
>>
>> I don't see anyone selling any of the stuff and making any money
>> unless they hire kids in Taiwan to do it. All the designs look
>> like RTA assemblies straight out of IKEA or Wayfair.
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> -MIKE-
>
> Mike,
>
> My plans are intended for beginning woodworkers and I think you agree
> with that. As for the rest of your comments, they are unnecessary. I
> have sold many of my plans to woodworkers who are very happy with the
> instructions.
>
> I would hope this is a respectable forum for woodworkers seeking info
> and help. So far the comments I have received tell me otherwise.
>
My first paragraph was a little snarky, I admit.
As for the rest, it's an honest and accurate assessment.
You can either be offended by it or use it as market research.
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com
On 12/29/18 10:32 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>>
>>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
>>> this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
>>> in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
>>> complain.
>>
>> If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
>> a little better for you:
>>
>> "Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
>> furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
>> for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
>> that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
>> to my website?
>>
>> Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
>> offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
>> list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
>>
>> [Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
>>
>> That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
>> would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
>> send-off.
>
> Thanks DerbyDad03. It's obvious this forum needs a moderator.
>
This isn't a forum, it's usenet.
Googlegroups and/or whatever other web based forums that show these
posts are simply a conduit that retrieves and re-displays from usenet
onto their web platform.
It's kind of like stealing, really. Many of these forums are monetized
and are making money off content that is produced and available free,
elsewhere.
No moderators. Don't need them. Usenet polices itself and people who
have used it for decades know the rules... like no spam. :-D
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com
On 12/29/18 6:32 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:30:10 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 7:14:53 PM UTC-5, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
>>> On 12/29/2018 4:24 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
>>>> On 12/29/2018 6:33 AM, [email protected] wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6,
>>>>> [email protected] wrote:
>>>>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and
>>>>>> furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan
>>>>>> available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy
>>>>>> the plan. Please take a look:
>>>>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I
>>>>> thought this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who
>>>>> are interested in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who
>>>>> just want to complain.
>>>>
>>>> I didn't respond before, but this is a pretty cordial newsgroup
>>>> as such things go. Maybe your problem is that you think it's OK
>>>> to use it for commercial purposes. It's a free internet, but
>>>> posting your own commercial advertisements is frowned upon in
>>>> these parts.
>>>
>>> Some folks would complain if hanged with a new rope.
>>>
>>> Hey, Brucie, do you also throw a temper tantrum when your FREE gmail
>>> account doesn't work to your satisfaction?
>>>
>>> Perhaps the biggest joke is your "licensing agreement"
>>>
>>> "Thrifty Cabinets plans are copyright © Bruce Kieffer 2018.
>>> Purchased plans are for the purchaser's personal use only. Plans may not
>>> be reconfigured, converted, distributed or sold. Finished products
>>> created from any Thrifty Cabinets plan cannot be sold without receiving
>>> written approval. Clicking the "Add to cart" button below and providing
>>> payment is your acceptance of this license agreement."
>>
>> 10 years after I build a dresser I'll make sure I contact Bruce before
>> I put it on Craigslist. ;-)
>
> Wait! I have a better idea.
>
> I'll leave one screw out or something like that and then it'll never be a
> "finished product". I can sell them like that and make a fortune!
>
Nope, nope!
That would be "reconfigured" which is expressly forbidden by the user
agreement!!
--
-MIKE-
"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
www.mikedrums.com
On 12/29/2018 11:11 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>
>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
>> this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
>> in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
>> complain.
>
> If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
> a little better for you:
>
> "Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
> furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
> for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
> that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
> to my website?
>
> Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
> offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
> list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
>
> [Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
>
> That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
> would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
> send-off.
Looks can be deceiving to the reading impaired. A turd is still a turd
regardless of how much you shine it up...
--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
http://jbstein.com
On 12/29/2018 11:32 AM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 10:11:40 AM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 8:33:59 AM UTC-5, [email protected] wrote:
>>> On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 7:30:40 AM UTC-6, [email protected] wrote:
>>>> Hello everyone! I have created a series of easy-to-build cabinet and furniture plans called Thrifty Cabinets. There's a sample plan available for every plan, so you can see what you get before you buy the plan. Please take a look:
>>>> https://thriftycabinets.com
>>>
>>> I'm so sorry that I ever posted on this angry miserable forum. I thought
>>> this was a "recreational" woodworking group. Woodworkers who are interested
>>> in woodworking, but instead it 's a group of people who just want to
>>> complain.
>>
>> If we could go back in time, the following technique might have worked out
>> a little better for you:
>>
>> "Hi! My name is Bruce. I have created a series of plans for cabinets and other
>> furniture. I sell the plans through my website and offer a sample of each plan
>> for free. I don't want anyone to think I'm spamming this group, so I thought
>> that I would introduce myself first. Would you folks mind if I posted a link
>> to my website?
>>
>> Here is an example of one of the sample plans so you can see what I am
>> offering. You'll note that the sample plans do not include the materials
>> list, cut list, etc. The full plans, of course, would.
>>
>> [Insert Sample Plan Link Here]"
>>
>> That post looks a lot less like spam than your version. I suspect that you
>> would have gotten a slightly warmer reception or, at a minimum, a more polite
>> send-off.
>
> Thanks DerbyDad03. It's obvious this forum needs a moderator.
It has a moderator, me. I'm an asshole and an idiot, but my rules are
written in stone. You can say, do whatever you want, including posting
spam. Everyone else is free to do what they want, including trashing
your spam to the point you wish you never attempted such a vile act.
--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
http://jbstein.com